Road rules, options or Law?

If you think tailgating is a Canberra thing you really don’t get out much.

The reality is that you is on your own when traversing Canberra’s roads be it on foot, bicycle or car. Tailgating is a national capital sport practised by more than those who don’t and if challenged by gradual slow down or light tap on the brakes one will often find oneself subject to furious light flashing or some crazed lunatic coming up alongside and swerving. “Ring the cops” you say? Good idea I guess, wonder how they would prioritise such a thing? My bet is after donuts, but happy to be proven otherwise. Note the word “proven”!

My answer is simple. Big tow bar and bad attitude.

ant said :

You almost had me there, monomania and spideydog…. except I have ACT plates. Damn!

I would suggest though that quite a few of teh replies here, and the attitudes thus displayed prove my comment about angry drivers. As to the unskilled bit, well it also appears that an awful lot of people regard the right lane as an overtaking lane, and it’s THEIR lane.

I tend to stay out of that lane, let the loons have it, the police will get them. NOT.

All this coming from a ‘Canberran driver’ who stated all Canberrans are angry and unskilled drivers… Geewhiz!

ant said :

vg said :

“Canberrans are angry, unskilled drivers.”

What makes you think Canberrans have a mortgage on being shitty drivers. Australians are shitty drivers full stop.

(non-angry bit about Scandinavian drivers snipped)

It must be a Monday and time for another whinge about driving. If things are as they should be we’ll have a Police bashing thread, a whinge about cyclists and someone complaining their coffee was 0.1 of a degree too cold by Wednesday

Sounding pretty angry there vg. What are your driving skills like?

Don’t be scared, I’m not angry.

My driving skills are just dandy, and thanks for asking

Bugger, foiled by spideydog. Never mind, I’ll get you next time!

vg said :

“Canberrans are angry, unskilled drivers.”

What makes you think Canberrans have a mortgage on being shitty drivers. Australians are shitty drivers full stop.

(non-angry bit about Scandinavian drivers snipped)

It must be a Monday and time for another whinge about driving. If things are as they should be we’ll have a Police bashing thread, a whinge about cyclists and someone complaining their coffee was 0.1 of a degree too cold by Wednesday

Sounding pretty angry there vg. What are your driving skills like?

ant said :

You almost had me there, monomania and spideydog…. except I have ACT plates. Damn!

I tend to stay out of that lane, let the loons have it, the police will get them. NOT.

Are you trying to get me to bite ant ??? lol

You almost had me there, monomania and spideydog…. except I have ACT plates. Damn!

I would suggest though that quite a few of teh replies here, and the attitudes thus displayed prove my comment about angry drivers. As to the unskilled bit, well it also appears that an awful lot of people regard the right lane as an overtaking lane, and it’s THEIR lane.

I tend to stay out of that lane, let the loons have it, the police will get them. NOT.

and overcharging for pizzas is missed this week as friday is a fish day…

i agree with ratsnest, the closer you get up my clacker the slower i go and so longer you’ll be there…

what always amazes me is the no. of drivers who scoot round past me as i idle down towards a set of lights that have just gone red, accelerating past me to be able to stop a car ahead (or sometimes less if there is more traffic in the lane they change to…) what a waste of, well, everything.

vg said :

“why is a police computer screen any different?”

Try Section 305 of the Australian Road Rules champion

Well actually rule 299 covers that example the best 😉

“Canberrans are angry, unskilled drivers.”

What makes you think Canberrans have a mortgage on being shitty drivers. Australians are shitty drivers full stop.

Go to a Scandinavian country and test the theory out. They embarrass us with their attention to driver training. Over there licences are hard to get and easy to lose. Here its the other way around.

It must be a Monday and time for another whinge about driving. If things are as they should be we’ll have a Police bashing thread, a whinge about cyclists and someone complaining their coffee was 0.1 of a degree too cold by Wednesday

“why is a police computer screen any different?”

Try Section 305 of the Australian Road Rules champion

peterh said :

on the weekend, I had a driver beep his horn at me whilst I loaded the children into the car at the fyshwick markets. They aren’t children, when trying to strap them into a car seat. they behave like an octopus. the driver was leaning on his horn and gesticulating at me to hurry up. Fail. I don’t respond well to threats, especially when i have something he really seemed to want. I guess he was in a rush to park.

