Violence against women strategy released

Calamity,
as I said before saying “deserves it” is too far. No one deserves to be abused.

Your link lists three main reasons why people don’t leave:
1. They have nowhere to go.
2. They can’t afford to leave.
3. Abusers are controlling people.

Now we can do things about 1. such as providing shelters and making public housing available and 2. providing the dole, family payments, access to job training and divorce settlements. These are all currently available.
But what can we do about 3. other than provide both legal and emotional support to abused people who choose to do something? You can provide support but you can’t leave for them or force them to leave.

There has to be an amount of personal responsibility in removing yourself from an abusive relationship and not allowing yourself to be treated poorly.
You can’t just absolve someone of all responsibility when they choose to stay in an abusive relationship because it’s easier than leaving, you can only make it easier for them to leave.

Women that get beat up by men are normally the ones that only go after them because they see them as the bad boy.

Human nature, if a lady sees a guy beating up another guy she likes him more, thinking that he’ll be able to protect her more.

Anyway the guy is being theatened to be dumped lost his kids, be weighted down with child support. Perhaps may only get to see his kids once a fortnight, the courts wont help him, he has nothing in the world to lose.

Perhaps if the courts gave guys a real chance at custordy, then they wouldnt be so agressive. Also if the female gender didnt go after the loser guys who beat up on people then perhaps less other guys will aspire to be like them.

The best page is page 11 (or the one numbered with a 5 on it)
Stereotpyes of masculinity also shape men’s attituedes towards violence againt women.

Isn’t a whole strategy about stopping men and only men beating up women and kids and only women and kids.. Kinda just promoting such stereotype.

I’m sorry but I just honestly can’t believe anybody is standing up for comments such as the below –

“If you’re sticking around because of “self esteem” issues, then the violence isn’t the problem because you’ll find your way into another abusive relationship, you should seek professional help.”

“If you’re sticking around because you are financially dependent on the abuser, essentially letting someone beat you for money, then you need to get a job.”

“I just shake my head and tell myself if she’s dumb enough to stick around, if she’d rather be with a “thug” than the thousands of decent, hardworking single men out there, she deserves it.”

Just thought I’d pop them up here again because I suppose I’m praying you haven’t read them properly the first time.

chewy14 said :

colourful sydney racing identity said :

I was in now way taking the comments out of context.

It is a stupid and flippant thing to argue that if you don’t want to be a victim of domestic violence you should not get into a relationship with a violent person. Most people do not get into violent relationships, rather the relationship turns violent.

Which is why his point 2 was:

2. Leave at the first sign of it becoming abusive.

Do you really think it’s that simple?
If so, would you mind explaining why domestic violence is a prevalant issue at all? Or do you also think it only happens to the ‘dumb’ people who let it?

Helpful article for you on the questions of “Why Don’t Battered Women Just Leave?”
http://www.ibiblio.org/hazine/battered.html

You are over-simplifying things.

colourful sydney racing identity said :

I was in now way taking the comments out of context.

It is a stupid and flippant thing to argue that if you don’t want to be a victim of domestic violence you should not get into a relationship with a violent person. Most people do not get into violent relationships, rather the relationship turns violent.

Which is why his point 2 was:

2. Leave at the first sign of it becoming abusive.

chewy14 said :

colourful sydney racing identity said :

Darkfalz said :

Do not get into an abusive relationship in the first place.

Seriously, it is that simple.

*wow* that is absolute genius right there. Let me guess, the way to not get beaten up is not to be assaulted in the first place, the cure to cancer is not getting it. Congratulations, you have won the internet.

Yeah just take part of the post and then whinge about it out of context.

Like :

colourful sydney racing identity said :

the way to not get beaten up is not to be assaulted in the first place, the cure to cancer is not getting it

I can’t believe you would say something like that. That’s horrible.

I seriously don’t know what is so offensive about telling someone not to get into a relationship with someone who you know may be abusive or to leave a relationship if your partner becomes abusive. Sure it’s not going to be easy but that’s why we have government support services to help people.

I was in now way taking the comments out of context.

