TOOT TOOT! Labor promises light rail and names it "Capital Metro"

Ding ding, election polling must tell them they need a BIG promise to change the game. Turn clock forward and if they are returned watch the excuses for doing nought appear. Especially if Greens lose influence. TWU and CFMEU will never let it happen anyway. Ding ding.

JC said :

Masquara said :

Look out for the totally dishonest “artists impression footage” in the TV ad. It shows ONE track of light rail occupying all the space available between the trees up the Northbourne Avenue median strip. As if you could operate light rail with a single track. This light rail means Northbourne will LOSE at least one, probably both of its rows of trees. Thumbs down from me.

You believe an artists impression? Hmmm. As for Northborne for the most part the gap between the trees is plenty wide for dual track.

You are saying that the Northbourne Avenue median strip can accommodate two rail lines? Absolute nonsense. Go and measure it.

brad82 said :

Can’t wait for it. Quick, quiet and efficient public transport. If they are anything like Melbourne’s trams this will be brilliant.

It’ll give certainty to the private sector to build around the system (unlike bus routes which can be axed at a whim), it’ll give the construction industry a boost, and it’ll make Canberra feel like a capital city.

They did leave all those middle “nature” strips expressly for the purpose of a tram system when they built the city.

Can’t wait for it. Quick, quiet and efficient public transport. If they are anything like Melbourne’s trams this will be brilliant.

It’ll give certainty to the private sector to build around the system (unlike bus routes which can be axed at a whim), it’ll give the construction industry a boost, and it’ll make Canberra feel like a capital city.

Good point joingler – I hope Tharwa, Oaks and Hall are on the radar for the light rail proposal.

Masquara said :

Look out for the totally dishonest “artists impression footage” in the TV ad. It shows ONE track of light rail occupying all the space available between the trees up the Northbourne Avenue median strip. As if you could operate light rail with a single track. This light rail means Northbourne will LOSE at least one, probably both of its rows of trees. Thumbs down from me.

You believe an artists impression? Hmmm. As for Northborne for the most part the gap between the trees is plenty wide for dual track.

steveu said :

Simple. Lets vote them out. I too am growing weary of all the money being thrown to the northside to buy votes whilst they ignore the southside. And no, a 30 year plan to sell off the tuggeranong lakeside area isnt gonna cut it.

Did you ever stop to think the reason the Northside is getting the lions share of infrastructure projects is because that is where the new suburbs are? Just like 20-30 years ago Tuggeranong was where the new suburbs where and they were getting the infrastructure projects and soon you will see more in Molonglo? Nothing to do with vote buying, just investing in infrastructure where it is needed.

If you want vote buying a pool fo Laynon is a perfect example. Already two indoor public pools in Tuggeranong. If a new pool is needed southside then I would have thought Weston Creek would have been the better place, serving an existing and growth area with a lack of indoor pools in the northern part of the southside. (read Woden/Weston Creek and South Canberra)

Options for investigation……..are already being considered.

So they are considering their investigation options. LOL Meaning of course that they can talk about the future (in hope of getting our votes) but make no commitment at all to doing anything.
They think we forget about how they paid that Canadian consultant $1M to come up with a great plan for ACTION and then chopped his plan to shit as soon as he got on a plane for home. What confidence can we have that they will go ahead with this project, and what confidence can we have that they will expand the project in any meaningful way, sadly based on their past performance, very bloody little.

Chop71 said :

arescarti42 said :

Kiron2222 said :

Not a fan of Southside being left out though, Canberra’s light rail should link our population centres and provide a better and faster service than the 300 Bus route, not just service Northside.

I wouldn’t say the south side is being left out.

If there is no rail to south side, then I would say they are being left out.

+1

the southside also has crappy roads, and they need serious work.

the problem I have with the project and the electoral cycle in general is that all these promises are made and have a political spin put on them. then we vote, and after that, the real cost comes out, and we have no recourse to boot the pollies out because they are being irresponsible with our money.

regardless of any spin, this labour govt has proven it cannot properly manage any infrastructure project and I can’t see light rail being any different.

as an aside, I would be interested to see if all parties have a consolidated list of their policies and their expected cost and what it would mean for me as a taxpayer…………………….no I didn’t think so.

