Poll: Chuggers - Do we need a law?

I did part with my money though, I bought two Legacy bracelets for my girls

I don’t consider Legacy to be chuggers. Generally because the collectors are serving ADF and it’s only once a year.

Thats why they got my money 😉

00davist said :

I have a set amound I donate to charity each year, I do it in december, online.

If a charity, of any kind, sprooks me, They are out of the pool, and the other charity’s I chose to donate to are allocated a bigger cut.

This excludes the red sheild appeal, and red cross, Both of which i now to expect at a certain time.

And the lovely (and QUIET!!!) gentlman at the bottom of the 1/2 way esculators in the civic centre (Salvo’s) gets my change frequently, as he has never pestered me, or made me feel uncomfotable.

No money for chuggers!!!

Ditto.

And I regularly give money to the lovely people collecting money for the homeless at the Watson IGA. Because I never feel pressured to do so.

00davist said :

If a charity, of any kind, sprooks me, They are out of the pool…

This excludes the red sheild appeal, and red cross, Both of which i now to expect at a certain time.

I’m with you here. I’m not a Christian, but the Salvos and the Red Cross get a fair bit of my money. However so do World Vision, and I am f**king sick of being pestered by the idiots they hire.

I generally punch them in the face and then violently pierce their evil, cold, black hearts with a sharpened oak stake and then laugh deliriously as they perish.

Oh, sorry. That’s vampires. I always get chuggers and vampires mixed up.

Dont we all mate, Dont we all…

I have a set amound I donate to charity each year, I do it in december, online.

If a charity, of any kind, sprooks me, They are out of the pool, and the other charity’s I chose to donate to are allocated a bigger cut.

This excludes the red sheild appeal, and red cross, Both of which i now to expect at a certain time.

And the lovely (and QUIET!!!) gentlman at the bottom of the 1/2 way esculators in the civic centre (Salvo’s) gets my change frequently, as he has never pestered me, or made me feel uncomfotable.

No money for chuggers!!!

Man they are out in force today, must be the sun………

I did part with my money though, I bought two Legacy bracelets for my girls.

Used to drive for a courier company in Sydney who had a well known charity as a client. People would be horrified as to how much this charity spent on couriers each week!

Canon76 said :

They are a huge pain, donate to the charity directly and do not give to these people . Firstly they are not representatives of the actual charity they are collecting for, they are usually contractors who get a small % of the amount collected. The majority of the money goes to the company that they are working for and about 10-20% actually goes to the charity.
Please always do not confuse chuggers with people volunteering their time to collect for charities. Prior to giving money to these people ask if they are volunteers ? if they say yes and they are actually chuggers then they have basically engaged to misleading and deceptive conduct.

Also some of the company’s that these chuggers “work for ” (but they are actually contractors) have interesting websites and company structures (that look very similar to pyramids!)

Spot on Canon76..Eg..the little charmers (some of them) selling the tickets to ‘raise $8,000,000 for the Paralympians at a suburban mall near you are doing exactly this. I was shocked to discover that the charity itself receives only THREE DOLLARS out of the $10.00. The seller gets paid 3 and the ‘sports marketing company’ gets the remaining $4.00….

I do however feel sad for the sellers..sorry, chuggers, as they are often lured in by these ‘Team Managers’ with false promises of great careers in sales etc..Not realising when they reply to the ads online, what it is that they will actually be doing..So whilst these chuggers are as annoying as mosquitos at a BBQ, it is the Managers who worked their way up that are the real villians in the piece.

So I say, be kind to to the chuggers, state you would love to have their charities info, and you will give directly…Should see the little chuggers heading off to Dominoes to find a more fullfilling career path..

Based on all the comments so far I cannot see how in the end any charity in their right mind would continue to use such approaches to raise funds. After all, in the long run what they are damaging is their brands and creating friction with potential supporters.

To my mind this situation of having “fund raising middle-men” between the charity and the supporter creates a serious potential for a disconnect in the relationship. I have talked to some of the “chuggers” in the past, and generally very few of them really understand or support in any real sense the organisations they purport to represent. I believe that people build relationships with charitable agencies because of a connection with the people that are being helped. The greater the distance between the two ends of the relationship then the less likely that much change is really made in the world by the agency.

