14 January 2008

Dangerous Bus Driving

| H1NG0
Join the conversation

Driving down Northbourne to work this morning, I witnessed a massive brainfade involving three ACTION bus drivers.

Heading South in the the left lane, I noticed three busses ahead in my lane. I switched into the middle lane presuming one of the busses would eventually stop to pick up passengers. As the first bus in the line stopped, the bus at the end of the line (3rd bus) quickly switched into the middle lane forcing the cars in front of me to hit their brakes. The second bus in the line decided to pull out as well, forcing the 3rd bus further into the right lane narrowly missing a Toyota Echo.

The ACTION drivers who switched lanes never even thought about hitting the brakes and did this at speed. I doubt they checked their mirrors as there was simply no time. Luckily, there was just enough space in each lane so nobody got hit. The funny thing is, the bus in the right lane had to switch back over all the lanes to make a quick turn left soon after. Why couldn’t they wait the 30 or so seconds it takes for the other bus to pick up the passengers? Insanity.

Join the conversation

All Comments
  • All Comments
  • Website Comments

Yeah now I think of it you’d probably end up with a speed sign for 130, closely followed by a 60 zone and a sign telling you to look out for skiing kangaroos. And pedestrian crossings everywhere….

Vigilantes do TAMS’ work for it?
What is this, bizarro world?

I think this calls for people to show ACT planners what for and take matters into their own hands – install our own speed signs, warning signs and line markings where appropriate…
: P

Yeah that bus lane is exactly what the cars need to get a decent chance at turning left. I have seen plenty of cars use it to avoid the frustration of trying to get on the roundabout. I don’t blame them.

It is a roundabout, why would someone say it isn’t? The only thing is traffic heading south bypass it, it is only used by cars going from Kingsford Smith right into Drake Brockman, William Hovell left into Drake Brockman and straight onto Kingsford Smith and of course lef from Drake Brockman into Kingsford Smith. Like I said the problem I have been speaking of usually happens at these kind of roundabouts and where there is a high speed entry with people not knowing the rules. The small roundabouts usually sort themselves out so you don’t usually get into that situation.

Agree the Russell and Woden roundabouts are shockers. I dislike the bus bypass on the Woden one, they could have included a car lane too and got a better solution. Bloody ACT road planners, bugger good roads and totally *uck the bad.

or loses an eye

oh dear, I’ve seen a few people lately try and go down the wrong way. Streets like northbourne really confuse them and they try and treat each side as two way. Saw one family turning left from the golf course, they drove across two lanes and then tried to travel the wrong way into traffic heading towards civic. What the?

JC – I think I know the Belco roundabout you speak of (slap me on the hand for not being certain of all the facts 😛 ). But I rarely go that way. Someone tried to tell me it wasn’t really a roundabout. This didn’t help me.

To be able to do anything over 60, or not have to go to third gear to handle the ’rounded’ curve of a roundabout kind of says – if you can’t slow the traffic down properly why didn’t you just put a friggin set of traffic lights in!

Being able to do 80 sounds like the silly road people just created more of a dangerous T junction.

There’s a web site somewhere where you can report dangerous intersections. Not that they really listen until someone dies…

That Woden roundabout is insane. I really don’t know how there aren’t more accidents on that thing

hingo_VRCalaisV69:23 am 17 Jan 08

The Woden roundabout is probably the worst I have seen anywhere in Australia. Sometimes it is almost impossible to get on when cars are doing the 80km/h around it (which is quite easy to do).

The other day I had a scary moment. I was driving my work car around it when I see a lady driving a Holden Barina straight towards me! Yes, she was driving the opposite way around the roundabout. I made a quick lane change to avoid her. Obviously freaked out, she pulled into the centre of the roundabout and had a good hard think about what the hell was going on.

el ......VNBerlinaV88:24 am 17 Jan 08

Most scary moments I’ve seen are people turning from the wrong lane…


And it’s standard practice in Queanbeyan.

I can think of several examples where a car could legaly enter a roundabout, not be cutting it fine and still come close to an accident. That roundabout I talk about is one, where the approach is 80km/h (it drops from 90 about 100m before hand). If we all sat and waited because someone might hit us we would never go. But in that situation it has been close.

