28 October 2010

31 October 2011 the last day for light plastic shopping bags

| johnboy
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[First filed: Oct 27, 2010 @ 10:31]

plastic bags

Simon Corbell has announced the end of light plastic shopping bags with the final ban to be in place from 1 November next year.

Before panicking bear in mind there will be many exemptions:

The Plastic Shopping Bags Ban Bill 2010 will ban the supply of plastic shopping bags of 35 microns or less, generally the type distributed through supermarkets, grocery stores and takeaway food outlets.

A range of bags will be unaffected by the ban, including barrier bags of the type dispensed from a roll to hold items such as fruit or meat and heavier retail bags used in department, footwear and clothing stores.

The Government expects that retailers will provide a range of bags to consumers to replace light weight plastic bags including reuseable ‘green’ bags, paper bags and biodegradable bags which meet Australian Standard AS 4736-2006. The sale of plastic bin liners for waste containers in the home is unaffected by the ban.

I’m still not sure how we’re getting greasy take-away home without making a mess in the car, but we’re going to find out.

UPDATE: The Greens’ Caroline Le Couteur has expressed her pleasure at this piece of Green policy being adopted.

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Jim Jones said :

Honestly, it’s just getting rid of plastic bags, it’s not some sort of human rights abuse. The sky isn’t going to fall and Nazis won’t be riding dinosaurs through rivers of blood.

How is Nazis riding dinosaurs through rivers of blood a human right abuse? Personally I reckon that would be worth a looksee.

colourful sydney racing identity11:59 am 11 Nov 10

Jim Jones said :

Disabled people can use cloth bags or whatever else type of bag they might own: they’re disabled, not stupid.

It’s easier to carry things with prams (most have ample cargo space).

The elderly are usually much better at planning ahead for shopping trips than their younger cohorts.

Honestly, it’s just getting rid of plastic bags, it’s not some sort of human rights abuse. The sky isn’t going to fall and Nazis won’t be riding dinosaurs through rivers of blood.

+1

Disabled people can use cloth bags or whatever else type of bag they might own: they’re disabled, not stupid.

It’s easier to carry things with prams (most have ample cargo space).

The elderly are usually much better at planning ahead for shopping trips than their younger cohorts.

Honestly, it’s just getting rid of plastic bags, it’s not some sort of human rights abuse. The sky isn’t going to fall and Nazis won’t be riding dinosaurs through rivers of blood.

Seems Im a bit late to the party, but how will this work for the disabled? Sure, an able-bodied person might be able to easily carry a box or paper bag of their goodies, but what happens for the little old lady on a walking-frame, who needs to buy a couple of items? Does she have to use a box? Does she have to pay 10c, because she is physically unable to carry the items without the assistance of a bag? Is she required to carry her own bags with her, just in-case she decides to make a purchase?

What about people on bicycles? Are you likely to be able to carry a cardboard box on your handlebars? What about parents with prams? Its much easier to hang a plastic bag off the pram handle than balance a box above your baby’s head.

CraigT said :

Real change will have occurred when people are eating seasonal local produce instead of produce that’s been trucked back and forth across the country for weeks.

The government will need to do this by:
– increasing taxes on freight so the rest of us stop subsidising road maintenance for the benefit of trucks
– increasing the availability of land for growing food on – release land for market-gardens and put an end to postage-stamp-sized blocks with over-sized houses on them
– increased funding for education to teach children and adults the basics of horticulture and agriculture

I was surprised by how many people posting say they buy their veges and fruit from the supermarket. I am not even sure its real food sometimes.

Like this guy says, take your canvas bags to the supermarket.

Woody Mann-Caruso said :

What is this ‘newspaper’ that you speak of?

It’s wonderful stuff. I print all my Google News articles on A3 so I can wrap up more tampons.

I hope I never meet a woman who uses A3 tampons.
I might only have a wee organ but it was not meant to played in a cathedral…

Jim Jones said :

Let me get this straight, because you won’t get some plastic bags free at the supermarkets anymore:

– the elderly will be driven to the poor house
– we’ve become a totalitarian state
– and, finally, we should never bother taking small steps to address environmental problems

Is that right?

Not exactly. Small steps such as these are taken in place of much larger and more difficult steps. They replace them. Where is the conversation about limiting economic growth and consumption in general?
It will never occur as long as we think our plastic bag-less, Prius driving, garden composting ‘little steps’ are making a difference.

Or you can use one of the cardboard boxes the supermarket has heaps of.

Frano said :

However, what about situations where you make an impromptu run into the shop. Such as:
1. You get off the bus after work. You have a 5/10 minute walk home. You then decide to duck into the supermarket to get milk, bread, eggs, vegemite. Not a major shop, but you can’t really carry these items by yourself..

Yes, you can. You just need to plan ahead. I planned ahead years ago by buying and always travelling with a bag that when empty is light and not too large – but can fit a slab of beer.

This issue is all about forcing change on people. Unfortunately there are plenty of people not keen to otherwise tolerate losing some degree of convenience, or lacking enough foresight to prevent being inconvenienced, and without the imagination to see how easily alternatives can be arranged.

chewy14 said :

I think the point is, that this small step isn’t actually going to achieve anything.

