13 May 2009

The full litany of prison complaints

| johnboy
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The Liberals Jeremy Hanson has finally got his prison complaint list online. So here goes:

    — The iris scanner only works after multiple attempts;
    — The searching of visitors is intrusive and demeaning;
    — The prison is freezing cold and prisoners have inadequate clothing:
    — The food portions are inadequate;
    — A mother and child were locked in the chamber access to the visiting area when the electronic system failed;
    — A number of doors, toilets, and door handles are faulty;
    — Prisoners are told that if they touch Mr Hargreaves glass artwork that was installed at massive expense in the visitors’ area then visits will be cancelled!

The cold is an interesting one. That can kill people over time, especially if they’re on a reduced calorie diet. (In a human rights compliant way).

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Heavs said :

Yay for H1NGO at #36. You win a prize for being hte first person to mention the big wall mounted TV’s.

You win an even better prize if you could point out where you could actually procure a couple of hundred old style tv’s that can be wall mounted? Might they have plasma TV’s because that is what is being sold in the shops now?

Well done mate, you missed the point completely. Why should they have the luxury of TV’s and internet conenctions in their cells? Sure, have a TV in a common room, but having their cells decked out with them is a joke. These people are supposed to be serving time for their crimes. In case you forgot, they are criminals. I’ll gladly donate my old AWA box.

Deadmandrinking12:44 pm 14 May 09

I’d rather mess with the bikies than the Yakuza, to be honest. The amount of power they hold in Japan is shocking. You piss them off, you leave Japan. And what about California and it’s 3 strikes law? The murder rate in California is about 5 times what it is here. To go even further – I would not want to go to jail in Brazil or South Africa (if I ever had to go to jail anywhere).

Japan is also a different society. There are specific codes of behavior within their society which we do not have, honor systems, respect, etc. A better comparison would be a California or other parts of the US, which have certain areas that have shocking crime rates (although, it’s important to remember that alot of the US is more or less as safe as we are).

Yay for H1NGO at #36. You win a prize for being hte first person to mention the big wall mounted TV’s.

You win an even better prize if you could point out where you could actually procure a couple of hundred old style tv’s that can be wall mounted? Might they have plasma TV’s because that is what is being sold in the shops now?

johnboy said :

Spideydog said :

The japanese have a tough love approach to criminals and I don’t see them “breeding harder criminals”

Ho ho ho.

Never heard of the Yamaguchi-gumi?

You also might like to look at the fatality rates in Japanese prisons, not something I’d like to see repeated here.

I didn’t say it was the correct way of doing things JB, I just countered DMD’s point that the tough approach just breeds harder criminals. It is not necessarily true, but not the right way either. Granted the Japanese example was a little extreme 😉

Spideydog said :

The japanese have a tough love approach to criminals and I don’t see them “breeding harder criminals”

Ho ho ho.

Never heard of the Yamaguchi-gumi?

You also might like to look at the fatality rates in Japanese prisons, not something I’d like to see repeated here.

Deadmandrinking said :

I agree with Jim. The role of society should include setting an example. It’s well known and well documented that societies that come down brutally on people who break their laws only breed harder criminals.

Yeah thats why we have such a fantastic rehabilitation rate with these new touchy feely prisons and “corrections” practices ……. NOT.

The japanese have a tough love approach to criminals and I don’t see them “breeding harder criminals”

I’m all for rehabilitation, but use something that works.

Mr Hargreaves artwork??? Is that of or by Mr Hargreaves?

Not that it matters. But why is Mr Hargreaves artwork not seen as the most disturbing piece de resistance on the list??

Kooky….

Deadmandrinking11:32 am 14 May 09

I agree with Jim. The role of society should include setting an example. It’s well known and well documented that societies that come down brutally on people who break their laws only breed harder criminals.

Pommy bastard said :

sunshine said :

GnT said :

couldn’t agree more…people are still people and should be treated accordingly

You missed a bit there; people are still people and should be treated accord to the way they treat society.

