27 March 2011

Were you whelmed in any way by Earth Hour? [with poll]

| johnboy
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Spare a thought for YouTube’s cool13q who spent an hour on top of Mount Ainslie making a video of Canberra’s Earth Hour for little effect. They left this note:

Timelapse video over canberra to see people turn off their lights for earth hour. Taken from 8:30 till 9:30, i froze my ass off standing next to my camera for that time. I was at Mt Anslie lookout. I don’t think many people really turned off their lights, and the street lights definitely didn’t turn off. But you can see Parliament House and The War Memorial turn their lights off.
I had a problem with the wind shaking the camera, so I used some digital stabilisation, however this created some unwanted artefacts.
Anyway I hope you like it

If the Canberra Times wants to chop down even more trees and coat them in poison for thousands of 12 page “Earth Hour Liftouts” we suppose that’s their own business.

But is this a piece of gesture politics you find compelling?

Earth Hour in Canberra

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Mr Gillespie said :

Yeah but have you considered the basic fact that this move towards renewable, green energy is NOT the answer to ‘climate change’??

Nope, what do you mean?

Oh, come on, Earth Hour is a fantastic idea.

It’s a great time to get together with family and friends out in the backyard around a lovely bonfire.

The only thing I found with this year’s event was that the bonfire I had got a little out of hand when I put a couple of old tyres I found in the corner of the garden on it, but other than that I really feel I made a contribution to the cause, and removed a few tons of carbon from the atmosphere, whilst enjoy the company of friends.

Being Green is not that hard.

creative_canberran10:58 pm 29 Mar 11

Wallly1972 said :

I can’t believe how many cynical, short sighted and spiteful people there are.

No doubt you’re in your office, fingers in ears head on desk shouting at the top of your lungs
“I GOT A PRIUS… I”M SAVING THE WORLD”

Mr Gillespie8:20 pm 29 Mar 11

Wallly1972 said :

I can’t believe how many cynical, short sighted and spiteful people there are.
Hopefully the posts here are not representative of the community.

Earth Hour is not supposed to fix anything it is about raising awareness of sustainability. It about saying yeah I think sustainability and climate change are such important issues and I’ll take a symbolic action. Then what can I do in my everyday life that would make a real difference?

Most of its devotees are not saying that electricity is bad (typical straw man argument) – just that we’re going to be in trouble if we keep going the way.

Sure, base load is critical and many electricity sources are not dispatchable (can be turned on/off on demand) but the proportion of renewable sources that are dispatchable is increasing. It also includes the hydro power making up the ACT electricity consumption.

Also many people make the mistake of thinking of a single power station or a single wind farm. Electricity grids connecting numerous sources have much less variability than do the individual sources. See http://www.sustainabilitycentre.com.au/BaseloadFallacy.pdf

I agree that it is pointless if ALL people do is sit in the dark for an hour. If you know such people then challenge them!
And yes, we should consider the resources consumed doing it.

Me, I celebrated Earth Hour, but also have green power, turn the lights out when not in the room, have improved my house insulation, ride to work sometimes, …

What are you doing (apart from bitching, I mean)?

Yeah but have you considered the basic fact that this move towards renewable, green energy is NOT the answer to ‘climate change’??

georgesgenitals said :

Wallly1972 said :

I can’t believe how many cynical, short sighted and spiteful people there are.

You can’t believe it, or you just don’t like it…?

Got me there – I’ve been hanging around RA long enough to know what the comments are usually like. Basically I’m an optimist who likes to see the positive in people/things – yes, I’m often dissapointed 🙁

georgesgenitals7:16 pm 29 Mar 11

Wallly1972 said :

I can’t believe how many cynical, short sighted and spiteful people there are.

You can’t believe it, or you just don’t like it…?

Jivrashia said :

It’s all in the mind. If ACTEW did actually DO IT they would have been liable against their Service Level Agreement. Their generators were operating at normal capacity in readiness for 9:30pm when all those *cough*-kers turned their lights back on.

