8 June 2006

Gay Marriage showdown looms

| johnboy
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Having brought down an apocalyptic budget the ACT Government is now heading for Armageddon with the Commonwealth Government over the issue of civil unions. I’ve been writing about some of the issues over on The Concatenate.

But while the Senate gets around to heated debate on the issue and Senator Humphries decides where his loyalties lie (he’s reportedly seeking urgent meetings with Phillip Ruddock) Simon Corbell has upped the ante by announcing that he’s going to rush emergency legislation into the Assembly to bring forward the commencement date for civil unions.

It’s not going to be too difficult for the Federales to bring forward their disallowance so it’s mostly a symbolic resistance. Dissolving the Assembly is the only real protest available. Don’t hold your breathe for that.

UPDATED: AAP, via News, has a story on Gary Humprhies thinking very seriously about crossing the floor and voting to uphold the ACT’s laws.

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Yeah tell that to the people of Chernobyl.

well that displays his agenda.

nuclear reactors are safe.

Quote from Bob Brown: After discussions with George Bush, John Howard has come back with the view that gay marriage is dangerous and nuclear reactors are safe.

Bonfire, as the name of the Civil Unions Act suggests, there is a lot more to formal recognition of domestic relationships than your relationship having the symbolic endorsement of your community. It has serious legal consequences, eg being able to decide with finality who receives your superannuation benefits should you die, being recognised as next of kin should your partner be hospitalised etc.

I don’t believe in god and don’t give a rats arse what some stupid happy-clappy Christian and his imaginary friend think of my relationship. I am however concerned about the legal consequences of there being no formal process whereby I can guarnatee the standing of my family and our legal rights.

i havent said im opposed. how do you draw that conclusion ?

i think that everyone is entitled to the same treatment.

i dont believe that the state has any right deciding who can or cannot marry.

i dont believe that you even need the state to reognise your union, and especially not require any religion to recognise your union.

if you wish to aid your oppressors – fill your boots.


We’ve gone from a serious topic to a referrers nightmare.

Is it likely that the Senate will vote down the executive order to disallow the enactment of the ACT legislation? We can expect the Family First Senator to vote with the Government on this issue; thus we’ll need three Government senators to cross the floor. The two most likely to do this seem to be Gary Humphries (territory rights) and Warren Entsch (equality); will there be a third?

Absent Diane2:09 pm 09 Jun 06

barrel of monkey rooting???

Then why the voiciferous opposition to the law bonfire?

this fallacy that greeks/romans etc approved of homosexuality is not based on fact. generally, homosexuality was shunned. if you didnt flaunt your homosexual tendencies then you werent shunned.

if im wrong on this, please produce peer reviewed evidence to support your case.

i know it suits homosexual lobbyists to promote all that oppose their agenda as bigots, but im not.

your sexuality plays no part in my opinion of you, only your actions, behaviour and beliefs.

Absent Diane2:04 pm 09 Jun 06

Was it the ebola or the aids reservoir that they found recently???

RG – the bestiality theory of where AIDS came from is (very vaguely) feasible; but probably apocryphal. Far more likely was some dude skinning and gutting a monkey nicked himself in the process and transmission occurred that way.

Sorry to be the fun police, but I’m pretty sure HIV didn’t come from monkey-rooting.

BTW – what are the odds that “monkey+rooting” will turn up on the next referrers report 😉

Then go spend the weekend in Lakemba…

Still reckon it’s a good thing done badly.

Absent Diane1:43 pm 09 Jun 06

bulldog I do agree that it seems more of a hippy-like we will stand defiant kind of approach rather than a smart plan of attack to try and find some loophole or whatever… which does it make it stink of publicity stunt… BUT at least it is something and gets this issue out into the open…

I would like to see attacks on all these old fashioned christian morals that seem to dominate the way live…

AIDS came from beastiality actually.

What a crock of shit. Check this out;

“Legalizing [domestic] partnerships between men and men, between woman and woman, it will simply create disasters–beyond comparison! We are already seeing the results of this. We see it through the spread of AIDS. Certainly, not all AIDS-infected individuals are homosexuals, but it came into existence because of this in the past. For that matter, innocent people can become infected with this terrible disease, without having had anything to do with what lies behind it, as far as homosexuality is concerned.”

It beggars belief.

However I still maintain that whilst the principal is admirable (and somehwat important) I believe there are more important issues at hand. I take this stand based on the fact that Stanhope would have to be a bigger idiot than I thought if he thought the Feds would sit idly by and watch him legalise gay marriage. As such he had a responsibility to the G&L community and the people of Canberra to do his research before trying to float this half-arsed plan.