Personally I find this behaviour tends to slow me down, you want to be an ass and take my spot? then it’s going to take me a looooong time to get out of that parking space. Same for tailgaters, the closer you get the slower I’ll go.

monomania said :

ant said :

Canberrans are angry, unskilled drivers.

I was heading back to NSW around the airport (not rush hour).

This seems to be the attitude of a lot of drivers here. They drive poorly, their attitude to the road and others is just appalling, and I do wish more was done.

Tough.
Just more Canberra bashing.
There are a lot a speeding tailgating aggressive drivers with bad attitude and NSW plates on Canberra roads.

Monaro highway headed south towards Lanyon Dr anyone ???? Lots of NSW drivers in a hurry to get home along there !!!!!

ant said :

Canberrans are angry, unskilled drivers.

I was heading back to NSW around the airport (not rush hour).

This seems to be the attitude of a lot of drivers here. They drive poorly, their attitude to the road and others is just appalling, and I do wish more was done.

Tough.
Just more Canberra bashing.
There are a lot a speeding tailgating aggressive drivers with bad attitude and NSW plates on Canberra roads.

What used to give me the shits was the tailgaters on Adelaide Ave, when I’m doing the posted limit, and there’s an empty bus-lane to the right. Happy to break the law by speeding, but not happy to use the bus lane, I thought it was strange.

That’s not to say you should drive in the right lane, though. This encourages overtaking on the left which can be quite dangerous, particularly if the overtaking vehicle is a motorcycle.

Punter said :

Incorrect Madman, the rule (# 130 from the link in post# 44) applies to speeds over 80kph unless a keep left sign is displayed. There are exceptions but for straight ahead driving, that’s it. If the limit’s 80 or under you are allowed to drive in the right lane with no sign. I know Erindale Drive heading north past Sulwood Drive is an 80 kph road with said sign.

Correct.

dvaey said :

My problem is with the fact that its hypocritical to penalise someone for something you do yourself. I very much doubt a police officer driving by themselves pulls over to the side of the road before using his police radio, which if a driver of a public car or truck did, would be committing an offence.

I think you will find: 1. It is not an offence to use a CB radio (police or member of the public). 2. Not one person that has a CB radio would pull over to the side of the road either.

Incorrect Madman, the rule (# 130 from the link in post# 44) applies to speeds over 80kph unless a keep left sign is displayed. There are exceptions but for straight ahead driving, that’s it. If the limit’s 80 or under you are allowed to drive in the right lane with no sign. I know Erindale Drive heading north past Sulwood Drive is an 80 kph road with said sign.

Seeing as the weight of opinion here seems to suggest that the “keep left” rule applies to roads with a posted limit above 80 (rather than 100 as you claim Madman) you can imagine the confusion and frustration.

(“Keep left unless overtaking” is not an option, its a road rule that when ignored holds everyone up.)

Sorry if someone has already said this, but Madman returns from his vacation and hasn’t been on RA in a while – BUT…

Keep left unless overtaking is only a rule for roads that are posted at 100km/ph or over….

Dvaey,

Check out rule # 300 for mobile phone use in vehicles from the Australian Road Rules link http://www.legislation.act.gov.au/ni/2004-230/default.asp, just select the top PDF you may find it interesting.

vandam said :

Awesome posting Dveay. Lets go back to the flinstones age, where its just you and a steering wheel. Who needs horns, indicators, radios, mobile phones etc etc.

While your there, take away all those other distracting things like road signs traffic lights and roundabouts. Oh and don’t forget to travel alone because your wife/husband/kids/pets could be distracting too.

Awesome posting vandam, you completely missed my point. My issue isnt to do with distractions, my issue is that while driving you are always going to have distractions, ie. exactly the things you pointed out (radio, indicator, turning on headlights, etc). My problem is with the fact that its hypocritical to penalise someone for something you do yourself. I very much doubt a police officer driving by themselves pulls over to the side of the road before using his police radio, which if a driver of a public car or truck did, would be committing an offence.