I’m sure they did make sure they had enough electricity.

But ever thought they might have planned for a small reduction in consumption?
On the grids some of the load-following sources would have been switched off.

Nothing was fixed in the hour and yes, we’ve got a long way to go before renewables are capable of replacing all fossil fuels but the sooner we get started the better.

For those interested here are some articles
http://www.solarsouthwest.org/node/9
http://www.visionofearth.org/industry/renewable-energy/renewable-energy-review/how-can-renewables-deliver-dispatchable-power-on-demand/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pumped-storage_hydroelectricity

I can’t believe how many cynical, short sighted and spiteful people there are.
Hopefully the posts here are not representative of the community.

Earth Hour is not supposed to fix anything it is about raising awareness of sustainability. It about saying yeah I think sustainability and climate change are such important issues and I’ll take a symbolic action. Then what can I do in my everyday life that would make a real difference?

Most of its devotees are not saying that electricity is bad (typical straw man argument) – just that we’re going to be in trouble if we keep going the way.

Sure, base load is critical and many electricity sources are not dispatchable (can be turned on/off on demand) but the proportion of renewable sources that are dispatchable is increasing. It also includes the hydro power making up the ACT electricity consumption.

Also many people make the mistake of thinking of a single power station or a single wind farm. Electricity grids connecting numerous sources have much less variability than do the individual sources. See http://www.sustainabilitycentre.com.au/BaseloadFallacy.pdf

I agree that it is pointless if ALL people do is sit in the dark for an hour. If you know such people then challenge them!
And yes, we should consider the resources consumed doing it.

Me, I celebrated Earth Hour, but also have green power, turn the lights out when not in the room, have improved my house insulation, ride to work sometimes, …

What are you doing (apart from bitching, I mean)?

Holden Caulfield5:01 pm 29 Mar 11

Watson said :

…Any skimping on electricity us mere mortals can do will always just be a tiny drop in the ocean. The ocean is owned by big business and should be controlled more by the government. Neither of them have made much of an effort so far, so WTF should I?

Brilliant, that’s the spirit!

It requires such a huge effort on each individual’s part to make a minor change to their daily routine, so I can see why you’d be so reluctant to make such a concession.

You go bro!

A good example is the attitude towards smoking. Pretty much in one generation a constant and targetted education campaign about the perils of smoking has taken it from something a majority of kids tried to something very few kids try. And if they do, at least they are much more aware of the risks than I ever was as a Gen Xer.

Turning off lights for one hour isn’t going to do much on its own, I agree, but it should be about more than that. It should be viewed as a small example of a broader conservation message that shows we can all contribute to making a difference by following a few pretty simple approaches.

harvyk1 said :

And there in is the problem… You get a whole lot of people switching off lights for that one hour and then not caring about saving electricity for the next 8759 hours.

The thing is, we need to work towards making clean energy the cheapest energy around. Make it so burning coal is more expensive (both in set up and running costs) than any other option, and make it so that the cost of converting from coal powerstations to clean energy powerstations is recovered within a year or 2…

Basically consumers are not in the position to make a difference… (yes I am aware of the “all it takes is one child turning off a light to change the world” type arguments) serious changes will only happen when it makes financial sense (within an accounting period) to do so…

Hear, hear.

I actually get seriously peeved at how these types of ‘awareness campaigns’ seem to be aimed at making you feel guilty about using electricity in the first place too. Any skimping on electricity us mere mortals can do will always just be a tiny drop in the ocean. The ocean is owned by big business and should be controlled more by the government. Neither of them have made much of an effort so far, so WTF should I?

georgesgenitals3:14 pm 29 Mar 11

Mr Gillespie said :

ACTEW are jumping for joy at the massive 27 tonnes of CO? saved by this event. Wow! That’s 27,000 over 5×10^18kg, or 0.0000000000005%. Talk about a drop in the ocean!

And you should see the bleating in today’s Canberra Times about this. So many people fall for this scam it’s so laughable it’s frightening!

