Parkway woes

shauno said :

No idea why there are 147 posts about this. Its amazing that so many people get pissed off at things that don’t affect them what so ever. How the hell is a motor bike travelling at safe speed down a break down lane going to effect joe public sitting in his camry in traffic. People just need to lighten up.

They’d be affected more if the riders were the “normal” single driver in a car.
Its cyclists who are potentially much more affected by this.

No idea why there are 147 posts about this. Its amazing that so many people get pissed off at things that don’t affect them what so ever. How the hell is a motor bike travelling at safe speed down a break down lane going to effect joe public sitting in his camry in traffic. People just need to lighten up.

Also bikes filtering through traffic is generally safer then sitting in one position in the traffic. Because they are more easily seen. After a period of time a bike remaining in one spot in the moving traffic can go unnoticed and drift in and out of blind spots.

If traffic is at a standstill on a cool winter night, no way will I hang around if there is a gap. Common sense must prevail at some stage. If the traffic is moving, albeit slowly, I will remain part of it.

Because it is a break down lane and is there for a reason, and that reason is not for motorbikes to get ahead of the traffic.

Getting back to the issue, why shouldn’t someone riding responsibly doddle down the breakdown lane on their bike if they fit? I am talking about doing say 40 – 60 km/h or so.

“The study of motorcycle crashes conducted by the Monash University Accident Research Centrei found that of the 222 crashes investigated only 2, that is less than 1%, were the result of lane splitting and both of these crashes were relatively minor.”

There are also very few injuries from parkour, but if everybody did it we would not have a populaion probelm for very long.

Very few people die from juggling live hand grenades, however this is also not a very wise practice.

Doctor Evil said :

Axe Man,

You quoted from a submission BY the Motorcycle Council of nsw TO the NTC regarding the amendment of Aust road rule 151A.

Are you saying MCCOFNSW aren’t a lobby group?

Sorry Dr Evil. You are correct. I didn’t properly read the title and just saw NTC and not MCCOFNSW (even though it’s in a few places). I was probably a little hasty considering I was at work when I found it.
I found what the NTC were trying to do with amendment 151a

Rule 151A attempted to clarify the intent of several existing road rules, which prohibit the practice of motorcycle lane-splitting or lane-filtering. The proposed rule would more explicitly require motorcycles to move into an adjacent lane or line of traffic when overtaking other vehicles and pass at a safe distance.

In excess of 800 submissions (excluding duplicated submissions) were received, which primarily oppose the recommendation. The NTC notes that there is a wide misperception among the motorcycling community that lane-splitting and/or lane-filtering is legal. Motorcycle riders still have a responsibility to comply with existing road rules (outlined below).
drivers/riders on a multi-lane road must travel entirely within a single lane (ARR 146)

• drivers/riders must travel within a single line of traffic on a road without marked lanes (ARR 146)

• drivers/riders are required to pass at a safe distance (ARR 144)

• drivers/riders are prohibited from overtaking on the left on a multi-lane road, unless the vehicle can be safely overtaken by moving into a marked lane (ARR 141)

• drivers/riders on a multi-lane road must not move from one marked lane into another marked lane by crossing a continuous line separating the lanes (ARR 147)

• drivers/riders approaching or at traffic lights showing a red traffic light must stop, if there is a stop line at or near the lights – as near as practicable to, but before reaching the stop line (ARR 56)

• drivers/riders at an intersection or marked foot crossing with a red traffic light must not enter the intersection or marked foot crossing.

So it’s back to what I said earlier. There is no specific law against it. As long as you don’t go over the lane marking and you are a ‘safe’ distance from the car on your immediate left then you don’t have a problem. Obviously some peoples definition of ‘safe’ is varied but I think in stopped traffic a motorcycle can safely travel down inbetween two cars

http://www.ntc.gov.au/DocView.aspx?page=A02312403400450020

Axe Man,

You quoted from a submission BY the Motorcycle Council of nsw TO the NTC regarding the amendment of Aust road rule 151A.

Are you saying MCCOFNSW aren’t a lobby group?

Holden Caulfield

“In regards to lane splitting, my understanding, which is probably incorrect, is that if traffic is at a standstill (at a red light, for example) then it is perfectly legal for a motorcyclist to make their way to the head of the pack???”

On the right handside, maybe. On the left even if it is within the lane, certainly not (that’s called undertaking), same too with the shoulder.

Doctor Evil:

Doctor Evil said :

The only problem with the study that Axe Man refers to is that he chose to only quote the parts that support the argument that lane splitting/filtering should be legalised.

And this is from a organisation that represents riders?

I believe I also quoted their suggestion which was to encourage lane spitting/filtering whenever it was safe to do so. If their research indicates that wouldn’t their report also indicate that?

Doctor Evil:

Doctor Evil said :

Yep, like most research quoted by interest groups, the closer you look the thinner it gets…..

You make it sound as though they are a lobby group for motorcyclist groups. This is from the NTC site:

“The National Transport Commission (NTC) was established to assist Australian governments in achieving their jointly agreed objective set out in the Inter-Governmental Agreement1(IGA) of:

“…improving transport productivity, efficiency, safety and environmental performance and regulatory efficiency in a uniform or nationally consistent manner.”

Our role is to lead transport regulatory reform nationally to meet the needs of transport users and the broader community for safe, efficient and sustainable land transport. We contribute to a vision of the best national transport outcomes for Australia. To achieve this, we consult widely and work with industry and all levels of government to establish priority areas for transport regulatory reform.

We are independent body that works in close partnership with the road and rail transport sectors, governments, transport agencies, the Australian Local Government Association and regulators and police, to develop practical land transport reforms.”

The points that stand out for me is the fact that they are ‘independant’ and they encourage ‘safety’.

I’m not sure they are an interest group in the sense that you mean

I lanesplit regularly, and have never crashed whilst doing so. I did, however, once crash whilst cornering – thus conclusively proving that lanesplitting is safe, and cornering should be punishable by a $318 fine and three demerit points.

Yep, like most research quoted by interest groups, the closer you look the thinner it gets…..

Doctor Evil, what you’ve got there is a conclusion based on on assumption on an aproximation. Hardly science. Actually, begs the question about the rest of the study.

I would always be wary of stats, comments made from an organisation that represent the point that it is trying to make. They are usually “spun” to appear to back up opinions, when the true fatcs/stats are not telling the same story. In quite a few circumstaces anyway.

The only problem with the study that Axe Man refers to is that he chose to only quote the parts that support the argument that lane splitting/filtering should be legalised.

Here is another excerpt:

“Data on the total number of motorcycle crashes in Australia is not readily available, however, as NSW represents approximately a third of motorcycle fatalities, it is reasonable to assume that NSW represents a third of all Australian motorcycle crashes. NSW has in the order of 2,200 crashes per annumiv. Therefore the total number of motorcycle crashes in Australia each year would be in the order of 6,600. One percent, or 66 crashes, would be as a result of lane splitting.”