Having said that, I dislike people who talk on the phone and are obviously distracted from their driving, but this should have a more encompassing law, such as failing to maintain proper control of a motor vehicle. A mobile phone law doesnt outlaw telling off kids in the back or lighting a cigarette (hopefully not at the same time), or doing your makeup or any other distracting activity, why not enforce (or introduce) a law which does?

Just today I was behind a woman sightseeing along Mugga Way driving 40km/h (way past the school zone). The bloke in front of me got frustrated and proceeded to pass her on the blind side of a rise, forcing a car coming the other direction to swerve. A brilliant demonstration of road skills by all concerned.

Cars need zero-tolerance enforcement. Cut points from 12 to 6, or less. People need to be reminded that driving cars in public is a responsibility, not a right. People driving around in 1-2 ton heavy vehicles smsing, chatting, racing and other dangerous behaviour need a serious jackboot up them. Imagine professional operators of heavy machinery carrying on like that.

It wouldn’t hurt to test people’s knowledge of road rules every 10 years when they refresh their license. They can learn about indicators again, who has right-of-way at junctions (a shocker in Canberra), and learn to stay left.

The more money people have the more arrogant and self absorbed they become (whether they worked hard for it or not).

That’s a pretty broad brush you’re painting with there buddy. In fact I think you’re trying to creat a link that just doesn’t exist.

I don’t know what police cars you’ve been looking at dvaey, but they’re not ACT police cars.

peterh said :

funny thing, i have seen a lot of police cars recently with single occupants, not a driver and passenger. mainly around kambah area, but that is probably not relevant.

Well, I’m not going to argue with what you have seen, but I can tell that your front line patrolling response vehicle’s will be a two person patrol. These are the vehicle’s that are most likely to have the need to use lights/sirens/radio etc.

Awesome posting Dveay. Lets go back to the flinstones age, where its just you and a steering wheel. Who needs horns, indicators, radios, mobile phones etc etc.

While your there, take away all those other distracting things like road signs traffic lights and roundabouts. Oh and don’t forget to travel alone because your wife/husband/kids/pets could be distracting too.

Clown killer, I’m not trolling, Your right maybe Canberra isn’t mostly PS, but they certainly whinge loud enough to make it seem like there are more here. The point is there are a lot more here than anywhere else in terms of per capita. It is also known that Canberran’s have a significantly higher average wage per capita as well. The more money people have the more arrogant and self absorbed they become (whether they worked hard for it or not). Their attitude towards to everything they do on a daily basis, such as driving etc well and truly shows it.

Spideydog said :

I know very well what is inside a police vehicle and can tell you it takes a single button press to activate lights and/or sirens.

99% of Police patrols are a 2 person patrol and it is actually the passenger who is activating the various controls (radio’s and other controls) NOT the driver.

When was the last time you saw a Canberra Police vehicle with a on-board computer. Besides, as I just said, it is the passenger who would be operating it anyways.

funny thing, i have seen a lot of police cars recently with single occupants, not a driver and passenger. mainly around kambah area, but that is probably not relevant.

I know very well what is inside a police vehicle and can tell you it takes a single button press to activate lights and/or sirens.

99% of Police patrols are a 2 person patrol and it is actually the passenger who is activating the various controls (radio’s and other controls) NOT the driver.

When was the last time you saw a Canberra Police vehicle with a on-board computer. Besides, as I just said, it is the passenger who would be operating it anyways.

Spideydog said :

dvaey said :

I find this ironic, that once a police officer spots someone talking on their mobile phone, the police officer fiddles with his dash/computer/radio/etc, while pulling over said driver. Isnt this the pot calling the kettle black?

So, what do you suggest then ????

I find there is a distinct difference between a police officer pressing a button to activate lights/sirens and a driver who is distracted and using up a great deal of their concentration in 1. operating their mobile phone, 2. Concentrating on the conversation they are having.

Perhaps if operating a lights/siren switch is comparable to mobile phone use, operating a indicator switch is equally taxing and should be outlawed as well ????

