Do I deserve the bird?

dorrie 20 August 2008 147

Do I deserve ‘the finger’ while driving the speed limit on right hand lane of Belconnen Way at 5.15pm

Is there a rule that I should be on left hand lane if I’m doing 80 kph. Everyone seems to be in a hurry these days,  especially P platers.

[ED – Still waiting to find out when these good old days actually were]

Sitting in the right hand lane doing 80 in an 80 zone

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147 Responses to Do I deserve the bird?
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Overheard Overheard 12:20 pm 05 Sep 08

I’m not a flag-waver for Gooooooogle, but if anyone’s interested, this new Chrome Beta browser gets around the ‘too many posts’ melt-down that afflicts IE, the problem that is also solved by Firefox. It seems quite a bit quicker than IE as well.

That’s about as techo as I get. (Sheesh! It also tells me that ‘techo’ is spelt wrong. Hmmm. It also says ‘spelt’ has some issues. Spelled? Mr Goooooooogle likes that one better. My friend Herr Herman Helmut Spelt from Hamburg will be highly offended.)

Oh, and finally, on topic, I take it all back (on this or the ‘Indicate or I will bludgeon you to within an inch of your life’ post) about indicating on the lead up to the roundabout just down from Defence on the approaches to Kings Avenue bridge. It’s two lanes already before you get to the roundabout, just not very well-defined lanes.

Gawd! ‘Defence’ is spelled wrong. Off to look for a language option.

Sgt.Bungers Sgt.Bungers 5:13 am 24 Aug 08

No you did not deserve the bird. It is remarkable just how many drivers get worked up over loosing minuscule amounts of time on the road. Would anyone here give someone else the finger or scream abuse at someone in the shopping centre for holding them up for a few seconds? Not likely! Consider how much road rage we all see compared to verbal abuse or assaults on the street. If we all drove as though everyone else in every other car was a psychopath just waiting for an excuse to kick off and destroy someone, our roads would be far more pleasant.

That said, depending on where you were on Belconnen Way, you may have been required to be in the left lane. There are “Keep Left Unless Overtaking” signs on Belconnen way, meaning you’re legally required to keep left (unless you’re turning or the road is congested) regardless of the speed limit or how fast you’re going.

Sleaz274 Sleaz274 7:47 pm 22 Aug 08

Hi vg

You’re right flog is a better word and easier and shorter to say… I wonder if I shoudl change my screen name?? of course I’m called sleaz right now so I doubt names really bother me to much.

And yes to date it would appear I’ve been able to use my “mad skillz” to control my car up to 110km/h oh my god just like everyone else how exciting for me yay yay can I play with you big men on campus now up on your pedestal? Can I really?

I hope they are still making you count your rounds in I’d hate to see what happens to someone who actually does something really bad rather than post on a website.

If I take your advice and go visit a magistrate I’ll simply say Grand Theft Auto made me do it… which I’m going to play right now with a bottle of vodka.

I bid you a good weekend this post has become boring and a little personal for my liking…. I do enjoy “flog” however I might work that in more often.

aidan aidan 12:32 pm 22 Aug 08

“Does my 5-10 km/h really affects the whole community? Really?”

If the road is clear then it probably doesn’t, but in moderate to heavy traffic it is dangerous to be doing 10 km/hr more than the bulk of the other cars.

On of the reasons I stay in the right hand line going west along Barry Drive/Belconnen Way is that it can be hard to get into the right hand lane by the time you get to Hayden Drive because of aggressive drivers that don’t let you merge.

Personally I find it alot more relaxing to drive on the Victorian part of the Hume as most cars and trucks do the speed limit (miraculous how most speedometers agree on that stretch of road). On the NSW side (when traffic is heavy) when I have to overtake a slower vehicle I often have someone behind me slamming on their brakes and tailgating me until I have the room to move back into the left hand lane.

vg vg 9:05 am 22 Aug 08

“Does my 5-10 km/h really affects the whole community? Really?”

When that increases your stopping distance and causes you to go from no accident into accident then yes.

You were wrong about one thing though. You’re not a nob jockey. With your attitude to driving you’re actually a flog.

But I gather you’re one of those people who ‘can’ drive above the speed limit because you have ‘better skills’ (or is it madd skillz?).

The speed limit is ‘arbitrarily’ decided to respond to the lowest common denominator. Just because you think that rationale doesn’t apply to you doesn’t mean you can or should exceed the limit but, if you feel so strongly about it, feel free to maintain that 5-10 above the limit as you pass a speed camera van. Then argue about how arbitrary it is to the magistrate. In fact give us all a yell when you’re going to court it will be a hoot.

