Jury Service

Watson said :

HenryBG said :

Watson said :

I turned on 666 today and the first sentence I heard was: “Research has shown that wealthy people are more inclined to break the law because they have a real sense of entitlement.”

OR, people are wealthy because they are less inclined to consider others and more likely to take risks and trample a few (poor) people underfoot in the process.

Not many of the benefits of our civilisation were provided to poor people.

Sense of entitlement x100.

The give-away there is the meaningless leftie jargon – “sense of entitlement” is a verbal weapon in the leftie war against everybody they suffer envy of.

They do not let facts intrude and that’s what makes believing in this “sense of entitlement” a text-book example of “political correctness”.

Let me give you a fact from the real world: Alexander Fleming was rich. Poor people all over the world live much longer and healthier lives as a result of Alexander Fleming’s work.

And there are millions more examples of how poor people all over the world today benefit from what they have been given by the world’s productive minority.

If you want to know what happens when over-educated do-nothings end up in charge – look no further than Soviet Russia – a sick, sick society run by people who were consumed with envy and inferiority complexes.

Incidentally – it is *extremely* poor form to change somebody else’s words and to still pretend you are quoting them.
Presumably you learn this sort of ill-mannered dishonesty in your soft-as-jelly University Arts degrees.

colourful sydney racing identity said :

HenryBG said :

I am rich and I hate the poor

Well, if I were rich I wouldn’t be living in Canberra and I wouldn’t bother working, but, generally, yes – the poor get paid to do nothing, using my taxes.
I’d be much happier if that money was handed over on condition they get themselves neutered first.

HenryBG said :

Watson said :

I turned on 666 today and the first sentence I heard was: “Research has shown that wealthy people are more inclined to break the law because they have a real sense of entitlement.”

OR, people are wealthy because they are less inclined to consider others and more likely to take risks and trample a few (poor) people underfoot in the process.

Not many of the benefits of our civilisation were provided to poor people.

Sense of entitlement x100.

HenryBG said :

I am rich and I hate the poor

Watson said :

I turned on 666 today and the first sentence I heard was: “Research has shown that wealthy people are more inclined to break the law because they have a real sense of entitlement.”

OR, people are wealthy because they are less inclined to follow rules and more likely to take risks and embrace change.

Not many of the benefits of our civilisation were provided by poor people.

Without getting into the intricate ins and outs of each weapon, I couldn’t hit a barn door with an SLR but was pretty bloody good with the Austeyr.

Same with me and the M16 – I was amazed at how little you needed to concentrate to hit target after target after target. It aimed itself.
The SLR needed vastly more concentration, but in my book was well worth it for the effect. Especially at nice long ranges – with the M16, once the bullet started to drop, that was the end of it, but with the SLR you could very confidently aim the dropping bullet.

Watson said :

And hope you never have to appear before a jury…

The keen ones would balance out the unemployed. I’d rather 50% of people don’t want to be there, than 100%

Disinformation said :

As for ballistic comparison, the SS109 round was designed to try and replicate the performance of the 7.62, which required a different center of mass, longer projectile and more aggressive rifling rate of twist compared to a standard .223.

The tighter rifling just compensates a bit for the lack of mass. It’s not in and of itself a good thing.

The SLR’s projectile gave you 840m/s X 25.4g = 21336N.
The Steyr gives you 11446N, not much more than half. This gives you less punch and less range, and increases the value of whatever cover is available to the enemy.

As I see it, the decision was entirely political – the shiny bums in Canberra got it into their heads that a/ they could deliver a much greater *quantity* of 5.56 rounds using the same transport and b/ this silly idea of “compatibility” with our allies.

We worked alongside our allies in Vietnam – and the thing the bad guys learnt in Vietnam was that if somebody was firing at you with an M16, just duck behind a wall or a tree. But, if an Aussie was firing at you with his SLR, forget about that wall or tree being useful protection and get the $#@% out of there.

Yes, the M16 was great on the range – its lightness and gentleness meant you could get off a very high rate of fire (of single, accurate shots) compared with the SLR. But the range isn’t the field, and in the field, the SLR proved itself a great morale-breaker against the enemy. Even an enemy in decent cover could be panicked to move by a well-placed meaty ricochet, not something that works very well with the lighter calibre.

poetix said :

Watson said :

I had a whole rant prepared about community spirit etc, but this is RA so I’ll just move on.

I come for the news but I stay for the rants. Don’t disappoint please. Particularly if it’s that rarest of things, a (mildly) left wing rant.

Just out of interest, do they arrange childcare for people with young children who do jury duty? (That’s a general question not for Watson particularly.)

People who have to look after kiddies are one of the exemptions:
http://www.courts.act.gov.au/supreme/section/view/260#applicationstobeexcused

Watson said :

I had a whole rant prepared about community spirit etc, but this is RA so I’ll just move on.

I come for the news but I stay for the rants. Don’t disappoint please. Particularly if it’s that rarest of things, a (mildly) left wing rant.

Just out of interest, do they arrange childcare for people with young children who do jury duty? (That’s a general question not for Watson particularly.)

I was called for jury duty a week after starting a new job. I did the duty, and worked outside of court times. It isn’t that hard. just because you have been selected for duty doesn’t mean that you will be on a trial. the lawyers can exclude people from a jury, or your name may not be called. just accept that you have been called, front up and see what happens.

in the ACT, it is not unknown to be called again for a second or third jury duty run. Even if your $1400/day job isn’t affected this time around, you may be called in the future.

I turned on 666 today and the first sentence I heard was: “Research has shown that wealthy people are more inclined to break the law because they have a real sense of entitlement.”

It immediately reminded me of this post. In this case it is someone feeling way too important to do his civil duty.

The people I have known who did jury duty were all exited about the opportunity to be part of the democratic process.

Though I do agree that it would be fair to get fair compensation for lost income. But it looks like you are covered after all. I bet you still won’t want to go waste your time and will find some other excuse though.