So they proudly announce that if lane splitting was made legal we would be financially better off, because 66 crashes a year costs us less than the increased congestion?

66 crashes is acceptable? And this is from a organisation that represents riders?

Thankyou Axe Man. Your the first person to bring any argument to the table with a credible argument for or against.

http://www.mccofnsw.org.au/cgi-bin/user.pl?download_file=1&file=109

Peter said “or that a young lass with a P Plate and several stuffed toys in the car was trying to merge on top of me,”

I think I’ve encountered her! Red P plate, back shelf full of stuffed crap toys, and she started sailing into my lane as though I wasn’t there! Does her neck not turn?

Anyway, I have an air horn so she stopped trying to move over me quite abruptly.

nah, not 70, but some times when I look after my 3 kids under 4, I feel like I am – I know, glutton for punishment… especially with twins…

don’t know if damart is still in civic, used to be near babars. not cheap, but well worth the cost.

lol – peter are you like 70 years old?!

Just kidding mate – good on ya! 🙂

Aeek said :

Winter is a bad time to start cycling to work, but its easy to ride through, just wear a little more but not too much and adjust day by day. Right now I’m wearing winter gloves in the morning and summer gloves at night (often 7pm). I’d go psyco driving every day.

damart thermolactyl – goes under riding gloves for motor bikes, or can be used by cyclists as an outer glove. I have very little heating in the magna – it is pointed at the windscreen, so gloves keep my hands warm.

I drive everywhere as a part of my daily job. I see idiots with P plates in cars, idiots with L plates on bikes, and elderly drivers that really should admit to themselves that it is time to hang up their keys and catch the bus.

I drive a very old magna, and stick to the left hand lane as I am the first to admit that it doesn’t go very fast. I marvel at the tourists that come to town, screaming past the speed camera vans – most don’t register what it is till its too late, and I get from A to B listening to the AM Radio – 2CA and don’t really worry about much at all.

I am however, a different person come home time. I want to be home now, dammit! why are you going so slow in the right lane, why don’t you let me through etc, etc. I have found that most of my rage is let out via simmering at the moron who has cut me off – (I have Tourist plates as I bought it elsewhere)in my head. doesn’t help others to let it out, doesn’t help me.

so I chug along, with the radio belting out Neil Diamond, and I get to my destination.

on the parkway yesterday, with the magna in neutral and just rolling down the hill, at a slow crawl, I actually was calm.

did not care that there were bikes passing me, or that a young lass with a P Plate and several stuffed toys in the car was trying to merge on top of me, as I had driven in Sydney and melbourne traffic and now was prepared.
we don’t get gridlock, gungahlin drive extension is a bit of a stuff up – why make it single lane?? but I am now quite peaceful.

re the bike riders that are saying that the shoulder is safe, I have lost 2 mates due to undertaking on the shoulder, one was cut off by a car and hit a power pole, the other went under a truck. if you can do it safely, then fine. if you are a L-plater, maybe wait until you have your license and a few more years experience.

I don’t want to try and save you with first aid if you go under a truck. There really isn’t a lot I can do.

Winter is a bad time to start cycling to work, but its easy to ride through, just wear a little more but not too much and adjust day by day. Right now I’m wearing winter gloves in the morning and summer gloves at night (often 7pm). I’d go psyco driving every day.

i never asked to feel sorry for me – i’m quite toastie riding to work – always get overheated. I could drive my commodore in but it’s just not as fun and i’d have to donate a leg for parking!!!!

Well you may not be waiting long madman, diesel is already $1.80. But I guess like many others I will choose to pay rather then freeze on a bike in a Canberra winter.
I wont ask you to feel sorry for me and my choices and vice versa…. ok?

wont you be laughing andym when fuel hits over $2 a litre.

Hope that sends you on to a bike then we’ll be awaiting your retraction or I will see you in my homeless program that VY Berlina is going to help with!!!

amarooresident said :

Jeez it’s funny what fires people up on this site. For the record I ride a scooter, have done for 20 years and I sometimes cut through lines of traffic when its stopped or use the bike lane/shoulder at the lights if I’m turning left.

When turning left, is arguably legal for, I think, 10m.

Lets face it. There are idiots on bikes and idiots in cars, lets hope natural selection takes care of them before they have a chance to breed.

Bikes using the shoulder to pass if traffic has stopped. OK by me, do it slow and do it safely.
Lane splitting, must admit it urks me. Sure, you say you can get away quicker and faster then me and get out of my way. Next time you are lined up at the cinema, you wont mind if I push in cause I can get in and sit down faster then you?! We take turns – its common curtesy.

Had to laugh about the people who said we have to think about the bike riders, in the cold, in the heat,sucking down fumes. Sorry – thats your choice. Dont like it – dont ride.

I have no problems with motorcycles lane splitting if traffic is at a standstill. Lets face it, they are a lot lighter, smaller and faster than your car, so its unlikely you are going to be held up by them. As for the Parkway., at least it has dual lanes. Try living northside.

astrojax said :

what door opening law? you mean where it is implicit in opening your vehicle’s extremities (door, self, etc) such that it doesn’t interfere with the progress of traffic in the lane? like, if you open your door and a car or other vehicle hits it, you’re in the wrong… that law?

and lane splitting, i guess if the bike was within the lane to the right of the vehicle it was passing, it would be a legal manouevre, if on the left it would constitute the offence of ‘pass vehicle on near side’. rule of thumb – keep right to pass.

You cannot overtake within the same lane…whether on the left or right. Additionally, if someone does open thier car door into the path of a another road user, Yes it does make it their fault, however if the “other road user” is doing an illegal manouvre, like riding/driving in the shoulder/bicycle lane, then the rider/driver is also at fault.

There is “almost” a law for everything 😉

I don’t mind motorcyclists using the shoulder, as ant said.

What I *do* mind is impatient drivers who spit the dummy and, in a fit, pull out of their congested lane into the transit lane, right into my path. I’ve had several near misses because of this.

Yes, green Commodore on Adelaide Avenue last week. I am looking at *you*.

astrojax said :

what door opening law? you mean where it is implicit in opening your vehicle’s extremities (door, self, etc) such that it doesn’t interfere with the progress of traffic in the lane? like, if you open your door and a car or other vehicle hits it, you’re in the wrong… that law?

I took it that that person was still talking about opening your door on riding past motorists….

what door opening law? you mean where it is implicit in opening your vehicle’s extremities (door, self, etc) such that it doesn’t interfere with the progress of traffic in the lane? like, if you open your door and a car or other vehicle hits it, you’re in the wrong… that law?

and lane splitting, i guess if the bike was within the lane to the right of the vehicle it was passing, it would be a legal manouevre, if on the left it would constitute the offence of ‘pass vehicle on near side’. rule of thumb – keep right to pass.

