How (not) to share the road

Publicserpent 16 August 2013 70

If the middle-aged brunette driver of the Nissan X-Trail (YDY 34C) that felt the need to blast their horn at me – while traveling through the roundabout between McCaughey and Masson Streets – would like to explain what point you were trying to make, I’d be much obliged.

Another shining example of tolerance on Canberra’s roads!

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70 Responses to How (not) to share the road
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Jim Jones Jim Jones 9:20 am 28 Aug 13

CraigT said :

rigseismic67 said :

Being a road user you are meant to be tolerant of other road users, something you are obviously not. Regardless of her horn you should learn to share the road
You don’t own the road, only share it with the rest of us.

But being a cyclist means he delights in obstructing other people and holding them up.

So ‘sharing the roads’ = get out of my way I’m a motorist.

:golfclap:

CraigT CraigT 6:34 am 28 Aug 13

rigseismic67 said :

Being a road user you are meant to be tolerant of other road users, something you are obviously not. Regardless of her horn you should learn to share the road
You don’t own the road, only share it with the rest of us.

But being a cyclist means he delights in obstructing other people and holding them up.

Aeek Aeek 12:28 am 28 Aug 13

As an example of sharing, MacArthur Avenue is 2 lanes but often light traffic. When I notice the only vehicle behind me is signalling left I LOVE to shift to the right lane. It’s pure win win.

Aeek Aeek 11:58 pm 27 Aug 13

rigseismic67 said :

Being a road user you are meant to be tolerant of other road users, something you are obviously not. Regardless of her horn you should learn to share the road
You don’t own the road, only share it with the rest of us.

As a cyclist, I’m all about sharing the road. I just don’t get how being attacked with a horn or threatened with over 1 tonne of metal is sharing.

rigseismic67 rigseismic67 9:40 pm 27 Aug 13

Being a road user you are meant to be tolerant of other road users, something you are obviously not. Regardless of her horn you should learn to share the road
You don’t own the road, only share it with the rest of us.

thebrownstreak69 thebrownstreak69 10:39 am 19 Aug 13

One thing I find interesting about threads like this is the impression that problems are widespread. I’ve walked, ridden and driven around Canberra for a couple of decades now, and never had any problem more serious than having to brake suddenly a few times (both bike and car) because someone did something silly, and that was the end of it. I’ve never once had a problem with either bikes or cars while I was a pedestrian. All in all, I’d say that was a pretty good outcome.

Holden Caulfield Holden Caulfield 10:12 am 19 Aug 13

davecdp said :

I don’t understand why bike riders don’t use the paths? Its safer and more relaxing that trying to fit in with cars especially on these smaller streets. If this roundabout is where I think it is, i’m pretty sure there is one of the good larger bitumen bike paths on this route. If it makes your commute quicker to use the road your being a bit of a hypocrite because most of you are telling the cars they should slow down and don’t rush their commute…..

As a general rule I would agree with you. However, in this instance the cycle path you’re thinking of runs perpendicular to the route the OP is taking.

Postalgeek Postalgeek 9:54 am 19 Aug 13

Weatherman said :

The cyclist was riding on the road, when there is a footpath nearby and it is also legal in the ACT to cycle on footpaths. The lane width on many roads were not designed for accommodating both a bike and a car, whilst there is oncoming traffic. That’s the actual situation, despite all the hoopla about how we should be sharing roads.

The Dutch solution to have cycle paths segregated is the most logical solution. No risk of collision.

I’ll get my quoting right this time :-/

Yes, segregated cycle paths would be the ideal solutions.

There are several problems with paths that lead to cyclists using parallel roads.

A major one is right-of-way. A footpath running parallel to a trunk road will be dissected by all side roads, and a cyclist will have to give way at every cross-over point, expending far more energy accelerating each time than they would if they cycled on the trunk road, where they would have right-of-way. No motorist would use a parallel side road with give ways at every single intersection if they had the option to use the trunk road, and they are expending far less energy than cyclists.

Cyclists leaving paths to crossing road are also very vulnerable to turning traffic, especially coming from behind. Head checks for cyclists are much trickier than for drivers as they can affect balance and line much more, and motorists, while they are expected to be situationally aware, are generally looking for other cars on the road. Being on the road in bright colours puts you in a more prominent position to negotiate these intersections, in theory.

