16 June 2009

In search of advice on Supermarkets

| johnboy
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Chief Minister Stanhope has announced that he’s dragging a former Australian Competition and Consumer Commission Deputy Commissioner, Mr John Martin, in to figure out what’s needed in the ACT’s supermarket sector.

    Mr Martin will advise the ACT Government on a range of issues that surround the review, in particular the local implications of the ACCC’s 2008 findings and recommendations in relation to the sector.

    “The ACT Government has led the way in supermarket competition policy for some time, and we can point to tangible outcomes such as the presence of Aldi. For example, Aldi’s growing presence in the ACT was kick started by two direct land sales supported by my Government,” Mr Stanhope said.

    “I believe the Canberra community is well served by a diverse fresh food and grocery sector that does strive to provide choice, convenience and value for money to Canberrans.”

    “However, it is a fast paced industry and we need to have adaptive policy and the best information and advice we can obtain, and that is the reason for the review and the appointment of Mr Martin and the expertise he will bring,” Mr Stanhope added.

(Surely when it comes to Dickson Woolies there can only be one plan: “We take off, nuke the site from orbit”)

UPDATE: The Greens Caroline Le Couteur has expressed pleasure at the appointment while remaining disappointed that there’s been so little action to date.

FURTHER UPDATE: Mr Martin on ABC Radio just expressed his interest in what RiotACT commenters have had to say on the subject so far today. If we can keep the conversation broader than just fruit and veg that would be nice too.

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Hells_Bells742:41 pm 18 Jun 09

My apologies. Got carried away, should’ve just said diets suck like I was going to.

Back on topic please people.

Hells_Bells748:47 am 18 Jun 09

Granny, denying yourself will only lead to resentment. Have a little not a lot, everything is wonderful in moderation and diets suck.

My tips:

Fitness balls, light weights, loud music.
Taking away anything you eat ‘feel the need to eat’ daily and replacing that with a better choice (mine was chocolate bars and cheese & bikky platters with all the trimmings) after giving up smoking when I turned 30 for 17 months I put on 20 kgs and hated it so bad, so before I took smoking back up (wasn’t thinking like that at the time) I lost it all and looked fit as Hell. I exchanged my one-a-day chocolate bar addiction with the chocolate flavoured LCM bars with the little lollies on top, they are only 86 calories and no fat and the way I beat the bikky’s was when I was feeling like it, I would jump on my fitness ball or do some house dancing instead. Oh and I went out and danced myself stupid as often as I could. I would’ve allowed myself a chocolate bar anytime though, but with that in mind, I don’t think I had one for ages, don’t miss what you aren’t thinking about denying yourself. (+ just keep the animal fats and butter and cream to a reasonably small level of course)

A little fasting goes a long way too. Find it breaks my cycles of abusive eating.

Not saying it works for everyone, but I know damn well know diets don’t.

Oh, god! My life has been pretty straight for too long …. I. Need. Twisties.

Now!!

*meltdown*

I especially heart the really noisy and cheesy ones. There’s nothing like that fresh Twistie crunch! I’ve got to get off this diet!!

Granny said :

I’m still drooling over the Twisties!

Gah! don’t buy the Aldi twisties, they are dead-set fail twisties. Horrible.
But for some reason, Kingston IGA have the best twisties, they must be Special Bin twisties or something. Really noisy and cheesy ones.

And Coles at the moment is mostly selling ‘coles brand’ of everything from milk to cans of tuna. So their product range is shrinking fast.

monomania said :

Woolies and Coles have only achieved the size they have by offering a cheaper or better product than the alternative independent grocers. They operate on small margins and carry a wide range of brands and in the main have been responsible for keeping food prices down in Australia. Producers and manufacturers whinge about their buying power but that works in favour of the consumer.

Not too sure about this. I heard on the 7.30 Report several years ago that Woolworths was purchasing oranges from farmers for $195 per tonne, and then selling them to consumers for $3 per kilo – $3000 per tonne. How does that advantage the consumer, or indeed anyone else but Woolworths and its shareholders?