It’s like trying to stop a cyclone by farting at it.

Diggety said :

Mr Gillespie said :

ACTEW are jumping for joy at the massive 27 tonnes of CO? saved by this event.

I’d be very interested to know how ACTEW came up with that figure.

It’s all in the mind. If ACTEW did actually DO IT they would have been liable against their Service Level Agreement. Their generators were operating at normal capacity in readiness for 9:30pm when all those *cough*-kers turned their lights back on.

Earth Hour brought to you by WWF and Fairfax Media.

http://www.earthhour.org/mediasite/faq.aspx

So yeah… base load consumption wouldn’t have changed during that hour.

But it may have delayed/prevented the peaking plants from coming online.
Unfortunately, the peaking plants are often of the renewable type. Hydro, wind, etc.

Holden Caulfield said :

Genie said :

I like the concept behind Earth Hour…. and the fact that it points out we dont need to use all that electricity…

On the other hand, I thought it might actually trigger a light (boom, boom) inside the small minds of many that the effects of Earth Hour can last much longer than a simple PR exercise by helping to remind us all that we simply don’t need to use as much electricity as we do.

And there in is the problem… You get a whole lot of people switching off lights for that one hour and then not caring about saving electricity for the next 8759 hours.

The thing is, we need to work towards making clean energy the cheapest energy around. Make it so burning coal is more expensive (both in set up and running costs) than any other option, and make it so that the cost of converting from coal powerstations to clean energy powerstations is recovered within a year or 2…

Basically consumers are not in the position to make a difference… (yes I am aware of the “all it takes is one child turning off a light to change the world” type arguments) serious changes will only happen when it makes financial sense (within an accounting period) to do so…

Mr Gillespie said :

ACTEW are jumping for joy at the massive 27 tonnes of CO? saved by this event.

I’d be very interested to know how ACTEW came up with that figure.

Holden Caulfield2:45 pm 28 Mar 11

Genie said :

I like the concept behind Earth Hour…. and the fact that it points out we dont need to use all that electricity…

On the one hand Earth Hour is a wank. On the other hand, I thought it might actually trigger a light (boom, boom) inside the small minds of many that the effects of Earth Hour can last much longer than a simple PR exercise by helping to remind us all that we simply don’t need to use as much electricity as we do.

I view it as an awareness and education campaign, as opposed to realistic means to any measurable goal.

I don’t think the organisers expect the results of a one hour exercise, with a poor take up rate, will do much. Based on many of the comments posted here it would seem their mistake has been to assume the general populace has a clue and that the message might bring on behavioural change for a bit longer than 60 minutes.

Mr Gillespie2:28 pm 28 Mar 11

ACTEW are jumping for joy at the massive 27 tonnes of CO? saved by this event. Wow! That’s 27,000 over 5×10^18kg, or 0.0000000000005%. Talk about a drop in the ocean!

And you should see the bleating in today’s Canberra Times about this. So many people fall for this scam it’s so laughable it’s frightening!

georgesgenitals12:35 pm 28 Mar 11

troll-sniffer said :

georgesgenitals said :

It’s a complete wank.

Sorry… I must take offence at this post, after all, a complete wank ends in a productive outcome of sorts, EH can’t even achieve that!

Way more power and energy (read: CO2 emitted) is consumed by the pilgrimage up the mountains to watch it than is saved by this pointless feelgood, achieve nothing exercise.

Are you seriously trying to tell me that a wank isn’t a ‘pointless feelgood, achieve nothing exercise’??

troll-sniffer12:11 pm 28 Mar 11

georgesgenitals said :

It’s a complete wank.

Sorry… I must take offence at this post, after all, a complete wank ends in a productive outcome of sorts, EH can’t even achieve that!

Way more power and energy (read: CO2 emitted) is consumed by the pilgrimage up the mountains to watch it than is saved by this pointless feelgood, achieve nothing exercise.

