Stanhope bags out Greens

Thumper 6 March 2008 38

Chief Minister Jon Stanhope has, rightly in my opinion, criticised the ACT greens for their proposal to devote this year’s entire budget surplus to retrofitting every house and building in Canberra with solar hot water heaters and insulation.

Mr Stanhope said that (this) “was yet further proof of the gross naivety of the Greens, and their leader, MLA Dr Deb Foskey.”

Mr Stanhope’s statement has suggested that the Greens have proposed putting the entire $200 million surplus into a capital fund for the retrofit project.

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38 Responses to Stanhope bags out Greens
S4anta S4anta 1:59 pm 12 Mar 08

Thumper, i will personally cyrogenically freeze you, so in 50 years if you are wrong we can hunt Kevin Costner and his gills, using drift gill nets and a pair of really magnifying glasses that was once part of the hubble telescope. All the listening to the song where have all the cowboys gone?

Thumper Thumper 1:15 pm 12 Mar 08

I’ll say that I’m glad I put in solar water and planted lots of trees and worked in environmental agencies, etc etc etc…

Actually, i’ll probably be dead.

funny thing is, I recall in the 70s people talking about pacific islands being swamped by rising sea levels. Over 30 years on and it still hasn’t happened.

dalryk dalryk 12:37 pm 12 Mar 08

Thumper, if in 50 years you can say ‘I told you so’, I’ll be happy to say ‘eh, not such a big deal after all’. What are you going to say in 50 years if you’re wrong though?

VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy 12:23 pm 12 Mar 08

…it’s all about peddling bullshit to the public, whatever your game.

Ingeegoodbee Ingeegoodbee 12:18 pm 12 Mar 08

I recall that the term “climate change” came about in the early 90s as a result of CIA run focus groups – the Whitehouse at the time was looking for a way to describe the phenomena in a way that would play down the impact in the mind of the public – it seemed that little old ladies in Florida retirement homes quite liked the idea of the climate changing.

Thumper Thumper 11:59 am 12 Mar 08

True Santa, but at the rate new buildings are going up,and old ones flattened, there will be no need for retro fitting!

dalryk, at least you don’t automatically resort to name calling when someone disagrees 😉

And in hindsight, if in 50 years there is no change in the climate whatsoever, I will say ‘told you so’, and you will say, ‘ah, but it takes a long time’.

Not much point arguing about it really 😉

VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy 11:48 am 12 Mar 08

I think we should ban all carbonated drinks, because, after all, CO2 is released into the atmosphere when we drink them!

S4anta S4anta 11:47 am 12 Mar 08

The one small problem with this, is that many buildings in the ACT problably will need substantial work to ensure that they can be retrofitted, adding to the financial burden that many businesses and individuals will need to bear in this climate of random interst rate hikes, and a lack of contractor supply, not only will the surplus be hammered, but the back pockets of you average punter. Far better that a scheme is in place, as a choice rather than Govt ran semi-compulsary loan system.
Great idea, lacking the input of certain fincially and economically minded individuals.

Thumper Thumper 11:35 am 12 Mar 08

I should have added that maybe I am right, then again, I could be wrong.

But that goes for the climate change apologists as well. Just maybe, like me, you could be wrong as well?

Thumper Thumper 11:34 am 12 Mar 08

What an incredibly silly thing to say.

In other words, the scientists you choose to believe are right, and the one’s that I choose to believe, are wrong?

Leaving that aside, I could take your complete post and change it all to suit me. The words would be exactly the same.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m thinking solar water for my house and I’ve been pretty much an environmentalist before the word was invented.

I just don’tbelieve that climate change is manmade. And the term ‘climate change’ has been appropriated by the green movement to mean anything that now happens climatically is the direct result of human intervention.

Which it plainly isn’t.

See, for one, you can’t stand there and tell me 100% for a fact that you know it is all man made, can you? No, because it can’t be proven so.