I was once shirt-fronted into a corner by an activist from a prominent green, er, peace organisation in Brissie (Fort Valley perhaps predictably) once and hectored with vigour on petitioning against proposals for the construction of a replacement facility for Lucas Heights. After I’d gotten a word in edgewise, I enquired of the nubile proponent of things rightous if the organisation she was representing were, ” . . . truly, seriously, opposed to the continuance of activities such as the practice of nuclear medicine in Australia. You know, the treatment of cancer and leukeamia and the like. And the production of mildly isotopic contrast mediums and stuff. ‘Cos, deary, that’s largely one of the functions of Lucas Heights you know?” I refrained from my usual ‘Solar IS nuclear, you know?’ speil just this once. She loosened her grasp on my genuine cotton flax Haiwian shirt and stumbled off, confused.

The next week, though, the very same person recalled my face (or perhaps the shirt) from our previous encounter and prostrated herself before me profuse in her apologies. She told how she had done some of her own research on Lucas Heights and, well, yeah, she felt pretty shabby for her prior performance and pavlovian subserviance to a distortion of facts.

I like to think that, given all considerations and other responsibilities, I give reasonably generously to worthy causes. For instance, Royal Childrens Oncology in Sydney are about to commence some promising trials that might ‘cure’ leuko in infants. Well worth putting out for in my book. But, like so many have said here . . . get out of my face. I’m polite . . . I smile and say ‘no thank you’ and walk by, but I don’t think I need to feel ‘pressured’ when all I’m doing is going to medicare or subway.

Bennop said :

Wow. Whats wrong with most of you. Ever heard of just walking along your merry way and ignoring them ?

Oh noes, people have opinions and are putting them up on a public website!

So, you’re bothered because people are bothered by the Chuggers? Or you’re annoyed because people are saying their annoyed by the Chuggers?

There seems to be a bit of a contradiction here.

They are dumb as too, The same person will come up to you like your their old long lost friend 3 times in 5 minutes. I just give them a face palm and keep walking.

dundle said :

….they’re definitely better than people trying to sell you useless face cream and stuff like that.

Trying to get them to explain exactly how salty dirt from a lake inhospitable to any life can possibly be good for your skin is fun.

Wow. Whats wrong with most of you. Ever heard of just walking along your merry way and ignoring them ?

You can even make a game of it: when they ask if you care about the environment, you can (cross eyed, with a huge smile) “say not today mate, I drove all the way from Gungahlin to Tuggers for my public servant slave wage!”.

Man up rioters. If you have this much bile for these guys, then you must have a pretty sweet life. Enjoy it.

Gantz said :

Nope not Jeggings. Just really, REALLY tight jeans. Jeggings are leggings made to look like jeans.

Those must be “leans” then – jeans made to look like leggings

Nope not Jeggings. Just really, REALLY tight jeans. Jeggings are leggings made to look like jeans.

EvanJames said :

We certainly need a law against those horrible jeans they are wearing in the photo. What the hell are those, stockings with pockets?

I believe the technical term is ‘jeggings’.

I give them a wide berth and then ease over to the quietly sitting Salvo, and unleash some silver. hoping they will notice.. Have been tempted to ring up the charity concerned over some of their ‘collector’ behaviour..

Davo111 said :

They’re the scum of society, i hope they are banned.

make them stand in front of charity bins. There is a cost to collect and dump the rubbish so they could get paid for stopping the dumpers. Have to work 24/7 though

I’m surprised by how much hate there is for these guys! Do people just feel bad about not donating and turn their guilt into anger?

I do agree it’s annoying to be harassed especially when you’re on a timeline but some of these guys ignore you if you say you’re busy. It depends on the charity though, I find some are pushier than others (usually they’re the charities I’m not so keen on, and the ones where I don’t think enough of the money goes to the cause). I believe some of the charity collectors are volunteers, at least that was the case a while ago. Some seem to be just hired but others really seem to believe in what they’re doing which is nice, I know it’s inconvenient to think about these things but I don’t see why everybody wants to hate and mock them. :-/ They’re definitely better than people trying to sell you useless face cream and stuff like that.

Erg0 said :

For a more local comparison: imagine how little dead sea makeup would be sold if the Canberra Centre didn’t allow them to “just ask you a question” on the way past.

I always respond, “You just DID” to those people. My God they are the worst of the bunch – they are parked right outside the GAME shop which I frequent. Do they really consider me as a possible candidate for their overpriced skin care products, given my poor fashion sense, not-so-perfect hair, my lack of effort to wear make up on a regular basis and the fact that I’m making a bee-line into a video games shop?!

