13 February 2012

Indicate, indicate indicate.....

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Honestly, drivers it’s not that hard. That stick on your steering wheel is to tell everyone (including those people that you can’t see) where you intend to go. Don’t assume that your direction is obvious or, like some people I know, only indicate if you can see another car that you think might be affected by your actions.

As an ocassionally disabled pedestrian I sometimes need to allow a lot of time to get across the road. It is very frustrating when I have been waiting a long time for a car to go past only to watch them indicate at the last minute (or not at all) and turn just before they get to me. I can only imagine how frustrating this must be for extremely disabled and slow moving people, the elderly or those with children.

Don’t the Greens have a policy along the lines of giving priority to pedestrians and a legal weighting if a pedestrian is hit by a vehicle. As a pedestrian I wouldn’t want to argue right of way with a four wheel drive and it would be small comfort from my hospital bed if I had the force of law behind me, but something needs to be done to give pedestrians more power.

Someone has to have a gripe on Monday morning so I thought that I would have a go…

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astrojax. wheely wheely hope you got personalised plates on your trike hon

astrojax said :

kambahkrawler said :

I don’t think people should just stereotype bad drivers. Include the idiots too.

Rubbish drivers – do not know how to indicate or negotiate roundabouts:

Anyone driving a blue-plated vehicle
Drivers with any kind of hat on other than a baseball cap
People who drive with their mouth fully agape

Selfish drivers – know full well how to indicate and negotiate roundabouts but would rather not do it properly:

Taxi drivers
Drivers of clapped out utes
Any driver wearing a baseball cap
Red P platers
Suited middle aged male drivers of BMW’s, Mercs or Lexus
Fat people

you forgot 4wd drivers; drivers of cars; drivers of vans; truck drivers, and; motorcyclists. and short people. they got no reason…

And drivers who wear socks and sandals. Bit hard to spot the socks and sandals, but you know straight away that that’s what they’re wearing having seen the driving.

And any driver who wears a wide-brimmed hat in a car. It’s a sure sign of severe situational awareness impairment. Often they also wear socks and sandals.

And glasses. Just screams “Visual impairment”.

And gingers. Fiery people are dangerous people.

I remember reading complaints about the “indicating right when driving straight” on this site years ago, I thought it couldn’t possibly be true until I saw it one time heading home from the airport. I just can’t comprehend how someone could think it was the right thing to do…

Also mentioned on this site a long time ago, people in Canberra seem to be under the impression that the “Indicator” is called the “Confirmiator”… you get so many people putting it on when they’re already in the process of changing lanes or turning, as if it was to confirm their action, rather than indicate it… never trust anyone on the roads, because they might be one of those people.

kambahkrawler said :

I found it not practicable once. I had just been for a boxing lesson, still had the gloves on, and for some strange reason my hands were tied to the bottom of my chair. Couldn’t reach the indicator.

Otherwise it’s pretty practicable.

Unless you’re lazy or don’t give a toss about anyone else.

Oh wait, I forgot we’re in Canberra….

Many of the small roundabouts make it not practicable to indicate on exit (except for turning left as you are already indicating on approach anyway), simply because the time after passing the last exit before your turn is far to little for the indicator to be of any use, hence it is not practicable. If it were possible to indicate each and every time they wouldn’t have that ‘exception’ in the rules would they?

kambahkrawler said :

I don’t think people should just stereotype bad drivers. Include the idiots too.

Rubbish drivers – do not know how to indicate or negotiate roundabouts:

Anyone driving a blue-plated vehicle
Drivers with any kind of hat on other than a baseball cap
People who drive with their mouth fully agape

Selfish drivers – know full well how to indicate and negotiate roundabouts but would rather not do it properly:

Taxi drivers
Drivers of clapped out utes
Any driver wearing a baseball cap
Red P platers
Suited middle aged male drivers of BMW’s, Mercs or Lexus
Fat people

you forgot 4wd drivers; drivers of cars; drivers of vans; truck drivers, and; motorcyclists. and short people. they got no reason…

Holden Caulfield12:59 pm 14 Feb 12

qbninthecity said :

The ones that indicate after they’ve already started turning are the ones that annoy me the most….really they are already halfway through, why bother?

