5 January 2010

Where vigilantes roam the streets

| WillowJim
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[Ed] – We’ve had 3 stories submitted about the Canberra Guardian Angels. Damien Heffernan first wrote to RiotACT back in March 2009 asking for volunteers.

When I first read that the Guardian Angels had set up a chapter in Canberra, I dismissed the story as a beat-up: one sole whiner who likes the thought of wearing berets does not comprise a vigilante force.

But the New York-based organisation seems to be genuinely behind this push; it lists Canberra as its only Australian chapter.

Canberra? The only city in Australia in need of the Guardian Angels? I agree with Simon Corbell on this one: we don’t need it. The only time I’ve ever felt unsafe here is when I’m on the road near some Cro-Magnon who is about to explode because the traffic is only travelling 10km/h above the limit. I’ve never felt threatened in Civic, even in the wee hours.

But judging by talkback yesterday and the letters to the editor in the paper today, many disagree with me. So would the red berets be of any use in Canberra? Or would they just attract/cause trouble?

Other submissions below

From PBO

VIGILANTES! Woo Hoo
I was having a read of our great local rag when i came upon an article that made me giggle. We are getting “Guardian Angels”! Now it struck me as a bit over the top, being that Charnwood and Kippax are not at all like the movie “the Warriors” (70’s urban apocalypse gang flick).

I believe that the presence of these folk will only lead to games of keepings off involving red berets as opposed to making the streets safer.

Has anyone heard anymore than what has been reported?

From Moneypenny2612

The Goon Squad comes to town
Recently the Canberra Times carried an interesting story touting “vigilantism” with the Guardian Angels establishing a presence in the ACT.

Who are the Guardian Angels? Apparently they walked the mean streets of New York City and fought crime where police feared to tread. In the ACT, it looks like they’ve been putting it appearances at neighbourhood association meetings (if a recent Cook chapter meeting is any indication). Have they been promoting their wears in other neigbourhoods too?

But seriously. Is Canberra really comparable to NYC (c. 1980s) when it comes to violent crime and vulnerable law abiding citizens?

Do we really need to form gangs to take the law into our own hands? Discuss.

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Well…with my mother-in-laws car getting broken into last night, and the (likely) same filfth ramming a screwdriver or something down my motorcycle ignition, I can say that I am somewhat sympathetic to the idea of vigilantes.

I’d rather be putting more into policing…but if our politicians don’t have the bottle to spend the money, well…

Can’t say the response was overwhelming from ACT police. The operator I spoke with was very nice and listened well, but admitted that nothing could be done. For my mother-in-law, well, she got the impression that they simply couldn’t car less and felt that reporting it was a waste of time.

So – in these circumstances isn’t it quite natural for people to want to take matters to hand?

Love the bagging out of these guys, I have to admit Canberra isnt very dangerous and these guys would be better placed in Sydney or Melbourne but bagging them out for trying to be proactive cmon? You are the same clowns that bag the police out for taking an hour to show on a call out. Rather have proactive citizens and a less then effective police force then just the po po.

i know what we need! DOG the Bounty Hunter and his family..lol they’d clean up the wild canberran streets for sure.

I agree with what you have said SIGMA.
I can understand your frustration.
Not sure or not weather this is the solution to the problem but something has to be done down here in the Southside.
I cannot believe the confidence in some of the youth that roam the streets near us.
They are rude disrespectful and when you try and say something like Everyone else suggested Sigma do we had a group of youths smashing bottles and other projectiles at our house.
Of cause by the time police arrived they were gone and who had to pay the bill NOT THEM.
I think the ones that need to wake up are the PARENTS where are you?
Get off your bums because the problem seems to hard for you to fix and do SOMETHING about your teenage shit heads that are making other people’s lives a living nightmare.
Remember this if you are a law abiding citizen why should you have anything to worry about.
They’re not going to impact your lives only those that break the law.
Sad we have to put others out there to do the job of some lazy parents but i say
BRING IT ON

I wonder if the training in South Africa contravenes the terrorism laws + 8 members, that’s

sunshine said :

canberra quiet! obviously don’t know the real canberra.