Then there are the driveways and lane ways that dissect paths, and the myriad hedges, walls, and fences that conceal cyclists and reversing vehicles from one another. Not to mention all the obstructions in the form of overgrowth and vehicles parked across footpaths.

The pedestrian traffic on footpaths is anarchic and follows no hard and fast rules. At least cars have a set of rules that makes their actions more predictable, again in theory.

Paths also might also take rambling lines, diverge away, or there are limited access points, or the cyclist intends to turn right, or other indirections.

And then there’s path quality, which doesn’t matter much on some bikes, like MTBs, but can make it very unpleasant for someone riding on slimline road tyres running at 110+ psi.

Cyclists don’t want to mix with cars anymore than cars want to mix with cyclists, but until everyone gets what they want, the mixing will continue.

jase! jase! 9:49 am 19 Aug 13

magiccar9 said :

Why is it always up to drivers to make the compromise?
Why can’t the cyclist be considerate and stay as close to the left as possible (or better yet use the paths build for them)?

Is it really that bad for everyone to make an effort? No, it’s common sense. So just use it.

I will ride as far over to the left as is safe, I’m not going to ride in the gutter just because it is possible, I’m not going to ride in an area where I can be hit by opening doors just to “keep as far left as possible”. If the bike paths go where I need to go I am happy to use them. If the video above is a car driver ‘making an effort’ then it is probably better if they didn’t

Postalgeek Postalgeek 9:06 am 19 Aug 13

TheBusDriver said :

Common sense says you don’t suddenly dart right in front of a car behind you.

Where’s the darting? He’s riding a straight line through the apexes of the curves of the –>single lane<– roundabout like many drivers and motorcyclist would do, doing head checks and drifting away from the curb in the lead up to the roundabout to own the intersection before returning to the left after negotiating the roundabout.

The only person who would resent that and honk is an asshat intending to overtake in a single lane roundabout while breaking the three-second buffer rule and ignoring all indications of intent. The driver's not honking as a courtesy; I don't believe anyone is genuinely naive enough to believe that. The car doesn't even honk until he's half-way through the intersection.

Why is it always up to drivers to make the compromise?
Why can't the cyclist be considerate and stay as close to the left as possible (or better yet use the paths build for them)? Why can't parents keep their children (or pets) away from roads (like responsible parents should)?

Is it really that bad for everyone to make an effort? No, it’s common sense. So just use it.

Mainly because the majority of the time it’s drivers operating their heavy machinery at speed in urban areas who are at fault, and cause the overwhelming majority of carnage on the road overall, especially the ones who have an over-inflated opinion of their own driving skills.

Most other road users like cyclists and pedestrians already know this and compromise, staying left, waiting for you to pass, using pedestrian crossings instead stepping straight out in front of you. You’re just too blind to see it.

davecdp davecdp 8:45 am 19 Aug 13

johnboy said :

Have you ridden on a footpath?

Between the gaps, cracks, pedestrians, and cars pulling out behind fences it’s not an option for anything but the shortest of trips

Yep i ride a few times a week to work, the majority is on the smoother bitumen bike paths and about 5 streets on the paths in front of houses. You just have to ride to the conditions when around pedestrians and fences etc. Still don’t think the condition of the paths and saving a bit of time is worth putting myself at risk on the road.

Weatherman Weatherman 6:20 am 19 Aug 13

The cyclist was riding on the road, when there is a footpath nearby and it is also legal in the ACT to cycle on footpaths. The lane width on many roads were not designed for accommodating both a bike and a car, whilst there is oncoming traffic. That’s the actual situation, despite all the hoopla about how we should be sharing roads.

The Dutch solution to have cycle paths segregated is the most logical solution. No risk of collision.

magiccar9 magiccar9 6:17 am 19 Aug 13

BimboGeek said :

Ok here are the rules of intelligent driving.

If you see one kangaroo look out for her family.

If you come up behind a cyclist riding somewhere that it’s not brilliant to overtake or if there’s someone coming the other way, just wait a few moments or a hundred metres and then pull out.

Check gor cyclists when exiting a busy road. Again if you need to brake for a moment, big whoop.

Slow to a crawl if you see children playing near the road. Or dogs off leash.