The dumbest thing I ever saw on the roundabout was a semi enter the roundabout, with nothing in bulls roar, but being slow off the mark a car came up from William Hovell and had the hide to toot him. I was behind waiting (my turn) to enter.

And no you can give way to the left in the example I gave, but the rule is give way to anything that is already on it, regardless of left or right. Ie you should avoid hitting someone as much as they should avoid hitting you.

I will agree roundabouts are generaly safe to pull out unless someone else is already on it, except again where one leg has a high entry speed with very little traffic to slow them down.

The issue I talk about happens more at 3 way roundabouts, I can think of a few of them in the ACT. 4 way’s generally slow everyone down enough.

As for stupid roundabouts, ever driven in the UK? They are stupid, quite often they will have lights in the middle of them and to make a ‘right’ hand turn often involves changing lanes mid roundabout. With UK drivers the way they are (either stupid as or agressive beyond belief) it is pretty scary.

(And why I said you might be cutting it fine if you’re often being beeped – sorry if this was presumptuous but as above. I’m a bit stumped : (

: )

Yeah no, I think this is what got me started –

The timing of most roundabouts I can think of is such that if someone has to give way to the left then surely they were already on the roundabout and a car has pulled out in front of them.

A really small roundabout – maybe, if you both entered at the same-ish time.
A big straight roundabout, hmmmmm. yeah, but still, i reckon the car on the left, even if speeding would be on it first.


my brain : (

I think it’s both, but if you can’t find it written then the RTA probably consider that given the nature of the roundabout that the ‘give way to traffic already on the roundabout’ rule adequately incorporates the give way to the right rule. I see sense in that.

I’m actually trying to think of such an incident of someone failing to give way or pulling out in front of me, or someone else but I can’t. Most scary moments I’ve seen are people turning from the wrong lane… Roundabouts seem to flow fairly nicely otherwise.

In order to ensure smooth traffic flow it is up to up to the car on the the left to asses whether they have time to safely pull out (traffic to the right being considered as ‘oncoming traffic’). If they don’t have time to pull out, they give way. Especially on smaller suburban roundabouts.

Most of the time roundabouts are designed so that you are safe to pull out unless there is someone already on it. Even if there is someone already on the roundabout it can be perfectly safe to pull out (as long as you aren’t forcing someone to slow down and risking a collision). If giving way to the right means stopping when you had a perfectly safe gap than I can see why you would say the rule doesn’t apply 🙂

If someone has to give way to the left then surely they were already on the roundabout and a car has pulled out in front of them?

That’s where I’m a bit stumped. Ok, doing 90k’s, yep. That probably explains all the street signs you see knocked out on each corner… They’re just idiots anyway. Take evasive action, don’t go near them and just hope they write their car off on a light pole, not you.

Anyway, I got my ‘license’ from Mozilla Firefox spell check. I’m yet to get my real ‘licence’. Noooooooooooo, red underlines haunting meeee!!!!

So how abouts them buses? : P

The following links are from the NATION road rules. Even though it is from the NSW RTA they still apply in the ACT:

First giving way:


See no blanket give way to the right rule anywhere, although yes in most cases you do give way to vehicles on your right.

And roundabout rules:

They are pretty clear actually. The problem is people in this day and age are way too selfish and don’t give a rats.


my post should read, the road shouldn’t be a place for cyclists! purely for safety reasons and because of the way they’ve gone about it! widen the road, great, but making the lanes smaller….of course this was going to cause problems for buses and trucks etc.

Great driving school that one!!! The road rules I follow are the ones on the TAMS website. Which do you think is right? Yeah the driving school. I will repeat there is no such thing as a give way to the right rule. Yes in most cases that is the practical interpritation, there are however many cases now where you must also give way to the left. A round-about is one such example, although with that it is give way to everything already on the roundabout.

But yes it is up to everyone to ensure saftey on the road. I try not to be assertive without being a bully.

Oh BTW have a look at that thing with your picture on it. Unless you are American it is a drivers licence, not license!!!

el ......VNBerlinaV86:33 pm 16 Jan 08

It’s both, guys.