Some initiates are just to remind you of a larger problem. (Nudging?) I’m not saying this is one of them, but if people are reminded to ‘save the planet’ every time they buy something, I have no problem with it.

Thumper said :

I tend to use plastic bags as bait when fishing for endangered sea turtles.

Not sure what i’ll use now.

Tampons, naturally.

sepi said :

Frano – do you think All plastic shopping bags are used as bin liners? Every single one?

Where is all that rubbish coming from. Surely after you consume all the food you’ve carried home, there should be a bit less to go back out to the bin in the empty bag?

And to those commenting about supermarkets overpackaging food (eg – 8 cheery tomatoes in a plastic tray inside a plastic sleeve etc), I agree. We can go after them next.

I think the last statistic I read was that 80% of households re-used their plastic bags for other purposes (don’t have a source). Obviously that doesn’t account for all plastic bags.

What I really don’t like about this policy is the banning aspect.
I would have no problem if the government was able to put a levy on plastic bags so that those who were using plastic bags had to pay for them.
Unfortunately they don’t have the power to do it.

Thoroughly Smashed1:50 pm 28 Oct 10

Proudof Canberra said :

This is becomming a totalitarian fascist state.

Hahahahahahahaha.

Frano – do you think All plastic shopping bags are used as bin liners? Every single one?

Where is all that rubbish coming from. Surely after you consume all the food you’ve carried home, there should be a bit less to go back out to the bin in the empty bag?

And to those commenting about supermarkets overpackaging food (eg – 8 cheery tomatoes in a plastic tray inside a plastic sleeve etc), I agree. We can go after them next.

Amanda Hugankis1:12 pm 28 Oct 10

Woody Mann-Caruso said :

What is this ‘newspaper’ that you speak of?

It’s wonderful stuff. I print all my Google News articles on A3 so I can wrap up more tampons.

What’s black and white and read all over! Ha!

Bahahahahahahhahaha. Boom tish!

I’m investigating above suggestions to save the enviornment and my counter-top. Now we need suggestions on disposing of cat litter – Yowler Hugankis will only use crystals, and while biodegradeable, have no garden to dump them in. Outside groceries, we don’t shop a lot to be able to get other bags, so how to dispose environmentally? What do others do?

chewy14 said :

Jim Jones said :

So, Frano, because one act won’t ‘save the planet’ in and of itself, we should completely give up on making small steps towards better environmental policy?

I think the point is, that this small step isn’t actually going to achieve anything.

It’s not better environmental policy if it doesn’t work.

It will reduce the amount of plastic bags being used – that’s something.

As others have pointed out, it’s already been successfully implemented in other Australian states, and in other countries (strangely, none of these countries have burst into fire yet).

Jim Jones said :

So, Frano, because one act won’t ‘save the planet’ in and of itself, we should completely give up on making small steps towards better environmental policy?

I think the point is, that this small step isn’t actually going to achieve anything.

It’s not better environmental policy if it doesn’t work.

So, Frano, because one act won’t ‘save the planet’ in and of itself, we should completely give up on making small steps towards better environmental policy?

bd84 said :

Oh all thses poor souls getting their knickers in a twist about losing their precious bin liners and actually having to purchase some. Boo fricken hoo. All you need is one bin inside the house, the type of bin liners for that bin are already sold in the supermarket. You will actually spend money to buy them and just have to get off your lazy asses and walk to it to dispose of your waste.

bd84, you like many others on here just don’t get it. The purchase of bin liners is NOT the issue. I couldn’t care less if there were only 1cent for 1000 bags. I will buy them in future and then use them as bin liners (I will not walk out to my green bin every time, especially at night in mid winter as some on here have suggested)….these bags will then end up as land fill just like the shopping bags do currently. How banning of some bags but allowing the purchase of others will save the planet is beyond me?!!?

I tend to use plastic bags as bait when fishing for endangered sea turtles.

Not sure what i’ll use now.

James-T-Kirk10:30 am 28 Oct 10

avengerness said :

Personally, I can’t use normal dog poo bags to pick up after my dog (they are too small) so I use shopping bags

Nooooo – The dog is doing a poo – RUN FOR IT!!!

That must be a *lot* of poo!

Woody Mann-Caruso10:20 am 28 Oct 10

What is this ‘newspaper’ that you speak of?

It’s wonderful stuff. I print all my Google News articles on A3 so I can wrap up more tampons.

What’s black and white and read all over! Ha!

Target introduced this a while ago and I think its fantastic

The reason why you’ll be charged for shopping bags instead of getting them free is because they won’t be the usual plastic bags you’re used to, they will be biodegradable bags

I’m quite happy for the government to regulate this, unfortunately there are too many people in this world that only care for themselves & what’s easy for them rather than putting a bit of thought about the enviroment

Woody Mann-Caruso9:36 am 28 Oct 10

You say we have to start somewhere. Well, I say you’re starting us down a dark road…TO COMMUNISM. If it doesn’t fix everything at once with no inconvenience to me, I’m against it!

Jim Jones said :

Let me get this straight, because you won’t get some plastic bags free at the supermarkets anymore:

– the elderly will be driven to the poor house
– we’ve become a totalitarian state
– and, finally, we should never bother taking small steps to address environmental problems

Is that right?

