12 March 2013

Given a chance will cyclists do the right thing?

12 March 2013 | Dorfrom

…Sadly, the answer is an unsurprising ‘no’.

Walking down the celebrations along the lake on the NLA side, I came across this sign:

But I was perplexed by what I saw, surely that would mean that people would be dismounting due to an event where there are crowds of people and small children around? Surely cyclists would do the right thing and follow the direction instead of what I saw, a select group of people being selfish and ploughing through the crowd in a “me first” attitude.

Perhaps there’s a misunderstanding here, maybe the hapless fools who organised the event have only placed the sign on one end of the stretch and people have just not seen it?

No, that’s not it. They’re just self absorbed jerks.

So I took it upon myself to both observe and gently remind a few people that the sign there was not a suggestion like riding through red lights or riding full speed in family areas. What did I see? Most of the casual rider groups upon seeing the sign would dismount and do the right thing. The majority of those wearing the spandex getups would see the signs but that is about it, they’d just continue riding through the crowd. I even went to the effort of doing a “oi!” whilst pointing at the sign, all I got were fingers or just a look and peddling off into the crowds.

Strangely I didn’t see any cars driving through showing the same level disrespect.

I took a few photos before I got tired of seeing it over and over. This is exactly why people get pissed at cyclists (I also overheard a comment regarding it from a random passer by). Its a direction for the safety of everyone, not just a suggestion that you can power peddle through. There were young children and decent sized crowds. If anyone there was riding through the crowds, lets hear the justification for it, the signs were up and all around so that isn’t an excuse. A lot of people were dismounting, why weren’t you?

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KB19713:02 pm 15 Mar 13

Grail said :

Dilandach scores 40 out of the 172 responses so far. Not bad, but obviously someone with a barrow to push. This comes back to the article about assumed moral codes (Why Cyclists Enrage Car Drivers).

Dilandach apparently believes that any sign bearing instructions is to be obeyed.

Given the lack of response here: http://the-riotact.com/learn-how-to-drive/75946

I would say the barrow is full 😉

bundah2:40 pm 15 Mar 13

DrKoresh said :

davo101 said :

I ride to work in my work clothes (shocking I know). If I’m feeling really keen this includes a tie as it increases the pleasure of overtaking a member of the lycra brigade.

I think I’m a little bit in love with you now :p 😀

Attracted by the ‘odour de pheromone’?

DrKoresh2:27 pm 15 Mar 13

davo101 said :

I ride to work in my work clothes (shocking I know). If I’m feeling really keen this includes a tie as it increases the pleasure of overtaking a member of the lycra brigade.

I think I’m a little bit in love with you now :p 😀

tim_c2:19 pm 15 Mar 13

I took a few photos before I got tired of seeing it over and over.

If your attention span on this thread is anything to go by, you must have been standing there until the signs were packed away before you got “tired of seeing it over and over”. And after all that, you only managed to photograph three cyclists riding past the advisory signs. Granted, one of them is about the same size as two people.

Grail1:25 pm 15 Mar 13

Dilandach scores 40 out of the 172 responses so far. Not bad, but obviously someone with a barrow to push. This comes back to the article about assumed moral codes (Why Cyclists Enrage Car Drivers).

Dilandach apparently believes that any sign bearing instructions is to be obeyed.

Aeek1:01 pm 15 Mar 13

slashdot said :

Canberroid said :

You still haven’t grasped the fact that some “rules” deserve to be ignored.

Motorists en mass have decided that “rules” pertaining to on road bike paths deserved to be ignored, so shouldn’t that mean cyclists go back to using bike paths?

Don’t you mean go back to using roads? Bikes were there first.

slashdot11:55 am 15 Mar 13

Canberroid said :

You still haven’t grasped the fact that some “rules” deserve to be ignored.

Motorists en mass have decided that “rules” pertaining to on road bike paths deserved to be ignored, so shouldn’t that mean cyclists go back to using bike paths?

Solidarity11:18 am 15 Mar 13

johnboy said :

Well I wear jeans or shorts, more rarely suit trousers.

