26 August 2013

Music Venue Closures?

| chutneyGreen
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Hey I am a local CIT student studying PR and for my latest assessment I am researching the Canberra music scene.

I am looking for a list of live music venue closures over the past decade within Canberra. I am exploring the link between noise complaints made by neighbouring residential developments and the closure of venues.

An example would be the closure of Toast due to noise complaints made by The Waldorf Hotel. I believe nearby Transit Bar has also had to reduce it’s live music capacity due to similar complaints from The Waldorf.

Also looking for facts and figures on closures and live music attendance over the past decade.
If anyone has any ideas or links they would like to share I would be very appreciative 🙂

Even email me separately cagreen@live.com.au

Thanks 🙂

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Oh yeah. It’s not actually closed, but what about Tilleys? Their decision to basically stop hosting gigs has had a massive detrimental impact on the quality of gigs in town. So many fantastic gigs there; Bob Brozman (RIP), Karma County, IOTA, Diesel, Vince Jones, Badloves, Gadflys, Lior, Mike Stern (!), Tiddas…

grunge_hippy said :

…lack of mid sized venues …Royal Theatre or Canberra Theatre

John Butler Trio at Canberra Theatre was… interesting. He was encouraging people to break the rules and dance in the isles. He did return some months later with a more intimate show with his wife which suited the venue quite well.

grunge_hippy said :

He said that if they were to play UC or ANU they have to bring everything with them (stage, rigs etc) which makes it too expensive.

Do they even have bands anymore at ANU???

The former owner of the Greenroom is now the in-house supplier at the ANU; his equipment nearly perpetually set up in the refectory and would definitely suit these type of mid-size gigs.

chutneyGreen said :

Can anyone tell me the exact year that the Asylum closed down?

It was around 1997. The owner was Craig Azzopardi.

chutneyGreen said :

Ronald_Coase said :

Thanks for the memories! Still remember the last night at the Terrace, well mostly remember anyway.

I can’t believe I’d forgotten about Asylum and Gypsy bars. The Asylum was very appropriately named, especially given acid is the poorer cousin of ecstasy.

And, while not officially closed I nominate the ANU bar. It is a shadow of its formerly dodgy self. Whatever happened to the regulars of the outside table next to the wall?

Can anyone tell me the exact year that the Asylum closed down?

I’m gonna go out on a limb and say 1993… My memory is hazy at best though.

chutneyGreen10:09 pm 28 Aug 13

Ronald_Coase said :

Thanks for the memories! Still remember the last night at the Terrace, well mostly remember anyway.

I can’t believe I’d forgotten about Asylum and Gypsy bars. The Asylum was very appropriately named, especially given acid is the poorer cousin of ecstasy.

And, while not officially closed I nominate the ANU bar. It is a shadow of its formerly dodgy self. Whatever happened to the regulars of the outside table next to the wall?

Can anyone tell me the exact year that the Asylum closed down?

chutneyGreen10:07 pm 28 Aug 13

grunge_hippy said :

I was speaking to a well known Australian artist about venues in Canberra. He said that there is a definite lack of mid sized venues and that’s why hardly anyone comes to Canberra. (well, one reason at least) It’s either the Royal Theatre or Canberra Theatre and that’s it they are hardly “rock” venues. I have one friend who refuses to go to Royal Theatre, even if he likes the band.

This artists last incarnation sold out Royal Theatre twice (and did back in 2003) and they then moved to tents/festival style, but this time as a solo artist, he barely filled the Royal Theatre. He said that if they were to play UC or ANU they have to bring everything with them (stage, rigs etc) which makes it too expensive.

His previous band also had their start at the asylum back in the day. I wish I had seen them there, would have been awesome. I did see them however at ANU a few times before they got stupid big, but its not a great venue. Do they even have bands anymore at ANU???

Not strictly related to venue closures but if there were more of those types of venues around, we might get more artists coming to Canberra.

