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Birth centre not staffed up

johnboy 21 January 2013 29

The ABC has the grimly familiar news of another cockup in health, this time at the Birth Centre which is turning away 400 women a year despite running at half capacity:

Last year the centre was expanded from three birth suites to five as part of the new Women’s and Children’s Hospital.

But documents obtained under FOI laws show the new centre has an occupancy rate of less than 50 per cent most days.

The Friends of the Birth Centre says that is because staff numbers have not increased in line with the expansion.


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DrKoresh DrKoresh 10:34 pm 24 Jan 13

Tetranitrate said :

DrKoresh said :

Pork Hunt said :

Women have been spitting kids out since the birth of mankind, why is this an issue?

Yes, but thanks to modern medicine, the odds of losing the woman and/or child in the process is no longer the same as tossing a coin. I think most people who insist on homebirths are making a selfish decision for ideological, rather than logical, reasons. I dunno, I think gambling your baby’s life on an ideology is selfish, at least, even if you’re well within your rights to do it.

Are you retarded? ‘the same as tossing a coin’. Seriously? I’m not even going to bother pulling up as source as what you’ve just posted is just prima-facie ridiculous.

Think of what a 50/50 mortality rate in childbirth implies for the population as a whole, and for growth or even replacement given other sources of mortality, particularly in childhood. Seriously. Think about it, think about it well, and never post such rubbish again.

Are you retarded? You think child-birth was easy as ‘one, two, three’ back in the day? Seriously? When I said the same as tossing a coin I was speaking figuratively, not literally. I’d explain the difference but you’re prima-facie a total idiot who can’t access a computer without turning into a gibbering, faeces-flinging monkey. Don’t take everything you read online literally.

Think about the possibility I was using hyperbole to make a point, and how your reaction looks in that context. Seriously, think about it well, and then never post such hateful, puerile sh*te again.

poetix poetix 5:30 pm 24 Jan 13

Re #23 (polite) and #26 (impolite):

I learnt a lot during my week in hospital. Got to know my baby at our leisure. Also, I knew beforehand where the stitches would be, and the scar, and that was by far the better option. My husband stayed overnight in the suite sometimes and he could eat (and drink) there. They even offered to mind the baby while we went out, which struck me as a strange thing to even consider, but some people did exactly that. It was truly empowering! I swore I would never do birth naturally. Thank god I didn’t have to. I will never be a woman who sits around describing the travails of birth, as I had virtually none, thanks to an epidural.

My husband had the first time alone with the baby, as I had to hang out in the recovery room for a little while after holding her for a little while. He quite liked that.

When I have had to deal with midwives, I have found many of them (not all) to be disapproving lumps, totally judgmental while fluffing on about women’s choices. (Any choice you like so long as it’s vaginal.) So glad I cut them out of the equation…

I’m not saying it’s for everyone, as I really do believe in choice. But I do like to raise it as an option, as some of those midwives (and certain others) are a noisy lot. Opting for a planned C-section does not mean you are ignorant or insane. You, #26, should examine why you feel the need to adopt that sort of language. What is making you so uncomfortable here? My doctor was probably the best available, and I was fully informed about the procedure.

Tetranitrate Tetranitrate 4:54 pm 24 Jan 13

DrKoresh said :

Pork Hunt said :

Women have been spitting kids out since the birth of mankind, why is this an issue?

Yes, but thanks to modern medicine, the odds of losing the woman and/or child in the process is no longer the same as tossing a coin. I think most people who insist on homebirths are making a selfish decision for ideological, rather than logical, reasons. I dunno, I think gambling your baby’s life on an ideology is selfish, at least, even if you’re well within your rights to do it.

Are you retarded? ‘the same as tossing a coin’. Seriously? I’m not even going to bother pulling up as source as what you’ve just posted is just prima-facie ridiculous.

Think of what a 50/50 mortality rate in childbirth implies for the population as a whole, and for growth or even replacement given other sources of mortality, particularly in childhood. Seriously. Think about it, think about it well, and never post such rubbish again.

Tetranitrate Tetranitrate 4:47 pm 24 Jan 13

poetix said :

Pork Hunt said :

Women have been spitting kids out since the birth of mankind, why is this an issue?

As to labour itself, evolution has made us have big heads, even as babies. Women’s hips can’t always accommodate this. It’s a battlefield, really, played out painfully at every birth. I don’t think the expression ‘spitting out’ is quite accurate. As I think you may know…birth of mankind indeed. Quite a few women and babies still die during birth, obviously more often in less developed areas.

