18 May 2011

Slutwalk comes to Canberra

| johnboy
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With gender studies academics waging war through opinion columns on the global phenomena that is Slutwalk it was just a matter of time and now Facebook informs that Canberra women too will get their chance to dress trashy, and walk:

We are tired of being oppressed by slut-shaming; of being judged by our sexuality and feeling unsafe as a result. Being in charge of our sexual lives should not mean that we are opening ourselves to an expectation of violence, regardless if we participate in sex for pleasure or work. No one should equate enjoying sex with attracting sexual assault.

We are asking you to join us for SlutWalk, to make a unified statement about sexual assault and victims’ rights and to demand respect for all. Whether a fellow slut or simply an ally, you don’t have to wear your sexual proclivities on your sleeve, we just ask that you come. Any gender-identification, any age. Singles, couples, parents, sisters, brothers, children, friends. Come walk or roll or strut or holler or stomp with us.

Join us in our mission to spread the word that those those who experience sexual assault are not the ones at fault, without exception.”
(http://www.slutwalktoronto.com/)

Ladies we salute you.

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creative_canberran12:17 am 07 Jun 11

creative_canberran said :

The people behind this are from ANU and generally the same people behind recent protests over HECS, Same-Sex Marriage and library mergers. No matter how good/valid the cause, all these have descended into nothing more than photo ops for the organisers. And like these other events, they copy an existing idea so not even original thinking. Just self serving and derivative.

I would like to make a correction to this comment on the record.

The first sentence was meant to say “The people behind this are from ANU and generally the same kind of people behind recent protests over HECS, Same-Sex Marriage and library mergers.”

It was meant to suggest that the people behind this are the same kind of people as organisers of various other recent events, that is ready to make a quick shout with a short slogan but nothing more substantive. It was not meant to suggest that the organisers of SlutWalk are the exact same people as the organisers of those previous events. Only that there are parallels in their methodology.

My apologies for any confusion and to the organisers.

Mr Gillespie8:33 am 06 Jun 11

Erg0 said :

#107: Reflecting on the matter, I had come to the conclusion that the point of Slutwalk should be similar to what you’re saying – i.e. “if you consider someone a slut purely because they are the victim of sexual assualt, then we are all sluts”. If that is the message, then I don’t think it’s been communicated very clearly, to the point where many of the people supporting the walk (see above) don’t appear to properly understand what it’s about. That’s the danger of using such a charged word to gather attention for your cause, I suppose.

So that means EVERYONE is a victim of sexual assault. Not just the 1 in 3 that say they are. Every man and every woman is a slut, a victim of sexual assault.

so how did it all go on the big day?

#107: Reflecting on the matter, I had come to the conclusion that the point of Slutwalk should be similar to what you’re saying – i.e. “if you consider someone a slut purely because they are the victim of sexual assualt, then we are all sluts”. If that is the message, then I don’t think it’s been communicated very clearly, to the point where many of the people supporting the walk (see above) don’t appear to properly understand what it’s about. That’s the danger of using such a charged word to gather attention for your cause, I suppose.

markjuliansmith6:41 am 02 Jun 11

One in four women and one in 10 men are raped in their lifetime. Over 98 percent of the perpetrators are men.

Walk down the street and reflect on one in four, one in ten.

SlutWalk – Is Not about Extreme – It is about the Ordinary – Women being perceived as extreme in either dress, movement, spatial context, culture or a combination of all, a Slut –less-Other, by Man to justify Mans atrocious behavior towards Women.

There is a reticence on the part of a significant number of women and men to support the SlutWalk because of a misinformed notion SlutWalk is about promoting the acceptance of extreme behavior – being a Slut.

Nothing could be further from the truth.

SlutWalk is about the Ordinary of the condition woman find themselves in simply because they are women.

Women are not able to traverse societal space in the same way a Man does without fear of being labeled a Slut and the terrible consequences that can and does flow from such a notion.

SlutWalk is not about promoting negative behavior it is about promoting positive behavior by bringing to the attention of Society at large the notion of being ‘a Slut’, is not only completely inequitable, for clearly it does not apply to Man, but as important is being utilized to control and subject women to Mans abuse.

SlutWalk is bringing to the fore Simply being a women whether your dressed from head toe in black keeping to the walls or in the middle of a Public square with thousands of People women can and are regarded by Man to be Sluts-less-Other (not anyone’s daughter cousin, Mother, Aunt etc) and therefore able to be subject to harassment and rape.

Activists: Authorities release Saudi woman detained for driving From Atika Shubert, May 30, 2011 CNN
“Strict segregation by sex means women in Saudi Arabia can’t travel without a male relative or take public transportation. Many women hire expensive drivers or taxis to get around.
Al Sharif said she became frustrated after she had difficulty going home one evening.
“I had to walk on the street for half an hour looking for a cab. I was harassed by every single car because it was late at night and I was walking alone,” she told CNN. “I kept calling my brother to pick me up but his phone wasn’t answering. I was crying in the street. A 32-year-old grown woman, a mother, crying like a kid because I couldn’t find anyone to bring me home.”

The above is not to focus on a particular religion but to show whether a woman is covered from head to toe it does not matter.

Be it cultural, religious based notions supporting such a state of affairs it is a complete inequity of circumstance for Women to be treated in such a manner to keep them in line – and prevent them from traversing societal space independently and in peace.

It has to Change and it Will Change for it is based on an irrational perception based on certain societal foundation text Women are less and further Women must be kept there subject to Mans will.

As Plato advised many years ago Change the Text informing new citizens of evil against Other or Change Nothing.

If SlutWalk prevents even one more rape occurring because a Male has to reflect on the nature of determining a Woman or Man as a Slut to justify such a diabolical act then we have succeeded.

Turn Up Face Up – Change the World.

Jim Jones said :

LeatherJen said :

Enjoy your walk as a slut. Hopefully it changes something.

You’re completely right.

Much better to do nothing, isn’t it?

The Canadian Police officer who first made the comment was not ‘blaming victims’ or ‘justifying rape’. He was suggesting ways of preventing becoming a victim.

The comment was misunderstood by a bunch of female university students, and had a protest. Good on them I suppose; for some, the whole point of university is to look like you are ‘fightin’ the system’, it doesn’t matter on the cause. Sort of like teenagers trying to get the most ‘friends’ on facebook.

I spent a while at university and now I teach there. It will never change, it is just a phase of life.

I do think we need to bring back Comprehension 101 to all university degrees, as a core subject.

Jim Jones said :

LeatherJen said :

Enjoy your walk as a slut. Hopefully it changes something.

You’re completely right.

Much better to do nothing, isn’t it?

So disagreeing with being labeled a slut means I don’t care about sexual assualt?

And this walk is the only event?

You need to get out more.

LeatherJen said :

Enjoy your walk as a slut. Hopefully it changes something.

You’re completely right.

Much better to do nothing, isn’t it?

creative_canberran2:26 pm 29 May 11

Jim Jones said :

Let me get this straight – you’re not going to support the first high-profile anti-sexual-assault campaign that’s taken place in a looong time because of …. god-knows, some quibble or other – and then you complain about the negativity of others?

I’ll be at the event while you’re still whinging about it. Which one of us is negative?

Are you serious? “The first high-profile anti-sexual-assault campaign”?

It’s one day of wearing loud 80s clothing and in the case of the Brisbane march was organised by the Australian Sex Party and Fiona Pattern, who is a known advocate of the porn industry.
You need to get out more, there are dozens of campaigns targeting this, long haul campaigns both on a broad scale and at a grass roots, peer-to-peer level.
Indeed the issue of consent specifically is now also a basic and mandatory part of the curriculum in ACT High Schools.