Hey this is great feedback so thanks! I’d love to know who the artist is *hint hint* 🙂
Ha ha but understand your discretion.
This is exactly what my original research and the general opinion of Canberra locals has shown:
a) that the smaller venues left in Canberra are too small for many well-known interstate acts
b) the larger venues are too large for Canberra artists to play or don’t have that ‘rock’ appeal like you mentioned for interstate artists, or
c) the larger venues are still too small for the larger overseas bands eg. Tool and Black Sabbath (which has also bring the festival issue into things.. we just don’t have somewhere suitable to stage a BDO or similar)

Dorette’s (where the Hippo is) – jazz and cabaret …

In more recent times, The Maram closed only a couple of years ago. I saw a popular JJJ band there about 3 years ago – it was a great for mid-size acts as you could get really close and be part of it. Such a shame, as there’s a lack of places Southside.

http://the-riotact.com/the-demise-of-the-maram/62255

grunge_hippy7:33 pm 28 Aug 13

I was speaking to a well known Australian artist about venues in Canberra. He said that there is a definite lack of mid sized venues and that’s why hardly anyone comes to Canberra. (well, one reason at least) It’s either the Royal Theatre or Canberra Theatre and that’s it they are hardly “rock” venues. I have one friend who refuses to go to Royal Theatre, even if he likes the band. This artists last incarnation sold out Royal Theatre twice (and did back in 2003) and they then moved to tents/festival style, but this time as a solo artist, he barely filled the Royal Theatre. He said that if they were to play UC or ANU they have to bring everything with them (stage, rigs etc) which makes it too expensive.

His previous band also had their start at the asylum back in the day. I wish I had seen them there, would have been awesome. I did see them however at ANU a few times before they got stupid big, but its not a great venue. Do they even have bands anymore at ANU???

Not strictly related to venue closures but if there were more of those types of venues around, we might get more artists coming to Canberra.

Ronald_Coase6:11 pm 28 Aug 13

Thanks for the memories! Still remember the last night at the Terrace, well mostly remember anyway.

I can’t believe I’d forgotten about Asylum and Gypsy bars. The Asylum was very appropriately named, especially given acid is the poorer cousin of ecstasy.

And, while not officially closed I nominate the ANU bar. It is a shadow of its formerly dodgy self. Whatever happened to the regulars of the outside table next to the wall?

The Henry Grattan in Phillip was a pretty full on covers venue … not sure why it closed …
Royals used to have a bit flow of interstate main stream type acts …. I can ( in the dim blurry past ) remember seeing The Angels , The Radiators , The Divinyls etc there , and it was shut down for noise issues iirc … played there a few times myself in support slots ….
Raiders in Queanbeyan was the same big name acts / local supports …. Noise issues apparently …
The 80’s and 90’s were so good to be in a band in Canberra 🙂

PBO said :

I have heard a rumour that the Basement wants to cut out bands.

Really, and replace them with what exactly? Karaoke..

devils_advocate2:24 pm 28 Aug 13

Jim Jones said :

PBO said :

I have heard a rumour that the Basement wants to cut out bands.

Nope.

LOL, cut out bands and remove their client base completely. Seems legit.

devils_advocate2:23 pm 28 Aug 13

chutneyGreen said :

Grimm said :

Pretty much every place that had metal bands on regularly. Some of these are more than a decade ago, but all closed due to noise complaints:

The Asylum
Circus Circus
Terrace Bar
Zorros
The Gypsy Bar (Twice)
The Rock Ape

Could you specify where The Asylum, Circus Circus and Zorros used to be located please?

Zorros was in the civic bus interchange, where downstairs shooters is now.

So many good memories. You would pay $8 and get a jug of beer and a ticket. After midnight, you could redeem the ticket for another jug. But they basically closed b/c of teh smoking ban, I remember the first night it came into effect walked in there and it was deserted. And for the first time could see all the way to the other side of the bar.

PBO said :

I have heard a rumour that the Basement wants to cut out bands.

Nope.

I have heard a rumour that the Basement wants to cut out bands.

chutneyGreen11:17 am 28 Aug 13

Just wondering, to make my facts more succinct, could anyone provide me with the year that these bars closed?

