19 July 2021

Double glazing in Canberra?

| Deref
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I’m thinking about retrofitting double glazing.

Does anyone have any experience or recommendations?

Thanks!

If you are also looking for a glazier in Canberra, check out our recently updated article The best glaziers in Canberra

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I decided to get a quote from Magnetite (Canberra) after seeing the product used on a television program (in that case it was for noise issues and not thermal). My house is an 1960s-1983-extended home in Narrabundah with all single pane windows. The quotes I got for conventional double glazing were astronomical, the frames and windows would be thrown away (because who wants metal framed windows and older wooden windows…), and there would be significant disruption. So I got the whole house retrofitted dble-glazed by the Magnetite product and have not regretted it. The first night following the 2 day installation completion, when the temperature dropped to minus 4 degrees Celsius, there was NO condensation on any of the windows in the morning! Unbelievable after spending years with condensation every day in winter. I am assuming my gas central-heating consumption will be also be substantially reduced. My dealings with the Canberra office was excellent from the quote through to the installation. All my questions were answered promptly and in-full. The installers were methodical and efficient and always respectful and mindful of their surroundings during the two-day installation process. The job was completed within the predicted timeframe, and all appointment times honoured.

Deref said :

Whoops – my mistake – the Magnetite bloke came today. He was obviously knowledgeable and gave us a good rundown on how they worked. The quote was, I thought, quite impressive. Remember that the house is solar passive and the whole long north-facing wall is basically glass. The quote was a little over $11k, excluding the far end of the house that contains the kids’ bedrooms and bathroom. We asked for some of it to be split up so that we could do it a bit at a time if we decide to do it that way. The Mrs wants to see the showroom and we may do some bits initially to see how it goes and she may want a quote for traditional double glazing (though I wouldn’t bother personally).

The advice to consider how long it would take to save that sort of money on heating and cooling is definitely something we’ll consider before we jump but, so far, I’m quite impressed.

Magnetite = awesome.

Does a great job in both heating/cooling and sound reduction. I couldn’t be happier with them!

Comic_and_Gamer_Nerd11:14 am 10 May 12

I will just say that, unless you have your walls and roof insulated, then double glazing will make hardly any difference. Are you looking at installing entire new frames or do you have existing timber frames that will fit double glazed units in? Are you doing it yourself or get somebody to do it for you?
I cant see you saving money importing from england. Units made here themselves are quite cheap now days.

I am interested in double glazing, is it worth importing from somewhere such as the UK?? There is an abundance of the stuff there and it is a standard in all buildings now. Worth noting that double glazing units fail (go bad) after 20 or so years.

michellecanberra11:57 am 26 Nov 11

milkman said :

Unless your existing glass is really thin, I woould struggle to see the benefits of double glazing over spending the money on decent window dressings and insulation for ceilings, walls (and sometimes floors).

There does come a point of diminishing return when considering efficiency improvements.

The problem with putting on heavy drapes etc is that you lose your view. I have double glazed in a couple of my homes and recently used a company in Sydney called Eco Vue. They use Chinese windows. Their quality was awful and dealing with a Sydney supplier was very hard. They were not available to come and do service calls a they were busy in Sydney. I didn’t get flyscreens or reveals and the windows had to be assembled at my house. My builder was frustrated and it took 15 weeks to get my windows from the date of order. I would not use them again.

There are a couple of local companies that can handle the window order for you and take the whole burden off you. In hindsight, I should have used them. They are here in Canberra and can deal with everything from the order to any after sales services. My friend used them and their windows are far better than mine. The company she used was Solace Creations and they are http://www.solacecreations.com.au. She was very happy with them and she bought the Inframe Windows from Melbourne which are a German window system.

She paid about $2,000 more than I did but I can tell you, if I had known the Eco Vue windows were such poor quality then I would have saved up for the better local product.

Hindsight is a great thing!

Felix the Cat7:35 pm 24 Sep 11

banjo said :

Not wanting to high jack the thread but it is inline with the topic, has anyone had any experience with the roller shutters for their windows? I know they introduce a security element not found in double glazing but are they any better at noise reduction and insulation over a form of double glazing? I to am considering my options for the windows but my number 1 concern is noise as I live on a main road, insulation second, security not so much… especialy if that is what I am really paying for.

I have roller shutter and find they are good for heat/cold insulation but don’t notice much difference with noise, though my street is relatively quiet…except for 4am this morning when a V8 driving bogan decided to get in some practice for the Summernats burnout comp outside my bedroom window.