Wow – that article is quite a rant. Possibly even less coherent than some of mine.

Heh – I especially liked the bit (and I paraphrase) were the dude talks about having a homosexual crisis when you’re “not getting what you need from a partner”.

Does that mean the next time my gal has a “headache”, I’ll turn into a puff?

Absent Diane1:15 pm 09 Jun 06


A link my girlfriend just sent me…

and a snippet

That instinct, which God has embedded in humanity to experience the deepest form of relationship, and in order to protect marriage in true faithfulness, has become the Devil’s strongest weapon against God and against marriage. So he is using it against God. That which God has created so that man shall experience togetherness and faithfulness and happiness and everything it brings–the Devil uses this against God and in God’s face, in order to twist and distort.

Now tell me that christianity is not evil and should be wiped from the face of the planet… until a point whence they can play with the other children nicely!!!!!!!

That goes for any other evil dirtbag religion as well..

I hope that decent christians with morals slap there fucking counterparts around and tell them to wake up to themselves

Who gives a rats where it originates from? Working out if it’s genetic or environmental is only useful if you are treating it as a pathology.

doh! too slow…


being homosexual isn’t genetic.

Bonfire – if homosexuality was such a collossal genetic abberation, it would have dissappeared from the genome before we anyone realised it was there.

Thankfully, genetics is a lot more complex an issue than you win/you lose.

And not “pretty much every civilisation since the year dot” has persecuted homosexuals. The middle ages in Europe left it pretty much untouched (kinda “Don’t ask don’t tell. If that’s your bag, go become a monk”). The Greeks pretty much saw it as de rigeur. The Romans, likewise.

The active persecution of Gays is a pretty modern thing – and a Judeo-Christian modern thing at that.

Regardless of the history…who cares. Adam and Steve aren’t doing you any harm (not like they’re asking you to join in). Allowing them the same rights to formalise thier union under law is not going to make a blind bit of difference to your life. Why not leave it alone then?

BTW – I’m assuming that you’re using the inflammatory language to get various people’s backs up. It works, but it also leads us to think “he doth protest too much”.

Unless you lived in Sparta, man-on-man action made you heaps tougher. Maybe that’s just what little Johnny needs.

People always seem more than eager to customise their religion to suit their bigotry.

ad – its not just christians that oppose homosexuality. its been opposed by pretty much any and all civilisations since the year dot.

i think genetic aberrations unless they are useful, are generally shunned.

confidence vote in the Senate?

They lose ’em all the time, it’s not a problem.

Absent Diane11:39 am 09 Jun 06

Bonfire – I am sure that bible doesn’t say anything negative and that it is cultural thing… but most christians I know are homophobic… obviously not all.. but it seems to be standard issue…

I don’t think the ALP is the answer but you are more likely to find people with more moderate beliefs than in that bastion of evil christians the liberal party

bonfire – the federal government isn’t using legislation this time to overturn the ACT’s law; instead, the executive council is recommending to the Governor-General that he use his power under the ACT Self Government legislation to disallow the enactment of the ACT’s law. The Senate may be able to vote to disallow this but it’s unlikely to be a conscience vote, because losing the vote would essentially be a vote of no-confidence in the executive government.

absent diane – nowhere in the new testament does jesus say anything about homosexuals.

in fact many of the things extreme christians bang on about are not the things christ discussed.

many christians are homosexuals, look at the clergy of the roman catholics and church of england. its almost a mandatory job qualification.

this is more a states rights issue than a religious issue. i hope the federal parlt moves are conscience votes.

if you think the alp are all lovers of perverts, you are very wrong.

I only believe in gay marriage when both chicks are hot.

No I don’t think it’s stupid Mr Evil, obviously the actual situation for the Jews of Europe was immeasureably worse, but the sentiment is exactly the same. Failing to provide all citizens equal protection of the law, and exploiting a minority group for political advantage.

Absent Diane9:40 am 09 Jun 06

not allowing them the same rights as everyone else is the next worse thing… a little thing called discrimination…

but then again we live in a country where most people are ignorant beyond belief and obviously have no problem consistenly voting in these fundamentalist wankers.. so it doesn’t really suprise me….idiots

Boomacat, I wasn’t aware that the Commonwealth was going to start gassing gays and lesbians in Australia!

I think comparing the mass genocide of Jews in Europe and gay rights in Australia is a little stupid, don’t you?