Slut walk deals only with the apportionment of blame, arguing against the dismissive attitude of some elements of the community that a certain manner of presentation attracts or even justifies assault.

The banners at the Melbourne event ranged from “no more slut shaming” to “my lycra, if it’s good for Madonna, it’s good for me”.

The official motto of the Canberra event is “Stop slut shaming”.
The official purpose put forward is “no victim of sexual assault should ever be blamed for a crime against them.”
The word “consent” does not appear once on the SlutWalk Facebook page.

And let’s look at this little gem from the Facebook page:

“When we consider that the ANU has one of the highest incidences of sexual assault in Australia”

Go out to Alice Springs and regional communities and tell us ANU has one of the highest incidences of sexual assault. Go out there and tell them. They’ll laugh and cry telling you how high the incidences are of sexual assaults and STIs are in pre-teens and early teens. And they don’t even dress like sluts in indigenous communities. Excessive claims don’t help the cause either.

This whole thing is just an excuse for some publicity and a way to feel like you’re part of the solution. What happens in a month? A year? A decade? If sexual violence is so bad at ANU, where is the grass-roots campaign on campus to create a culture where that isn’t tolerated? Listen to people on campus talk, it’s clear the culture is one where women are easy pickings.

One day, one walk, with an ambiguous and ill though message won’t change that.

creative_canberran2:07 pm 29 May 11

Jim Jones said :

Let me get this straight – you’re not going to support the first high-profile anti-sexual-assault campaign that’s taken place in a looong time because of …. god-knows, some quibble or other – and then you complain about the negativity of others?

I’ll be at the event while you’re still whinging about it. Which one of us is negative?

Also, still waiting for an explanation on what the statement by the ANU Women’s Club means.

Specifically:

1. This stereotype: “hit the town in our classiest sassiest lady gear. This means HEELS pretties”
So what, you can’t be classy in flats?
Sounds to me like some stereotyping based on what people where… surely not?

2. “UniLodge girls can be classy as f***.”
Classy as [expletive that also serves as an aggressive word for sex].
So why not just stop at class. Why classy as f**k?

I wonder if some of the opponents of this event will organise an anti-slutwalk? They could all come dressed up in Victorian (the era, not the state) outfits and boo scantily clad women (or men). That would be hilarious! (This is not meant as a statement of any kind! Just thought I’d try to get some humour back into the thread. Though I admit it’s a pretty poor effort!)

Jim Jones said :

LeatherJen said :

Jim Jones said :

LeatherJen said :

Jim Jones said :

LeatherJen said :

It would be nice for something like this to separate the concepts of ‘slut’ and ‘unsafe’. It also isn’t clear whether the ‘slut’ component is about empowering womens’ sexuality, trying to gain social acceptance for behaviours that some consider undesirable or simply shock value to draw attention to the cause.

I haven’t decided whether I will participate or not yet.

Wouldn’t it be even nicer to put these sorts of minor semantic and philosophical quibbles aside and focus on supporting a high-profile event that aims to send a big message that sexual assault is never justified, no matter the circumstances?

Minor to you maybe. As a woman, these things are actually important to me.

That’s great. In that case, you can organise your own – ideologically pure – high-profile event that gets bucketloads of media attention and raises the public profile of issues of sexual assault within the community.

Let me know how that turns out.

It would be a wonderful change to actually see a positive comment from you one day. Tearing people down and working in big words as though this is an ANU Arts class is really rather sad.

Let me get this straight – you’re not going to support the first high-profile anti-sexual-assault campaign that’s taken place in a looong time because of …. god-knows, some quibble or other – and then you complain about the negativity of others?

I’ll be at the event while you’re still whinging about it. Which one of us is negative?

The problem is that I don’t want to be called a slut. I don’t like the term, and don’t think it is appropriate to label women in that way. It’s derogatory and hurtful.

Yes, it is a good cause, but the name is really just shock value. It also won’t change the opinions of men who believe that how we dress invites unwanted attention.

You clearly like the shock value, and also seem to take pleasure in the discomfort of others who while opposing violence don’t wish to be labeled a slut.

Enjoy your walk as a slut. Hopefully it changes something.

As long as there is no man hating feminist rhetoric I’m all for the slutwalk as stated before!!

There has been a bit of man hating feminism going around lately. Some chick on JJJ radio was on her high horse recently regarding the defence scandals – and was openly knocking ‘the myth’ of mateship in male Australian soldiers. I couldn’t believe what I was hearing. Not to mention the move by some lady to ban legal prostitution in the ACT because the prostitutes are ‘helpless victims’ used by men. Give Aussie blokes a fair go I say, stop dividing the sexes male and female are the same species.

LeatherJen said :

Jim Jones said :

LeatherJen said :

Jim Jones said :

LeatherJen said :

It would be nice for something like this to separate the concepts of ‘slut’ and ‘unsafe’. It also isn’t clear whether the ‘slut’ component is about empowering womens’ sexuality, trying to gain social acceptance for behaviours that some consider undesirable or simply shock value to draw attention to the cause.

I haven’t decided whether I will participate or not yet.

Wouldn’t it be even nicer to put these sorts of minor semantic and philosophical quibbles aside and focus on supporting a high-profile event that aims to send a big message that sexual assault is never justified, no matter the circumstances?

Minor to you maybe. As a woman, these things are actually important to me.

That’s great. In that case, you can organise your own – ideologically pure – high-profile event that gets bucketloads of media attention and raises the public profile of issues of sexual assault within the community.

Let me know how that turns out.

It would be a wonderful change to actually see a positive comment from you one day. Tearing people down and working in big words as though this is an ANU Arts class is really rather sad.

Let me get this straight – you’re not going to support the first high-profile anti-sexual-assault campaign that’s taken place in a looong time because of …. god-knows, some quibble or other – and then you complain about the negativity of others?

I’ll be at the event while you’re still whinging about it. Which one of us is negative?

Could somebody please explain to me, what is the purpose of wearing shirts or tops which expose large expanses of chest flesh, including breasts and cleavage?

I don’t see blokes doing it (not where I work, although I’m aware of the hairy chest/gold bling look some tradies affect), but some women turn up at meetings wearing clothes which have clearly been deliberately designed to put her breasts on show.
As far as I am concerned, the woman wearing clothes that expose her breasts (quite apart from being horribly unprofessional) has chosen to make a spectacle of herself and *is* most certainly asking for her breasts to be ogled.
I think they only get upset if the wrong person ogles them.

On the other hand, a psychologist of my acquaintance reckons women don’t wear sexualised apparel for the purpose of attracting men – they do it specifically to demoralise other women.

The_Bulldog said :

@Watson – Who (here) is blaming the victim? Show me where people have stated this is normal, let alone even marginally acceptable? I get the impression that you think this is an issue buried within a broader trend of sexism, when I fail to see how those issues are at all relevant…

Don’t get me wrong – it’s kinda like a zombie invasion when dead things rise up to attack the innocent, and zombies are cool. Just a shame that this man-hating vitriol, while clearly dead, actually seems to gain traction amongst elements of the community who are clearly smart enough to know better.

Perhaps I’ve missed the bit whereby men (other than the odd numpty) have sated that sexual assault is something women bring on themselves. Perhaps, if this bit can’t be found, we need to pleasantly agree on most aspects of you discussions, but disagree that this is a broad problem with it’s roots embedded in men seeking the upper-hand in the still raging battle of the sexes.