Maybe you havent looked inside a police car in the last 20 years. Police cars dont just have a single switch for lights/sirens, they have several large lcd screens, encompassing various things from moving-map GPS, computers for rego/id checks, amongst other things. Also, how is a police officer talking on his radio to base ‘Im in pursuit of a … on such n such street, travelling this direction …’, etc, any different to a person on a mobile phone? Other than the mobile phone doesnt have a mic cord dangled in front of them. Im sure if I was pulled over and had a 12″ lcd display mounted on my dashboard, Id be defected for it as it is distracting, why is a police computer screen any different?

What i don’t understand is the people who fill my space between me and the car in front. I create this space carefully, to stop without collecting the car in front. and then, some moron fills the space, jumping on their brakes at the same time. also, I am not averse to undertaking, but i prefer not to. the main culprits that I have seen in the right lane are usually interstate drivers, most often with vic plates. My car has vic plates, and I know which lane i should be in. it isn’t the right hand one.

I just wish that the drivers could be educated to stay in the left lane when not overtaking, don’t try to change from a slip lane to the far right lane at 60kph, in a 100 zone, or coming to a complete stop on the slip lane. Don’t accelerate when i am overtaking, it isn’t personal, my speed is just faster than yours, and, if you sit behind me, really close in a 40 zone, obviously in a rush, there is no way I am speeding up for you.

on the weekend, I had a driver beep his horn at me whilst I loaded the children into the car at the fyshwick markets. They aren’t children, when trying to strap them into a car seat. they behave like an octopus. the driver was leaning on his horn and gesticulating at me to hurry up. Fail. I don’t respond well to threats, especially when i have something he really seemed to want. I guess he was in a rush to park.

mooo_cow said :

Why doesn’t a person start a daily blog on this site called idiot of the morning, where people reply with the most insane things they had witness that morning, even quote peoples number plates.

You mean something like http://www.ratetheplate.com.au?

dvaey said :

I find this ironic, that once a police officer spots someone talking on their mobile phone, the police officer fiddles with his dash/computer/radio/etc, while pulling over said driver. Isnt this the pot calling the kettle black?

So, what do you suggest then ????

I find there is a distinct difference between a police officer pressing a button to activate lights/sirens and a driver who is distracted and using up a great deal of their concentration in 1. operating their mobile phone, 2. Concentrating on the conversation they are having.

Perhaps if operating a lights/siren switch is comparable to mobile phone use, operating a indicator switch is equally taxing and should be outlawed as well ????

Keep left unless overtaking applies on roads with a posted speed limit above 80km/h AND where ever else it is sign posted to keep left unless overtaking.

I know you’re trolling Vandam, but I can’t help myself and I have time on my hands while I wait for some software to do its thing. Contrary to popular opinion, whilst people employed in the APS make up the single biggest prt of the work force they are nowhere near the majority of employed people in Canberra.

The problems aren’t the road rules or the roads. Its the people.

Here’s a few reasons why:

They are stuck up.
They earn more than everyone else.
They expect more out of people then anywhere else.

Canberra people which consist mostly of public servants I’m afraid always demand more out of services and are always the first to whinge when something doesn’t go their way. We whinge and get angry at taxes, price rises, bike lanes, car drivers, the weather (we whinge when it rains and whinge when it doesn’t!!!WTF), having to queue up at supermarket registers, (not to mention the person that has 10 items in a 8 items or less checkout)

Maybe what Canberra really needs is a beach. Maybe that will relax a few of us and change the way we think about everything, including our driving. Either that or a really good Dr that can provide everyone with Chill pills.

Grail said :

As for quality of driving, Canberran drivers are the worst of the country, with a possible exception for Perth drivers who just don’t understand the whole two-lanes-merging-into-one thing.

As an ex-Perthite I would strongly suggest that it is you who doesn’t understand Perth’s way of merging, rather than the other way around… 🙂

The one thing that still irks me about Canberra roads after a few years here is the number of inappropriate situations where you have to merge across a broken line. LANE ONE FORM or death!

You’d hate Melbourne then Chrispy! Every set of lights is a drag race and you’re flat out keeping up with the traffic and keeping a watchful eye out for the myriad of speed cameras they have down there.