Downstairs at the old Rex, and there was also a fantastic venue downstairs either next door to the old YWCA in the bus exchange, or the building next door. I can’t remember the name, but it was excellent. Late 1980s …

And, for the oldsters, Flloyds upstairs in one of those u-shaped streets in Phillip …

This guy looks like he knows a thing or two about Canberra music!
http://www.canberramusicians.com/

chutneyGreen said :

Wouldn’t you say most closures are significant in their own way?
Which do you think are the most significant and why? 🙂

I think there was a time in the mid-late 90’s where a lot of venues that existed purely to host original, live music disappeared. This gave way to “pubs that host the odd band every now and then.”

The Asylum, for example, existed primarily to host original, live music. There was nothing else to do up there but drink and watch bands. No comfy couches, nothing interesting mounted on the walls, the floor was made of chewing gum and, if I recall correctly, it was owned and operated by a sound engineer. The Asylum was upstairs in East Row a few doors north of The Phoenix.

I think the most significant would have to be Gypsy Bar. They fought hard to stay open and a lot of musos were very unhappy about it’s unfortunate demise – I suppose it was the last large venue in Civic that really supported live music.

There’s still places to play, sure, but nothing big enough to host a big-name national act let alone anything else.

chutneyGreen4:36 pm 27 Aug 13

And I seem to remember The Basement in Belconnen shutting down or at least not doing gigs for a while but have begun again in the past few years. Am I correct?

I moved away from Canberra from 07-10 so missed a big chunk of the local scene in that time..

chutneyGreen4:33 pm 27 Aug 13

niftydog said :

I think limiting yourself to a ten year time frame will mean you miss out on many of the most significant closures.

Places I played (that I can remember) that aren’t around any more;
-Asylum
-Zoros
-Heaven
-Gypsy Bar
-Terrace Bar
-Finnegan’s/Rock Ape
-The Boardroom
-Terminus Tavern
-Toast
-Holy Grail

Wouldn’t you say most closures are significant in their own way?
Which do you think are the most significant and why? 🙂

chutneyGreen4:29 pm 27 Aug 13

Grimm said :

Pretty much every place that had metal bands on regularly. Some of these are more than a decade ago, but all closed due to noise complaints:

The Asylum
Circus Circus
Terrace Bar
Zorros
The Gypsy Bar (Twice)
The Rock Ape

Could you specify where The Asylum, Circus Circus and Zorros used to be located please?

chutneyGreen4:19 pm 27 Aug 13

Hey everyone, this is a way better response than I was ever expecting! Me being the youngen I am, some of these places I have never heard of and will investigate their closures further.
If anyone has a link or evidence of a news report about any of these closures I’d love to hear from you.

“Funny how horrible places like Mooseheads never seem to have these sort of problem.”

Totally agree. After a boozy night at Transit I slept in my car outside Mooseheads and woke at 5 or 6am with their fist pumping music still blaring across the empty morning..

On the comment of seeing The Living End play, if anyone else wants to comment on great Australian acts that they witnessed playing at these venues before they closed I’d love to hear from you too 🙂
thanks again guys 🙂
feel free to email me separately if you’d like too cagreen@live.com.au

Magic Dirt at Gypsy Mark II, or Machinegun Fellatio at the same venue

Note also that when a venue changes hands, often, one of the first things the new owner does is axe the music – they need to get control of their expenses and may use noise complaints as an excuse.

I think limiting yourself to a ten year time frame will mean you miss out on many of the most significant closures.

Places I played (that I can remember) that aren’t around any more;
-Asylum
-Zoros
-Heaven
-Gypsy Bar
-Terrace Bar
-Finnegan’s/Rock Ape
-The Boardroom
-Terminus Tavern
-Toast
-Holy Grail

veg said :

The Terminus was downstairs in East Row opposite Bailey’s Corner and it changed into the Gypsy Bar. The restaurant upstairs forced them to close due to noise and so the Gypsy moved to the downstairs spot near King O’Malleys and operated for a while. Not sure why it closed at that location.

