Self-defence claim in Kingston killing

Ari 15 December 2006 48

Tying in with the speculation found among the comments in this post, the Canberra Times reports that Ian Edward Hirst, 54, will claim self-defence over the killing of David Peter Bagnall, 53, at Fraser Court.

Hirst apparently met the “special or exceptional circumstances” requirement needed to gain bail after a murder charge.

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48 Responses to Self-defence claim in Kingston killing
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Rog Rog 11:49 am 15 Dec 06

I very, very vaguely know of the prisoner. I know he was a spokesman for Public Housing but I think the accused has an interesting past and even a entrepenourial background? Something to do with Kingston foreshore development ironically, but quite a few years ago…anyone heard of him before?

Nero Nero 12:13 pm 15 Dec 06

There is a rumour going around that Jacqui Burke recently offered Hirst a job in her MLA office but was over-ruled by her Party. Great judgement by our voiceless MLA!

vg vg 1:12 pm 15 Dec 06

Its curious than whenever legislation is enacted in this town that involves “special or exceptional circumstances”, that we have so many people with those “special or exceptional circumstances”.

simto simto 2:17 pm 15 Dec 06

Yup, I’d be interested to know what those “special and exceptional circumstances” were. Having a job and dependants is, in and of itself, not usually considered special or exceptional.

victimsfamily victimsfamily 4:19 pm 15 Dec 06

Could be a case of “Who you Know” not “special and exceptional circumstances”

Heavs Heavs 6:44 pm 15 Dec 06

Maybe the fact that the Magistrate said that there was a strong prima facie case that it was self-defence and a murder charge would be unlikely to succeed.

gaelhope gaelhope 6:59 pm 16 Dec 06

Or maybe it’s just that Hirst is the son of an elderly Sydney millionaire with good legal connections. It’s bullshit that Hirst wouldn’t be able to pay a surety. Daddy has lots of dosh…

victimsfamily victimsfamily 9:49 pm 16 Dec 06

Thank you to gaelhope for your comment. I also had heard this. But as with a heap more I know about this case to be fact, I am unable to put more comments. I’d hate to give Hirst reason to say I’d jeopardized his case. I will say that David had NO defence wounds at all and there are a lot more facts that don’t add up.

seepi seepi 10:01 pm 16 Dec 06

if his family is so well off why would he live in divey flats?

victimsfamily victimsfamily 10:05 pm 16 Dec 06

Hirst was living in low imcome housing (Fraser Court). How can he not afford surety but CAN afford a high profile lawyer like Pappas?????

Big Al Big Al 10:18 pm 16 Dec 06

What troubles me is that we need such things as “special and exceptional circumstances” in relation to bail arrangements in a legal system that presumes innocence until proof of guilt has prevailed – could it be that those who seek pre-trial incarceration are infact just another bunch of shit bag arse-maggots unprepared to understand and embrace our legal system, yet more than happy to sprout off about what ever bit of reactionary bullshit they can regurgitate from the likes of the Tele. Get a life people … lets wait and see what comes out in the trial.

gaelhope gaelhope 11:18 pm 16 Dec 06

Hirst’s father is extraordinarily well-off and it’s he who is bank-rolling Pappas.

I don’t read the Tele. I don’t know Hirst. I just know the rest of the family.

Big Al Big Al 11:41 pm 16 Dec 06

So theres a problem with rich fathers looking out for their kids! Get real … briefs like Pappas are the reality check our community needs to reign in the donut munching arse-wipes our over-taxing Government wastes what it calls a police force – and you dont have to read the Tele to be dumb enough to join the demographic that does.

vg vg 8:34 am 17 Dec 06

Quite clearly little Al has had no exposure whatsoever to our legal system. By the way, feel free to call me a “donut munching arse-wipe” to my face next time you see me……oh, thats right, you’ll never meet me so you can be a he-man at the end of your DSL line.

Never eaten a donut at work by the way, clearly your knowledge of policing and the law is gained from American TV shows. Next time you’re at work at 4am on a regular basis give me a tinkle.

Pappas has long been known as all show, no go. Reality check? Give me strength. The reality with Pappas, Murphy and counsel of that ilk is once they start ranting and raving in Court you know they’ve got nothing factual or evidential to come at you with. His strike rate is not as great as people like to think it is.

Its a big, wide world out there beyond your computer Al, take a trip outside and have a look

vg vg 8:36 am 17 Dec 06

No easier target than someone who’s view of the world is perpetuated by sterotypes

Big Al Big Al 9:11 am 17 Dec 06

What’s that smell? Looks like our rancid little mate vg has crawled out from under his cosy little rock to vent his spleen at anyone who doesn’t share his fucked-up totalitarian view of the world. Nice lecture about the legal system and local brief strike rates though – If I had a buck for every cop I’ve met who reckoned he knew something about the legal system I’d be a shit load richer than I already am.

If you’ve got nothing to add except anecdotes about your snack preferences and yet further veiled threats of violence and how big and tough you are and how I’m supposed to be so frightened of Mr Tough Man Cop you may as well fuck off back to your shitty little life.

vg vg 10:52 am 17 Dec 06

Veiled threat of violence? Please point it out.

You are a petty little troll. At least I can discuss with intelligence rather than invective. But then again the way you crumbled last time when asked to put up or shut up really did prove the queslity of man/woman/child you are.

As for nothing to add, well sadly for you I brought something to the argument that was borne out of actual experience, rather than your demonstrated lack of knoweldge of a system I have forgottem more about than you will ever learn.

All you bring is abuse and naivety, as clearly demonstrated in Thumper’s post re his sons stolen car.

Like I said to Jim, its almost cruel to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed man….but sorta fun

vg vg 10:52 am 17 Dec 06


simbo simbo 11:00 am 17 Dec 06

I should point out, if the cops didn’t have a particularly strong prima facie case (or if there was a strong prima facie case for self defence), then surely Mr. Hirst’s lawyers are being professionally negligent by not moving to have the entire instance summarily dismissed, rather than just arranging bail?

It’s perfectly fine for people to have all the expensive lawyers they like, however, where magistrates decide to fold like a card table just because someone being paid more than them is in the room, then that’s a problem..

j j 11:17 am 17 Dec 06

im back
And i must of made a Impression AS all the people on here us my name.
I read some were that if you tell the truth like i have people will get upset.
And insult you for it.
I have sat in court and Listened to DPP AND POLICE LIE.
I have been to court and defended my self against police and won.

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