19 November 2007

Letterdrop: Thinking Voting for Greens?

| jemmy
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I got a pamphlet in the letterbox today, Thinking about voting for the Greens? It was about the risk a voter takes by voting Greens in the Senate and giving them the balance of power. It hits at the Labor Party for dealing with the Greens. Fair enough, get the info out there for all to see. Everyone’s got a right to an opinion, surely.

It has the usual mish-mash of irrelevent associations, quotes from several years ago, and absurd “A implies B, therefore B implies A” logic fallacies. We’re all pretty used to it by now, I guess. Even though mud-slinging irritates me enormously, we won’t see it reduce because research shows that character assassination does work in elections. There are very good reasons why, and they don’t say much that is good about the human condition, but that’s a topic for another day. Mud-slinging does work, that’s why American election ads are almost all negative ones, and we’re going that way too.

However, although irritated already, it irks me more when the mud-slingers try to hide and don’t even have the courage to show themselves. The pamphlet has no party logo and is written by an individual, Andrew Heath, who I’ve never heard of.

A quick google search shows he is not only a Liberal Party official, he is the Campaign Director for this election! An anonymous pamphlet critical of the Greens and Labor, written by the Liberal’s Campaign Director.

Heath, at least have the courage of your convictions and reveal yourself when you write these things. I might think a bit more of you than a bit of a cowardly-custard.

UPDATED –
There is a letter in today’s The Age, “Ssh, It’s the Liberals” complaining about the same anonymous pamphlet, except that their pamphlet comes from a Julian Sheezel who is the State Director in the Vic Liberals.

Perhaps Andrew Heath isn’t acting alone but is part of an organised campaign arranged to take place around the nation. All in all, it appears there are sneaky antics afoot. Come on Libs, don’t hide behind tricky pamphlets, be plain and upfront.

(The letter writer expresses the view that the pamphlet’s colour of green has been intentionally chosen to be misleading. He also has an interesting slant that the pamphlet demonstrates that the Liberals believe they have lost the election because it mentions Labor and Greens in power, which is a no-no for spin coming from an opposing party.)

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Holden Caulfield3:57 pm 05 Dec 07

A bit late on this one, but I was pretty pissed off at this pamphlet. Well, actually I wasn’t, I was rather too cynical about it all. But my wife was pretty angry about it. And Humphries’ efforts at defending the brochure on 666 were pretty feeble it has to be said.

I wrote an angry email to him, Lundy and Tucker explaining why I thought his brochure stinks and asked that whoever won the Senate seats ensured they look into making political material such as this have greater transparency.

Let’s see what happens.

The simple fact is that the Liberals are scared that the Greens will get in on the donkeys back.

Frankly, I can’t blame them – they have made a lot of electoral enemies in the last decade of power.

Dont’ know what happened there the correct order of the last post was:

Not really Caf – Just saw it for what it was a big power game (despite some really talented top rate people being in there). Some of my friends stayed in hoping to fix it from the inside, but they were slowly beaten down.

Hell even Crean couldn’t reform it – he was knifed for trying to push through the Wran – Hawke reforms.

I agree that the labor party is not a social democratic party. Their website says:

“The Australian Labor Party has been a mainstay of political life in Australia for well over one hundred years. It is one of a small group of genuine labour parties around the world which provides for the direct affiliation of trade unions, incorporating them into the structure of the party.

This distinguishes labour parties from social democratic parties, although many have common ideals and philosophies, and from other broadly-based progressive parties like the Democratic Party in the United”

So I will not (can not) join. I personally think it is a weakness, but then the polls would suggest the most do not give a toss

Not really Caf – Just saw it for what it was a big power game (despite some really talented top rate people being in there). Some of my friends stayed in hoping to fix it from the inside, but they were slowly beaten down.

Hell even Crean couldn’t reform it – he was knifed for trying to push through the Wran – Hawke reforms.

“I agree that the labor party is not a social democratic party. There website says:

The Australian Labor Party has been a mainstay of political life in Australia for well over one hundred years. It is one of a small group of genuine labour parties around the world which provides for the direct affiliation of trade unions, incorporating them into the structure of the party.

So will it is not I will not (can not) join. I personally think it is a weakness, but then the polls would suggest the most do not give a toss
This distinguishes labour parties from social democratic parties, although many have common ideals and philosophies, and from other broadly-based progressive parties like the Democratic Party in the United States.”