To hand out leaflets on how to avoid rape with the advice “don’t dress like a slut” is basically blaming the victim before the crime has even happened. And that is all that the organisers of the rallies are saying.

If I came across as relating this to a broader sexism problem, that is probably because to me this is reminiscent of the good ole days when women were regarded as the guardians of virtue and the punishment for non-compliance was to be cast out of the tribe (ie. lose your right to protection). I stress reminiscent, because we have indeed come a long way since then. But maybe that’s why I – having grown up in a post-feminist society – am so shocked when I find examples of remnants of this attitude still being supported by SOME men. And when they are men in positions of power or the ones women are supposed to turn to when their rights have been violated, it can become somewhat problematic.

I expect to see as many men at the rally as women. Calling someone a sexist for trying to point out inequalities (whether they are about actions of attitudes) is a nice try to kill the debate.

@Watson – Who (here) is blaming the victim? Show me where people have stated this is normal, let alone even marginally acceptable? I get the impression that you think this is an issue buried within a broader trend of sexism, when I fail to see how those issues are at all relevant…

Don’t get me wrong – it’s kinda like a zombie invasion when dead things rise up to attack the innocent, and zombies are cool. Just a shame that this man-hating vitriol, while clearly dead, actually seems to gain traction amongst elements of the community who are clearly smart enough to know better.

Perhaps I’ve missed the bit whereby men (other than the odd numpty) have sated that sexual assault is something women bring on themselves. Perhaps, if this bit can’t be found, we need to pleasantly agree on most aspects of you discussions, but disagree that this is a broad problem with it’s roots embedded in men seeking the upper-hand in the still raging battle of the sexes.

I-filed said :

johnboy said :

C’mon CC, where’s your sense of fun?

It isn’t a fun occasion though … it’s about a very serious topic. Somehow I think it’s too difficult to put across the message in this “format”!

+1 If the protest becomes the issue then you run the risk of losing you message.

creative_canberran10:54 pm 28 May 11

From some of the organisers of Canberra’s slut-walk comes a new group to show us Canberra boys something, described as:

“As a response to the Gentlemans Club of UniLodge, we now have the Ladies Club! Once a month we ladies are going to hit the town in our classiest sassiest lady gear. This means HEELS pretties. Let’s show all the Canberra boys that UniLodge girls can be classy as f***.

Welcome to the Ladies Club.”

If you thought making sense of “reclaiming” the word slut was difficult, try working out what being “classy as f*** means”?

Source: http://www.facebook.com/home.php?sk=group_213395615349327

Minimising risk is one thing. Blaming victims for the crime another.

I’ll stay on my soap box for as long as the latter is accepted as normal.

Though debate is useless of course. Both sides are thinking that if you don’t get it now, you’ll never get it.

Jim Jones said :

LeatherJen said :

Jim Jones said :

LeatherJen said :

It would be nice for something like this to separate the concepts of ‘slut’ and ‘unsafe’. It also isn’t clear whether the ‘slut’ component is about empowering womens’ sexuality, trying to gain social acceptance for behaviours that some consider undesirable or simply shock value to draw attention to the cause.

I haven’t decided whether I will participate or not yet.

Wouldn’t it be even nicer to put these sorts of minor semantic and philosophical quibbles aside and focus on supporting a high-profile event that aims to send a big message that sexual assault is never justified, no matter the circumstances?

Minor to you maybe. As a woman, these things are actually important to me.

That’s great. In that case, you can organise your own – ideologically pure – high-profile event that gets bucketloads of media attention and raises the public profile of issues of sexual assault within the community.

Let me know how that turns out.

It would be a wonderful change to actually see a positive comment from you one day. Tearing people down and working in big words as though this is an ANU Arts class is really rather sad.

johnboy said :

C’mon CC, where’s your sense of fun?

It isn’t a fun occasion though … it’s about a very serious topic. Somehow I think it’s too difficult to put across the message in this “format”!

I agree wholeheartedly with all the sentiments behind “Slutwalk”. People should be free to wear whatever they like in public, without having to fear for their safety.

I’m sick of people judging me and threatening me with violence because I choose to wear my Waffen SS uniform in public.

By the way, Slutwalk has already been done to death – there’s one at Summernats every January.

creative_canberran5:13 pm 28 May 11

Watson said :

I very much doubt that the word slut was ever used for men? I believe the word for men who have multiple sexual partners was and still is “stud”.

I thought “stud” more reffered to male who is “doable” while “player” referred to male who actually scored multiple goals on the field.

Besides, why not, “whore” has been. Still is actually.
By all means address your correction to Oxford.

@Watson – I really think you’re missing the point. I don’t believe anyone has stated that the answer is prescriptive “guidelines” regarding how short, how late, how dark or how slutty.

By your own admission, awareness and application of judgement is key to minimising the risk of assault – why try and tart the issue up and make it about women being told what to do, regressive views, footy players or Islamic law? I’m yet to see any statements that support any of this clap-trap – but don’t let that stop your ascent to the giddy heights of the soap-box.

Pommy bastard said :

The word ‘slut” will not be “reclaimed”, as it was never claimed in the first place. What will happen is the word “slut” will be sequestered for use by a group (trendy hipster lefty feminist girls and their “I wonder if I’m really gay” boyfriends, (but only with girlfriends permission of course.)) Just like the biggest sin in English is for anyone not black or ghetto to use the “N” word.

“Hey girl you’ve got your sluts shoes on tonight, let’s go play at being slutty at the Uni bar, then get really offended and report anyone who treats us like sluts. Party on, slut power! Boyfriend, stay at home and rearrange my wardrobe…”

This is worth quoting just to look at how much hatred there is here.

With the exception of Andrew Bolt, is there *anyone* that you don’t detest?

LeatherJen said :

Jim Jones said :

LeatherJen said :

It would be nice for something like this to separate the concepts of ‘slut’ and ‘unsafe’. It also isn’t clear whether the ‘slut’ component is about empowering womens’ sexuality, trying to gain social acceptance for behaviours that some consider undesirable or simply shock value to draw attention to the cause.

I haven’t decided whether I will participate or not yet.

Wouldn’t it be even nicer to put these sorts of minor semantic and philosophical quibbles aside and focus on supporting a high-profile event that aims to send a big message that sexual assault is never justified, no matter the circumstances?

Minor to you maybe. As a woman, these things are actually important to me.

That’s great. In that case, you can organise your own – ideologically pure – high-profile event that gets bucketloads of media attention and raises the public profile of issues of sexual assault within the community.

Let me know how that turns out.

Would women assume that he was “looking for it” and proceed to rape or molest him? Probably not. Let’s ask Tony Abbott 😀

Exactly what this is campaign is about!!!

Look, I do understand where everyone is coming from with “common sense” approach to clothing and taking risks. I have struggled with this when I hear stories in the media like the girl who was raped by the footy team, etc.

But if we are going to introduce officious rules regarding clothing (and also where and when a woman can walk alone for example) and blame women for attracting predators if they don’t follow them, we really are going backwards. Back to the 50s, or Sharia law as someone here made a reference to.

I watched this “Recipe for murder” doco on ABC the other night. which was about Thallium poisoing cases in the 50s and I had to explain to my daughter why the all male jury didn’t have any sympathy for one of the accused who had been savagely beaten by her husband because there were rumours about her having ‘loose morals’. This really is a similar thing. To say that women bring it onto themselves because they should be aware of the risks.