It is a stupid and flippant thing to argue that if you don’t want to be a victim of domestic violence you should not get into a relationship with a violent person. Most people do not get into violent relationships, rather the relationship turns violent.

colourful sydney racing identity said :

Darkfalz said :

Do not get into an abusive relationship in the first place.

Seriously, it is that simple.

*wow* that is absolute genius right there. Let me guess, the way to not get beaten up is not to be assaulted in the first place, the cure to cancer is not getting it. Congratulations, you have won the internet.

Yeah just take part of the post and then whinge about it out of context.

Like :

colourful sydney racing identity said :

the way to not get beaten up is not to be assaulted in the first place, the cure to cancer is not getting it

I can’t believe you would say something like that. That’s horrible.

I seriously don’t know what is so offensive about telling someone not to get into a relationship with someone who you know may be abusive or to leave a relationship if your partner becomes abusive. Sure it’s not going to be easy but that’s why we have government support services to help people.

Darkfalz said :

Calamity said :

WTF???!! I have no words. That is just disgusting. You are incredibly, mind-numbingly uninformed on this topic and plainly NEVER known a woman in this situation. Unbelievable, truly.

She never deserves it, mate. Never. And she’s not ‘dumb’ for staying – she is most likely trapped, be it physically or via emotional blackmail. There are a plethora of reasons that women don’t simply say ‘Oh, he’s smacked me in the mouth – suppose I’ll just go and quietly pack a bag and politely say goodbye to him’. Honest to God, that is the most appauling response to this issue.

And I agree that situations exist in reverse – women abusing men. I don’t think the men are ‘stupid’ or that they ‘deserve it’ – I think they feel stuck in that situation.

I just cannot believe you’ve actually typed that out, honestly.

1. Do not get into an abusive relationship in the first place.
2. Leave at the first sign of it becoming abusive.

Seriously, it is that simple. If there’s assault you can prove on the way out, press charges. I didn’t make it clear before that while I have little sympathy for people who stay in abusive relationships (especially when they go for the abusive archetype in the first place) I have zero respect for the abusers, and the sooner they end up where they belong (alone, in prison) the better.

If you’re sticking around because of “self esteem” issues, then the violence isn’t the problem because you’ll find your way into another abusive relationship, you should seek professional help.

If you’re sticking around because you are financially dependent on the abuser, essentially letting someone beat you for money, then you need to get a job. If you’ve got kids, especially when they are kids you have brought into the relationship, you are responsible for them and for putting them in danger.

As someone else said, an abuser with nobody to abuse may just become a street thug, but they’ll end up in prison faster this way.

Does this mean we can all assume that you have been in an abusive relationship before and therefore know firsthand how “simple” it is to just walk away from it? Just because someone doesn’t have the strength or knowledge to get out of an abusive relationship doesn’t mean they deserve it.

Darkfalz said :

Do not get into an abusive relationship in the first place.

Seriously, it is that simple.

*wow* that is absolute genius right there. Let me guess, the way to not get beaten up is not to be assaulted in the first place, the cure to cancer is not getting it. Congratulations, you have won the internet.

Darkfalz said :

Calamity said :

WTF???!! I have no words. That is just disgusting. You are incredibly, mind-numbingly uninformed on this topic and plainly NEVER known a woman in this situation. Unbelievable, truly.

She never deserves it, mate. Never. And she’s not ‘dumb’ for staying – she is most likely trapped, be it physically or via emotional blackmail. There are a plethora of reasons that women don’t simply say ‘Oh, he’s smacked me in the mouth – suppose I’ll just go and quietly pack a bag and politely say goodbye to him’. Honest to God, that is the most appauling response to this issue.

And I agree that situations exist in reverse – women abusing men. I don’t think the men are ‘stupid’ or that they ‘deserve it’ – I think they feel stuck in that situation.

I just cannot believe you’ve actually typed that out, honestly.

1. Do not get into an abusive relationship in the first place.
2. Leave at the first sign of it becoming abusive.

Seriously, it is that simple. If there’s assault you can prove on the way out, press charges. I didn’t make it clear before that while I have little sympathy for people who stay in abusive relationships (especially when they go for the abusive archetype in the first place) I have zero respect for the abusers, and the sooner they end up where they belong (alone, in prison) the better.

