On crashes upon Southern Cross Drive

Genie said :

I have to agree this whole street is a joke ! People zoom through the Southern Cross/Ginninderra Dr lights in both lanes in peak hour traffic not realising that quite often both lanes are stopped. From cars waiting to turn left into Starke St or piled up behind a bus letting passengers off and cars waiting to turn right into Latham. Further down at Florey Drive is even worse. Traffic lights at that intersection I fear would be worse… a roundabout in my opinion seems like a better option.

To whoever wrote this post I think your stats are a little off, 1 in 5 people speeding ?? Umm probably 4 in 5 people speed along here.. Including me. I wont deny that quite often I’m over the speed limit, but I’m usually traveling along the roads with light traffic which is also no excuse. I think the only answer to keep speed down to 60k’s an hour is to install those “slow zones” or speed humps. Those white bumpy lines could also prove helpful in slowing down traffic on the mini hill approaching the Florey Drive intersection heading towards Macgreggor.

Clearly the first few people who have commented on this thread dont live in the area, and are unaware how dangerous this street is.

i guess you mean southern cross and kingsford smith? ginnenderra does not cross southern cross

I reckon that the houses on the Latham side of SCD are set far enough back from the road, that the speed limit should be at least 70. If SCD were in Sydney or Melbourne, with the dual carriageway, two lanes each situation, it would probably be 80.

People DO drive like they’ve been possessed by Brocky’s evil twin down SCD towards Kippax, but if you look at ’em they’re always driving old Bombadores, or stolen Hyundai Excel’s and are often wearing baseball caps. Young bogans driving like dickheads won’t take notice of the speed limit no matter what it’s posted at, and I bet if they put lights in at the Florey Drive intersection, the temptation to run the red will be too great for most of them to resist – being that it’s at the bottom of a hill and all.

i live on southern cross drive and concur with most of the above actually i drove past last night’s prang and think i recognised the silver commodore that was involved. this certainly is a dangerous intersection and is not helped by the fact that southern cross merges into one lane shortly before florey drive……..a lot of merging cars leave their indicators on giving the impression that they are turning right into florey drive……some drivers turning right from florey think theses cars will slow to turn and take the risk of turning in front of them……i am not saying that this is the cause of all accidents here but over the last 5 years i have witnessed at least 4 that have occurred this way.

I have to agree this whole street is a joke ! People zoom through the Southern Cross/Ginninderra Dr lights in both lanes in peak hour traffic not realising that quite often both lanes are stopped. From cars waiting to turn left into Starke St or piled up behind a bus letting passengers off and cars waiting to turn right into Latham. Further down at Florey Drive is even worse. Traffic lights at that intersection I fear would be worse… a roundabout in my opinion seems like a better option.

To whoever wrote this post I think your stats are a little off, 1 in 5 people speeding ?? Umm probably 4 in 5 people speed along here.. Including me. I wont deny that quite often I’m over the speed limit, but I’m usually traveling along the roads with light traffic which is also no excuse. I think the only answer to keep speed down to 60k’s an hour is to install those “slow zones” or speed humps. Those white bumpy lines could also prove helpful in slowing down traffic on the mini hill approaching the Florey Drive intersection heading towards Macgreggor.

Clearly the first few people who have commented on this thread dont live in the area, and are unaware how dangerous this street is.

Sleaz274 said :

Of course there is also the opposite theory that suggests that all the speed limits and regulations and rules of the road in fact cause situations that result in accidents and only a tiny proportion of accidents are due to “speeding” above a somewhat arbitary and occasionally ridiculous limit. From your post I obviously read that the 60 limit is too slow and most cars simply move faster than it because they are obviously able to and thousands of drivers do so daily, just like adelaide avenue, just like limestone, just like ginniderra.

60km/h is appropriate along there. On the issue of speed limits though, the are clearly places where the speed limit is too low, to me when you have sections of roads like that people then don’t take other speed limits too seriously when they should.