And how long can your skirt be before you are just asking for it? How dark does it have to be before you are just considered plain stupid for walking alone on the street? And how explicitly sexual does your behaviour have to have been before you are considered a slut and therefor send the message that you’re “up for it”. I need to know the rules so I can tell my daughter so she can grow up to be a good, sensible girl who doesn’t attract unwanted attention.

creative_canberran said :

Slut would fall into the former category, a word inherently and inescapably negative. It has traditionally always referred to a woman OR man that is promiscuous or slovenly. The etymology is disputed but widely regarded to stem from middle english meaning unclean water.

I very much doubt that the word slut was ever used for men? I believe the word for men who have multiple sexual partners was and still is “stud”.

Jim Jones said :

LeatherJen said :

It would be nice for something like this to separate the concepts of ‘slut’ and ‘unsafe’. It also isn’t clear whether the ‘slut’ component is about empowering womens’ sexuality, trying to gain social acceptance for behaviours that some consider undesirable or simply shock value to draw attention to the cause.

I haven’t decided whether I will participate or not yet.

Wouldn’t it be even nicer to put these sorts of minor semantic and philosophical quibbles aside and focus on supporting a high-profile event that aims to send a big message that sexual assault is never justified, no matter the circumstances?

Minor to you maybe. As a woman, these things are actually important to me.

Pommy bastard6:00 pm 27 May 11

Two thoughts:

Aren’t the biggest users of the derogatory term “slut” women? (normally used against any other woman who is having more and better sex than them.)

And

Isn’t this rally going to attract exactly the sort of person its aimed against? (“Sluts? wha-haay, you go girls the lads, I love sluts me, tits oot fer the lads”!)

I think it’s fine to argue against wearing revealing clothing as being a cause of sexual assault, especially when it’s quite prevalent in the home by a family member or relative.

However, I think it’s naive to ask people NOT to judge you for what you wear. For example, if a teacher rocked up to class dressed like Lady Gaga, I imagine there will be much outrage expressed by parents of the students at the school. Similarly, if you wore your PJs to a job interview, it’s unlikely to make a good impression on the interview panel.

ie, dress appropriately for the occasion/location/.

Pommy bastard4:45 pm 27 May 11

The word ‘slut” will not be “reclaimed”, as it was never claimed in the first place. What will happen is the word “slut” will be sequestered for use by a group (trendy hipster lefty feminist girls and their “I wonder if I’m really gay” boyfriends, (but only with girlfriends permission of course.)) Just like the biggest sin in English is for anyone not black or ghetto to use the “N” word.

“Hey girl you’ve got your sluts shoes on tonight, let’s go play at being slutty at the Uni bar, then get really offended and report anyone who treats us like sluts. Party on, slut power! Boyfriend, stay at home and rearrange my wardrobe…”

LeatherJen said :

It would be nice for something like this to separate the concepts of ‘slut’ and ‘unsafe’. It also isn’t clear whether the ‘slut’ component is about empowering womens’ sexuality, trying to gain social acceptance for behaviours that some consider undesirable or simply shock value to draw attention to the cause.

I haven’t decided whether I will participate or not yet.

Wouldn’t it be even nicer to put these sorts of minor semantic and philosophical quibbles aside and focus on supporting a high-profile event that aims to send a big message that sexual assault is never justified, no matter the circumstances?

creative_canberran4:15 pm 27 May 11

Jim Jones said :

Gantz said :

Yeah just one problem with that – the march is to reclaim the word ‘slut’ in which context will you then begin to use it in?

It is a derogatory word/term, with no other meaning, created to use as weapon.

So can we expect to hear the girls/women in the coming months at bars/clubs/movies, hell even cafes?

‘Hey girl!’

‘Oh, hey my fave slut, how’ve you been?’

Plenty of previously derogatory words have been reclaimed: queer, bastard (now widely-used as a term of affection by many Australians), bugger, n#gger (by hip-hop culture), freak, and so on.

There’s nothing essential or inherit about words – meaning is dependent upon social usage. So why not reclaim slut?

Even if it doesn’t become incorporated into common parlance, its use as a strategy has been insanely successful: damn near everyone is talking about it, and the issue has become front and centre.

Good on ’em I reckon. I’ll support this whole-heartedly.

Contrary to popular belief, not all publicity is good or constructive.

And as for the meaning of words, some do have inescapable origins.

You mentioned bastard, from old french meaning “son of a mule driver”. It’s origins are clearly to refer to someone of lower caste or inferior breeding and to date, I’ve not seen any usage that has escaped this and turned it into a positive word, nor has any segment of the community wished to appropriate it. It is inherently negative.

On the other hand, you mentioned queer which is from german meaning oblique, which simply means to diverge from being straight. This word too hasn’t escaped its origins. It’s origin is not inherently negative, though hence it has acquired a multitude of meanings from architecture and military planning to more recent derogatory usage dependant on social context.

Slut would fall into the former category, a word inherently and inescapably negative. It has traditionally always referred to a woman OR man that is promiscuous or slovenly. The etymology is disputed but widely regarded to stem from middle english meaning unclean water.

creative_canberran4:14 pm 27 May 11

Jim Jones said :

There’s nothing essential or inherit about words – meaning is dependent upon social usage. So why not reclaim slut?

Even if it doesn’t become incorporated into common parlance, its use as a strategy has been insanely successful: damn near everyone is talking about it, and the issue has become front and centre.

Good on ’em I reckon. I’ll support this whole-heartedly.

Contrary to popular belief, not all publicity is good or constructive.

And as for the meaning of words, some do have inescapable origins.

You mentioned bastard, from old french meaning “son of a mule driver”. It’s origins are clearly to refer to someone of lower caste or inferior breeding and to date, I’ve not seen any usage that has escaped this and turned it into a positive word, nor has any segment of the community wished to approbate it. It is inherently negative.

On the other hand, you mentioned queer which is from german meaning oblique, which simply means to diverge from being straight. This word too hasn’t escaped its origins. It’s origin is not inherently negative, though hence it has acquired a multitude of meanings from architecture and military planning to more recent derogatory usage dependant on social context.

Slut would fall into the former category, a word inherently and inescapably negative. It has traditionally always referred to a woman OR man that is promiscuous or slovenly. The etymology is disputed but widely regarded to stem from middle english meaning unclean water.

Jim Jones said :

Stevian said :

Jim Jones said :

Gantz said :

Yeah just one problem with that – the march is to reclaim the word ‘slut’ in which context will you then begin to use it in?

It is a derogatory word/term, with no other meaning, created to use as weapon.

So can we expect to hear the girls/women in the coming months at bars/clubs/movies, hell even cafes?

‘Hey girl!’

‘Oh, hey my fave slut, how’ve you been?’

Plenty of previously derogatory words have been reclaimed: queer, bastard (now widely-used as a term of affection by many Australians), bugger, n#gger (by hip-hop culture), freak, and so on.

There’s nothing essential or inherit about words – meaning is dependent upon social usage. So why not reclaim slut?

Even if it doesn’t become incorporated into common parlance, its use as a strategy has been insanely successful: damn near everyone is talking about it, and the issue has become front and centre.

Good on ’em I reckon. I’ll support this whole-heartedly.

How can you ‘reclaim’ a word that has never deen anything other than derogatory, that’s just ‘claiming’.

Whatever dude. What does that matter?

It would be nice for something like this to separate the concepts of ‘slut’ and ‘unsafe’. It also isn’t clear whether the ‘slut’ component is about empowering womens’ sexuality, trying to gain social acceptance for behaviours that some consider undesirable or simply shock value to draw attention to the cause.

I haven’t decided whether I will participate or not yet.