Also, Woolies and Coles have used things other than cheaper / better products to achieve their dominance. They’ve also used things like non-compete clauses in retail leases (where their $PSM rent drops by up to 90% if another supermarket, fresh food store or liquor outlet is allowed to open in the same shopping centre) and used their right to object to liquor licenses being granted to protect the market share of their bottle shops, and been prosecuted for it.

Woolies and Coles have only achieved the size they have by offering a cheaper or better product than the alternative independent grocers. They operate on small margins and carry a wide range of brands and in the main have been responsible for keeping food prices down in Australia. Producers and manufacturers whinge about their buying power but that works in favour of the consumer. I will admit that their fresh produce may not always be of the highest standard. Aldi and AGL competition is welcome from the consumers point of view. A place to get specials or convenience. We have a tendency to support the underdog at the expense of the talented and successful. Disclaimer to follow.

I have herd that the current owner of Mother Natures is going under, apparently his coop number at the sydney wholesale markets has been cancelled (so he cant get still get a full range of fruit and veg) i believe he owns a large farm near cooma that is on the market, they grow a lot of broc and coli there. I have heard that the airport shop sent him under, apparently there is $4 million worth of unused refirgeration sitting out there. Tuggers is not going to reopen as a mother nature it has propbably been sold or has just closed like queanbeyan

Don’t forget to come back and report your findings!

will have to test out this spurious ‘rum ball theory’ tomorrow… ; )

I’m still drooling over the Twisties!

I’ve been meaning to try out the Aldi bottled Glüwein that’s about $7 for a while now.

astrojax said :

agree with you ant on iga’s… prefer ainslie to dickson because of that (though the dickson cake shop pies are an attraction – as is the walkability for me at the moment until i can drive again!). having said that, there is a marked difference inter-iga, qua lyneham is nowhere near as good as ainslie; neither for that matter is o’connor, though it used to be. much better meat selection at ainslie, for instance…

aldi rocks, but.

I really like the IGA at Kingston, they have all kinds of fascinating things. You duck in to grab the essential Twisties, and end up with an armful of things. Their bags of spices seem cheaper than the same product elsewhere, and they have SO many things you just don’t see in Cwoolies. Lots more “continental” things… Cwoolies seem to have almst got out of the jars of pickled chillies market, for instance.

The IGA at Ainslie always impresses, too. We often order chips at the Theo’s, and then wander up to the IGA for our BBQ chooks, they have free range ones! Again, you get sidetracked by the amazing things they have. There’s a good one at Griffith, too. I was struck by how The Essential Ingredient keeps its truffle oil in a locked cabinet, but Griffith IGA has it all out on the shelves.

Aldi have some products that have me going in there specially to get it. Their plain tomato passata is gold, delicous and cheap. And their low-fat milk is so, so much better than the Cwoolies versions. their washing powder is excellent too, and they have a picture of a baby on it with “hazmat” to warn you about babies. And Aldi beer is just a no-brainer, it’s German, and cheap. Have to go to the ACT Aldis to get it though.

Oh, and regarding Dickson pies, if you’re in the Vietnamese bakery there, the giant rum balls are to die for. (wanders off drooling).

Hackett IGA is good too, although small – no deli. They used to sell heaps of organic stuff and sacks of bread flour etc, but they seem to be going back to just normal groceries now.

Watson IGA is ok – it has a deli, but is a bit overcrowded for easy shopping.

Lyneham is really expensive, and O’Connor is even more expensive, and isn’t an IGA anymore I think.

And Gungahlin woolies and Coles are both much more pleasant than Dickson woolies. Free parking, plenty of spots, and nice wide aisle in the shops, without too many people.

2604 said :

imarty said :

deezagood, you’re right about many well known companies manufacturing for Aldi, as they do for other retailer’s homebrand products but the “recipe” is often different so in many cases it is not the exact same product.
I know this to be true at least in bread and smallgoods.

