5 April 2006

P&C nixes school uniforms - will Katy move without them?

| johnboy
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In February we had an excited discussion on the subject of compulsory school uniforms following the issue being put out to consultation.

Yesterday the ABC reported that the P&C association has nixed the idea.

This raises three question.

1) Given that no issue ever went out for community consultation without the minister being already on board will Katy Gallagher push on without them.

2) Is the P&C still representative? Or has it suffered the curse of community organisations and been stacked with earnest lefties?

3) Do we actually want our young men to stop dressing like idiots and the young women like whores? Or would we prefer the continuing entertainment?

UPDATED: The Canberra Times take on the issue is oushing this as a “leave it to the schools” line. Which is fine except it represents the status quo.

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Hook, line and sinker

My, my….I’ve been asking you to stop directing posts to me for weeks now and only when I get personal do you get the hint.

To be honest, you left me no choice. But let’s just remember that it was you who got personal first, don’t go playing the martyr here.

What was it you said?

You are getting personal, which is the haven of the weak when defeated.

Perhaps you should reflect on your own words before making this statement. Again, you have attacked me personally many times.

As for winding me up? Thanks for the laugh.

Perpetuating a stereotype? What is that? The usual “teachers don’t know anything so they shouldn’t get paid $46k”?

Wake up to yourself. Or better yet, realise this: this thread is about school uniforms.

You are easier to wind up than a child’s toy. And this come even after I have agreed with you on a point.

By this line:

“You clearly have nothing much to do – which only proves my case re: ACT Police”

you seem to intimate that I waste my work time posting on this forum. I do not post on this, or any other open forum, during my work time. When I’m at work I work.

You, on the other hand, do nothing more than perpetuate a stereotype, hence the lack of interest in others of participation in your amateur histrionics.

You are getting personal, which is the haven of the weak when defeated. Incessant rantings indicates that they will never stop. I am bored with you, so mine stop now. Hence their apparent ‘incessantness’ is gone.

You are way too precious in any case

LG and AD have commented – not in this thread btw – and I have accepted their comments.

You on the other hand, find nothing better to do than to twist my words to suit yourself.

Several times now I have gone over the point re: teacher uniforms, which you continue to skirt around.

You clearly have nothing much to do – which only proves my case re: ACT Police – than to attack me on a regular basis.

You don’t like what I write, you don’t have to read it, no one is forcing you to.

However, yet again, you have hijacked a thread with your incessant rantings.

All I have said is that, as a collective, they are right up there with nurses as whingers.

Aww, boo hoo, people care about the ill and the nations future (children), damn them all to hell. Right vg?

FYI, Labour party was a typo, get over it.

Oh and we will never be friends….

My silly friend. People = myself, LG, AD and several others who have taken issue with you. If you took the time to read threads this would be more than apparent.

“Tell me vg, have you ever had to provide equipment (when you are on a course) for the entire class?” Yes, on numerous occasions, but, like your comment, no one cares and I choose not to attempt to make a case for sainthood because of it.

I shudder to think what level of education your students receive when you suggest I should join the ‘Labour’ party. Not one to look for manual work outside of what I already do, methinks you mean the Labor party, you know that big one in Australia.

Speaking of word twisting, as your clearly paranoic state comes back to regularly, please tell me where I specified that “You obviously think teachers are overpaid, underworked, unkempt and lacking in moral judgment.”

I have never said anything of the sort. All I have said is that, as a collective, they are right up there with nurses as whingers. I stand by that comment.

I do a lot of work. I get paid to do a lot of work. In essence this means I do my job. I am not a special snowflake. If I didnt like my job, or more specifically my conditions, I would take mature industrial action or leave. I don’t look to run off to the Vatican to embolden my case.

You clearly have as much skill in maintaining a cogent argument as you do in accident investigation. I would leave arguing with me alone now for a while. You are clearly on the losing side

Now, anyone want to talk about uniforms in schools?

You keep trotting out the same line about people ‘twisting’ your words when you are cornered in a discussion.

No, I have only stated you.

People are getting sick and tired of you pointing out what they consider ‘de riguer’ as something special, like family responsibilities, unpaid overtime and having to pay for some of the stuff you use at work.

People = you.

I get sick and tired of people thinking teachers don’t have lives nor do a hell of a lot.

We all know nurses and *cough* police do a hell of a lot, so why do people believe teachers don’t?

Tell me vg, have you ever had to provide equipment (when you are on a course) for the entire class? I know I have. Yes I can claim it on tax but the point is, I shouldn’t have to.

So what? It’s a part of work life.

Ignore the sarcasm and take that overtime crack (other thread) as fact if you like. That’s your choice.

We’re talking about uniforms here. I pointed out teachers already do have uniforms, in response to someone other than yourself.

You want to take it further.

Accident investigator? LMAO.

Maybe you should apply for the Labour Party here in Canberra and take over Katy Gallagher’s job. You obviously think teachers are overpaid, underworked, unkempt and lacking in moral judgment.

I buy stuff for my own work all the time, in fact some of the items could be considered ‘uniform’. Teachers are not unique and special snowflakes. Everyone else has been doing it for years as well.

Its not twisting your words when I only repeat what you say. You keep trotting out the same line about people ‘twisting’ your words when you are cornered in a discussion. People are getting sick and tired of you pointing out what they consider ‘de riguer’ as something special, like family responsibilities, unpaid overtime and having to pay for some of the stuff you use at work.