If you’re sticking around because of “self esteem” issues, then the violence isn’t the problem because you’ll find your way into another abusive relationship, you should seek professional help.

If you’re sticking around because you are financially dependent on the abuser, essentially letting someone beat you for money, then you need to get a job. If you’ve got kids, especially when they are kids you have brought into the relationship, you are responsible for them and for putting them in danger.

As someone else said, an abuser with nobody to abuse may just become a street thug, but they’ll end up in prison faster this way.

Must be nice to have all the answers to some of society’s most complex problems.

Calamity said :

WTF???!! I have no words. That is just disgusting. You are incredibly, mind-numbingly uninformed on this topic and plainly NEVER known a woman in this situation. Unbelievable, truly.

She never deserves it, mate. Never. And she’s not ‘dumb’ for staying – she is most likely trapped, be it physically or via emotional blackmail. There are a plethora of reasons that women don’t simply say ‘Oh, he’s smacked me in the mouth – suppose I’ll just go and quietly pack a bag and politely say goodbye to him’. Honest to God, that is the most appauling response to this issue.

And I agree that situations exist in reverse – women abusing men. I don’t think the men are ‘stupid’ or that they ‘deserve it’ – I think they feel stuck in that situation.

I just cannot believe you’ve actually typed that out, honestly.

1. Do not get into an abusive relationship in the first place.
2. Leave at the first sign of it becoming abusive.

Seriously, it is that simple. If there’s assault you can prove on the way out, press charges. I didn’t make it clear before that while I have little sympathy for people who stay in abusive relationships (especially when they go for the abusive archetype in the first place) I have zero respect for the abusers, and the sooner they end up where they belong (alone, in prison) the better.

If you’re sticking around because of “self esteem” issues, then the violence isn’t the problem because you’ll find your way into another abusive relationship, you should seek professional help.

If you’re sticking around because you are financially dependent on the abuser, essentially letting someone beat you for money, then you need to get a job. If you’ve got kids, especially when they are kids you have brought into the relationship, you are responsible for them and for putting them in danger.

As someone else said, an abuser with nobody to abuse may just become a street thug, but they’ll end up in prison faster this way.

Angelina said :

Darkfalz, does your opinion that the victim of domestic abuse deserves it apply to men too or to you only apply it to women?

For example with LSWCHP’s awful experiences. Are you saying that he deserved to be abused by his then-wife for 7 years?

It depends. If they had children, he could have been sticking around to protect them. Considering the courts would pretty much award custody to the woman automatically, even if she is abusive – if he claims she was abusive, it is very easy for her to make a counter-claim – and the “justice” system would usually believe her.

Remember, according to yourselves, and Burch, he doesn’t exist.

colourful sydney racing identity said :

Darkfalz said :

what_the said :

Our maybe Our just means community….as in if you’re in town and see a bloke abusing the hell out of some woman, maybe just tell him to take a chill pill.

Are you serious? Not a chance in hell, unless it was my daughter, sister, fiancee or mother. Look at that poor sod in Melbourne who tried to interfere in a domestic and it cost him his life.

I just shake my head and tell myself if she’s dumb enough to stick around, if she’d rather be with a “thug” than the thousands of decent, hardworking single men out there, she deserves it.

I was going to go into a leghty response to your appaling attitudes but have decided to be succinct. You suck.

I feel the same – there is so much wrong with it, I can’t begin to tackle it. Really, really shameful though and shows and MASSIVE lack of understanding.

Darkfalz said :

what_the said :

Our maybe Our just means community….as in if you’re in town and see a bloke abusing the hell out of some woman, maybe just tell him to take a chill pill.

Are you serious? Not a chance in hell, unless it was my daughter, sister, fiancee or mother. Look at that poor sod in Melbourne who tried to interfere in a domestic and it cost him his life.

I just shake my head and tell myself if she’s dumb enough to stick around, if she’d rather be with a “thug” than the thousands of decent, hardworking single men out there, she deserves it.

I was going to go into a leghty response to your appaling attitudes but have decided to be succinct. You suck.

Darkfalz, does your opinion that the victim of domestic abuse deserves it apply to men too or to you only apply it to women?

