4 January 2009

Illegal speed testing

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A couple of years ago they had a report about where police were allowed to test speeding drivers.

The report stated that it’s illegal for police to test for speed going down a hill or at the bottom of a hill.

After driving down the park way the other day, I noticed that the camera (the one under the bridge) is located going down a hill.

I also noticed that a speed camera was parked on the side of erindale drive (just before the fadden round-a-about) at a bottom of a hill.

Does anyone know if the report I read was correct and if so, have they changed the laws or are they illegally testing for speed?

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neanderthalsis4:26 pm 02 Feb 09

Thou shalt not put a camera on a down hill slope.

Define downhill? Is there a specific gradient or will the fact that if I stop my car, put it in neutral and it rolls enough to make it a hill? Should I be allowed to belt down the range to the coast at 210km/h simply because it’s down hill?

Speed limits are still legal limits no matter how steep it is.

Holden Caulfield2:15 pm 02 Feb 09

farnarkler said :

Surely it shouldn’t matter where a speed camera is positioned??

I’m pretty sure I’ve read a report on the interwebz somewhere about the guidelines for use for mobile speed cameras in NSW. IIRC it was the hand held type. It stated that it was unable to be used at the bottom of hills and, as suggested, I’d always figured it had something to do with the waves, or the vibe, or somesuch.

Of course, NSW is not necessarily the same as ACT and this was a few years ago as well.

Generally, I agree with the if you speed and get busted you cop it on the chin approach. But if there are guidelines for use of cameras, then one would expect the guidelines were made for good reason and that they should therefore be followed.

p1 said :

“HIGHWAY Patrol officers could not book anyone in a back street.

I am interseted in this Urban legend. Has anyone heard it? Is the poster suggesting that people drive from the back seat? Or jump there after being pulled over?

it was supposed to be that a highway patrol officer wouldn’t be found in suburbia…

they would be found, wait for it, on a highway.

love to see someone try to get away with speeding on a back road past a police car.

Police are police, regardless of where they are.

“HIGHWAY Patrol officers could not book anyone in a back street.

I am interseted in this Urban legend. Has anyone heard it? Is the poster suggesting that people drive from the back seat? Or jump there after being pulled over?

When Speed Camera where first introduced into Canberra, there was plenty of information for the public both on the RTA website and at the Government Shopfront. Including procedures for them to operate the camera’s by. Funny enough this information is very hard to find and obtain these days. I have tried the web site, nothing and in years gone by when I have had to go to a Canberra shopfront I have always look for the little booklets they once had.

The procedures are there to ensure not only safety but fairness for the Canberra Community. They were published at the time the speed cameras where introduced. So the Government of the day did not get a back lash.

Some of the rules I remember where for mobile speed cameras:

Speed Camera had to be at least 200m past a posted speed sign.
Speed Camera will not be used to enforce road works or school zones.
Speed Camera will/maybe should not be used down hills.
Speed Camera will not operate in one area for longer than 30 minutes. (I love this one when you go somewhere see a speed camera on the side of the road, only come back 50 minutes later and its still there).
Automatic vs manual operation of the camera, the camera was not suppose to kept on automatic for longer than 15 minutes. (Which is half the time).

I wonder if the information has been recalled and not publicized due to drivers within the ACT writing in to complain about their ticket in the mail. However, I am not sure if there has been a change in the procedure for use over the years.

I think what came out last year / year before were the guidelines for taking a reading based on the manufacturer of the guns.. IIRC they have to be a certain angle and the like and resulted from the ‘wrongful’ catching of sydney busses.

I agree Xbikee there has never been a rule… just a myth.

I remember years ago when the Hume Highway used to still go through Jugiong… the cops had a field day sitting at the bottom of the hill into town where it went from 100 to 60 half way down it.

No such ‘rule’ … never was, never will be. What “may” have happened is that a seniopr officer suggested/ibstructed radar operaters way back not to do the hills. His opinion and instruction as the boss of the day. Sounds like the old furphy that “HIGHWAY Patrol officers could not book anyone in a back street. Also kind of like (well, not really) the other furphy about speeeding ticket quotas. Never was, never will be.

Vic Bitterman10:53 pm 04 Jan 09

No such rules exist in the ACT in regards to a downhill grade as to whether a fixed or mobile speed camera, or even a hand held device can be operated.

“Does anyone know if the report I read was correct and if so, have they changed the laws or are they illegally testing for speed?”

Is the report correct…..no
Are they illegally testing for speed…………no

fnord

What a load of bollocks.

fnord

I generally agree with this.

Clown Killer6:09 pm 04 Jan 09

Speed detection on a downhill grade is justified on the basis that serious accidents
have occurred at that location and there are no other means of preventing vehicles
from speeding

Well that would explain the speed camera on the Tuggeranong Parkway at Cotter Road. If you hear a radio report any given peak hour about traffic delays on the parkway caused by an accident, the sentence invariably finishes with … at the Cotter Road on ramp.

Naturally, if people could grasp the need to temporarily move into the right-hand lane to give merging traffic some room (and refrain from staying in the left hand land and speeding up to make sure merging traffic dosen’t get in front of them in ‘their’ lane then we could probably live without the speed camera … ce la vie

There’s also the camera on the Barton Highway, city bound, just after the speed limit drops from 100 to 80, and also in a downhill strip.

This is from the Queensland Police Service. It may explain the confusion, and the reason they’re in those positions.

Downhill grades are classified as ‘restricted site locations’. It is important to
understand that this does not prohibit the use of a speed detection device on
a downhill grade, but it does mean that such use will be limited.

Speed detection on a downhill grade is justified on the basis that serious accidents
have occurred at that location and there are no other means of preventing vehicles
from speeding (i.e. through publicity or road engineering solutions).

Nosey said :

Why doesn’t common sense prevail these days?????

It’s because the Guvmint ain’t made a law enforcing it.

Some people need any excuse to get off a ticket don’t they?

If the radar/laser hits your car and detects an excessive speed then tough chest puppies.

Wear it and pay it.

Cars speed up hills and down hills.

Why doesn’t common sense prevail these days?????

I do remember hearing that, but I was in QLD at the time. It depends on each state as to where and how they are sited.

it’s something to do with the way radar type cameras detect car speed. they can’t determine the difference between a car and a reflection from the ground. obviously at the bottom of the hill the camera is basically aimed at the hill therefore there is an increase in this reflection problem. The fixed camera on the parkway hopefully is one designed to measure using some sort of non-radar timing method. Otherwise all the tickets it produces are doubtful.

Sounds like wishful thinking. I couldn’t spot anything supporting this wish in the Road Transport (Safety and Traffic Management) Act 1999

I wasn’t speeding, officer – it was downhill and my brakes don’t work

Surely it shouldn’t matter where a speed camera is positioned??

Clown Killer10:26 am 04 Jan 09

Some more detail would probably help.

I wouldn’t be surprised if there were some form of official guidelines for speed camera placement but I doubt that failure to conform to the guidelines would render the speed camera illegal.

Sounds like an April fools joke.

Woody Mann-Caruso10:01 am 04 Jan 09

*rolls eyes*

You know. THEM. They write REPORTS.

fnord

What report?
Who are ‘they’?

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