Masquara said :

Look out for the totally dishonest “artists impression footage” in the TV ad. It shows ONE track of light rail occupying all the space available between the trees up the Northbourne Avenue median strip. As if you could operate light rail with a single track. This light rail means Northbourne will LOSE at least one, probably both of its rows of trees. Thumbs down from me.

Fully agree. Great environmental impact to some very distinctive trees, which I’m sure will please the Green party. Also, if this track runs down the middle of Northbourne, how do the passengers get from the median to their respective accommodation/work areas? I’m guessing the pedestrian crossings will be pretty busy, further congesting this main traffic corridor. How will the commute be any faster than a bus, when the train will still have to stop at the same intersections as the rest of the traffic? Surely it can’t get a privilege override on the red lights, as this will only increase congestion on the east and westbound roads crossing Northbourne as well as turning vehicles, such as is the case with cars turning right into Barry Dr at peak hour in the mornings presently.
I say we spend 1% of that costing in doing a sensible and logical assessment of the plan, considering the cascading effects it will have on other roads and cyclists/pedestrian traffic, before committing any money to what will undoubtedly be a massive white elephant.
Furthermore, why do we need to reduce traffic congestion from Gungahlin to City? I thought creating more jobs in Gungahlin and expanding government services to major hubs such as this would help reduce the need for people to travel into the city for work. It’s not like everyone goes to Civic to go shopping.

stillflying said :

kakosi said :

stillflying said :

kakosi said :

I’d prefer a hospital system that doesn’t have a 50/50 chance of killing or disabling you when you go in for simple procedures or even the flu.

You are exaggerating. Which most Australians seem incapable of understanding is that our healthcare system is actually pretty bloody good, as are our hospitals. The staff there work under many pressures and do so amazingly.

Also, if you are going into the hospital when you have the flu, you are part of the problem. Hospitals are for emergencies and the really sick. If you’re sick go to your GP, drink lots of fluids and stay in bed, don’t bog the hospital up.

Influenza is an emergency but it’s obvious you haven’t been injured by the “system” or you’d see it differently.

Clearly you claim to have been injured by the “system” so you’re now blowing the figures out of proportion. Yes shit still happens in hospital but to claim its a one in two chance is absolutely bogus and you’re talking out your ass. Link facts or stop making outrageous accusations.

Not outrageous – and it was a figure of speech brought on by frustration. But if you had spent as much time at hospitals as I have in the past few years and seen the things I’ve seen, you might not feel so confident about the state of things.

As for hurling abuse at me, I have no idea what motivates you to do that. Perhaps you’re just nasty?

schmeah said :

kakosi said :

I’d prefer a hospital system that doesn’t have a 50/50 chance of killing or disabling you when you go in for simple procedures or even the flu.

I must be one of the lucky ones then. Given I’ve had 2 stays at hospital in a 7 month period for more than 1 night, including going under the knife once and a stay in emergency, I really should thank my lucky stars that such terrible odds didn’t befall me .. or maybe you’re just talking through your a-hole.

In the past few years one person we know was made a quadriplegic after a lung biopsy (they somehow punctured the spinal column), I’ve personally watched as a surgeon sewed up a leg cut down to the bone from an accident in the emergency ward as no operating theatre was available. I’ve spent many hours in emergency waiting for doctors to treat a relative with heart disease (with disastrous results). Another friend was recently given the wrong medication and had to go on life support, she’s been in and out of hospital for months. A friend lost her parent last year after contracting a VRE infection at one of the hospitals during surgery. I continually hear staff say they don’t have enough beds for incoming patients. And talking to patients in the shared rooms I have yet to hear a positive story about their treatment. Even staff tell you they are very busy and apologise regularly for not getting round to doing their job quickly for every patient.

And I’m not the only one who’s noticed. The problems have been reported many times: http://www.canberratimes.com.au/act-news/hospital-death-probe-20111025-1wo1s.html

So maybe you were lucky!

kakosi said :

stillflying said :

kakosi said :

I’d prefer a hospital system that doesn’t have a 50/50 chance of killing or disabling you when you go in for simple procedures or even the flu.

You are exaggerating. Which most Australians seem incapable of understanding is that our healthcare system is actually pretty bloody good, as are our hospitals. The staff there work under many pressures and do so amazingly.