I think you got the first one wrong. My reference to the sick and elderly was to say that some people *do* need a bin in every room, because they can’t walk to the other end of the house every time they got rubbish or recycling. That is not to say that each bin has to be lined with a supermarket bag or a bought bin liner.

As for becoming a totalitarian state, some posters remind me of Americans, who, when introduced to the concept of water restrictions, say, “We would never stand for that!”.

Let me get this straight, because you won’t get some plastic bags free at the supermarkets anymore:

– the elderly will be driven to the poor house
– we’ve become a totalitarian state
– and, finally, we should never bother taking small steps to address environmental problems

Is that right?

I’m so ‘Glad’ I haven’t bought into this issue – until I saw a dead possum down by the lakeside, wrapped in a plastic bag

Real change will have occurred when people are eating seasonal local produce instead of produce that’s been trucked back and forth across the country for weeks.

The government will need to do this by:
– increasing taxes on freight so the rest of us stop subsidising road maintenance for the benefit of trucks
– increasing the availability of land for growing food on – release land for market-gardens and put an end to postage-stamp-sized blocks with over-sized houses on them
– increased funding for education to teach children and adults the basics of horticulture and agriculture

Amanda Hugankis said :

That’s good – cos I sure as hell dont want to start trying to compost tampons/pads and what-have-you. The only other ‘environmental’ solution I can see is just wrap these up in newspaper, and place on the countertop till we go out to our wheelie bins/hoppers.

Amanda, me neither! I never thought of newspaper; good idea.

I save the small plastic bags which I would be throwing out anyway, eg bread bags and carefully-opened toilet paper/biscuit packaging etc. With the transparent plastic bags, I put the item in, give the bag a twist, and put the item in again, then tie it. This ‘double bags’ it to guard against holes in the bag and identification of the item.

I also carefully open envelopes so I have a stock of them to use for this sort of thing.

bd84, some people don’t have lazy asses, some have sick asses or they are old, but I think technology will help us all.

One day, all packaging will be made of cornstarch. I’ve bought greeting cards in cornstarch bags.

Window dressing – completely meaningless given the amount of packaging of thousands of products in supermarkets. At least shopping bags served a purpose as opposed to most of the packaging of items everyone buys. This is a smokescreen to hide the real problems of plastic packaging and make people think change is occurring. They’ll never go after manufacturers who will keep wrapping products in several layers of plastic and paper just to make them look pretty.

Oh all thses poor souls getting their knickers in a twist about losing their precious bin liners and actually having to purchase some. Boo fricken hoo. All you need is one bin inside the house, the type of bin liners for that bin are already sold in the supermarket. You will actually spend money to buy them and just have to get off your lazy asses and walk to it to dispose of your waste.

People have thought getting a free plastic bag with their shopping is their god given right for too long. A plastic bag for their chocolate bar, loaf of bread, bottle of milk complete with handle, a packet of chips, a packet of cigarettes. Heard every excuse in the book, no plastic bags do not keep your cold foods cold, yes you do not need to triple bag your 1.25L bottle of coke. It really is rediculous, to a point where I even think its a good idea to ban them when I’m not even normally that environmentally minded.

Build an environmentally friendly bridge and get over it. You can cry a river to go under it for the next 12 months anyway, just do it quietly.

Why should one have to pick up dog poo, it’s environment friendly, isn’t it, honestly it’s becoming a communist country

I recently bought takeaway from a great Indian place in Melbourne and waqs impressed that it was packed up in a custom-made thick cardboard box for carrying home. Very handy.

That aside, I am thrilled about this news – all the dolphins in Lake Burley Griffin are now safe from death by plastic bag.

Thank god our leaders are addressing the things that really matter: perverted marriages and bans on plastic bags. This society of ours is clearly built to last.

noone i know is saying that becuase we are banning plastic bags we can do whatever else we like guilt free.

This is a step in the right direction – about time too.

No single action is going to be dramatic, but lots of things like this will add up to a result.

Bags you have had to pay for will be more likely to be used and reused, rather than easily disposed of as there are always more turning up. You might even find you are starting to use other bags, such as bread bags, for a second purpose.

“Sigh – and when there are no longer newspapers, what then?”

What is this ‘newspaper’ that you speak of?

Amanda Hugankis said :

The only other ‘environmental’ solution I can see is just wrap these up in newspaper, and place on the countertop till we go out to our wheelie bins/hoppers.

I-filed said :

Sigh – and when there are no longer newspapers, what then?

Well, I would’ve thought that was obvious – counter-tops and benches worldwide will become overrun with used tampons, society will decay even further, and the reptoids will finally enact their evil plan for world domination.

On the flipside, I believe the reptoids have different ideas about publicly funded artwork and cycle lanes.

georgesgenitals9:16 pm 27 Oct 10

I-filed said :

Amanda Hugankis said :

The only other ‘environmental’ solution I can see is just wrap these up in newspaper, and place on the countertop till we go out to our wheelie bins/hoppers.

Sigh – and when there are no longer newspapers, what then?

What is this heresy?