Give way to vehicles already on the roundabout, and give way to traffic on the right.

I think you only read part of what I wrote, maybe just the part written to you. Nevermind.

I have an old car. I go so slowly through roundabouts I get tailgated reguarily. I could fit 7 cars safely behind me on the road but by the time I’ve braked and entered a roundabout some agro is up my backside. I know how fast they go, don’t worry.

“If people did the right thing and look both LEFT and RIGHT and SLOWED DOWN and GIVE WAY as the law says it would work”

– is what I was also supporting, only with the extra angle of ‘it’s also your responsibility to take care and don’t expect people to always do this when you are on the road’ – which your comments suggest that you support

“And BTW if my nose is in the round-about I have right of way, very very simple”

– could contradict what you said was the right thing to do as quoted above as there were three other things you suggested that came into play. And you still have to give way to traffic already on the roundabout, as the road rule said.

Actually I’m still not sure how correct that is. I’d like to call an insurance company and ask : P
I actually got my license approx 8 years ago. Did you go to the driving school link? That says give way to the right and is current.

Reading through the lines we both seem to agree that it’s not all black and white though. You have every right to get annoyed at people flying recklessly through round abouts.

Just take care and don’t get hit by one of them
: )

Well Howdy great attitude you have? You suscribe to the beleif that because people do it one way it is right? What crap. People who think like you are the one’s who don’t understand the traffic flow benifits of round-abouts, I bet you hate them?. To work properly you need to be going much the same speed, WHEN you get a fool entering a round-about at 70km/h and someone from a start you can see the problem. In most cases the only reason it is cutting it fine is because people like you plough stright through not doing as the law says.

The Drake-Brockman/William Hovell one is the classic example. The problem is being a 3 way round-about and with the main approach coming from the 90Km/h William Hovell Dr and the flow into Drake Brockman from the Kingsford Smith being small there is little traffic to break the William Hovell flow. If people did the right thing and look both LEFT and RIGHT and SLOWED DOWN and GIVE WAY as the law says it would work.

And BTW if my nose is in the round-about I have right of way, very very simple. But as someone else said even if in the right you must avoid putting youtself at risk so 9/10 times when I see an indiot like Howdy flying up to the round-about I won’t go in. Sometimes you don’t know however.

One last thing there is NO WHERE in the book that has a give way to the right rule. Maybe 30 years ago.

Preachy preachy : ) sorry I’ll stop now. At this rate I’ll probably run into someone at a roundabout on the way home : P

Just want people to see the life in the car, not the car as another obstacle/challenge/ego.

Caf, exactly : ) responsibility lies on both sides. Many people speed up on roundabout entry to try and make it look like you pulled out too close and freak you out.

In JC’s example it appears both drivers believe they have right of way, universally in Australia it’s safer to go with give way to the right when in doubt.

JC – even if you make it there first you’re cutting it too fine on that roundabout. Unfort round abouts are hard to get onto in peak hour when the traffic coming from the right has flow and speed and you are trying to get out from a complete stop. And the people on the right of you are not expecting to have to slow down for the traffic on their left.
Everyone else, be defensive/courteous and slow down on roundabouts and give JC a chance to get out! (You’re supposed to go down a few gears).

Gungahlin Al11:54 am 16 Jan 08

What’s that old line about “he died defending his right of way”…?

That applies equally to the person coming from the right too though. If you’re flying up to the roundabout at great speed, and you can see someone approaching from the left entrance at a slower speed, but it’s clear that they’ll nonetheless get there before you – SLOW DOWN.

Just looking at other RTA websites and driving school literature etc they often stress that road rules are about “driving to avoid a collision” If you see someone running a red you don’t go through your green light and hope they stop, or to make a point about how ‘close they came to hitting you’ because you had right of way.

To cover every driving situation ie. a chapter on what to do when a drunk driver breaks each road rule – would be a bit ridiculous.
It’s also about common sense and avoiding potential accidents. Ever heard that an insurance company may asses your accident differently to the police? The police would say – drunk driver at fault running light, the insurance company might asses that the red light runner was already halfway across the intersection when you entered and you would have had a clear view of them and you should have been looking. Your fault.