You want to mug, burgle rape, and abuse? Sure, you will forgive us if we don’t go the extra yards to feed and clothe you when you go to jail then, will you? After all, people are people…

Shorter PB: “He did something bad, therefore I’m allowed to do bad things to him.”

You’re arguing that two wrongs make a right. By that logic, if you forgot to pay your taxes I should be allowed to repeatedly kick you in the balls.

I have been out there quite a bit for work and never had a problem with the Iris scanners. Maybe it gets mixed up by the dilated pupils of junkies. As a person who has had a full tour of the joint, It think it is pretty swank to me. Far too nice for prisoner scum but our rubbish government thinks these people deserve big plasma TVs on their walls. It is much better than Belco Remand, Symonston or Quamby. I reckon they should have a big cup of shut the f**k up.

Blingerific said :

Well, um, it *is* a prison isn’t it? Not a holiday resort?

Sure it is not good that security measures/devices are not working as advertised but I know of office buildings (hello Campbell Park) that are constantly cold and the workers within are not equipped for those conditions yet Parliament (State or Federal) isn’t banging on about those is it?

Exactly, its a prison, for people who have committed crimes against society. Its not Club Med. I do think certain things aren’t great, like the mother and child being caught out by a security measure, but ITS A JAIL

Pommy bastard7:33 am 14 May 09

sunshine said :

GnT said :

couldn’t agree more…people are still people and should be treated accordingly

You missed a bit there; people are still people and should be treated accord to the way they treat society.

You want to mug, burgle rape, and abuse? Sure, you will forgive us if we don’t go the extra yards to feed and clothe you when you go to jail then, will you? After all, people are people…

I’m wearing my rug tonight, I knew having ice cream was a mistake. And it’s not even properly cold yet. You can certainly live without heating, and I bet the prison has some form of heating. Maybe the criminal element are used to living in fugs.

I lived in a weatherboard in yarralumla and the toilet and bathroom/laundry were outside – there was heating – a fireplace. The house was cute in summer though.

Clown Killer10:11 pm 13 May 09

As a student I lived in a weather board in Turner and we couldn’t afford heating. I remember having to put the kettle in the fridge before going to bed, because if you didn’t the water would be frozen in te morning, taps in the kitchen would freeze, even the water in the bloody dunny!

That said, I think heating a place so you can wander about in a t-shirt nd jeans when it’s -3 outside is a bit rich. A jumper, beanie and a good pair of socks should suffice for these people.

‘The Tenderness of Wolves’ is another book that makes you feel cold just reading it.

I’ve lived in several houses in Canberra with no heating. Blo*dy awful. And didn’t several old people die way back when, when there was a power failure? Or is this an urban myth.

OMG its cold…. in canberra….. in winter…… in prison?

After several weeks of smaller meals their stomachs will adjust and they won’t be fat lazy ahtards who while away their hours by thinking of ways to breach the human rights of others.

Go ask the ADFA and RMC cadets if the Army gives a flying f*** if they are a little bit chilly during training exercises out in Majura in the rocks and kangaroo s*** for weeks at a time.

Maybe they should all receive one copy of “a day in the life of Ivan Denosovich(?)” Now just reading that book makes me shiver.

I think that no matter what, they have got to be doing it better than the homeless.

Clown Killer6:20 pm 13 May 09

The iris scanner only works after multiple attempts

Warranty issue – get the people who installed it to come fix it. Alternately, stay off the drugs and after a week or so you’re retinas will become less dilated and there’ll be more iris to scan.

The searching of visitors is intrusive and demeaning

No apologies. Comprehensive physical searches of visitors is still the best way of insuring that the only contraband that gets into the prison is brought in by the security guards – they have profit margins to protect.

The prison is freezing cold and prisoners have inadequate clothing

On the one hand prison is where we send our convicted criminals as punishment, it isn’t supposed to be a venue for punishment. On the other hand they could harden the fcuk up. In the end its an easy fix, give them all a jumper.