Also, if you are going into the hospital when you have the flu, you are part of the problem. Hospitals are for emergencies and the really sick. If you’re sick go to your GP, drink lots of fluids and stay in bed, don’t bog the hospital up.

Influenza is an emergency but it’s obvious you haven’t been injured by the “system” or you’d see it differently.

Clearly you claim to have been injured by the “system” so you’re now blowing the figures out of proportion. Yes shit still happens in hospital but to claim its a one in two chance is absolutely bogus and you’re talking out your ass. Link facts or stop making outrageous accusations.

Look out for the totally dishonest “artists impression footage” in the TV ad. It shows ONE track of light rail occupying all the space available between the trees up the Northbourne Avenue median strip. As if you could operate light rail with a single track. This light rail means Northbourne will LOSE at least one, probably both of its rows of trees. Thumbs down from me.

If this goes ahead, I really hope that the Government takes some lessons from Sydney’s private sector partnerships, and doesn’t repeat history.

Schemes like the Cross Sydney Tunnel, where roads that would allow commuters to bypass the toll road were – to be blunt, screwed – as part of the effort to drive people to pay the toll. Efforts which failed, with the private sector company becoming insolvent due to low patronage.

So we’re going to possibly end up in a situation where a private operator needs to charge at a realistic level to make any money out of it, alongside a government subsidised bus services. So what does the government do? Will they have to subsidise the private company, in the same way as ACTION? Will they use light rail as an excuse to reduce services along the rail corridors, thus forcing people onto the more expensive option? How does a private – public partnership work when the private portion is competing against the public portion?

A guaranteed vote loser to anyone with even half a brain cell who can see Labor’s inability to delivery anything on service or on budget.

All the sweeteners and pipedreams in the world aren’t going to change my mind about a party that, in December 2010, embarked on the most in-your-face, sneakily insignificant yet annoying of all government policies in the history of self-government: one that forces people to pay for shopping bags at checkouts (a fine detail that doesn’t appear in the legislation in question, there is no law requiring shopkeepers to charge for bags, but they have to charge anyway).

Sorry Labor, you’ve done your dash as far as I’m concerned. Your campaigning is simply a waste of time. You have lowered yourselves to one rung above the Greens, who I wouldn’t even vote for if they were the only ones left on the ballot paper.

Cheap said :

Is light rail really all that faster than bus? It’s still travelling down roads and having to stop at traffic lights, no?

Quite adverse to thinking and reading are we?

>Reduce traffic congestion (1st para) = faster commute for all.

>And most rail systems have independant traffic systems so they operate on their own network not using infrastructure used by cars, buses etc. So no, it wouldn’t travel down the same roads and stop at the same lights. In fact it could be designed without any stops between woden and civic or civic and belconnen. So its speed would be limited by cost to build/operate and safety.

miz said :

Truthiness said “Queanbeyan and Gungahlin have similar population sizes, one of them has a pool, all sorts of services and infrastructure and is most importantly in another state. Gungahlin needs its issues fixed before we roll rail out to Queanbeyan.”

I wouldn’t hold your breath Gunners-ites – Tuggers is 30 years old and still waiting for many services inner suburbs take for granted – including decent bus routes/frequencies. My bro in law, an ACTION driver, states that South Tuggers (Lanyon) is the most under-served by buses in all Canberra. I am therefore amazed that the light rail proposal hardly mentions Tuggers except as an afterthought.

Your bro in law obviously hasn’t heard of Tharwa, Oaks Estate or Hall.

stillflying said :

kakosi said :

I’d prefer a hospital system that doesn’t have a 50/50 chance of killing or disabling you when you go in for simple procedures or even the flu.

You are exaggerating. Which most Australians seem incapable of understanding is that our healthcare system is actually pretty bloody good, as are our hospitals. The staff there work under many pressures and do so amazingly.

Also, if you are going into the hospital when you have the flu, you are part of the problem. Hospitals are for emergencies and the really sick. If you’re sick go to your GP, drink lots of fluids and stay in bed, don’t bog the hospital up.

Influenza is an emergency but it’s obvious you haven’t been injured by the “system” or you’d see it differently.

$3 million to raise a fence over the lake, but a complete rail network for ten times that????
Does not compute…does not compute….
I can see figures tripling before the first clod of dirt is dug.