For example with LSWCHP’s awful experiences. Are you saying that he deserved to be abused by his then-wife for 7 years?

Watson said :

Darkfalz said :

I just shake my head and tell myself if she’s dumb enough to stick around, if she’d rather be with a “thug” than the thousands of decent, hardworking single men out there, she deserves it.

Wowee…

This is the sort of post that makes me turn away from RA in disgust at regular intervals. I think I’m going to find a dark comfy place to hide in again…

+1 – its hard to read some of this.

Watson said :

Darkfalz said :

I just shake my head and tell myself if she’s dumb enough to stick around, if she’d rather be with a “thug” than the thousands of decent, hardworking single men out there, she deserves it.

Wowee…

This is the sort of post that makes me turn away from RA in disgust at regular intervals. I think I’m going to find a dark comfy place to hide in again…

Why?
The “deserves it” part is probably going too far, but I believe that people will treat you the way you allow them to.
There are plenty of services around now to help people who are in these situations and if they don’t avail themselves of them then really, what do you want the rest of us to do?
It’s extremely hard to help those who won’t help themselves.

Darkfalz said :

what_the said :

Our maybe Our just means community….as in if you’re in town and see a bloke abusing the hell out of some woman, maybe just tell him to take a chill pill.

Are you serious? Not a chance in hell, unless it was my daughter, sister, fiancee or mother. Look at that poor sod in Melbourne who tried to interfere in a domestic and it cost him his life.

I just shake my head and tell myself if she’s dumb enough to stick around, if she’d rather be with a “thug” than the thousands of decent, hardworking single men out there, she deserves it.

WTF???!! I have no words. That is just disgusting. You are incredibly, mind-numbingly uninformed on this topic and plainly NEVER known a woman in this situation. Unbelievable, truly.

She never deserves it, mate. Never. And she’s not ‘dumb’ for staying – she is most likely trapped, be it physically or via emotional blackmail. There are a plethora of reasons that women don’t simply say ‘Oh, he’s smacked me in the mouth – suppose I’ll just go and quietly pack a bag and politely say goodbye to him’. Honest to God, that is the most appauling response to this issue.

And I agree that situations exist in reverse – women abusing men. I don’t think the men are ‘stupid’ or that they ‘deserve it’ – I think they feel stuck in that situation.

I just cannot believe you’ve actually typed that out, honestly.

Darkfalz said :

I just shake my head and tell myself if she’s dumb enough to stick around, if she’d rather be with a “thug” than the thousands of decent, hardworking single men out there, she deserves it.

Wowee…

This is the sort of post that makes me turn away from RA in disgust at regular intervals. I think I’m going to find a dark comfy place to hide in again…

Darkfalz said :

what_the said :

Our maybe Our just means community….as in if you’re in town and see a bloke abusing the hell out of some woman, maybe just tell him to take a chill pill.

Are you serious? Not a chance in hell, unless it was my daughter, sister, fiancee or mother. Look at that poor sod in Melbourne who tried to interfere in a domestic and it cost him his life.

I just shake my head and tell myself if she’s dumb enough to stick around, if she’d rather be with a “thug” than the thousands of decent, hardworking single men out there, she deserves it.

Sadly, intervening in such a situation usually unites the warring couple – against you. I’ve seen this happen. The best thing to do is to call the cops, unless you’re very capable with your fists and don’t mind using them.

what_the said :

Our maybe Our just means community….as in if you’re in town and see a bloke abusing the hell out of some woman, maybe just tell him to take a chill pill.

Are you serious? Not a chance in hell, unless it was my daughter, sister, fiancee or mother. Look at that poor sod in Melbourne who tried to interfere in a domestic and it cost him his life.

I just shake my head and tell myself if she’s dumb enough to stick around, if she’d rather be with a “thug” than the thousands of decent, hardworking single men out there, she deserves it.

milkman said :

Darkfalz said :

I like the caption “our responsibility” – what are they implying here? That we (as men) am somehow responsible for the actions of other men? That all men are either violent or condoners of violence against women? Or maybe that we should risk our lives getting involved in other people’s abusive relationships.