Theoretically cars entering from the right are most likely to enter the roundabout first. Just because a car has managed to get their nose onto the roundabout first doesn’t give them the right of way to then pull out in front of someone traveling through on the right – that’s how accidents occur, no wonder you are always getting beeped. People will usually only beep you when you have put them at risk.

Driving is about being defensive – if you are involved in an accident but not at fault legally could you have avioded it? If a car starts drifting into your lane do you continue to sit next to it or slow down and merge in behind in case they are drunk off their nuts?

I believe the ‘give way to the right’ rule is a general rule that applies to most intersections (and situations where the give way rules are not clearly defined or obvious). And according to any driving school the give way to the right rule does apply to roundabouts as well. There is something separate in the rule books I believe that covers situations where the give way to the right rule applies.

And above all the give way to the right rule just makes common sense. If you don’t want to get hit drive defensively – watch other drivers in case they screw up – don’t just assume they are going to stop, not merge into you, not pull out in front of you… If they are approaching an intersection too fast get ready to brake and look for the option to change lanes (whilst watching what lane they may also be going for), don’t drive in a cars blind spot. We are all human and humans make errors.

It’s not just our pride at stake on the road it’s usually more so your life and the life of others. Cars nowadays crumple incredibly easy and even if your car has all the safety features in a roundabout accident the other person’s car may not and you could kill a baby, a passenger and end up paralised for life for the sake of your pride…

But you had right of way you cry!!!!!
So what. You saw the accident coming.

(re cars attached to the road – yeah, just a joke but a nice pipe dream for keeping us all safe : )

“Like Vice Pope, I, too, was almost hit by an ACTION bus at a roundabout in Wanniassa yesterday.
The driver disregarded the old ‘Give Way to the Right’ rule and missed my family by an inch! A frightening way to start the day. Perhaps a breath test prior to commencement of work on Sunday mornings is in order at Tuggeranong ACTION HW?

Comment by marcothepolopony — 14 January, 2008 @ 12:53 pm “

Marcothepolopony, there is no such thing as a give way to the right rule. Go read the rule book. With people beliving that no wonder we have so many problems. I bet you don’t understand the two different merging rules either

FYI the roundabout give-way rule states you must give way too all vehicles already on the roundabout. So if the bus pulls into the roundabout and you are hooning through, even from the right, then so long as the bus (or any vehicle) for that matter has entered the roundabout before you, thenYOU are the one that has to give way.

I hate the roundabout at William Hovel/Drake Brockman heading towards Belco for this reason. If turning right off Drake Brockman onto William Hovell, I wish I had a dollar for every car that failed to give way to me, hooning through without slowing down. Touch wood but I have never been hit. The crap things is these fools toot and carry on as if they are in the right.

As for giving way to buses, you have to give way if they and you are in the same lane of traffic or they are in a bus bay. But if on a multilane road like Northborne then they have no special right to change lanes. That is what the quote from the road rules says. That being said there is always the unwritten rules of the biggest vehicle has right of way!!!

Yes hingo, I’m well aware of how the thread started but it soon swayed along the lines I’m talking about with Gungahlin Al quoting Road Rule 77 – Giving Way To Buses.
Anyhow, I’d hazard a guess that no one here has ever driven a fully loaded bus in service and running 10 minutes plus late…
Care to try?

canberra towie10:10 pm 15 Jan 08

canberra bus drivers and taxi drivers are dickheads anyhow
i’m sure to get a job with either company you just need to be blind and retarded !!

Although it’s hard to tell if you are joking or serious, this will clearly never happen not because of loss of revenue, but because of the hundreds of billions, perhaps even trillions of dollars it would cost to create the necessary infrastructure through out cities and highways, plus the huge cost of manufacturing or modifying cars to suit this new car/tram system.

Trillions of dollars that we would inevitably be taken out of our tax dollars. You can have it taken out of yours if you like, I quite like the feel of actually driving my car freely though.

People driving cars and vehicles is just far too dangerous a concept. All vehicles should be attached to the ground like a train. You type in where you want to go and your vehicle takes you there safely. There could be sensors everywhere to prevent accidents.