Quite a lot of women seem to like riding in summer dresses for which I am eternally thankful

Ones on BMX’s in booty shorts are better.

poetix10:28 am 15 Mar 13

johnboy said :

Well I wear jeans or shorts, more rarely suit trousers.

Quite a lot of women seem to like riding in summer dresses for which I am eternally thankful

There was an old Scottish man who used to ride a bike in the inner north in a kilt. He would set up with an ancient boom box and tell everyone to repent or they’d go to Hell, and he had signs about that, too. The whole thing was from another era, even the type of Christianity, it seemed.

I never caught a glimpse under the kilt. Thank you Jesus.

davo10110:02 am 15 Mar 13

johnboy said :

Well I wear jeans or shorts, more rarely suit trousers.

I ride to work in my work clothes (shocking I know). If I’m feeling really keen this includes a tie as it increases the pleasure of overtaking a member of the lycra brigade.

tim_c10:46 am 13 Mar 13

Dilandach said :

The reactions go part way to show that in any section there are a subsection of those that attempt to justify why rules don’t apply to them. Whether it is not wearing helmets, why its ‘safer’ for a cyclist to run a red light, not wearing hi-vis gear / lights on a the bike whilst riding at night or in this case a simple sign with a simple request. There are just excuses after excuses on why.

“cars were parked illegally!” (What that has to do with the subject at hand I’m not sure)
“can’t walk in the shoes”
“it was only a suggestion”
“no one got hurt”

A simple direction that was far too much for some to handle. There were others that were able to dismount and follow directions, others… well its a shame that they are only demand following the letter of the law when it comes to pedestrians or drivers and pull out Regulations in an attempt to strengthen and prove their point.

The only difference between this and other threads is that it was primarily cyclists doing the wrong thing, there were no drivers involved. There are already plenty of threads from cyclists doing the whole “oh won’t somebody think of the children! (on bikes)” when it comes to drivers and sometimes pedestrians.

So what happens when cyclists do something wrong and they’re called on it? Apparently you literally become Hitler.

First of all, your original post asked for reasons why some didn’t (or wouldn’t) dismount – what would you expect other than a bunch of reasons (or excuses as you call them)?

Secondly, you’ve been very selective in the ‘reasons’ you’ve remembered, and you seem to have ignored comments that indicate there was no legal requirement to dismount. Black text on a yellow background means advisory or cautionary signage. If it were black text on a white background, it would be mandatory. Even then, it probably wouldn’t be enforceable in ACT as it would contradict existing road rules which allow cyclists to ride in pedestrian and shared areas (other than within 10m of a shop open for trading, and on a pedestrian crossing).

Thirdly, the signage is inadequate – where was the sign saying that cyclists could remount? Without such signage, it is up to the cyclists discretion.

Fourth, opting not to follow the suggestions of a cautionary/advisory sign in no way implies that same person would disobey mandatory rules such as wearing helmets, stopping at red lights and/or using lights whilst riding at night. I wasn’t there, but I would probably not have dismounted because it was only an advisory/cautionary sign that has no legal basis, but I do always wear a helmet, stop at red lights (and not just to film all the people driving their cars through after the light has changed http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ui65_higKk4), and I always use lights after sunset – because these things are mandatory.

OpenYourMind5:19 pm 12 Mar 13

Dilandach said :

KB1971 said :

Dilandach said :

KB1971 said :

I would love to see you report someone in a motor vehicle for say, running a red light see how much action you get from the police.

Like the Jim’s Mower guy?

KB1971 said :

I seriously doubt even with camera footage they would do anything about it.

My very valid point is, people carry on here like a cyclist is the antichrist when they break a rule but not other road users doing equally, if not more stupid things in vehicle that weigh up to 62.5 tonnes.

The lack of logic astounds me.

Yep, I am a cyclist, but I am also a motorcyclist, a car driver. Yep other cyclists give me the shits, but so do pedestrians, car drivers, motorcyclists, truck drivers and pretty well anyone who uses the roads without thought to anyone else.

I have to say, Dilandach has done an excellent trolling job.

So far the majority of the comments have just been “well, other people do worse!” or just plain giving “so what?”.