It’s ‘our responsibility’ in the same way that it’s ‘our fault’ that Aborigines were killed and their lands taken.

Actually identifying individuals and taking meaningful action is difficult.

Personally, I blame the funding of non-government schools by the federal government for the comparatively worse academic outcomes achieved by government school students.

Punishing those successful non-gov’t schools by withdrawing federal funding and boosting the salaries of government school teachers by 7% per year for three years should fix all of that, though.

Darkfalz said :

gooterz said :

Another way to completely ignore men and make men more outcast from the lives of their children. Have the london riots proved anything yet?

We should setup a minister for men. we have one for women! If thats not sexist i dont know what is!

I like the caption “our responsibility” – what are they implying here? That we (as men) am somehow responsible for the actions of other men? That all men are either violent or condoners of violence against women? Or maybe that we should risk our lives getting involved in other people’s abusive relationships.

I guess everyone is responsible for an abusive relationship except the woman who put herself in it.

Our maybe Our just means community….as in if you’re in town and see a bloke abusing the hell out of some woman, maybe just tell him to take a chill pill.

Just to prove the quality(or lack their of) of this article
Page 6 of the strategy.. “One in four 12-20 year old Australian are aware of domestic violence against their mothers or step-mothers by their fathers or step-fathers.”
Which references ‘A White Ribbon Foundation Report – An Assault on Our Future’

http://www.whiteribbonday.org.au/media/documents/AssaultonourFutureFinal.pdf

Page 4. which references yet another Report this time from 2001. (getting over 10 years ago)
Young People & Domestic Violence: National research on young people’s attitudes and experiences of domestic violence.

http://pandora.nla.gov.au/pan/21248/20070722-0007/www.ag.gov.au/agd/www/rwpattach.nsf/viewasattachmentpersonal/(E24C1D4325451B61DE7F4F2B1E155715)_ypadv25-201.pdf/$file/ypadv25-201.pdf

Now this report is fairly unbiased. Maybe because its 10 years old and there were less feminists back then.
The main idea of the report is about a survey of 5014 children between 12-20 and how they percive domestic violence. One of the major things brought up is that most of the kids dont see female to male violence as violence because they dont think that the female could actually cause harm to the male.

Page 125

the survey size is 5014 young people between 12-20 sometime in 2001 or previous.
Of these 452 or 9.0% of those young people said that witnessed only the male parent being violent towards the female parent.
389 or 7.8% reported that only their female parent had been violent towards the male parent
but 14.4% had claimed that both parents had been violent.
9% + 14.4% give you 23.4% which is where they drew the one in four from, but no mention of the 22.1% of females that had been violent!
If you then take into account that female violence isn’t seen as violence due to stereotypes this would imply that females are likely main offenders!

I was married for seven years to a sociopathic monster who subjected me to continuous physical and emotional abuse from almost day 1 after our wedding. I was attacked on several occasions with fists, feet and household implements including a broken glass. I have physical scars that will never leave my body. I have mental scars that will be with me until the day I die. I was contemplating suicide as the result of the abuse I was suffering, but through a miracle I managed to escape and recover my sanity and my life.

I’m a 6 foot 5 inch 190 pound male ex infantry soldier.

So yeah, there are a lot of male arsehats out there abusing women. They’re probably in the majority. But I know other men who have been through experiences similar to mine. Domestic violence is not a one way street. Don’t let anybody tell you otherwise.

If you’re undergoing domestice violence, whether you’re a man or a woman, get out. Do whatever it takes, but get out. If you don’t there is a very good chance that you will end up dead, either at your own hands, or the the hands of your abuser.

Darkfalz said :

I like the caption “our responsibility” – what are they implying here? That we (as men) am somehow responsible for the actions of other men? That all men are either violent or condoners of violence against women? Or maybe that we should risk our lives getting involved in other people’s abusive relationships.

It’s ‘our responsibility’ in the same way that it’s ‘our fault’ that Aborigines were killed and their lands taken.

Actually identifying individuals and taking meaningful action is difficult.

gooterz said :

Another way to completely ignore men and make men more outcast from the lives of their children. Have the london riots proved anything yet?