Agreed. That actually annoys me more than not indicating at all, because at least no indicating shows a complete lack of thought. Indicating after the fact shows the driver has acknowledged they need to let otehr drivers know WTF they are doing, but why bother since it has already been done (at least the moment to inform has passed).

Infuriating!

Also, I mentioned something like that on here once before and somebody replied with the rather quaint comment, “That’s a confirmicator!”

qbninthecity11:58 am 14 Feb 12

breda said :

I hear you, OP. There is a T junction coming out of my local shops where most pedestrians have to cross (no marked crossing nearby) and I estimate that 50% of cars coming out of the shops parking area do not indicate on their way out. Or, they begin to turn and simultaneously hit the indicator. Thanks. Now and then they indicate one way and turn the other.

The advice above is correct. Trust no-one. It means waiting a bit longer till the coast is clear, but it also means living a lot longer.

The ones that indicate after they’ve already started turning are the ones that annoy me the most….really they are already halfway through, why bother?

Holden Caulfield11:47 am 14 Feb 12

kambahkrawler said :

I found it not practicable once. I had just been for a boxing lesson, still had the gloves on, and for some strange reason my hands were tied to the bottom of my chair. Couldn’t reach the indicator.

Otherwise it’s pretty practicable.

Unless you’re lazy or don’t give a toss about anyone else.

Oh wait, I forgot we’re in Canberra….

When you’re not being the int3rn3t h3r0 you’ll probably have time to notice some roundabouts are quite small and in such cases there is generally not enough time of any merit to indicate when exiting. I’d say it is in these instances that Mr Plod would find it acceptable if one failed to indicate their intention to exit the roundabout.

kambahkrawler11:31 am 14 Feb 12

I don’t think people should just stereotype bad drivers. Include the idiots too.

Rubbish drivers – do not know how to indicate or negotiate roundabouts:

Anyone driving a blue-plated vehicle
Drivers with any kind of hat on other than a baseball cap
People who drive with their mouth fully agape

Selfish drivers – know full well how to indicate and negotiate roundabouts but would rather not do it properly:

Taxi drivers
Drivers of clapped out utes
Any driver wearing a baseball cap
Red P platers
Suited middle aged male drivers of BMW’s, Mercs or Lexus
Fat people

kambahkrawler11:22 am 14 Feb 12

Jono said :

WillowJim said :

Untrue. The road laws say you must indicate to leave every roundabout.

Pardon? Where do the Australian Road Rules say this? S118 seems to be the relevant section and it says, “If practicable, a driver driving in a roundabout must give a left change of direction signal when leaving the roundabout.”.

Note the phrase, “If practicable…” – clearly not mandatory on “every>” roundabout.

I found it not practicable once. I had just been for a boxing lesson, still had the gloves on, and for some strange reason my hands were tied to the bottom of my chair. Couldn’t reach the indicator.

Otherwise it’s pretty practicable.

Unless you’re lazy or don’t give a toss about anyone else.

Oh wait, I forgot we’re in Canberra….

Any Canberran’s scariest nightmare would be a roundabout with a ‘merge’ sign. The ambulances should just line up nearby..

Mysteryman said :

Okwhatever said :

Dilandach said :

Of course the fluoro menace do a lot more than their fair share of tailgating and other driving stunts.

Oh dear another person that thinks your driving behaviour is somehow related to the clothes that you wear, you just sound like a snob. Hang on I can do it too: “…Yeah, um it’s just like the stupid shirt and tie wearing zombies who all think they are exempt from slowing down in 40km roadwork zones”( I mean how dare they be slowed by lowly high vis wearing, loser second class citizens)

Oh wait, do my comments seem unfair and in no way grounded in reality? Hmm.

Oh dear another person who thinks that there cannot possibly be behavioural trends amongst certain groups of people based on factors such as vocational choice. That’s right, everyone is a beautifully unique snowflake that can’t be categorised.

True enough but Id like to see something more concrete before making a statement like ” Anyone in an occupation that requires hi viz clothing is X% more likely to be an inconsiderate, dangerous driver” .

I havent looked to make sure which thread but on one of these two running at the moment someone made the same claim that the worst drivers are public servants. I think in either case its oversimplifying.