This is the end of the world as we know it.

what a waste of time and money. oh well, at least people will feel happy thinking they are making a difference. i’m all for making changes that actually improve the environment, but can someone please explain to me how this move will REDUCE plastic bags in landfill? People need to put rubbish into something, and if not for shopping bags it will be actual rubbish bags purchased (making companies like Glad very happy).

all this does is help the bottom line for companies…. woolies gets to sell cotton bags, and rubbish bag makers get to sell more units.

here’s a bright idea…. how about bringing in legislation that reduces wasteful and non biodegradible packaging? less plastics used = less plastics to throw away.

but no no no… dont actually make legislation that makes a difference, lets just all feel happy in the false knowledge that we are making a difference. this costs the government nothing, but earns it ‘green votes’ from people who really have no idea how ineffective this measure really is.

Amanda Hugankis said :

The only other ‘environmental’ solution I can see is just wrap these up in newspaper, and place on the countertop till we go out to our wheelie bins/hoppers.

Sigh – and when there are no longer newspapers, what then?

Could someone more knowledgeable please explain how the plastic bags that I buy to line my bins are not nearly as bad as the ones I’m given to line my bins?

Thanks.

georgesgenitals8:12 pm 27 Oct 10

That’s a top idea – I’ll buy one next month.

PantsMan said :

Jethro said :


Now the other 99.999% of crap we do to the earth can be forgotten.

+1

Proudof Canberra said :

This is becomming a totalitarian fascist state.

Stupid.Stupid.Stupid

+1

+2+2

moneypenny26128:00 pm 27 Oct 10

Amanda Hugankis said :

That’s good – cos I sure as hell dont want to start trying to compost tampons/pads and what-have-you. The only other ‘environmental’ solution I can see is just wrap these up in newspaper, and place on the countertop till we go out to our wheelie bins/hoppers.

Instead of tampons/pads, perhaps you might like to consider using a lunette (moon) cup?

Reuseable and much more comfortable and hygienic than a tampon. The manufacturer also sells reuseable cloth pads (which is really back to the future – just like nana…).

I’ve been using a lunette for years and have no regrets and no dramas: http://www.lunette.com.au/

JC said :

schmeah said :

Most people have those recycable green bags now anyway, so hopefully this won’t be too controversial! My impression of Canberra – after 3 years – is that it’s a far more eco-friendly city than elsewhere in the country (except for those old buses .. )

I know this is getting OT a bit, but the comment above shows how much you know. Whilst sure ACTION does have old buses, our old buses are still much newer than any other government operator in the country. ACTION normally gets rid of theirs around the 15-18 year mark, whereas other operators, including Adelaide between 20 and 25 years.

Also the greenhouse gas emission that these busses emit would more than likely be less than it takes to build a new one.

Jethro said :


Now the other 99.999% of crap we do to the earth can be forgotten.

+1

Proudof Canberra said :

This is becomming a totalitarian fascist state.

Stupid.Stupid.Stupid

+1

The emissions caused by the Canberra Glassworks would be sufficient to manufacture about 1 billion plastic bags … hypocrisy much, ACT Govt?

Proudof Canberra7:19 pm 27 Oct 10

This is totally idiotic.Plastic bags are now so biodegradeable the come apart before you are even finished with them.

Plastic bags are not killing the planet. Banning them will not change anything.

This is becomming a totalitarian fascist state.

Stupid.Stupid.Stupid

Not banned in Victoria yet. What about NSW?

Nice try Amanda Hugankis (??), but instilling an image of your sanitary by-products isn’t going to make the policy any less appealing. It’s all very tiring.

As mentioned, the supermarkets aren’t taking away your right to a plastic bag, they’re just making you part with all of 10 cents if you need one. And why can’t you use other bags for your rubbish – such as those you get when you buy a pair of shoes, or a book, or whatever it is?

And if you’re really desperate, try a Diva Cup http://www.bumbles.co.nz/products/The-Diva-Cup.html that way you’ll never have to worry about leaving your tampon anywhere.

it’s amazing that we even have to debate topics such as this…..yet when it comes to war, mobile speed cameras etc, the gov jump right in and do what they like

Who said the ACT government (with the Greens) couldn’t deliver real, effective and significant change?

This is a perfect example of the stupidity that is the human race.

‘Oh wow. We have banned plastic bags. Aren’t we a good bunch of people.”

Now the other 99.999% of crap we do to the earth can be forgotten.

Until we stop living in a society based on consumption and a fascination with non-stop economic growth, gestures like this are completely meaningless.

Meaningless clap trap.

georgesgenitals said :

You mean I’ll have to pay an extra 5 cents for a bag at Woolies? Oh the humanity!

Are they giving that option though?

I don’t care if I have to pay 5c for a bag, so be it. Banning them entirely though (if that’s the case) is a little OTT on an issue that is so far down in the list of things that could be addressed if the phony greens and labor actually WANTED to help the environment. It’s a rubbish (pardon the pun) token gesture and smacks of a commercial money grab to force people to buy bags for all sorts of waste that the shopping bags are currently used for.

Personally, I can’t use normal dog poo bags to pick up after my dog (they are too small) so I use shopping bags, heaps of other people do that around my suburb too. With no bins around here either, I reckon we could be in for a little more doggy poo being left around due to this law. Unless we of course still have the option to buy the bags at 5c.