Think about it. It would mean you could even safely drink and drive.

You know why they wont do this??? Loss of revenue. They would rather see us kill ourselves than lose money. Shame.

Holden Caulfield2:52 pm 15 Jan 08

“LOL HC! But surely your good will to all road users doesn’t extend to recumbent cyclists too??”

Bloody hell, of course it doesn’t, they’re road abusers them. 😛

hingo_VRCalaisV611:17 am 15 Jan 08

Or a nuclear warhead launched from space.

Gungahlin Al11:13 am 15 Jan 08

Nothing a lighter and fly spray flame thrower wouldn’t sort out!

I saw a nest of recumbent cyclists the other day. Scary stuff. Some say that in our climate they can produce “supernests” containing thousands of recumbents.

Gungahlin Al9:15 am 15 Jan 08

LOL HC! But surely your good will to all road users doesn’t extend to recumbent cyclists too??

PS: yes it is rather easy to reel in some tiddlers here isn’t it? 😉

Don’t worry about Big Dave. He’s just going off on his usual redneck rant without reading the full thread.

hingo_VRCalaisV68:50 am 15 Jan 08

BigDave, you may want to re-read this entire thread because you missed the point completely. This isn’t about cars not giving way to the busses, this is about busses making sudden dangerous lane changes with no prior warning. I have no problem with cars giving way to busses, its the law, but I think bus drivers take this for granted and assume people will just get out of the way in every situation.

Holden Caulfield – Wanniassa is a fine place with a useful IGA in one centre, a Woolies that does better seafood than most specialists and a pretty good bakery. It also has a High Country meatshop, from which inexpensive and usually well cut bits of dead animal can be obtained for culinary purposes. The Thai restaurant isn’t bad either and Doug Lee is one of the better GPs in town.

It has downsides (the Erindale College vermin who infest the shopping centre during term being one), but a thread about buses is not the place to unleash upon them.

@ vandam, if we are talking about Northbourne Ave, there is a bike lane going both directions on the road so it actually is a place for cyclists my friend! I tend to try and stay off the road as much as I can when there is no lane, but stupidly from the governments poor planning, plenty of them just run out and you are forced to merge in to the traffic, such as Ginnenderra Dr near UC.

Holden Caulfield12:25 am 15 Jan 08

VicePope said: “The most recent was the one who charged through a very small roundabout in Wanniassa…”

Good lord man, what stroke of misfortune took you to the depths of Wanniassa? Did your driver take a wrong turn, or were you car jacked from a more fashionable location?

Holden Caulfield12:21 am 15 Jan 08

Haha, cool, I landed a few. The Jas … it was a joke based on the usual motorist v cyclist rants this site tends to host.

As a sign of good will I’ll share my happy bus story from this morning’s commute to work.

I know that buses have right of way when moving out from bus stops, but as today’s discussion has shown it’s kind of nice, or at least polite, if Mr/Ms Bus Driver has the courtesy to check their mirrors before doing so. My rule of thumb is, if the bus driver is indicating then let them go, if not, they’re fair game.

I digress, so on this morning’s commute a bus was parked at a stop letting commuters out. After the driver was all done he/she indicated to move out and I was almost in that no man’s land of being right on the bus’ rear corner, but I did have enough time to back off to allow the bus to move out freely, which I did. However, the driver was kind enough to allow me to pass.

So, like most things in life, for every deadshit bus driver there is most likely at least one with a balanced view on life, love and the universe. Oh, and other road users, of course.

Still, nobody has answered my original question?! 😉

Isn’t it a bit funny how it’s always the bus drivers at fault?? No one ever blames the ignorant Canberra motorist who refuses to give way thus forcing the buses to move out.
My dad’s a driver and I’ve been getting on his bus from when I was a kid.
I can truthfully say that it’s the moronic attitudes and dreadful driving habits of these poeple that are the problem. What’s the problem with giving way to a bus?? Will that extra second kill you?? Why do some people find it impossible to travel behind a bus and will risk everyones’ lives trying to get in front??
As for bus bays, that’s just an excuse so more motorists can NOT give way to the bus!


