4 June 2009

Firework menace completely un-policed

| johnboy
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The Canberra Times has been digging for records on the numbers of firework miscreants getting punished for misusing black powder fun.

And it turns out there aren’t any.

    “The Office of Regulatory Services says its records, which aren’t exhaustive, show no fines were issued last year or over the past few years.”

That’s one hell of a menace to society which must be banned.

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Holden Caulfield9:51 pm 08 Jun 09

sepi said :

Why can loud music go to 11pm and planes can go all night, yet fireworks have to stop after dinner.

Well, it’d be nice if they did.

I went to bed after the Socceroos game on Sunday morning. I heard two crackers go off in the time it took me to walk from my lounge to my bedroom.

It was 4:30am.

I don’t really see why fireworks have to finish by 9.30 either. It seems pretty early.

Why can loud music go to 11pm and planes can go all night, yet fireworks have to stop after dinner.

Woody Mann-Caruso12:10 pm 08 Jun 09

Could somebody explain to me how “right to have dog never ever temporarily upset by anything” > “everybody else’s right to let off fireworks a couple of days a year”? My cats are terrified of trucks. Shall I call for a ban on two-tonners in suburban streets? What do you do with these precious, feeble canines when there’s a thunderstorm? How do your rights outweigh those of dog owners with more robust animals who are perfectly fine with fireworks?

How do we know if those that do illegally use fireworks aren’t the ones that are trying to ban them in the first place? As if there is no evidence of illegal use, then they don’t really have a case for the ban.

Plus everyone says that dogs get terrified by crackers & it makes them run off. Well the last few nights my dog has been happy to sit outside while our neighbors let crackers off & just watch the bright lights & big bangs. But then again once when a crack of lightning hit 2 houses from us & the resulting thunder shock the house, he wasn’t scared either.

+1 to Dougal’s words. I’m glad my dogs don’t seem affected by crackers, although I think the terrier gets scared, but she’s not here. Last night around 10-ish I took the chihuahuas outside for their ablutions before bed, and the neighbours suddenly commenced world war III (this is NSW, btw), but the dogs took it quite well. Put their ears up and sniffed but that was it.

For some reason, crackers seem particularly attractive to people with nasty attitudes to those around them. Giving such people yet another way to impose themselves on others clearly isn’t a good idea. If the rest of the country has banned them, that does indicate that enough people were over crackers for that to happen.

i think we should just ban having pets all together.

“4. Freedom to Express Normal Behaviour
By providing sufficient space, proper facilities, and company of the animal’s own kind”

Are you breaking your own rule by not allowing them to hunt in the wild with other animals of their own species?

shame, shame on you.

@ futto #41 – What a sad life you must have, living in Canberra so you can go all slack-jawed at some bangs and flashes one weekend a year. Perhaps while twiddling your thumbs in anticipation of the next round of fireworks you can look up the meaning of ‘fascism’

@ willo # 45 – I am sure that many people lack adequate fencing. I am also sure that people can secure their yard 363 days of the year, but cracker weekend is a whole new ball game.

@ ahappychappy #51 – Your dog is deaf I presume? I KNOW when to put my dog inside but unfortunately I don’t KNOW when random crackers will go off. My dog has an uncanny knack of being able to hear things through windows. Would you change your tune if you had to watch your dog suffer?

@ jakez # 52 “I’m about to start donating money/time to ACT Resue & Foster. I no longer support RSPCA (beyond acknowledging them as a potential pet source) as they are an organisation that actively works against freedom”.

Are you serious? The whole basis of that organisation is about protecting the five freedoms for animals (and if you don’t know what they are:

The five freedoms for animals
1. Freedom from Hunger and Thirst
By ready access to fresh water and a diet to maintain full health and vigour

2. Freedom from Discomfort
By providing an appropriate environment including shelter and a comfortable resting area

3. Freedom from Pain, Injury and Disease
By prevention through rapid diagnosis and treatment

4. Freedom to Express Normal Behaviour
By providing sufficient space, proper facilities, and company of the animal’s own kind

5. Freedom from Fear and Distress
By ensuring conditions and treatment which avoid mental suffering)

What freedom of yours are they working against? I’d love you to back up that comment because it pisses me off when people have a go at charities that shouldn’t even have to exist but for the d***heads in our society that make them necessary.