Well at Woden interchange I get a bunch of 14yr olds trying to “hold me up” armed with little more than their attitudes – vs – a lot of places I could think of in Sydney same situation except they are all armed with knives, basevall bats, chains, etc… and they’re a lot tougher than the 14yr old punks I come across around canberra late at night or even during the day. Canberrans like to think Canberra is somewhat hardcore but its really not, its more like the emo equivelant of hardcore really.

@ #40 raw hide I believe that they discovered watching movies like Action Jackson and the various Steven Segal ones was more exciting than trying to live the dream.

How quaint, Canberras own little tribe of S1W’s
Love the red beret look by the way.

I would suggest something like this would be more productive…

http://the-riotact.com/?p=13569

Sigma said :

You people need to get your heads out your arses get out of your house after dark. Roaming groups of gangs on the Southside, three cars stolen in my street in two years numerous break and enters.

IF THE PISS ANT LITTLE WANKERS THAT ROAM AROUND LOOKING FOR TROUBLE KNOW THAT THEY ARE PEOPLE WATCHING THEM THEY WONT STEEL OR WRECK MY STUFF.

WAKE UP PEOPLE ):

So I take it that you have not roamed the streets yourself and taken any initiative to stop local crime? Waiting for someone to put on a beret and do it for you? Seriously though, we should not need to have such a thing purely because not looking out for your neighbour is Un-Australian.

dr phil said :

And will it mean that 3 RAR will be upset that someone else will be wearing a red beret?

No. they wear a cherry beret, Military Police wear the red one, so i think that the Guardian Angels think that people will take them more seriously.

If you read some of the articles that are one some of their websites, you can find many examples of the Guardian Angels infringing on peoples civil liberties. One example was that they stopped a person on the street and said raise your arms, you’re getting a pat down. Now if some random in a dodgy shirt tried to do that to me I would laugh in their face as they have no power whatsoever to enforce such a thing.

Also, is there not a law regarding local militias in Canberra? They certainly have a lot of paramilitary aspects about them.

colourful sydney racing identity11:00 am 07 Jan 10

I hope they will be wearing asbestos pants to protect themselves when the go after Todd Carney

Sigma said :

You people need to get your heads out your arses get out of your house after dark. Roaming groups of gangs on the Southside, three cars stolen in my street in two years numerous break and enters.

IF THE PISS ANT LITTLE WANKERS THAT ROAM AROUND LOOKING FOR TROUBLE KNOW THAT THEY ARE PEOPLE WATCHING THEM THEY WONT STEEL OR WRECK MY STUFF.

WAKE UP PEOPLE ):

Angry person on internet makes empty threat of vigilante justice … news at 11

Somewhere_between said
“I remember reading somewhere that the ACT had the highest rate of juvenile crime in Australia.”

Must be true if you read it somewhere!

if ppl want to get our and try to help our community rather than sit there winging doing nothing about it then I say good on them!! Ppl are so quick to judge other ppl and what they do with their life around here when they should be worrying about their own. Majority of crime that happens is never heard about it so nobody really knows how much crime canberra has and if these Gaurdian Angels stop the slightest bit of crime in our community then im more than happy to have them here!!

Sigma said :

You people need to get your heads out your arses get out of your house after dark. Roaming groups of gangs on the Southside, three cars stolen in my street in two years numerous break and enters.

IF THE PISS ANT LITTLE WANKERS THAT ROAM AROUND LOOKING FOR TROUBLE KNOW THAT THEY ARE PEOPLE WATCHING THEM THEY WONT STEEL OR WRECK MY STUFF.