“Don’t call me, honey. I’ll call you.”

That’s my standard line these days. I say something about not making any financial committments on the spot/in the street/at the front door and if I want to donate, I’ll do it through their website.

I will give gold coin donations to the quiet ones.

Re doing up fake IDs, I’m sure many here have experienced the highly professional beggars that infest LAX in the past, who have huge professional-looking IDs in pouches on lanyards. All manufactured. I find that a turn-off, anyway. The way Legacy and the Poppy blokes do it is more my style. Red Cross, Salvos… even bloody Greenpeace with the koalas with buckets. These highly professional paid money-extractors are a blight.

Overheard said :

Sometimes that’s also dictated by the shopping malls who request their patrons not be harassed.

This reminds me of a shopping centre in Auckland that had a strict no harassment policy – the forlorn looks on the faces of the guys who were trying to flog Amex cards under such constraints was priceless. I must have walked past their booth a hundred times and never saw a punter even pause on their way by.

For a more local comparison: imagine how little dead sea makeup would be sold if the Canberra Centre didn’t allow them to “just ask you a question” on the way past.

My family has three chosen charities that we support. The reasons for doing so range from the personal to lost in time. However we only donate what we can, when we can. Sometimes the budget is tight so charity then begins and ends at home. I figure that most people give to charities according to their means and circumstances. So its a flexible thing. Having said all that, there is no way known to man that I would give to any charity that has someone approach me in the street, they then rank themselves with telemarketers…..scum of the earth!!

Though a favorite response to green types (wwf, greenpeace, acf) when asked about saving whales is to refer to them as ‘free range beef of the sea!’ their reaction is always sooo amusing (my apologies to the gruen transfer for ripping off their line).

I-filed said :

Another, even dodgier outfit, were collecting throughout the Dickson Shops a few months ago. I asked one of them for ID, and he said he had “left it in his car” – waved vaguely towards the car park and asked if I needed him to fish it out. I didn’t donate.

I worry about the way this street style of charity collection attracts con artists. Every time there is a natural disaster or other high profile story of people in need there is a story about a con artist getting picked up taking collections for some associated cause (and pocketing them).

On Thursday afternoon at Belconnen mall I was in a shop when a dodgy guy walked in with a little box of friendship bracelets and chocolates, walked up to the counter and asked the people working there for some ridiculous price and saying it was for charity. I looked at the poor guys wondering how to make him go away and asked him “Where’s your ID, mate?” He looked confused and I explained that it’s illegal for charities to collect without a license and that collectors have to wear ID so he left.

Well, fine, it’s easy enough to weed out the amateur hour con artist like i-filed did in Dickson, but how hard is it to get some colourful t-shirts printed up, laminate a name tag and start asking people for money? For a $50-100 initial expenditure you could make absolutely hundreds of dollars or collect a stack of valid credit card details. How much easier is it if you are in a different city for a day or two? Would you be able to tell a professional con artist from the real thing?

If I really wanted to make some money, I’d set up a real charity or a “foundation” doing something vaguely philanthropic, pay myself a huge wage as CEO and send out a small army of teenagers to collect for me. So I’m even more cautious of charities that I’ve never even heard of because for all I know they are getting away with just this.

So that’s why I never give money to chuggers. Don’t call me, honey. I’ll call you.

I-filed said :

Another, even dodgier outfit, were collecting throughout the Dickson Shops a few months ago. I asked one of them for ID, and he said he had “left it in his car” – waved vaguely towards the car park and asked if I needed him to fish it out. I didn’t donate.

Mental Health Worker said :

I have feeling it is illegal for them to approach you? I know when I’ve sold raffle tickets for the rural fire brigade we have strict instructions not to hassle people. Perhaps that’s because it’s gamblng? And also I’m n NSW?

MHW

It’s not illegal. It’s just some of the more moderate charities have a policy of not mugging. They just smile sweetly and say ‘Hello’ or something similar and wait for the punter to engage.

Sometimes that’s also dictated by the shopping malls who request their patrons not be harassed.

I have feeling it is illegal for them to approach you? I know when I’ve sold raffle tickets for the rural fire brigade we have strict instructions not to hassle people. Perhaps that’s because it’s gamblng? And also I’m n NSW?

MHW

I just put my hand up, TALK TO THE HAND!