If we want to talk technicalities… a motorcycle that “lane splits” is technically overtaking a vehicles on the left, which is illegal. Motorcycles as I understand are allowed to ride 2 a breast in a lane but cannot ride abreast with a car, which would also make it illegal….technically

For the record, I am a motorcycle rider,

As a side note, alot of traffic law is designed to protect motorists from them selves, ie seatbelts etc. Riding driving on the shoulder, in bike lanes etc are illegal because it is dangerous to ride/driver there, it a unpredicable area and is not designed for mainstream traffic, hense the “near misses” mentioned in some previous posts of riders in the shoulder/bicycle/emergency lanes. Although alot would argue that driving in Canberra is “unpredicable” in general…lol

I do agree that it sucks being stuck behind vehicles with exhaust fumes filling your helmet, but as pointed out I do choose to ride even though these days it is begining to become a necessity to hop on a motorcycle as opposed to a car 😉

@ Doctor Evil and The Axe Man

In the various motorcycle forums that I have posted to in the past there have been numerous discussions on the legality of lane splitting in the different states. As far as I know the outcome of the discussion at the time (a couple of years ago) is that lane splitting is illegal in the ACT (even if the traffic isn’t moving) but it was legal in Victoria (when the traffic isn’t moving, or is moving very slowly or somesuch).

I can attest to being being given a TIN in the ACT for “overtaking when unsafe” for overtaking on the left (and resonably for lane splitting as well I would assume) because in a moment of weakness I was the recipient of such a TIN and I copped it sweet because I knew full well I was breaking the law.

I think the point here is that a lot of the things motorcyclists are talking about doing or having done are actually illegal and that they take the risk of being hurt or booked when they do such things. Same as motorcyclists who choose not to wear appropriate protective gear, although most of it isn’t mandatory… They’re still choosing to take a risk and they should be (and most of the time I believe they are) aware of the possible consequences.

I also found this study from the National Transport Commission from 2005 about lane splitting/filtering. Of particular note is this

“The study of motorcycle crashes conducted by the Monash University Accident Research Centrei found that of the 222 crashes investigated only 2, that is less than 1%, were the result of lane splitting and both of these crashes were relatively minor.”

and this

“Therefore, motorcycles have no effect on congestion if they are able to make their way to near to the front of the queue.”

and the killer

“The benefit to the community in allowing lane splitting far outweighs the cost to the community to the extent that safe lane splitting should be encouraged not discouraged.”

Full report here
http://www.mccofnsw.org.au/cgi-bin/user.pl?download_file=1&file=109

Holden Caulfield said :

Doctor Evil said :

In regards to lane splitting, my understanding, which is probably incorrect, is that if traffic is at a standstill (at a red light, for example) then it is perfectly legal for a motorcyclist to make their way to the head of the pack???

Doctor Evil said :

Be very interested to see the answer to that last one Holden. Maybe one of the local lads can provide a definitive view?

From what I have been able to gather (as I’m interested in this) is that there is no specific law against this.
What you probably will get ‘done’ with by the Police is ‘incorrect overtaking’ or something to that effect.
The link below is to a Victorian site but I would imagine out road rules are pretty similar
http://mraa.org.au/forum/modules/issues/index.php?pagenum=3

As I mentioned earlier a cop could pull you over but you wouldn’t get done for lane splitting/filtering, it’d be something like ‘not indicating’ or ‘dangerous riding’.

OTT but I wanted to know if I could drive and drink a beer at the same time as long as I was under the limit. My friends asked some of his cop mates and there was no specific law against it but they pretty much all agreed that they would try to book you for something else

There is no door opening law!!!

Be very interested to see the answer to that last one Holden. Maybe one of the local lads can provide a definitive view?

Doctor Evil said :

Holden, if you can show me a road rule that indicates that, I would have no choice but to agree with you.

Regardless, if that did actually happen, who do you reckon would be most likely to be found to be in the wrong from a legal point of view? The passenger who forgot to check for motorbikes on the shoulder before getting out, or the rider who hit him?

First answer, one of the cycling numpties somewhere on the internetz made mention of the door opening law. It sounds feasible enough to me, so I’ve not bothered to check it out.

Second answer, I agree with you, but just because one person isn’t using their common sense shouldn’t provide an excuse for others to do likewise. Although, I concede, if you have broken down (ie. already a bit p!ssed off, and you have been able to get on to the shoulder, the last thing you’d think of when hopping out on the left hand side of the car is to check for a motorcyclist, haha.

In regards to lane splitting, my understanding, which is probably incorrect, is that if traffic is at a standstill (at a red light, for example) then it is perfectly legal for a motorcyclist to make their way to the head of the pack???

Madman – I didn’t just mean the narrow bike lanes/shoulders. I see lots of places I could easily go in the average 4WD to get me home 5 minutes quicker, but I don’t do it.

For those that don’t believe they can be booked for lane splitting – i’m told there are multiple options for issuing a TIN on that one. Even “Overtaking when unsafe” would probably do the trick – $143 and 2 points – ouch….

And agreed, anyone who would open their door on a rider deserves a lengthy trip to the big house and a new wife called Ivan…..

I hate blogs because its like listening to the voices in other peoples heads.

What does it mean if one twit can make a rather poor statement that he should have kept to himself turns into dozens of people bickering over … oh wait now I’m doing it!

Holden Caulfield said :

@ Dr E post #42

Doctor Evil said :

…Here’s another scenario that’s within the realms of possibility – traffic jam for whatever reason, a car in the left lane overheats and stalls. The passenger/s jump out on the “safe” side to push the car off the road. Bike hits human and/or car door…

Erm, isn’t it a driver/passenger’s responsibility to check it is safe to open a door before doing so? If it is not set in stone that this is the case, then surely common sense dictates as much.

Holden, if you can show me a road rule that indicates that, I would have no choice but to agree with you.

Regardless, if that did actually happen, who do you reckon would be most likely to be found to be in the wrong from a legal point of view? The passenger who forgot to check for motorbikes on the shoulder before getting out, or the rider who hit him?

I think size does matter when using the shoulder or bike lane? You’re not going to get a 25tonne hummer in the bike lane that could safely get between the car next to him. Where on a bike you get into the bike lane or shoulder, keep to the left and slow and you’ve done no harm.

trilobite – it would be interesting for you to know that Nige actually got counselling for suggesting opening doors on riders going past. As said before if you nudge a rider or open your door on them and you injure or kill them – you are the one at fault and you are liable for negligence. Plus you have probably ruined the riders life and will be sued for all your worth. So think about that before you think about it! That’s why we don’t follow that advice.

wait to what?

I think bicycle riders should have to wait to!