I visited Adelaide last year and drove around getting more and more frustrated about something I couldn’t quite put my finger on. Then I realised that the drivers there were actually going at the speed limit (not above). Once I slowed down to their speed, driving became much more relaxing.

The lesson of this story is that Canberrans are so used to going above the speed limit, we have come to think of it as normal. Next time you holiday interstate (batemans bay doesn’t count) try slowing down and see what happens.

PS: I have always been one of the slower canberra drivers.

Perhaps a bit broad to disparage the driving skills of all Canberrans. There are at least two courteous drivers out there (besides me, of course).

I like mooo_cow’s idiot driver blog idea. Since they stopped public floggings, a little bit of public ridicule is the most effective behaviour changer we still have.

I believe not all Canberran drivers are hopeless, but there seems to be a percentage who can’t manage themselves on our roads without getting into some form of mischeif. It’s easy to forget the guy that backed off when you were merging into the lane he occupies or slowed down in the school zone, because that is what the community expects of people. On the other hand it’s hard to forget the spanner who couldn’t drive a greasy stick…well you know. The ability to make a car go and stop aside, good driving really comes down to the right attitude.

mooo_cow said :

Considering that it normally the same people driving around the same time, day in day out to and from work that you tend to come across, see tailgating, hanging in the right hand lane doing under the speed limit, zig zagging in and out of lanes, speeding etc. Why doesn’t a person start a daily blog on this site called idiot of the morning, where people reply with the most insane things they had witness that morning, even quote peoples number plates. It very likely that these drivers behaviour is not a once off but a regular occurance on our roads.

Too true… there’s a Black Mini that heads up the Tuggers expressway about 7:20 of a morning, i’d be surprised if they spend more than 20 seconds in the same lane. Forever swerving into lanes and being a total asshat.

“Maybe a police blitz in unmarked cars during peak hours to raise awareness maybe the answer? “

Yes, a car pulled to the side of the road in front of a vehicle with emergency lights flashing will speed up the flow. No Canberran would prefer to stickybeak rather than paying attention and driving. There wouldn’t be a single slowdown or nose-to-tail as a result.

Considering that it normally the same people driving around the same time, day in day out to and from work that you tend to come across, see tailgating, hanging in the right hand lane doing under the speed limit, zig zagging in and out of lanes, speeding etc. Why doesn’t a person start a daily blog on this site called idiot of the morning, where people reply with the most insane things they had witness that morning, even quote peoples number plates. It very likely that these drivers behaviour is not a once off but a regular occurance on our roads.

Wow, so much debate over something that should just be common courtesy.

From TAMS:

Keeping to the left on a multi-lane road.

This rule applies on a multi-lane road where:
• the speed-limit is over 80 km/h; or
• a keep left unless overtaking signapplies.

You must not drive in the right lane unless:
• you are turning right, or making a U–turn from the centre of the road, and are giving a right turn signal;
• you are overtaking;
• a left lane must turn left sign or left =traffic lane arrows apply to any other lane and you are not turning left;
• you are required to drive in the right lane;
• you are avoiding an obstruction;
• the traffic in the other lanes is congested; or
• the traffic in every lane is congested.

A keep left unless overtaking sign on a multi-lane road applies to the length of road beginning at the sign and ending at the nearest of the following:
• an end keep left unless overtaking sign on the road;
• a traffic sign or road marking on the road indicating that it is no longer a multi-lane road;
• if the road ends at a T–intersection or dead end — the end of the road.

Keep left unless overtaking sign/End keep left unless overtaking sign:
If there are three or more available lanes, use the left lane. Move with care to the centre lanes if you need to pass slower vehicles. Move back to the left lane once it is again clear. The right lane is normally reserved for overtaking and you must move out of it as soon as it is safe to do so.

Canberra needs big boost in numbers of both marked and unmarked police cars. Probably about 10 of each. These need to be on patrol rather than being used on speed traps on major, low accident rate roads such as Adelaide Ave etc where revenue raising is the name of the game.

Amen.