Thats prob fair enough! The road is not a place where cyclists should be…sorry! A little bike at 15kph verses a car or bus or truck at 60kph+, I’m surprised there hasn’t been a few hit already.

Felix the Cat9:23 pm 14 Jan 08

,i.Did they hit any cyclists?

I have been “squeezed” by buses (the ones with one “s”…) on Wells Station Rd going into Mitchell from Gungahlin Drive (before the current roadworks). I was forced onto the footpath on at least two occasions. I was too shocked and upset to get the number of the bus. I suspect it was the same driver as it was the same time, same place on two consecutive mornings. There was no other traffic around, all the driver had to do was take the corner a little wider but no he decided to play “squash the cyclist” instead.

Vic Bitterman9:01 pm 14 Jan 08

A bunch of us play golf regularly, and one of our mob is an Action bus driver.

Last year we did a golf trip to Mulwalwa, we took several cars… my bus driving mate took his car and a couple of us were his passengers for our golfing weekend. Thinking he was a professional driver and all that.

I’ll quite simply say he is a shit house driver, incredibly scary, broke every road rule you could imagine, never sat on the speed limit, failed to give way to pretty much anything else on the road, sudden neck breaking lane changes…. fair dinkum I thought I was going to die. He’s the type of driver who turns his head away from the road to engage in conversation, including people in the back seat….

And to think, he pilots a big orange (maybe green?? dunno) thing around Canberra every day, possibly with you, your loved ones and your kids as his passengers. Someone gave him his bus licence. Scary stuff.

el ......VNBerlinaV88:32 pm 14 Jan 08


let buses pull out…

…and reduce the mini-bus population!

el ......VNBerlinaV88:28 pm 14 Jan 08

Agree with Jas’ comments above. I’m fairly sure Holden Caulfield wasn’t advocating vehicular homicide against cyclists though.

Also agree with VicePope about giving them a wide berth – probably the only effective course of action. They _do_ have right of way, and they sure as hell make the most of it.

My only other suggestion (at a higher level) would be to engineer bus stops in better locations. Countless times I’ve seen a bus pull out from the Treasury bus stop on Commonwealth Avenue (southbound) and the driver have to deliberately cut off two lanes of traffic to shift lanes in peak hour (and just think, if people actually gave way he wouldn’t need to).

“Did they hit any cyclists?”

You could just come out and say you can’t stand cyclists and wish buses would run them down willy nilly you know?

I am a cyclist by the way and although there are a terrible amount of them on the roads with no clue that go through red lights, don’t obey the road rules etc. it’s like motor bike riders, there are plenty of normal law abiding riders but its the idiots that weave in and out of traffic and ride up your ass in your blind spot that leave the impression.

Regardless of that, suggesting that you think it would be ok for a bus to hit and kill (which is what would happen if a bus hit a cyclist more than likely) a cyclist is a rather scary thought don’t you think? I have had my fair share of close calls as a cyclist on Northbourne, all in exactly the same circumstances as the drivers complaining here. Mostly buses pulling out without indicating or pulling over without indicating. Whether you are in a car or riding a bike, whats the difference? Apart from the people in the car have a far better chance of survival. For the record, I have found them to be just as much of a handful whilst driving also.

hingo_VRCalaisV63:51 pm 14 Jan 08

Bus bays would be a great solution. Works well along Marrabei drive in Gungahlin. I don’t see it happening, but its a nice idea.

Gungahlin Al3:32 pm 14 Jan 08

Solid points all around. When Tom Elliott came back to our meeting in December, we put it to him that a solution would be to build bus stop bays in the footpath area and out of the traffic lane, wherever there was sufficient space. The idea wasn’t dismissed, so it would come to follow-up and funding.

Anyway, I’ll drop an email to Tom to make sure he’s seen this thread…

Not nearly as bad as when i was waiting in woden last year.. at the interchange only to hear a bang and then see a taxi rolling down through the keep clear at the enterance to the interchange. then a bus pull up next to it.. then later driving off and stopping near the police station.

The passanger in the the taxi forgot something and forced the driver to stop at the lights..
the lights were green so the bus decided to roar around the taxi but ended up hitting it and the elderly passenger fell out onto the concrete.

