Advertisement

Greens call for an effective end to police pursuits [With poll]

By 17 April 2012 96

police pursuits

The Greens’ Shane Rattenbury has announced the release of a discussion paper on police car chases.

Shane’s release tends to shy away from what he’s actually proposing but the discussion paper is reasonably direct:

The ACT Greens proposed to trial an updated ACT police pursuit policy to restrict chases to violent crimes only like murder, rape and armed robbery.

This discussion paper set out evidence that most chases currently are for traffic infringements or suspicion of car theft, and also that a chase poses risks to police and innocent bystanders.

Based on this evidence, we believed a better balance can be struck by only permitting chases to take place for serious violent crimes that warrant the risk.

Further evidence cited showed that other jurisdictions, such as Tasmania, are using more progressive policies and have experienced decreases in crimes. This is contrary to the often stated view that amending our police chase policy will result in an explosion in crime.

We proposed that if the trial was successful and crime levels remained steady or declined, the trial should be made permanent.

So what do you think?

When people run from police

View Results

Loading ... Loading ...

UPDATE 17/04/12 16:40: The Liberals’ Jeremy Hanson is not at all impressed.

Please login to post your comments
96 Responses to
Greens call for an effective end to police pursuits [With poll]
buzz819 12:55 pm
21 Apr 12
#91

c_c said :

Well look what we have here: http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-04-21/police-shoot-two-teens-in-kings-cross/3964184

Police using firearms to stop a stolen car fleeing, and not for the first time this year.

Of course unlike my suggestion, they were firing multiple shots wildly into the vehicle cabin putting both the offenders and bystanders at great risk of injury.

Suddenly, the thought of specially trained Police targeting the engine looks a whole lot better doesn’t it?

Obviously there wouldn’t have been time to do it in this particular case, but for those who ridiculed my suggestion as the stuff of video games and violence fetishes, it was a safer suggestion than the actual conduct of Police in real situations!

Are you saying these Police put more people in danger?

c_c 1:55 pm
21 Apr 12
#92

johnboy said :

c_c said :

Well look what we have here: http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-04-21/police-shoot-two-teens-in-kings-cross/3964184

Police using firearms to stop a stolen car fleeing, and not for the first time this year.

Of course unlike my suggestion, they were firing multiple shots wildly into the vehicle cabin putting both the offenders and bystanders at great risk of injury.

Suddenly, the thought of specially trained Police targeting the engine looks a whole lot better doesn’t it?

Obviously there wouldn’t have been time to do it in this particular case, but for those who ridiculed my suggestion as the stuff of video games and violence fetishes, it was a safer suggestion than the actual conduct of Police in real situations!

50 cal rifles (and anything less is not going to work reliably) are not items casually toted:

http://armedkomando.blogspot.com.au/2011/09/steyr-50-hs-austria-sniper-rifle.html

I never said casually toted. I wouldn’t want general duties officers to be able to do it. And I said that in this case, there wouldn’t have been time for what I suggested to be put in place. The officers responded as best they could at the time. It was still dangerous.

The fact that three times this year (twice in NSW and once in WA) general duties officers have sprayed vehicles with weapons fire to stop them is frankly reckless and scary. It puts bystanders at significant risk.

It also makes those who dismissed the idea of skilled officers having the option to use specialist equipment to stop a vehicle by force look look silly. Because that idea entailed far more considered, careful use of force compared to these Yosemite Sam like examples.

Personally, I think it’s time to adopt a model more like the British and SO19. General duties police are being asked to respond to serious incidents too often involving use of force and they’re turning pear shaped, with either the officers getting injured or suspects being seriously injured or killed. General duties Police are too little equipped, and asked to do too much, all the while minor crime is getting over looked, as if frequently complained about on here.

That pursuit that ended in Manuka involved according to AFP 20 Police vehicles, just what were they all doing and what call outs were being ignored while they were tied up with it?

It’s not just for Police pursuits either, general duties police bungled the Crowley incident, where as specialist Police would have had access to additional less than lethal force options.

I’m not suggesting going completely in the direction of Britain and New Zealand and disarming front line Police. I am also not advocating adopting the British model where only he designated pursuit car and driver for an area can engage in a pursuit while most officers can’t. But I do think there is merit to having more division between the bobby on the beat and those who have better training to respond to the dangerous and out of the ordinary.

Woody Mann-Caruso 9:51 pm
23 Apr 12
#93

I’m glad those Dessert Eagles stopped that stolen car in King’s Cross before anybody got hurt. Those shots straight through the engine block sure did the trick.

/mental note to self: Don’t have heart attack driving in King’s Cross.

HenryBG 10:17 pm
23 Apr 12
#94

Darkfalz said :

Jim Jones said :

Do you actually think it’s okay if people die unnecessarily, just so long as they’re ‘criminals’ of some sort?

I do. For me, the death of a person involved in a criminal act is less tragic than a completely innocent person having their wallet or purse stolen. Zero tolerance. Our revolving door legal system makes victims of us all.

Excellent summary of how I think car thieves should bed treated. Their death in a pursuit is *far* less important than the safety of the law-abiding.

And if some drunken chick staggers out into the road and gets cleaned up by a pursuing police car it’s incredibly unfair to blame that on anybody but the drunken chick.

HenryBG 11:29 pm
23 Apr 12
#95

Woody Mann-Caruso said :

I’m glad those Dessert Eagles stopped that stolen car in King’s Cross before anybody got hurt. Those shots straight through the engine block sure did the trick.

/mental note to self: Don’t have heart attack driving in King’s Cross.

So you’re equating your heart attack with a situation in which a car-load of drugged-up, drunk Redfern scumbags are driving (in a stolen car) around Kings Cross running pedestrians over?

Exactly what is it about lefties that makes you so keen to make excuses for criminals?

It’s a bloody good thing these pricks were shot. It’s a shame they look like surviving.

Duffbowl 9:57 am
24 Apr 12
#96

I’m going to address a few things here, and can’t be arsed finding the original responses to quote.

Why is the Q8 grey? I presume you mean on the Wikipedia link that JB posted. All images are of a USN MQ8. The USN uses a light grey scheme for it’s aircraft.

Why not use a .50cal sniper rifle, as they use in Afghanistan? Different environments require different tools. In urban areas of Iraq, the common method of delaying vehicles was the use of squad weapons (USMC: M240; Aust Army: F89), or a mounted 25mm (LAV; ASLAV). In areas where troops were not present, remote strikes from aerial platforms were used. These were mostly AH64 helicopters, as they had the ability to engage targets using their 30mm gun, rockets or missiles. The first two are accurate only in short bursts (less than two seconds). The last is more accurate, and more effective against fast moving targets. Snipers are used to guard given points, and will intercept a target when it is known to be traveling through an area.

There is no easy answer to this problem, and better minds than ours (and no doubt better than the majority of our politicians) have been considering this for quite some time.

Follow
Follow The RiotACT
Get Premium Membership
Advertisement
The-RiotACT.com Newsletter Sign Up

Images of Canberra

Advertisement
Sponsors
RiotACT Proudly Supports
Advertisement
Copyright © 2014 Riot ACT Holdings Pty Ltd. All rights reserved.