27 March 2012

Mugged at the Florey shops

| johnboy
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A 28-year-old man was arrested following an aggravated robbery in Canberra’s north last night (Monday, March 26).

About 7.30pm a woman was leaving the Florey Shopping Centre when she was approached by a man. The man demanded cash while pointing a knife towards the woman. The woman handed the man a sum of cash after which he walked back towards the shopping centre.

A short time later police attended the Florey Shopping Centre and located the alleged offender. He was subsequently arrested and taken to the ACT Watch House.

He will face the ACT Magistrates Court today where he will be charged with aggravated robbery and possess offensive weapon with intent.

[Courtesy ACT Policing]

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VYBerlinaV8_is_back10:27 am 28 Mar 12

CCTV achieves nothing but providing a blurry pic or two after the event. Cameras are easily defeated by either covering the face or covering (or damaging) the camera itself.

TheDancingDjinn10:26 am 28 Mar 12

VYBerlinaV8_is_back said :

buzz819 said :

… your keyboard ninja dreams.

Maybe the security guard should have torn off his shirt (revealing rippling muscle), shouted “this time it’s personal” and jumped into a spinning back kick whereby he kicked the knife out of the perp’s hand. Then, with the knife skittering away over the damp cobblestones, said “now the odds are even, sucker – let’s do this thing”, and proceed to launch a series of kicks and open handed blows. The fight ends with a back kick sending the perp into a stack of old cardboard boxes and lying still, but with his eyes very wide. The security guard then says “next time you want to hurt someone, remember this moment”, and strides off toward his shiny Harley Davidson, just as the cops show up.

I loved this so very much – “lets do this thing” has to be the best thing i have ever read, im going to make sure i use it in a sentance soon haha – is this a scene from that Renegade show? hah

Chop71 said :

HD Cameras are more efficient than a security person.

Crooks don’t care about cctv cameras, otherwise there would be no shoplifting.

Chop71 said :

HD Cameras are more efficient than a security person.

Unfortunately video camera’s as a general do nothing to deter crime, they are an investigation tool at best, not crime prevention.

Look at how many “world stupidest criminal shows” etc. there is on TV.

HD Cameras are more efficient than a security person.

VYBerlinaV8_is_back9:58 am 28 Mar 12

buzz819 said :

… your keyboard ninja dreams.

Maybe the security guard should have torn off his shirt (revealing rippling muscle), shouted “this time it’s personal” and jumped into a spinning back kick whereby he kicked the knife out of the perp’s hand. Then, with the knife skittering away over the damp cobblestones, said “now the odds are even, sucker – let’s do this thing”, and proceed to launch a series of kicks and open handed blows. The fight ends with a back kick sending the perp into a stack of old cardboard boxes and lying still, but with his eyes very wide. The security guard then says “next time you want to hurt someone, remember this moment”, and strides off toward his shiny Harley Davidson, just as the cops show up.

breda said :

Well, if the security guard can’t actually do anything, except call the cops (which anyone with a mobile would do anyway) – why are they there? What is their role? Serious question.

Visual deterrent only I’m afraid. They have pretty much no power to do anything and they’re only there in the hope that a potential offender will consider a softer target instead.

Jethro said :

Why should a security guard be expected to attempt to restrain someone with a knife, or even remove it from them, when not even armed and trained police do that. The cops will shoot a person dead before they attempt to remove a knife from them so what was this security guy meant to do?

I agree, but it does leave you wondering what the point of a security guard actually is.

I would’ve thought it was pretty obvious – to prevent shoplifting and act as a general deterrance. Who knows, maybe the bloke would’ve robbed the chemist if the security guy wasn’t there. In this situation, I’d expect him to call the cops and get as detailed description as he could. He is not equipped to deal with a man with a knife.

Why should a security guard be expected to attempt to restrain someone with a knife, or even remove it from them, when not even armed and trained police do that. The cops will shoot a person dead before they attempt to remove a knife from them so what was this security guy meant to do?

I agree, but it does leave you wondering what the point of a security guard actually is.

Sure it matters who has the biggest stick, but it matters a hell of a lot more who’s swinging it – General Shepard, CoD MW

TheDancingDjinn said :

a few strikes to the head with an asp would probably kill the average person before they got close enough to stab you.

that’s assume you can get a few hits before they get close enough.

In MMA, if you’re up against someone who has a reach advantage, you rush them and take the fight to the ground in order to remove that advantage, even if that means taking a punch or two in the process. Same would apply in an ASP vs knife battle.

Speaking as an internet expert. 😉

TheDancingDjinn10:39 pm 27 Mar 12

buzz819 said :

Captain RAAF said :

An ASP baton (qualified BTW) over the forearm will soon see the knife on the ground, where sometimes, they have been known to rebound off the ground and end up in the perps neck..