DON’T pay retail price for roller shutters, the RRP they quote can be halved straight away and a good negotiator coulod probably talk the price down even further. The electric version is even more overpriced – about $1500 EXTRA PER SHUTTER! A remote control garage door motor is <$500 installed I have no idea why roller shutters would be more expensive as the motor wouldn't need to be as heavy duty.

Whoops – my mistake – the Magnetite bloke came today. He was obviously knowledgeable and gave us a good rundown on how they worked. The quote was, I thought, quite impressive. Remember that the house is solar passive and the whole long north-facing wall is basically glass. The quote was a little over $11k, excluding the far end of the house that contains the kids’ bedrooms and bathroom. We asked for some of it to be split up so that we could do it a bit at a time if we decide to do it that way. The Mrs wants to see the showroom and we may do some bits initially to see how it goes and she may want a quote for traditional double glazing (though I wouldn’t bother personally).

The advice to consider how long it would take to save that sort of money on heating and cooling is definitely something we’ll consider before we jump but, so far, I’m quite impressed.

Deref said :

Got Magnetite coming out to give us a quote on Saturday. I’ll let you know how it goes.

Thanks Deref, Please do. I have heard many great things about magnetite and have been meaning to call them myself. My neighbours have gotten it on their lounge room, sliding door and main bedroom for both temperature and noise insulation (we live on a busy road) and they have been really happy with thte results this winter. They did some research on the wers website which rates all windows in Australia for energy efficiency and said that magnetite rated really high. so definitley let us know what you think.

Banjo
I’ve got shutters – but I don’t find they insulate very well against noise.

banjo said :

Not wanting to high jack the thread but it is inline with the topic, has anyone had any experience with the roller shutters for their windows? I know they introduce a security element not found in double glazing but are they any better at noise reduction and insulation over a form of double glazing? I to am considering my options for the windows but my number 1 concern is noise as I live on a main road, insulation second, security not so much… especialy if that is what I am really paying for.

Banjo, our secondary glazing cuts down the noise quite considerably. Also consider planting densely packed conifers or Super Hedge (you can buy them at Bunnings) along the side of your house where the main road runs, that will serve to deflect the noise as well.

Generally conifers are slow growing, but you can get some varieties that grow quickly. Conifers tend to be the best for deflecting noise as they have very dense foliage.
Unless you have the money to buy more mature ones straight up.

With regards to the shutters, I have heard that they do cut down noise, but then again any barrier between you and the noise will deflect sound.

banjo said :

Not wanting to high jack the thread but it is inline with the topic, has anyone had any experience with the roller shutters for their windows? I know they introduce a security element not found in double glazing but are they any better at noise reduction and insulation over a form of double glazing? I to am considering my options for the windows but my number 1 concern is noise as I live on a main road, insulation second, security not so much… especialy if that is what I am really paying for.

Actually, I think double glazing does add a security element – although obviously not as perhaps as shutters. From memory, it is much harder to smash insulated glazing units than single glazing. I haven’t looked but I think there might even be some tests on the net that prove this.

Not wanting to high jack the thread but it is inline with the topic, has anyone had any experience with the roller shutters for their windows? I know they introduce a security element not found in double glazing but are they any better at noise reduction and insulation over a form of double glazing? I to am considering my options for the windows but my number 1 concern is noise as I live on a main road, insulation second, security not so much… especialy if that is what I am really paying for.

GardeningGirl7:04 pm 19 Sep 11

Noting all of this. (Especially re Stegbar. We were going to get a quote from them as the existing windows are Stegbar and although many of the windows needed parts replaced as soon as we moved in that was no worse than the previous house with a different brand where many of the windows also needed replacements/adjustments as soon as we moved in, so we had thought perhaps that’s standard for the industry.)

have a think about getting a HEAT assessment on the house done first – cost is $30 though I believe you can get up to $500 back on up to $2000 of expenditure for items in their recommendations list. A very thorough audit (much better than the one for green loans IMHO).

Thanks Bulldog and G Al

Gungahlin Al12:22 pm 19 Sep 11

The_Bulldog said :

I installed the honeycomb blinds a few years ago and I’ve been really happy with them. I would suggest they’re as effective as heavy curtains. On the plus side they make a room look much larger and retract to give you full windows and views. I also had some exterior blinds installed which have combined for great effect – although no benefits as far as noise reduction.

Ditto.
And there are double honeycomb ones available now.

I installed the honeycomb blinds a few years ago and I’ve been really happy with them. I would suggest they’re as effective as heavy curtains. On the plus side they make a room look much larger and retract to give you full windows and views. I also had some exterior blinds installed which have combined for great effect – although no benefits as far as noise reduction.