I take pride in trying to say something funny in response every time to get a reaction. I could feel the fiery internal rage from the Greenpeace guy trying to hold it together when I told him we should nuke the whales.

I put my f*** off face on and if that doesn’t work answer all of their questions with “Nope”… do you have five minutes to chat… do you want to help xyz cause… whatever their question the answer is the same.

I wish they would piss off to somewhere other than the merry-go-round, at least while it’s directly between work and my favourite lunch spot.

Yes we need a law.
NO means NO.
NO doesn’t mean keep following me or asking me questions.
NO doesn’t mean you can swear at me.
NO doesn’t mean you can shove pictures in my face and try and make me feel bad.
NO doesn’t mean I have to explain myself to you.

No just means NO (or f* off depending on how long I’ve been saying NO for)

I smile nicely and ask whether they are being paid or volunteering their time. Then I say “Sorry, I only support charity drives staffed by volunteers”.

It’s either 40 or 60 per cent that the companies are allowed to pocket, which is appalling – so please discourage these companies. One has been hanging outside Ainslie IGA recently collecting for Medecins Sans Frontieres.

Another, even dodgier outfit, were collecting throughout the Dickson Shops a few months ago. I asked one of them for ID, and he said he had “left it in his car” – waved vaguely towards the car park and asked if I needed him to fish it out. I didn’t donate.

I have to deal with these people just about every lunch time and while it’s VERY annoying, they do have a right to be there. Usually I just give them a “no thanks” and keep walking. That’s generally enough. Every so often there is a chugger who doesn’t get the hint, like the WWF one.

WWF guy: “Hey, can I have a minute of your time to talk about animals?”.

Me (on the way to a meeting): “No, sorry, I’m busy”.

WWF guy: “What? You don’t have 5 minutes?”.

Me (continuing to walk past): “No, I don’t.

WWF guy (walking along next to me): “But don’t you like animals?”.

Me: “Of course I like animals. They’re bloody tasty!”.

At this point, the guy stopped with his mouth wide open and had nothing else to say.

It seems you can’t go anywhere without being confronted by them in this town. I am suffering massive charity overload and rarely bother to donate to any at all anymore. I’m happy to support some causes but not the whole charity industry that has sprung up, I’m just sick of it.

They are a pain and curiously, they’re not locals often. The UNICEF ones in the Civic Bus Interchange (early twenties, mostly college drop-out girls) were here for a week from Sydney, on the charity’s dime assumedly. That’s not what I donate money for!

Anyway, these people aren’t the brightest tool in the shed. I normally ignore them but this week played along with the UNICEF one. It didn’t go well for her. She was more focused on asking the personal and lifestyle questions than actually selling her charity, which just got her in to trouble when I said I do “Law/arts” at Uni… she asks me “is that like painting court cases?”. She wasn’t kidding, prompting several attempts to explain about liberal arts… didn’t get it, political science and foreign affairs… still didn’t get it, and finally “society”. Still didn’t get it. Also she loved shaking hands???

Pales in comparison to a group working for Guide Dogs Victoria in Melbourne once who on being rejected politely as I walked by with coffee shouted after me that I wasn’t to poor for coffee. At the time, I had an RSPCA cap on too so a stupid reaction.

Mr Gillespie said :

These people need to learn that if someone wants something, it is up to US to go for it, and not the chugger to offer it (sometimes in your face).

I used to do the red shield appeal (unpaid volunteer) and generally if you asked people for donations they were more likely to give money. Having said that, the old guy who wears the salvos uniform in canberra centre seems to get quite a lot of donations (without asking)

Mr Gillespie said :

I really wonder about the health issues some chuggers have to face, being forced to sit there at every shopping centre entrance in rain, hail, shine, or blazing heat or freezing cold, whether they are being coerced or lured with lucrative payouts by their overpaid bosses.

lol “coerced or lured”? you sounds like they’re blackmailed to work. The fact of the matter is they get paid to collect, both an hourly wage & commission.

I don’t think they work in the rain/hail anyway – would have the same issues as tradies in terms of working in weather.

I miss that old bloke who used to sit at a card table at manuka in his Salvation Army duds, with a box. I always put gold coins in that box and figure many others did too. He’d sit there smiling, strike up a conversation if someone wanted a chat… that’s my kind of charity collection. Not these predatory, aggressive types who feel they are entitled to your money. They can actually bugger off.