On this road when you are coming from Belconnen you have a dual carriage way, but as it has houses on the Latham side the speed limit is 60km/h. If it were not for the houses no doubt it would be 80. Nearing Kippax you come down a hill and at the bottom the road ceases being a dual carriageway, so clearly the cars have to merge. What do Canberra drivers do when they merge, yep speed up to get in front. A short while after the merge you have the intersection with Florey Drive, which is where most of the accidents happen, followed 30m futher along by a side street into Macgregor followed another 50m on the other side by Starke Street into Holt.

The bulk of the accidents are cars turning right out of Florey Drive. The heavy flow of traffic coming along Southern Cross and the speed they do make it quite difficult to turn.

For mine the best solution would be to extend the dual carriage way (westbound) until Starke Street. The right lane would end with a turn into Florey and the left lane continue on. A slip lane could then be given to traffic turning left out of Florey Drive. Doing this would not be all that hard as the road where it needs to be two lanes is already quite wide, so the work would be minor adjustments between Florey Drive and Starke Street.

The problem is not the speed limit of the road but ACT driver’s complacency -v- ACT Government’s controlling over driving.

My theory is simple. The problem is that ACT roads are more controlled than in any other state. I am referring to red arrows at lights no matter what time of day or night, an innordinate number of stop signs and line markings enough to control how you stop, merge, turn, and even drive on the road. So ACT drivers have gotten use to being told when to turn, when to merge, when to stop, when to start, etc. So when a road by chance doesn’t have lights, is not divided with a big f&#$k-off median strip, has some changes to line markings, and contains driveways and intersections where a driver must make a decision themselves, ACT drivers don’t know how to handle it and treat the road like all the others and invariably get it wrong.

ACT roads are so controlling it can be frustrating. I wonder if there are stats on the number of ACT drivers who cause accidents interstate because they don’t know how to drive on real roads!

And no, I don’t speed and do burnouts etc, I used to drive in Sydney in peak-hour for hours on end so I and know how to drive and know how good the traffic down here is!

My Neighbour phoned Roads ACT when they did the works to the Starke St Intersection recently to complain about the work they had done and that the removal of the lane to merge when turning left onto Southern Cross Drive had made that intersection much more dangerous than it had previously been.

She was told at that time that Traffic lights were scheduled for the Florey Drive/Southern Cross Drive intersection.

When that happens of course, is anyones guess.

Not to forget driver that have a few or more drink in them. Four bars in Kippax where people stop off for after work drinks. Then risk driving home.
A couple of weeks ago I saw a women stumble out of magpies hop into her car, struggle to get out of the normal parking spot and hit the car next to her a couple of times, then drive off.

The condition of the road at that intersection is appalling, and it only gets worse in the wet. Add that to inattentive drivers and you get smashes like the one that occurred last night.

Traffic lights or a roundabout (or even just resurfacing the road properly) would probably mitigate some of the danger, as people are still going to drive like twats there.

LOL, I think they do that at every intersection along there. The government has to come up with something better than what there is currently. Maybe close off the Starke street turning right, and extend Florey Drive into Kippax with lights there. A bit of a pain, but so would 2 sets of traffic lights in 200m.

I agree Scrappy, although I think the Florey Dr intersection needs lights or a roundabout. Half the issue there is during peak times, you can wait for what seems like forever to turn onto Southern Cross, and people get hasty and try turn when its not safe. However, it also seems that this intersection is the corner of choice for the wankers who think burnouts and going sideways is just awesome.

Traffic does move far too fast along Southern Cross. The accident on Tuesday morning is testament to that. Actually the truck drivers speed probably saved the life of the woman who ran in to him.

A huge problem is traffic turning out of Starke Street right onto Southern Cross. My husband and I have had many near misses with Starke St traffic taking risks getting across the intersection.

Many of the trucks travelling down Southern Cross drive speed, as do some cars and motorbikes. Living on Southern Cross I hear it all, and can tell which ones are going too fast. No one cares though.

Only one person stopped her car to make sure everyone was ok the other day, I came out of my home to give assistance. Most people were peed off because they were going to be a minute later for work and probably ended up speeding anyway.