Why are people so happy to be government regulated/nanny state ‘protected’ on everything these days?

What the hell happened to choice?

For the next year, I am going to put each individual item I buy at Woollies into a separate plastic bag including individual pieces of fruit, and start stashing and hoarding …

schmeah said :

Most people have those recycable green bags now anyway, so hopefully this won’t be too controversial! My impression of Canberra – after 3 years – is that it’s a far more eco-friendly city than elsewhere in the country (except for those old buses .. )

I know this is getting OT a bit, but the comment above shows how much you know. Whilst sure ACTION does have old buses, our old buses are still much newer than any other government operator in the country. ACTION normally gets rid of theirs around the 15-18 year mark, whereas other operators, including Adelaide between 20 and 25 years.

Amanda Hugankis4:54 pm 27 Oct 10

3Jane said :

emd said :

Now if I could just find a small bin the right size for those little cornstarch bags, the compost bin liner issue would be solved too.

emd, where do you get your cornstarch bags, how big are they and how much do they cost?

I recently bought a MaxAir Compost Bin, but unless I find another source, I have to buy rolls of 8L compostable bags from the manufacturer, plus shipping.

They also make All Purpose compostable Bags, for nappies, landfill, shopping, what-have-you. http://www.biobaganz.com/compostable-biodegradable-plastic-kitchen-bags.htm

That’s good – cos I sure as hell dont want to start trying to compost tampons/pads and what-have-you. The only other ‘environmental’ solution I can see is just wrap these up in newspaper, and place on the countertop till we go out to our wheelie bins/hoppers.

georgesgenitals4:54 pm 27 Oct 10

You mean I’ll have to pay an extra 5 cents for a bag at Woolies? Oh the humanity!

emd said :

Now if I could just find a small bin the right size for those little cornstarch bags, the compost bin liner issue would be solved too.

emd, where do you get your cornstarch bags, how big are they and how much do they cost?

I recently bought a MaxAir Compost Bin, but unless I find another source, I have to buy rolls of 8L compostable bags from the manufacturer, plus shipping.

They also make All Purpose compostable Bags, for nappies, landfill, shopping, what-have-you. http://www.biobaganz.com/compostable-biodegradable-plastic-kitchen-bags.htm

I’m a bit surprised that no-one has brought up the pricing of plastic bag alternatives.

I have no problem with the banning of plastic bags but I do wonder why I am asked to pay an additional sum of money by the retailer for an alternative, when previously they have provided a bag as part of the cost of purchase (the assumption therefore being that the cost of the plastic bag is built into the price of the product being purchased).

Sorry for being a bit cynical but this just seems to be another example of environmental policy where the cost is passed yet again onto the end consumer (currently doing some building works around the house so don’t get me started on the topic…)

Chill out guys, the 2012 apocalypse will kill us all anyway.

I imagine many retailers will just switch to the EPI or similar bags, that said many have ALREADY made the switch, and it didn’t end in riots.

Lets all have a valium and a J.

schmeah said :

Fano, why don’t you look at the South Australian model – it’s been implemented since 2008 and there haven’t been riots because people have found themselves unpredicatably at the shops without a bag. They just have to pay 5cents (or whatever it is to use a bag – Borders in Civic also uses this option).

+1 It’s not a levy, because the stores will pass that cost on to customers anyway. It’s more like, “you want a bag, then pay for the privilege.” And the cost is kept by the store.

James-T-Kirk3:00 pm 27 Oct 10

Thoroughly Smashed said :

Change, oh no!

I always find it funny how willing some people are to kick up a fuss over life’s trivialities.

Maybe I can contribute… Yes that’s it, if I forget my green bags, I’ll have to drive back home to get them! Personal responsibility be damned, take that environmental policy!

+1

James-T-Kirk2:58 pm 27 Oct 10

Now, good people is the correct time to enter the market for making 36 micron bags.

What a twit!

schmeah said :

Oh, John Boy – is that a tin of ‘pal’ dog food I see? Do you know how bad that crap is? it’s like feeding your pooch a big mac every day!

S’ok. It’s not for the dog.

More subscribers now so JB can eat properly!

I predict massive panic buying of shopping bags by the morbidly stupid.

Fano, why don’t you look at the South Australian model – it’s been implemented since 2008 and there haven’t been riots because people have found themselves unpredicatably at the shops without a bag. They just have to pay 5cents (or whatever it is to use a bag – Borders in Civic also uses this option).

Amazingly enough, the South Australian model has also come up very favourably – they even researched community attitudes to it 1 year on;

http://www.zerowaste.sa.gov.au/upload/ExecSummary_PlasticBagBan_Research.pdf

Big deal, you get off the bus and you have to go to the shops and you don’t have a bag! This happens to me all the time, what do I do – I buy what I REALLY need, and carry it home and if it fits in my bag (as I imagine you too often travel around with a bag of some description) I put it in my bag just the same.

If peeople are so concerned about bin liners, than save the bags you will still get from everywhere else and use them as a bin. Or buy a composter, put your waste in there and then sell it to people in the neighbourhood who have gardens and are in need of compost.

