It's a mosque planned for Nicholls

I agree with Fisho. Logic is, if the mosque in Yarralumla is too small then extend it! There is ample land there already, plus it desperately needs a facelift.

If you had restaurant or business that was overcrowded, would you open a second venue miles away? Or simply expand to cater for the crowd?

We already know that ACTPLA can’t plan anything for the future, as demonstrated by the poor car parking design and quantity or car spaces at the Nicholls shops.

There is NO WAY little Kellaway Avenue could cater for approx. 800 people for Friday Prayers. (within 5- 10 years)

I went to the information session at the Palmo last night as well – saw a loud mouthed red neck there and guessed that was Brian.

I don’t live far from the proposed development and I am more than happy to have the mosque and community centre there – looks like it might bring a better class of people to the area. Not before time based on some of these comments.

For all the ignorant out there it would seem to me that these people are being put through the hoops. More often community land is just allocated – it seems to me they are getting the rough end of the stick both from the government and some of the public.

Where can I donate to the building fund??

It is obvious that users of the building will come from a wide area of the northern ACT. It is simply Planning 101 that this mosque should be near some town centre/transport hub such as Belconnen or Gungahlin.
I am amazed that in 2009 planners apparently take seriously the view expressed by Alan Kerlin in the Sunday Canberra Times re “..looking like a Middle Eastern transplant.”
Surely we are mature enough to want a mosque to look like a mosque – we should expect a modern landmark building which could enhance our often bland town centres.
I am surprised the CMC gave in on this point, they should reconsider and plan for a mosque that is recognized for what it is and not build something disguised.
This whole matter makes me wonder what else is planned between the CMC and Govt. Is an Islamic school being discussed ?
I am not impressed with the pictures of worshippers outside which strike me as propaganda to support the case for a new building. Facts are that the CMC has had years to plan for increased mosque attendees and has, apparently by those photos, failed to plan adequately.
To wrap up – this looks to me like Labor imposing a possibly controversial proposal on an area that tends to vote for the opposition. Nicholls people should get together and oppose this poor quality proposal.

Jim Jones said :

I’m still trying to figure out some sort of food that doesn’t go with beer.

Well you know, anything served onsite at the mosque open day clearly won’t be allowed to go with alcohol, if they have such a thing…
(Can you eat at a mosque?)

But for anyone complaining about their property values and not knowing a community facility could be put up, part of your property’s value is associated with the phrase “close to shops, schools, transport, community facilities’, nothing to do with the concrete render, gigantic faux-Greek columns , or the surrounding houses full of Stepford wives.

That you didn’t do your own due diligence when either buying off the plan or just assumed that the house itself was all you were buying is entirely your problem.
The community facility zoning was there long before you were.

And as to complaining specifically about a mosque, its not like it can attract anyone more ‘undesirable’ than yourself or your hellish crotchspawn.

PsydFX said :

bigred said :

Bla bla bla, I’m a massive f(_)ckwit

Congratulations Bigred – Loser comment of the year.

+1

You obviously don’t live near us in Nicholls… I do not want a Mosque across the road from where I live. They didn’t mention that was in the pipeline when we bought here. Bigred is right, our real estate values are just about to drop significantly and it’s too late to sell to someother unsuspecting sucker. Any Mosque goers want to buy a house… great location!!

You should’ve done your due diligence,; the land was always going to end-up being used for community purposes. Bet you’d jump at a mosque if it was an alcohol and drug rehab/drop-in centre being proposed for the site.

In my suburb we have a Russian Orthodox church, a Mecedonian Orthodox churuch, a Uniting Church, a Catholic Church, a Buddhist temple, two primary schools, two private high schools, a senior college, two old-style public housing estates, drug and alcohol facilities, an old persons’ home, 25,000 plus traffic movements a day, and we’re all good friends.

Move on.

I think I have a solution which will satisfy both parties: the proposed mosque in Nicholls only admits elite muslims.

bigred said :

Bla bla bla, I’m a massive f(_)ckwit

Congratulations Bigred – Loser comment of the year.

I saw the mosque on the local news last night. It actually looked really lame.