Personally, I see all this as an extremely compelling argument for a planned C-section, obviously in a hospital theatre, without waiting for labour at all, on a particular date. But not everyone wants to avoid labour. To each her own. The more safe properly serviced choices, the better. If women want to give birth in this centre, they should be able to, and have the time to make a choice at their leisure with a little dignity, not the day after they find that they are pregnant.

That’s just tacky.

Are you insane? A C-section is MAJOR surgery, and the more times you have it, the more risk there is of further complications. After 3 it’s pretty much a case of “don’t get pregnant again”, and each one increases the risk of uterine rupture as well as other complications in future pregnancies.

You are cutting through skin, fat, several layers of muscle, into the uterus. Aside from uterus specific issues, when these sorts of incisions are made, the tissue is never quite the same again. It is never as elastic and if it needs to be cut through again it’s much more difficult. It’s not unknown for for c-section scars to rupture when people are driving or in similar activities – obviously precautions are taken during healing of course but that doesn’t eliminate the risk.
That isn’t to say there isn’t a place for them, of course there is – but you’d have to be either insane or deeply ignorant to seriously consider an elective C-section.

Pork Hunt Pork Hunt 4:30 pm 24 Jan 13

YeahBuddy said :

poetix said :

Pork Hunt said :

Women have been spitting kids out since the birth of mankind, why is this an issue?

Personally, I see all this as an extremely compelling argument for a planned C-section, obviously in a hospital theatre, without waiting for labour at all, on a particular date. But not everyone wants to avoid labour. To each her own. The more safe properly serviced choices, the better. If women want to give birth in this centre, they should be able to, and have the time to make a choice at their leisure with a little dignity, not the day after they find that they are pregnant.

That’s just tacky.

I have to disagree here – I can see no logical reason for an otherwise healthy pregnant woman to undergo major abdominal surgery, rather than have some painful contractions and possibly risk a 2nd degree tear by birthing naturally. And why on earth would you want to stay in hospital (full of germs, intended for treating the sick and injured) if your birth goes well and both mum and bub are healthy. Lastly, hospitals don’t “kick women out” – if you need to stay longer than the average 3 days (for normal birth, 5 for c-section) you can. And in the ACT we have Mid-Call where a midwife visits you in your home for a week after discharge.

I personally couldn’t get out of hospital quick enough after birth and wish they would have discharged me earlier. Birth is such an empowering, beautiful experience, but it is the shortest chapter in your journey to parenthood.

I thought conception was the shortest.

DrKoresh DrKoresh 4:29 pm 24 Jan 13

Pork Hunt said :

Women have been spitting kids out since the birth of mankind, why is this an issue?

Yes, but thanks to modern medicine, the odds of losing the woman and/or child in the process is no longer the same as tossing a coin. I think most people who insist on homebirths are making a selfish decision for ideological, rather than logical, reasons. I dunno, I think gambling your baby’s life on an ideology is selfish, at least, even if you’re well within your rights to do it.

YeahBuddy YeahBuddy 4:02 pm 24 Jan 13

poetix said :

Pork Hunt said :

Women have been spitting kids out since the birth of mankind, why is this an issue?

Personally, I see all this as an extremely compelling argument for a planned C-section, obviously in a hospital theatre, without waiting for labour at all, on a particular date. But not everyone wants to avoid labour. To each her own. The more safe properly serviced choices, the better. If women want to give birth in this centre, they should be able to, and have the time to make a choice at their leisure with a little dignity, not the day after they find that they are pregnant.

That’s just tacky.

I have to disagree here – I can see no logical reason for an otherwise healthy pregnant woman to undergo major abdominal surgery, rather than have some painful contractions and possibly risk a 2nd degree tear by birthing naturally. And why on earth would you want to stay in hospital (full of germs, intended for treating the sick and injured) if your birth goes well and both mum and bub are healthy. Lastly, hospitals don’t “kick women out” – if you need to stay longer than the average 3 days (for normal birth, 5 for c-section) you can. And in the ACT we have Mid-Call where a midwife visits you in your home for a week after discharge.

I personally couldn’t get out of hospital quick enough after birth and wish they would have discharged me earlier. Birth is such an empowering, beautiful experience, but it is the shortest chapter in your journey to parenthood.

