Glebe Park is not for Floriade – it's a park!

Ghettosmurf87 said :

dungfungus said :

The subject of speed limits on the Tuggeranong Parkway related to cars, not bicycles (you referred to drivers, not riders). As you are aware, the legal limit on the Parkway for cars is 100KMH.
Now, please tell me what is the legal limit for cyclists on shared paths.
I saw someone on an electric mountain bike on a roadway at the weekend – speed was at least 50 kmh – much too fast.

The legal limit on the Parkway for ALL vehicles is 100Km/h. If the electric bicycle you observed was on a motorway, then I don’t see why 50Km/h is too fast unless the speed limit of the road was less than 50Km/h? Why would there be a different speed limit for cyclists on a road as there is for cars, when they are operating legally as vehicles on the same surface? May as well have different speed limits for motorbikes/4WD/utes/hatchbacks/busses/trucks…

Ummm…there already is different speed limits for different road users. P-platers have different speed limits to full licence holders as do heavy vehicles such as trucks.

Not sure what any of this has to do with moving Floriade from Commonwealth Park to Glebe Park?

dungfungus said :

Maya123 said :

dungfungus said :

Maya123 said :

dungfungus said :

Maya123 said :

dungfungus said :

Maya123 said :

Postalgeek said :

Maya123 said :

Glebe Park to me is too small and unsuitable. If Commonwealth Park is no longer available, a suggestion would be Telopea Park and Bowen Park combined. Lake frontage and near the bus markets, which could be utilised during the event. Buses run along Wentworth Avenue. Plus Kingston Shops are close. Plus some hotels.

You think it’s possible that Bowen could be used without the main safe cycle route to Kingston/Manuka/Inner South being closed off for several months(not to mention the Lake loop)?

The cycle path could still operate. Fence it off to stop people wandering across it. People could still ride or walk along it. Besides, a new path is to be constructed along the lake’s shore, which would free up the park.

Is that “main safe cycle route” an exclusive thoroughfare for cyclists or a shared path?
If it is the first by all means fence it off but if it is indeed a shared path, speed limits should be enforced and speed humps introduced.

It was built in the 1970s as a cycle way, but was never legislated as that, so as for all paths in Canberra it is a shared path. (It should be remembered that it likely wouldn’t exist, but for bicycles.) People who want to walk along this, only usually have a problem with sharing when they refuse to keep left and don’t check before changing direction, wear earphones so they can’t hear bells and warning shouts, and have their dogs not fully under control with too long a lead and the like. Otherwise, there is usually no conflict.
I do believe though for the busiest sections, there should be segregated paths. But, how to keep people walking off the cycle path, even though there will be a neighbouring pedestrian path, will be tricky.
It is a main cycle route, the closest for people cycling as main road routes, such as the Tuggeranong Parkway, are for people driving. How would it feel if someone suggested lowering the speed limit for the Tuggeranong Parkway and adding speed humps?

There are already speed restrictions and radar cameras on the Tuggeranong Parkway – speed bumps not required.
Didn’t I read somewhere on this blog that the speed limit for cyclists on shared paths was 10KMH?

I think I read somewhere that the speed limit on the Tuggeranong Parkway is 30kph.

Both are wrong.

So, what are the correct speed limits (according to you)?

Um, perhaps 30kms for both the cycleway and the Tuggeranong Parkway. If you think a person cycling should only be able to travel home and to work at 10kms (that’s an hour’s journey for ten kms. Two hours for twenty kms.), why shouldn’t the people in cars have to travel slowly too?
Seriously though, I have rarely, if ever, found people cycling past me as I walk along the path a worry. But that’s because I walk along the very left edge of the shared path and check the traffic before I change direction. People who complain about people cycling past are likely those (too many) I see not keeping on the left edge of the path and making sudden changes in direction without considering other path users. I even saw a group of people walking side by side right across the width of the path yell at a passing cyclist that they had more rights than the cyclist to be there. And this right beside by a sign directing everyone to keep left and not block the path for others.
As for a top speed limit. Very few people on bikes can and do reach dangerous speeds. The odd person might speed. Wow, how often do some cars speed. But most people are careful. The speeds that are happening now are mostly fine. Electric bikes are becoming more popular. I believe many of the motors cut out at 25kph.