“I have recently come to the conclusion that sedating of animals is a rightful cost of pet ownership”.

Do you have any idea of the amount of medication that you have to put into a dog to sedate it? It’s not about cost, it’s about not giving my dog a dose of drugs that would land a human in hospital. Would you do it to your kids???

“Is this enough for me to have my freedom back or do I need to drop my pants for further inspection first?”

What about everybody else’s freedom? Fireworks are not a right, they are a privilege that people abuse year after year after year. They bother more people than they amuse, they are STILL GOING OFF RIGHT NOW because people don’t recognise that other people have a life outside of cracker night.

If it would help you understand, I am willing to visit you and honk my horn incessantly at odd times for odd lengths of time over the next month.

@ futto #41 – What a sad life you must have, living in Canberra so you can go all slack-jawed at some bangs and flashes one weekend a year. Perhaps while twiddling your thumbs in anticipation of the next round of fireworks you can look up the meaning of ‘fascism’

@ willo # 45 – I am sure that many people lack adequate fencing. I am also sure that people can secure their yard 363 days of the year, but cracker weekend is a whole new ball game.

@ ahappychappy #51 – Your dog is deaf I presume? I KNOW when to put my dog inside but unfortunately I don’t KNOW when random crackers will go off. My dog has an uncanny knack of being able to hear things through windows. Would you change your tune if you had to watch your dog suffer?

@ jakez # 52 “I’m about to start donating money/time to ACT Resue & Foster. I no longer support RSPCA (beyond acknowledging them as a potential pet source) as they are an organisation that actively works against freedom”.

Are you serious? The whole basis of that organisation is about protecting the five freedoms for animals (and if you don’t know what they are:

The five freedoms for animals
1. Freedom from Hunger and Thirst
By ready access to fresh water and a diet to maintain full health and vigour

2. Freedom from Discomfort
By providing an appropriate environment including shelter and a comfortable resting area

3. Freedom from Pain, Injury and Disease
By prevention through rapid diagnosis and treatment

4. Freedom to Express Normal Behaviour
By providing sufficient space, proper facilities, and company of the animal’s own kind

5. Freedom from Fear and Distress
By ensuring conditions and treatment which avoid mental suffering)

What freedom of yours are they working against? I’d love you to back up that comment because it pisses me off when people have a go at charities that shouldn’t even have to exist but for the dickheads in our society that make them necessary.

“I have recently come to the conclusion that sedating of animals is a rightful cost of pet ownership”.

Do you have any idea of the amount of medication that you have to put into a dog to sedate it? It’s not about cost, it’s about not giving my dog a dose of drugs that would land a human in hospital. Would you do it to your kids???

“Is this enough for me to have my freedom back or do I need to drop my pants for further inspection first?”

What about everybody else’s freedom? Fireworks are not a right, they are a privilege that people abuse year after year after year. They bother more people than they amuse, they are STILL GOING OFF RIGHT NOW because people don’t recognise that other people have a life outside of cracker night.

If it would help you understand, I am willing to visit you and honk my horn incessantly at odd times for odd lengths of time over the next month.

Holden Caulfield12:11 am 08 Jun 09

Good timing there. Shortly after I wrote the previous post a few crackers were set off from over the road towards three or four houses, including ours.

Thanks for the attention, we really appreciate it.

Holden Caulfield11:48 pm 07 Jun 09

Well, last night wasn’t too bad, but some yokels have been letting off firework regularly for the last 40 minutes or so now. 🙁

cranky said :

So Hargreaves wants to ban fireworks because some irresponsible fools defy the law and let them off outside of specified times. A further problem is the illegal ‘dynamite’ grade crackers that also seem to be available under the counter. Apparently policing is too dificult.

The sale and consumption of alcohol is also regulated by law. One of these laws is that irresponsible fools are not permitted to drive when inebriated. Unfortunately it is reported that this seems to occur regularly, with accidents, sometimes including death and injury, causing huge social costs. And this all happens in spite of heavy policing.