I had a whole rant prepared about community spirit etc, but this is RA so I’ll just move on.

colourful sydney racing identity said :

OP, it probably would have been better to do some research before getting your panties in a bunch and making a fool of yourself on here.

Section 111 of the Fair Work Act provides that employees (other than casuals) are entitled to be paid for the first 10 days of an absence on jury service less the amount paid by the Court for the employee’s attendance for jury duty…

I tried to point that out to him in #38. There is a form that comes with the jury ‘invite’ that is for employers. The OP would have got that, so should have just read it and handed it onto his employer HR instead of posting here really. I’m assuming he was bored, and by the tone of the OP, looking to stir up people more than get a sensible answer.
If he employs himself or has some tricky employment arrangement (he didn’t say and has no obligation to do so here!) to maximise his salary (by cutting corners on sick leave etc) then it is probably something he should have considered: i.e. the 1 in a million chance of jury duty not being covered in his employment arrangements?
As I said, most people I know that have done jury duty get the jury pay, and their company pays the difference up to their normal salary…. A mate of mine works for one of the stingiest businesses I know and even he got that arrangement!

Henry82 said :

imo we should get the people who want to go, then dilute them with the unemployed.

And hope you never have to appear before a jury…

OP, it probably would have been better to do some research before getting your panties in a bunch and making a fool of yourself on here.

Section 111 of the Fair Work Act provides that employees (other than casuals) are entitled to be paid for the first 10 days of an absence on jury service less the amount paid by the Court for the employee’s attendance for jury duty…

The problem would be solved if the payment rate by the court had been meaningfully updated since 1956 or whenever it was set. Its not the job of employees or employers to subsidise the court system – they should be fully compensated for participating.

Given that average weekly ordinary time earnings in Australia are around the $1,330 mark, something like $260/day is where the rate ought to be if it had kept pace with reality.

Disinformation said :

How’s that for off topic? Being in the Armed Services can get you out of Jury Duty too..

Nicely off topic 🙂

I missed out on my cuff rate with the SLR when it was declared that the test firing I did was null and void as the Steyr was being introduced. Did the cross training, but then had to wait to certify with it untill all the upper decks guys were qualified. So, I learnt to blow things up instead. Duffbowl make big boom-boom 😀

Back to jury duty… never had to perform it.

“You’re poor”

Oh zing. Great riposte. You totally got me. What a compelling, watertight argument against people fronting up to do their civic duty.

I’ve done my jury duty – quite recently too.

I don’t recall whining about it like a little b%tch either.

That must have been a new experience for you. Not whining like a little bitch that is.

BTW. spelling it “b%tch” doesn’t make it any less sexist you naughty boy!

wow, ‘haters gonna hate’. For all we know OP could be a contractor with a huge mortgage to pay.

I understand his point of view (not because we share the same screen name), he could be down 3 weeks pay, while a kid get a $50 fine which he will pay off in $5 increments – so who is being penalised here? imo we should get the people who want to go, then dilute them with the unemployed.

Even if he gets knocked back (or the trial ends) on the first day, he might have turned down 3 weeks worth of work and his employer has rehired someone else.

Jim Jones said :

I’ve done my jury duty – quite recently too.

I don’t recall whining about it like a little b%tch either.

Let me guess – the $96.54 per day that was on offer actually put you ahead of what you normally earn?

Jim Jones said :

Jury duty does take ‘financial hardship’ into consideration, and they’ll accept that as a reason not to serve. But seriously, if you *really* think that you’ll be so financially ruined by jury duty, how is it that you’re bragging about how much money you’re worth?

I don’t recall doing any bragging whatsoever – but it is interesting that you interpret my plain statement of facts as such – I suspect a psychologist would diagnose your misinterpretation as a fairly straightforward case of envy.

Duffbowl said :

Clown Killer said :

Sorry to bust your bubble Mr Evil but people getting billed out at $1400 a day isn’t that unusual. At my business professional services are billed at $1300-2600 a day. We really don’t do anything special. Most of those guys have a BA (Hons.) degree, some a MA.

$1400 is a starting point for some contracts in some professions. Depending on the length of the engagement, I earn between $1100 and $1400 a day for the company I work for, and we have a reputation for being at the more affordable end of the spectrum.

HenryBG said :

Having fired both in a previous job, I preferred the “Austrian toy”; that said, my experience with them is somewhat limited. The 5.56mm is designed to produce greater injuries, keeping an enemy combatant out of combat for longer. Their lighter weight (about 750 grams) and larger magazine capacity are seen as pluses as well.

Having also fired both in a previous job and being narrowly beaten to be first in my mustering to gain crossed rifles with it, I liked the Austeyr’s trigger, but hated it for its barrel/action coupling wear. This affected accuracy potential like you wouldn’t believe. If you didn’t know how to eliminate worn receivers at the armory by kneeling against the rifle in the rack and wobbling the barrel looking for play, you just wasted your time.
As for ballistic comparison, the SS109 round was designed to try and replicate the performance of the 7.62, which required a different center of mass, longer projectile and more aggressive rifling rate of twist compared to a standard .223.

After hearing personal accounts of its effectiveness compared with the 7.62 round, I would never want to be in an armed conflict with a 5.56 weapon of any sort. Published opinions reflecting the difference in effectiveness can be found in such interesting books as “Black Hawk Down”

How’s that for off topic? Being in the Armed Services can get you out of Jury Duty too..

Wow, I just read through the comments.

First, I think those called up for jury duty should do their part.

That said, $1400/day is bog standard for many professional services consultants. Bagging this guy simply because he has a well paying job is tall poppy syndrome at its finest – pure jealously speaking.

HenryBG said :

Jim Jones said :

When you turn up for jury duty, they’ll ask if anyone has any reason why they should be excused.

At this point, stand up and say (loudly and clearly so everyone can hear): “I’m too self-involved and I don’t care about the community I live in anyway”.