DawnDrifter said :

For the record i dont mind it at all if they build a mosque in Nichols

Some of the comments here display ignorance and general stupidity along the lines of that flag draped redneck in camden.
the rest have been great

Follow the rules, get the approvals, build it – then once its there people will wonder what all the fuss was about

You obviously don’t live near us in Nicholls… I do not want a Mosque across the road from where I live. They didn’t mention that was in the pipeline when we bought here. Bigred is right, our real estate values are just about to drop significantly and it’s too late to sell to someother unsuspecting sucker. Any Mosque goers want to buy a house… great location!!

Did anyone go to the public meeting today?

Mosque-No Mosque-No
There’s nowhere to park my car
Muslims chanting InshAllah
Wa ha ha ha ha HEY

Surely all the extra towel heads will drag down real estate values. And think about sharing the one laned GDE with all the chanting masses. Oh yes, all the strange smells. Nicholls will be a ghetto in no time at all.

Got to the community meeting tonight and I must say they have made a few parking spaces for the cars on the plans for the mosque, but! as for trying to get one at the palmerston community hall with all those toyota camerys, got one after a few loops of the carpark.

Good to meet al and it was great to see what was going on just dont like the idea for the entry and exits going out onto Kelleway ave but the building looks great, if you were not from canberra you would drive past and not know that it was a mosque.

Just a shame the Stanhopless goverment could not fix the carpark in the shop so that it joins with the mosque in a way that people of the community and visitors from others have plenty of parking to enjoy the two restrants and the takeaway we have and for the ladys to get done up at the lady make up place.

Ohh! the only other thing that got raised was this guy saying he will have no place to put his 4×4 as he parks it on the grass, shame that he is not a riotact poster, he could have been in the running for the flame of the week yes?

As for having an open mind, I have an extremely open mind.
Any number of really stupid ideas seem capable of coming into my head 🙂

Re the pictures in the media showing people praying outside the Yarralumla Mosque – surely the obvious and most economical solution is to enlarge the building.

Postalgeek said :

Jim Jones said :

I’m still trying to figure out some sort of food that doesn’t go with beer.

Anything minty.

I suppose that’s why wine was invented.

It seems to come down to parking so far based on the rational comments above – so what is the go at the moment in Yarralumla?

If they currently get 150 cars (I’m guessing) for a regular Friday session – then common sense would dictate that space would be required for at least 200 at the new joint. Make sure the plans cater for this and all should be happy – shouldn’t they?

The Parkway singers and dancers seemed to get their parking issues sorted in their centre at the top of Kambah a couple of years ago….and there wasn’t a peep in the media about that development.

Build what you want for whatever make-believe superhero you worship, just don’t jam it down my throat.

Jim Jones said :

I’m still trying to figure out some sort of food that doesn’t go with beer.

Anything minty.

PM said :

YapYapYap said :

I’m not sure I can see the lack of consultation. After all you have to have a proposal to consult on and this appears to be that proposal, and the consultation is under way. perhaps you can explain a consultation process working some other way.

Um… from original post on the issue:

“In the local paper stuffed right on the back page is a notice to sell land at Nicholls. block 17 section 73, next to the Nicholls shop to the CMC, Canberra Muslim Community.
Not many people know what is going on so lets spread the word and find out.”

Just that guy’s view, but it’s clearly his view that sticking a notice on the back page isn’t sufficient. I can imagine many better ways of consulting, and the ACT government has a lot to improve upon in that regard. The recent debacle of the Belconnen bus interchange demonstrates that much.

And let’s not forget Katy Gallagher’s views on consultation ie it begins with a decision. Not a proposal, in her words, but a decision. I’d be nervous as a resident, too, given the govt track record of consultation is to listen and spend lots of money on adverts in local rags only to ignore the concerns raised.

Racism and/or discrimation based on religion (it might be either in this case) has no legitimate role in our society. Unfortunately, sometimes debates get hijacked in favour of unsavoury interests. On the other hand, we shouldn’t let politcal correctness be used by certain ACTPLA apologists to sidetrack the issue by letting an inappropriate development be approved for fear of a community being called (potentially unfairly) racist.

