New Protected Cycle Lanes for Civic?

Horrid 12 November 2009 49

The Canberra Times reports that separated ‘Copenhagen’ style cycle lanes are being considered for Civic, along with a ‘shared space’ zone on Bunda St where all users have equal rights. Pedal Power seem to think it’s a good thing and a bit of digging on their website soon revealed where the idea came from- looks like part of some kind of orbital cycling route around the whole of Civic.

Personally I reckon it’s a great idea- you could ride round this cycleway thing in quarter of the time it would take in a car in rush hour, methinks. And get to just about anywhere in Civic you needed to go on it. And give the people screaming about cyclists in their way exactly what they want- the cyclists off to one side somewhere. Now me, I don’t mind riding in Civic now, but I’ll bet that the shopper set, trendy uni students, office workers and the like would all go for this and get on their bikes to ride it.

So hopefully it’s something that Canberrans will get behind and support. I fear not all will- nothing brings out the hatemongers and rednecks faster than the prospect of taxes that cyclists pay being spent on cycling, instead of yet another freeway or carpark. But there is probably a lot more people who reckon if it works in Copenhagen, or Melbourne like the CT story says, then it’ll probably work in Canberra as well.


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49 Responses to New Protected Cycle Lanes for Civic?
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Grrrr Grrrr 12:37 pm 13 Nov 09

James-T-Kirk said :

I don’t have to register my trailbike I hoon up and down the reserve on.

AFAIK, if you’re unregistered and unlicensed, your riding venues consist of the ACT MCC track in Fairbairn or one of the other private tracks around.

On public property your trailbike is only allowed on roads – dirt or paved – and like any road you have to be registered to use them. There are no legal off-road trails in the ACT to the best of my knowledge.

MTBs are allowed on formed tracks in Canberra Nature Parks, as well as the MTB-legal areas (Kowen, Stromlo, Majura etc.)

Regarding the shared use road – traffic flows? Close it permanently and get the cafes like Gus’/Essen and restaurants like Sammy’s spread right out there. That’d be great. That little stretch of road accomodates bugger-all parking and traffic and trying to get through there at busy times is just as slow as going around Cooyong.

Not sure what you on about regarding the 90 degree thing, as the only cars at 90 degrees in the PDF are in the artist’s drawing of Bendigo.

The roads chosen for the dedicated bike lane seem like good choices to me.

Pedal Power’s members’ taxes will pay for the cost just fine, methinks. If they fall a little short, perhaps Mr Plod can hang out in Civic and fine all the bogans riding bikes without helmets. Then move onto stupid drivers, who do things like blocking intersections by entering them without being able to exit them. That’d raise revenues pretty quickly, and sort out some of those traffic flow issues you’re on about.

VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy 12:07 pm 13 Nov 09

Quite clearly, noone is being punished enough…

Jim Jones Jim Jones 12:03 pm 13 Nov 09

nexus6 said :

actually i think bike riders should be fined for breaking the law.

There’s nothing magical about not being registered – if you break the law, you can still be brought to account.

By the same token, I regularly see registered motorists breaking the law, and they go unpunished.

Registration has absolutely nothing to do with law-breaking and ‘being held to account’. This argument is a red herring.

James-T-Kirk James-T-Kirk 11:05 am 13 Nov 09

The proposal says Pedal Power has 3000 members – Share the cost among them.

Oh – And in the stakeholder/issues list – it only mentions positives. Go out and canvas the actual stakeholders, and publish the negatives. Who gives two hoots that the NRMA is happy about the street becoming one way – what about the commuters?

Also, is the parking in one of the pictures actually 90 degree. That will stop traffic as soon as somebody goes to find a parking spot – this plan is a plan built by people with no understanding for traffic flows.

Apart from that, I *love* the idea…..

James-T-Kirk James-T-Kirk 11:02 am 13 Nov 09

nexus6 said :

” should i register my MTB which has never been ridden on public roads?

Of course not – I don’t have to register my trailbike I hoon up and down the reserve on.

J Dawg J Dawg 11:01 am 13 Nov 09

nexus6 said :

actually i think bike riders should be fined for breaking the law. I dont think we shoudl pay rego. should i register my MTB which has never been ridden on public roads? I also think cyclists should be liable for any damage or injury they cause. My comments earlier were more directed at the frustration that drivers feel when they see a cyclist break the law.