I also believe (though I know it will never happen, $$$ and all that), that penalties for traffic offences should be based around a community-service aspect. If you get nabbed at 90 in an 80 zone by a camera, or even (unlikely these days) by a real policeman, you get a $100 fine and a point or two off your licence. If you get nabbed at even 40 or 50 over, its a monetary fine, and a portion of your licence. If this was changed, so you get say 2hrs community service for every km/hr over the limit youre travelling… well, I suspect a lot of people would reduce speeding. Not to mention, a *LOT* of free community work will get done.

As nice as this idea sounds though, it would cost the government such a large amount in lost revenue, I couldnt imagine them ever doing such a thing, even if it was directly shown to have a significant impact on accidents and driver behaviour.

More marked police vehicles are needed to indicate the police presence on our roads which will, over time, change driver attitudes while unmaked vehicles are needed to detect offences such as mobile phone use.

I find this ironic, that once a police officer spots someone talking on their mobile phone, the police officer fiddles with his dash/computer/radio/etc, while pulling over said driver. Isnt this the pot calling the kettle black?

Regardless of the law, it is common courtesy to stay in the left lane unless overtaking. BUT I would say that most right lane hogs ARE doing the speed limit anyway (unless they are being held up by a vehicle infront of them). It’s a bit rich to complain about a right lane hog when what you are trying to do is break the law by speeding.

Canberra needs big boost in numbers of both marked and unmarked police cars. Probably about 10 of each. These need to be on patrol rather than being used on speed traps on major, low accident rate roads such as Adelaide Ave etc where revenue raising is the name of the game.

More marked police vehicles are needed to indicate the police presence on our roads which will, over time, change driver attitudes while unmaked vehicles are needed to detect offences such as mobile phone use.

ALL driving offences need to be targeted by the police. People who don’t take driving seriously will learn over time if all offences are targeted. When was the last time someone was pulled over and booked for not indicating. I’ll bet it was a long time ago. I’ve seen the same car with “INJEKTD” written sideways down the right hand side of the front windscreen protruding inwards by about 200mm over about 2 years now. Why is this allowed to happen? That car should have been pulled over and defected for obscured vision on day 1. What about all the cars we see with nice 19s or 20s on the front and stock burnout rims on the back. This is dangerous and illegal and these hoons are getting away with it while good safe drivers are getting caught by speed cameras for doing 85 in an 80 zone.

I firmly believe that by targeting all driving offences people will start to take driving more seriously. This will reduce the number of speeding drivers and help reduce the obnoxious, self centred, arrogant behaviour that is so very common in Canberra.

i live off a road where i have to turn from the right lane into a right hand turn lane in an 80km/h speed zone.

because of the number of jackasses out there, i generally need to get into this lane more than 500m before the turn lane starts, or else i’ll be shut out of the lane.

i like to drive at the speed limit, because i don’t want to get a ticket, so i drive in the right lane at 80km/h while waiting for my turnoff to come up. this apparently is unacceptable behaviour to most people, so i get tailgated or people hoon past “undertaking” me in the left lane.

the thing that gives me the shits is when people drive on this road at 40-60km/h. ok, i’ll accept it for a little bit because they may not have seen a sign stating the road is 80, and be driving at a reasonable speed considering that. but then once we’ve gone past two more of the 80km/h speed signs it starts to piss me off (unless the road is really busy/trucks /buses etc are slowing them down).

but anyway, back to my point, you can’t tell me to get out of the right lane when i need to be in it to make my turn off. i’m not going to take a massive detour to save you 20 seconds (if that)

ant said :

dvaey said :

I do love it when people jump in with answers without the facts. According to the RTA, at http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/trafficinformation/downloads/00_03.pdf ‘Keep left unless overtaking’, means what it says. Its not a courtesy thing on freeways only, it is applicable anywhere the roadsign is in place, and is enforcable by law.

The law hasn’t changed. It is law to use the left lane (unless overtaking) on any multi-lane road where teh speed limit is 80 or above.

It is also law to be in teh left lane (unless overtaking) where a “keep left unless overtaking” sign is erected.

If neither of these conditions exist, being in the left lane is a courtesy, it is not law.
.

The rule is for speed limits above 80. This does not include roads with speed limits of 80. If their speed limit is 81 or greater, the rule of keeping left unless overtaking applies

dvaey said :

I do love it when people jump in with answers without the facts. According to the RTA, at http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/trafficinformation/downloads/00_03.pdf ‘Keep left unless overtaking’, means what it says. Its not a courtesy thing on freeways only, it is applicable anywhere the roadsign is in place, and is enforcable by law.