We should setup a minister for men. we have one for women! If thats not sexist i dont know what is!

I like the caption “our responsibility” – what are they implying here? That we (as men) am somehow responsible for the actions of other men? That all men are either violent or condoners of violence against women? Or maybe that we should risk our lives getting involved in other people’s abusive relationships.

I guess everyone is responsible for an abusive relationship except the woman who put herself in it.

Another way to completely ignore men and make men more outcast from the lives of their children. Have the london riots proved anything yet?

We should setup a minister for men. we have one for women! If thats not sexist i dont know what is!

Darkfalz said :

kakosi said :

The only way to deal with violence, against women in particular, is to make it a serious crime – rather than classify it as a “domestic disturbance or sexual assault”.

I had a neighbour who was beaten to death by her husband in her house after years of such “domestic disturbances” were reported and somehow he never got arrested, until the end, when he was charged with manslaughter (of course).

She should have left after the first beating. These things only escalate, they rarely get better. What bothers me is that a very small percentage of men are physically abusive, yet they rarely have trouble attracting women as there are many who like the aggressive “bad boy” footy player type. Nobody forces women do date them, and nobody is much surprised when the guy ends up to be abusive, but there’s still no accountabilty for their poor choice in men. You can lock the thug up, but unless the woman is taking some responsibility, she’s just going to end up with another one. These guys won’t have anyone to bash if women can learn to spot them and avoid them (most sensible ones do just that).

With people of a lower socio-economic strata, you’ll tend to find in most cases when there is physical abuse, it occurs on both sides, and on the kids – because that’s how many of these people deal with conflict in general.

i’m sorry, but you don’t know much about this, do you? leaving isn’t always a simple option and it is through concerted community intervention and engagement with the issue, such as through such strategies as this, that could assist some victims to leave the abusive relationship.

and btw, ‘they’ will always find someone against whom to exert their violence – let’s hope you’re not in the wrong place at the wrong time, eh?

Maybe someone could teach these chicks not to tailgate while driving on the Parkway…

Ben_Dover said :

Oh..Ending …violence against women strategy. I do wish you’d made that a bit more clear. I was coming here for tips.

Agreed. Im sick of seeing the current government trying to garnish the female vote further with infamatory things like this. You never see in the media that 69% of homicides of children are committed by the custodial parent? (http://www.aic.gov.au/statistics/homicide/victim-offender.aspx) The custodial parent is predominantly (last I looked it was 92%) female.
Just a bit of balance is reasonable to ask. I think guys have been made out to be ogres far too much. Dont get me wrong, theres heaps of them out there – though alot of them do get locked up for it.

kakosi said :

The only way to deal with violence, against women in particular, is to make it a serious crime – rather than classify it as a “domestic disturbance or sexual assault”.

I had a neighbour who was beaten to death by her husband in her house after years of such “domestic disturbances” were reported and somehow he never got arrested, until the end, when he was charged with manslaughter (of course).

She should have left after the first beating. These things only escalate, they rarely get better. What bothers me is that a very small percentage of men are physically abusive, yet they rarely have trouble attracting women as there are many who like the aggressive “bad boy” footy player type. Nobody forces women do date them, and nobody is much surprised when the guy ends up to be abusive, but there’s still no accountabilty for their poor choice in men. You can lock the thug up, but unless the woman is taking some responsibility, she’s just going to end up with another one. These guys won’t have anyone to bash if women can learn to spot them and avoid them (most sensible ones do just that).

With people of a lower socio-economic strata, you’ll tend to find in most cases when there is physical abuse, it occurs on both sides, and on the kids – because that’s how many of these people deal with conflict in general.

The only way to deal with violence, against women in particular, is to make it a serious crime – rather than classify it as a “domestic disturbance or sexual assault”.

I had a neighbour who was beaten to death by her husband in her house after years of such “domestic disturbances” were reported and somehow he never got arrested, until the end, when he was charged with manslaughter (of course).

Oh..Ending …violence against women strategy. I do wish you’d made that a bit more clear. I was coming here for tips.

How about ending violence against people?

Most violence against children, incidentally, is by mothers. By men are always portrayed as the villains in these campaigns and literature.