I see your point, I agree with most things you say. Although as others have said, a cyclist can hide behind anonymity. And a rego system similar to motorcycles makes sense – don’t register it if you don’t ride it on the road. In addition to accountability, the gov’t could spend a hell of a lot more money making dedicated cycle lanes to make cycling even safer. From my point of view, it’s the poor actions of a few cyclists which ruin it for the rest of you and give motorists a bad impression of all of you.

J Dawg J Dawg 10:48 am 13 Nov 09

Horrid said :

…turning it into an unrelated discussion on road rules, full of the usual fallacies of logic, sweeping generalisations, double standards and outright lies that they use in place of actual arguments.

Please don’t act all ‘holier-than-thou’, for someone who criticises all of these negative traits you sure do use a lot of them. Instead of complaining about people highjacking your thread why don’t you break the cycle and comment on the many positive and legit criticisms (i.e. changing rooms and showers in office buildings)?

nexus6 nexus6 10:42 am 13 Nov 09

“Using that logic do you also support no rego, no fines and no liability for motorcycle and scooter riders?”

actually i think bike riders should be fined for breaking the law. I dont think we shoudl pay rego. should i register my MTB which has never been ridden on public roads? I also think cyclists should be liable for any damage or injury they cause. My comments earlier were more directed at the frustration that drivers feel when they see a cyclist break the law. “why so angry?” its not uncommon to have drivers intentionaly swerve close to you, beep their horn for no reason, yell abuse or throw things at you when you cycle on the road. basically WTF is wrong with car drivers that they get SO angry at cyclists who are only risking their own lives when they do something stupid? Maybe its the frustration of being stuck inside your metal box, breathing fumes and listening to crap commercial radio that makes you so angry? I dont know but i do my absolute best not to ride on roads at all these days, hence my calling for more and better designed paths. most of the paths are good, but there could still be more of them, and better design is somthing you should always aim for.

as fo cyclists having no liability, is this really tru? if i ride my bike into someones car or a person on the footpath are there really no penalties?

dvaey dvaey 10:36 am 13 Nov 09

Deckard said :

Dvaey
.. You always need to hijack any thread to do with cycling to rabbit on about rego for cyclists. Give it a rest will you. It ain’t going to happen so deal with it!

I never said anything about paying rego, other than a small joke about drivers maybe paying less because of less roads to use.

Deckard said :

When drivers pay for 100% of the road they’re driving on, then maybe you’d have a point.

Drivers dont pay 100% for the road they drive on at all, but they do pay 100% for their RIGHT to drive on the road. If I try to use the road without a licence and without paying my dues for rego, road safety, and insurance or without displaying proper identification, Im liable for an offence, however once again that is an argument for another thread.

I have no problem with bike paths or cyclists in general, infact I believe they are a part of what makes canberra a more attractive place to live, with the ability to cycle along our many paths at your own pace while enjoying the best nature has to offer, which is different to how I view roadways and on-road cycleways where as I was always taught, being able to use the public road isnt a right its a privilege.

Postalgeek Postalgeek 10:32 am 13 Nov 09

VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy said :

I find it interesting that cyclists seem free to criticise and be unhappy about their cycle paths, but car drivers just have to suck up whatever is thrown at them.

Yeah right. So the NRMA has never lobbied in its entire existence?

Horrid Horrid 10:20 am 13 Nov 09

As I predicted in my op, “nothing brings out the hatemongers and rednecks faster than the prospect of taxes that cyclists pay being spent on cycling”.

It was of course, too much to hope for that a sensible discussion on possible alternative cycling methods would not be almost immediately hijacked by anti cycling bigots (who presumably are too lazy or stupid to start their own thread), turning it into an unrelated discussion on road rules, full of the usual fallacies of logic, sweeping generalisations, double standards and outright lies that they use in place of actual arguments.

This just makes me like the idea of a redneck and bigot-free zone in these special cycleway lanes even more than I did before.