As for round abouts … geez i’ve had quite a few drivers of 300 route busses pull out into the round about on athalon drive then have to stop because of an on coming car.. which then caused 5-10 cars to have to change lanes on the round about to pass the bus..

Unfortunately bus drivers often need to force themselves onto the road because if they didn’t no-one would let them out. We know they will pull out and as defensive drivers we slow down and let them.

Otherwise have you ever seen a car stuck on the side of the road try and pull out into traffic using their indicator? Pfft, serves em right, they can sit there we think as we drive by – that’s what would happen to the bus.

Needless to say I came close to being a decoration on the side of a bus once. Because a bus driver decided to follow another bus out and cut me off when I was next to him. If I had been less wary I would have been accelerating to get past and would not have made it. Luckily I wasn’t feeling very trusting at the time and was able to brake instead as he skimmed past.
That’s when they take their liberties too far. Decent bus drivers indicate, move forward slowly to show their intention and then make sure people are changing lanes and slowing down for them, they don’t pull out ‘into’ a car : P

If they want to fix the problem they probably need to address whatever is making them run behind schedule and putting on the pressure to ‘go go go’. Unrealistic bus time tables?

Pull over and wait 30 seconds? Time is money!

Holden Caulfield2:32 pm 14 Jan 08

Did they hit any cyclists?

hingo_VRCalaisV62:03 pm 14 Jan 08

Yeah Astrojax, unless the bus hit the Toyota, in which the passengers would be canned tuna. Three busses three lanes wide. As soon as I saw it my foot was on the brake followed promptly by a “Holy Shiiiiit!!!”. It could have a been huge.

yes people, but if you were in the bus and not driving your car, all would have been well…

hingo_VRCalaisV61:05 pm 14 Jan 08

I have no problem with the busses changing lanes Gungahlin Al as we all want to be on time, but they need to give sufficient notice. If a bus is turning left at the next intersection, there is no point doing the lane change as they will not be stuck behind that bus after they make the turn anyway. Its pointless. If their are cars alongside in the lane, then the car should have right of way since they are already in the lane. This was changing lanes for the sake of saving a few seconds.

marcothepolopony12:53 pm 14 Jan 08

Like Vice Pope, I, too, was almost hit by an ACTION bus at a roundabout in Wanniassa yesterday.
The driver disregarded the old ‘Give Way to the Right’ rule and missed my family by an inch! A frightening way to start the day. Perhaps a breath test prior to commencement of work on Sunday mornings is in order at Tuggeranong ACTION HW?

I go the same way to work, see it happen all the time. Saw it even moreso when I used to catch the bus. Nowadays I avoid busses like the plague…

I had a far more intimate encounter with a bus about ten years ago- one rammed my mum’s car when she was taking me to school. We were sitting in the middle of a T-intersection waiting to turn right (coming from the ‘bottom’ of the T, there was an island so room to wait) and a bus came up from behind and rammed into us. He said he couldn’t see us, since he was watching the cars coming from the left…

that was my point – surely it being safe to pull out and sufficient notice is the crux of the whole thing – most just seem to think the “law” and their magic signs on the back give them impunity to act without due notice or safely.

I was nearly run off the road when an ACTION bus driver decided to abuse their Give Way right and cross 3 lanes of traffic from the left lane of Northbourne out of a bus stop (Northbound) to the turn right slip lane into Dickson in the space of 5 metres. I had to stomp on the brakes to avoid being run into the curb, I’m not kidding.

Gungahlin Al11:44 am 14 Jan 08

The Road Rules state:

77 Giving way to buses
(1) A driver driving on a length of road in a built-up area, in the left lane or left line of traffic, must give way to a bus in front of the driver if:
(a) the bus has stopped, or is moving slowly, at the far left side of the road, on a shoulder of the road, or in a bus-stop bay; and
(b) the bus displays a give way to buses sign and the right direction indicator lights of the bus are operating; and
(c) the bus is about to enter or proceed in the lane or line of traffic in which the driver is driving.
Offence provision.
Note 1 Built-up area, bus and length of road are defined in the dictionary, left lane and left line of traffic are defined in subrule (2), and shoulder is defined in rule 12.
Note 2 For this rule, give way means the driver must slow down and, if necessary, stop to avoid a collision — see the definition in the dictionary.
Note 3 The driver of the bus must give the change of direction signal for long enough to give sufficient warning to other drivers and pedestrians — see rule 48 (2) and (3).
Note 4 Under rule 87 (1), a driver entering a marked lane, or a line of traffic, from the side of the road must give way to any vehicle travelling in the lane or line of traffic. However, the driver of a public bus does not have to give way to a vehicle if the vehicle is required to give way to the bus under this rule and it is safe for the bus to enter the lane, or line of traffic, in which the other vehicle is travelling — see rule 87 (2).
(2) In this rule:
left lane, of a road, means:
(a) the marked lane nearest to the far left side of the road (the first lane) or, if the first lane is a bicycle lane, the marked lane next to the first lane; or
(b) if there is an obstruction in the first lane (for example, a parked car or roadworks) and the first lane is not a bicycle lane — the marked lane next to the first lane.
left line of traffic, for a road, means the line of traffic nearest to the far left side of the road.

So they can change lanes and a following driver must give way when they do. Looks like the key issue is whether the driver gave “sufficient notice”.

Certainly it’s good to see ACTION drivers leapfrogging a stopped bus. We have been onto ACTION GM Tom Elliott about the stupidity of the conga lines of buses stuck in the outside lane on Northbourne (they call it “clumping”), meaning that the bus in front determines the time taken for every other bus behind it. While one stop might only be 30 seconds Hingo, by the time you add all the stops down Northbourne, you have a situation where the bus trip from Gungahlin takes about 8 minutes to Downer, then 35 minutes for the last 5 minutes worth of road.

All of that said, ACTION drivers have to start giving a bit more notice with the Give Way move. I regularly have to dodge them pulling back onto the Federal Highway northbound near the Kamberra Winery, which is an 80kph area, and therefore a very dodgy move on the driver’s part.

Action bus drivers act like they own the roads. They never give way and they change lanes without checking if there’s people there already. I’ve complained several times, but nothing ever happens about it.

If you don’t think ACTION are going to do anything about it you -could- complain to your local MLA, but then we’ll all think you’re a pansy.
Any good RiotActer knows the best way to get things done is the Vigilante Method.

don’t know but probably is one – in relation to thsoe who pull out from stops without looking – it’s arrogance associated with the give way to buses/buses have right of way pulling out form stops – they seem to take this as carte blance to opull out when the feel like it. i would have thought due care, diligence and regard for mororists close to them , along side etc comes before their right to pull out – the “put indicator on and go attitude” is bullying and not good for ACTION’s rep or road safety generally. There, I feel a little better with that off my chest!

hingo_VRCalaisV610:27 am 14 Jan 08

Yep – http://www.action.act.gov.au/contact.cfm

I figured complaining directly to ACTION would fall on deaf ears. I’m also not old and grey just yet so I’ll survive. I thought it was pretty retarded driving and needed to make sure I’m not the only one who thinks so.

Found at http://www.action.act.gov.au/contact.cfm

ACTION Feedback (online form)
Complain by email

Telephone: Call 13 17 10 or (02) 6207 7611 outside the ACT.

By post:
GPO Box 158
Canberra City ACT 2601

Have seen enough of this kind of thing to give them a wide berth. The most recent was the one who charged through a very small roundabout in Wanniassa, forcing a car already going through onto the roundabout to avoid being hit. And those who pull out from stops, sometimes without indicating, when some poor clown is halfway along their length and must either slam on the brakes or make an ill-considered move into another lane.

Buses are big and hard to drive. They spend much time on suburban roads. They have passengers, especially on school specials, who are clueless and distracting. These are reasons their drivers should be more careful, not excuses when they behave like clowns/bullies.

Anyone know if ACTION has a line/e-mail for reporting some of this stuff?

Daily Digest

Want the best Canberra news delivered daily? Every day we package the most popular Riotact stories and send them straight to your inbox. Sign-up now for trusted local news that will never be behind a paywall.

By submitting your email address you are agreeing to Region Group's terms and conditions and privacy policy.