Mr Hargreaves: You stand accused of hipocracy unless you also present a ban on alcohol to the LA!

don’t you mean to mr hargreaves? wholesale ban of sale of alcohol to him would be good.

perhaps he should run an online poll on whether to ban fireworks, and put it out to the entire act population who use the internet…

So Hargreaves wants to ban fireworks because some irresponsible fools defy the law and let them off outside of specified times. A further problem is the illegal ‘dynamite’ grade crackers that also seem to be available under the counter. Apparently policing is too dificult.

The sale and consumption of alcohol is also regulated by law. One of these laws is that irresponsible fools are not permitted to drive when inebriated. Unfortunately it is reported that this seems to occur regularly, with accidents, sometimes including death and injury, causing huge social costs. And this all happens in spite of heavy policing.

Mr Hargreaves: You stand accused of hipocracy unless you also present a ban on alcohol to the LA!

Well for many year fireworks in my suburb go on for the next few weeks regardless of various complaints from neighbours in Rivett, they just go down to the local ovals and destroy them with the remains of the rubbish left over from the fireworks.. The ACT continues to inforce the safe times and private properties that they can be left off, but this is constantly ignored throughout the years. I used to enjoy them, but my it’s just gotton out of hand with people not respecting the laws inforces by authorities that turn a blind eye every year this goes on! Staying indoors in the only option for some of us

jakez said :

I can solve that problem overnight. Legalise the illegal fireworks and then there won’t be any illegal fireworks being let off.
;-P

riiight. and that would mean that 18yo kids could get ahold of crackers and blow up concrete bunker letterboxes, bins, and themselves? not what I want to see.

I can solve that problem overnight. Legalise the illegal fireworks and then there won’t be any illegal fireworks being let off.
;-P

all well and good jakez, don’t drop your pants, really. The fundamental problem that we law abiding citizenry face is the illegal devices being detonated around canberra over the weekend. maybe hargreaves should impose heftier fines for the sale and use of the illegal fireworks and leave the legal ones alone? banning the fireworks won’t solve the problem he is addressing, fining users of the illegals may cramp their style somewhat.

futto said :

i’m a anti-gun, pro-firework guy. It’s the only damn reason i live in this town and yes, i will be supporting local businesses this weekend with my legal quota of high quality sparkers and wizz fizzers.

All you nanny state facists need to live a bit more and not be so afraid of your shadow so much.

Anti-gun in what way? In a nanny state fascist way? Or a I’m personally not into it way?

laughtong said :

Can I ask if any of you that really want to let off fireworks are prepared to assist with handling the consequences. The dogs and cats that end up in the pounds, the rubbish left about, the damage caused, the small fires.
There are already a large number of dogs on the list to be killed at the DAS pound shortly if they are not adopted or rescued in the next few days. This is before the expected influx of dogs due to the fireworks.

1, I have recently come to the conclusion that sedating of animals is a rightful cost of pet ownership. I do not have any pets at the moment but will carry this principle with me when I do.
2, I’m about to start donating money/time to ACT Resue & Foster. I no longer support RSPCA (beyond acknowledging them as a potential pet source) as they are an organisation that actively works against freedom.
3, I would get a dog now from the pound/rspca/act rescue & foster but I am not the owner of my house.
4, As for the damage, rubbish, and small fires. Having worked in the cinema industry for 9 years I am meticulous about not leaving rubbish. I have never had use for the Fire Service and thus consider myself in surplus contribution to that organisation. I will be joining the Volunteer Firefighters this year. I contribute to the intellectual debate on issues of law reform and insurance that would also address your concerns.

Is this enough for me to have my freedom back or do I need to drop my pants for further inspection first?

ahappychappy9:56 am 05 Jun 09

laughtong said :

Can I ask if any of you that really want to let off fireworks are prepared to assist with handling the consequences. The dogs and cats that end up in the pounds, the rubbish left about, the damage caused, the small fires.
There are already a large number of dogs on the list to be killed at the DAS pound shortly if they are not adopted or rescued in the next few days. This is before the expected influx of dogs due to the fireworks.