Maybe your calling as an accident investigator could be a change of focus.

Well duh.

However the point was that teachers buy them because they want to and do it because they feel a sense of pride in their school community. Jazz spoke of compulsory uniforms, so I responded.

Don’t try and twist my words vg.

“which they pay for themselves”

and, like most occupations in a similiar position, claim on tax.

GnT, I asked about it from the school clothing shop and the main disributor of school clothing in the ACT. The material is cheaper and seeing as most Non-Govt schools have identical dresses, there is plenty of material to go around.

The dresses at my school are over $65 each. Hand made, they are $35-$40.

Personally, I’d rather save $25.

Teachers don’t wear “uniforms” but they can and do wear shirts/jumpers/jackets with the school logo on it – which they pay for themselves. It’s been happening for years.

ghughes I’m not exactly sure what schools your seeing but I just spent my last two weeks on Prac in a Primary school and I didnt see one of those things.

Children can still be individuals, even though they are dressed the same. Being an individual goes more than the way they dress, its their personalities and attitudes which really decided stuff like that.

Uniforms are a good thing because the children who come from the poorer families arn’t made to feel inadequate because of the way they dress. I remember some of the people I went to school with, who couldnt afford brand names, turned to smoking and drinking because they were constantly made to feel on the ‘outside’ because they didnt have the latest $150 jeans or the $200 shoes. I’m not saying this is the case for all kids, I’m sure alot of children handle it fine. This is just what I have seen in my experience.

BTW Chalker, at my school we’ve just had a compulsory PD to inform staff of the department’s brand new dress code policy, so there should be no confusion among teachers anymore.

Nyssa – when was the last time you turned on your sewing machine?

Sewing clothes is no longer cheaper than buying them in most cases. I agree with LG – tracksuit pants and polo shirts are a pratical and cheap uniform.

And uniforms for teachers? Bring it on!!

You might want to tell some of the ones I’ve worked with that.

ghughes, teachers, whether in the Non-Govt or Govt system have a dress code.

Absent Diane4:01 pm 06 Apr 06

but whinging is so much fun!!!

We didn’t get a choice in Coffs Harbour, uniforms from kindy right through to year 12, hence we never knew we were missing anything.

Much ado about nothing.

Boo-hoo! I’m being oppressed!

Sorry AD, but you are your employer’s bitch. Especially post-“Work Choices”.

No, I wasn’t crazy about the uniform I wore at school, but I think the arguements for the benefits of uniforms are more compelling than petulant whining about supression of individuality.

Absent Diane1:56 pm 06 Apr 06

Mr Shab – I just remember hating being told what to wear and I was never one of those fashion concious kids either- just destested having that choice of what to wear taken away from me… I still hate being told what to do what to wear how to act – so I can be a bit of a handful to employ at times but I counter that with the brilliance……

Nyssa
I too am sick of seeing muffin tops, g-strings riding up, boxers over the top of pants, sleeveless shirts and low cleavage t-shirts on teachers.

Bring in a dress code for teachers – and then get the students in uniform.

sorry, socialist at heart.

Oh ferchrissakes AD – the kiddies won’t turn into zombies or (gasp!) Liberal voters cause they have to wear the same damn t-shirt.

And you seem to assume conformity is always a bad thing. You strike me as a bit of a socialist at heard. You should be the first to admit that sometimes you’ve gotta conform for the greater good 😉

Absent Diane11:17 am 06 Apr 06

school uniforms encourage conformity… in my view that is a bad thing….

Me too. Less midriffs and boxer shorts and more looking like they are ready to have an education. And anyone can afford blue tracksuit pants and a white top. It’s cheaper than designer jeans.

Lookout Nyssa, I agree with you

Curious anecdote that was revealed to me the other week (I haven’t checked its validity): Low-rider or hipster jeans have the effect on guys of pinching certain nerve clusters that lead into the groin region, resulting in erectile disfunction.

Now working in a school where the uniform is compulsory, I say bring it in.

Kids can still be individuals.

After working at schools without even a “dress code”, I am sick of seeing muffin tops, g-strings riding up, boxers over the top of pants, sleeveless shirts and low cleavage t-shirts.

Uniforms can be cheap and be made at home with a pattern and material for less than actually buying a new one.

Don’t use the argument that parents can’t afford it. That’s what the student equity budget is for.

Put them in uniforms. Im sick of seeing 16 year old females’ ass cracks and the boxers of males who insist on wearing their pants around their ankles.

“the parents save money because they only need two sets of unforms all year”

Always the arugment for uniforms….always completely wrong. Those kids stay in uniform after school when they hang out with their friends do they? No, of course not. They put on the trendiest garb they have at their disposal as soon as they walk in the door. All uniforms do in this case is create more washing!

& two sets of uniforms? I know my 8yo needs a LOT more than that to get through the year.

they already dress like their pop idols in either hip or hop attire.

Agreed. really is an issue that is best dealth with on a school to school basis. that way the P&C still have a bit of tug, and can really have a say as to what affects their very local community.

Hmmm got carried away with my ‘anyways’ above – delete any one as you see fit…

Dunno that they’ve nixed it JB – just left it to each school to decide for themselves and if Katy goes ahead she’ll be getting total support from 80% of the parents at our kid’s school, The remaining 20% of parents are feral anyway and take no interest in what their kids do at school anyway.

lots of scratchy wool, thats what they need to be wearing
good for them, good for the country

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