Is it really so bad being in your car with your air con and your thoughts and your favourite music? No, it’s lovely. So just enjoy it.

Why is it always up to drivers to make the compromise?
Why can’t the cyclist be considerate and stay as close to the left as possible (or better yet use the paths build for them)? Why can’t parents keep their children (or pets) away from roads (like responsible parents should)?

Is it really that bad for everyone to make an effort? No, it’s common sense. So just use it.

c_c™ c_c™ 1:09 am 19 Aug 13

TheBusDriver said :

Okay, let me clarify my post. I did not and do not advocate overtaking in round abouts. What I said was that with the bike on the left, the driver could safely overtake, I meant on a straight stretch of road. Even well before before and after a round about, the driver can safely overtake, because the cyclist is not in their line of travel. Suddenly, with no warning, the cyclist gets right in the car’s line of travel. It is kind of like when you are on double lane road and the car just in front of you in the left lane chnges to the lane right in front of you with no warning. If something goes wrong with that car you have the potential to have an accident. The same with the cyclist, they’re suddenly right in front of the car and if the shit hits the fan, they have the potential to be under the car.
Now all you trolls and egotists put away your crap and see reality for what it is. The cyclist did something stupid. The car driver was doing them a favor.

Last person anyone should take driving advice from is a bus driver frankly, though it’s probably a tie with taxi drivers.

nhand42 nhand42 11:09 pm 18 Aug 13

johnboy said :

Have you ridden on a footpath? Between the gaps, cracks, pedestrians, and cars pulling out behind fences it’s not an option for anything but the shortest of trips

Have you ever driven on a road? Between the potholes and cyclists it’s not an option for anyth… stop me if you’ve heard this before.

nhand42 nhand42 11:07 pm 18 Aug 13

So I get that bicycles are now fully legal road vehicles, with the same rights to the road as cars and motorbikes and trucks.

What other vehicles are allowed? Can I ride my skateboard on the road? How about rollerblades? A pedal-powered kart?

Inquiring minds would like to know.

BimboGeek BimboGeek 10:27 pm 18 Aug 13

What eucy said. If I’m riding where it’s not safe for you to overtake me, I won’t let you pass for a few seconds. Or if I’m riding along a busy road and there’s an exit I will be saying prayers because I’m scared.

You frighten us with your road rage. I take care not to be that guy when I’m driving (which is most of the time, lately).

Aeek Aeek 10:06 pm 18 Aug 13

TheBusDriver said :

I think if you stuck to the curb when there are vehicles right behind you,

The curb is death to an aware cyclist. You give away any chance of escape.

Aeek Aeek 9:06 pm 18 Aug 13

johnboy said :

Have you ridden on a footpath?

Between the gaps, cracks, pedestrians, and cars pulling out behind fences

Ironically, path has right of way over driveway but sadly too many drivers are oblivious to that.
(not many fences in Canberra but shrubbery blocks sight-lines well enough)

TheBusDriver TheBusDriver 6:39 pm 18 Aug 13

I didn’t say the rider was doing anything illegal, or that they didn’t have the right to “take ownership” of the road, I said ithey did something stupid. Sure, they might have every legal right to ride like that, but if there is a car following close behind, and the cyclist suddenly darts into the middle of the road like this rider did, that is obviously stupid.
Sure cars are not supposed to overtake on round abouts, but as I know, they do. This car obviously overtook just after the round about. Meaning it was pretty close behind the bike as they entered the round about. Suppose the cyclist slipped and fell? Would they then take ownership for the car running them over because they did something stupid?
Yes there is right, and wrong, but it it is all good and well thinking “wow, I’m in the right” as you get run over for doing something stupid.
I understand where the cyclists are coming from, but as a professional driver I see so many accidents caused by people ‘in the right’ pushing that to the point of it becoming dangerous driving and then an accident. There’s right and there’s common sense. Common sense says you don’t suddenly dart right in front of a car behind you. Personally I’d rather excercise caution than exercise ownership of the road because one day that ownership is going to get you run over where as the caution won’t.

jase! said :

TheBusDriver said :

The cyclist did something stupid. The car driver was doing them a favor.

no they didn’t. the rider took ownership of their part of the road before the roundabout to ensure their safety through it and no amount of name calling to those that disagree with you will change that fact

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