PS – I’d have to say if a large christian church was being proposed in the area, there’d be similar concern.

Gungahlin Al’s post pretty much covers the issue to my mind. The land was always going to be for community use, and now we know precisely what that use is. Some here want to revisit the community use satus of the land, whereas the consultation ought to be about the DA. Every suburb has its share of land reserved for community uses, and we’d be the poorer for it if that wasn’t the case.

I’m still trying to figure out some sort of food that doesn’t go with beer.

Skidbladnir said :

I am quite happy to have a minaret-adorned mosque next to an oniontop Eastern Orthodox amongst some Angican churchspires, in the shadow of a multi-statued Hindu temple, next to a chubby little roadside Buddha out the front of a monsatery, so long as they can contribute tasty\new things, invite me around occasionally, and help make BAMOASD better.

(If its going to be vegetarian for cultural\religious reasons, it had better go well with beer. If it can’t go with beer for whatever reason, it had better be damn tasty…)

Now THIS makes sense. If they use chilli it’s a bonus.

For the record i dont mind it at all if they build a mosque in Nichols

Some of the comments here display ignorance and general stupidity along the lines of that flag draped redneck in camden.
the rest have been great

Follow the rules, get the approvals, build it – then once its there people will wonder what all the fuss was about

barking toad said :

Muslims don’t integrate or assimilate. They infiltrate.

The 7th century blood cult has as its basic tenet per the Koran (or Quoran) – convert, subjugate and pay the tax, or be slain.

Good luck Nicholls residents. Enjoy the call to “prayer” from your new mosque.

You have got to be kidding me. Right?

What you’re saying about Muslims could also be directly applied also to Christians (there are lot of skeletons in Christianity’s extremely large closet also), so in effect your point is completely cancelled out in my somewhat more open mind than yours.

“I have no problem living next to a sign” they may say.

PM you make much more sense than our PM.

Think the very intuitive nature of that sign was clearly lost on some Al.

There is one simple reality for this piece of land – it is zoned as Community Facility, and always has been. So there will be a traffic/parking impact no matter what the use proposed for the site. It is therefore important that Roads ACT work with the proponent to integrate the parking solution in such a way as to resolve the problems. Under normal planning assessment, the proponent would have to deal with all traffic issues within their own site. But in this situation we have an existing situation, caused by poor assessment of the original shops DA. So the whole lot needs resolution together.

Anna Key said :

VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy said :

There’s no place for intolerance in Australia.

Sure there is. Nicholls.

Quite ironic given it is named after Sir Doug Nicholls.

+1 very ironic! LOL!

YapYapYap said :

I’m not sure I can see the lack of consultation. After all you have to have a proposal to consult on and this appears to be that proposal, and the consultation is under way. perhaps you can explain a consultation process working some other way.

Um… from original post on the issue:

“In the local paper stuffed right on the back page is a notice to sell land at Nicholls. block 17 section 73, next to the Nicholls shop to the CMC, Canberra Muslim Community.
Not many people know what is going on so lets spread the word and find out.”

Just that guy’s view, but it’s clearly his view that sticking a notice on the back page isn’t sufficient. I can imagine many better ways of consulting, and the ACT government has a lot to improve upon in that regard. The recent debacle of the Belconnen bus interchange demonstrates that much.

And let’s not forget Katy Gallagher’s views on consultation ie it begins with a decision. Not a proposal, in her words, but a decision. I’d be nervous as a resident, too, given the govt track record of consultation is to listen and spend lots of money on adverts in local rags only to ignore the concerns raised.

Racism and/or discrimation based on religion (it might be either in this case) has no legitimate role in our society. Unfortunately, sometimes debates get hijacked in favour of unsavoury interests. On the other hand, we shouldn’t let politcal correctness be used by certain ACTPLA apologists to sidetrack the issue by letting an inappropriate development be approved for fear of a community being called (potentially unfairly) racist.

PS – I’d have to say if a large christian church was being proposed in the area, there’d be similar concern.

VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy said :

There’s no place for intolerance in Australia.

Sure there is. Nicholls.

Quite ironic given it is named after Sir Doug Nicholls.