I believe that is a good demonstration of projection and lack of empathy.

Just imagine being put in the situation where you were unable to pay your monthly mortgage payment because the government decides it won’t compensate you for earnings it is denying you.

I’ve always wanted to do jury duty, but I can’t afford to if they won’t cover me for lost income during the period they want me for.

How about *you* do something for the community, Jim, and *you* cover me for the $5000 I’ll be out of pocket, thus providing the community with the services of a juror of unusual competence for a change?

I’ve done my jury duty – quite recently too.

I don’t recall whining about it like a little b%tch either.

Jury duty does take ‘financial hardship’ into consideration, and they’ll accept that as a reason not to serve. But seriously, if you *really* think that you’ll be so financially ruined by jury duty, how is it that you’re bragging about how much money you’re worth?

Also worth noting that you’re almost guaranteed not to be actually doing anything during the theoretical 3 weeks you’re supposed to be available. If you’re called onto a jury, then you will serve for some time, but incredibly unlikely that it will be the whole period.

As an earlier poster has pointed out: with this kind of attitude, anything you choose to say about the judicial system in the ACT (or the rest of the country) carries absolutely no weight whatsoever.

All the talk about ‘limp-wristed magistrate from giving some scumbag druggie his 35th “chance’ and ‘slow-moving lawyers’ is empty rhetoric coming from the mouth of someone who considers themselves ‘a juror of unusual competence’, but is either too selfish or too poor (despite bragging to the contrary) to be able to man up and do his civic duty.

This prevailing mindset that the gummint owes us everything and that we have absolutely no responsibilities whatsoever to safeguard our democracy (probably connected with the fact that people now consider themselves to be ‘consumers’ rather than ‘citizens’) makes me want to vomit blood.

Jim Jones said :

When you turn up for jury duty, they’ll ask if anyone has any reason why they should be excused.

At this point, stand up and say (loudly and clearly so everyone can hear): “I’m too self-involved and I don’t care about the community I live in anyway”.

I believe that is a good demonstration of projection and lack of empathy.

Just imagine being put in the situation where you were unable to pay your monthly mortgage payment because the government decides it won’t compensate you for earnings it is denying you.

I’ve always wanted to do jury duty, but I can’t afford to if they won’t cover me for lost income during the period they want me for.

How about *you* do something for the community, Jim, and *you* cover me for the $5000 I’ll be out of pocket, thus providing the community with the services of a juror of unusual competence for a change?

When you turn up for jury duty, they’ll ask if anyone has any reason why they should be excused.

At this point, stand up and say (loudly and clearly so everyone can hear): “I’m too self-involved and I don’t care about the community I live in anyway”.

colourful sydney racing identity said :

harvyk1 said :

davo101 said :

So you’d be happy with volunteer jury duty?

I think counsel would become suspicious if people started volunteering for jury duty.

Don’t see why? You could make a job out of it and thus going on a jury would not be a disruption to your life, and obviously counsel could state they didn’t want you if they didn’t like you.

It would be a great job for those who are interested in having their say in the legal system, and would provide the level of protection against rouge judges which the jury is meant to provide. Furthermore considering that jury duty already takes randoms off the street, it would be a job which they could offer to anyone with no training, and no limit on how many people could apply \ be accepted into the position.

Oh jesus. there is so much wrong with this that I do not know where to begin.

Puts me in mind of the tricoteuses…

harvyk1 said :

davo101 said :

So you’d be happy with volunteer jury duty?

I think counsel would become suspicious if people started volunteering for jury duty.

Don’t see why? You could make a job out of it and thus going on a jury would not be a disruption to your life, and obviously counsel could state they didn’t want you if they didn’t like you.

It would be a great job for those who are interested in having their say in the legal system, and would provide the level of protection against rouge judges which the jury is meant to provide. Furthermore considering that jury duty already takes randoms off the street, it would be a job which they could offer to anyone with no training, and no limit on how many people could apply \ be accepted into the position.

Oh jesus. there is so much wrong with this that I do not know where to begin.

HenryBG said :

But if the government arbitrarily decides to deny me the ability to work for three weeks, thus denying me access to 5% of my annual income, how do I insure against that?

Perhaps if you feign you own death and get taken off the electoral roll? The other advantage with this option is your family will really clean up on your income protection insurance – and you won’t have to pay taxes ever again! 🙂

I would love to be given the opportunity to do Jury Duty… unfortunately i wont have that opporunity!

dtc said :

How about you do your civic duty like everyone else?

It’s a responsibility for living in this thing we call a democracy.

Or is jury duty simply for the lower paid plebs?

So why is jury duty a ‘civic duty’ but a whole list of other activities that contribute to society – from meals on wheels, to picking up rubbish to the SES – is totally voluntary or is fully funded by the taxpayer?

And I hate to be a pedant, but will be – there is no link between jury duty and democracy. Many non democratic countries dont have juries, but some do. And many democratic countries dont have juries.

We live in THIS democratic country. AUSTRALIA. Do your bit…

harvyk1 said :

dpm said :

Just out of interest, what about if you were sick or injured for a few weeks? Do you have some sort of income protection? You seem to be overly stressed about (possibly) losing a few bucks – like you’d be destitute if it were to happen? BTW, i got my first jury duty letter last week too! We might be chatting about this between sessions at court in a few weeks! Hahaha! 🙂

I would consider that a legitimate question, and as a result there is things like sick leave, income protection insurance and medical insurances available to people in which to insure you don’t end up too out of pocket over a medical incident.

Exactly. I have insurance.
If I go under a bus, the mortgage gets paid out. If I end up in hospital, the same insurance covers my mortgage payments and income protection covers other bills.

But if the government arbitrarily decides to deny me the ability to work for three weeks, thus denying me access to 5% of my annual income, how do I insure against that?

davo101 said :

So you’d be happy with volunteer jury duty?