I don’t think that the people letting off the fireworks (or the fireworks) are to blame. I think the un-educated and un-willing members of society who show complete disregard for the animals by leaving them outside are to blame. They KNOW the fireworks are about at the moment, if you love your animals so much, bring them inside and save them the “torment”. I agree, that in some cases the animals suffer (like my dog is scared of fireworks) but I just bring him inside and there’s no issue.

The last time we did a Queens Birthday cracker night, we lit a couple of bonfires on a rural private property. Someone called out the fire brigade three times, complaining about the bonfires. The firies were good about it; their advice was to notify them in advance of a bonfire so they can ignore the cranks. I pass that advice on.

Woody Mann-Caruso9:06 am 05 Jun 09

I make a substantial donation to the RSpCA every year. I didn’t know this meant I could buy bigger and more fireworks. Thanks laughtong!

…or we could all just realise there are some dickheads in society, chill with a beer and let off some fireworks.

Yep exactly why isn’t this a problem in Europe but it is in our over governed over regulated insulated society.

We use to have a great time on a winters night in Canberra with a bonfire in the back yard to keep warm and fireworks its great. I had dogs to and just kept them inside to easy.

laughtong said :

Can I ask if any of you that really want to let off fireworks are prepared to assist with handling the consequences. The dogs and cats that end up in the pounds, the rubbish left about, the damage caused, the small fires.
There are already a large number of dogs on the list to be killed at the DAS pound shortly if they are not adopted or rescued in the next few days. This is before the expected influx of dogs due to the fireworks.

What Willo said plus: most people do pick up theior spent fireworks, sure some don;’t but then have you ever been to a venue after a major sporting or musical event? Idiots leave trash on the ground are numerically speaking in the minority. I’ve also never seen damage caused by crackers – again that’s a few idiots. As Kramer said above, ever seen the damage caused by cars? Take a deep breath, lock your dog up and move on.

chewy, I would applaud your comment if I could. +1!

can i ask if you have done anything to educate the clowns that allow their dogs to escape from what by law is meant to be a secure yard?

Can I ask if any of you that really want to let off fireworks are prepared to assist with handling the consequences. The dogs and cats that end up in the pounds, the rubbish left about, the damage caused, the small fires.
There are already a large number of dogs on the list to be killed at the DAS pound shortly if they are not adopted or rescued in the next few days. This is before the expected influx of dogs due to the fireworks.

Late last night some guys were doing burnouts in their cars not far from my house, so lets ban all cars! Also a guy hit another guy in Civic on the weekend, so lets ban all guys!!!

…or we could all just realise there are some dickheads in society, chill with a beer and let off some fireworks.

You live in Canberra because you can get crackers? bloody hell.

i’m a anti-gun, pro-firework guy. It’s the only damn reason i live in this town and yes, i will be supporting local businesses this weekend with my legal quota of high quality sparkers and wizz fizzers.

All you nanny state facists need to live a bit more and not be so afraid of your shadow so much.

“Why should something that annoys people for two weeks of the year mainly concentrated around one weekend be banned due to yet another attack of the “wowsers”?”

People getting killed annoys me. Am I a wowser?

You answered your own question. Because that thing is only supposed to happen ON that weekend, not the 2 weeks around it

Pesty said :

Sic said :

No amount of kids having fun setting of fireworks can be more frustrating than a bad animal owner who ignores their barking dog all through the night, every night.

Ok, who’s for the banning of dogs? WTF why stop there, get rid of cats, rabbits, and those bloody annoying budgies!

winge winge winge

Way to not get the point Einstein.

Why should something that annoys people for two weeks of the year mainly concentrated around one weekend be banned due to yet another attack of the “wowsers”?

Plus hey, it’s not the dogs fault it has dropkick owners, but end of the day, it’s the dog that’ll get my hose when it’s 2am and I’m still awake from the barking. Should get the point now that it’s colder.