Captain RAAF11:19 am 28 Mar 11

Pandy said :

I was appalled!!!!!

I went around the house, but forgot to turn ON the lights in garage!!!!

Frankly, getting me to spend $30 bucks to buy several franapani scented candles to have our dinner over for an hour is a waste of time and effort. Makes it difficult to see the food and makes the diners look like ghouls.

Tokenism for one hour…..meh

Fear not, I turned on the garage lights, started both cars, even turned on the flood lights and the pond pump that I usually turn off as it keeps the daughter awake, then I warmed up the spa for a few hours.

I reckon I undid any of the ‘good’ that about a hundred Earth hour fruitcakes did.

happy days!

You missed an option JB,

“There was an earth hour and I wasn’t informed”

Yeah I completely forgot that earth hour was happening. However if I had realised it was happening I would have been more likely to celebrate human achievement hour by switching on every light in the house just in case I wanted to walk into that room sometime during the hour…

For the last 3 years my friends and I have used this as an excuse to have dinner parties. Sure, it’s slightly tokenistic, but then, so is only going to church at Christmas and Easter.

Hosinator said :

Base load people, read about it. Earth Hour does not affect base load, which means it doesn’t reduce carbon emissions.

Really highlights the utter pointlessness of this EH malarkey

creative_canberran said :

It’s a total wank. (Can I say that on RA?).
Put simply, it makes people feel like they’re saving the world by doing nothing.

+1

I always wonder too how much energy and resources they use to print and broadcast all the advertising involved in this event.

creative_canberran11:28 pm 27 Mar 11

Pandy said :

I was appalled!!!!!

I went around the house, but forgot to turn ON the lights in garage!!!!

Frankly, getting me to spend $30 bucks to buy several franapani scented candles to have our dinner over for an hour is a waste of time and effort.

It’s worse than a waste of time my friend, it could have actually being counter prductive.
Unless the candles were made of soy or bees wax, they were likely paraffin based. When you burn them, they emit toxic vapours including toluene and benzene which both cause cancer and birth defects.
So all these candles people are lighting up, instead of saving the world, are really just poisoning people.

It’s definitely a wank. One hour a year and go back to burning the oil as normal. Surely Light bulbs aren’t the problem as opposed to major energy using appliance, for example cooling/heating. Plus I am a bit tired of this always being put back on the ‘household’ like water use. Shower less, don’t water the garden etc, let it all go to dust. Meanwhile, industry, government, corporations etc, still use water at will. Look at a google earth image of Canberra from the drought period and see where all the greenery is around the city. Like the GFC it is easier to lean harder on individuals with austerity measures than actually make those responsible pay or do things differently. I haven’t seen too many mines in Australia give up their water for processing.

astrojax said :

when’s mars hour?

Too late according to the Socialists… http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2011/03/23/3171019.htm

I was appalled!!!!!

I went around the house, but forgot to turn ON the lights in garage!!!!

Frankly, getting me to spend $30 bucks to buy several franapani scented candles to have our dinner over for an hour is a waste of time and effort. Makes it difficult to see the food and makes the diners look like ghouls.

Tokenism for one hour…..meh

I like the concept behind Earth Hour…. and the fact that it points out we dont need to use all that electricity…

Do Government buildings really need all their lights on all night… (and all day – I know my building doesn’t really need lights on during sunny days)

georgesgenitals7:07 pm 27 Mar 11

It’s a complete wank.

Was it that cold? I turned off my lights, TV, computer and went out for an hour’s walk.I wore a jacket and shorts, and I didn’t feel that cold at all.

When I went out, initially it looked dark (except for the guy upstairs). As I walked around the parks and streets it seemed more lights were on than off.

