Holt hold up

reasonableperson said :

I’m not a big movie fan, but from what i remember, Minority Report was about arresting and charging people before they commit a crime.

This is about holding a person accountable not just for the consequences of their criminality (in this case, armed robber which is stealing $25 whilst holding a knife), but rather the potential consequence of their criminality (death of the attendant you moved towards with your knife). Look at the footage, that knife comes awfully close.

Just trying to fix a broken way of thinking. May not make much sense to you, but it does make more sense than the current system.

You should really change your username if you’re going to spout such nonsense.

I’m not a big movie fan, but from what i remember, Minority Report was about arresting and charging people before they commit a crime.

This is about holding a person accountable not just for the consequences of their criminality (in this case, armed robber which is stealing $25 whilst holding a knife), but rather the potential consequence of their criminality (death of the attendant you moved towards with your knife). Look at the footage, that knife comes awfully close.

Just trying to fix a broken way of thinking. May not make much sense to you, but it does make more sense than the current system.

Jethro said :

Armed robbery is a serious offense that can get a person years in prison (well the laws say that it can get you years in prison, some of our magistrates probably think otherwise.

.

Yes indeed, instead of sending them to prison, they reward scrotes such as this one by sending them to the $600/day holiday resort at Hume.

reasonableperson said :

He came into that store with a knife. The knife is there to intimidate the staff to give him the money. If they don’t comply, the knife is there to stab the staff. If someone is stabbed with a knife, they may die.

Every now and then I go and sit in the Magistrate’s court and watch. I find it incredibly amazing what goes on there. Has anyone else done this?

His lawyer will say that his actions were “on the lower end of the scale” because it was only $25 that he stole, the knife was a mere 30cm long and when seen in a photograph, doesn’t look that scary, and in the end, everything was okay because, well, no one got hurt. No harm no foul your Honour!

Again, this is bullshit!

This is extreme violence that could easily have caused a death!

Im thinking your a big fan of the first half of Minority Report?

reasonableperson said :

He came into that store with a knife. The knife is there to intimidate the staff to give him the money. If they don’t comply, the knife is there to stab the staff. If someone is stabbed with a knife, they may die.

Every now and then I go and sit in the Magistrate’s court and watch. I find it incredibly amazing what goes on there. Has anyone else done this?

His lawyer will say that his actions were “on the lower end of the scale” because it was only $25 that he stole, the knife was a mere 30cm long and when seen in a photograph, doesn’t look that scary, and in the end, everything was okay because, well, no one got hurt. No harm no foul your Honour!

Again, this is bullshit!

This is extreme violence that could easily have caused a death!

Yeah.. I’m not getting your argument at all. Armed robbery is a serious offense that can get a person years in prison (well the laws say that it can get you years in prison, some of our magistrates probably think otherwise.

But you can’t charge someone with murder or even attempted murder if they don’t actually commit the act. It’s not like he even tried to stab the attendants and missed.

He came into that store with a knife. The knife is there to intimidate the staff to give him the money. If they don’t comply, the knife is there to stab the staff. If someone is stabbed with a knife, they may die.

Every now and then I go and sit in the Magistrate’s court and watch. I find it incredibly amazing what goes on there. Has anyone else done this?

His lawyer will say that his actions were “on the lower end of the scale” because it was only $25 that he stole, the knife was a mere 30cm long and when seen in a photograph, doesn’t look that scary, and in the end, everything was okay because, well, no one got hurt. No harm no foul your Honour!

Again, this is bullshit!

This is extreme violence that could easily have caused a death!

reasonableperson said :

I am somewhat amazed by the posts almost making light of what this guy did. I am outraged by this! How can we as a community allow/accept this as being “just one those things” that happens. There is a media release almost every day about robbery’s at our business’, exreme violence at our pubs, abductions of our children. When do we demand enough is enough? He could have killed those 2 guys! When he is caught (I live in hope that he is) he should be charged with murder, because that was the potential harm of his actions. Our legal system should be based on the potential harm caused by your criminality. In the end this guy will probably only be charged with theft of $25 and having a knife in public. I’m sorry but it’s bullshit! How do we make a stand against this or do people not even care unless it effects them?

I’m no friend of scum like this blagger, and I can understand your anger at his crime, and how the law so often appears to be impotent in dealing with such arsehats.

But calling for him to be charged with murder when he hasn’t murdered anyone is silly. What he did was armed robbery, not murder. You could equally claim that he should also be charged with sexual assault because he could have raped the attendants. Not to mention other potential crimes he didn’t commit, like littering the place.