Stick to the speed limit. I can guarantee you’re not as good a driver as you think you are

Special G Special G 8:09 am 22 Aug 08

The major cause of accidents on or roads is fatigue. People push the envelope a bit too far and skills degrade rapidly when tired, or are less than desired when asleep at the wheel. There was a great push to keep the American national speed limit at 55mph (88km/h) in the states due to the ‘speed kills’ lobby. This was discounted when the road toll on highways dropped significantly when it changed to 80mph (128km/h). The same could be applied very effectively here especially on the large stretches of dual lane highway up and down the East Coast. Obviously sections would need to change until they are upgraded. Decreased trip time = less fatigue. Modern cars can easily handle these speeds safely. Old cars don’t go that fast (unless you cook the engine).

Around town this doesn’t apply as merge speeds/lanes/reaction times/visability etc apply. Some boffin does the calculations and the road speed is set from there. I haven’t seen any stats on collisions since the residential speed limit was dropped to 50 and how this has impacted.

Driver discoutesy is becoming a leading cause of road rage which is becoming more frequent and more violent . If you are happy to piss other drivers and possibly get your car smashed up by some little punk in his fully sick CRX with oversized wing then go for it. But unless you’re built like VG then I advise against putting yourself into the victim category lest we be reading about you here after your head gets caved in with a tyre iron.

Sleaz274 Sleaz274 11:51 pm 21 Aug 08

We borrow systems from every where else all the time and why won’t they work here? Has anyone tried or does veryone just blindly follow the “presumably” safe limit because someone decided to put a sign up and deem a road “safe” at a certain speed. Let’s drop the auto bahn example it has no relevance to any australian road at all. From general pbservation I’d say the greater percentage of Canberran’s speed on roads such as Ginninderra drv limestone ave monaro highway majura road etc etc the speed on limestone is regularly around 70km/h not 60 km/h as one example. Again comparing our roads to Tassie or the Kings highway there seems to be vast discrepancies in what is deemed “presumably safe”. Does my 5-10 km/h really affects the whole community? Really?

I don’t think so and everybody breaks or bends the rules do the people who look right and left evaluate the risk and then cross the road before the little man turns green deserve to be called a moron those drug smoking hippies!! I don’t speed in school zones or in the wet because I assess the risk and decide it is not appropriate (unlike a lot of canberran drivers) but on wide clear well marked roads I can’t really see how the posted limits can apply so rigorously as your comments would suggest.

I definitely don’t go “as fast as I wanted” that would be stupid and reckless but that is very different from merely going above an arbitarily decided (in all conditions I may add) speed limit.

Thanks for the reasonable response and sorry about the family glad they are okay. I hope you can see from my arguments that I do take driving to be a serious business in fact it used to be my job and I have thought about these issues a great deal.

astrosapien astrosapien 8:44 pm 21 Aug 08

Sleaz274 said :

Seeing as my comment created a fair bit of vitriol I thought a short reply would be in order.
To dear Astrosapien a) yes I am a knob jockey, which you’re about to discover b) I wasn’t comparing the roads to autobahns which are 6-8 lane mega highways specifically built to allow a large amount of traffic to travel at speed. Even the autobahns have limits per lane with only the far left (driving on the right hand side remember so teh opposite to here I’ll draw a diagram if you need it) being the UL or unlimited lane. Have you even driven on one? They also have far superior driver education, get crap cars off the road very quickly and have two sets of tyres summer and winter.
I was comparing the rules and regulations on similar roads. France for instance or Britain with variable speed limits depending on conditions and time of day, including congestion are taken into account. You can be pulled over in France for not keeping up with the flow of traffic or by being an obstruction like our original poster. Canberra is not a little bubble so why should we treat it as such? To just say “It’s Canberra you moron” hardly counts as an argument I’ll draw your attention to Tassie again where a road similar to Majura road is teh main highway betweeen North and South and is 110 km/h.

I don’t smoke weed because I’m an extremely fit young professional who plays fairly high level soccer and loves scuba diving. Personal insults are so primary school but you know us kindergarteners look up to all you big kids so well done there. I hope you didn’t just have a stroke from me bursting your stereo typical bubble in which you live. it’s Canberra indeed, now open your eyes and discover this world…

I haven’t driven on the autobahns, but I’ve been a fair way out of Canberra, regardless. But I don’t need to have driven on one to tell you that just because a system works in one location that it would necessarily work in another… So yeah, saying that “it’s Canberra” actually DOES count as an argument.