@ Dr E post #42

Doctor Evil said :

…Here’s another scenario that’s within the realms of possibility – traffic jam for whatever reason, a car in the left lane overheats and stalls. The passenger/s jump out on the “safe” side to push the car off the road. Bike hits human and/or car door…

Erm, isn’t it a driver/passenger’s responsibility to check it is safe to open a door before doing so? If it is not set in stone that this is the case, then surely common sense dictates as much.

Man I love this site.

How’s the lost dog? Riding his GS500F down a bicycle lane while pissing on the tyres of stopped cars. Drivers grumbling or shrugging. How dare the rotten Rottweiler get home earlier than me!

Why don’t we follow the advice of the morning nitwits on 104.7 and open the car door on filtering motorcyclists? Whoops, took out a bicyclist! Ah well, only 10 points. I’ll go for the pregnant woman in shock from that accident up ahead next.

Why are these damn utes so underpowered?

Loose Brown said :

I’d like to take this opportunity to apologise for breaking down at the intersection of Majura and Limestone Ave on Monday at 5:20pm peak hour. I’d like to assure everyone that no matter how stressful it was having to crawl along all the way from Ainslie, it was far more stressful for me copping the abuse. Note to the lady with the horn – stationary cars with no driver inside and emergency lights on will not get out of your way no matter how long you beep for.

Thanks to the two fellows who helped me push the car through the intersection and out of the way.

Anyone interested in an ’89 SAAB 900i?

What the hell is wrong with people nowadays? We are turning into a city of rude, ignorant idiots. In years gone by, people would’ve stopped to help, now they swear and abuse and press their horns. Pack of pricks!

80s Saabs, a very sad story, those things! They weigh a bit, too, so the blokes who pushed it got their exercise I’d think.

Jeez it’s funny what fires people up on this site. For the record I ride a scooter, have done for 20 years and I sometimes cut through lines of traffic when its stopped or use the bike lane/shoulder at the lights if I’m turning left.

So sue me.

Yep, this would be much better 🙂

http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r46/Motorbiker_photos/NewsPics2/Indonesia-Lots-Motorcycles.jpg

@ Smee, Post 89

Technically the rider has done nothing wrong. I wouldn’t be surprised if the rider had just recieved a stern talking to.
Much like the cops pulling over ‘racer’ cars just cause they can

Bring on Indonesian driving standards. I’ve never agreed with this ‘must drive between the white lines’ homogenous requirement thats not adhered to anywhere else in Oceania.

I don’t think size really matters madman, and there are lots of major arterial roads around that don’t have gutters.

you can’t compare a 4wd to a motorbike….
motorbikes are alot smaller and alot more moverable then a 4wd.

Most likely the 4wd will have to mount the gutter of the shoulder or the likes.

I’ll be one of those Thumper, and actually I don’t think there are so many bikes on the road in any one place/time that the increase in congestion would even be noticeable.

If lots of 4WD owners decided they could “safely” overtake slower traffic by driving up the verge or centre median strip, using the “but it reduces congestion” argument, wouldn’t that be pretty much the same?

Just thought i would contribute to the posts here…maybe we can crack 100 before the nights got.

I was caught in both the jams that happened in the last two weeks. I was glad no cyclyst was hurt this time. The accident happened in the exact same spot as the last one…about half way down the hill in the darkest part of that road.

If you look at the side of the lanes on that part(both north and south) during the day…there is nothing but broken glass and plastic the whole length of it. Check it out the next time you are on it.

No margin for error on that hill but people still drive up my ass like they have ABS brakes. haha.

Obligatory motorbike story:

Was sitting in the left lane at the lights near Melrose High a few months ago when a motorbike pulled up between the two lanes (there was a 4WD in the other lane) and edged in front of my (~2 ton) Falcon. Apparently unknown to him there was a cop car in the right turn lane on the other side of the road.

When the turning lane light went green the cop car did a U turn and stopped in front of us at the bus stop. As soon as our light went green the beacons on the cop car fired up and the cop pointed to the rider and motioned him to the side of the road.

Laugh? Yeah, we did. Lots…

wow bd84. Reading your post it is clear you have no idea about motorcyclists. And poking fun at 3 dead Australian’s because they were riding motorcyclists. Your a disgrace. Those people were sons/daughters of people.

The road would be better and safer with out idiots like yourself out there. But after reading through all the posts its clear you are in a twisted minority.

how many car deaths have there been this year? 474…
Still pretty small figure of motorcycles dying from road related activities.

Motorcycles make up 4.5% of road users and 15% of road toll deaths as well as 20% of the deaths being riders without a valid license along with 10% not wearing a helmet and 20% incorrectly wearing a hemet.

I say there’s more chance of a drivers dying then motorcyclsts….

Having read almost every post above, I could sit here all night and quote all the moronic posts that have been written, mostly by the motorcyclists. They all seem to have the same theme and intent on convinsing themselves that what they do is perfectly safe and legal.

1. Using the road shoulder/emergency lane to bypass traffic is ILLEGAL, there are no excuses unless it is an emergency (which slow moving traffic is not one).

2. You are not contributing to solving the traffic jam, one less in the line of traffic is not going to get anyone anywhere quicker, unless you’re the motorcyclist (if you make it safely).

3. It is not any “safer”, you’re less likely to be seen especially when you run out of road and force/jump back into traffic, reminds me of the moron crashing into the innocent lady’s car doing exactly that a while ago.

4. Weaving in and out of traffic is illegal, even if you are Casey Stoner. The best driver doing a head check IS NOT GOING TO SEE YOU speeding and weaving.

5.You are no more likely to be hit from behind riding a motorcycle, unless your’re said above Casey Stoner weaving into the 2 metre gap as I see most mornings.

6. You have no extra “rights” or deserve any “compensation” for riding a motorcycle. It’s your damn choice, if you choose to ride one you deal with the weather and all the exhaust like everyone else.

7. Yes there are plenty of bad drivers on the road who don’t look, can’t merge, force their way in traffic etc etc, I see them every day. However, the percentage of drivers who do the wrong thing is a lot less than the 95% who think the above are perfectly fine.

But I’m sure the riders will keep on thinking the way they do. The Jas had got it 100% you’re compiling the list of how to become temporary Australians, do I care? nope. They’ll be the roadkill not me. We’re at what 3 motorcyclists dead this year? and there were 5 or 6 a year or two before? No tears here.

OH and I was lucky that the traffic jam was long enough for me to see it and have time to exit onto hindmarsh, go caught in the one a couple of weeks ago. The people reversing down on ramps etc should be shot too.

I wish they’d fix the speed of these damn comment boxes, typing at 3 words per minute is highly annoying.

Ahh LooseBrown, you have my sympathies.

Firstly for owning a Saab, and secondly for breaking down in such a sh!tty spot! I hope you didn’t have to wait too long to get help pushing the car off the road.