Stevian said :

Jim Jones said :

Gantz said :

Yeah just one problem with that – the march is to reclaim the word ‘slut’ in which context will you then begin to use it in?

It is a derogatory word/term, with no other meaning, created to use as weapon.

So can we expect to hear the girls/women in the coming months at bars/clubs/movies, hell even cafes?

‘Hey girl!’

‘Oh, hey my fave slut, how’ve you been?’

Plenty of previously derogatory words have been reclaimed: queer, bastard (now widely-used as a term of affection by many Australians), bugger, n#gger (by hip-hop culture), freak, and so on.

There’s nothing essential or inherit about words – meaning is dependent upon social usage. So why not reclaim slut?

Even if it doesn’t become incorporated into common parlance, its use as a strategy has been insanely successful: damn near everyone is talking about it, and the issue has become front and centre.

Good on ’em I reckon. I’ll support this whole-heartedly.

How can you ‘reclaim’ a word that has never deen anything other than derogatory, that’s just ‘claiming’.

Whatever dude. What does that matter?

I for one welcome our new slut overlords

colourful sydney racing identity3:39 pm 27 May 11

mouthface said :

Awesome.. maybe this will catch on and we could have other events just like this. I suggest “D***head walk” where all the d***heads can march to show that just because you are a d***head, people should not laugh at you.

I guess you will be leading the procession then?

Jim Jones said :

Gantz said :

Yeah just one problem with that – the march is to reclaim the word ‘slut’ in which context will you then begin to use it in?

It is a derogatory word/term, with no other meaning, created to use as weapon.

So can we expect to hear the girls/women in the coming months at bars/clubs/movies, hell even cafes?

‘Hey girl!’

‘Oh, hey my fave slut, how’ve you been?’

Plenty of previously derogatory words have been reclaimed: queer, bastard (now widely-used as a term of affection by many Australians), bugger, n#gger (by hip-hop culture), freak, and so on.

There’s nothing essential or inherit about words – meaning is dependent upon social usage. So why not reclaim slut?

Even if it doesn’t become incorporated into common parlance, its use as a strategy has been insanely successful: damn near everyone is talking about it, and the issue has become front and centre.

Good on ’em I reckon. I’ll support this whole-heartedly.

How can you ‘reclaim’ a word that has never deen anything other than derogatory, that’s just ‘claiming’.

Awesome.. maybe this will catch on and we could have other events just like this. I suggest “D***head walk” where all the d***heads can march to show that just because you are a d***head, people should not laugh at you.

Gantz said :

Yeah just one problem with that – the march is to reclaim the word ‘slut’ in which context will you then begin to use it in?

It is a derogatory word/term, with no other meaning, created to use as weapon.

So can we expect to hear the girls/women in the coming months at bars/clubs/movies, hell even cafes?

‘Hey girl!’

‘Oh, hey my fave slut, how’ve you been?’

Plenty of previously derogatory words have been reclaimed: queer, bastard (now widely-used as a term of affection by many Australians), bugger, n#gger (by hip-hop culture), freak, and so on.

There’s nothing essential or inherit about words – meaning is dependent upon social usage. So why not reclaim slut?

Even if it doesn’t become incorporated into common parlance, its use as a strategy has been insanely successful: damn near everyone is talking about it, and the issue has become front and centre.

Good on ’em I reckon. I’ll support this whole-heartedly.

Watson said :

I wasn’t sure if I would make the effort to go until I read this thread. All the comments about ‘appropriate clothing’ etc. proof that an action like this is needed because sexism is still rampant, even in our liberal Canberra apparently.

I had no idea that the concept of “appropriate clothing” was so sexist and offensive.

Here’s a question for you: if I (a man) went out to a posh dinner tonight clad only in a pair of speedos, would that be considered “appropriate” by your definition? It sure wouldn’t by mine.

Gantz said :

Yeah just one problem with that – the march is to reclaim the word ‘slut’ in which context will you then begin to use it in?

It is a derogatory word/term, with no other meaning, created to use as weapon.

So can we expect to hear the girls/women in the coming months at bars/clubs/movies, hell even cafes?

‘Hey girl!’

‘Oh, hey my fave slut, how’ve you been?’

A friend of mine has a dictionary of archiac words which gives the word the meaning ‘an apron’. If you think about it makes a sort of sense on why it came to it present day meaning. The ones most likely to be wearing aporns were chambermaids and their ilk. Often seen to have loose morals (though it was more likely their masters morals that were loose). The association of the clothing with the behaviour would of led to them being referred to as ‘sluts’.

Another meaning is given as ‘a dog’. Seems some things don’t change.

Why has this turned into an excuse for some predicatble man-bashing? Did I miss the statements where the blokes are all pigs yearning for a return to the fifties? Not once have I read a post advocating sexual violence – yet we’ve managed to create a storm in a tea-cup with the whole he said/she said bit.

IMHO – a woman SHOULD be able to wear what the hell she pleases. Just as I SHOULD be able to leave my front door unlocked at night. However, if someone walks into my unlocked house and takes my stuff, I certainly haven’t invited this to occur and it’s certainly not my fault, but I haven’t necessarily excerised good judgement when I am well aware of the risks associated with the rotten minority who walk into houses and steal stuff. So – hands up who isn’t aware that sexual assaults, as horrible as they are, continue to occur in our community? I can’t say we’re uneducated about the risks of sexual assault.

I believe the point the Canadian copper was trying to make was about recognising risks, and applying a little bit of thought into how one might mitigate these risks. His choice of words, however, was exceedingly poor, and some women would deservedly feel angered by them.

So – march if you will, and dress as you damn well please. If nothing else this is a good opporunity to raise awareness of the reality of sexual assault, rather than taking a stand for a “wish-list” ideal.

Yeah just one problem with that – the march is to reclaim the word ‘slut’ in which context will you then begin to use it in?

It is a derogatory word/term, with no other meaning, created to use as weapon.

So can we expect to hear the girls/women in the coming months at bars/clubs/movies, hell even cafes?

‘Hey girl!’

‘Oh, hey my fave slut, how’ve you been?’

I missed this post, but got here via a Google after I got the invite on Facebook.

I wasn’t sure if I would make the effort to go until I read this thread. All the comments about ‘appropriate clothing’ etc. proof that an action like this is needed because sexism is still rampant, even in our liberal Canberra apparently. So I’ll be there, with bells on. Or a mini skirt and net stockings, and cleavage down to my panani, whichever takes my fancy. And I will be taking my 6yo daughter.

And if my daughter ever ends up in hospital with a cracked skull and torn off limbs because she didn’t look before she stepped onto the zebra crossing and didn’t see the car that sped up and swerved with the intention to hit her, I REALLY am NOT going to tell her that it was her fault she got hit because she didn’t look! And THAT is the correct analogy!

*Walks off shaking her head and muttering profanities about male chauvinist pigs hunkering for a return to the 50s, etc, etc.*

P Taker said :

chewy14 said :

CRSI,
you can probably expect both women and men to react, judge and possibly comment to people in different forms of dress.
Read this article on Crikey:
http://www.crikey.com.au/2011/05/18/the-brocial-network-proves-just-why-we-need-sl-twalk/

Anyone who thinks that they should be able to do whatever they like in public is kidding themselves.
The world is not a perfect place, not everyone is going to be respectful of you and some are outright pricks.
No amount of slutwalking is going to change it.