The subject of speed limits on the Tuggeranong Parkway related to cars, not bicycles (you referred to drivers, not riders). As you are aware, the legal limit on the Parkway for cars is 100KMH.
Now, please tell me what is the legal limit for cyclists on shared paths.
I saw someone on an electric mountain bike on a roadway at the weekend – speed was at least 50 kmh – much too fast.

As far as I am aware there is no speed limit for people on bicycles, I guess because most people on bicycles can’t get to dangerous speeds, especially on our rough, badly maintained shared paths. If an electric bicycle was going “at least 50 kmh” (you have something to accurately measure the speed, do you, to be certain of this?), either the rider was an unusually fit athlete, or the electric bicycle was not legal. Electric bikes are regulated and limited in power, if they are legal.
Why are you concerned about a non problem? If you are finding a problem with your interaction with people on bicycles, might I suggest that you should consider what in your behaviour might be contributing to this. I say this, because I have never had a problem when sharing the paths when walking, with bicycles. Last night for instance, I was walking along a shared path in peak hour (people going home from work), as bicycles passed me, but as I was walking on the very left edge of the path, even the swiftest bike was not a hazard. In fact I received several friendly smiles and waves. I hope this wasn’t because my consideration in where I walked was not the average. I like to think that my fellow walkers are more considerate than that; however sadly from my observations, this isn’t always the case. And then they have the audacity to blame people on bicycles.

dungfungus said :

The subject of speed limits on the Tuggeranong Parkway related to cars, not bicycles (you referred to drivers, not riders). As you are aware, the legal limit on the Parkway for cars is 100KMH.
Now, please tell me what is the legal limit for cyclists on shared paths.
I saw someone on an electric mountain bike on a roadway at the weekend – speed was at least 50 kmh – much too fast.

The legal limit on the Parkway for ALL vehicles is 100Km/h. If the electric bicycle you observed was on a motorway, then I don’t see why 50Km/h is too fast unless the speed limit of the road was less than 50Km/h? Why would there be a different speed limit for cyclists on a road as there is for cars, when they are operating legally as vehicles on the same surface? May as well have different speed limits for motorbikes/4WD/utes/hatchbacks/busses/trucks…

As to the speed limit on shared paths, I am not aware if there is one. Perhaps someone could check, rather than wild speculation?

It seems to me that the only reason Glebe Park was mooted was because Civic traders are lobbying for it to be near them. But to me that aspect is irrelevant – people will travel to Floriade, wherever it is, just as they do now, and a number never go into Civic afterwards now (I certainly don’t – in fact I simply avoid Civic these days because of the excessive pay parking regime).
Wherever Floriade is located, you would need space for temporary parking (which hopefully will be free instead of the last couple of years’ gouging) and bus and coach access. Most suggested options are far better than Glebe Park for this. For example, Weston Park has loads of space and is already a gorgeous, horticulturally suitable location. Further, it is practically smack bang in the middle of Canberra, and on LBG. People can be encouraged to travel to the new location on special buses, just as they are now.

Maya123 said :

dungfungus said :

Maya123 said :

dungfungus said :

Maya123 said :

dungfungus said :

Maya123 said :

Postalgeek said :

Maya123 said :

Glebe Park to me is too small and unsuitable. If Commonwealth Park is no longer available, a suggestion would be Telopea Park and Bowen Park combined. Lake frontage and near the bus markets, which could be utilised during the event. Buses run along Wentworth Avenue. Plus Kingston Shops are close. Plus some hotels.

You think it’s possible that Bowen could be used without the main safe cycle route to Kingston/Manuka/Inner South being closed off for several months(not to mention the Lake loop)?

The cycle path could still operate. Fence it off to stop people wandering across it. People could still ride or walk along it. Besides, a new path is to be constructed along the lake’s shore, which would free up the park.

Is that “main safe cycle route” an exclusive thoroughfare for cyclists or a shared path?
If it is the first by all means fence it off but if it is indeed a shared path, speed limits should be enforced and speed humps introduced.