The taste of the Aldi brand is superior in at least two products that I can think of: Aldi’s Corvaloni dry spaghetti tastes better than any other brand on the market (including San Remo, Vetta, etc) and costs only 59 cents per 500 gram packet.

This is an interesting observation, because I know for a fact that San Remo actually produces all Aldi pasta and sauces, to the exact same recipe as their own goods!

You’d be really surprised at who actually does produce Aldi stuff (I had a friend who worked in Aldi HQ and so got all of the good goss); usually the top brand manufacturers of whatever you are buying at Coles! The way is works (apparently) is that the Aldi folks approach the leading manufacturer of whatever product – say Wheetbix for example. And they say ‘okay, if people are shopping at Aldi, they are probably going to buy our wheetbix, and not your wheetbix. So – either you can produce our Aldi Wheetbix under a made-up Aldi name (and still make money) OR we will go to your competitors and they can produce our Aldi Wheetbix instead’. That is why so many of the top brands produce their goods for Aldi – at least this way, they still make money. People think that Aldi stuff is inferior quality (perhaps like ‘black and gold brand’), but actually it really is the exact same top stuff, but cheaper. I heart Aldi.

agree with you ant on iga’s… prefer ainslie to dickson because of that (though the dickson cake shop pies are an attraction – as is the walkability for me at the moment until i can drive again!). having said that, there is a marked difference inter-iga, qua lyneham is nowhere near as good as ainslie; neither for that matter is o’connor, though it used to be. much better meat selection at ainslie, for instance…

aldi rocks, but.

imarty said :

deezagood, you’re right about many well known companies manufacturing for Aldi, as they do for other retailer’s homebrand products but the “recipe” is often different so in many cases it is not the exact same product.
I know this to be true at least in bread and smallgoods.

The taste of the Aldi brand is superior in at least two products that I can think of: Aldi’s Corvaloni dry spaghetti tastes better than any other brand on the market (including San Remo, Vetta, etc) and costs only 59 cents per 500 gram packet. And, their 75 cent packet cake mixes are sensational, as well – moister and better than Cadbury’s, Green’s, etc.

I used to be a real skeptic but am a total Aldi convert nowadays. Like Deezagood I also save a fortune, around $30-40 per week less than I used to spend when I shopped exclusively at Coles.

Aldi is great, and in the ACT you even get Aldi Grog! I keep being impressed by IGAs too, when you go in the different products they have is a real eye-opener when you’re used to teh same old stuff at woolies and coles. They do the gourmet and local specialties thing so much better at IGAs.

Mother Natures is another that I hope survives whatever is happening to it at the moment. There’s clearly something wrong. the Qbn shop has shut its deli, the fridge is empty, the cold shelves just have staples. teh F and V are still good and mostly cheaper than what I observed at the Fyshwick “markets”. Mother Natures is more than F and V, in fact before it went down, you could pretty-well do your whole shop there. They even had cleaning products and toiletries tucked behind a shelf. A few fully-stocked Mother Natures go a long way towards plugging the gaps, I was always very happy to do the bulk of my shop there and eschew Cwoolies.

Jivrashia said :

Dickson Woolies… never fails to disappoint.
The range of brand appears to be decreasing.

I say raze the site and start all over again (or, on failing that, head to Kaleen Supabarn).

Well it will go close, they’re planning on doing a full refurbishment of Dickson Woolies, you will be able to do your banking and liquor shopping in the one stop when the liquor store is moved from the supermarket and will absorb some of the space of the Commonwealth Bank. The self serve checkouts will help the plebs lining up for express service too.

http://apps.actpla.act.gov.au/pubnote/pubnoteDetail_new.asp?DA_no=200914094

miz said :

Chisholm is an interesting example – it’s a really vibrant, bustling local shops, yet there are still empty shops. (I notice, for example, that the toyshop which relocated there from Lanyon has closed. What a shame, it was a top shop.)