Okwhatever said :

Dilandach said :

Of course the fluoro menace do a lot more than their fair share of tailgating and other driving stunts.

Oh dear another person that thinks your driving behaviour is somehow related to the clothes that you wear, you just sound like a snob. Hang on I can do it too: “…Yeah, um it’s just like the stupid shirt and tie wearing zombies who all think they are exempt from slowing down in 40km roadwork zones”( I mean how dare they be slowed by lowly high vis wearing, loser second class citizens)

Oh wait, do my comments seem unfair and in no way grounded in reality? Hmm.

Oh dear another person who thinks that there cannot possibly be behavioural trends amongst certain groups of people based on factors such as vocational choice. That’s right, everyone is a beautifully unique snowflake that can’t be categorised.

Dilandach said :

Of course the fluoro menace do a lot more than their fair share of tailgating and other driving stunts.

Oh dear another person that thinks your driving behaviour is somehow related to the clothes that you wear, you just sound like a snob. Hang on I can do it too: “…Yeah, um it’s just like the stupid shirt and tie wearing zombies who all think they are exempt from slowing down in 40km roadwork zones”( I mean how dare they be slowed by lowly high vis wearing, loser second class citizens)

Oh wait, do my comments seem unfair and in no way grounded in reality? Hmm.

Indicating is over rated…..every man for himself!

mcmc said :

On a similar note, CHECK YOUR BLINDSPOT before changing lanes! Noticed this (like most things) is particularly bad on Northbourne! Had a few near misses and if you’re in the middle lane there isn’t anywhere to go if someone decides to change into your lane on top of you! Not that hard especially on a straight road like most of our multi-laned roads are in Canberra!

That is always the one I’m worried about. I never hang in someone blind spots for longer than absolutely necessary. That bit where Northbourne turns into the Federal Highway past the Dickson intersection is downright scary because of this. I watch the traffic in the middle lane like a hawk to be prepared if one of them would decide to change lanes without checking to avoid slowing down for the lane merge.

And yesterday I had to speed because the car in the lane next to me decided to go past the bus as it was already pulling out into his lane.

I have blindspot mirrors and absolutely love them. But I still get annoyed by cars hanging in my blindspot for no good reason too. I only check my blindspot mirror if I’m planning to change lanes and I prefer to see the cars close to me even when I’m not changing lanes.

Minor gripe, but how much fun is complaining about bad drivers?!

WillowJim said :

Untrue. The road laws say you must indicate to leave every roundabout. However, police turn a blind eye to the small roundabouts.

Come to think of it, police turn a blind eye to this law regardless of the roundabout. Which is odd, because I notice that police almost always obey it themselves.

Untrue….. If your going to quote rules at least read them.A s mentioned by others the rules say we should indicatle left on exit “where practicable”. On small roundabouts it is often not practicable to indicate left on exit, so not a case of the police turning a blind eye or a driver doing something wrong.

On a similar note, CHECK YOUR BLINDSPOT before changing lanes! Noticed this (like most things) is particularly bad on Northbourne! Had a few near misses and if you’re in the middle lane there isn’t anywhere to go if someone decides to change into your lane on top of you! Not that hard especially on a straight road like most of our multi-laned roads are in Canberra!

Woody Mann-Caruso8:21 pm 13 Feb 12

Goood, good, run to the Greens, that will help.

Extra ‘o’ made me read it in the Emperor’s voice.

I hear you, OP. There is a T junction coming out of my local shops where most pedestrians have to cross (no marked crossing nearby) and I estimate that 50% of cars coming out of the shops parking area do not indicate on their way out. Or, they begin to turn and simultaneously hit the indicator. Thanks. Now and then they indicate one way and turn the other.

The advice above is correct. Trust no-one. It means waiting a bit longer till the coast is clear, but it also means living a lot longer.

WillowJim said :

Untrue. The road laws say you must indicate to leave every roundabout.

Pardon? Where do the Australian Road Rules say this? S118 seems to be the relevant section and it says, “If practicable, a driver driving in a roundabout must give a left change of direction signal when leaving the roundabout.”.

Note the phrase, “If practicable…” – clearly not mandatory on “every>” roundabout.

bobzed57 said :

Along the theme of road users and behaviours, ‘lane markings are purely for decoration’ – discuss.