Has anyone used those honeycomb blinds – have they worked better than, say, heavy drapes as window coverings?

Got Magnetite coming out to give us a quote on Saturday. I’ll let you know how it goes.

Deref,

Magnetite does the measurement, quote and installation themselves, just contact them directly. We have an old 70’s home and the heat loss through our windows was incredible. You would be sitting next to a closed window and feel a breeze coming through.
The magnetite windows are installed in such a way as to leave a gap between your existing windows, thus eliminating the transfer of cold between the frames. In addition the acrylic ‘glass’ does not transfer any cold and the magnetic seals prevent any loss of warm air or infiltration of cold air.
After having travelled extensively in Europe during their winter a few years ago, I can comfortably say that the magnetite performs just as well as a proper European double glazed window does, if not better.

We paid $6500 for 11 magnetite windows (3 of them being floor to ceiling windows), whilst the average double glazed window quotes were $20,500.

Double glazing is outrageously expensive and then window treatments have to be purchased (also expensive – existing windows have to be removed). The measuring has to be exact and there are usually a lot of hassles.
A good compromise is to keep the existing windows and have plantation shutters fitted. These are really good insulators and they have infinite setting combinations and provide 100% privacy when required. Also keep out noise very effectively.
Would recommend Apollo to supply and fit – very competitive and fitting is excellent – they can be fitted to an average size house in 1 – 2 days.
The price is less than half of double glazing and they obviate the extra costs of curtains/blinds. They look good without be a passing fashion item.

Hosinator said :

We have magnetite windows and they have worked exceptionally well, both in keeping heat in and noise out.

I hadn’t heard of magentite windows, but a little googling has really got me intrigued. Who did you get to do them, Hosinator?

Excellent food for thought, all – thanks very much!

We’ve got some magnetite too. They do work really well for insulation and noise reduction, but they make it very very hard to open some of the windows.

Hosinator said :

JC said :

One bit of advice, if you are going to retrofit do it properly and replace the whole window. Do not accept film or ad-on inner windows as double glazing. Whilst they may improve things it is not substitute for the real thing.

Really, I beg to differ. We have magnetite windows and they have worked exceptionally well, both in keeping heat in and noise out.
For a quarter of the cost of double glazing, we have the benefits of proper double glazing. When I compare our magnetite windows to those of friends who have double glazing, our windows seem to out perform theirs.

As I said they may well improve things but they are NO substitute for the real thing. BTW comparing the performance of your windows to someone else’s is hardly a fair comparison, unless of course they have an identical house in layout, construction and insulation. There are heaps of other factors that change the perception of performance that go beyond the windows, insulation, draught sealing for starters.

Unless your existing glass is really thin, I woould struggle to see the benefits of double glazing over spending the money on decent window dressings and insulation for ceilings, walls (and sometimes floors).

There does come a point of diminishing return when considering efficiency improvements.

JC said :

One bit of advice, if you are going to retrofit do it properly and replace the whole window. Do not accept film or ad-on inner windows as double glazing. Whilst they may improve things it is not substitute for the real thing.

Really, I beg to differ. We have magnetite windows and they have worked exceptionally well, both in keeping heat in and noise out.
For a quarter of the cost of double glazing, we have the benefits of proper double glazing. When I compare our magnetite windows to those of friends who have double glazing, our windows seem to out perform theirs.

I remember their used to be a gentleman in Canberra of German origin, who ran a window business manufacturing and installing double glazed windows.
He had learnt his trade in Germany and used some of the latest European techniques when manufacturing window units. Not sure if he is still around, worth a look though.

mikal said :

Under no circumstances go with Stegbar. Incorrect reveals, wrong winders, broken windows delivered, missing fly screens, incorrect lock keying. 12 weeks later, we’re still waiting for them to install the last security screen. We call them daily and they never return our calls.

Hey, it could be worse, you could have acutally ended up with Stegbar windows on your home. You might as well have gladwrap… They leak amazingly, and the double glazing eventually gives up and you end up with heavy condensation in between the panes. I have a housefull of them, and they’ll all have to be replaced, at massive expense. Cut your losses now!

Try this company http://www.certainteed.com.au/. They specialise in installing double glassed windows into existing window frames or openings. Certainteed have been in business in Canberra for over a decade and should be able to give you local references and clients to contact in regard to the product. Be aware that you are considering purchasing one of the better building products and therefore seem expensive. However, the performance and quality of their windows is outstanding and should provide added value (over the cost) of the windows to your house.