Traffic lights at Starke Street are a must. Painting lines on roads fixes nothing.

+1 to Tony. Too many drivers appear to be in the grip of hysterical rage and desperation when they drive, the swerving in and out of cars, the tailgating, the crazed accelorating even though they can SEE that cars up ahead are stopped, or there’s an intersection.

Many people don’t seem interested in slowing down for intersections, they charge up to them.

Cars who are in the right lane because they are actually turning right get tailgated by the angry who view the right lane as theirs. I notice a lot of people roaring along in right lanes, not actually overtaking anyone, and then someone angrier and more aggressive than they come up and tailgate them, then another comes and tailgates that car, and so-on. Driving for many people is a competitive business evidently.

The new road around the airport is speed limited to 60, but plainly that’s just an advisory. The ACT government is missing out on making a nice bit of nicker out of the NSW people leaving Canberra by that road every afternoon!

I reckon those lollipop men Guideline have standing around the roadworks there must be on danger money. There’s some crazed behaviour on display.

Tony’s right, that intersection is a joke. I’m assuming the recent works there was an attempt to fix the issue, but to no avail. What it needs is a roundabout, or take one of the many un-needed traffic lights in Belconnen centre and actually put it somewhere it’s needed.
The speed limits also need to be enforced on all of southerncross drive (including the 80 section). The police need to get back on there motorbikes and hide behind the bus shelters again on a daily basis.
Also I think from the kingsford smith lights down to kippax should be single land either side with the other lane becoming a shared cycle/bus lane.

And like Jim, I use it at least twice a day.

Representin’ foh the Westside K-Pax Krew!

There’s nothing wrong with the speed limit or the road itself, the crashes are occurring because people are driving like massive tools.

I use this road at least twice a day, and the amount of aggressive lane-swerving f3cktards is completely astounding. I’ve had more than one driver completely lose his sh1t because I dared to drive at the speed limit alongside another car also doing the speed limit and put an end to his hurtling demonstration of virility.

Seriously people, travelling at 60kph on Southern Cross Drive is not going to make your penis disappear. Just relax FFS.

Limestone Av is lined with driveways, which is why 60 is totally appropriate there.

Of course there is also the opposite theory that suggests that all the speed limits and regulations and rules of the road in fact cause situations that result in accidents and only a tiny proportion of accidents are due to “speeding” above a somewhat arbitary and occasionally ridiculous limit. From your post I obviously read that the 60 limit is too slow and most cars simply move faster than it because they are obviously able to and thousands of drivers do so daily, just like adelaide avenue, just like limestone, just like ginniderra.

Free and smarter societies are moving towards a reduction in regulatory matters of drivers and achieving good results.

There is also the theory of complicated systems which suggests that collisions are simply part of any system in which literally tens of thousands of moving bodies are placed in an environment.

In the immortal words of Mr Kelly…”such is life”

Personally I would suggest that if people weren’t so focussed on the “rule of law” and more focussed on handling their car and being situationally aware accidents would be far more irregular although still ultimately inevitable.

I’m afraid I have to agree with you, Tony. While there will always be people who feel hard done by and whinge and moan about speeding fines (just see any of the numerous threads on RA), the fines are clearly no disincentive to disobeying road rules.
There was a story in this weeks Chronicle about drink driving stats (granted, it was for Queanbeyan, but I think the trend would be similar here in the ACT). About half of the drivers done for DUI in Quangers were repeat offenders. Anyone want to hazard a guess how closely the stats for speeding and other driving offences correlates?
Until society as a whole stop treating speed limits and road rules in general as mere guidelines, rather than actual law, this kind of thing will go on ad infinitum.

Maybe they could just, you know, fix up that particular intersection where the issue is. Southern Cross Drive is already under work further up towards Macgregor in anticipation of the numbers moving into the new suburb. I’d reckon there is probably some sort of plan to fix up the Florey Drive and Beaurepaire intersections as well. Or you could just huddle under your doona.