Muttsybignuts said :

screaming banshee said :

Hahaha gotta love google ads, on the right of my screen is a selection of ‘Muslim Singles’

Some real hotties too!

“umamah” could be hot. Cant see her under the Hausegger’s albatross but anyway. She does have some strong thoughts about marriage and the desire to be lead.

screaming banshee said :

Hahaha gotta love google ads, on the right of my screen is a selection of ‘Muslim Singles’

Some real hotties too!

Assimilation: Gradual incorporation of one ethnicity or cultural identity into another culture in such a way that the signs of the original cultural identity are lost and replaced by the signs of the dominant absorbing culture.
Integration: the incorporation of an individual or group into a collective society without the appreciable loss of its culture and identity.

You shouldn’t be expecting assimilation, it runs contrary to Australia’s social progress in the last fifty years.
Just happy if people are willing to integrate and then be civil in that society.
Actually getting along with eacother is a bonus.

I am quite happy to have a minaret-adorned mosque next to an oniontop Eastern Orthodox amongst some Angican churchspires, in the shadow of a multi-statued Hindu temple, next to a chubby little roadside Buddha out the front of a monsatery, so long as they can contribute tasty\new things, invite me around occasionally, and help make BAMOASD better.

(If its going to be vegetarian for cultural\religious reasons, it had better go well with beer. If it can’t go with beer for whatever reason, it had better be damn tasty…)

nyssa76 said :

Don’t worry, he’ll be back at school tomorrow tormenting his peers and annoying his teachers….

lol

There’s no place for intolerance in Australia.

Sure there is. Nicholls.

Every religion has its own fundamentalist cell, its just Islam’s turn this century to be in the spotlight after 9/11.

No religion assimilates with each other, how many wars have there been in the name of religion?

So who cares what they do, as long as it isn’t shoved down peoples throats, every one is entitled to their beliefs. There is the real question, will it be shoved down peoples throats? Time will tell.

bigred said :

It will encourage local employment for the white ute driving tradies and keep them out of the rest of town for a while. This will mean we can go about our business in an orderly fashion for a while. Might alos mean Elaine’s pies can set up a shop out there. Is all good.

Because during this period, there will be no other construction projects taking place.

And we all know that people who work for a living and don’t wear suits while they do it are the instigators of every social problem known to man.

It will encourage local employment for the white ute driving tradies and keep them out of the rest of town for a while. This will mean we can go about our business in an orderly fashion for a while. Might alos mean Elaine’s pies can set up a shop out there. Is all good.

Felix the Cat said :

I think the parking and lack of consultation by the govt is what the OP (not jenjen, the other person, Brian somebody?)was upset about. It just came across as being a bit racist that’s all, don’t think it was meant that way, not unexpected in these PC times we now live in.

I’m not sure I can see the lack of consultation. After all you have to have a proposal to consult on and this appears to be that proposal, and the consultation is under way. perhaps you can explain a consultation process working some other way.

Parking is an issue anywhere, and I kind of think it’s going to be less of an issue in Nicholls than in an inner-suburb.

People like bd-84 and shauno show why some people try to use what could be a legitimate concern as a smokescreen for cultural ignorance. There’s no place for intolerance in Australia.

Can we ban Gloria Jeans coffee too? Don’t want to see any more funds channelled to the Hillsong fundamentalists

It just wouldn’t be Nicholls without a parking problem. I’m fairly sure all DAs in Nicholls require you to demonstrate how you’re going to screw up the parking situation.

Why?

You sound as if you’re being churchist

Now a little closer to on-topic,

I think we can stop the racism here and now with a call to ban the construction of new churches of any religion

Hahaha gotta love google ads, on the right of my screen is a selection of ‘Muslim Singles’

johnboy said :

On the other hand, church bells on Sunday morning hold terrors of their own.

I strongly doubt the muslim community actually want to be hated. And standard (overly draconian) EPA noise restrictions will apply.