I think counsel would become suspicious if people started volunteering for jury duty.

Don’t see why? You could make a job out of it and thus going on a jury would not be a disruption to your life, and obviously counsel could state they didn’t want you if they didn’t like you.

It would be a great job for those who are interested in having their say in the legal system, and would provide the level of protection against rouge judges which the jury is meant to provide. Furthermore considering that jury duty already takes randoms off the street, it would be a job which they could offer to anyone with no training, and no limit on how many people could apply \ be accepted into the position.

So you’d be happy with volunteer jury duty?

I think counsel would become suspicious if people started volunteering for jury duty.

Me no fry said :

Mr Evil said :

Wow – do people really earn $1400/day just for having their head permanently wedged up their arse?

Yes. Not only that, but usually, the higher up the head is, the greater the pay. This principle can be observed in most white collar workplaces.

Man, I’ve clearly been addressing selection criteria the wrong way.

Mr Evil said :

Wow – do people really earn $1400/day just for having their head permanently wedged up their arse?quote]

I go the impression that he doesn’t earn $1400 a day, but that is what his ‘company’ charges him out at.

If that is the case then he would probably get somewhere around $1000 of that less lease/tax/medicare/flood levy etc.

Mr Evil said :

Wow – do people really earn $1400/day just for having their head permanently wedged up their arse?

Yes. Not only that, but usually, the higher up the head is, the greater the pay. This principle can be observed in most white collar workplaces.

caf said :

harvyk1 said :

HenryBG does raise a very important point. They have randomly selected someone and ordered them to preform work without real compensation for their loses. This person was simply unlucky enough to have their number come up, they committed no crime, however in the real world this person is now going to have to find the money to continue paying their mortgage, lease fees and other expenses which do not stop simply because jury duty starts.

It could be worse – 45 years ago you might have been shipped off to Vietnam.

I have to say, I’m not too crazy about the idea of conscription either…

dpm said :

Just out of interest, what about if you were sick or injured for a few weeks? Do you have some sort of income protection? You seem to be overly stressed about (possibly) losing a few bucks – like you’d be destitute if it were to happen? BTW, i got my first jury duty letter last week too! We might be chatting about this between sessions at court in a few weeks! Hahaha! 🙂

I would consider that a legitimate question, and as a result there is things like sick leave, income protection insurance and medical insurances available to people in which to insure you don’t end up too out of pocket over a medical incident.

How about you do your civic duty like everyone else?

It’s a responsibility for living in this thing we call a democracy.

Or is jury duty simply for the lower paid plebs?

So why is jury duty a ‘civic duty’ but a whole list of other activities that contribute to society – from meals on wheels, to picking up rubbish to the SES – is totally voluntary or is fully funded by the taxpayer?

And I hate to be a pedant, but will be – there is no link between jury duty and democracy. Many non democratic countries dont have juries, but some do. And many democratic countries dont have juries.

Clown Killer said :

Sorry to bust your bubble Mr Evil but people getting billed out at $1400 a day isn’t that unusual. At my business professional services are billed at $1300-2600 a day. We really don’t do anything special. Most of those guys have a BA (Hons.) degree, some a MA.

$1400 is a starting point for some contracts in some professions. Depending on the length of the engagement, I earn between $1100 and $1400 a day for the company I work for, and we have a reputation for being at the more affordable end of the spectrum.

HenryBG said :

Just as long as they issue me with an SLR instead of that ridiculous Austrian toy they seem to be now using.

Having fired both in a previous job, I preferred the “Austrian toy”; that said, my experience with them is somewhat limited. The 5.56mm is designed to produce greater injuries, keeping an enemy combatant out of combat for longer. Their lighter weight (about 750 grams) and larger magazine capacity are seen as pluses as well.

$1400 per day is $200 per hour. Lots of tradies, let along professional services, charge that much.

And for all of those criticising and claiming its part of society – how would you feel if you were told that you had to do 2 weeks compulsory ‘community service’ (picking up rubbish or helping in aged care or something), on the basis that it was part of your contribution to society. Oh, you would get $100 per day doing it, lose your normal income and most richer people can get out of it by claiming an exemption?

I think everyone misread what he has written, it doesn’t say that he earns $1400 for himself, that is how much he earns for his company.

Tell someone you dreamt the correct verdict last night…

Sorry to bust your bubble Mr Evil but people getting billed out at $1400 a day isn’t that unusual. At my business professional services are billed at $1300-2600 a day. We really don’t do anything special. Most of those guys have a BA (Hons.) degree, some a MA.

Some time ago, I rang up the Sheriff’s office to find out about jury duty. The lady I spoke to educational. When I said that I’d like to do it to see what it was all about, she took my name and I have never heard anything back. Maybe volunteering was the wrong thing to do…

Never have I once been called for Jury Duty and when the day finally comes I can get out of it cos I’m a Nurse – Glad I don’t need B******T excesses to get out of it!

You’ll need to get up in front of everyone else selected to do jury duty and plead your case as to why you should get out of it. You’re then either excused or told to sit back down with a lecture from the judge about serving the community.

1. I believe if you are called for jury duty you should do it. It’s one of the responsibilities of being a citizen in a democracy.

2. I believe if you do jury duty you shouldn’t come out of it in a financially worse off position. It’s HenryBG’s duty to serve on the jury, but certainly not his duty to lose a few thousand dollars in income to do so.

Simply to say, ‘but you’re obviously rich enough to afford the losses’ doesn’t cut it. If HenryBG is a contractor, he isn’t going to be getting any payments from his employer and will lose out. You are effectively arguing that HenryBG should pay a tax of thousands of dollars for the privilege of serving on a jury.

If he isn’t a contractor and his employer covers the cost of him going, why should it be the duty of his employer to lose income? Again, this is effectively levying a tax on a private company to cover the cost of our jury system.

If we are going to have a jury system it stands to reason that it should be properly funded so that people who get called for duty don’t have to suffer financial losses.