I love the “Only Liberals Like Gary Nairn are tough on crime – Labor is soft on crime” – what? You guys must be desperate – crime is clearly a State responsibility and NSW (under State Labor) has one of the harshest criminal justice systems in Australia.

Deadmandrinking2:50 pm 20 Nov 07

Did anyone get the pamphlet about ‘teaching stanhope a lesson’ at the federal election?

Uh, I might teach Howard a lesson at the FEDERAL election…

philbert83au1:36 pm 20 Nov 07

Can anyone beat 8 letters from Gary Nairn in the last two months? Plus umpteen leaflets in the mailbox…

Student unions and trade unions are very different things.

Anyway, like it or not, the fact that you quit the CPSU rather than attempt to work inside it to improve it means you don’t really agree with the ideals of the Labour movement. As much as you’d like the ALP to be the “Social Democratic Party”, it’s not. (By the way, I’m not an ALP member *or* a union member)

that we was a typo – brain moves faster than fingers

We I was in the Public Service and had stopped my membership of the CPSU after the union rep was caught talking about her plan to stop a promotion of a work college. I was also once in the Storeman and Packers union because they would not let me work without membership. Strange I also couldn’t go to uni with union membership.

There is a pattern, which many do not remember

Like I said you have to be in your union if you can be, it’s not usually investigated though.

I always loved rule e), you can still be in the PLO and a member of the ALP.

I was refused membership -true. Each state and Territory requires it.

Here are the requirements out of the ACT constitution.

3.1 Individual Membership
(1) Any person may apply for individual membership of the ACT Branch if they are:
a) a resident of the ACT; and
b) 15 years of age or over; and
c) correctly enrolled with the Australian Electoral Commission at their stated
address unless not entitled because they are less than 18 years of age or not
an Australian citizen.
d) a financial member of a union covering their occupation, trade or profession if
they are eligible to join a union, or have made all attempts to encourage their
employees to join a trade union and the applicant observes union conditions if
they are an employer; and
e) not a member of any other political party or any organisation proscribed by
ACT Branch Conference, unless the organisation is a fellow party of the
Socialist International.

Voting for the Greens makes you a queer, and voting for Labor will kill us all. Best off voting for Howard and Costello who can manage the economy. If Labor gets in, Australia will go backwards 200 years . We’ll all be living in tents, millions of foreigners will infest the country, unions will run rampant killing everybody etc etc.

John Howard and Costello. What utter magicians. Amazingly outstanding economic managers….

What would they do without the mining boom. How good an economic hero would Howard be without China buying all our coal.

What the fuk has Howard ever done about the climate issue ? SELL SELL SELL COAL COAL COAL …

Tap, i think the rule is that if you’re in an industry that has a union you’re supposed to be in a union. If you’re self employed, retired or in an industry without out clear ACTU cover then you don’t.

The person who calls him/herself the truth, (im not calling you the truth… sorry)

Thats interesting you weren’t allowed to join the labor party because you aren’t in a union. I was…

Who was it that was called “mean and tricky” and the “lying rodent” by his own side? Just more of the same, from more of the same. Turkeys.

Junk mail often keeps me entertained while I’m on the toilet.

The Liberals really have sunk to quite a low level in many ways this election.

sorry smilesr (Find me a political party that treats me like an intelligent person and I will vote for them.) looks like another vote for ‘none of the above’, then!

and btw, on topic, do people really actually read junk mail?? well, i’ll be. ya learn sumfink every day…

Actually you must be in Fraser to get Troy. In Canberra its Natalie.

Yeah, but Annette Ellis comes in as not having filled out the survey either, yet she gets a preference vote-for card with the Libs last still; look at the fine print with the ** and #.

I took a look at the GetUp site smilesr, I went hard right in my answers and it told me to vote for the CEC guy.

Troy Williams came last because he hasn’t filled out their survey that they use to compare your views with the candidates. McMullin came ahead of the Greens, Dems and Socialist candidates.