+1

Man, I’m getting far too old for this stuff!!! But I have to agree with the above. Any form of sexual assault is wrong – but it is a shitty world sometimes with shitty people in it.

chewy14 said :

CRSI,
you can probably expect both women and men to react, judge and possibly comment to people in different forms of dress.
Read this article on Crikey:
http://www.crikey.com.au/2011/05/18/the-brocial-network-proves-just-why-we-need-sl-twalk/

Anyone who thinks that they should be able to do whatever they like in public is kidding themselves.
The world is not a perfect place, not everyone is going to be respectful of you and some are outright pricks.
No amount of slutwalking is going to change it.

+1

creative_canberran11:15 am 20 May 11

NiroZ said :

creative_canberran said :

colourful sydney racing identity said :

chewy14 said :

Creative Canberran has it right.
The whole “sexual assault” theme is just part of it.
Like who is actually going to say they are FOR sexual assaults?

Basically they want to wear whatever they want and act however they want without anyone looking at them, commenting on or judging them.

I think they actually want to be able to choose what they wear without being raped. Not asking a lot.

Clothing has never been shown to be a factor in rape of any consequence. Also worth noting about 10-15% of sexual assaults have male victims.

My only point was the message of the protest is wrong and many feminists are speaking out against it even. One should aspire to be better than others. Instead, this walk sends the message that “if you’re going to call as something bad, let’s see how low we can go”. Wrong attitude and it sets up a slippery slope.

This is a really odd comment seeing that if you read through the comments in this thread, you realise the need for it.

Even if this is just a photo op, it’s already brought about discussion, and undoubtedly will bring more, which is the point.

What are you trying to say? Messy quotations aside you’re still not making sense.
I agree with the right for women to be safe from assault regardless of any factor. Where the heck do I say I agree with the need for a slutwalk? I specifically say it’s the wrong approach. It doesn’t build respect, it instead embraces disrespect and tries to make up for the lack of respect by creating some false ownership of the disrespect.
It’s like the rappers who now claim to “own” the word nigger. Sure, they regained it and even make money form it. But on the streets of DC or Chicago, nigger is still a racial slur and black people are dying from gang crime… some folk owning the word hasn’t solved the problems.

I know some people self describe using the word slut as an acronym. Sexually Liberated Uninhibited Temptress. Wotevs. I have questions; can a male be a slut ? (yes according to the Macquarie) Is a slut a slut because of the way she dresses, or her behaviour, or both ? The definition in the Mac refers to “a woman who has many sexual partners”. It does not mention clothing. By that measure there could be lots more sluts around than you might think. Who am I to judge if a woman likes to wear clothes of her choice ? Personally I prefer speedos to boardies, so am I a slut ?

I’m not a slut, I’m a people person

creative_canberran said :

colourful sydney racing identity said :

chewy14 said :

Creative Canberran has it right.
The whole “sexual assault” theme is just part of it.
Like who is actually going to say they are FOR sexual assaults?

Basically they want to wear whatever they want and act however they want without anyone looking at them, commenting on or judging them.

I think they actually want to be able to choose what they wear without being raped. Not asking a lot.

Clothing has never been shown to be a factor in rape of any consequence. Also worth noting about 10-15% of sexual assaults have male victims.

My only point was the message of the protest is wrong and many feminists are speaking out against it even. One should aspire to be better than others. Instead, this walk sends the message that “if you’re going to call as something bad, let’s see how low we can go”. Wrong attitude and it sets up a slippery slope.

This is a really odd comment seeing that if you read through the comments in this thread, you realise the need for it.

Even if this is just a photo op, it’s already brought about discussion, and undoubtedly will bring more, which is the point.

I think for most men “making a move” means politely asking if you’d like to meet up for a drink sometime and getting a phone number.

That’s sexual assault these days?

creative_canberran said :

The intent of the original in Vancouver and the ones held in Sydney and Melbourne were to “reclaim” the word slut.

The problem is that the word has always been and always will be a derogatory term. Calling a woman a slut is to insult them, to put them down. It was never originally a term of endearment.

It’s like persons of skin of a very dark hue marching to reclaim the word “nigger”, or persons whose sexual preference is of the same sex marching to reclaim the word “poofter”.

LeatherJen said :

willo said :

LeatherJen said :

anonymoose said :

I-filed said :

Potentially confusing. One of my (very nice) colleagues dresses slutty and isn’t aware of it! I’m talkin’ lacy cleavage and five inch stillets, micro mini skirts and lace stockings … and loads of makeup.

Maybe she’s just got a thing for you and you should make a move?

Isn’t that exactly what this movement is against?

i doubt it…what does “making a move” have to do with sexual assault?

‘Making a move’ simply because of how someone dresses? Isn’t the point of this movement to NOT make a judgement because of how a women chooses to dress? Besides, your respectful ‘making a move’ may well be my sexual assault.

you are an idiot

CRSI,
you can probably expect both women and men to react, judge and possibly comment to people in different forms of dress.
Read this article on Crikey:
http://www.crikey.com.au/2011/05/18/the-brocial-network-proves-just-why-we-need-sl-twalk/

Anyone who thinks that they should be able to do whatever they like in public is kidding themselves.
The world is not a perfect place, not everyone is going to be respectful of you and some are outright pricks.
No amount of slutwalking is going to change it.

colourful sydney racing identity2:45 pm 19 May 11

chewy14 said :

CSRI,
have you read some of the comments from people attending these walks (even on this thread)?

Sure, a part of it is about sexual assault but there is a lot of other stuff thrown in.

Everyone has the right to wear whatever they want, but to think that our actions and behaviours won’t affect the way people react around us is ridiculous in the extreme.

And specifically what reaction do you think people should expect if they are wearing say, a short skirt?

creative_canberran2:45 pm 19 May 11

colourful sydney racing identity said :

chewy14 said :

Creative Canberran has it right.
The whole “sexual assault” theme is just part of it.
Like who is actually going to say they are FOR sexual assaults?

Basically they want to wear whatever they want and act however they want without anyone looking at them, commenting on or judging them.

I think they actually want to be able to choose what they wear without being raped. Not asking a lot.

Clothing has never been shown to be a factor in rape of any consequence. Also worth noting about 10-15% of sexual assaults have male victims.

My only point was the message of the protest is wrong and many feminists are speaking out against it even. One should aspire to be better than others. Instead, this walk sends the message that “if you’re going to call as something bad, let’s see how low we can go”. Wrong attitude and it sets up a slippery slope.

Mysteryman said :

…and it has just dawned on me that you may have been referring to the other post in your quote, not mine. Oops!

Better late than never. 😛

CSRI,
have you read some of the comments from people attending these walks (even on this thread)?

Sure, a part of it is about sexual assault but there is a lot of other stuff thrown in.

Everyone has the right to wear whatever they want, but to think that our actions and behaviours won’t affect the way people react around us is ridiculous in the extreme.

…and it has just dawned on me that you may have been referring to the other post in your quote, not mine. Oops!

Erg0 said :

bazinga said :

Mysteryman said :

I don’t think sexual assault is acceptable. Ever. But if you’re going to dress slutty in public, you can expect that there will be some people who will comment on it.

I’m a believer in the concept of “appropriate attire” – dressing for the circumstance/occasion. I know that’s not a popular idea any more, especially as the lines between personal freedoms appropriate behaviour seem to blur more and more.

aaand this is the point. All to often when women are sexually assaulted people comment on the clothing they were wearing and say she was asking for it. The message here is that no matter how slutty women dress, they are not asking to be assaulted.