Wow – do people really earn $1400/day just for having their head permanently wedged up their arse?

I’m actually thinking you won’t get picked for jury service anyway, once everyone sees how big that chip on your shoulder is.

And speaking of parasites who fleece the system; I’m guessing you’ll honestly say you’ve never, ever claimed a cent for dubious expenses of any kind, or attempted to ‘legally’ minimise your taxable income at all – being such a hardworking, wonderful person and all that?

To be fair, I don’t think that he said he earns $1400 a day, but that he’s worth $1400 a day – maybe he works for an IT firm and knows all sorts of coding that would make him extremely hard to replace in the event that he can’t rock up for work. Who knows? Haters gonna hate in any case.

If you want to get out of jury duty, don’t shave, bathe or sleep for as long as possible before the interview and make them repeat every question. Otherwise, move interstate, get your license changed and eventually you’ll get kicked off the electoral roll – sure you won’t be able to vote but you definitely won’t have to do jury duty ever again.

Or refer them to me – I’ve always wanted to do jury duty!

It is worth checking out how the system works as you may not necessarily have to be there every day of that 3 weeks unless you are picked – essentially they call up people to have a pool to pick from for any new cases that occur in that period of time. Once they have picked whatever is set down for that first day they may not have any for a few days if at all.

Now it has been 20 years since my number came up but when I did it we went in for the first day, they selected a jury for the first trial and one of the sides didn’t like the look of me (young uni student) so I wasn’t picked to sit on that one and we were out of there before lunch time. We had to keep an eye on the canberra times during our period and there would be a notice telling us to come in if we were needed – I presume modern technology would be used now.

HenryBG said :

TheDancingDjinn said :

HenryBG said :

buzz819 said :

…. so I’ll end up getting less than $1,500 for 3 weeks’ “work”. What do they think I am? Some spotty teenager packing bags at Woollies?
Just the mortgage, the car lease, and the school fees add up to $2,200 per week. Plus all the other bills.

$1,500 would cover 3 days of my expenses, not 3 weeks.
What a crazy system.

seriously man, shut up and thank your lucky stars you earn such a princely sum that allows you to SAVE money to pay for all that first world sh*t that you own. Do the duty and get over it.

I thought only unemployed people and grandma’s got called for jury duty ..

‘Instead of that ridiculous Austrian toy they seem to be now using”

Henry, there seems no end to your knowledge of the world, and ability to criticize.

Next time the ADF rearms, make sure you are on the panel that makes the decision.

Also, if you ever find yourself the victim of a crime where the perpetrator is put before a jury, I am sure that would help to adjust your attitude to both juries, and the legal profession. (Of which I am neither.)

Good luck on the Clapham omnibus.

I had a mate who recently got called up for Jury Duty…. the first day she sat in a room for half a day and didn’t get selected was back at work after lunch, but was told to go back the following Monday.

She got selected the following Monday, was told she was needed for “up to 2 weeks”

Her ‘service’ was over and done by lunchtime Tuesday.

Suck it up and do your service. If doing jury duty is going to cripple you financially because can’t afford 3 weeks off work because they don’t pay you for jury duty, get a letter and try to get exempt.

Oh and secondly.. you said you earn $1400 a day and your expenses are $500 a day… soooooo your able to save $900 a day and STILL have things like a mortgage, car loan, bills etc ?? What on earth do you spend the other $6000+ on a week ?

Feng said :

LOL.

I am surprised that you stated your company’s income to such a degree. I don’t think anyone really cares like you don’t care about jury duty.

It also sounds like you got ‘alot’ of money to waste so why not donate it to some charity rather than think of using it for some seriously twisted personal issue?

Some countries would kill for a court system like ours. It may be slow at times but it’s damn good. It’s not perfect but nothing is in this world. I think it does the job nicely and I think the process behind the outcomes of decisions that come out of the courts is pretty darn good.

So why not just think about doing a good service to your community and to a system that’s giving you the protection to earn your ‘$1,400’ income?

But what I really wanted to say after all that is seriously, shut the hell up and think about doing some good rather than dwell in your own idiocy.

HenryBG said :

tonys said :

HenryBG said :

Just the mortgage, the car lease, and the school fees add up to $2,200 per week. Plus all the other bills.
$1,500 would cover 3 days of my expenses, not 3 weeks.
What a crazy system.

You chose to have all these things. crazy!

Why is it crazy?
So long as the government doesn’t arbitrarily decide to deny me the opportunity to have an income for 3 weeks, there’s no problem, because I can afford “all these things”.

Just out of interest, what about if you were sick or injured for a few weeks? Do you have some sort of income protection? You seem to be overly stressed about (possibly) losing a few bucks – like you’d be destitute if it were to happen? BTW, i got my first jury duty letter last week too! We might be chatting about this between sessions at court in a few weeks! Hahaha! 🙂

HenryBG said :

So long as the government doesn’t arbitrarily decide to deny me the opportunity to have an income for 3 weeks, there’s no problem, because I can afford “all these things”.

+1. Charitability only goes so far. If the private sector values HenryBG at $X then the public sector should cough up $X. If we actually believe in having a representative jury that is.

By failing to accept your responsibilities you have forfeited any right to have your opinion taken seriously on any law and order issue.

caf said :

It could be worse – 45 years ago you might have been shipped off to Vietnam.

They didn’t ship off people my age, with my familial responsibilities to Vietnam.

However, as it happens, I would far prefer the opportunity to spend 3 weeks shooting communists than to spend 3 weeks being paid $100/day to be stuck in a room full of overpaid lawyers and having to listen to their, and their criminal scumbag clients’, lies.

Just as long as they issue me with an SLR instead of that ridiculous Austrian toy they seem to be now using.

tonys said :

HenryBG said :

Just the mortgage, the car lease, and the school fees add up to $2,200 per week. Plus all the other bills.
$1,500 would cover 3 days of my expenses, not 3 weeks.
What a crazy system.