The food portions are inadequate

You’ll find you do less in prison. You’re not running down a lane way with a DVD player under your arm any more. You don’t need the extra calories (unless you want to stay warm).

A mother and child were locked in the chamber access to the visiting area when the electronic system failed

Not much excuse for this really. Warranty issue.

A number of doors, toilets, and door handles are faulty

You’re supposed to turn the knob dipshit, not kick the door in.

Prisoners are told that if they touch Mr Hargreaves glass artwork that was installed at massive expense in the visitors’ area then visits will be cancelled!

This is just part of the rehabilitation process people – it’s called look but don’t touch. It teaches simple concepts like taking responsibility for your actions … if you damage something, you will pay a price – it’s not bloody rocket surgery.

“The searching of visitors is intrusive and demeaning”

Only if your searched in a dark room by big bloke called Bubba.

“The food portions are inadequate;”

Don’t they get prison allowances each week. Save up and have some Dominos delivered… actually, after the last Dominos pizza I tasted, I think allowing such food in that prison would violate human rights.

It all depends on the extent to which these complaints go.
For instance:
** – The iris scanner only works after multiple attempts;**
Does this mean that some one once had to scan their eye twice? Or does it mean that everyone has to scan their eye 10 times to get it to work? Or somewhere in between?

**– The searching of visitors is intrusive and demeaning;**
What is considered intrusive? Is getting asked to stand still while getting a metal detector waived over you intrusive? Is getting a pat down intrusive? Is getting an X Ray Intrusive? Is being stripped and cavity searched intrusive?
Needs to actually go into detail.

**– The prison is freezing cold and prisoners have inadequate clothing:**
This would be fairly easy to measure I would think. Look at a thermometre and say “The prison is sitting at XX degrees C in temperature. It should be at ZZ degrees C.”
Don’t just say “It’s cold”
And what is inadequate clothing? Are they running around in G strings and singlets or are they not given a spare jacket to wear while the other jacket is being cleaned?

Any of these things could be either really bad human rights/security breaches or on the other hand be someone nitpicking

peterh said :

….who in their right mind would put glass artwork into a prison?

The same kind of idiot who’d go and put fist sized stones in the foyer of the Magistrate’s Court?

Maybe the prisoners aren’t allowed to touch the glass artwork because they’ll leave finger prints on it?

– The iris scanner only works after multiple attempts;

Well, if only they weren’t all sporting dilated pupils…

– The searching of visitors is intrusive and demeaning;

Yeah, because we want the family of criminals to be bringing drugs/weapons/contraband inside so that hubby can make some money whilst being on the ‘inside’.

– The food portions are inadequate;

Doesn’t mean that the calorie intake isn’t.

GnT said :

Agree with captain – we send people to prison as punishment not for punishment.

couldn’t agree more…people are still people and should be treated accordingly

LG said :

I like the rules on the artwork. I wonder if it will be rolled out to the broader community. 10m radius at all times around the ‘pear-shaped rocks on crates’, ‘pine log native grasses’ and ‘left over industrial waste’ along the GDE – on the spot fines to be issued.

the artwork is dangerous – very sharp shardes of glass hence it best not to touch

Agree with captain – we send people to prison as punishment not for punishment.

Deadmandrinking2:39 pm 13 May 09

FC said :

Jim Jones said :

captainwhorebags said :

This reminds me of the tripe that started spewing forth when the public was told that Ivan Milat had access to a toaster.

A toaster! Well I’m just appalled.

No wonder people commit crimes: in prison everyone is just living the high life, eating toast and whatnot.

lol

I work ‘ard for me toast!

People should really step outside, walk to the park, then have a cup of coffee at a cafe, then think of how good it is that they can do it.

On the list of complaints, all of this stuff can easily be improved. Intrusive searching is nessercary, though, I’m afraid to say. Prison is always going to suck. Anyway, you can’t tell me this is worse than BRC, where they were bunking people in areas with wire-grate roofs.