Personally, I was annoyed that our supposedly apolitical Cth Department, AG’s, sent an all staff email ‘reminding’ us about Earth Hour.
Also, my sister who is a teacher had her and everyone else’s computers got hijacked by a Departmental screensaver selling Earth Hour.
An individual’s choices about such matters are not something a Govt Department should be involved in – smacks of propaganda.
My view is that, while personally very supportive of many eco-related policies (such as green belts, trees, home grown vegies, organic farming practices etc), I do not wish to go back to the dark ages, thank you very much. Why would I wish to be reminded of pre-electricity, when women did most of the chores by hand and there was no hot water and poor hygiene? No, thank you.

when’s mars hour?

Most buldings had the lights off friday night as they would of had to PAY someone to go in to turn the lights off on Saturday (1.5 is saturday rate and most is a 2 – 4 hour min shift) ie security or cleaners turned them off on friday. Maybe next year they could do it on a friday night and see the difference.

All i know is it was dark when I turned my head lights off down horse park, decided not to leave them off for the hour….

creative_canberran6:12 pm 27 Mar 11

It’s a total wank. (Can I say that on RA?).
Put simply, it makes people feel like they’re saving the world by doing nothing.
It’s worth noting that in the US, the Prius, with it’s unique styling and nameplates outsells every other Hybrid on the market combined because the others are variants of normal vehicles which, even if cheaper, don’t have the same recognition. It doesn’t scream “world saver driving”.

Before anybody wants to point out that turning off a light bulb consumes no power I’ll still compare lit rooms to lit rooms before you try to whip out the efficiency word, thanks.
I fully realise a fluorescent doesn’t use an hour’s energy to come online and then give light for free . (You’d need to keep the lthe light bulb in startup more for something like two minutes for to get the hours power, but the surge is still there…)
But even if you want to buy into the EH nonsense, your power provider is still producing electricity as if you weren’t, and still needs to bring surge capacity on line for when you get your well intentioned nonsense.

How many Earth Hour supporters left their mobile phone charger plugged in, or simply delayed their electrity consuming activities until after it was over?

Skidbladnir said :

All the paths to hell are paved with good intentions, and hope is the first step on the road to disappointment.
Earth Hour somehow manages to achieve both, but still gets a lot of money and media attention for it.

Light bulbs and fluorescents (and most electronics) require more power to turn on than keep on, the power consumption is mostly delayed instead of prevented, the resulting ‘peak’ a everything comes back on again probably causes more strain or surge than the lull relieves, and the lesson being taught is ‘learn to live without’ instead of ‘ be more efficient in your consumption and production’.

Well… The mythbusters busted that myth, a fluorescent light’s start up energy is equivalent to to it being on for 23 seconds, so turning off the lights for an hour is a lot more efficient then leaving them on, even if it is a thousand of them.

Base load people, read about it. Earth Hour does not affect base load, which means it doesn’t reduce carbon emissions.

Skidbladnir said :

Light bulbs and fluorescents (and most electronics) require more power to turn on than keep on, the power consumption is mostly delayed instead of prevented, the resulting ‘peak’ a everything comes back on again probably causes more strain or surge than the lull relieves, and the lesson being taught is ‘learn to live without’ instead of ‘ be more efficient in your consumption and production’.

Or, you could just disprove that old myth with a simple google search…

http://lightingdesignlab.com/articles/switching/switching_fluorescent.htm

Apparently the NSW ALP misread the Earth hour email and have turned the lights out for the next decade in Sussex St.

I’m amazed it wasn’t bigger… My grade one boy brought home a poster he had to make at primary school… With that sort of indoctrination nice and early, we should be back in our mud huts in no time…

FWIW – voted jumped the shark.Was gonna vote the Leo Burnett thing, but was too lazy to google him to find out who the f… he is…

All the paths to hell are paved with good intentions, and hope is the first step on the road to disappointment.
Earth Hour somehow manages to achieve both, but still gets a lot of money and media attention for it.

Light bulbs and fluorescents (and most electronics) require more power to turn on than keep on, the power consumption is mostly delayed instead of prevented, the resulting ‘peak’ a everything comes back on again probably causes more strain or surge than the lull relieves, and the lesson being taught is ‘learn to live without’ instead of ‘ be more efficient in your consumption and production’.

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