Jets and Vapour streams over Canberra

loki964 9 December 2009 57

[First filed on: Dec 6, 2009]
Hi all,

So, has it just been me noticing all the Jets flying over Canberra today?? (Sunday) I have watched more planes flying over head all very close together today then I think have ever flown over Canberra before (ok slight over statement…but you get the idea…), Anyone know if there was any military ops going on as im sure there cant be that many people flying to and from Sydney and melb!!

[Ed] I took some photos of what was left:
Only possibilities I came up with was RMC or ADFA graduation but RMC is probably not until Tuesday.


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    57 Responses to Jets and Vapour streams over Canberra
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    eh_steve eh_steve 11:31 pm 07 Dec 09

    Holding patterns should be loop-the-loops. That would be awesome.

    Mathman Mathman 10:36 pm 07 Dec 09

    Hmm, the Liberal Party is taken over by climate change deniers, ETS is defeated in the Senate, global leaders are about to start talks on climate change and all of a sudden there is a massive increase in chemtrails linked to global dimming – co-incidence? Probably.

    bileduct bileduct 10:17 pm 07 Dec 09

    stonedwookie said :

    explan this if these are normal flights?
    why are there no trails being left today?

    Inside jobby job!

    jase! jase! 9:29 pm 07 Dec 09

    I’m guessing harvyk is a pilot or at least someone very interested in aviation. Melb Centre does seem to have control until quite close to sydney from looking at the Canberra VTC.

    Where most airliners live (35ish thousand feet) the temperature is nominally considered for calculations to be -57 degrees, yes it does vary a little but it will always be what most people consider to be damn cold

    Mr Evil Mr Evil 8:00 pm 07 Dec 09

    It’s actually a giant paperclip made from smoke created by burning the unborn fetuses of Aborigines. This smoke released in a paperclip patten has been proven to stop global warming, and as a bonus, it kills white cabbage butterflies, and softens your hands while you do the dishes.

    I read all about it on the internet…….www.elvisisnotreallydead.com

    harvyk1 harvyk1 6:50 pm 07 Dec 09

    stonedwookie said :

    @ozmackem
    water particles frozen in front of the sun for
    5 plus hours i dont think so

    This is the last post I’ll waste on you, as you seem to be intent that everything is a giant gov’t comspiracy…
    How on earth can snow exist for an entire ski season, when it’s sitting out under the sun? Another gov’t conspiracy?

    The average temp at the typical altitudes which airliners fly at is usually well below zero. With exception to very very high altitudes usually the higher up in the air you go the colder it gets. Sun or no sun, when water gets below zero it freezes. When the amount of water in the air gets too high water particles “clump together” and form clouds (think fog or mist on the ground). Seeing contrails in the air is no more amazing than seeing a cloud in the air.

    Just quickly stonedwookie, do you really want to be publically talking about this? For all you know, I’m a gov’t spy and I’m simply trying to get as much information out of you as possible whilst tracing this connection. Expect a white van to pull up out the front of your house shortly 🙂

    basketcase said :

    Realistically though by the time the northbound flights hit Canberra, they are probably under Sydney approach control.

    Not yet, they would still be talking with Melbourne centre. Infact I do believe Sydney approach doesn’t take over until the plane is virtually landing, also with exception to the tower at Canberra airport itself, all of Canberra’s airspace (including Canberra approach) is controlled out of Melbourne centre.

    Anna Key Anna Key 5:22 pm 07 Dec 09

    stonedwookie said :

    explan this if these are normal flights?
    why are there no trails being left today?
    Chemtrail next to a contrail see the difference
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhTu59ru0Go

    Aint no scientist, but I think it would depend on atmospheric conditions.

    basketcase basketcase 5:20 pm 07 Dec 09

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jet_trails gives some info.

    Canberra is on the Melbourne-Sydney route. There is a 10 NM track difference for Northbound and Southbound traffic. Probably some vertical separation as well. Hence the two trails you see sometimes

    In the days of TAA and Ansett, when planes took off for the same destination with a minutes difference, the contrails created visions of a great race between two jets. Realistically though by the time the northbound flights hit Canberra, they are probably under Sydney approach control.

    During WW2, weather spitfires flew at 30,000 feet over Europe, they were identified by their contrails and a lot of effort went into “camouflaging” the trail, to no success afaik. The Germans however knew they were weather aircraft, and never bothered to waste resources in trying to chase them away.

    harvyk1 harvyk1 4:22 pm 07 Dec 09

    stonedwookie said :

    explan this if these are normal flights?
    why are there no trails being left today?
    Chemtrail next to a contrail see the difference
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhTu59ru0Go

    Did you know that the government are in cahoots with aliens to abduct us all. The “chemtrails” are really government mind control drugs.

    On a more serious note, contrails are only left for an extended period of time when the weather conditions are right. You have to remember that the weather conditions up there can be vastly different to down here.