The law hasn’t changed. It is law to use the left lane (unless overtaking) on any multi-lane road where teh speed limit is 80 or above.

It is also law to be in teh left lane (unless overtaking) where a “keep left unless overtaking” sign is erected.

If neither of these conditions exist, being in the left lane is a courtesy, it is not law.

Pedantic, but that is the law. On slower roads, like say Limestone, you can be in either lane, and common sense says you’d choose the lane you’re going to be turning from.

“Canberrans are angry, unskilled drivers”.

Here I was thinking I was a Canberran.. Can’t possibly be if I’m not one of these angry, unskilled drivers. My ruling planet is Mars I’ll stick to that then.

dvaey said :

Grail said :

Obeying “Keep Left Unless Overtaking” signs is law in NSW where the RTA road rules apply.

Actually.. from the first line of the pdf I pasted above “On 1 December 1999, New South Wales adopted new road rules. These new road rules include the Australian Road Rules.”

Most road laws now (for the last 10 years) are part of the Australian Road Rules, for exactly the reason you pointed out, that different states had different laws that applied.

When I first moved to Canberra a bit over a decade ago, the ACT was the only jurisdiction I knew of where keep left unless overtaking didn’t apply. It was soon after that that the ACT law was changed to conform with the Australian Road Rules. So, it is true that you do have to keep left unless overtaking, but it has not always been so, and some drivers haven’t caught up yet.

I think the national one is a silly change and the old rule of ‘keep left unless you’re doing the speed limit’ was more sensible, as it permitted drivers travelling at the speed limit to clog the roads for speeders, frustrating them (and hopefully increasing the chances of them having a crash and dying (although I would prefer if these people would die without risking everyone else’s lives)).

Does anybody remember the Canberra road-campaign t.v. ads that were briefly on in the early 90’s :’It’s different out there’; targeting Canberra drivers who go interstate? The ads were designed to remind Canberra drivers that they needed to change their appalling driving behaviour once they left the ACT or they might end up dead on NSW or Victorian roads.

The ads gave me a good giggle – ‘It’s Different out There’!!! Canberra drivers can afford to be bad because the roads are so fantastic and driving is incredibly easy here.

Canberrans are angry, unskilled drivers. I was musing on this yesterday. I get tailgated a lot, because my old jalopy just isn’t a go-fast car and I’m over it. I tootle around at the speed limit, I hate being in the right lane (feels very weird in the US, that’s the slow lane), I indicate, I let people in, I merge religiously, and the angry people I observe, using their cars as devices to impose their will on others is just incredible.

Mind you, I don’t slow down on roundabouts. The jalopy corners rather well! Corners are fun.

The other day, I saw a doozy that just illustrates the amazing attitude of “drivers” here. I was heading back to NSW around the airport (not rush hour). Approaching the last airport roundabout, before you go behind the runway, 2 cars were coming into Canberra on the roundabout. The one in the outside lane was just normal, going around. The car on the inside lane crossed over the lane markings, into the outside lane, he was about 2 feet over, and then evidently noticed the car already there, and recovered.

I then saw the driver of the errant car pointing his whole arm, outstretched, at the outside lane car that was now exiting, mouthing something, his whole face contorted.

This guy had moved into the other car’s lane, he was in teh wrong, and he was apoplectic with rage and screaming… at the car he’d almost hit with his mistake?

This seems to be the attitude of a lot of drivers here. They drive poorly, their attitude to the road and others is just appalling, and I do wish more was done.

Marked police cars have an amazing effect on tailgaters, I’ve noticed. Marked Police Car = No Tailgaters.

Grail said :

Obeying “Keep Left Unless Overtaking” signs is law in NSW where the RTA road rules apply.

Actually.. from the first line of the pdf I pasted above “On 1 December 1999, New South Wales adopted new road rules. These new road rules include the Australian Road Rules.”

Most road laws now (for the last 10 years) are part of the Australian Road Rules, for exactly the reason you pointed out, that different states had different laws that applied.