‘Climate Change’ is now nothing but a buzzword.

dalryk dalryk 11:21 am 12 Mar 08

Thumper, you may be right. Maybe this global warming hooey is all garbage.

But then again, maybe you’re wrong. Can you actually stand there and tell me that you know 100% for a fact that you completely understand all the factors that influence our climate, and can categorically rule out CO2 levels as being in any way involved?

It seems to me that you can’t. Certainly if make the argument that these climate ‘scientists’ don’t know what they’re talking about, then you can hardly claim to have all the answers either.

There is no doubt that the Earth’s climate has changed in the past, but that does not mean that what we do has no impact. There’s good theoretical reasons why CO2 would affect the climate, and there is evidence that is at least passably persuasive that it is indeed doing so. Whether you accept that evidence as conclusive is up to you. However, it seems to me that to deny the possibility outright is recklessness on a grand scale.

And it’s not like trying to avert *possible* catastophe is the only issue at play here. Coal-fired power is detrimental to the environment for a whole host of reasons. And increasing efficiency and reducing wastage similarly bring their own benefits. Our need for energy is only going to increase in the future, and we need to be more conscious of harvesting that energy in a sustainable manner.

Maybe climate advocates are misguided, but don’t dismiss an otherwise benficial idea just because it addresses their concerns.

VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy 11:09 am 12 Mar 08

Mael – I realise it’s not that complicated, but it really comes down to financial viability. There’s no point paying a few thousand bucks to install additional infrastructure when the current system would be lucky to cost a few hundred bucks a year to run. The Infinity system I currently have costs three fifths of bugger all, because we don’t use much hot water at our house, and it just makes hot water to demand. Our washing machine uses cold water and runs only a few times a week, same for the dishwasher.

Ralph Ralph 10:40 am 12 Mar 08

Read the Manhattan Declaration which Thumper pointed to a story about.

Don’t forget they used to grow crops on greenland as well.

Thumper Thumper 10:37 am 12 Mar 08


it can change rapidly as well.

Look at the Norman landings in 1066. The coast line at that time was a lot further out than it was today, ans the industrial revolution hadn’t even been thought of at that stage.

Ingeegoodbee Ingeegoodbee 10:26 am 12 Mar 08

While it is true that the worlds climate changes over long periods of time, as Thumper has suggested, there is now significant, measurable and testable evidence to suggest that human activity is causing a far more rapid change in the worlds climate – one that will see dramatic shifts over centuries rather than millennia. The tin-foil hat brigade will of course trot out all manner of nonsense to try and convince people other wise, simply because they’re not smart enough to grasp the science.

That said, the Greens policy to blow the surplus is plain stupidity.

Thumper Thumper 10:16 am 12 Mar 08

I’m seriously thinking solar in my new place.

Seems like a good idea although I still need to check a few things.

Mælinar Mælinar 9:58 am 12 Mar 08

yeah, that’s gonna happen – actually its not too complex. Instead of plugging into a tap, your hot water system needs to be plugged into a solar hot water unit, the fittings are avaliable from any hardware shop.

VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy 9:53 am 12 Mar 08

I’d install solar hot water heating if it could be done reasonably cheaply, and I could route the warmed water through my existing Infinity hot water system. It might be interesting to have a go at doing it myself one day (yeah, that’s gonna happen).

Thumper Thumper 9:25 am 12 Mar 08

I’m all for solar as well. Afterall, it has to be a good thing to not pour heaps of crap into the skies and oceans, whether or not it adds to the mystical global warming/ climate change.

Speaking of ice ages, the last one finished roughly 10K BP.

neanderthalsis neanderthalsis 9:08 am 12 Mar 08

Who cares if retro-fitting ACT houses with Solar hot water systems and insulation will save the planet? It will save me money on my power bill, so I’m all for it.

Mind you, I’m sure that if we put solar generators everywhere, mother nature will kick us all in the bollocks by plunging us into an ice age.

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