If they were smart, they’d get sad and pathetic looking dogs to do the begging, they’d make squillions.

noms said :

The thing that ticks me off about these organisations is that they operate during weekday lunchtimes – most people are busy getting from one place to another and don’t have time to waste. They should be forced to operate on the weekends only.

I buy lunch everyday so I’m constantly on the lookout for clipboards and brightly coloured t-shirts. Walking around at lunch has become like riding a bicycle through the city at ultra slow speed while calculating the safest routes to avoid contact with people.

I too have the same problem, of having to find a different away to avoid these “chuggers” (if I can put a more polite term to it).

These people need to learn that if someone wants something, it is up to US to go for it, and not the chugger to offer it (sometimes in your face).

I really wonder about the health issues some chuggers have to face, being forced to sit there at every shopping centre entrance in rain, hail, shine, or blazing heat or freezing cold, whether they are being coerced or lured with lucrative payouts by their overpaid bosses.

p1 said :

I am curious how these professional chugging companies work interacts with the tax deductible status of the charities in question. If I give money to them, is it only fifty per cent tax deductible because half the money is going towards funding some brit’s gap year sex tourism?

If you actually receive something ( ie a scratch) then it is not tax deductible at all (as you are actually not donating your money). If you are actually donating to the charity via a chugger then it is tax deductible. It all depends on who the funds are actually going to .

geetee said :

Ban them. Or legislate that all chuggers have to be chained to a tree

i agree, or should be forced to wear a shirt that says exactly what % of the funds actually sees the charity.

Ban them. Or legislate that all chuggers have to be chained to a tree in the centre of the Mall, so I can actually catch my bus/get to the post office/buy my lunch/get to work without being harassed.

I find two things work well in shutting these people up;

1. Walk past, wearing a uniform (bus/taxi/customs not applicable), and/or
2. a good old fashioned F*** OFF!, just as they begin their spiel.

I am curious how these professional chugging companies work interacts with the tax deductible status of the charities in question. If I give money to them, is it only fifty per cent tax deductible because half the money is going towards funding some brit’s gap year sex tourism?

Perth used to (and may still) only allow charities to collect in the city on Fridays, a different charity each week, which seemed to work pretty well in terms of the karma/annoyance tradeoff. I got pinged to “volunteer” as a collector once, and made a bundle hassling people for change as they were feeding the parking machines by the river. Good times.

But I digress… I’m pretty good at just ignoring the collectors, but it really was getting beyond a joke when I was working in civic. The problem is that the entire system has devolved to the point where this is apparently the easiest way for all involved parties to make their money. It’s amazing what can be made cost effective through the simple application of slave labour.

They’re the scum of society, i hope they are banned.

Just smile, say; “No thank you”, and keep walking. It doesn’t matter if shes sweet and sexy, and has an @rse to die for, keep walking. Even if she looks at you with that twinkle in her eye which says; “Hey big boy, come and sign up here, I could really go for a man who had a standing order with Amesty,” keep walking. Even if her top is low cut and her bra is lacy, and highly arousing keep walking….

Or if it’s a male, just slap them upside the head as you pass.

They are a huge pain, donate to the charity directly and do not give to these people . Firstly they are not representatives of the actual charity they are collecting for, they are usually contractors who get a small % of the amount collected. The majority of the money goes to the company that they are working for and about 10-20% actually goes to the charity.
Please always do not confuse chuggers with people volunteering their time to collect for charities. Prior to giving money to these people ask if they are volunteers ? if they say yes and they are actually chuggers then they have basically engaged to misleading and deceptive conduct.

Also some of the company’s that these chuggers “work for ” (but they are actually contractors) have interesting websites and company structures (that look very similar to pyramids!)

The thing that ticks me off about these organisations is that they operate during weekday lunchtimes – most people are busy getting from one place to another and don’t have time to waste. They should be forced to operate on the weekends only.

I buy lunch everyday so I’m constantly on the lookout for clipboards and brightly coloured t-shirts. Walking around at lunch has become like riding a bicycle through the city at ultra slow speed while calculating the safest routes to avoid contact with people.

Poor things, cant even afford pants that fit

We certainly need a law against those horrible jeans they are wearing in the photo. What the hell are those, stockings with pockets?

I find these professional charities a complete turn-off. Charities with highly-paid CEOs and executives and sophisticated media departments, I have stopped giving money to them. I do give to the RSPCA and hope that it hasn’t gone that way, and otherwise support smaller, more local animal charities.