So I’ll ask what I’ve been asking repeatedly, was it really too much to ask to dismount?

Ahhh, but the Jims mowing guy actually had an accident with another road user and then left the scene of said accident.

As discussed in that thread, the result of the action directly leads to the severety of the crime. If he had killed the rider then he may have been done for vehiclular homicide.

In the case that most people here talk about with cyclists, they want them registered so they are accountable for their actions (which they are anyway) so they can report them running red lights & riding across pedestrian crossings. I have no real issue with this except that it wont really change a thing. As I said, try reporting a car running a red light with all the details to the police & see what would happen.

Sweet FA as they really do have better things to do.

As far as cyclist being held accountable? They are if you handle the situation right. I have had two accidents with cyclists, one while riding my Honda and the other in my car. Both times we exchanged details and I clamied once through my insurance for the repairs which the rider had to pay (I didnt worry about it the other time).

Has anyone been talking about rego for bikes in here?

There was no crime, I never indicated that there was a law broken or that any one was killed or injured however there was certainly potential and was most likely the motivating factor behind the signs being placed there. The main point was when it came to common courtesy, was it paid?

So, no law broken, you are simply bitching because you perceive that people weren’t courteous. Personally, I find the cyclists dismount signs to be discourteous. Dismounting goes fundamentally against the whole point of being on your bike in the first place and for some of us lycra clad enthusiasts not an easy thing to do in that our clip-in shoes are designed for riding, not walking. It’s a bit like telling a car driver to push their car at certain places. They simply won’t do it,because the instruction itself is silly.

The lycra clad brigade spend enormous sums of money on our delicate carbon fibre machines. The last thing we want to do is hit someone or something.

A simpler sign would be ‘slow down – pedestrian event ahead’.

We are lobbying to get the pedestrian crossing law changed too, because it is equally silly. A more appropriate law would be for cyclists to slow down to a set speed limit approaching crossings. Dismounting is counter-intuitive and the majority of riders (lycra clad and otherwise) simply disobey the rule because it makes no sense.

Dilandach3:16 pm 12 Mar 13

KB1971 said :

Dilandach said :

KB1971 said :

I would love to see you report someone in a motor vehicle for say, running a red light see how much action you get from the police.

Like the Jim’s Mower guy?

KB1971 said :

I seriously doubt even with camera footage they would do anything about it.

My very valid point is, people carry on here like a cyclist is the antichrist when they break a rule but not other road users doing equally, if not more stupid things in vehicle that weigh up to 62.5 tonnes.

The lack of logic astounds me.

Yep, I am a cyclist, but I am also a motorcyclist, a car driver. Yep other cyclists give me the shits, but so do pedestrians, car drivers, motorcyclists, truck drivers and pretty well anyone who uses the roads without thought to anyone else.

I have to say, Dilandach has done an excellent trolling job.

So far the majority of the comments have just been “well, other people do worse!” or just plain giving “so what?”.

So I’ll ask what I’ve been asking repeatedly, was it really too much to ask to dismount?

Ahhh, but the Jims mowing guy actually had an accident with another road user and then left the scene of said accident.

As discussed in that thread, the result of the action directly leads to the severety of the crime. If he had killed the rider then he may have been done for vehiclular homicide.

In the case that most people here talk about with cyclists, they want them registered so they are accountable for their actions (which they are anyway) so they can report them running red lights & riding across pedestrian crossings. I have no real issue with this except that it wont really change a thing. As I said, try reporting a car running a red light with all the details to the police & see what would happen.

Sweet FA as they really do have better things to do.

As far as cyclist being held accountable? They are if you handle the situation right. I have had two accidents with cyclists, one while riding my Honda and the other in my car. Both times we exchanged details and I clamied once through my insurance for the repairs which the rider had to pay (I didnt worry about it the other time).

Has anyone been talking about rego for bikes in here?

There was no crime, I never indicated that there was a law broken or that any one was killed or injured however there was certainly potential and was most likely the motivating factor behind the signs being placed there. The main point was when it came to common courtesy, was it paid?