You chose to have all these things. crazy!

Why is it crazy?
So long as the government doesn’t arbitrarily decide to deny me the opportunity to have an income for 3 weeks, there’s no problem, because I can afford “all these things”.

I just quickly scanned the exemptions in that pdf, and one of the classes of people who are exempted are people 60 years and older. I would have thought that these are exactly the people required, they have time on their hands, looking for exciting and new things to do, as well as an opportunity to make a few extra quid.

Who writes these rules? Legislators. Of course, the very same who are also exempted!

tonys said :

HenryBG said :

Just the mortgage, the car lease, and the school fees add up to $2,200 per week. Plus all the other bills.
$1,500 would cover 3 days of my expenses, not 3 weeks.
What a crazy system.

You chose to have all these things. crazy!

Must be hard not having a wife to help out with the bills.

Harvyk @ #42

+1

Much as I can see the virtue of the jury system, I would be financially crippled if forced to do 3 weeks jury duty at those rates.

Obviously, if the court was required to pay the jurors their individual normal weekly wage, the only people called for duty would be Centrelink customers and retirees. I am equally sure that a hefty percentage of employers would be loathe to make up their absent employees wages.

harvyk1 said :

HenryBG does raise a very important point. They have randomly selected someone and ordered them to preform work without real compensation for their loses. This person was simply unlucky enough to have their number come up, they committed no crime, however in the real world this person is now going to have to find the money to continue paying their mortgage, lease fees and other expenses which do not stop simply because jury duty starts.

It could be worse – 45 years ago you might have been shipped off to Vietnam.

HenryBG said :

Just the mortgage, the car lease, and the school fees add up to $2,200 per week. Plus all the other bills.
$1,500 would cover 3 days of my expenses, not 3 weeks.
What a crazy system.

You chose to have all these things. crazy!

Wow. Your costs for school, car and house are nearly 10 grand a month. Are your kids so fed up of you that they board? Give said kid/s a fighting chance and stop being such a tool. Show them what civic duty is. I have to inform you that you are payng mightily over the odds for one of those three things.

Anyone with a brain cell knows that your company can make the decision as to whether to pay you your normal rate and let you keep the jury payment as a bonus or they can pay you the difference. Most companies do the latter. You may be a contractor, in which case, I’m not sure they have to pay you anything.

I really hope I never have to meet you. I pity the poor accused person in the dock who gets you on their jury. I pity the rest of the jurors. But I hope you end up being gainfully employed by the courts for the whole three weeks or even longer. Maybe then you will see what real life is like and not make stupid posts such as this.

HenryBG does raise a very important point. They have randomly selected someone and ordered them to preform work without real compensation for their loses. This person was simply unlucky enough to have their number come up, they committed no crime, however in the real world this person is now going to have to find the money to continue paying their mortgage, lease fees and other expenses which do not stop simply because jury duty starts.

Now some of you have suggested that Henry can use his vast savings that someone who is earning $1,400 must have. But in my opinion him being forced to use any savings to keep living it’s almost like he is being seriously “taxed” this year because the gov’t doesn’t want to pay him appropriately for his time.

I’m personally 100% against the idea of a jury system in it’s current form. You take a bunch of relatively disinterested people, force them to listen to stuff they know little about esp in a case like Henry’s where “what am I going to do about my mortgage payment this month” weighs on their mind, or have pre-conceived ideas or more importantly their own prejudices, and then they decide the fact of a person.

“Oh, yeah. The trick is to say you’re prejudiced against all races.”

Turn up drunk on day one.

Perhaps you should prepare a written submission to the judge explaining how important you are and how unimportant your community service is?

Make sure and mention your views about lawyers and magistrates – they love to hear constructive criticism.

Off topic I know, and I do hate to generalise (especially following you) but I’m guessing you are in the IT industry HenryBG?

HenryBG said :

TheDancingDjinn said :

HenryBG said :

buzz819 said :

Well that’s the thing, by law your company still has to pay you your normal wage…

I doubt it. What law are you thinking of?

There is no law so to speak – but it does say on the website that “public servants should still recieve their normal pay from their jobs, but you might have to check with your work before hand to make sure”
http://www.courts.act.gov.au/supreme/public/jury_service_in_the_australian_capital_territory#furtherinformation

it says on that website that if you have a state dec written out explaining why you cannot attened jury duty, then the “sheriff” will let you off.

Thanks, handy link, it’s got the figures for Juror payment – so if I’m stuck there for 15 days, they will pay me just short of $2,000.
It doesn’t say anything about it being tax-free, so I’ll end up getting less than $1,500 for 3 weeks’ “work”. What do they think I am? Some spotty teenager packing bags at Woollies?
Just the mortgage, the car lease, and the school fees add up to $2,200 per week. Plus all the other bills.
$1,500 would cover 3 days of my expenses, not 3 weeks.
What a crazy system.

From most people I know who done it, you take your juror payment slip into your HR dept and they pay the difference that makes it up to your normal work pay you would have received. That’s from both people in the private and public systems. So, you should be OK….?

HenryBG said :

It doesn’t say anything about it being tax-free, so I’ll end up getting less than $1,500 for 3 weeks’ “work”. What do they think I am? Some spotty teenager packing bags at Woollies?
Just the mortgage, the car lease, and the school fees add up to $2,200 per week. Plus all the other bills.
$1,500 would cover 3 days of my expenses, not 3 weeks.
What a crazy system.

HenryBG – you clearly don’t have any concept of what jury duty is and the role it plays in the justice system. I suspect your income claims are bogus – most tradies I know are pretty bright and clued-in to politics and society. Most of those “spotty kids” at Woollies are going off to uni and I bet a random poll would reveal they were taught about the jury system at school. And non-tradies have to have an education to be earning $3000 a week, let alone $1400 a day. Calling you on bullsh*tting.