Having a small piece of cycberspace on Riot Act taken over by these morons is slightly annoying to me and other cyclists. But that’s fine- the consolation is going to be watching them work themselves into a lather of hatred and fury, when these special cycle lanes get built on physical space that they think belongs to themselves only, and being completely unable to stop it. That will be so much fun that any improvement that makes cycling easier will be almost a bonus. I might even join Pedal Power to help them achieve it.

VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy 9:33 am 13 Nov 09

I find it interesting that cyclists seem free to criticise and be unhappy about their cycle paths, but car drivers just have to suck up whatever is thrown at them.

steveu steveu 7:28 am 13 Nov 09

If all workplaces had shower and change room facilities, I think that would help encouraging people to use their bike more. But I dont think there are many commercial buildings that have this. It would be interesting to see if that was a requirement of all new buildings that were leasing office space.

J Dawg J Dawg 10:10 pm 12 Nov 09

Sgt.Bungers said :

People who ride bicycles do not have to pay registration on their vehicle because it is human powered. End of story. Build yourself a Fred Flinstone car with your feet dangling out the bottom to push it along and you wont have to pay rego on that either.

I’m sorry, but that is stupid logic. Do you really think if I took the engine out of my car and pushed it down the road the police would be okay with that? I don’t think so…

nexus6 said :

But the fact that a cyclist can so easily be killed if they stuff up is more than enough of a penalty i think.

Using that logic do you also support no rego, no fines and no liability for motorcycle and scooter riders?

bd84 bd84 9:18 pm 12 Nov 09

If they put some thought into the cycle lanes in the first place, I think there would be a lot more happy people. The cyclists on roads separated by a thin white line and some green paint is not safe by any means for either cyclists or drivers. There are far safer options available.

As for Bunda St, this one thing I actually agree with the Greens on. Close the street off to vehicle access between Genge St and Akuna St, with the exception of delivery/emergency access to certain sections through shared access. There is no point in allowing traffic on it anymore, unless you want to sit waiting for pedestrians at the zebra crossings for long periods of time. Plus there’s a perfectly good road to connect one side to the other via Corrinderk St.

Postalgeek Postalgeek 7:19 pm 12 Nov 09

dvaey said :

Many years ago, I had this thing called a ‘bike map’ which showed the myriad of bike paths available in the city. It doesnt take a rocket scientist (or apparently it does) to find bike paths in Canberra, and realise that they often follow a more direct route from point-to-point than the road network, often cutting across blocks of (bush)land more directly than roads. For example from the tuggeranong parkway to my house, is maybe 200m by bike path but over 1km by road, as a lot of suburbia is.

dvaey If there’s a cycle path that offers an safe direct route, and doesn’t ram our bikeseats into our arses, we’ll use it over roads. Trust us on that one.

In the meantime, it sounds like you’ve got it made with a 200m bike path to the Tuggeranong Parkway. Of course, if the Tuggeranong Parkway isn’t your ultimate destination, you might be a little stuffed if you think cyclists don’t need to use roads.

Deckard Deckard 5:54 pm 12 Nov 09

Dvaey

Start a new thread on road/cycling rules will you. You always need to hijack any thread to do with cycling to rabbit on about rego for cyclists. Give it a rest will you. It ain’t going to happen so deal with it! If I ever do have to pay rego I’m going to ride down the middle of Northbourne Ave doing 20kph, blocking the traffic and yelling out to the world that I pay for this road!!

When drivers pay for 100% of the road they’re driving on, then maybe you’d have a point. Would love to see the day when you have to pay a toll to drive down the shops.

Purpose built cycle lanes, not shared with pedestrians, would be a godsend. But I feel city circle loop may not be utilised enough to stop the rednecks complaining.

Granny Granny 5:26 pm 12 Nov 09

I think it’s an excellent idea!

🙂

Funky1 Funky1 5:25 pm 12 Nov 09

sepi said :

someone told me this is ok if you have 3 people in the car – isn’t it a transit lane? Or is that little roundabout bit just a bus lane?

The transit lane is further up Yarra Glen where it is signposted as a transit lane. The section off the roundabout, unless I’m mistaken, is a bus lane and therefore should only be used by buses, taxis or motorcycles (or cyclists if they stay in the cycle lane).

sepi sepi 5:15 pm 12 Nov 09

someone told me this is ok if you have 3 people in the car – isn’t it a transit lane? Or is that little roundabout bit just a bus lane?

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