Doctor Evil, in answer to your questions:

Would you ride on the left or right shoulder in steady moving traffic? No

Would you ride in a cyclists lane, ever? Yes, if it’s free and there is stopped traffic around.

Would you ride between lanes of moving traffic? Never

Madman, you’re right, bike accidents per km travelled by more riders is reducing. Better training, better bikes including tyres, suspension, frames forks etc, and overall better roads. Shame about the tin cans driven by some of the posters above.

LOL – good one! I guess we’re all retarded in our own ways!! hehehe

madman, if there was a retard test to get a licence the roads would be so quiet we would only need one lane.

Love all the excuses to justify breaking the law. As my favourite quote of all time goes, from one of the greatest cyclists of all time funnily enough, the great uniballed Lance Armstrong, “Excuses are like assholes, everyones got one and they all stink”.

Theres many reasons why motorcyclists are called temporary Australians and you guys seem to be listing them all one by one.

not as long as you chap! :-p

i sometimes wonder about p-platers having such heavy vehicles like 4wd’s and then doing stupid stuff like that. there should also be a retard test before you get a license!

“The same goes for when motorcycles use bike lanes…”

ohhhh ohhh never mind motobike, a saw a 4WD (or 4WMD) use a bike labe last weekend… that’s one P-plater I hope that soon has no driving permit.

Ok, that’s a start. How long riding?

54-11 you will also note that motorcyclists numbers have risen and accidents have decreased – that’s a pretty proud figure to stand by.

I ride a 07 Suzuki GS500F

@54-11, just curious:

Would you ride on the left or right shoulder in steady moving traffic?

Would you ride in a cyclists lane, ever?

Would you ride between lanes of moving traffic?

Motorcyclist are not allwed to that, but nothing will stop them.

Interstingly pedalbikes are allowed to pass staionary vehicles, providing you do it on the left side*. Motorcyclist are apt to do it left/right/whatever, over the top if they have a dirt bike.

*this was introduced to save stationary motorists’ throats from wearing out screaming vulgar abuse at stationary cyclists

As a biker since 1969, most of the time I ride the bike like I do the car – take up my lane and move with the traffic. When traffic is stopped or slow moving, as has been discussed above, then I’ll look for a shortcut that is safe for everyone.

I have no problem with this – bikes are not taking up anyone else’s space (or so little of it not to be noticed). We also have a very small environmental footprint compared with most other vehicles. My bike weighs about 250kg, compared with about 25tonne for some of the Hummer wannabes that are out there, and sips fuel when I’m riding it sanely.

And as pointed out in the thread above, we occasionally make good organ donors, although when the stats about actual prangs and their causes are properly examined, we’re still pretty safe.

And don’t get me start on those scooterists!

What do you ride madman?

No probs CR – Any fellow riders going to attend the funeral?

thanks to madman for the CT article link – court case in june – i’ll be watching this one

hear hear!

Glad you’re still with us blaringmike 🙂

When your riding you have to have the attitude that everyone is out to kill you. Using emergency lanes and splitting to the front of the traffic lights not only reduces congestion and speeds up the trip home for yourself and other road users but it also decreases your chances of being hit by a car. If your at the front of the lights you can get away from the lights quicker than cars and take yourself out of their blind spots as well as give you more road to use in an emergency. Today for example I was stopped at a set of lights in an 80kph zone, I didn’t split to the front of the lights and whilst sitting in traffic heard the dreaded stretch of tyres coming towards me. Some fool had not been paying attention to the traffic lights and at the last moment had locked up his brakes and only just pulled up behind the cars behind me. If I was at the back of the line I would have been nailed at about 60k’s and probably dead.

I’m glad to see that most poster have a positive attitude to motorcycle riders as we do not feel superior than car drivers when we lane split/use emergency lanes. We do it for a variety of reasons including to save our lives.

Must be missing your point madman, assuming you have one. Did you actually read that properly? Was it not a motocross (i.e. racing) bike? Don’t they have a plastic plate on the front where the race number goes? If it had been a legally registered bike wouldn’t there have been a headlight and maybe a rego sticker instead?

Actually I got my bike licence in 1979, how about you?

Funny you say you have been riding along time when in November 2007 you wrote:
“The racing number plate on the front (where the headlight and rego should be) displays a simple sticker – “No Fear”.” about a motorbike…

Not having a go at you or anything I just think it’s funny!! 🙂 :-p

The 100k+ wasn’t a “scenario” madman, it really happened. Only luck saved the cyclist.

I have been riding a long, long time and never found the need to ride anywhere other than in the “legal” lanes. Never had a problem with other vehicles that wouldn’t have happened even if I was in a car.

Strangely enough, the only time I ever came off a bike on the road was due to another motorcyclist suddenly locking up his brakes in front of me, leaving me with no choice but to drop the bike sideways.

Riding a bike is a risk, riding it in places where people don’t expect you to be is a much bigger one.

shiney flu, so you are happy to kill someone for the sake of your so called rights?

You will deliberately cause an accident because you think you are above the law?

I hope you are joking, otherwise you are a fckuwit. I hope I’m wrong and that I misinterpreted your comments.

Obviously you are a cyclist.

Thumper – love the comment!!! I was trying to say the same thing but thought he was more of a cnut! You posted just before me as it took me a while to write above and missed everything between!

Dr Evil – it was on the front page of the CT yesterday.
http://canberra.yourguide.com.au/news/local/news/general/mother-in-anguish-as-son-loses-brave-battle/777161.aspx

I myself am a daily motorcyclist and I have to say to mrnamjama “THANKS!”, motorists that give motorbikes space are legends. I also occasionaly use the left hand lane but not just because it gets me home faster but because it lessons the chance of someone not seeing me and running over me from behind. You have to understand that as a motorcyclist the thing that runs over and over your mind are “the tin-tops are out to kill me” and as a motorcyclist you have to not just concentrate on your riding but the driving of every other motorist because most of the time it is not the rider that causes an accident but the carelessness of the other motorist. – Exactly what twin venom said – you just want to stay away from anything bigger then you.

shiny flu your a cnut. There is no need to say to door motorcyclists… If you mame, injur or kill a rider from dooring them – you are liable for there death. And… you can ride faster then a motorcycle? You sound like a real pompus twit. You nudge them? I hope you do this to me and i’m going to make sure you end up worse – think of your actions if it does cause injury… hope your push bike has insurance/third party… doubt it!

Dr Evil – how far ahead should you be looking while on a motorbike? it’s all about the attitude of the rider. You could safely pull it off if you were doing under 50km/h with 8 seconds of view ahead… don’t know why you would be doing 100+ in a shoulder thats blind luck – but if you take it easy observe the traffic and the road ahead you would avoid any accident – so your scenario is a little flawed there….

You reckon a crap car costs less then my motorcycle to keep? I don’t think so – you’re dreamin!

I would say the main reason behind it all in my opinion is to keep safe and keep away from the bigger vehicles that would potentially kill you.