WAKE UP PEOPLE ):

so why don’t you get a petition together to get more funding for the coppers, and more coppers in the community? vigilantes create problems. and I don’t want a bunch of blokes who think they are quasi coppers, and above the law…

Sigma “IF THE PISS ANT LITTLE WANKERS THAT ROAM AROUND LOOKING FOR TROUBLE KNOW THAT THEY ARE PEOPLE WATCHING THEM THEY WONT STEEL OR WRECK MY STUFF.

WAKE UP PEOPLE ):”

I hate being woken with insults and bully boy tactics.

What you are saying is that you want another gang of violence trained adults, roaming the streets, to pick on the neighbourhood children. Sorry not pick on, watch the neighbourhood children. I’m awake but I still don’t see how that is actually going to foster respect of your stuff from the piss ant wankers, whoever they are. I’m pretty sure it will just reinforce that adults are not to be trusted. Your such a shinning light to our youth.

somewhere_between_bundah_and_goulburn12:32 am 07 Jan 10

sunshine said :

youth being d/hds

Come out to Gungahlin and you’ll see those youth!! I remember reading somewhere that the ACT had the highest rate of juvenile crime in Australia.

Rawhide Kid No 211:12 pm 06 Jan 10

andy pandy said :

I have memories of them having a chapter here in the early 90’s.

What happened to it? Did they get bored?

You people need to get your heads out your arses get out of your house after dark. Roaming groups of gangs on the Southside, three cars stolen in my street in two years numerous break and enters.

IF THE PISS ANT LITTLE WANKERS THAT ROAM AROUND LOOKING FOR TROUBLE KNOW THAT THEY ARE PEOPLE WATCHING THEM THEY WONT STEEL OR WRECK MY STUFF.

WAKE UP PEOPLE ):

Pommy bastard said :

I’ve more respect for people who put their money where their mouths are, and get out and do something to try to improve our city, than a bunch of keyboard heros…

where are you living? where are the trouble spots these people seem to think are here? if it is so bad, why don’t we call for policing numbers to be increased, increase the AFP’s budgets and hire more coppers? what can a vigilante do? if they break up a fight, and someone gets seriously injured, chances are they are going to get sued… that really helps canberra.

PBO said :

If this takes off i can see a conversation like this taking place down the track:

Jim Gordon: What about escalation?
Damien Heffernan: Escalation?
Jim Gordon: We start carrying semi-automatics, they buy automatics. We start wearing Kevlar, they buy armor-piercing rounds.
Damien Heffernan: And?
Jim Gordon: And sigh, *you’re* wearing a beret and jumping off rooftops. Now, take this guy: armed robbery, double homicide. Got a taste for theatrical, like you. Leaves a calling card.
[Gordon presents Damien Heffernan with a clear plastic evidence bag containing what appears to be a single playing card; Damien Heffernan turns it over to reveal a “Massey-Joker face”]

From this point on ACT criminals will start wearing costumes and using stupid code-names like Ultra-Massey Man or Ice-Bitch.

See what costumed crime fighting does Damien?

P.S. Get a chinstrap for your beret or you WILL lose it to some kids/adults/whomever who have a taste for keepings off.

A+ post, Well done PBO, wish the site had more content like this.

NickD said :

Why don’t these guys join the police if they want to fight crime?

‘Cos they can’t get in.

If they want to do it properly they have to wear the MC Hammer pants, like the NY mob did in the early 90s.

Stop…………………Hammer time!

Well it isn’t the greatest idea, but does highlight Canberra’s chronic shortage of police officers, despite Corbell’s best bullshtting. Very rarely do you see any police patrolling any area of Canberra and if you call for Police attendence you’re lucky if they show up 3 hours later, if not the next day.

When the police do patrol, such as the operation down at Lanyon last year, you actually see the results occurring. The same with money being pumped into extra RBT resulting in a “record” number of people getting caught. If Corbell pulled his head out of his ass and put enough police on the streets, then he wouldn’t have to spend his time whinging in the media when people create these groups.

Sunshine

Most people in Canberra walk around with rose coloured glasses on, it’s like having a Claytons lol

I have memories of them having a chapter here in the early 90’s.