It was built in the 1970s as a cycle way, but was never legislated as that, so as for all paths in Canberra it is a shared path. (It should be remembered that it likely wouldn’t exist, but for bicycles.) People who want to walk along this, only usually have a problem with sharing when they refuse to keep left and don’t check before changing direction, wear earphones so they can’t hear bells and warning shouts, and have their dogs not fully under control with too long a lead and the like. Otherwise, there is usually no conflict.
I do believe though for the busiest sections, there should be segregated paths. But, how to keep people walking off the cycle path, even though there will be a neighbouring pedestrian path, will be tricky.
It is a main cycle route, the closest for people cycling as main road routes, such as the Tuggeranong Parkway, are for people driving. How would it feel if someone suggested lowering the speed limit for the Tuggeranong Parkway and adding speed humps?

There are already speed restrictions and radar cameras on the Tuggeranong Parkway – speed bumps not required.
Didn’t I read somewhere on this blog that the speed limit for cyclists on shared paths was 10KMH?

I think I read somewhere that the speed limit on the Tuggeranong Parkway is 30kph.

Both are wrong.

So, what are the correct speed limits (according to you)?

Um, perhaps 30kms for both the cycleway and the Tuggeranong Parkway. If you think a person cycling should only be able to travel home and to work at 10kms (that’s an hour’s journey for ten kms. Two hours for twenty kms.), why shouldn’t the people in cars have to travel slowly too?
Seriously though, I have rarely, if ever, found people cycling past me as I walk along the path a worry. But that’s because I walk along the very left edge of the shared path and check the traffic before I change direction. People who complain about people cycling past are likely those (too many) I see not keeping on the left edge of the path and making sudden changes in direction without considering other path users. I even saw a group of people walking side by side right across the width of the path yell at a passing cyclist that they had more rights than the cyclist to be there. And this right beside by a sign directing everyone to keep left and not block the path for others.
As for a top speed limit. Very few people on bikes can and do reach dangerous speeds. The odd person might speed. Wow, how often do some cars speed. But most people are careful. The speeds that are happening now are mostly fine. Electric bikes are becoming more popular. I believe many of the motors cut out at 25kph.

The subject of speed limits on the Tuggeranong Parkway related to cars, not bicycles (you referred to drivers, not riders). As you are aware, the legal limit on the Parkway for cars is 100KMH.
Now, please tell me what is the legal limit for cyclists on shared paths.
I saw someone on an electric mountain bike on a roadway at the weekend – speed was at least 50 kmh – much too fast.

dungfungus said :

Maya123 said :

dungfungus said :

Maya123 said :

dungfungus said :

Maya123 said :

Postalgeek said :

Maya123 said :

Glebe Park to me is too small and unsuitable. If Commonwealth Park is no longer available, a suggestion would be Telopea Park and Bowen Park combined. Lake frontage and near the bus markets, which could be utilised during the event. Buses run along Wentworth Avenue. Plus Kingston Shops are close. Plus some hotels.

You think it’s possible that Bowen could be used without the main safe cycle route to Kingston/Manuka/Inner South being closed off for several months(not to mention the Lake loop)?

The cycle path could still operate. Fence it off to stop people wandering across it. People could still ride or walk along it. Besides, a new path is to be constructed along the lake’s shore, which would free up the park.

Is that “main safe cycle route” an exclusive thoroughfare for cyclists or a shared path?
If it is the first by all means fence it off but if it is indeed a shared path, speed limits should be enforced and speed humps introduced.

It was built in the 1970s as a cycle way, but was never legislated as that, so as for all paths in Canberra it is a shared path. (It should be remembered that it likely wouldn’t exist, but for bicycles.) People who want to walk along this, only usually have a problem with sharing when they refuse to keep left and don’t check before changing direction, wear earphones so they can’t hear bells and warning shouts, and have their dogs not fully under control with too long a lead and the like. Otherwise, there is usually no conflict.
I do believe though for the busiest sections, there should be segregated paths. But, how to keep people walking off the cycle path, even though there will be a neighbouring pedestrian path, will be tricky.
It is a main cycle route, the closest for people cycling as main road routes, such as the Tuggeranong Parkway, are for people driving. How would it feel if someone suggested lowering the speed limit for the Tuggeranong Parkway and adding speed humps?