I suspect the cost of retail space in local shopping precincts is prohibitive and this should be looked at. Is it any wonder we are now getting the big corporations like Coles/Woolies and their associated brands dominating the small centres and crowding out the more interesting ones? Seems that only the biggies can actually afford to move in.

Funny, it’s actually the opposite. The supermarkets actually draw customers to the surrounding businesses as people will normally pop in before/after doing shopping. Hence why small suburban centres have died as people flock to large shopping centres so they can do grocery shopping and visit all the other shops at the same time. Small group centres work well for people on the way home from work who don’t wan’t to bother with parking hassles and hinderences of shopping centres. Hence why you will find the supermarkets in places like woden/tuggeranong to be dead after about 6pm and group centres chisholm/erindale/kaleen to busy.

deezagood, you’re right about many well known companies manufacturing for Aldi, as they do for other retailer’s homebrand products but the “recipe” is often different so in many cases it is not the exact same product.
I know this to be true at least in bread and smallgoods.

deezagood said :

In terms of generic supermarkets, Aldi has rocked my world, especially for non-perishable/frozen/pre-packaged stuff and basics such as milk, yoghurt, cheese etc.. We have saved a fortune by shopping at Aldi, and I honestly can’t understand why people wouldn’t shop for their basics there over Coles and Woolies. I wonder if people realise that Aldi often sells the exact same product from the exact same producers, but packaged under a different lable at 60% of the cost?

Hell yeah. I even think that their fresh fruit, vegetables and meat are better than Coles most of the time…and about half the cost.

There sure are some great shops at Chisholm; the Florist is divine (I source all of my flowers from there, as well as teacher-presents etc…), the butcher is fantastic (slightly pricey, but you get what you pay for), the take away is apparently great, newsagency is friendly, bakery makes great coffee etc… I try my hardest to support the local businesses by shopping locally, and I’m sure many locals do the same. I think the problem Miz, is that Chisholm currently has just what it needs in terms of essential local shops (hair-dresser-check, beauty place-check, fruit/veg-check, bottle shop-check, chemist-check), so I just don’t think there is room for any more new businesses. I know the new little gift shop is really struggling and as you noted, the toy shop has sadly closed. I think the only extra businesses that might thrive in Chisholm are really good take-away/dine in alternatives, such as an Indian, Thai, Vietnamese, Noodle house or Turkish place – I hate competing with the crowds at Erindale on a Friday night and I’m sure others feel the same way!

Chisholm is an interesting example – it’s a really vibrant, bustling local shops, yet there are still empty shops. (I notice, for example, that the toyshop which relocated there from Lanyon has closed. What a shame, it was a top shop.)

I suspect the cost of retail space in local shopping precincts is prohibitive and this should be looked at. Is it any wonder we are now getting the big corporations like Coles/Woolies and their associated brands dominating the small centres and crowding out the more interesting ones? Seems that only the biggies can actually afford to move in.

It’s the ‘Bunnings factor’ – undercut everyone (eg poach all the bread and butter business from the small paint shops, lighting shops, garden nurseries, bathroom/kitchen suppliers etc) and soon there is no competition. which rather defeats the purpose.

We asked at Mother Nature Tuggeranong what was happening there a couple weeks ago.
The checkout girl said that the store was closing in the next week for refurbishment.
Explained the empty counters and what stock they had was not of great quality.
We haven’t bothered going round there to check since.
I assume that there will some fanfare when it reopens.

Leaves the Hyperdome without a greengrocer at present as well.

According to ACTPLA’s website Jim Murphy’s carpark in Fyshwick is requesting a change of use variation. Included in the new uses would be Home Produce. Could turn into a new fruit & veg market!