It doesn’t seem to me that the post you’ve quoted was suggesting any such thing, and I think you’ve demonstrated the potential issue with this event. The organisers’ intent doesn’t appear to be to defend the right right to dress in a “slutty” way per se, but a lot of people are going to conflate an objection to inappropriately short skirts with an approval of sexual assualt, which isn’t helpful to the discussion.

Um…. Post number 16…

“The point of the whole thing is that sexual assault happens no matter what you’re wearing, and the disingenuous insistence by law enforcement that a short skirt “causes” rape needs to be exposed as the pernicious bullcrap that it is.”

I was referring to that comment specifically, which quite clearly states that the poster believes that there is a “disingenuous insistence by law enforcement that a short skirt “causes” rape”. I think that claim is ridiculous and unfounded. That’s what I was getting at.

colourful sydney racing identity1:43 pm 19 May 11

chewy14 said :

Creative Canberran has it right.
The whole “sexual assault” theme is just part of it.
Like who is actually going to say they are FOR sexual assaults?

Basically they want to wear whatever they want and act however they want without anyone looking at them, commenting on or judging them.

I think they actually want to be able to choose what they wear without being raped. Not asking a lot.

Creative Canberran has it right.
The whole “sexual assault” theme is just part of it.
Like who is actually going to say they are FOR sexual assaults?

Basically they want to wear whatever they want and act however they want without anyone looking at them, commenting on or judging them.

creative_canberran1:04 pm 19 May 11

Erg0 said :

bazinga said :

Mysteryman said :

I don’t think sexual assault is acceptable. Ever. But if you’re going to dress slutty in public, you can expect that there will be some people who will comment on it.

I’m a believer in the concept of “appropriate attire” – dressing for the circumstance/occasion. I know that’s not a popular idea any more, especially as the lines between personal freedoms appropriate behaviour seem to blur more and more.

aaand this is the point. All to often when women are sexually assaulted people comment on the clothing they were wearing and say she was asking for it. The message here is that no matter how slutty women dress, they are not asking to be assaulted.

It doesn’t seem to me that the post you’ve quoted was suggesting any such thing, and I think you’ve demonstrated the potential issue with this event. The organisers’ intent doesn’t appear to be to defend the right right to dress in a “slutty” way per se, but a lot of people are going to conflate an objection to inappropriately short skirts with an approval of sexual assualt, which isn’t helpful to the discussion.

The organiser’s intent in Canberra is nothing whatsoever, except that “it’s fun” and “why isn’t Canberra having one”.* That and the photo op it gives them.
The intent of the original in Vancouver and the ones held in Sydney and Melbourne were to “reclaim” the word slut.
Quite frankly I’ve always thought the motto “revenge is to live well” was a better way to act, that is rise above the sluttiness and have a bit of class. But instead, it’s more of a “bogan pride” mentality, that is if you call us sluts then we’ll be the biggest sluts possible and make it our own. It’s stupidity.

*quotes from Facebook

Having only read the title, I imagined something along the lines of the multicultural festival themed around sluts. Oh well, one can dream……

random said :

Erg0 said :

a lot of people are going to conflate an objection to inappropriately short skirts with an approval of sexual assualt, which isn’t helpful to the discussion.

No, they are going to ask, why is a short skirt “inappropriate”? Because “she looks like a slut”? Because “she’s just asking for it”? Think about those answers. Applied to a rape victim, the meaning is pretty clear: “she brought this on herself”.

QED.

TAD said :

The best analogy I’ve read about “appropriate attire”, sexual assault and some onus being on women to reduce the risk thereof is to compare it to crossing a zebra crossing.

Sure, it’s always the driver’s fault if a pedestrian gets struck whilst crossing, but common sense and self preservation suggests that it’s good advice to turn your head for traffic first.

Please, I want to know what a woman should do to “turn [her] head for traffic”. Are you saying that wearing an ankle-length skirt qualifies as proper traffic safety? If it’s at knee height, is that like a glance from the corner of the eye for oncoming traffic (a bit risky, but still safe-ish), and higher than that, well, the bitch is asking for it, running out into traffic like that?

It’s not a good analogy.

Erg0 said :

a lot of people are going to conflate an objection to inappropriately short skirts with an approval of sexual assualt, which isn’t helpful to the discussion.

No, they are going to ask, why is a short skirt “inappropriate”? Because “she looks like a slut”? Because “she’s just asking for it”? Think about those answers. Applied to a rape victim, the meaning is pretty clear: “she brought this on herself”.

That is what this event is about. Labels like “inappropriate attire” and “slut” perpetuate a culture in which rape is trivialized or ignored because victims are seen as complicit. They are excuses used to blame women for being raped, and that is not OK.

You don’t have to approve of sexual assault to help perpetuate a culture in which it is trivialized, under-reported and under-prosecuted.

willo said :

LeatherJen said :

anonymoose said :

I-filed said :

Potentially confusing. One of my (very nice) colleagues dresses slutty and isn’t aware of it! I’m talkin’ lacy cleavage and five inch stillets, micro mini skirts and lace stockings … and loads of makeup.

Maybe she’s just got a thing for you and you should make a move?

Isn’t that exactly what this movement is against?

i doubt it…what does “making a move” have to do with sexual assault?

‘Making a move’ simply because of how someone dresses? Isn’t the point of this movement to NOT make a judgement because of how a women chooses to dress? Besides, your respectful ‘making a move’ may well be my sexual assault.

I did say zebra crossing, but yes there are extra points available if the pedestrian is dressed slutty

TAD said :

The best analogy I’ve read about “appropriate attire”, sexual assault and some onus being on women to reduce the risk thereof is to compare it to crossing a zebra crossing.

Sure, it’s always the driver’s fault if a pedestrian gets struck whilst crossing, but common sense and self preservation suggests that it’s good advice to turn your head for traffic first.

Maybe you should obey the road rules rather than trying to mow pedestrians down. Do you get extra points if they are using a crossing?

colourful sydney racing identity10:41 am 19 May 11

Mysteryman said :

BlondieACT said :

Mysteryman said :

What? Are they promoting slutiness, or are they raising awareness for sexual assault victims? Or are they just looking for an excuse to parade around in slutty attire?

Seems like a bit of a non-event.

They’re saying that regardless of what women wear, it’s not an invitation for lewd comments, sexual assault or anything related.

I don’t think sexual assault is acceptable. Ever. But if you’re going to dress slutty in public, you can expect that there will be some people who will comment on it.

I’m a believer in the concept of “appropriate attire” – dressing for the circumstance/occasion. I know that’s not a popular idea any more, especially as the lines between personal freedoms appropriate behaviour seem to blur more and more.

Ah yes, ‘appropriate attire’, I have heard that somewhere before, what was it again?

‘If you take out uncovered meat and place it outside on the street, or in the garden or in the park, or in the backyard without a cover, and the cats come and eat it … whose fault is it, the cats’ or the uncovered meat? The uncovered meat is the problem.’

bazinga said :

Mysteryman said :

I don’t think sexual assault is acceptable. Ever. But if you’re going to dress slutty in public, you can expect that there will be some people who will comment on it.

I’m a believer in the concept of “appropriate attire” – dressing for the circumstance/occasion. I know that’s not a popular idea any more, especially as the lines between personal freedoms appropriate behaviour seem to blur more and more.

aaand this is the point. All to often when women are sexually assaulted people comment on the clothing they were wearing and say she was asking for it. The message here is that no matter how slutty women dress, they are not asking to be assaulted.

It doesn’t seem to me that the post you’ve quoted was suggesting any such thing, and I think you’ve demonstrated the potential issue with this event. The organisers’ intent doesn’t appear to be to defend the right right to dress in a “slutty” way per se, but a lot of people are going to conflate an objection to inappropriately short skirts with an approval of sexual assualt, which isn’t helpful to the discussion.