Yeah good work, take a stick to a knife fight.

I’ll put my hand up to go against you and your baton with a knife.

I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again, the real world is a lot different to your keyboard ninja dreams.

You’re forgetting that an Asp is quite long, it has more reach than someone holding a knife. One swing at the head of said knife holder with just the tip of an asp will cause skull fractures. Thats no fantasy, that just someone having more reach – stabbing someone is something you have to get close to do, and a few strikes to the head with an asp would probably kill the average person before they got close enough to stab you.

Captain RAAF said :

An ASP baton (qualified BTW) over the forearm will soon see the knife on the ground, where sometimes, they have been known to rebound off the ground and end up in the perps neck..

Yeah good work, take a stick to a knife fight.

I’ll put my hand up to go against you and your baton with a knife.

I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again, the real world is a lot different to your keyboard ninja dreams.

whitelaughter8:46 pm 27 Mar 12

Found out about this as a friend of mine was also threatened by this creep!

A major problem for security guards is that they need to be *on* their employers land to be able to do anything legally. This is repeatedly hammered home during security training.

Solution? Well, one option would be that the ACT govt ‘gifts’ lease of road/park space to businesses so that their security guards can enforce safety there.
A better way though, would be that when you get your security licence, you are authorised to enforce security on govt land, so long as you are on duty at a neighbouring private site. Rather than paying guards for this, grant them to travel for free on ACTION so long as they’re in uniform – that costs the govt nothing, gives the guards a valuable perk and makes bus travel safer.

Well, if the security guard can’t actually do anything, except call the cops (which anyone with a mobile would do anyway) – why are they there? What is their role? Serious question.

Captain RAAF7:46 pm 27 Mar 12

An ASP baton (qualified BTW) over the forearm will soon see the knife on the ground, where sometimes, they have been known to rebound off the ground and end up in the perps neck..

Mike Bessenger3:49 pm 27 Mar 12

MrMagoo said :

My understanding was the security guard was put in place after a spate of incidents at Florey shops. I believe (stand to be corrected) that his tenure is at the behest of the shop owners/lease holders of the Florey Shopping Centre as a whole.

The security guard is paid for by the Florey Chemist. He’s there daily from 5pm until they close at 9pm.

Tetranitrate2:22 pm 27 Mar 12

No security guard with half a brain is going to go and tackle someone waving a knife around. That is simply not what they are paid to do – agreed it sounds like the guy was slacking off on the job, but there’s not much more a guard is going to do in this situation than call the police and yell at the offender to f**k off.

It’s absolutely absurd to expect that an unarmed security guard on $20 an hour is going to be running around tackling armed crims using the skills and knowledge gained from a week-long cert II course when the police themselves wouldn’t be approaching the guy without firearms at the ready.

Erg0 said :

firebrand said :

Are you saying that if the security guard was hired by the chemist he should just stand and watch it happen because he wasnt robbing them??

He’s a private security guard, not a police officer. If he’s being paid by the chemist to guard the chemist then he has no more (or less) obligation to get involved than any other bystander.

My understanding was the security guard was put in place after a spate of incidents at Florey shops. I believe (stand to be corrected) that his tenure is at the behest of the shop owners/lease holders of the Florey Shopping Centre as a whole.

In sayng that, if he is to be some sort of deterant, then surely he should act upon seeing someone obviously affected by substances or acting in a manner other than ‘normal’ who it could be conceived poses a threat to publis safety. Surely he has some role, other than dialing the police, cause anyone can do that and doesn’t have to wear a security unifrom.

firebrand said :

Are you saying that if the security guard was hired by the chemist he should just stand and watch it happen because he wasnt robbing them??

He’s a private security guard, not a police officer. If he’s being paid by the chemist to guard the chemist then he has no more (or less) obligation to get involved than any other bystander.

firebrand said :

Are you saying that if the security guard was hired by the chemist he should just stand and watch it happen because he wasnt robbing them??

If you paid for the security guard to protect your store, would you want him patrolling the entire shopping centre? Would insurance covers him if he had an accident outside the store? Would the store have a higher work-cover premium next year because the guard is out getting involved in fisticuffs away from your store during work hours?

Anyway, it’s been known for a while security do nothing. Paid crap all, mostly internationals and can’t string a sentence together.

firebrand said :

Are you saying that if the security guard was hired by the chemist he should just stand and watch it happen because he wasn’t robbing them??

Security guard is a type of business, not volunteers.
What I am saying, however, is there is no reason to accuse someone for not going above and beyond their obligation. If he wants to deter crime that is outside of his original contract then he’s more than welcome to. If he doesn’t want to then that’s his choice.

firebrand said :

I have seen the “security” guards there a number of times *snip*

If you know the person or organisation who hired him then you may wish to let them know of your concerns.

like what? crash tackle him to the ground and get the knife away from the offender?