BeyondThought10:52 am 19 Nov 07

Like the “Save Our Senate” campaign isn’t trying to be “independent” whilst plugging away at every opportunity for the Greens.

or then there is the billboards that have the Howard working families quote with reference to http://www.howardfacts.com.au – all without ANY reference to the ALP

The Libs aren’t the only ones doing this. GetUp – calling themselves apolitical but with links to the Greens, are doing an online campaign How Should I Vote that no matter how you answer the quiz questions, always places the Libs last.
Find me a political party that treats me like an intelligent person and I will vote for them.

Where are the Greebs on RiotACT

Happy to pump out electronic junk mail but not enter the bullpit???????????

Vote 1 Kerrie for an independent Senate – nice cynical manipulation. In the Green party machine backrooms : ” I know lets associate the word independent with the person. At the same time down play the Green PARTY part – that will make people think that they are voting for an independent voice not a part of a party machine.”

Where’s Senate candidate Gary Humphrie’s courage to sign his name to the brochure? Instead an anonymous item is posted with all the paid for junk delivery mail ( I saw the motorbike…)It’s not good enough to not reveal who has put the brochure out.Nor for Andrew Heath’s authorisation – ACT Liberals Director of campaign)see other comments – to be the only giveaway.(Yeah I googled him too coz I was thought all the drug festival, tax twaffle was so lame…) How disingenuous of Humphries. Does he think the electorate is so dumbo as to not be suspicious of the origins of such a piece of sensationalist, made up ALP/Greens badpress? He he. And even after a media release put out by Senator Humphries on 27 Sept announcing his intention to run a clean campaign which “does not misrepresent the views or policies of another party.” By chance, as a journo, I just happened to see that one at the time) So its Ok for Humphries – or his campaign director to make up alot of claptrap, print it on green paper to confuse the punters…But its not OK for him to put his name to it.Sounds like you have a major internal ethical dilemma to deal with Gary Humphries .Doesn’t exactly make one want to trust you if re-elected to the Senate. What sort of voice or political professionalism/standard/ethics would you show us there, this time around.Hang on by your fingernails this time Gazza. Whatever teh outcome, you’re under scrutiny & will be proise-watched.But first you gotto win. Voters don’t like dirty tricks, so maybe it’s time to come clean….

Jemmy has no political affiliations. However, I am frustrated that we let politicians and parties get away with behaviour that would have company directors gaoled. Ignoring it allows it to continue, so I’ve stopped ignoring it.

and who is Ant and Pandy?? they seem to know who all the lib are – what are there afiliations.

For the record – not a member of any party. Tried to join the Labor party, but was not allowed to join as I was not a member of a union. I believe in not being forced to join a union – so no ALP membership for me.

I have served both Labor and liberal Governments. I have voted labor more than liberal – but did vote Liberal last time.

typed and spoken – thetruth

Both parties have always done this crap – I usually ignore it – but at least you were able to look up Andrew Heath on the internet – who the hell is “Jemmy”?

Deadmandrinking10:49 pm 18 Nov 07

Although Gary Nairn seems to have taken responsibility for this piece of shit, I must say that it’s eerily reminiscent of the tactics of those scary donate-but-don’t-vote Brethren fanatics.

Both the major political parties are guilty of this.

I think the electoral laws should be amended so that where someone is campaigning on behalf of a party, they should have to disclose their party affiliation on the material. At the moment, they just have to show name and address.

Totally misleading, person reading thinks they are hearing from an independent community voice when in fact they are getting party propaganda.

Newspapers today had an article about how the greens are looking good to win Gary Hargreaves’ seat.

If only lib polling had shown that a few months ago and we could’ve had some bonus money thrown around.

100% with you ant

It’s pretty disgusting. It shows that they think we are stupid, and able to be affected by such tripe. Sadly, there must be some basis to their view, but still.

I’ve been bombarded with addressed and mailed crap from Gary Nairn (although the return address is in Sydney). Our taxes at work. I hate that. Most of the crap is about how bad labor is, and how one mustn’t vote for them. I’ll vote for the Greens AND Labor, so there you Liberal fascists.

The libs pull this sort of stunt EVERY election. I will NEVER vote liberal whilst they do this dishonest stuff.

When I once delivered political stuff we were told that as it is area specific it counts as an addressed mail, not junk mail and to give one to everyone. This is the same for neighbourhood watch newsletters.

What bugs me is that political pamphlet distributors ignore my “no junk mail” sticker. I’d rather read about pizza deals.

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