Jim Jones said :

captainwhorebags said :

This reminds me of the tripe that started spewing forth when the public was told that Ivan Milat had access to a toaster.

A toaster! Well I’m just appalled.

No wonder people commit crimes: in prison everyone is just living the high life, eating toast and whatnot.

lol

At least Guantanamo Bay was warm

amarooresident22:01 pm 13 May 09

“The searching of visitors is intrusive and demeaning”

Of course it’s intrusive – that’s the whole f**king point.

I like the rules on the artwork. I wonder if it will be rolled out to the broader community. 10m radius at all times around the ‘pear-shaped rocks on crates’, ‘pine log native grasses’ and ‘left over industrial waste’ along the GDE – on the spot fines to be issued.

captainwhorebags said :

This reminds me of the tripe that started spewing forth when the public was told that Ivan Milat had access to a toaster.

A toaster! Well I’m just appalled.

No wonder people commit crimes: in prison everyone is just living the high life, eating toast and whatnot.

screaming banshee1:17 pm 13 May 09

dammit, chain gang

screaming banshee1:16 pm 13 May 09

For those inmates that have taken away the human/civil rights of others I feel no pity for when they themselves have their human/civil rights taken away

We could always give them nice warm orange jump suits and start a chain gain….plenty of litter on the highways. Prisoners might take offence though, what with looking like Palavi and all.

I can end this thread now for us. the rest will basically read:

– rabble-rabble…prisoners are scum, bring back the stocks, etc.

back in your box ‘people’. go back to your tabloids and current affairs shows.

Sounds like the outcome of most act gov projects. Lots of stuff-ups.

Meh.

Now that the Greens are part of the Government, someone has to come up with vacuous reasons to poo-bar the decision making of the powers that be.

PBO said :

I would love to see Emporor Corbell ….

You lost me right there.. Emporor Corbell.. Thats one thing I would love not to see, thanks all the same
*shudders*

captainwhorebags12:48 pm 13 May 09

Blingerific: typically office workers have the ability to wear warmer clothes, get more food, use a toilet in a different part of a building etc. Comparing an office to a prison is a bit of a stretch (no matter how much you may hate your job).

TP 3000: The punishment is deprivation of liberty. I’m no fan of criminals, but I am a believer that the function of prisons is to keep dangerous people out of society, not inflict additional punishments such as freezing cells and insufficient food rations. If they can be rehabilitated along the way, even better.

This reminds me of the tripe that started spewing forth when the public was told that Ivan Milat had access to a toaster.

Perhaps make the prison yard into a colesseum and we can pit prisoners against one another, charge an entry fee and our prisons become self supporting. I would love to see Emporor Corbell giving a Massey the thumbs down.

My thoughts on a prison is where the inmates get whomped around the clock, it is cold and dingly and there is only general population, no special protection for peadophiles or rapists. This is not meant to be a holiday camp ppl.

Perhaps we should consider Sharia law in our prisons?

I suppose if the Liberals had built the Hume Gaol, then it would of been better then the Hyatt Canberra? Now while these prisoners aren’t the lowest of the lowest. They have still ruined innocent victims lives & so why shouldn’t they be punished for it? Have a look at when the Daily Telegraph went into NSW’s Maximum Security Prison (http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,25450641-5006009,00.html).

I have one sentence that use to go around in prisons “Toughen up Princess!!”

Well, um, it *is* a prison isn’t it? Not a holiday resort?

Sure it is not good that security measures/devices are not working as advertised but I know of office buildings (hello Campbell Park) that are constantly cold and the workers within are not equipped for those conditions yet Parliament (State or Federal) isn’t banging on about those is it?

his list is titled “NEW PRISON IS NO BETTER THAN THE OLD ONE” is there an old one?

where is it?

who in their right mind would put glass artwork into a prison?

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