There are already speed restrictions and radar cameras on the Tuggeranong Parkway – speed bumps not required.
Didn’t I read somewhere on this blog that the speed limit for cyclists on shared paths was 10KMH?

I think I read somewhere that the speed limit on the Tuggeranong Parkway is 30kph.

Both are wrong.

So, what are the correct speed limits (according to you)?

Um, perhaps 30kms for both the cycleway and the Tuggeranong Parkway. If you think a person cycling should only be able to travel home and to work at 10kms (that’s an hour’s journey for ten kms. Two hours for twenty kms.), why shouldn’t the people in cars have to travel slowly too?
Seriously though, I have rarely, if ever, found people cycling past me as I walk along the path a worry. But that’s because I walk along the very left edge of the shared path and check the traffic before I change direction. People who complain about people cycling past are likely those (too many) I see not keeping on the left edge of the path and making sudden changes in direction without considering other path users. I even saw a group of people walking side by side right across the width of the path yell at a passing cyclist that they had more rights than the cyclist to be there. And this right beside by a sign directing everyone to keep left and not block the path for others.
As for a top speed limit. Very few people on bikes can and do reach dangerous speeds. The odd person might speed. Wow, how often do some cars speed. But most people are careful. The speeds that are happening now are mostly fine. Electric bikes are becoming more popular. I believe many of the motors cut out at 25kph.

Maya123 said :

dungfungus said :

Maya123 said :

dungfungus said :

Maya123 said :

Postalgeek said :

Maya123 said :

Glebe Park to me is too small and unsuitable. If Commonwealth Park is no longer available, a suggestion would be Telopea Park and Bowen Park combined. Lake frontage and near the bus markets, which could be utilised during the event. Buses run along Wentworth Avenue. Plus Kingston Shops are close. Plus some hotels.

You think it’s possible that Bowen could be used without the main safe cycle route to Kingston/Manuka/Inner South being closed off for several months(not to mention the Lake loop)?

The cycle path could still operate. Fence it off to stop people wandering across it. People could still ride or walk along it. Besides, a new path is to be constructed along the lake’s shore, which would free up the park.

Is that “main safe cycle route” an exclusive thoroughfare for cyclists or a shared path?
If it is the first by all means fence it off but if it is indeed a shared path, speed limits should be enforced and speed humps introduced.

It was built in the 1970s as a cycle way, but was never legislated as that, so as for all paths in Canberra it is a shared path. (It should be remembered that it likely wouldn’t exist, but for bicycles.) People who want to walk along this, only usually have a problem with sharing when they refuse to keep left and don’t check before changing direction, wear earphones so they can’t hear bells and warning shouts, and have their dogs not fully under control with too long a lead and the like. Otherwise, there is usually no conflict.
I do believe though for the busiest sections, there should be segregated paths. But, how to keep people walking off the cycle path, even though there will be a neighbouring pedestrian path, will be tricky.
It is a main cycle route, the closest for people cycling as main road routes, such as the Tuggeranong Parkway, are for people driving. How would it feel if someone suggested lowering the speed limit for the Tuggeranong Parkway and adding speed humps?

There are already speed restrictions and radar cameras on the Tuggeranong Parkway – speed bumps not required.
Didn’t I read somewhere on this blog that the speed limit for cyclists on shared paths was 10KMH?

I think I read somewhere that the speed limit on the Tuggeranong Parkway is 30kph.

Both are wrong.

So, what are the correct speed limits (according to you)?

dungfungus said :

Maya123 said :

dungfungus said :

Maya123 said :

Postalgeek said :

Maya123 said :

Glebe Park to me is too small and unsuitable. If Commonwealth Park is no longer available, a suggestion would be Telopea Park and Bowen Park combined. Lake frontage and near the bus markets, which could be utilised during the event. Buses run along Wentworth Avenue. Plus Kingston Shops are close. Plus some hotels.

You think it’s possible that Bowen could be used without the main safe cycle route to Kingston/Manuka/Inner South being closed off for several months(not to mention the Lake loop)?