In terms of generic supermarkets, Aldi has rocked my world, especially for non-perishable/frozen/pre-packaged stuff and basics such as milk, yoghurt, cheese etc.. We have saved a fortune by shopping at Aldi, and I honestly can’t understand why people wouldn’t shop for their basics there over Coles and Woolies. I wonder if people realise that Aldi often sells the exact same product from the exact same producers, but packaged under a different lable at 60% of the cost?

In terms of supermarkets in the woolies/coles sense of the word, I’ve always found Supabarn’s fresh food sections to be far superior to the other two.

Clown Killer4:53 pm 16 Jun 09

Fyshwick markets fruit and vegie prices have been through the roof for the last few years

To be honest I hven’t noticed too much of a hike in prices. We buy pretty much the same stuff from week to week with some seasonal diferences obviously but it always costs around $40-50 for our fruit and vegies. I quite prefer Wiffens for the quality of the goods but they are a little dearer than some of the other vendors at Fyshwick.

deezagood said :

FC said :

My advice – more fresh fruit and veg stores. Especially in Tuggeranong! I’m don’t like having only the choice of ‘crappy woolworths fruit and veg’ or, ‘crappy woolthworths fruit and veg’.
Put a green grocer at Lanyon! (a bid to any potential store owners!!!)

FC – you must try the fruit and veg shop at Chisholm; they are really terrific (nice people, good quality produce, lots of local stuff etc…). only 10 minutes from you at Lanyon too.

+1
we get all our F&V there. worth the trip from kambah…

Fyshwick markets fruit and vegie prices have been through the roof for the last few years

true but mother natures were always a cheaper option in belco, and i think go tropo always had a few really good specials each week at fyswick

jjoking said :

on the smaller side of things, it seems one family is buying up all the medium sized green grocers, one family now own wiffins, ziggies, they bought go tropo fyswick and turned it into a ziggies and have just bought mother nature belco and are tuning it into another wiffins, soon they will own all both “markets” and what will happen to prices then?

Fyshwick markets fruit and vegie prices have been through the roof for the last few years

cranky said :

Rumour has it that the ex garden nursery at Southlands, Mawson, may become an Aldi.

Looks like the garden centre building is under demolition as we speak

on the smaller side of things, it seems one family is buying up all the medium sized green grocers, one family now own wiffins, ziggies, they bought go tropo fyswick and turned it into a ziggies and have just bought mother nature belco and are tuning it into another wiffins, soon they will own all both “markets” and what will happen to prices then?

Deadmandrinking3:25 pm 16 Jun 09

Dicko woolies is still better stocked than a lot of suburban ones – and dickson itself is a good complex, lots of little stores where you can find stuff you need.

Dickson Woolies… never fails to disappoint.
The range of brand appears to be decreasing.

I say raze the site and start all over again (or, on failing that, head to Kaleen Supabarn).

I second the trip to Chisholm from Lanyon- much better quality than Woolies, better prices and fresh food. And you can duck into Coles while you are there for non-perishables (on that front, they’re all the same)

Rumour has it that the ex garden nursery at Southlands, Mawson, may become an Aldi.

FC – Mother Nature’s at the Tuggers mall is also pretty good.

Thanks deezagood. I shall definitly go there next time I do a shop! I wasn’t even aware that they had one there.
cheers 🙂

FC said :

My advice – more fresh fruit and veg stores. Especially in Tuggeranong! I’m don’t like having only the choice of ‘crappy woolworths fruit and veg’ or, ‘crappy woolthworths fruit and veg’.
Put a green grocer at Lanyon! (a bid to any potential store owners!!!)

FC – you must try the fruit and veg shop at Chisholm; they are really terrific (nice people, good quality produce, lots of local stuff etc…). only 10 minutes from you at Lanyon too.

My advice – more fresh fruit and veg stores. Especially in Tuggeranong! I’m don’t like having only the choice of ‘crappy woolworths fruit and veg’ or, ‘crappy woolthworths fruit and veg’.
Put a green grocer at Lanyon! (a bid to any potential store owners!!!)

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