So, the Labor promises again to build light rail? Why dont you fix the bus system first. What is going to happen to Action buses? Will the bus drivers be out of a job? What about the bus mechanics? What about the money that was spent on Action? – the new ticketing system etc.

You really should think about fixing our health and education system before wasting money on “a promise’ which wil be broken AGAIN!.

No wonder our rates are being trippled – how else are we going to pay for this? No wonder we are so much in the red!

Get real Katy.I won’t be voting for you!

arescarti42 said :

I’ll believe it when I see it.

The release actually only refers to “investigating options” for light rail. That means they will back out as soon as they feel like it, having “identified issues” …

Truthiness said :

Queenbyan and Gungahlin have similar population sizes, one of them has a pool, all sorts of services and infrastructure and is most importantly in another state.

Gungahlin needs its issues fixed before we roll rail out to Queenbyan .

Queenbean already has rail and a railway station and would you believe it was completed in 1887. Get with the times.

They’ve locked in my vote now. Ding Ding!

Truthiness said “Queanbeyan and Gungahlin have similar population sizes, one of them has a pool, all sorts of services and infrastructure and is most importantly in another state. Gungahlin needs its issues fixed before we roll rail out to Queanbeyan.”

I wouldn’t hold your breath Gunners-ites – Tuggers is 30 years old and still waiting for many services inner suburbs take for granted – including decent bus routes/frequencies. My bro in law, an ACTION driver, states that South Tuggers (Lanyon) is the most under-served by buses in all Canberra. I am therefore amazed that the light rail proposal hardly mentions Tuggers except as an afterthought.

arescarti42 said :

Kiron2222 said :

Not a fan of Southside being left out though, Canberra’s light rail should link our population centres and provide a better and faster service than the 300 Bus route, not just service Northside.

I wouldn’t say the south side is being left out.

If there is no rail to south side, then I would say they are being left out.
Is it in the Tuggies 30 year plan? Belco residents you’ll be long dead so you may as well go for your green bins while they are on offer.

Kiron2222 said :

Not a fan of Southside being left out though, Canberra’s light rail should link our population centres and provide a better and faster service than the 300 Bus route, not just service Northside.

I wouldn’t say the south side is being left out. It doesn’t really make sense to build everything at once due to the phenomenal cost and the fact that we’d be waiting years before the first passenger were to ride on it. The south side would get rail, just later on in the process.

If you’re going to do it in stages, Gungahlin to the city is a pretty obvious choice. It’s the fastest growing district in the city, the roads there are pretty shite, there’s dedicated land available for almost the entire route (Flemington road and Northbourne median strips), the road lanes along the route are already pretty congested, and there are no bus lanes from Gungahlin to the city, like there are with other town Centres.

There’s also high density housing and offices directly next to most of the route and major shopping and industrial sites (Dickson and Mitchell) along the route, which would supply passengers.

rosscoact said :

Wasn’t Chic Henry the bloke who sucked off the public teat for a decade of summernats? Speaking of not very good at business basics.

Oh I don’t know, sounds like nice work if you can get it.

Yep, the same Chic, who kept threatening to take his oil, flee and headlight fest elsewhere if the government didn’t keep the dollars pouring in.

Meanwhile Chic drives (and often shows off) his Chrysler C300, which to my mind speaks of someone with very little taste, sense and foresight.

Wasn’t Chic Henry the bloke who sucked off the public teat for a decade of summernats? Speaking of not very good at business basics.

Monorail is still waaaaaaaaaaaaayyy cooler.

Imagine, monorail from Gunners down Northbourne. Do a lap around civic and then fang it over the lake into the triangle. A quick run down to Kingston then back over King’s Avenue, up past the AWM where it hangs a left down the middle of Limestone before joining back up with Northbourne.

If there is anything cooler then you are a better man, or woman, than me 🙂

Monorail can also have it’s tracks changed and can go over roads, this is why Monorail is used alot in dense population areas in Asia over Light Rail.

Light Rail for Canberra is a good thing, we have huge areas of open space and light rail corridors down the centre of roads that the Light Rail can use to bypass roads. It will be better to get it built now rather than wait till it is desperately needed and rail corridors are shut off and land prices become much, much more expensive.
Light Rail can also free up ACTION to service the suburbs more so we can actually get a decent amount of buses through the suburbs, instead of that hour wait for a bus that may or may not show up 50% of the time.