The cycle path could still operate. Fence it off to stop people wandering across it. People could still ride or walk along it. Besides, a new path is to be constructed along the lake’s shore, which would free up the park.

Is that “main safe cycle route” an exclusive thoroughfare for cyclists or a shared path?
If it is the first by all means fence it off but if it is indeed a shared path, speed limits should be enforced and speed humps introduced.

It was built in the 1970s as a cycle way, but was never legislated as that, so as for all paths in Canberra it is a shared path. (It should be remembered that it likely wouldn’t exist, but for bicycles.) People who want to walk along this, only usually have a problem with sharing when they refuse to keep left and don’t check before changing direction, wear earphones so they can’t hear bells and warning shouts, and have their dogs not fully under control with too long a lead and the like. Otherwise, there is usually no conflict.
I do believe though for the busiest sections, there should be segregated paths. But, how to keep people walking off the cycle path, even though there will be a neighbouring pedestrian path, will be tricky.
It is a main cycle route, the closest for people cycling as main road routes, such as the Tuggeranong Parkway, are for people driving. How would it feel if someone suggested lowering the speed limit for the Tuggeranong Parkway and adding speed humps?

There are already speed restrictions and radar cameras on the Tuggeranong Parkway – speed bumps not required.
Didn’t I read somewhere on this blog that the speed limit for cyclists on shared paths was 10KMH?

I think I read somewhere that the speed limit on the Tuggeranong Parkway is 30kph.

Both are wrong.

watto23 said :

If its moved, its going to have to be at one of 5 locations IMO. Weston Park, Yarramundi Reach, Black Mountain Peninsula, Kings Park or Stirling Park. None are close to existing public transport options, no carparking remotely close either.

Kings Park though is probably the best solution. Heaps of defence parking across the road, great for weekends, bad for weekdays.

The current location is close to public transport hub of civic, close to plenty of parking (despite what some think). Gelebe park is too small. However Kings park could work with the lightrail extension perhaps?

Also I’ve wonder why there isn’t a ferry service on during Floriade? surely that would be useful, allow people to park at various spots around the lake and catch the ferry to Floriade wherever it is held?

That would have to be a Car Ferry. We established early on in one of the other forums that most people consider it socially unacceptable to be asked to get out of their cars.

Maya123 said :

dungfungus said :

Maya123 said :

Postalgeek said :

Maya123 said :

Glebe Park to me is too small and unsuitable. If Commonwealth Park is no longer available, a suggestion would be Telopea Park and Bowen Park combined. Lake frontage and near the bus markets, which could be utilised during the event. Buses run along Wentworth Avenue. Plus Kingston Shops are close. Plus some hotels.

You think it’s possible that Bowen could be used without the main safe cycle route to Kingston/Manuka/Inner South being closed off for several months(not to mention the Lake loop)?

The cycle path could still operate. Fence it off to stop people wandering across it. People could still ride or walk along it. Besides, a new path is to be constructed along the lake’s shore, which would free up the park.

Is that “main safe cycle route” an exclusive thoroughfare for cyclists or a shared path?
If it is the first by all means fence it off but if it is indeed a shared path, speed limits should be enforced and speed humps introduced.

It was built in the 1970s as a cycle way, but was never legislated as that, so as for all paths in Canberra it is a shared path. (It should be remembered that it likely wouldn’t exist, but for bicycles.) People who want to walk along this, only usually have a problem with sharing when they refuse to keep left and don’t check before changing direction, wear earphones so they can’t hear bells and warning shouts, and have their dogs not fully under control with too long a lead and the like. Otherwise, there is usually no conflict.
I do believe though for the busiest sections, there should be segregated paths. But, how to keep people walking off the cycle path, even though there will be a neighbouring pedestrian path, will be tricky.
It is a main cycle route, the closest for people cycling as main road routes, such as the Tuggeranong Parkway, are for people driving. How would it feel if someone suggested lowering the speed limit for the Tuggeranong Parkway and adding speed humps?

There are already speed restrictions and radar cameras on the Tuggeranong Parkway – speed bumps not required.
Didn’t I read somewhere on this blog that the speed limit for cyclists on shared paths was 10KMH?