After the cafe that was where London Burger is now forced ridiculous noise constraints on the Gypsy Bar which meant they couldn’t operate as a live music venue Gypsy broke its lease and moved to underneath King O’Malleys. Their old landlord sued and won ~$450 000 IIRC so Gypsy had to close permanently. A sad tale all round.

Funny how horrible places like Mooseheads never seem to have these sort of problems.

veg said :

The Terminus was downstairs in East Row opposite Bailey’s Corner and it changed into the Gypsy Bar. The restaurant upstairs forced them to close due to noise and so the Gypsy moved to the downstairs spot near King O’Malleys and operated for a while. Not sure why it closed at that location

The Terrace Bar was over next to what used to be Electric Shadows (close to the casino) and was closed in 1994. I remember hearing that the casino didn’t like all the smelly long haired people congregating out the front which gamblers had to walk near however I’ve no idea if they actually closed it. Some of my favourite gigs were at the Terrace and I still miss it

Rock Ape in Dickson was quite regularly hassled by the Tradies probably due to metalheads boozing and bonging in the car park and I don’t think it was a noise issue with them.

You had me right up until you made that last comment.

the website http://www.mendicantmusic.com has a lot of scans of old gig flyers from 1988 to present with heaps from Terrace Bar, Gypsy and Rock Ape.

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Geoff_from_Lushpup_Images10:09 am 27 Aug 13

Oh wow … so many memories! Back in the day when I played in bands we used to do the Asylum (I think I still have an Asylum weekly gig guide somewhere from the early 90’s … I’ll have a look!) and Gypsy(1&2), the Terrace Bar of course … played up at Heaven more than a few times too 🙂

Darker gigs were to be had at the Rose & Crown (Weston) or the Boot & Flogger (Kingston) or even Subway (Garema PLace). There was the Glovebox in Philip too. I miss them all in their own way. Oh don’t forget Finnigans in Dicko.

Good thread!

The Terminus was downstairs in East Row opposite Bailey’s Corner and it changed into the Gypsy Bar. The restaurant upstairs forced them to close due to noise and so the Gypsy moved to the downstairs spot near King O’Malleys and operated for a while. Not sure why it closed at that location

The Terrace Bar was over next to what used to be Electric Shadows (close to the casino) and was closed in 1994. I remember hearing that the casino didn’t like all the smelly long haired people congregating out the front which gamblers had to walk near however I’ve no idea if they actually closed it. Some of my favourite gigs were at the Terrace and I still miss it

Rock Ape in Dickson was quite regularly hassled by the Tradies probably due to metalheads boozing and bonging in the car park and I don’t think it was a noise issue with them.

I really miss Zorro’s. Although I don’t think it was closed due to noise complaints or anything else like that. Hadn’t Sue just had enough and decided it was time to call it quits?

NB – I was in my naive early 20’s at the time, so I may be completely wrong

I can’t remember if it was the Terrace Bar or The Terminus where I first saw The Living End play – before they’d been signed. Was it the Terminus downstairs in East Row, before or after Gypsy Bar moved to the area under King O’Malley’s?

I have nothing of value to add.

RIP Lithium @ Toast.

The Terrace Bar – wow that brings back memories.

Pretty much every place that had metal bands on regularly. Some of these are more than a decade ago, but all closed due to noise complaints:

The Asylum
Circus Circus
Terrace Bar
Zorros
The Gypsy Bar (Twice)
The Rock Ape

A good one to watch will be the lighthouse in Belconnen with all the apartments being built around it. The Old Canberra Inn have some ridiculous noise monitor which sends them a fine every time they breach the dB limit now too.

The Greenroom operated in Phillip above O’Sheas from 2003-2008.

Finnegans/Rock Ape in Dickson

The wonderful Gypsy Bar, downstairs near where the Phoenix is, closed because developers who were opening a brasserie on the corner above wanted it gone.

chutneyGreen4:28 pm 26 Aug 13

This is also what I am researching, the other reasons behind the closures of venues in Canberra so any more insight you have would be great 🙂

To be honest I think Toast had more and bigger issues than just the noise complaints for all I loved it so.

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