OpenYourMind OpenYourMind 10:41 pm 21 Jan 13

Madam Cholet said :

BimboGeek said :

If I can’t get into the birth centre when I have my next pregnancy, I’m just going to have my baby at home.

Imagine trying to have a baby in a hospital with all that MRSA and not even so much as a bath! Ick!

For goodness sake, go to a hospital, private or otherwise. Birth is of course a natural process, but you just never know what may eventuate and what care you may need. I was born at home…and no problems that I know of, but my older brother caused quite a bit of consternation, but luckily in hospital.

My own son, whilst born naturally, took 22 hours, drugs and mutterings of Caesars before he arrived. I know I felt glad then and now that we were ensconced in one of JJ’s birthing suites – as bad as the food is.

They wouldn’t build birthing suites, mat wards or women’s hospitals if they were not needed. Utilize them.

Umm, you do realise that the Birthing Centre is connected to the hospital and if there’s even a sniff of a problem, they will transfer to the hospital.

I’ve only good words to say about the Birthing Centre. Everything was perfect for us. We know lots of other couples who have had positive experiences there too. Some women may choose a hospital because they feel more comfortable/safer in a clinical environment, but thank goodness we have this wonderful facility.

As for the short stays at the birthing centre, we found that a positive. We drove there at 10am and were in the comfort of our own home by 5pm. Others I know have stayed overnight. Much to Mother’s surprise a birth doesn’t usually require 5 days of hospitalisation.

I’m not sure how the 50% full metric is calculated. From what I observed, that place can quickly go from all quiet to all beds full. Perhaps a bit of spare capacity is required.

It is tough to get a place in the Birthing Centre, but often a place will become available further down the track in the pregnancy as there are lots of reasons why women booked in have to give up their place.

poetix poetix 10:38 pm 21 Jan 13

Pork Hunt said :

Women have been spitting kids out since the birth of mankind, why is this an issue?

As to labour itself, evolution has made us have big heads, even as babies. Women’s hips can’t always accommodate this. It’s a battlefield, really, played out painfully at every birth. I don’t think the expression ‘spitting out’ is quite accurate. As I think you may know…birth of mankind indeed. Quite a few women and babies still die during birth, obviously more often in less developed areas.

Personally, I see all this as an extremely compelling argument for a planned C-section, obviously in a hospital theatre, without waiting for labour at all, on a particular date. But not everyone wants to avoid labour. To each her own. The more safe properly serviced choices, the better. If women want to give birth in this centre, they should be able to, and have the time to make a choice at their leisure with a little dignity, not the day after they find that they are pregnant.

That’s just tacky.

JimCharles JimCharles 9:36 pm 21 Jan 13

nazasaurus said :

While not a reflection of the hard working staff at these places, everytime someone has a crap experience, they should write to the minister if it’s warranted instead of just telling their friends and posting on RA. The state of some of the buildings and (lack of) resources are embarrassing for the amount of $$ in this town. That way we might actually get better/more health services instead of human rights commissions and cock-owls. Just a thought- if you’re unhappy write a letter/email.

One of the things I’ve noticed in this town is that complaint procedures are awful.
Everybody writes to the Chief Minister, Directors panic and divert resources away from work to deal with a complaint…thus creating more complaints, more letters to the Minister.
If the Minister had anything about her, she’d ensure that every Directorate had a properly managed complaints procedure with proper enquiry statistics, then she’d get to see collated results, performance and actually get some proper statistics about what the heck is going on in some of these places.
The current method is ridiculous, like 1970’s tale telling….people drop work and their areas perform worse because they have to deal with complaints, even if they’re minor moans and groans from your local nutter who just “lives” to complain.
They could easily be handled by some sort of investigative process if only these darn Directorates and the Chief Minister could drag themselves into the 21st Century and set some proper systems up.

Pork Hunt Pork Hunt 9:03 pm 21 Jan 13

Women have been spitting kids out since the birth of mankind, why is this an issue?

Madam Cholet Madam Cholet 8:24 pm 21 Jan 13

BimboGeek said :

If I can’t get into the birth centre when I have my next pregnancy, I’m just going to have my baby at home.

Imagine trying to have a baby in a hospital with all that MRSA and not even so much as a bath! Ick!

For goodness sake, go to a hospital, private or otherwise. Birth is of course a natural process, but you just never know what may eventuate and what care you may need. I was born at home…and no problems that I know of, but my older brother caused quite a bit of consternation, but luckily in hospital.