These petty arguments about something that has been a very long time in the pipeline are so counterproductive. It’s a small step sure, but it’s a step nonetheless. Stop moaning about how much you’ll be inconvenienced (when really you’re just sounding lazy)!

I own a retail shop, and I have never used lightweight plastic bags. I tried cornstarch biodegradable bags, but found that large, sturdy brown paper bags were better value for money and looked nicer too.

Do you know you don’t actually have to use a bin liner bag at all? You can just chuck all the rubbish directly into the big green bin. Just hose it out regularly, and it won’t be a problem. I have at times resorted to a liner for the nappy bucket (cloth nappies, not landfillers), but have found those roll-up nylon bags are a good fit, washable, and don’t hold stains. Now if I could just find a small bin the right size for those little cornstarch bags, the compost bin liner issue would be solved too.

Once upon a time, there were no plastic bags, and our grandparents seem to have survived the experience. I’m sure we will survive too.

KB1971 said :

cmdwedge said :

KB1971 said :

TVStar said :

Does Lin Hatfield Dodds still have here 4wd?

All cars are environmentally unfriendly, not just 4WD’s.

Brake pad life: Small cars can get exceptional brake pad wear, I have seen a Nissan Pulsar get 120,000km out of a set of pads. 4WD’s also get similar brake pad wear, I have a mate with a 1993 Toyota Hulux, 290,000km on its original brake pads. Brake pad wear is also variable due to driving styles. Falcons & Commodores, I replaced a set of pads at 9,000km in a Falcon once.

Overall vehicle quality: many 4wd’s are built stronger & last longer that your average 2wd car reducing the amount of natural resources required to build another one (I am not taking the original drain on resources in this statement, just the follow on.)

Citation needed

Thoroughly Smashed said :

Maybe I can contribute… Yes that’s it, if I forget my green bags, I’ll have to drive back home to get them! Personal responsibility be damned, take that environmental policy!

If you are planning to go to the supermarket, then yes it is not much of an effort to take your ‘environmental’ bags with you. However, what about situations where you make an impromptu run into the shop. Such as:
1. You get off the bus after work. You have a 5/10 minute walk home. You then decide to duck into the supermarket to get milk, bread, eggs, vegemite. Not a major shop, but you can’t really carry these items by yourself.. It is not practical to walk home, then walk/drive back to the shop again.
2. You work in a major hub (Civic, Belco, Tuggers, etc) and you need a few groceries for work or home. You decide to walk across to the mall. You have no bag?

Will we be able to ‘buy’ a bag adhoc?
I guess we can buy bin liners in the supermarket and then use them as our shopping bag….which will then end up as a bin liner at home….and then, oh dear landfill!

Has anyone looked at the flow-on effects?

p.s. Before some off you go off at me, I recycle heavily, but this just seems another ill-conceived feel-good idea.

I’ve often wondered what the point of this is when everyone is still using garbage bags and bin liners for their rubbish bins. Surely they need to look at making those bags biodegradable/recycled also? Instead it seems the new focus is on making plastic garbage bags and bin liners smell like citrus or mint. It really doesn’t figure.

CMDwedge:

Interesting article in Drive.com today:

http://news.drive.com.au/drive/sydney-motor-show/fuel-economy-is-fools-gold-says-suzuki-20101018-16pr9.html

TVStar, you you have a point there but to be honest, I travel domestically quite a bit & the with the business class seats up the front of a 737 you might only just get one more row of seats in there, 6 more people is hardly an evironmental disaster.

Cant comment on larger aircraft.

& no I dont work for Climate Change.

GardeningGirl1:15 pm 27 Oct 10

Wish people would just adopt an attitude of reducing waste and pollution. I don’t like these token bans while other problems, equally or even more valid, go unaddressed. Yes, it’s a CONSPIRACY to make us feel like we’re doing something! (Couldn’t resist.)

KB1971 said :

TVStar said :

KB1971 said :

What does a first class ticket have to do with the environment?

I can’t argue with stupidity. Sorry.

What yours?

So, instead of actually backing up your points when challenged you just resort to a personal attack?

Stupid is as stupid does………

Clearly, a first class ticket involves more space and weight on a plane, which leads to more fuel being consumed. While flying on a long-haul flight is actually one of the most energy efficent forms of transport, first class tickets, which cost many times more, are a waste of the world’s resources.

You don’t work at the Department of Climate Change do you? Ever been on a Climate Change junket?

cmdwedge said :

KB1971 said :

TVStar said :

Does Lin Hatfield Dodds still have here 4wd?

All cars are environmentally unfriendly, not just 4WD’s.

I would wager that my little Honda Jazz is more environmentally friendly than LH-D’s V8 4WD. It’s just amazing to see the Greens defend the indefensible. Yes, all cars are environmentally unfriendly. Are they EQUALLY environmentally unfriendly? Or are you just butthurt that the Greens spent $500K on a campaign which netted exactly 0 seats?

Agreed. Some more than others but people tend to think that drving a small car is a magic bullet.

Some examples of the lack of equality when people look at 4WD’s (given it is only in the last 5 years that 4 cylinder vehicles have become uber fuel efficient, anyone remember the 2.6 Magna?)