Woody Mann-Caruso8:19 pm 04 Jun 09

Go search YouTube for ‘ANNM’ to find out what you can make with some perfectly cheap and legal nitromethane from your local hobby shop (please, sir, it’s for my model plane) and some semi-regulated ammonium nitrate. Then go search Wikipedia for ‘ANFO’ for more laughs.

in light of the act health dept handing out patches to smokers, will we get a packet of sparklers?

I hope so, cause I love making sparkler bombs! 🙂

some of the big bungers sound like someone has got their hands on TNT. it doesn’t surprise me that the govt are trying to persecute the legal fireworks users in a bid to clean up the illegal users. in light of the act health dept handing out patches to smokers, will we get a packet of sparklers?

I think the best argument in favour of banning the fireworks is the post above talking about how annoying it is that people still purchase and let off the already illegal firecrackers.

…hmm

Der.
The solution to voters and their children letting off increasing quantities of illegal fireworks at the wrong time of year is clearly to increase the quantity of illegal fireworks and make every time of year “the wrong time”.

Voters and their children are never wrong, so any non-legislative behaviour-changing answer is not worth considering.

VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy4:28 pm 04 Jun 09

It’s not.

captainwhorebags4:22 pm 04 Jun 09

Yes I agree, it’s the loud bungers that are the annoying problem. Thing is, these are already illegal.

So how is banning currently legal fireworks going to fix this?

barking toad4:20 pm 04 Jun 09

There should be a constable at every letterbox in every street.

And others patrolling every empty space in every suburb to apprehend these criminals.

Nail ’em up I say!

Sic said :

No amount of kids having fun setting of fireworks can be more frustrating than a bad animal owner who ignores their barking dog all through the night, every night.

Ok, who’s for the banning of dogs? WTF why stop there, get rid of cats, rabbits, and those bloody annoying budgies!

winge winge winge

chrispy said :

I’m fairly certain I’ve heard fireworks going off near my home this week already.

really?

how can you tell?

I hear one a few minutes ago in Holt. But it doesn’t really relate to this story, because the legal ones don’t actually go bang any more (not that loud any, besides, they aren’t on sale yet…).

chrispy said :

I’m fairly certain I’ve heard fireworks going off near my home this week already.

I know i have. the screaming and swearing was a dead giveaway…

I’m fairly certain I’ve heard fireworks going off near my home this week already.

Holden Caulfield3:06 pm 04 Jun 09

Sic said :

No amount of kids having fun setting of fireworks can be more frustrating than a bad animal owner who ignores their barking dog all through the night, every night.

Haha, fair point, but it is when you don’t have that. 🙂

chewy14 said :

mroizo said :

whats next, banning porn ?
surely tourism in the capital would suffer from no porn or fireworks.

They can rip my porn from my cold dead hands. Well at least one of them.

at least we would still have pot…

mroizo said :

whats next, banning porn ?
surely tourism in the capital would suffer from no porn or fireworks.

They can rip my porn from my cold dead hands. Well at least one of them.

whats next, banning porn ?
surely tourism in the capital would suffer from no porn or fireworks.

No amount of kids having fun setting of fireworks can be more frustrating than a bad animal owner who ignores their barking dog all through the night, every night.

neanderthalsis said :

That’s one hell of a menace to society which must be banned.

I agree, the Canberra Times must be banned!

-1

Holden Caulfield2:09 pm 04 Jun 09

Last year on “this weekend” some kids were setting off fireworks in a hopper outside a nearby school. This, after they were unsuccessful at burning down the school’s playground equipment. Still, I guess you’re right, easy access to fireworks is just a bit of fun. If a school gets burned down by a few kids having a laugh then that’s a small price to pay for not living in a nanny state.

You know, it’s funny how incidents like this seem to happen around the same weekend. But, I’m sure it is just a coincidence.

The odd cracker let off from time to time throughout the year – I find it annoying, but not a massive problem.

The use of crackers as per the published regulations over the QB weekend – obviously I’m not a huge fan, but, really, no problem.

The use of crackers for anti-social behaviour such as letter box bombs, general vandalism and use well into small hours of the morning from Fri-Mon over the QB weekend – not acceptable.