There will be no showdown. earring boy can rush all he likes. He might need to check the Constitution once again. Like it or not the Federales will win in a canter.

I thought Standope had a legal background. He didnt learn much at uni did he, Con Law is the 2nd subject

Mr Evil, I wonder if Hitler told the Jews to stop blabbing on about their PC ‘equal rights before the law’ crap while he led them to the gas chambers?

It’s hardly an unimportant issue, it’s in fact fundamental to our existence as a civilised society.

I thought they only ever used electro-shock therapy to cure gays?

Absent Diane5:23 pm 08 Jun 06

Can it cure gay people… make them straight.. you know…the poor sick bastards

This is a perfect time to market my gay-proof al-foil wedding hats. Guaranteed to keep your vows safe from homo-influence.

That’s it! The G&L’s are secretly out to get everyone else… quick RUN!!

But by letting them (G&Ls) marry it will undermine the foundation of our (straight white anglo saxon conservative f*@ksticks) marriages.

–I love that one. Maybe there is some sort of quantum mechanics based relatioship that I don’t know about where one gay marriage affects the probability of the best man shagging the bride in a straight marriage.

Touché AD, my thoughts exactly. especially the whole state/religion thing.

Absent Diane4:45 pm 08 Jun 06

religion and state in an ideal world should be completely seperate. the anti-civil union push from the federal governwank is a religous driven agenda.. and we as a multicultural country should not have that rubbish forced down our throat..

I also think it is an abuse of power that the feds intervene in a local matter of such small significance…. it doesn’t really impact anyone.. it just gives our rainbow friends a few more rights… hardly a big one

Well, God’s self-appointed representatives don’t like them. God himself has been remarkably silent on the whole topic.

“I’m disappointed… this shouldn’t even be an issue.

Why shouldn’t everyone have the same rights?”

Because God doesn’t like them?????

How ironic. They foist self gov’t on us, after we voted against it.
Then, when we attempt to self govern, they pull the mat back.

I guess we are allowed to run the lawnmowers to make the grass nice for parliament, but not do anything much else.

“politicians publicly airing their views” was a general question re AD’s comment about john howard and his “facist christian regime” not the original post. derr.

Equality hardly deserves the (now) pejorative label of being PC.
Why should the G&L community escape the lifelong pain of marriage?
Legislation that is derisively labelled in this forum as “social engineering” such as the legislation in question, the smoking stuff and the B of R is probably quite cheap, (just a new graduate lawyers doing a bit of drafting and a couple of meetings), compared with capital works projects.

Re: “politicians publicly airing their views” isn’t part of their brief? Bit strange if you go to an election not knowing what a candidate’s position on issues is, part of leading rather than following.

I’m disappointed… this shouldn’t even be an issue.

Why shouldn’t everyone have the same rights?

Mr Evil – oh the horror! Someone’s being nice to the bum-pirates and forcing us to (gasp!) treat them like human beings.

The arboretum, the bill of rights and the busway are a waste of money; but there’s no way in the world this is IMO.

The ACT population’s right to self-determination seems pretty important to me.

Absent Diane3:09 pm 08 Jun 06

I think issues like these are important… its about reducing the impact of religion on society, and changing mindsets.. bigger picture kind of stuff.. not small fry rubbish like stanhopes a c&nt because he has a stupid haircut and sometimes leans to the left side of politics..

you obviuosly don’t give a crap about anything further than your own backyard, so maybe instead of spending 2 minutes out of your precious day whinging on a post you don’t care about, you could f*#k off and let the rest of us use our time here contructively.

In how it directly relates to you and me perhaps but not if you’re gay and your partner has cancer (for example).

Um, hello; aren’t there slighty more important issues for the ACT Govt to be worrying about than this PC crap????

is it really right that politicians are allowed to publicly share their views, and possibly steer their country towards whatever religion they believe, or believe that people will respond to?

i hate that.

Absent Diane1:36 pm 08 Jun 06

I just wish john howard and his facist christian regime would all declare the christian equivalent to jihad on themselves and drink a big fcking vat of cyanide….

man thats one angry paragraph…

I suspect we might need two other floor crossers, the Family First senator is likely to vote with the government.

It depends on whether it needs an absolute majority to disallow the action of the executive council, or whether it needs an absolute majority to endorse it (ie if the Senate vote is tied, which way does the result go?).

But where is the one other floor crosser going to come from? Whos the NT’s CLP senator?

I’ll say it again, I hope the god botherers get the ass on this one.

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