I agree that limits should change depending on conditions, but probably in a different way to you.

And the weed comment wasn’t intended to be so much an insult, as it was proving a point. To bend/break rules and laws at ones own whims is where a lot of problems come from. The laws are there for everybody, regardless of whether you like them or not. It’s as simple as that… No-one is going to give a flying f&*k whether or not you drove on a road in Europe or Asia. The roads in Canberra have been assessed presumably on safety and what speeds are appropriate. If sticking to a limit is too much to ask, maybe you should check Action’s new schedules…

My sister and her family were recently in an accident where none of them were hurt, thankfully, but it cost someone in the other car their life… No reports have been released with the official verdict on what actually happened there yet, but from the looks of the remains of the cars, I’d be surprised if speed wasn’t a factor. So that was a result of someone thinking that they were capable of going as fast as they wanted…

Just take a second to think about the fact that driving is some serious business… There is a whole community out there that you are putting into your hands every time you get behind the wheel. To go as fast as you want to is to put yourself and others into needless danger…

Blamemonkey Blamemonkey 3:38 pm 21 Aug 08

@G-fresh if you love to drive in the right had lane so much why not marry it.

Sleaz274 Sleaz274 12:37 pm 21 Aug 08

Seeing as my comment created a fair bit of vitriol I thought a short reply would be in order.

vg – yes 100 would be reasonable up to Flynn and down to Lyneham. Sure it is fed by arterial roads but all these intersections are well controlled by traffic lights which are easily visible. The kings highway is far more dangerous and is a 100 personally I think that road should be 80km/h and people shoule get used to taking an extra 1/2 hour to get to the coast. Or they should upgrade the stupid thing to the same conditions as Ginninderra dr.

And vg I know of whom you are and that you deal with “dead set fully sik wankers” all day so I’ll let that one pass.

To dear Astrosapien a) yes I am a knob jockey, which you’re about to discover b) I wasn’t comparing the roads to autobahns which are 6-8 lane mega highways specifically built to allow a large amount of traffic to travel at speed. Even the autobahns have limits per lane with only the far left (driving on the right hand side remember so teh opposite to here I’ll draw a diagram if you need it) being the UL or unlimited lane. Have you even driven on one? They also have far superior driver education, get crap cars off the road very quickly and have two sets of tyres summer and winter.
I was comparing the rules and regulations on similar roads. France for instance or Britain with variable speed limits depending on conditions and time of day, including congestion are taken into account. You can be pulled over in France for not keeping up with the flow of traffic or by being an obstruction like our original poster. Canberra is not a little bubble so why should we treat it as such? To just say “It’s Canberra you moron” hardly counts as an argument I’ll draw your attention to Tassie again where a road similar to Majura road is teh main highway betweeen North and South and is 110 km/h.

I don’t smoke weed because I’m an extremely fit young professional who plays fairly high level soccer and loves scuba diving. Personal insults are so primary school but you know us kindergarteners look up to all you big kids so well done there. I hope you didn’t just have a stroke from me bursting your stereo typical bubble in which you live. it’s Canberra indeed, now open your eyes and discover this world…

Overheard Overheard 11:48 am 21 Aug 08

astrosapien said :

Overheard said :

astrosapien said :

astrosapien: Speeding is rude, arrogant and selfish… To presume that your personal circumstances override the law of that area and should excuse you from penalties is the height of arrogance.

OH: astrosapien, I genuinely hope you never find yourself in personal circumstances that would make you question this statement of yours or believe anything to the contrary.

astrosapien: I certainly hope so too… More than anything I hope to have the presence of mind to call the proper emergency contacts if I am ever in such a situation…

What I was getting at though, and forgot to make clearer, is that there are a number of different circumstances out there that one might consider a personal emergency. But it’s completely subjective to the person who considers it as such… That is to say, what one person considers an emergency isn’t necessarily going to be considered an emergency by others or the relevant authorities. And the danger therein is that if one “personal emergency” is excused then it stands to reason that all other “personal emergencies” would have to be too… It’s a very slippery slope.

In my very limited experience, emergency and presence of mind rarely go hand in glove.

I’ve been speaking in generalities, so I’ll give one specific example. I really wasn’t going to go here, but suffice it to say it’s been front-brain this week (hence the other story on an unrelated thread).