TheDancingDjinn said :

HenryBG said :

buzz819 said :

Well that’s the thing, by law your company still has to pay you your normal wage…

I doubt it. What law are you thinking of?

There is no law so to speak – but it does say on the website that “public servants should still recieve their normal pay from their jobs, but you might have to check with your work before hand to make sure”
http://www.courts.act.gov.au/supreme/public/jury_service_in_the_australian_capital_territory#furtherinformation

it says on that website that if you have a state dec written out explaining why you cannot attened jury duty, then the “sheriff” will let you off.

Thanks, handy link, it’s got the figures for Juror payment – so if I’m stuck there for 15 days, they will pay me just short of $2,000.
It doesn’t say anything about it being tax-free, so I’ll end up getting less than $1,500 for 3 weeks’ “work”. What do they think I am? Some spotty teenager packing bags at Woollies?
Just the mortgage, the car lease, and the school fees add up to $2,200 per week. Plus all the other bills.
$1,500 would cover 3 days of my expenses, not 3 weeks.
What a crazy system.

Unless you have a diagnosed mental illness, being an unsavoury character yourself (how many DUIs?) won’t excuse you from jury duty. It’s something anyone called up simply has to do. Rather than whingeing, how about thanking your lucky stars that, on $1400 a day, you have ample savings (unless you’re a druggie yourself) or extra income derived from investments based on all that spare income, and are one of the very people who absolutely SHOULD be doing jury duty.
It’s unlikely that a low-level druggie would be going to a jury trial, so you would be doing the community a service. Part of the cost of living in a functional democracy is obligations like these.
So shut up with the clever-dick stuff, choose not to be a dead turd, and do the right thing.

HenryBG said :

buzz819 said :

HenryBG said :

Jim Jones said :

You have an opportunity to give a little bit back to the society that’s obviously given you so much.

I pay my tax. If they want more, increases taxes – we can plan for that.

Jim Jones said :

Your attitude about this opportunity speaks volumes about you, and it’s not good.

So – a “good” attitude about being prevented from having an income and not being able to make the mortgage payment in March should be….what? exactly?

Well that’s the thing, by law your company still has to pay you your normal wage…

I doubt it. What law are you thinking of?

I thought it was under the Juries Act, but that was in Victoria I have now found out, here you get $95 a day plus $16 travel allowance, for the first four days, and it goes up to $130 + $16 travel allowance.

But there is a long list of who is exempt and who can apply for an exemption –

http://www.legislation.act.gov.au/a/1967-47/default.asp

Or if you’re a tradie, just turn up two days late

HenryBG said :

buzz819 said :

HenryBG said :

Jim Jones said :

You have an opportunity to give a little bit back to the society that’s obviously given you so much.

I pay my tax. If they want more, increases taxes – we can plan for that.

Jim Jones said :

Your attitude about this opportunity speaks volumes about you, and it’s not good.

So – a “good” attitude about being prevented from having an income and not being able to make the mortgage payment in March should be….what? exactly?

Well that’s the thing, by law your company still has to pay you your normal wage…

I doubt it. What law are you thinking of?

There is no law so to speak – but it does say on the website that “public servants should still recieve their normal pay from their jobs, but you might have to check with your work before hand to make sure”
http://www.courts.act.gov.au/supreme/public/jury_service_in_the_australian_capital_territory#furtherinformation

it says on that website that if you have a state dec written out explaining why you cannot attened jury duty, then the “sheriff” will let you off.

shauno said :

HenryBG said :

Heavs said :

I’m just curious as to what sort of industry is charging a bloke who is clearly on the lower end of the brain spectrum out at $1400 a day? Love you long time Henry?

I’ve always wanted to move into anaesthesia – those guys’ rates *start* at $1,500/day, PLUS, they have access to the good stuff.

How much stress though knowing a slight mistake could kill some one.

That’s where having access to the good stuff comes in handy, I guess.

buzz819 said :

HenryBG said :

Jim Jones said :

You have an opportunity to give a little bit back to the society that’s obviously given you so much.

I pay my tax. If they want more, increases taxes – we can plan for that.

Jim Jones said :

Your attitude about this opportunity speaks volumes about you, and it’s not good.

So – a “good” attitude about being prevented from having an income and not being able to make the mortgage payment in March should be….what? exactly?

Well that’s the thing, by law your company still has to pay you your normal wage…

I doubt it. What law are you thinking of?

!400 an hour I found 2 billion barrel oil fields for less than that. lol

Dilandach said :

I got called twice last year. Both times, I didn’t show.

I have had no repercussions. Even if I had, ‘I didn’t get the letter’.

They always send the jury duty notices out to large amounts of people to cover those who don’t turn up and those that aren’t picked/fit for jury duty.

Don’t let people frighten you with BS arguments whilst they pretend to have their hand on their heart and an Australian flag waving in the background as they speak on the merits of the world’s greatest legal system.

Ignore that sh#$. Throw it in the bin.

If only everyone thought like you. Then we could abolish the whole jury system.

HenryBG said :

Jim Jones said :

You have an opportunity to give a little bit back to the society that’s obviously given you so much.

I pay my tax. If they want more, increases taxes – we can plan for that.

Jim Jones said :

Your attitude about this opportunity speaks volumes about you, and it’s not good.

So – a “good” attitude about being prevented from having an income and not being able to make the mortgage payment in March should be….what? exactly?

Well that’s the thing, by law your company still has to pay you your normal wage…

Jim Jones said :

You have an opportunity to give a little bit back to the society that’s obviously given you so much.

I pay my tax. If they want more, increases taxes – we can plan for that.

Jim Jones said :

Your attitude about this opportunity speaks volumes about you, and it’s not good.

So – a “good” attitude about being prevented from having an income and not being able to make the mortgage payment in March should be….what? exactly?

HenryBG said :

Heavs said :

I’m just curious as to what sort of industry is charging a bloke who is clearly on the lower end of the brain spectrum out at $1400 a day? Love you long time Henry?