Not surprised you didn’t post about the dog, 135 comments later it would have been established beyond all doubt that you were a callous, animal-hating, drugged-up child molester.

or taxeeeeeee even…..

Thumper…….taxi!!!!

Which one was that CR?

Spare a thought for the young motorcyclist who lost his life last week (after a nine month battle).

I assume a court will decide the fate of the driver of the vehicle involved in that crash.

Make mine a quadruple thanks

As long as it’s not another influx of f-wits, there’s enough here now

Did you post on here about it?

You, realistically if people didn’t whinge about stuff this site would get about 2 posta a week max.

Check back over the last week (or any week), take out the whinges, and you will probably be left with a story about a lost dog……

The things you people whinge about, seriously…..

oh please – “most motorbike riders don’t do this”???? ALL motorbike riders do this!

Dr Evil, finally someone speaks up to the obvious double standard here. Many on here get amazingly aggro (actually I have heard some say they would like to run them over) when a cyclist rides slowly across a pedestrian crossing to use an example, and then we have a plethora of people saying they have no problem with motorbikes using the bike lanes/shoulders (thats bicycle not motorbike)to get around the car traffic. Both examples are of the person trying to get out of the cars way quickly, so why so much difference in opinion?

I personally think that quite a lot of motorcyclists ride way too fast to begin with, often weaving in and out of traffic and sitting up your arse in your blind spot which I’m sure like cyclists (which I am) and any other minority group isn’t what all of them do, but neverless are noticed far more than the ones that obey the law of which I am sure there are many.

As far as motorcyclists being compensated for the negatives such as cold, helmet hair etc, get real people. You choose to ride, end of story. A crap car costs less than most half decent motorbikes.

@ jase! Yes, I realise the OP was about riding around traffic that had stopped. The car I saw that pulled left onto the shoulder nearly cleaning up a bike rider had been sitting in stationary traffic waiting for the lights to change.

So one impatient idiot nearly got cleaned up by another. Speed just adds to the stupidity factor.

Here’s another scenario that’s within the realms of possibility – traffic jam for whatever reason, a car in the left lane overheats and stalls. The passenger/s jump out on the “safe” side to push the car off the road. Bike hits human and/or car door.

Anyone that thinks riding a bike between/around lanes of traffic is a good idea, regardless of the amount of excuses they can conjure up, is running on blind luck.

Well that is a rare ocurence: a Canberra cage occupant admiting to seeing a motorcycle. Good on the guys for using their initiative and getting home a bit early. Oh yes, I ride a motorbike on the Parkway most days and am generally appalled at the crap I encounter.

The behaviour described is silly – though I was passed recently by a car in the breakdown lane at a silly speed, while I was doing 100 in the left (love that cruise control!) and a ute was overtaking me at, say, 110 in the right. Now that was scary, but regrettably no coppers in the wee small hours.

The issue underlying the behaviour seems to be a species of belief in one’s own specialness. See it anytime a left lane ends (so smart people aren’t in it). Maniacs who use it to steam a few cars ahead and break back in, on the basis that others have more manners and sense and will let them do it – because they’re special. I’m pretty sure there’s a description in the DSM for it …. anyone got one handy?

motorcycles are great for the environment and this is a good demonstration of another of their conveniences (weighted against the already mentioned in-concveniences). maybe see this as a sign, not an incendiary…

Just remember that for every motorcycle creeping up the side there is one less motorcycle in the line of traffic, making it quicker and easier for cars.

Agreed totally.

Additionally, motorcyclists have more to lose than us cage drivers, and as a result of this are more in touch with self preservation than anyone else on the road. They wouldn’t be doing this if it mean them coming to grief.

Sour grapes on the part of the OP, sorry pal.

dr evil the original discussion started off with riders riding down the shoulder when traffic was stopped. I agree that riding down there over the speed limit when traffic is moving is stupid but when traffic is stopped especially due to an accident I don’t have a problem with it

and flu, the last rider I know of who was “doored” had his bike written off but it was the opener of the door who had to pay for it after being charged by the cops.

The same goes for when motorcycles use bike lanes…

Firstly I can ride faster than they can bloody travel and secondly I stick my elbows out when I pass them intentionally nudging them. Why? Well it’s illegal for them and they know it. People who do these types of things deserve to be doored or crash.

What a timely post!

Only a week ago I was heading north on the Monaro highway one morning between the Johnson Drive turnoff and Rose Cottage roundabout (100km/h zone), with plenty of traffic travelling at, or close to, the speed limit in both lanes.

Two motorcyclists in convoy fly past on the left shoulder at well over the speed limit.

Up ahead I spot a cyclist who had left the bike lane temporarily during a break in the traffic(probably to avoid the assorted broken glass and rubbish) and was riding in the left vehicle lane.

I assume he heard the traffic coming and headed back for the safety (?) of the cycle lane, unaware that he had company arriving fast.

The first of these two idiots almost cleaned him up before they both suddenly swerved back into the vehicle lanes, causing everybody to slam on the brakes.

So, tell me again why it’s ok and safe for motorcycles to ride illegally on the shoulder?

Also, if you regularly travel on the stretch of road just past the Rose Cottage roundabout leading up to the lights at Hume, you will see lots of bikes riding on the shoulder.

I recently saw an impatient car driver in the left lane pull off onto the shoulder about 50 metres before the left slip lane onto Long Gully Rd, nearly cleaning up a motorcyclist in the process.

Who’s fault would that be?

And yes, I do regularly ride a motorcycle myself.

I was in that Jam last night for about 40ish minutes. Motorcyclists were fine. When I got to the front I only saw 2 cars, are you sure it was four?

I’m more pissed off at the incosiderate people who crash their cars and then leave them on the road while they walk around in shock. I don’t care that you crashed, If you’re not dead get your crapbox off the road as quickly as possible and let everyone else get on with their lives.

And oh so annoying! I felt for the small children in the back.

I had had enough by then and was hiding behind a tree chanting ‘there’s no place like home, there’s no place like home…’

More power to motorcyclists in instances like this I reckon.

For those complaining about being stuck in traffic, if you could squeeze in and get around with relative ease, I am sure you would do the same as well. The motorcyclists aren’t hurting anyone, and so long as they’re as sensible about it as can be what is the big deal? Where does it stop … what if somebody got out and walked on the shoulder and managed to be faster than you, would you get cranky at them also?

For those complaining about car queue jumpers … what is worse? Motorists using two relatively empty lanes on Commonwealth Ave Bridge, for example, or a bunch of lemmings that are unable to merge and change lanes with any degree of competence?

Nothing frustrates me more than an empty lane on a dual carriageway. I’m sorry, you’ll all call me a queue jumper, but all of our taxes have paid for both lanes, so I see no reason why a lane should be empty just because people cannot merge properly.