On that, is there anything worse than the electronic ‘bells’ that get blasted out across Thredbo whenever they hold a wedding at the chapel there? So loud it is almost completely distortion, and it just goes on and on and on and…

shauno said :

Yep the call to prayer at dawn is the most annoying. I’ve unfortunately been woken up numerous times while working in Islamic countries at sparrow fart in the morning. Usually with a wailing Iman over a loud speaker echoing across the country side. This will occur 4 other times during the day.

How old are you, 16?

You got woken up in an Islamic country by the call to prayer? Oh my hat, God/Allah/Dog forbid!! Do you actually know what it means? Grow up a bit. Jesus, heard church bells in a Christian country once

I’ve lived adjacent to a mosque in an Islamic country. The call to prayer added to the culture of the place. Didn’t annoy me one bit.

And what JB said about the noise restrictions. It won’t be allowed anyway, so put your ignorance away

Could be worse, the Witnesses could be moving in! Now that would concern me.

On the other hand, church bells on Sunday morning hold terrors of their own.

I strongly doubt the muslim community actually want to be hated. And standard (overly draconian) EPA noise restrictions will apply.

Mind you they do it via SMS as well these days.

Yep the call to prayer at dawn is the most annoying. I’ve unfortunately been woken up numerous times while working in Islamic countries at sparrow fart in the morning. Usually with a wailing Iman over a loud speaker echoing across the country side. This will occur 4 other times during the day.

The CMC rep on 2CC last week confirmed that they wouldn’t have call to prayer broadcasts. So let’s put paid to that one hey?

Oh come on BT, there have been minority muslim populations in countries across the world for over a thousand years.

Sometimes there’s trouble, sometimes there isn’t. It’s not a foregone conclusion.

Muslims don’t integrate or assimilate. They infiltrate.

The 7th century blood cult has as its basic tenet per the Koran (or Quoran) – convert, subjugate and pay the tax, or be slain.

Good luck Nicholls residents. Enjoy the call to “prayer” from your new mosque.

So some people want to build a church, and get together periodically.

Wow, what a big deal!

Empirically, it would seem Canberra has more problems with bad driving, teens beating up on each other and junkies robbing residential homes than we do with fundamentalist terrorists.

isnt friday their holiest of days?

With the exception of school days, during school times, wouldn’t there be an abundant of parking space available at the neighbouring school?

Don’t worry, he’ll be back at school tomorrow tormenting his peers and annoying his teachers….

Clown Killer, why are you allowed?

Dry your eyes princess. Like I said if you don’t love it just the way it’s going to be the fcuk off. Cry baby.

Clown Killer said :

In a perverse kind of way I’m sort of with Hargraves on the parking issue. Not enough car spaces? Well cry me a river. A bit of congestion? The worlds smallest violin is playing just for you. If you don’t like it you can always leave – after all it’s a free country.

I have to say, one of the most moronic posts I’ve seen here.

In a perverse kind of way I’m sort of with Hargraves on the parking issue. Not enough car spaces? Well cry me a river. A bit of congestion? The worlds smallest violin is playing just for you. If you don’t like it you can always leave – after all it’s a free country.

Ah, political correctness – the enduring belief that it is in fact possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

I think the parking and lack of consultation by the govt is what the OP (not jenjen, the other person, Brian somebody?)was upset about. It just came across as being a bit racist that’s all, don’t think it was meant that way, not unexpected in these PC times we now live in.

I would have thought near the Islamic centre down south would be ideal, plenty of spare land for a suitable building and parking facilities.

A downside might be the proximity to the culverts, making it flood prone, and some of the land in that corridor possibly being earmarked for road widening – although that implies a level of foresight not evident with those in charge…

Isn’t it funny how you can spell burqa as “burka” but you can’t spell mosque as “mosk”?

This is a few days old, hardly surprising it took the CT to broadcast the story.

As I mentioned in the famous jenjen flame post, I have no problems with any religious place of worship being built despite my non-beliefs. However, the full proper planning process must be used, including traffic and parking studies. Hargreaves’ idiocy in saying on the news the other night “parking is a problem everywhere and the people of Nicholls should just get used to it” stinks of what the stanhopeless’ government is all about, lack of thinking and planning. If sufficient parking and other facilities cannot be integrated into the plans then it should not be built in that location.