Fuel cost: Yes there is a fair difference in fuel cost with some 4wd’s such as the V8 Landcruiser using near 20lt/100km. That is an extreme, most COMMON 4wd’s now have common rail direct injection diesel engines with a prticulate filter. The Nissan Pathfinder comes to mind, used 11l/100 around town, not much more than say a Mazda 6 with its 4 cylinder engine. Smaller front wheel drive cars use a lot less but I might also add the fuel consumption is a variable thing.

Tyre cost: most cars that are not 4wd’s will get about 30-40,000km from a set of tyres. 4wd’s can get consistently 80-100,000km from a set of tyres (depending on tyre choice some get more).

Brake pad life: Small cars can get exceptional brake pad wear, I have seen a Nissan Pulsar get 120,000km out of a set of pads. 4WD’s also get similar brake pad wear, I have a mate with a 1993 Toyota Hulux, 290,000km on its original brake pads. Brake pad wear is also variable due to driving styles. Falcons & Commodores, I replaced a set of pads at 9,000km in a Falcon once.

Overall vehicle quality: many 4wd’s are built stronger & last longer that your average 2wd car reducing the amount of natural resources required to build another one (I am not taking the original drain on resources in this statement, just the follow on.)

Battries: the batteries in a hybrid car are more environmentally unfriendly that the car itself.

I could go on.

I was not really having a go at the Green thing as I am not actually a supporter of the Greens, I was having a poke at an unsubstantiated comment made by a goose who does not appear to know what they are talking about.

Or are you just butthurt that the Greens spent $500K on a campaign which netted exactly 0 seats?

That’s one of the funnier things I’ve read this month.

TVStar said :

KB1971 said :

What does a first class ticket have to do with the environment?

I can’t argue with stupidity. Sorry.

What yours?

So, instead of actually backing up your points when challenged you just resort to a personal attack?

Stupid is as stupid does………

Is this going to get rid of plastic bags or are the supermarkets going to start using 36 micron bags?

Will there be inspectors?

You know, despite a year’s warning and ample time to adapt, people are still going to roll up at the cash register on 1 November 2011 and ask “where’s the plastic bags?” And when they are told, they will say, “I wasn’t told this! When did this happen?”

Why do people need those placky bags in the veggie section? I put snow peas, beans, etc in the paper bags they provide for mushrooms, and just toss the rest of the veggies in together.

KB1971 said :

TVStar said :

Does Lin Hatfield Dodds still have here 4wd?

All cars are environmentally unfriendly, not just 4WD’s.

I would wager that my little Honda Jazz is more environmentally friendly than LH-D’s V8 4WD. It’s just amazing to see the Greens defend the indefensible. Yes, all cars are environmentally unfriendly. Are they EQUALLY environmentally unfriendly? Or are you just butthurt that the Greens spent $500K on a campaign which netted exactly 0 seats?

Cue the pensioner onslaught! I do believe I have heard it all – plastic bags are an assault against the aged pensioner! Plastic bags are not going to send you to the poor house, a lot of bad habits or unnecessary wastage might however, send everyone to the poor house.

A lot of people use plastic bags for bins, so everyone, not just pensioners, are going to have to find an alternative! And how much will these bags cost? 10 cents, 50 cents? Why don’t you buy some green bags and then occasionally resort to buying the odd plastic bag for your bin liners?

Or, just go to the supermarket and buy bin liners like everyone else!!!

the sky is falling the sky is falling!

19 posts and no conspiracy theories yet, what’s wrong with you people?

Love it! In Adelaide it cost me 10c for a plastic bag recently, or 15c for a nice big sturdy one from the supermarket. At other places, shops would supply a paper bag instead.

I find cotton or calico bags really convenient, as you can just throw them in the wash when they get greasy or dirty. My local Salvo’s is currently selling them for 20c each. True, you can’t use them for bin liners, but between recycling and composting, my family only needs a couple of bin liners a week.

KB1971 said :

What does a first class ticket have to do with the environment?

I can’t argue with stupidity. Sorry.

Originally, wasn’t the banning of plastic bags to stop sea turtles mistaking plastic bags for jelly fish?
Is it about land fill? Seriously, how much volume does a plastic bag take up? Surely most are used as bin liners anyway. Let’s ban Nappies and pre-packaged ‘fresh food’ that takes huge amounts of landfill.

Is there any evidence that such measures actually work to reduce usage of plastic bags overall, or is this just something that will make us all feel better about driving to the shops for food that has been flown in from China/Israel/Indonesia/wherever?

Not that I’m against reducing waste. I reuse all my plastic shopping bags, and when I’m finished with them I tie knots in them so they are less likely to become wind-borne (this makes me feel slightly better about driving to the shops for food that has been flown in from China/Israel/Indonesia/wherever).

I’d like to go back to shopping as I remember it in the 60’s and 70’s – groceries were packed in brown bags, and when you shopped for veges you took them home all mixed together in one bag – the bag you took to the shops with you.

John Moulis said :

We’re being sent to the poorhouse just to give a powerful, upper middle class minority a warm fuzzy feeling.

Getting rid of some plastic bags is going to send everyone to the poorhouse?