    Also Gunhahlin Al, yeah I saw at least 4 holding patterns again this morning. Not surprising as Sydney airport gets quite busy early in the morning. The Sydney to Melbourne route often gets compared to a commuter bus service, there are more early flights between these two cities before 9am than there are Action bus services from my place into the city before 9am. (10 Bus Services compared to 18 flights)

    sloppery sloppery 3:54 pm 07 Dec 09

    jase! said :

    sloppery said :

    It’s surprising that the trails are white, I thought most carbon derivatives were black. The emissions from these jets have lots of hydrocarbons and carbon dioxide

    not that surprising, from burning hydrocarbons in oxygen there are 2 main resultant products, CO2 as you have mentioned and H2O.

    Urrgghh! CO2 and H2O sound like chemicals to me… The first one can kill you, and isn’t the send one oxygen dihydride?

    stonedwookie stonedwookie 3:45 pm 07 Dec 09

    @ozmackem
    water particles frozen in front of the sun for
    5 plus hours i dont think so

    Thoroughly Smashed Thoroughly Smashed 3:33 pm 07 Dec 09

    stonedwookie said :

    More unoriginal and hilariously ridiculous conspiracy theories

    RiotACT thread delivers!

    Gungahlin Al Gungahlin Al 2:29 pm 07 Dec 09

    They had obviously been in these holdings patterns again this morning…

    stonedwookie stonedwookie 2:29 pm 07 Dec 09

    explan this if these are normal flights?
    why are there no trails being left today?
    Chemtrail next to a contrail see the difference
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhTu59ru0Go

    ozmackem ozmackem 2:26 pm 07 Dec 09

    stonedwookie said :

    Chemtrails for sure why would a plane do two u turns?
    Contrails are water based and should evaporate not stick around for hours n block the sky like chemtrails do.

    If they are high enough the water particles freeze and can last for quite some time.
    Do your wear a tinfoil hat in bed to stop alien abductions?

    Chop71 Chop71 1:57 pm 07 Dec 09

    Red Bull air race at 30,000 feet

    Aleximus Aleximus 1:56 pm 07 Dec 09

    Duntroon Graduation Parade today. They were probably practicing for the overflight on sunday

    just saying…

    jase! jase! 1:51 pm 07 Dec 09

    stonedwookie said :

    Chemtrails for sure why would a plane do two u turns?
    Contrails are water based and should evaporate not stick around for hours n block the sky like chemtrails do.
    They seem to been laying most trails near the sun almost blocking it out.i think there trying to reduce its uv damage but chemtrails can be used for many things.
    vist my youtube for video’s http://www.youtube.com/user/CanberraChris
    Or Search Dtic http://www.dtic.mil
    For barium ion clouds/Barium radar

    oh dear lordy, you are serious aren’t you?

    the reason for the 2 u-turns has been mentioned, to delay the entry in to the CTA for ATC reasons, flying Hobart to sydney we did a nice long loop from Canberra – Goulburn – Yass – Canberra before continuing on.

    Deano if you get the binos out when there is a 747 flying over you can see 4 trails that merge in to 1 if the conditions are right, some days its the wings, some days its the engines

    harvyk1 harvyk1 1:09 pm 07 Dec 09

    stonedwookie said :

    Chemtrails for sure why would a plane do two u turns?

    Because a holding pattern is designed to slow the plane down

    Step 1. Do a180 degree turn and flys in the wrong direction for a little bit
    Step 2. Do another 180 degree turn so that it’s flying in the right direction again…
    Step 3. Repeat as many times as required…

    stonedwookie said :

    Contrails are water based and should evaporate not stick around for hours n block the sky like chemtrails do.

    Just like clouds evaporate immediately and don’t stick around…

    The “chemicals” are invisible, just like the exhaust of your car should be… Yesterday would have been fairly still up in the air, and probably somewhat humid, which are both unusual, but not unheard of. Combine that with one of the busist air routes in the world and it doesn’t take a rocket surgeon to realise that planes will leave longer than usual contrails and that aircraft may from time to time have to do holding patterns.

    Canberra is almost the exact point at which aircraft flying to Sydney need to start their decent, so there would be quite a few aircraft which do holding patterns above us (where it doesn’t annoy Sydneysiders or us as we can’t hear or normally see them). It’s just unusual to see the holding patterns drawn out in the sky so clearly.

    s-s-a s-s-a 12:41 pm 07 Dec 09

    qantas aircraft has some technical issues and was given a priority clearance to Melbourne. Everyone else had to give up their “slots” which caused the traffic jam visible heading south

    The one shown in the pic at top of this post was an aircraft heading (mostly) north.

    Also interesting to note that this loop was STILL visible this morning, tho slightly less distinct (looking from Weston Creek towards Black Mtn).

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