LeatherJen said :

anonymoose said :

I-filed said :

Potentially confusing. One of my (very nice) colleagues dresses slutty and isn’t aware of it! I’m talkin’ lacy cleavage and five inch stillets, micro mini skirts and lace stockings … and loads of makeup.

Maybe she’s just got a thing for you and you should make a move?

Isn’t that exactly what this movement is against?

i doubt it…what does “making a move” have to do with sexual assault?

Make a move in a respectful way?

anonymoose said :

I-filed said :

Potentially confusing. One of my (very nice) colleagues dresses slutty and isn’t aware of it! I’m talkin’ lacy cleavage and five inch stillets, micro mini skirts and lace stockings … and loads of makeup.

Maybe she’s just got a thing for you and you should make a move?

Isn’t that exactly what this movement is against?

The best analogy I’ve read about “appropriate attire”, sexual assault and some onus being on women to reduce the risk thereof is to compare it to crossing a zebra crossing.

Sure, it’s always the driver’s fault if a pedestrian gets struck whilst crossing, but common sense and self preservation suggests that it’s good advice to turn your head for traffic first.

I-filed said :

Potentially confusing. One of my (very nice) colleagues dresses slutty and isn’t aware of it! I’m talkin’ lacy cleavage and five inch stillets, micro mini skirts and lace stockings … and loads of makeup.

Maybe she’s just got a thing for you and you should make a move?

I-filed said :

Potentially confusing. One of my (very nice) colleagues dresses slutty and isn’t aware of it! I’m talkin’ lacy cleavage and five inch stillets, micro mini skirts and lace stockings … and loads of makeup.

Hey…is that me? I always thought the cleavage and heels was a good look in the office. Maybe I’m gonna have to change my image…shave my beard, or something.

Potentially confusing. One of my (very nice) colleagues dresses slutty and isn’t aware of it! I’m talkin’ lacy cleavage and five inch stillets, micro mini skirts and lace stockings … and loads of makeup.

johnboy said :

RTFM

I did. There was no mention of “law enforcement” claiming that “short skirts cause rape”. There was mention of one member of a law enforcement agency on the other side of the planet making a statement that was questionable, but certainly nothing like in the post I was referring to.

Seems like a movement looking for a cause.

Mysteryman said :

I don’t think sexual assault is acceptable. Ever. But if you’re going to dress slutty in public, you can expect that there will be some people who will comment on it.

I’m a believer in the concept of “appropriate attire” – dressing for the circumstance/occasion. I know that’s not a popular idea any more, especially as the lines between personal freedoms appropriate behaviour seem to blur more and more.

aaand this is the point. All to often when women are sexually assaulted people comment on the clothing they were wearing and say she was asking for it. The message here is that no matter how slutty women dress, they are not asking to be assaulted.

Overheard said :

johnboy said :

RTFM

Oops! I just skimmed/didn’t read the fine print: “Whether a fellow slut or simply an ally, you don’t have to wear your sexual proclivities on your sleeve, we just ask that you come.”

Oh I will be ‘coming’ allright. I will be there with bells on, wearing my “I love sluts” teeshirt. Can’t wait!

Where do I get one of those?

Ronnielane said :

Sluts,Is/was used as an acroynom for Sexually Liberated Urban Terrosist Sisters

Whoa, accidently hit submit. If I recall correctly this goes back to Courtney Love, who at one time was highly regarded for both her music and opinions ( before a certain individual drugf…ed her) .The Sluts used to (prob still do) wear short dresses with tight slacks underneath, the point was to be sexual but at the same time be in control of your sexuality.

Sluts,Is/was used as an acroynom for Sexually Liberated Urban Terrosist Sisters

johnboy said :

RTFM

Oops! I just skimmed/didn’t read the fine print: “Whether a fellow slut or simply an ally, you don’t have to wear your sexual proclivities on your sleeve, we just ask that you come.”

i have no problem with ladies behaving/dressing in a slutty manner…..in fact i think there should be more of it……………

trix said :

You don’t actually have to dress like a “slut” to join in on the walk.

The point of the whole thing is that sexual assault happens no matter what you’re wearing, and the disingenuous insistence by law enforcement that a short skirt “causes” rape needs to be exposed as the pernicious bullcrap that it is.

Perhaps I’m not in the loop, but when did law enforcement insist that clothing choice can cause rape?

You don’t actually have to dress like a “slut” to join in on the walk.

The point of the whole thing is that sexual assault happens no matter what you’re wearing, and the disingenuous insistence by law enforcement that a short skirt “causes” rape needs to be exposed as the pernicious bullcrap that it is.

And as for the “derivative” complaint, oh, please. How many political events are innovative? The reason that people are jumping on the bandwagon everywhere is because it is a universal issue.

Pommy bastard4:45 pm 18 May 11

Is the right to dress like a slut incorporated into ACT human rights legislation?

BlondieACT said :

Mysteryman said :

What? Are they promoting slutiness, or are they raising awareness for sexual assault victims? Or are they just looking for an excuse to parade around in slutty attire?

Seems like a bit of a non-event.

They’re saying that regardless of what women wear, it’s not an invitation for lewd comments, sexual assault or anything related.

I don’t think sexual assault is acceptable. Ever. But if you’re going to dress slutty in public, you can expect that there will be some people who will comment on it.

I’m a believer in the concept of “appropriate attire” – dressing for the circumstance/occasion. I know that’s not a popular idea any more, especially as the lines between personal freedoms appropriate behaviour seem to blur more and more.

Very worthy and noble intentions. I just fear that the message will be lost in the medium (or short, or scant or plunging) for the pervert factor. I wish it well, and hope it doesn’t resemble a building site when the walkers walk by.

Chop71 said :

As a parent, would I be proud of my daughter walking in this event …… probably not.

Please tell me she studies at ANU.

The only problem is the organisers of this event are the exact opposite of actual sluts.

Surely they should be fined for false advertising.

As a parent, would I be proud of my daughter walking in this event …… probably not.

Looks a fun way to make a serious point. I read an article about this in the paper last week … the Toronto police officer responsible had no idea what he had started!

Mysteryman said :

Or are they just looking for an excuse to parade around in slutty attire?

Isn’t that just a Saturday night in Civic? Hardly a special event

Mysteryman said :

What? Are they promoting slutiness, or are they raising awareness for sexual assault victims? Or are they just looking for an excuse to parade around in slutty attire?

Seems like a bit of a non-event.

They’re saying that regardless of what women wear, it’s not an invitation for lewd comments, sexual assault or anything related.

Looks like fun along with a statement! Just a shame that it probably won’t make a difference to the opinions of sexual offenders and that short skirts aren’t an invitation for inappropriate actions.

What? Are they promoting slutiness, or are they raising awareness for sexual assault victims? Or are they just looking for an excuse to parade around in slutty attire?

Seems like a bit of a non-event.

Pommy bastard2:14 pm 18 May 11

I’ll say nothing then, shall I? Probably for the best….

C’mon CC, where’s your sense of fun?

creative_canberran1:54 pm 18 May 11

The people behind this are from ANU and generally the same people behind recent protests over HECS, Same-Sex Marriage and library mergers. No matter how good/valid the cause, all these have descended into nothing more than photo ops for the organisers. And like these other events, they copy an existing idea so not even original thinking. Just self serving and derivative.

Is there an afterparty? I’m lookin’ to pick up.

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