Demanding that people be charged with crimes that they could have committed but didn’t isn’t…ummmm…reasonable.

I am somewhat amazed by the posts almost making light of what this guy did. I am outraged by this! How can we as a community allow/accept this as being “just one those things” that happens. There is a media release almost every day about robbery’s at our business’, exreme violence at our pubs, abductions of our children. When do we demand enough is enough? He could have killed those 2 guys! When he is caught (I live in hope that he is) he should be charged with murder, because that was the potential harm of his actions. Our legal system should be based on the potential harm caused by your criminality. In the end this guy will probably only be charged with theft of $25 and having a knife in public. I’m sorry but it’s bullshit! How do we make a stand against this or do people not even care unless it effects them?

jsm2090 said :

The staff are in (what looks to be) a secure area, and they still handed over the money?

Seriously not worth the risk. Also, Retail staff are normally instructed in induction, never to resist a hold up. Besides, if the perp is apprehended by staff at the time, surely they would be able to be charged with fewer offences.

I guess what I should have said is that having been confronted in a similar situation (outside, not in a store) you never know how you’re going to react.

jsm2090 said :

Tooks said :

jsm2090 said :

The staff are in (what looks to be) a secure area, and they still handed over the money?

I’m sure you would’ve delivered a spinning fly kick to the robber’s face, but it’s usually a good idea to just hand over the cash.

haha, not quite what I was thinking, but I may have grabbed that pair of scissors sitting on the counter in defense. It would take considerable skill for this douche to squeeze through the wire ‘fence’ and still hold these guys at knifepoint at the same time. I would also contend that you’ve got a pretty good chance of being assulted after handing over the dough as well.

Reminds me of something that I have read lately….

http://www.news.com.au/entertainment/movies/mark-wahlberg-i-could-have-prevented-911/story-e6frfmvr-1226247933973

That’s what it was.

jsm2090 said :

haha, not quite what I was thinking, but I may have grabbed that pair of scissors sitting on the counter in defense. It would take considerable skill for this douche to squeeze through the wire ‘fence’ and still hold these guys at knifepoint at the same time. I would also contend that you’ve got a pretty good chance of being assulted after handing over the dough as well.

In most cases it seems that they really just want to get the money and leave ASAP, nothing to gain from stabbing someone and it’s a more serious charge if you get caught.

It’s probably also worth considering that any customers who might wander in while the robbery is in progress won’t have the benefit of a security screen. It’s in everyone’s best interests to get the guy with the knife out of there as quickly as possible.

Darkfalz said :

Two guys vs one wimpy little doucebag. Should have broken his arm when he reached over the counter. They should give the staff tazers or something. Even better some kind of safe room behind the counter that also engages a lock on the front door and calls the police.

Not sure the lock on the front door would be a good idea. Potential to trap other customers in with a scumbag holding a knife!!

Tooks said :

jsm2090 said :

The staff are in (what looks to be) a secure area, and they still handed over the money?

I’m sure you would’ve delivered a spinning fly kick to the robber’s face, but it’s usually a good idea to just hand over the cash.

haha, not quite what I was thinking, but I may have grabbed that pair of scissors sitting on the counter in defense. It would take considerable skill for this douche to squeeze through the wire ‘fence’ and still hold these guys at knifepoint at the same time. I would also contend that you’ve got a pretty good chance of being assulted after handing over the dough as well.

Darkfalz said :

Two guys vs one wimpy little doucebag. Should have broken his arm when he reached over the counter. They should give the staff tazers or something. Even better some kind of safe room behind the counter that also engages a lock on the front door and calls the police.

Yep spend $20000 on elaborate defence systems for the $27 and five used bottle tops Mr Mastercrimanal got away with.

rosscoact said :

DermottBanana said :

Of course, if Mark Wahlberg were there, it’d have turned out differently

Or Captain RAAF

He’s more into stern letter writing these days.

DermottBanana said :

Of course, if Mark Wahlberg were there, it’d have turned out differently

Or Captain RAAF

Of course, if Mark Wahlberg were there, it’d have turned out differently

jsm2090 said :

The staff are in (what looks to be) a secure area, and they still handed over the money?

I’m sure you would’ve delivered a spinning fly kick to the robber’s face, but it’s usually a good idea to just hand over the cash.

Two guys vs one wimpy little doucebag. Should have broken his arm when he reached over the counter. They should give the staff tazers or something. Even better some kind of safe room behind the counter that also engages a lock on the front door and calls the police.