Deref – It depends on how much you want to spend. Also, don’t forget the frames as some are more efficient than others (eg standard metal).

#2 2604 – Personally, I think that there is a benefit from double glazing that can’t be measured by cost alone especially if there is thermal mass in the house.

#3 patrick_keogh – Your order of merit is possibly correct. However, I’m curious to know who your supplier/glazier was?

#4 kakosi – You’re quite right. Gaps between glazing for thermal performance should be at least 12mm and preferably more (and most double glazing here only has 10mm). Gaps for noise insulation should be at least 16mm and, I might be wrong but from memory, gaps of 10mm or less are actually worse than single glazing for sound insulation. Glaziers in Australia also appear to (ignorantly) reduce gaps in the double glazing units depending on how thick the glass on either side has to be to meet building code requirements. Heaven help Australian glaziers if triple glazing in Oz ever takes off.

OpenYourMind6:30 pm 18 Sep 11

Depending on your window design, you could try our ‘poor man’s’ double glazing. We then fit a 12mm square bead of timber in the frame and then we buy sheets of 3 or 4mm acrylic/perspex from ACT Plastics cut to about 4mm shy of the window size and then hold the acrylic in place using clips of various sorts eg. bookshelf pins. The double glazing works as well, if not better than real double glazing. We place some silica gel in the bottom of the inside gap to reduce condensation.

The positives are it is relatively cheaps and can be done DIY, for lower windows it adds an element of safety for small children. There are some downsides, namely the perspex shrinks and contracts more than glass, it will over time potentially craze and yellow and it can get scratched more easily than glass. Not all windows are suited to this treatment and opening windows call for more creativity.

For small windows near front or rear doors, you can use much thicker perspex and mount it securely. This can deter a smash and grab burglar.

One bit of advice, if you are going to retrofit do it properly and replace the whole window. Do not accept film or ad-on inner windows as double glazing. Whilst they may improve things it is not substitute for the real thing.

Holden Caulfield6:00 pm 18 Sep 11

FYI HTH = hope that helps

okthxbye

😀 Excellent advice folks – thanks!

Thanks Mikal – of course they’re one of the first organisations that comes up under Google, so I’m very grateful.

HTH – that’s an excellent point.

Patrick, definitely. We’ve got excellent ceiling insulation and draught exclusion, but our house is passive solar so its long northern wall is virtually all glass – fantastic for solar heating, of course, but also a significant source of heat loss/heat incursion and, of course, it’s going to be expensive if we end up doing it. I’ll definitely look at window coverings too.

I fitted double glazed windows to my house and I don’t notice any difference in insulation or noise reduction over the other windows.

I went to Spanline who used another firm to contract out the fitting to. They were messy, destructive and very very quick. Although the windows look great compared to the old ones I think they won’t last as long and I’m not sure the wood they used around them was the best quality. Also, I had to get Spanline back several times to repair locks that just wouldn’t work after a few uses.

The moral of the story is that if you know ANYONE who is a chippie get them to do it for you. The windows cost me a lot of money.

Another thing I was disappointed at was the very small gap between panes and the very thin glass they use in Australia. Having visited a friend in Canada previously I can tell you that the double glazed windows overseas are far more insulating and a lot thicker and better made.

patrick_keogh1:19 pm 18 Sep 11

We have retrofitted double glazing to our entire ’80s vintage house. I’m probably telling you what you already know, but double glazing is about 4th on the list of things to do… decent in ceiling and in wall insulation, closing off draughts, decent window coverings, self discipline in terms of which parts of the house you heat and to which temperature… all more important.

Having said that double glazing has made a significant difference to our place… we had already done all of the above. It has an effect on comfort and heating cost and noise reduction. We went with good quality plastic extrusion and argon filled glazing. We have everthing from large sliders, wind outs and two sliding doors all done. Can’t particularly recommend our glazer (from Sydney), he did an OK job but nothing special.

My recommendation is to make sure it’s worth the money and if the ROI justifies the spend. In other words:

1. Get quotes for how much the glazing will cost.
2. Work out how much you would get if that amount of money was sitting in a high-interest savings account. (For every $10,000 you should allow for $651 in earnings, before tax).
3. Figure out whether the glazing will reduce your heating costs by an equivalent dollar amount.

HTH

Under no circumstances go with Stegbar. Incorrect reveals, wrong winders, broken windows delivered, missing fly screens, incorrect lock keying. 12 weeks later, we’re still waiting for them to install the last security screen. We call them daily and they never return our calls.

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