I think many Canberrans would observe lane markings if they could.

Along the theme of road users and behaviours, ‘lane markings are purely for decoration’ – discuss.

GBT said :

This is only for multi-lane roundabouts. Just saying roundabouts confuses the issue.

Untrue. The road laws say you must indicate to leave every roundabout. However, police turn a blind eye to the small roundabouts.

Come to think of it, police turn a blind eye to this law regardless of the roundabout. Which is odd, because I notice that police almost always obey it themselves.

And, as an afterthought, how can there be so many drivers that think a quick on/off flash of their indicator is enough notice to change lanes. I haven’t looked at the road rules for a while, but I think your indicator is supposed to be on for at least three seconds (but at least long enough for those around you to have seen it). We don’t all drive around just staring at your indicators waiting for you to tell us what you are going to do and heaven help us if we blink. Perhaps, on reflection, I should have butchered the old election motto and titled the OP “indicate early and indicate often”.

I shall also decree death to those who think sticking their indicator on gives them an immediate right to change lanes or that their desire to skip the line of traffic or not plan their journey gives them the right to force their way into the other lane further up by just indicating and forcing the other cars to avoid an accident.

Thoroughly Smashed said :

Dilandach said :

One thing I learnt in my time driving around Canberra.

Don’t trust anyone’s driving. Ever. Always assume they’re essentially Mr Magoo.

Actually you should have learned this from your driving instructor, but regardless, you will learn this driving anywhere.

Rings more true in Canberra than anywhere I’ve driven.

I’ve had all sorts of fantastical things on the roundabouts of canberra. I’ve been in the inside lane going straight and the person in the left lane decided “to hell with lines, cutting time!” without even bothering to look, cutting me off and continuing on their merry way. Another roundabout and another clown had myself once again on the inside lane of the roundabout going straight but the person on the outside lane instead of going straight decided that turning right from the outside lane was a smashing idea.

Just a couple among a plethora of near misses and endless tail gating. Canberra has some of *the* worst drivers. I suspect that its a public service element bringing the worst the country has to offer and jamming them into a small city. Of course the fluoro menace do a lot more than their fair share of tailgating and other driving stunts.

00davist said :

GBT said :

schmeah said :

EvanJames said :

I wish someone would explain to me what they think they are doing when they have their right indicator going as they exit a roundabout.

Sorry, I think I’m someone you are talking about. I was taught to indicate when exiting a round-a-bout .. it gives brain dead drivers the signal that they can speed off and get home that 10 seconds earlier! Everyone wins!

This is only for multi-lane roundabouts. Just saying roundabouts confuses the issue.

Are you saying you only need to indicate exit of a multi lane roundabout?

Have a look at the rules:
If practicable, a driver driving in a roundabout must give a
left change of direction signal when leaving the roundabout.

Who on earth would indicate to the right when they leave a roundabout? When I learnt to drive many years ago the exact wording of the hand book was “It is courteous to indicate left when leaving the roundabout”. It was law to indicate your intended outcome though. But here it is from TAMS for anyone that doubts…

http://www.tams.act.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0009/14013/roundaboutrulesadvertisement.pdf

GBT said :

schmeah said :

EvanJames said :

I wish someone would explain to me what they think they are doing when they have their right indicator going as they exit a roundabout.

Sorry, I think I’m someone you are talking about. I was taught to indicate when exiting a round-a-bout .. it gives brain dead drivers the signal that they can speed off and get home that 10 seconds earlier! Everyone wins!

This is only for multi-lane roundabouts. Just saying roundabouts confuses the issue.

Are you saying you only need to indicate exit of a multi lane roundabout?

Have a look at the rules:
If practicable, a driver driving in a roundabout must give a
left change of direction signal when leaving the roundabout.

Thoroughly Smashed1:13 pm 13 Feb 12

Dilandach said :

One thing I learnt in my time driving around Canberra.

Don’t trust anyone’s driving. Ever. Always assume they’re essentially Mr Magoo.

Actually you should have learned this from your driving instructor, but regardless, you will learn this driving anywhere.

schmeah said :

EvanJames said :

I wish someone would explain to me what they think they are doing when they have their right indicator going as they exit a roundabout.