I’d like to take this opportunity to apologise for breaking down at the intersection of Majura and Limestone Ave on Monday at 5:20pm peak hour. I’d like to assure everyone that no matter how stressful it was having to crawl along all the way from Ainslie, it was far more stressful for me copping the abuse. Note to the lady with the horn – stationary cars with no driver inside and emergency lights on will not get out of your way no matter how long you beep for.

Thanks to the two fellows who helped me push the car through the intersection and out of the way.

Anyone interested in an ’89 SAAB 900i?

V twin – I think the Plod are fairly reasonable about the deal, they impact with the quality of Canberra’s drivers on a far more regular basis than any motorbike rider.

One of the many little ‘common sense prevails’ kind of look the other way, thingammyjigs.

Just flick over to ABC Classic FM, crank it up and all the cares that you have will float away. It wont make the traffic ‘jam’ go away or get you home any quicker, but you’ll certainly still be in a good mood!

If a motorcyclist going past you in traffic is the worst thing that happened to you all day then I reckon its been a good one.

I read it but I don’t believe it. I was sure that most of you Rioters would be abuseing the crap out of the motorcyce community on this one.

I ride 5 days a week, rain, hail or shine on my 100km round trip to work and back. When ever possible I split lanes and use the shoulder to gain pole position at traffic lights.

I do this for one reason and with one exception. The reason – to keep as big a distance as possible between me and the rest of the traffic once the light changes to green. It’s a matter of self preservation. The exception – traffic MUST be stopped.

As for the gridlock situation, I will again use the shoulder but the exception still stands and I travel slowly because you never know what may lie ahead eg. crap on the road or a car suddenly pulling out trying to do the same thing and if a prang is the reason for the standstill, it will usually mean re-entering the traffic stream
at some point because Mr Plod will be waiting up the road and he has no sense of humour regarding such behaviour.

I often get stuck behind a postie on the GDE, southbound, around 9am weekdays, going 65kph max, orange saddle bags on each side, traffic held up for a mile, and the bugger doesn’t bother moving to one side. It’s happened 6 times in the past fortnight. Bluddy 125cc bees, shouldn’t be on the roads. But I still want my mail so I’ll make an exception, just this once. Avoided the GDE this morning, it’s lost it’s appeal.

Oh, and “You shop at Myer this week and you’ll get blah blah blah, this has been a traffic report brought to you by blah blah. Sorry I didn’t tell you what you really needed to know to avoid all those traffic jams blah blah”.

I was wondering what that was on my way to Woden last night. It was just about backed up to the turn off on Hindmarsh at 6:50. So thankfully I just missed it. I was more bemused by the 4WD after taking the exit towards Tuggers from Hindmarsh, they had changed their mind and was now reversing down the road. They kept mostly to the side which was good, but no less stupid.

What’s wrong with motorbikes sailing past? They’re getting out of the way, meaning LESS traffic for cars to deal with. I have no problem with this – it’s not like it’s impacting me.

well thanks guys for making my day while home crook. riding in hobart I never used to lane split, the traffic there rarely was bad enough to make it worthwhile. up here I do though, the lanes seem wider and the traffic is heavier.

yes the legality of it is questionable but like was mentioned before being hit up the backside by a car while stationary doesn’t seem like fun and if I make it to the front then I will be across the intersection before your foot is even off the brake, and if I don’t make it to the front I will just slot in.

I realise this does annoy some drivers (driver of a new black hilux on chrome rims and with a chrome grille for example) but I see it as at least helping to be part of the solution for congestion rather than being part of the problem and sitting in the middle of it all in a car

small vehicle utilising space to get home faster to have a beer. Dont have a problem and good on them.

in the bigger scheme of things going on in the world if this stressed you out and ruined your day then move to sydney or melbourne and see how you feel about traffic there. big deal if a motorcyclist does that. i am a motorcyclist and why should i not use the lane if the road is blocked? would you like me to pick you up next time?
all i have to say is that i pay rego for my bike so i can use the lane as i can use a bus lane as well which also cuts travel time in peak hour if i use it. any complaints there? id like to know your thoughts on push bike riders when they do whatever they want on the road and they dont pay rego yet im sure they cut traffic as well.
grow up!

darkmilk said :

“Motorcyclists using the emergency lanes and bike lanes to get around traffic is illegal in the ACT”
“it’ may be illegal (as in against the law) “

Last time I read the Australian road rules (something we should all do occasionally, it’s amazing how many small details we all forget) it is actually OK to use shoulders, footpaths, cross double lines etc for several reasons, one of which is to avoid an obstruction as long as it’s safe. Traffic moving 10 km/h too slowly probably doesn’t count as an obstruction but I reckon traffic stopped or nearly so (50 km/h below the speed limit on a clear day) counts 😉 but I’ve never been enough of a knobhead to have to argue that to the police.

I think you will find that “obstruction” is something that is a hazard that may cause an accident, ie broken down vehicle etc. Gridlock doesn’t really fit this situation I would think.

What’s interesting about this is that I was in the middle of this “traffic jam” last night, and I didn’t really notice the motorcyclists (who I agree with, that motorists treat with utter disregard). What I did notice were the numerous cars holding up the entire flow of traffic as the stopped, crossed lanes and went off-road over the traffic island to head back towards Weston for a quicker route. Our trip took longer because these morons stopped, crossed lanes, then stopped again to decide “should I, or shouldn’t I. Quicker, or not quicker”. After a few blows of my horn, the idiots made up their mind and doubled back. Good, they’d probably be one of the drivers causing the huge delay as they slowed down and stop to look at the 2 cars of idiots who had what looked to be a tailgating accident at high speed – holding up the flow of traffic further. Happy days!

More interestingly, I was listening in utter disbelief while in the traffic jam at some woman on 104.7 complaining that her poor husband has to pay too much tax, and that the $150k he earns (she doesn’t work), per year isn’t enough to make ends meet! Good grief! I thinks that’s almost worthy of a post in itself!

“Motorcyclists using the emergency lanes and bike lanes to get around traffic is illegal in the ACT”
“it’ may be illegal (as in against the law) “

Last time I read the Australian road rules (something we should all do occasionally, it’s amazing how many small details we all forget) it is actually OK to use shoulders, footpaths, cross double lines etc for several reasons, one of which is to avoid an obstruction as long as it’s safe. Traffic moving 10 km/h too slowly probably doesn’t count as an obstruction but I reckon traffic stopped or nearly so (50 km/h below the speed limit on a clear day) counts 😉 but I’ve never been enough of a knobhead to have to argue that to the police.

I love it when someone has a whine about “unfairness” and then gets the smackdown laid upon them (and from a great height!) by RA regulars. Thanks for brightening my day, lads and lasses. 🙂

I go out of my way to make space for motorbike riders whenever I can…

I consider it to be a different kettle of fish to queue jumping – a motorcyclist is doing 2 things, getting out of the way of everybody else, and reducing congestion.