Thursday 20 August 1998 I got a phone call. My brother had had a seizure and collapsed; the ambulance was on the way. (This was the coda to a long illness.) I lived in Kambah, he lived in north Watson. I recall very little of my trip there, but yeah, I’m guessing I may have sped a little. And yeah, if someone had been going up Northbourne Avenue in the right hand lane doing 78 and I had wanted to pass them doing just a tad more, I may well have expressed my displeasure.

Had I passed a fixed speeding camera and copped a fine, I’d have taken it on the chin. Mea culpa. Caveat speedor.

As it was, I got there not long after the ambos, and in time to see my bro’s eyes flicker open for an instant. And maybe there was some cognition there, and maybe there wasn’t. Either way, it was the last time I saw them open. He died about 30 hours later without regaining consciousness.

Yeah, it was my subjective call to speed then. I don’t make a habit of it.

Chris Chris 11:41 am 21 Aug 08

G-Fresh said :

shauno, poor interpretation.

G-Fresh, I believe shauno was referring to your attitude. Its the sort of attitude that pisses people off on the roads, in the workplace, in the pub, in the supermarket and at home…..

Therefore I officially rename you G-Up…….because I’m sure that you really are a nice, logical, unselfish person just looking to stir people up for a bit of fun.

VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy 11:32 am 21 Aug 08

Aurelius – fair enough, I can imagine after seeing that you’d be pretty annoyed. That said, I don’t believe hiding behind the rules excuses discourteous driving. Of course, sometimes things happen – the behaviour of that kid you described is unacceptable, and I’d be calling the cops myself with his rego if I’d seen something like that.

G-Fresh G-Fresh 11:25 am 21 Aug 08

shauno, poor interpretation.

Aurelius Aurelius 11:14 am 21 Aug 08

Berlina,
My comment is based on the fact that a week or two ago, I saw some kid almost run someone off the road on Gungahlin drive near Mitchell because they’d committed the awful sin of being in his way in the right lane (although they were doing over the speed limit).
When we drive, we drive the car we’re in. Too many people think they have some right to dictate how others drive. And they don’t. So long as what another person is doing is illegal, we should suck it up and deal with it.
While I generally drive to give others the maximum benefit, if someone’s going to behave like an asshat, that consideration evaporates. The original query in this thread was whether someone deserved to be abused for driving in a manner legal. Answer is no. Anyone who abuses other drivers is an asshat. It doesn’t matter what the provocation. And anyone who’s an asshat and cannot handle the fact traffic exists shouldn’t be driving.

VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy 11:12 am 21 Aug 08

I put this sort of behaviour into the same category as those people who speed up when someone indicates (shock, horror!) before changing lanes, so the person changing lanes can’t ‘get in front’. It’s just sad and pathetic, and shows an incredible lack of decency.

shauno shauno 11:07 am 21 Aug 08

The thing is its not about whether its right or wrong to speed while overtaking.Its about not thinking about yourself 24 hours a day but showing some consideration to other road users and sticking to the left hand lane so that it frees up the overtaking lane for other traffic. Just common courtesy.

And you see from the comment above from G-Fresh “without me having done anything wrong” thats a classic example of some one who drives along in their own little world not giving a stuff about any one else.

VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy 11:03 am 21 Aug 08

Kinda sad, Aurelius, to hide behind ‘the rules’ instead of simply accepting that there are benefits to basic driving courtesy (which don’t adversely impact you but may assist others).

I guess when I was taught to drive the old school rules applied.

G-Fresh G-Fresh 10:39 am 21 Aug 08

Whatsup said :

G-Fresh: You are potentially stoking the fires of road rage with your attempt to gain “satisfaction”. There are other ways to feel good about yourself without creating more agro on the roads. Just an observation !

No attempts perse. Just a wry smile at a person obviously having a hissy fit without me having done anything wrong. This is not self satisfaction Whatsup.

Aurelius Aurelius 10:28 am 21 Aug 08

What is remarkable here is the number of people who freely attack other people’s behaviour, and label it illegal, and are wrong.
“undertaking” as you’re calling it, or overtaking in the left lane, is not illegal. Neither’s driving in the right lane on Belconnen Way. If you think other drivers are being inconsiderate, chill out and get over it.
If you cannot handle traffic and that other drivers wont act according to the way you’d like them to, I’d suggest that you lack the maturity to drive in a modern city. Walk instead. And then at least, when someone gets in your way, you can be a hero and tell them off to their face (if you’ve the guts) and get laughed at or worse.

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