My own son, whilst born naturally, took 22 hours, drugs and mutterings of Caesars before he arrived. I know I felt glad then and now that we were ensconced in one of JJ’s birthing suites – as bad as the food is.

They wouldn’t build birthing suites, mat wards or women’s hospitals if they were not needed. Utilize them.

Thumper Thumper 8:11 pm 21 Jan 13

nazasaurus said :

While not a reflection of the hard working staff at these places, everytime someone has a crap experience, they should write to the minister if it’s warranted instead of just telling their friends and posting on RA. The state of some of the buildings and (lack of) resources are embarrassing for the amount of $$ in this town. That way we might actually get better/more health services instead of human rights commissions and cock-owls. Just a thought- if you’re unhappy write a letter/email.

Except that Ministers in this town have a habit of NFAing letters of criticism.

Or write some complete waffle with absolutely no relation to the topic the writer was alluding to.

Dork Dork 8:04 pm 21 Jan 13

I know a few people who have given birth there and have only heard bad things.
I went to visit one friend and the nurse (who they got in from somewhere else, because they were understaffed) dropped her IV then couldn’t figure out why it was beeping even after i told her that it said on the screen what was wrong. Same friend got released earlier than she should have because they had no room. For what they paid for it, it’s crap. Some rooms don’t even have a chair.

JC JC 7:25 pm 21 Jan 13

Who says that because the place has a 50% occupancy it is not being fully staffed.

Maybe, just maybe the place is being staffed as intended and heaven forbid was designed and built with the future in mind. With extra staff and more rooms being utilised as demand grows.

I mean to say think about it, sure people may be turned away from this location and not every room is being used, but the fact women are having their babies elsewhere (and not on the streets) says that the total amount of ‘beds’ and birthing suites available across the territory is right. I know as a tax payer I don’t want to be paying for more capacity than needed just so people can pick and choose where they get their free health care.

Case in point my old mum who had to have emergency surgery 2 weeks ago. The ambo’s took her to Calvary which is the closest hospital, where she was assessed, they then determined that they didn’t have the right care available so she was transferred to Woden. Another lady had the same issue but apparently was operated on at Calvary. As I said same issue, mum got the care, sure it was a paint in the arse to go to Woden every day to see her, but at the end of the day the right number of beds territory wide were available, mum just missed out on the one closest to where she and her family live.

nazasaurus nazasaurus 7:21 pm 21 Jan 13

While not a reflection of the hard working staff at these places, everytime someone has a crap experience, they should write to the minister if it’s warranted instead of just telling their friends and posting on RA. The state of some of the buildings and (lack of) resources are embarrassing for the amount of $$ in this town. That way we might actually get better/more health services instead of human rights commissions and cock-owls. Just a thought- if you’re unhappy write a letter/email.

TheTwinMama TheTwinMama 6:59 pm 21 Jan 13

We did IVF and booked into the birthing centre the day we found out I was pregnant. Without going into the technicalities, with IVF, you find out you’re pregnant far earlier than a couple who conceived naturally. I was the last person on the list for that month. Unfortunately, when I found out that I was pregnant with twins, I was no longer able to be cared for by midwives and was taken off the list. Apparently it’s common to be told that there is no vacancies, but a few weeks later, when early miscarriages happen, multiple births are diagnosed, high risk pregnancies are identified etc, most people that want a place, get a place.

Pork Hunt Pork Hunt 4:47 pm 21 Jan 13

astrojax said :

BimboGeek said :

If I can’t get into the birth centre when I have my next pregnancy, I’m just going to have my baby at home.

Imagine trying to have a baby in a hospital with all that MRSA and not even so much as a bath! Ick!

as in #4 above, queanbeyan is the go… 🙂

If Canberra women come to Qbn to give birth, does that increase or decrease the IQ of Canberra or Qbn or both?
Perhaps I’m just being vexatious…

basketcase basketcase 4:25 pm 21 Jan 13

Bit like that “Yes Minister” show where the hospital was built but patients not wanted!

astrojax astrojax 4:15 pm 21 Jan 13

BimboGeek said :

If I can’t get into the birth centre when I have my next pregnancy, I’m just going to have my baby at home.

Imagine trying to have a baby in a hospital with all that MRSA and not even so much as a bath! Ick!

as in #4 above, queanbeyan is the go… 🙂

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