I understand that most Motorbike riders don’t do this, but why did these riders feel that they were better than the rest of us?

I am pretty sure that what is motivating them is not a train of thought beginning with “I am better than all these cars…” so much as “I can get through this traffic and home much faster if I do this….”

So, no need for you to sit there feeling agitated at the perception that you are somehow being judged less worthy by a total stranger.

Hmmm – You clearly are confused about the role of the Police…

They are there to record information to be used to create cases for the court system. That way – they actually form a critical component of the ACT govmit revenue raising arm.

To believe that they are there to direct traffic – to let it flow more rapidly – is utter rubbish.

By the way – I used to ride, and spent two years on my ‘L’ plates – couldn’t be bothered doing the practice to avoid the 7 little cones in a row – in riding for 2 years, i never encountered a situation whereby I had to swerve around the little cones in a real life situation. I understand, and support the use of ‘alternative’ measures to avoid cars that the motor bikes use.

But – WOE be unto any pushbike rider that flouts even a single red light, or transitions from ‘road’ to ‘pedestrian’ mode. UYT%$R(&^%&%$#^E*(&%$&*(%( $$#@@@!@!@@#

Grumble.

Suck it up. I bet you would do the exact same thing in the same situation or are you honestly telling me you would wait in line between cars out of fairness??? Besides, they weren’t speeding passed the cars or driving dangerously from my vantage point. I don’t think that they think they are better than people in cars, it’s that they ARE better than people in cars when it comes to a situation like this and why shouldn’t they use that advantage? Yes it’ may be illegal (as in against the law) but breaking the law in this instance didn’t put anyone else in a potentially harmful situation so what’s the problem??

I’m not a motorcyclist but I have no problem with them doing this.

Motorcyclists should get some compensation for being the good community-minded organ-donors that they are.

As a motorist, I drive an automobile, and I find this quite frustrating.

Car push-ins and queue jumpers are a different matter, because the cars behind them have to stop to let them in, so the whole line stops. Everyone is adversly affected by someone “getting ahead”. They suck.

Motorcycles, yeah, I’ve thought about it, but essentially they’re not harming anyone else and that’s the crux of it for me.

I too am a motorcyclist, and I do this. The last few mornings I’ve done it on the GDE, as doing around 10-20km/h in almost stationary traffic, with cars doing 80-100 km/h coming up behind me, in the fog, while I’m sitting on a motorbike, isn’t my idea of fun.

I’ve been cleaned up from behind in traffic before. It hurts. Yes, it’s not technically legal, but at the same time I think it’s the lesser of two evils – being a sitting duck for someone who doesn’t slow down enough and taps you from behind, or risking the perils of the crap on the side of the road, people opening their doors (not much of a problem on the Parkway etc, unless someone is being deliberately stupid), or the odd person swerving out. In fact, in pretty stationary traffic, it’s hard for someone to swerve out at you, so that’s how it goes.

Do people object to cars pushing down the left-hand side to turn right at some of the bigger intersections (which have sliplanes away from the lights for people who want to turn left)? It’s identical to motorbikes filtering – you turn two lanes (plus almost into the slip lane, but not quite) into three lanes, with a car pushing down the left.

Yes, it probably is just jealousy. I sit there when I’m in the car and it’s frustrating with bikes getting past, but hey, you don’t have to brave the freezing sitting in your car. Or the stinking heat of summer.

ant said :

Closest thing to gridlock? You haven’t been in the Moreshead/Pialligo/Fairbairn area during morning and evening rush hour evidently! This doesn’t happen due to crashes, it happens *every* workday as the intersections lock up, people queue across them and no one can move in any direction. .

I try not to go near those areas at all – but for a standard drive home of 12mins max, crawling on the parkway seems a bit strange. I would have thought having a police car off the road directing the 2 lanes into the emergency lane and left hand lane could have sorted this out far quicker than getting the 2 lanes to merge into 1.

What I don’t understand is that whilst the riders were doing this, they weren’t paying attention to other cars – there was a case where one L-plater almost became an accident victim when a car lurched out of the way of a merging car into the shoulder.

I have several friends who ride bikes, and I wear a look left, look right, look volvo sticker on my car – but they are amazed that more riders don’t get cleaned up by doing dangerous things on the road, and we all agree that the levels of courtesy have gone out the window – for all road users. I am the first to admit that there are dangerous drivers in cars as well – look at the “rally drivers” that come out when it rains.

As a motorcyclist of some 6 or 7 years now and having mostly obeyed the road rules in that time, I don’t understand the animosity show toward motorcyclists who are doing the right thing and (because of the nature of their vehicle) are able to mavouvre through the traffic more quickly without causing any more delays to other motorists than they may already be suffering. When there were roadworks on William Hovell Drive way back when I actually had a motorist move their car across to block my path when I was trying to get past on the right. Motorcyclists using the emergency lanes and bike lanes to get around traffic is illegal in the ACT, but the use of “Bus Only” lanes is legal and there is still the same amount of animosity from some motorists.

I agree with ant that if they’re getting ahead in the traffic but not at anyone elses expense then they should be left well enough alone. I also agree with RuffnReady in that motorcyclists have to put up with a plethora of other inconveniences (including helmet hair, getting wet, breathing in exhaust fumes, being at greater risk whilst riding etc etc) so in a way they almost deserve a little compensation.

Myself, possibly BECAUSE I’m a motorcyclist some of the time, I don’t have a problem with them going around me. I have many motorcyclists go past me on the left each day while I’m driving (or rolling slowly) along the Gungahlin Drive Extension. I simply turn my heater (or airconditioner) up and smile. 🙂

yeah, using the shoulder is probably illegal (actually I’m sure it is), but spare a thought for the two-wheelers stuck behind cars belching exhaust. I got stuck in crawling traffic on the Commonwealth Ave bridge a few weeks ago and almost passed out from the fumes. Next time I’ll take my chances on the shoulder.

And how about the car drivers who cut lines? I see it all the time. Face it, courtesy is dead, and in this case they aren’t really doing any harm.

Suck it up. Motorbike riders are 5x more likely to die on the road than you so they need to extract some sort of compensation from the road.

Closest thing to gridlock? You haven’t been in the Moreshead/Pialligo/Fairbairn area during morning and evening rush hour evidently! This doesn’t happen due to crashes, it happens *every* workday as the intersections lock up, people queue across them and no one can move in any direction.

I agree, the ‘traffic watch’ radio thingy seldom reports on actual incidents like this so you can avoid them. Having a well-publicised “short” phone number would help.

as for the motorcyclists, I have to admit their utilising shoulders etc doesn’t really worry me, as they don’t affect the rest of the traffic. They don’t cause lines of traffic to slow down, yes they do get ahead, but it’s not at my expense, or anyone else’s.