Sorry – under security rules and legislation they aren’t even allowed to grab/restrain/get a weapon off anyone. He couldn’t have done too much…

Are you saying that if the security guard was hired by the chemist he should just stand and watch it happen because he wasnt robbing them??

I hae seen the “security” guards there a number of times when i have visited..and i have been astonished by the amount of times i saw them concentrate more on eating, or chatting with whatever friend is hanging around or talking on the phone. It scares me a little what would happen if they were actually forced to do something.

Jivrashia said :

MrMagoo said :

The whole point of having the guard there is to stop this from happening. With the medical Centre and Chemist open later, it was felt that such steps were needed.

To be fair, it depends.
It depends if the security guard was hired by the Chemist and the Medical Centre, or by the shopping complex. Don’t forget these people are being paid by specific people for specific tasks. If he has been hired by the chemist then he only has obligation to deter crime taking place within the Chemist shop.

MrMagoo said :

The whole point of having the guard there is to stop this from happening. With the medical Centre and Chemist open later, it was felt that such steps were needed.

To be fair, it depends.
It depends if the security guard was hired by the Chemist and the Medical Centre, or by the shopping complex. Don’t forget these people are being paid by specific people for specific tasks. If he has been hired by the chemist then he only has obligation to deter crime taking place within the Chemist shop.

missalli said :

We were there last night when all this unfolded. I had to make a quick stop at the chemist for Nurofen. When we pulled up, we commented on how things had gotten so bad that they needed a security guard, who mind you was on the phone and eating his dinner from the takeaway, when this guy approached him and asked him for a smoke. He was clearly under the influence of something, and we agreed that this was the exact reason a guard was needed. I was just drawing up the Nurofen for my son, when my 10 yr old daughter yelled out “Mum, he has a knife”. I turned to have a look, and saw it as well. I tried to get the guards attention, but he was happily eating and talking. I got out of the car and he tried to brush me off. I ended up in his face telling him “that guy has a F&*^ing knife”. It didnt register with him at first clearly as he continued his conversation, it must of them sunk in, because he dropped his chicken and ran into the chemist. The police were there very quickly, which I know now was because he had just robbed someone, they thanked my daughter for her awareness, took a brief statement and that was that.

and thus my point abut the guard. Talking on the phone and feeding your face is hardly ‘keeping an eye on things’. The whole point of having the guard there is to stop this from happening. With the medical Centre and Chemist open later, it was felt that such steps were needed. Now if we can just get a guard who isn’t trying to expand his wasteline and set up his Friday night dinner date.

Captain RAAF said :

North side crime….nothing to see here, move along!

I’ll have a chat to Rod Anderson when I see him next re: crime rates Vs north/south.

Is that Mr Anderson from The Matrix?

We were there last night when all this unfolded. I had to make a quick stop at the chemist for Nurofen. When we pulled up, we commented on how things had gotten so bad that they needed a security guard, who mind you was on the phone and eating his dinner from the takeaway, when this guy approached him and asked him for a smoke. He was clearly under the influence of something, and we agreed that this was the exact reason a guard was needed. I was just drawing up the Nurofen for my son, when my 10 yr old daughter yelled out “Mum, he has a knife”. I turned to have a look, and saw it as well. I tried to get the guards attention, but he was happily eating and talking. I got out of the car and he tried to brush me off. I ended up in his face telling him “that guy has a F&*^ing knife”. It didnt register with him at first clearly as he continued his conversation, it must of them sunk in, because he dropped his chicken and ran into the chemist. The police were there very quickly, which I know now was because he had just robbed someone, they thanked my daughter for her awareness, took a brief statement and that was that.

mooo_cow said :

I thought the charge would be ‘armed robbery’ instead of ‘aggravated robbery’?

Well there is no “armed robbery” charge.

Robbery is using force to take something off someone, aggravated robbery is the same act, conducted by more then one person, or by the use of a weapon, hence, aggravated robbery.

It’s like when someone’s house get broken into a stuff taken, it isn’t a robbery, it’s a burglary.

mooo_cow said :

I thought the charge would be ‘armed robbery’ instead of ‘aggravated robbery’?

Good point. Perhaps they chose the latter in order to also charge him with “possess offensive weapon with intent”?

Captain RAAF9:04 am 27 Mar 12

North side crime….nothing to see here, move along!

I’ll have a chat to Rod Anderson when I see him next re: crime rates Vs north/south.

a. There is a ‘security’ guard at the Florey Shops these days, what was he doing? b. The alleged offender was a rocket surgeon if he hung around the shops long enought to get caught.

I thought the charge would be ‘armed robbery’ instead of ‘aggravated robbery’?

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