All Ages No Alcohol gig (at a pub): not pretty.

Yeah, I know, I kinda wrote that in a rush… gives it a genuine rant feel. Thanks for the syntax snobbery.

and this one from the google ads down the bottom

Strofes Greek Band – Aust
‘Melbourne’s Premier Greek Band’ Greek, English & Italian Music’

Rock on google ads \m/

Hey jon tell ados meatloaf says hello 😛

So… I missed all of this as I was away for a few days. This was forwarded to me by a friend. I wouldn’t normally reply to this sort of a thread and I’m not even sure that anyone else cares anymore or at all, but here’s some facts:
“Carzee” actually came up to us after the show and gave us some positive feedback, right to our faces. Very little negative comments were made by him, none about us in particular, there was some mention of the crazy pit… we assumed this guy hadn’t been to too many punk or hardcore punk shows. So… I think in light of this, I think his views expressed here are a little strange.
I also find that his internet barrage is a little ignorant and ill-informed. There really isn’t much else that upsets me more than gutter journalism or keyboard ninjas that use the internet to spread pure rubbish.
As the vocalist in 4 dead, I know for a fact that I said one joke that may not have been in the best taste but in no way was it sexist, in fact it had nothing to do with sex what so ever. The Jokes which offended him, said by kids in the crowd, also offended me a little too. I also didn’t think that they were the most appropriate due to the age of the kids at the gig etc. But it’s their call.
On Rockstardom: This is a personal attack. Not one person attacked your character as a 40+ year old Male with a camera at a show where the average age of those who attended would’ve been 16 IF that. You clearly have no idea about DIY / Punk ethics held dear to bands like ourselves. That established, I think you have also forgotten what it’s like to be an angry young man living in Australia. Maybe you should give both the kids that are part of this more credit, particularly the womyn! I believe you have once again mis-represented both myself as well as 4 dead by stating that we encouraged the alpha male behaviour, as you put it. The thing that strikes me is by commenting about what was going on in the audience, I was suggesting that people may use the space a little differently, prompting the kids to approach the stage and close down the area being used for circle pits etc.
As far as legal matters are concerned, you’ve missed the point. These people don’t want to sit in a chair at the sydney football stadium or wherever. They don’t want barriers. They, as minors, certainly don’t want to be dragged outside of a gig they’ve payed $20 for and kicked til they bleed from a bouncer. They don’t want to be told what to do… how many weeks of a paper run, or how many pizzas delivered, burgers made is that for a kid? Punk has always been about accessing music and being involved. Musicians aren’t looking to be put on a pedestal here, they’re just angry kids being boxed in by a plethora of social pressures (as are the people who come to shows). It’s supposed to be about taking all the shit things out of music and music industry. It’s about “F*ck you! I don’t want your war, or your beer or your overpriced ticketmaster or your platinum club tickets. F*ck Big Day Out. F*ck Wolfmother and F*CK YOU! If your into it, I’m NOT.” I emphasise the word “supposed”.
On top of that, do you think when Iggy Pop was busy pissing blood onto people and breaking ribs that people were thinking “Öh dear, what a liability!”. Or how would Jimmy Hendrix have set his guitar on fire if he was thinking about public liability? Due to people like yourself, with these opinions, characters like Ray Ahn from the Hard Ons can’t breathe fire on stage anymore. I don’t wanna see the day when gigs become predictable.
By a book, read up. This is how it should be. No rules. No bouncers. No Rockstars. No authority figures. A great leveller.
For someone who seems very unsure about the legalities of these shows, I sure hope you had written permission from the correct people to be photographing minors. You wanna be careful with that stuff.
Stick to Jazz.
Jon Dangerous

I was in the mosh pit at the Crowded House concert. When I started feeling lonely, I went out to the counter and brought myself some popcorn and a soda.

Plenty of room though.

They aren’t flames mate, its stating facts and its how it has always been. Its the nature of the beast.

Well, the smirky response amongst our RA brainstrust is summed up by (quote) “I hope I never get old enough to be concerned about it.”

“Nobody got hurt”. Amen.

In general, the (combined) powers of comprehension shown in these posts are a monument to Sesame Street.

Genre? Pretty irrelevant. Messenger? Irrelevant. Machismo and socialisation of juveniles in Canberra is also irrelevant.

The point, a term explained in “Conversational Skills For Dummies”, is the double standard.

Common sense about crowd safety is currently to be observed at some gigs -in part because of liability- but virtually ignored at other irresponsible gigs.

All it takes is one judgement for $millions (teenagers have a lot of years of salary in front of them) and your All Ages as they currently exist are gone. You are proposing that there must be victims to prove the case for common sense.

At that point, following a point raised upthread, the kidies will be without a proper indoor venue and then their anti-socialization paradigm is back on the streets vandalising cars etc.

Common sense and care for gig patrons should not be dependant on age fgs.

Sorry if my tone is a tad narky after the flames and sorry I wasted time at RA.

Comparing this with the ‘mosh’ at *Wolfmother* FFS? Ridiculous.

Now, I’m happy to say this isn’t the sort of music I usually get into, but …4DEAD f*ckin KICK ARSE! 2 of the most enjoyable gigs I went to last year were theirs, ‘large area mosh’ and all. And guess what – NOBODY got hurt.

(Yer too old, sorry.)

BUT – I have to admit, I’m not completely across all these crazy subgenres of metal these days like ‘Nu wave sludge punk american metalcore 5000 +1’. I think it’s kind of dumb for these thousands of subgenres to even exist as terms… But y’know, I didn’t mean my previous comment to sound mean, since it’s understandable. That’s all.

(Sorry about the double-post!)

Something you need to note, Carzee – there’s a big difference between hardcore and metal in terms of genre, and similarly a big difference between the moshing at metal gigs and hardcore fans’ ridiculous antics.