I’ve always wanted to move into anaesthesia – those guys’ rates *start* at $1,500/day, PLUS, they have access to the good stuff.

How much stress though knowing a slight mistake could kill some one.

Heavs said :

I’m just curious as to what sort of industry is charging a bloke who is clearly on the lower end of the brain spectrum out at $1400 a day? Love you long time Henry?

I’ve always wanted to move into anaesthesia – those guys’ rates *start* at $1,500/day, PLUS, they have access to the good stuff.

Heavs said :

I’m just curious as to what sort of industry is charging a bloke who is clearly on the lower end of the brain spectrum out at $1400 a day? Love you long time Henry?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lN-4lX0QyZc

I got called twice last year. Both times, I didn’t show.

I have had no repercussions. Even if I had, ‘I didn’t get the letter’.

They always send the jury duty notices out to large amounts of people to cover those who don’t turn up and those that aren’t picked/fit for jury duty.

Don’t let people frighten you with BS arguments whilst they pretend to have their hand on their heart and an Australian flag waving in the background as they speak on the merits of the world’s greatest legal system.

Ignore that sh#$. Throw it in the bin.

Heavs said :

I’m just curious as to what sort of industry is charging a bloke who is clearly on the lower end of the brain spectrum out at $1400 a day? Love you long time Henry?

Maybe he’s a parking inspector.

dixyland said :

As the great Homer says “Getting out of jury duty is easy. The trick is to say you’re prejudiced against all races”.

That’ll be Plan B.

molongloid said :

You’re a contractor / sole trader.

Yes, a woe-is-me stat dec will be Plan A.

I’m just curious as to what sort of industry is charging a bloke who is clearly on the lower end of the brain spectrum out at $1400 a day? Love you long time Henry?

Hey he could make $1400 a day, he works at the mint….

Wow.

You are so very clearly *worth* $1400 per day, aren’t you, sweetie.

Why don’t you go along, it might broaden your mind.

As the great Homer says “Getting out of jury duty is easy. The trick is to say you’re prejudiced against all races”.

Have you ever thought that attending and making a decision on the matter, with your fellow jurors, that you could make a difference for the future. Let’s see, maybe the druggie won’t get a 36th chance.

You have an opportunity to give a little bit back to the society that’s obviously given you so much.

Your attitude about this opportunity speaks volumes about you, and it’s not good.

To get out of jury duty you just need to move house. I’ll help by drawing up a list of countries where they don’t have pesky jury duty and where the authorities hand out more meaningful sentences like 500 lashes, getting your arm chopped off or getting hung. Then you can move to one of those countries which would suit you much better.

You think you’re worth $1400 income a day to the company eh? Must make your wage negotiations a hoot.

I love that you’re having a whinge about judges who aren’t perfroming, yet when you’re called on to do your part for the process, you’re looking for a way out.

Suck it up princess.

I’m rather envious. I’ve never been called and I think it’d be interesting.

1. No, but you’re not worth $1400 a day unless your be of the later mentioned ‘druggies’.

2. Best strategy is join the Police, then you never have to do it

3. Not quite as much as the fact you’ll lose your $1400/day job because of your new criminal history. That and you’ll get to see the inside of a court room again.

Mind you I am impressed that people can be professional wankers, and the pay seems great

Feng said :

LOL.

I am surprised that you stated your company’s income to such a degree. I don’t think anyone really cares like you don’t care about jury duty.

It also sounds like you got ‘alot’ of money to waste so why not donate it to some charity rather than think of using it for some seriously twisted personal issue?

Some countries would kill for a court system like ours. It may be slow at times but it’s damn good. It’s not perfect but nothing is in this world. I think it does the job nicely and I think the process behind the outcomes of decisions that come out of the courts is pretty darn good.

So why not just think about doing a good service to your community and to a system that’s giving you the protection to earn your ‘$1,400’ income?

But what I really wanted to say after all that is seriously, shut the hell up and think about doing some good rather than dwell in your own idiocy.

+1.

It’s just one of those things you have to do.

Contempt of court, last time I saw it was an imprisonment term, so it’s not something that I would do lightly.

Your company also has to suck it up, unless you are a lawyer, teacher, Police officer or Doctor, it is one of those things that you can’t really get out of.

You can turn up on the day and hope that you don’t get selected, but that is it. But seems as the supreme court has put a huge rush on a heap of cases of the next month or two, I’m sure you you will be found suitable for something.

Hey you might even learn a thing or two.

Am i the only person who appreciates the irony of a person who wants to do nothing for their community, appealing to the same community for advice ?

You should go to find out how the system works. For one you will find that you won’t be in a court with a magistrate, they generally operate solo.

molongloid said :

It was very wet on Friday and your mailbox was full of water, wasn’t it? The letters were just a soggy pile of mush, right? You didn’t know what was in them.

OR

You’re a contractor / sole trader.

OR

show them this thread. I doubt they’d want you on the jury.

It was very wet on Friday and your mailbox was full of water, wasn’t it? The letters were just a soggy pile of mush, right? You didn’t know what was in them.

OR

You’re a contractor / sole trader.

LOL.

I am surprised that you stated your company’s income to such a degree. I don’t think anyone really cares like you don’t care about jury duty.

It also sounds like you got ‘alot’ of money to waste so why not donate it to some charity rather than think of using it for some seriously twisted personal issue?

Some countries would kill for a court system like ours. It may be slow at times but it’s damn good. It’s not perfect but nothing is in this world. I think it does the job nicely and I think the process behind the outcomes of decisions that come out of the courts is pretty darn good.

So why not just think about doing a good service to your community and to a system that’s giving you the protection to earn your ‘$1,400’ income?

But what I really wanted to say after all that is seriously, shut the hell up and think about doing some good rather than dwell in your own idiocy.

I just want you spending the next three weeks there on general principle. Let your company find out whether they get a net gain.