Not a fan of Southside being left out though, Canberra’s light rail should link our population centres and provide a better and faster service than the 300 Bus route, not just service Northside.

At first I was skeptical about the Libs’ story that Labor would triple rates. Now I think it’s a gross underestimate.

Queenbyan and Gungahlin have similar population sizes, one of them has a pool, all sorts of services and infrastructure and is most importantly in another state.

Gungahlin needs its issues fixed before we roll rail out to Queenbyan .

kakosi said :

I’d prefer a hospital system that doesn’t have a 50/50 chance of killing or disabling you when you go in for simple procedures or even the flu.

I must be one of the lucky ones then. Given I’ve had 2 stays at hospital in a 7 month period for more than 1 night, including going under the knife once and a stay in emergency, I really should thank my lucky stars that such terrible odds didn’t befall me .. or maybe you’re just talking through your a-hole.

jase! said :

can’t really see this happening but if it does then run it past the airport, hell do a deal with nsw and get our friends across the border on board too

Any plan for light rail which didn’t include Queanbeyan would be incredibly retarded. Which I imagine means any plan put out probably doesn’t.

joingler said :

steveu said :

Reprobate said :

Sigh. One full page of breathless announcements about light rail for Gungahlin and buses in Belco, but Tuggeranong? Woden to Erindale and Tuggeranong inprovements may be “an option for the second and subsequent stages”.

Nice.

Simple. Lets vote them out. I too am growing weary of all the money being thrown to the northside to buy votes whilst they ignore the southside. And no, a 30 year plan to sell off the tuggeranong lakeside area isnt gonna cut it.

I reckon this would be partly due to the electoral boundaries. What I’d like to see is each town centre get it’s own seat with 2-3 seats for each centre depending on population. I find it ridiculous that the seat of Molonglo covers Bonner as well as Sterling. These two suburbs have nothing to do with each other and I find it hard to believe one candidate can represent the needs of Gungahlin, Inner South and Weston Creek. Currently the MLAs for Molonglo represent the needs of the large amount of voters (Gungahlin/Inner North) but ignore everyone else. I say this even though I live in Watson and work in Gungahlin.

On the actual topic though, Labor have done NOTHING about light rail for 11 years. They only mention it at election time. So because of this, they have now lost my vote. If they could actually be honest and say ‘we don’t support light rail’ then they MAY have still got it. But I refuse to vote for a party that will lie to the electorate to try and gain a few votes. Get lost Labor.

I’d love some light rail.

Can anyone provide a succinct history on their history of promises and study in this area?

And another Labor screw up:

From: http://www.katygallagher.net/?p=2285

“ACT Labor is already delivering improvements to public transport, including the extension of Red Rapid services to the Kippax Group centre to service West Belconnen”

The Red Rapid service goes from Gungahlin to Fyshwick. It doesn’t get within 10km of Kippax.

Katy is referring to the Blue Rapid in this case which was one of the few good things her government has done.

Only a small error but still, a sign the Labor do not know their own public transport system

It is good to hear East Lake & Barton being mentioned in this ACT Labor Policy. I know this is a long way down the track. Phase two maybe!
What is important to consider, besides the financing, is the rail gauge. We do not want history repeating itself. If the existing heavy rail gauge is used from the start, the carriages could potentially go to Bungendore & maybe Michelago. Thus, we will have an integrated transport mode that serves the region. Federal money should be forthcoming as this is in the bell-weather seat of Eden Monaro. Once Googong is populated, the Monaro Highway and Canberra Ave will be car parks in commuter hours.

steveu said :

Reprobate said :

Sigh. One full page of breathless announcements about light rail for Gungahlin and buses in Belco, but Tuggeranong? Woden to Erindale and Tuggeranong inprovements may be “an option for the second and subsequent stages”.

Nice.

Simple. Lets vote them out. I too am growing weary of all the money being thrown to the northside to buy votes whilst they ignore the southside. And no, a 30 year plan to sell off the tuggeranong lakeside area isnt gonna cut it.