Why don’t these guys join the police if they want to fight crime?

peterh said :

Charnwood was, circa 1980’s. not now, nor is kambah a hotspot, nor is the causeway. interested to learn where these bad areas are. I certainly haven’t seen any for some time, unless there is a dark side to yarralumla or red hill…

umm, yes most defianately a dark side to red hill. it’s the flats near the shops – dodgy as anything

Mordd said :

If it wasn’t still 4 months till April 1st id be suspecting this was a joke, but zomg they really are serious. Although from the looks of it, if they tried this in sydney or melbourne where the “real” violence occurs regularly, they would probably get the snot beaten out of them so quickly they would all be in hospital within a week I suspect. My guess would be its only quiet places like Canberra where they can roam around pretending to do good while being safe in the knowledge that their likelihood of interrupting a real crime in progress is extremely minimal.

canberra quiet! obviously don’t know the real canberra.

i think having something like a strong regular presence in areas such as woden, civic, around the dodgy housing complexes (yes especially the red hill ones) is a good idea – as long as they don’t think they are the police.
canberra has a lot of crime – unfortunately mostly drug related or youth being d/hds – canberra just knows how to hide it well.

Deadmandrinking said :

I am now trying to figure out what is going to stop me taunting them when I’m drunk.

This ^^^^^^ LOL

gospeedygo said :

I can swing a sack of door knobs. Do they require you to supply a your own knobs?

I believe they supply the knobs, but you must supply the sack though. 😛

If it wasn’t still 4 months till April 1st id be suspecting this was a joke, but zomg they really are serious. Although from the looks of it, if they tried this in sydney or melbourne where the “real” violence occurs regularly, they would probably get the snot beaten out of them so quickly they would all be in hospital within a week I suspect. My guess would be its only quiet places like Canberra where they can roam around pretending to do good while being safe in the knowledge that their likelihood of interrupting a real crime in progress is extremely minimal.

I can swing a sack of door knobs. Do they require you to supply a your own knobs?

Mutant Ninja Turtles will also be around due to the gas leak at the CSIRO today.

http://www.esa.act.gov.au/ESAWebsite/content_esa/home_page/esa_home_page.html

astrojax said :

they could be used to book police cars parked where dvaey doesn’t like them to be…

They could start a “citizen’s registration” system for cyclists who ride on the road.

dr phil said :

And will it mean that 3 RAR will be upset that someone else will be wearing a red beret?

Who sells berets these days? Probably the only benefit to society could be increased sales at disposal stores but I don’t think we have any in Canberra anymore. Shame, I love a good disposal store.

Pommy bastard2:24 pm 06 Jan 10

I’ve more respect for people who put their money where their mouths are, and get out and do something to try to improve our city, than a bunch of keyboard heros…

p1 said :

What are the laws concerning dressing up in uniforms and roving the street in groups? Since they are going out with the stated intention of being involved in issues of social disturbance, will they be held to a high standard then the average citizen when they wind up in court after a game of keepings off goes wrong?

maybe they are bikies in disguise and not The Guardian Angels ?

sloppery said :

Maybe they can help the cops find and stop speeding drivers.

Maybe they will stop cops from parking in Murulla Lane…

😉

Deadmandrinking2:11 pm 06 Jan 10

I am now trying to figure out what is going to stop me taunting them when I’m drunk.

Rawhide Kid No 22:10 pm 06 Jan 10

If they (The Guardian Angels) intend to execute a “Citizens arrest” on suspect perpetrators of violence and crime then they will be spending a lot of time in Court defending their actions. Could be a very expensive little exercise if things go wrong as in this article from the Northern Territory News .

http://www.ntnews.com.au/article/2009/02/28/36331_ntnews.html

they could be used to book police cars parked where dvaey doesn’t like them to be…

What are the laws concerning dressing up in uniforms and roving the street in groups? Since they are going out with the stated intention of being involved in issues of social disturbance, will they be held to a high standard then the average citizen when they wind up in court after a game of keepings off goes wrong?