Obeying “Keep Left Unless Overtaking” signs is law in NSW where the RTA road rules apply.

I agree with Sgt.Bungers though – IMO one of the reasons Canberra drivers are so bad is that our roads are so good. Give us narrower lanes, roads that twist and wind and have three major intersections every 100m, and we’d sharpen up our act in a hurry.

As for quality of driving, Canberran drivers are the worst of the country, with a possible exception for Perth drivers who just don’t understand the whole two-lanes-merging-into-one thing. At least in Sydney everyone else is trying to help you because they know that one mistake will clog up the entire city for four hours.

I do love it when people jump in with answers without the facts. According to the RTA, at http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/trafficinformation/downloads/00_03.pdf ‘Keep left unless overtaking’, means what it says. Its not a courtesy thing on freeways only, it is applicable anywhere the roadsign is in place, and is enforcable by law.

The problem isnt that Canberra needs more unmarked police cars, the problem is we need more MARKED police cars. What good is an unmarked car, giving out 2 fines during rush-hour, as opposed to a high-vis MARKED car sitting on the side of the road, to remind everyone theyre being watched. Unmarked cars are good for generating revenue, not real good for rapidly changing the drivers behaviour.

If youre driving at 90 in 80 zone and saw a marked car on the side of the road, you’d slow down.. if that car was simply a blue falcon or a black ute (or a white econovan as I saw last night), you’d carry on doing what you were doing.

Also, Canberra drivers mightnt be the best, but Id rather be driving near an ACT vehicle in Syd/Melb, than a NSW/Vic vehicle in the ACT.. maybe just because Im used to the ACT driver craziness, while the NSW/Vic crazy drivers still do stuff that amazes me.

My 2c

Frustrated drivers are usually the ones that will cause an accident

I agree. The solution to this is to not worry about it – there will always be morons on the road, so if you’re stuck don’t make the situation dangerous by being a dickhead. CHillax, listen to some tunes, arrive 30 seconds later. Your blood pressure will be all the better for it.

People have to respect the road rules… which we tend not to. There are a few rules most of us stick to pretty much all the time, no excuses… such as keep left on a two way road, don’t open your doors whilst driving, give way rules. Most likely because the immediate danger we place ourselves into when breaking these rules is obvious. If there is no *obvious* immediate danger to breaking a rule, then we’re more inclined to break it.

First, implement laws that people respect. They should be based on the actions that the majority of reasonable people would take if there was no such rule in place. This is the only way to set road rules.

Once we have reasonable road rules in place that the majority of people agree with, implement minimum prison sentences for drivers who cause a crash by breaking these road rules and injure or kill someone. And perhaps most importantly, remove the monetary component of all fines so that we stop thinking it’s about revenue instead of safety.

As for getting people to stop talking on mobile phones, build uncertain roads that look dangerous. Statistically roads that look more dangerous end up being safer, as drivers give more concentration to the immediate task at hand, which is navigating their several tonne machine through a public place, as opposed to doing anything else.

The Keep Left Unless Overtaking is a courtesy thing. The idea is that if you aren’t overtaking anyone, get out of the way so others whi wish to travel faster can overtake you.

I suspect the (many) people who don’t observe this rule are the same people who want to speed up to close the gap when you try to change lanes.

And FWIW, I think Canberra drivers are much worse than Sydney or Melbourne drivers, based on my experience.

Danman, – sadly you are correct, keep left only truely applied at speeds of over 80km/h. Also old canberran, surprisingly Canberra drivers are pretty bad compared to the rest of the country. (One exception for me is the Gold Coast, they make Canberra drivers look good).

We don’t have the same traffic levels as the rest of the country, and yet we as drivers seem to do all we can to protect “our” bit of road.

I thought (Happy to be corrected) that Keep Left Unless Overtaking was only applicable where the speed limit is above 80kmh – which would rule out all but a few Canberra roads.

No excuses for mobiles, but there are crap drivers everywhere,.

What makes you think Canberra is any different from anywhere else? You people haven’t got it all on your own you know.

Mandatory electric chair for anyone caught doing less that the posted speed limit in the right hand lane. Tough, but fair!!