As usual, it is the halfwits like that who spoil the fun “responsible” people.

Have your fun, by all means, just don’t be pricks about it. That’s not too much to ask.

As with any activity a minority will spoil it for others.

I don’t mind the annual display of fireworks. What sh*ts me to tears are the miscreants who obtain “under the counter” bungers and other illegal “types” of fireworks and then set about a program of letting them off over the next 3 months at between midnight and 4:00AM.

stonedwookie1:42 pm 04 Jun 09

@Sic
i agree with you who really cares its just abit of fun.
living in a nanny state is no fun

Some kids were setting off fireworks in Giralang last night, we stepped outside and appreciated the free show.

Some people really need to take off their angry grandpa pants and get over themselves. Australia is already well on its way to becoming a police state where everything fun is illegal and regulated, I enjoy my one weekend a year we can set off fireworks, who really cares if people set them off in the week before and after, is it really effecting your life in such a negative way you need to get it banned?

Woody Mann-Caruso1:15 pm 04 Jun 09

VY +1.

VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy said :

The real question, though, is how much of a problem is it really? OK, pets get anxious and sometimes run away, and the odd letterbox gets blown to bits, but we have assualts, robberies, and all manner of much more serious crime in this town that doesn’t seem to be being adequately addressed at the moment.

And do we realistically expect a bunch of low level pubes to get together an enforcement program that will stand up in court? If the cops can’t respond to kids mucking around with fireworks, will parking inspectors do any better?

FWIW, I think fireworks get way too much media airtime. I’m not convinced it’s that big an issue.

^^ as per above

Agreed, VY.
Let’s keep some fun with an associated risk, lest all of Canberra’s children end up as bubble-wrapped, humourless servants of the fun police.

VYBerlinaV8_the_one_they_all_copy12:47 pm 04 Jun 09

The real question, though, is how much of a problem is it really? OK, pets get anxious and sometimes run away, and the odd letterbox gets blown to bits, but we have assualts, robberies, and all manner of much more serious crime in this town that doesn’t seem to be being adequately addressed at the moment.

And do we realistically expect a bunch of low level pubes to get together an enforcement program that will stand up in court? If the cops can’t respond to kids mucking around with fireworks, will parking inspectors do any better?

FWIW, I think fireworks get way too much media airtime. I’m not convinced it’s that big an issue.

Holden Caulfield12:35 pm 04 Jun 09

LG said :

Lets face it, its not surprising that fines haven’t been issued for misuse since it would be very unlikely to identify who blew up whos letter box.

Not to mention you’d need staffers working over time, well into the early hours, to catch the scrotes responsible.

neanderthalsis said :

That’s one hell of a menace to society which must be banned.

I agree, the Canberra Times must be banned!

Yeah, I’ll jump on that bandwagon …. lol

But it would be quite easy to identify those houses which are holding their own little SkyFire sessions outside the permissable dates and fine them. I think I might go and test whether they are just as compacent about some of the other laws in this fine town.

housebound said :

neanderthalsis said :

That’s one hell of a menace to society which must be banned.

I agree, the Canberra Times must be banned!

+1

+2

Lets face it, its not surprising that fines haven’t been issued for misuse since it would be very unlikely to identify who blew up whos letter box.

Let’s get the Brown Bombers onto Tailgating! They’d clean up big-time.

Gungahlin Al10:16 am 04 Jun 09

As I’ve said before, if everything else in the ACT got the level of enforcement that car parking does, perhaps people wouldn’t be so blase about complying?

I’m not sure that lack of official activity on the part of an official body means there’s nothing to investigate/prosecute.

neanderthalsis said :

That’s one hell of a menace to society which must be banned.

I agree, the Canberra Times must be banned!

+1

neanderthalsis9:52 am 04 Jun 09

That’s one hell of a menace to society which must be banned.

I agree, the Canberra Times must be banned!

That just proves that The Office of Regulatory Services is THE most inept A.C.T Gov dept.
Their heads are so far up their A%&ses they almost choke themselves.
IMHO.

Are you saying that fireworks aren’t being misused?
FFS!

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