Maybe they can help the cops find and stop speeding drivers.

Special G said :

Why not. If people want to get out and about and provide eyes on the street, good for them. The Police can’t be everywhere and too many people don’t want to get involved so turn a bling eye.

agreed. with the amount of thuggery going on of late etc in the ACT it probably cant hurt

Rawhide Kid No 211:55 am 06 Jan 10

An interesting. article from The New York Times 1992.

http://www.nytimes.com/1992/11/27/opinion/curtis-sliwa-s-confession.html

Rawhide Kid No 211:18 am 06 Jan 10

colourful sydney racing identity said :

Nothing but some profile raising for Mr Heffernen to assist his tilt for the next Legislative Assembly elections.

ROTM (Right on the Money)

With their little hats on, I hope they don’t become targets.

look at the bottom of this page http://www.guardianangels.org/index.php Its the all seeing eye, so they have got a secret… maybe they are mason’s?

If this takes off i can see a conversation like this taking place down the track:

Jim Gordon: What about escalation?
Damien Heffernan: Escalation?
Jim Gordon: We start carrying semi-automatics, they buy automatics. We start wearing Kevlar, they buy armor-piercing rounds.
Damien Heffernan: And?
Jim Gordon: And sigh, *you’re* wearing a beret and jumping off rooftops. Now, take this guy: armed robbery, double homicide. Got a taste for theatrical, like you. Leaves a calling card.
[Gordon presents Damien Heffernan with a clear plastic evidence bag containing what appears to be a single playing card; Damien Heffernan turns it over to reveal a “Massey-Joker face”]

From this point on ACT criminals will start wearing costumes and using stupid code-names like Ultra-Massey Man or Ice-Bitch.

See what costumed crime fighting does Damien?

P.S. Get a chinstrap for your beret or you WILL lose it to some kids/adults/whomever who have a taste for keepings off.

So does that mean Canberra will have its own Gestapo?

Will that also mean the the Security Officers that get $15 an hour to do the same thing may be out of a job?

And will it mean that 3 RAR will be upset that someone else will be wearing a red beret?

colourful sydney racing identity10:00 am 06 Jan 10

Nothing but some profile raising for Mr Heffernen to assist his tilt for the next Legislative Assembly elections.

Why not. If people want to get out and about and provide eyes on the street, good for them. The Police can’t be everywhere and too many people don’t want to get involved so turn a bling eye.

icantbelieveitsnotbutter9:19 am 06 Jan 10

Juice Terry said :

Hahahaha, oh dear. Are these people serious? Canberra is about as dangerous as soup. I think these vigilantes are going to get a bit bored of wandering about Kippax and Charnwood doing precisely nothing.

I once had soup from a shop (will remain annon) in Canberra one Christmas lunch and I got very ill from it… I would consider that dangerous 🙂

Oh and I live in Charnwood (heights) and your spot on, nothing too bad happening round the area nowdays…

Wouldn’t it be easier for them just to get an Xbox live subscription- then they can bust gangsta ass in the comfort of their own home..

Hahahaha, oh dear. Are these people serious? Canberra is about as dangerous as soup. I think these vigilantes are going to get a bit bored of wandering about Kippax and Charnwood doing precisely nothing.

What we REALLY need is a group of vigilantes protecting Intoxicated Persons from police in civic.

If you are drunk and walking around in civic the police can do anything they want to you based on you being drunk and – according to them, if they wish – disorderly.
If you’re drunk and if you say anything that a police officer would find inappropiate, even if its not directed at police or a random, they will beat you and send you to the watch house.

I have seen too many times police using physical violence against those that are only verbally “violent”.

When did it become some kind of crime to speak?

The people need protection from the conservative bullies that roam civic during the night out time.

Charnwood was, circa 1980’s. not now, nor is kambah a hotspot, nor is the causeway. interested to learn where these bad areas are. I certainly haven’t seen any for some time, unless there is a dark side to yarralumla or red hill…

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