Sorry, I think I’m someone you are talking about. I was taught to indicate when exiting a round-a-bout .. it gives brain dead drivers the signal that they can speed off and get home that 10 seconds earlier! Everyone wins!

This is only for multi-lane roundabouts. Just saying roundabouts confuses the issue.

It is very frustrating when I have been waiting a long time for a car to go past only to watch them indicate at the last minute (or not at all) and turn just before they get to me.

yes, well, though you want to have people indicate to let you know their intentions – DON’T TRUST THEM! (indicators, not people – though that’s a separate issue)

as a motorcyclist, i was taught, very sagely, to never trust an indicator and to not cross into a vehicle’s path until they are out of the way (either turning just before you, or zooming past with their indicator still on in error [or turning just past you…])

as far as i am aware, the underlying premise on road rules is that a pedestrian has right of way unlesd they’re stupid enough to use it, or something like that…

schmeah said :

EvanJames said :

I wish someone would explain to me what they think they are doing when they have their right indicator going as they exit a roundabout.

Sorry, I think I’m someone you are talking about. I was taught to indicate when exiting a round-a-bout .. it gives brain dead drivers the signal that they can speed off and get home that 10 seconds earlier! Everyone wins!

Yes, and you are supposed to indicate an exit, but do you use your right or left indicator to do so?

Lets say you are going straight through a round about, you should indicate your exit, with your left turn signal, starting just after you pass the 1st exit of the roundabout (assuming a 4 exit roundabout)

EvanJames said :

I wish someone would explain to me what they think they are doing when they have their right indicator going as they exit a roundabout.

Sorry, I think I’m someone you are talking about. I was taught to indicate when exiting a round-a-bout .. it gives brain dead drivers the signal that they can speed off and get home that 10 seconds earlier! Everyone wins!

One thing I learnt in my time driving around Canberra.

Don’t trust anyone’s driving. Ever. Always assume they’re essentially Mr Magoo.

I might wait an extra couple of seconds to see if the person on the roundabout is really going straight or if they’ve just been lazy and will be going for the turn.

Solidarity said :

Ain’t going to happen, write all the RiotACT posts you want it’s not going to happen. Just keep your wits about you and don’t take any other cars intended movement for granted.

Or ride your bike …………. off the road of course 🙂

I understand your frustration (and sometimes share it) but of course you cannot trust that a car indicating is going to turn either.

I’ve ever been puzzled by people who actively decide at every turn (heh) whether to indicate, based on some (no doubt highly sophisticated) algorithm which must factor in the proximity of other traffic, pedestrians, time of day, speed limit, angle of turn, phase of the moon and the number of spanners in a Sidchrome tool kit.

Wouldn’t it be easier to just do it every time?

Ain’t going to happen, write all the RiotACT posts you want it’s not going to happen. Just keep your wits about you and don’t take any other cars intended movement for granted.

EvanJames said :

I wish someone would explain to me what they think they are doing when they have their right indicator going as they exit a roundabout. They had to turn their steering wheel left, their tyres are pointing left, why is their right indicator going? What does it mean? Do they think that they must indicate right for the entire duration of their time on a rounabout?

They can drive, breed and vote. God help us.

+1

And it’s not just people turning right at the roundabout getting lazy and leaving it on, Since moving to the endless roundabouts of Ngunnawal, I have noticed daily at least on arse hat going straight, and using the wrong indicator to exit, just as they leave, showing that they are trying to indeed indicate the exit.

It is so F^&*^ing simple, if you are exiting out of the round about, onto a road, indicate left to exit, if you are plowing your f^&*^ing car into the grassy mound in the middle of the roundabout, indicate right to exit.

Rawhide Kid Part311:28 am 13 Feb 12

I use a pedestrian crossing.

Holden Caulfield11:25 am 13 Feb 12

“Indicate, indicate indicate…”

Agreed, agreed, agreed!

I wish someone would explain to me what they think they are doing when they have their right indicator going as they exit a roundabout. They had to turn their steering wheel left, their tyres are pointing left, why is their right indicator going? What does it mean? Do they think that they must indicate right for the entire duration of their time on a rounabout?

They can drive, breed and vote. God help us.

Goood, good, run to the Greens, that will help.

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