KB19713:05 pm 12 Mar 13

Dilandach said :

KB1971 said :

I would love to see you report someone in a motor vehicle for say, running a red light see how much action you get from the police.

Like the Jim’s Mower guy?

KB1971 said :

I seriously doubt even with camera footage they would do anything about it.

My very valid point is, people carry on here like a cyclist is the antichrist when they break a rule but not other road users doing equally, if not more stupid things in vehicle that weigh up to 62.5 tonnes.

The lack of logic astounds me.

Yep, I am a cyclist, but I am also a motorcyclist, a car driver. Yep other cyclists give me the shits, but so do pedestrians, car drivers, motorcyclists, truck drivers and pretty well anyone who uses the roads without thought to anyone else.

I have to say, Dilandach has done an excellent trolling job.

So far the majority of the comments have just been “well, other people do worse!” or just plain giving “so what?”.

So I’ll ask what I’ve been asking repeatedly, was it really too much to ask to dismount?

Ahhh, but the Jims mowing guy actually had an accident with another road user and then left the scene of said accident.

As discussed in that thread, the result of the action directly leads to the severety of the crime. If he had killed the rider then he may have been done for vehiclular homicide.

In the case that most people here talk about with cyclists, they want them registered so they are accountable for their actions (which they are anyway) so they can report them running red lights & riding across pedestrian crossings. I have no real issue with this except that it wont really change a thing. As I said, try reporting a car running a red light with all the details to the police & see what would happen.

Sweet FA as they really do have better things to do.

As far as cyclist being held accountable? They are if you handle the situation right. I have had two accidents with cyclists, one while riding my Honda and the other in my car. Both times we exchanged details and I clamied once through my insurance for the repairs which the rider had to pay (I didnt worry about it the other time).

Dilandach1:28 pm 12 Mar 13

KB1971 said :

Dilandach said :

KB1971 said :

Kewl, tomorrow I am going to sit out on Norhtbourne Ave and photograph a community demographic doing the “wrong” thing.

Like the parking photos? Or the many stories on drivers doing the “wrong” thing when it comes to cyclists?

…somehow bringing attention to cyclists doing the wrong thing when it comes to pedestrians is just awful! Those poor illiterate cyclists.

It was a direction, one that a lot simply ignored. Now why was that? It was clear why they were there.

‘kewl’? I thought that went out in the 90s zerocool.

You know why its attracts this sort of attention?

Beacues they are not alone. When it comes to stuff like this there is always a part of the COMMUNITY that ignores a direction.

As Helium said, there were people illegally parking all over the place and had dogs (one came up to my 2 year old and scared him as he didnt expect it). Are you taking photos of them & posting them all ove the net on your sopbox? No.

There are no police reports of any incidents, my experience with all the riders were positive (I was on the north side of the lake), there was no issue.

Kewl.

KB1971 said :

Dilandach said :

KB1971 said :

Kewl, tomorrow I am going to sit out on Norhtbourne Ave and photograph a community demographic doing the “wrong” thing.

Like the parking photos? Or the many stories on drivers doing the “wrong” thing when it comes to cyclists?

…somehow bringing attention to cyclists doing the wrong thing when it comes to pedestrians is just awful! Those poor illiterate cyclists.

It was a direction, one that a lot simply ignored. Now why was that? It was clear why they were there.

‘kewl’? I thought that went out in the 90s zerocool.

You know why its attracts this sort of attention?

Beacues they are not alone. When it comes to stuff like this there is always a part of the COMMUNITY that ignores a direction.

As Helium said, there were people illegally parking all over the place and had dogs (one came up to my 2 year old and scared him as he didnt expect it). Are you taking photos of them & posting them all ove the net on your sopbox? No.

There are no police reports of any incidents, my experience with all the riders were positive (I was on the north side of the lake), there was no issue.

Kewl.

So I can expect the same vigor the next time a cyclist vs car, car vs cyclist, pedestrian vs cyclist, cyclist vs pedestrian, car parking wrong, car speeding, car cutting off cyclist, story comes up?

“Everyone else is doing stuff” doesn’t seem to wash for drivers, why are cyclists in this situation much different?

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