I reckon this would be partly due to the electoral boundaries. What I’d like to see is each town centre get it’s own seat with 2-3 seats for each centre depending on population. I find it ridiculous that the seat of Molonglo covers Bonner as well as Sterling. These two suburbs have nothing to do with each other and I find it hard to believe one candidate can represent the needs of Gungahlin, Inner South and Weston Creek. Currently the MLAs for Molonglo represent the needs of the large amount of voters (Gungahlin/Inner North) but ignore everyone else. I say this even though I live in Watson and work in Gungahlin.

On the actual topic though, Labor have done NOTHING about light rail for 11 years. They only mention it at election time. So because of this, they have now lost my vote. If they could actually be honest and say ‘we don’t support light rail’ then they MAY have still got it. But I refuse to vote for a party that will lie to the electorate to try and gain a few votes. Get lost Labor.

Such blatant pandering to the metrosexual vote, next thing you know we’ll be letting them get married!

Can’t wait for the tram vs bus races down northbourne, looks like we’ll be getting a drag strip after all.

Angels and Ministers of Grace preserve us Katy Gallagher is committing Labor to light rail:

They are worried, very worried.

arescarti42 said :

I’ll believe it when I see it.

Mysteryman said :

So in 11 years they’ve done sweet FA to get light rail going, but one month out from the election they expect us to believe that it’s a priority for them and they’ll actually deliver it?

Get real, Katy. Not buying it.

Election? Soon? Really??

Jeez…imagine how high our rates will need to be for this!!

Bye bye Katy

johnboy said :

For some reason it comes to mind that the US built its first railways by giving the private partners all the land surrounding the tracks.

Wasn’t that called an incentive?

Reprobate said :

Woden to Erindale and Tuggeranong inprovements may be “an option for the second and subsequent stages”.

I can see it already – will be a whole separate line. With a different gauge track.

Reprobate said :

Sigh. One full page of breathless announcements about light rail for Gungahlin and buses in Belco, but Tuggeranong? Woden to Erindale and Tuggeranong inprovements may be “an option for the second and subsequent stages”.

Nice.

Simple. Lets vote them out. I too am growing weary of all the money being thrown to the northside to buy votes whilst they ignore the southside. And no, a 30 year plan to sell off the tuggeranong lakeside area isnt gonna cut it.

So in 11 years they’ve done sweet FA to get light rail going, but one month out from the election they expect us to believe that it’s a priority for them and they’ll actually deliver it?

Get real, Katy. Not buying it.

johnboy said :

For some reason it comes to mind that the US built its first railways by giving the private partners all the land surrounding the tracks.

I suspect a few of the body corporates along Northbourne Ave would object to this option!

Sigh. One full page of breathless announcements about light rail for Gungahlin and buses in Belco, but Tuggeranong? Woden to Erindale and Tuggeranong inprovements may be “an option for the second and subsequent stages”.

Nice.

kakosi said :

I’d prefer a hospital system that doesn’t have a 50/50 chance of killing or disabling you when you go in for simple procedures or even the flu.

You are exaggerating. Which most Australians seem incapable of understanding is that our healthcare system is actually pretty bloody good, as are our hospitals. The staff there work under many pressures and do so amazingly.

Also, if you are going into the hospital when you have the flu, you are part of the problem. Hospitals are for emergencies and the really sick. If you’re sick go to your GP, drink lots of fluids and stay in bed, don’t bog the hospital up.

It will be interesting to see the proposals for the private sector partnership develop.

There are a number of institutions, and members of the public, with the capital to contribute to these sorts of projects if it is structured appropriately.

I’ll believe it when I see it.

It was on the Burley Griffin original plan for Canberra…but then again on that plan it says “casino” around the spot the war memorial currently stands 🙂

I’d prefer a hospital system that doesn’t have a 50/50 chance of killing or disabling you when you go in for simple procedures or even the flu.

I think it’ll be worth it in the long run.

Election is looming, and Labor promise something they cannot deliver. I can’t see this will take off for another 10 years. No thanks Labor, I prefer Rapid Transit version better.

We’ll probably be sued by the French for misuse of the word metro.

can’t really see this happening but if it does then run it past the airport, hell do a deal with nsw and get our friends across the border on board too

Is light rail really all that faster than bus? It’s still travelling down roads and having to stop at traffic lights, no?

Ah, so that’s the plan to triple our rates–not so secret now.