I had no idea that plastic bags were such an intrinsic part of the capitalist system.

random said :

Otherwise it’s rather hard to throw a handful of green beans, snow peas, chilli peppers etc. into your trolley. Obviously you don’t need to stretch a plastic bag around a watermelon.

Which is why I said ‘most’ fruit and veg.

Yeah, I’d really rather not have to buy specific bin bags.

I carry one of those folded up shopping bags with me (the benefits of being a woman and owning a handbag) and its pretty easy to deal with.

Surprised no one has come up with the picking up dog poo line yet.

Thoroughly Smashed11:12 am 27 Oct 10

Change, oh no!

I always find it funny how willing some people are to kick up a fuss over life’s trivialities.

Maybe I can contribute… Yes that’s it, if I forget my green bags, I’ll have to drive back home to get them! Personal responsibility be damned, take that environmental policy!

Just another tax on the poor masquerading as an environmental measure. Pensioners who use the free bags as bin liners will now have to buy them. That’s in addition to the escalating electricity prices caused by “Canberra loves 40%”, carbon tax talk and the other green measures. It seems the ACT government has been spooked by the urban myths about dead whales and dolphins being cut open and thousands of plastic bags falling out. We’re being sent to the poorhouse just to give a powerful, upper middle class minority a warm fuzzy feeling.

Oh yes, and the Productivity Commission recommended against this!

TVStar said :

What crap! What about 4wd’s, MacMansions, first-class tickets for Department of Climate Change staff to travel overseas to work out how to end global warming?

Canberra – feel good initiatives that make people, who do more damage to the environment than any other people in Australia, feel better about their white trash lifestyles.

When we ban flat screen TVs that are made in highly polluting factories in China I’ll get on board with this garbage – or does that not matter because it’s out of sight?

Does Lin Hatfield Dodds still have here 4wd?

All cars are environmentally unfriendly, not just 4WD’s.

So I take it you dont live in a house, walk everywhere, done have any electrical appliances?

What does a first class ticket have to do with the environment?

Holier than thou?

OK, plasic bags are a bit of a token gesture but its a start as they are such a waste of plastic & bad for bird & marine life in particular. They should be banned.

Now the Government needs to look at packaging on all products from things like individually packed batteries to these meal for one things that come in a foam cup (non-recyclable) & have a little plastic spoon ect that comes with them. Are people not capable of taking a spoon with them to work that we need this?

There is so much waste in the food industry that is id bordering on discraceful.

AngryHenry said :

I don’t get the idea of plastic bags for most fruit and veg, mother nature does a pretty good job of packaging them herself.

Otherwise it’s rather hard to throw a handful of green beans, snow peas, chilli peppers etc. into your trolley. Obviously you don’t need to stretch a plastic bag around a watermelon.

trickyxr said :

What a joke, Supermarkets will just bring in the heavier plastic bags and charge the consumer, same as aldi

Which is why if I forget my green bags I always stumble out of Aldi trying to balance 15 cans of tuna on one arm.

JessicaNumber10:54 am 27 Oct 10

I wouldn’t worry too much about the KFA’s health, he is a seriously fast and shiny puppy.

His behaviour, on the other hand…

What crap! What about 4wd’s, MacMansions, first-class tickets for Department of Climate Change staff to travel overseas to work out how to end global warming?

Canberra – feel good initiatives that make people, who do more damage to the environment than any other people in Australia, feel better about their white trash lifestyles.

When we ban flat screen TVs that are made in highly polluting factories in China I’ll get on board with this garbage – or does that not matter because it’s out of sight?

Does Lin Hatfield Dodds still have here 4wd?

What a joke, Supermarkets will just bring in the heavier plastic bags and charge the consumer, same as aldi

I don’t get the idea of plastic bags for most fruit and veg, mother nature does a pretty good job of packaging them herself.

However, I do understand the need for plastic bags when I buy chicken necks for my dogs because for some reason the orignal plastic bag housing them ends up compromised and I end up with nasty chicken juice all over everything.

Woo – hoo! About time. South Australia introduced this 2 years ago while the rest of the country kept advocating the purposes of the plastic bag!

Most people have those recycable green bags now anyway, so hopefully this won’t be too controversial! My impression of Canberra – after 3 years – is that it’s a far more eco-friendly city than elsewhere in the country (except for those old buses .. ); most people (and some large workplaces) have a compost system of some description and an enormous amount of people use a bike as preferred transport so it’s great that this has come about!

Oh, John Boy – is that a tin of ‘pal’ dog food I see? Do you know how bad that crap is? it’s like feeding your pooch a big mac every day!

JessicaNumber10:41 am 27 Oct 10

“I’m still not sure how we’re getting greasy take-away home without making a mess in the car.”

Save the planet: put a basket on your bike and use that for the take-away run. Bikes are easily hosed off. 🙂

If the food you buy is that greasy then I’d be more worried about your arteries, not the car’s interior!

I am curious why the placky bags used to carry fruit/veg are exempt from this new law. Surely they could be repaced by recycled paper bags?

Oh okay, now I’ll go and buy plastic trash bags rather than using the plastic shopping bags as binliners. This policy will work….(for the bag manufacturers and retailers)…

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