Is there a law saying you aren't allowed to build on someone else's land?

Our backyard is almost identical to this, in that we can see the neighbor’s wall and termite barrier. Unfortunate that this occurs because it creates two problems.
1. The neighbor’s land becomes part of your backyard and you can’t do anything with it [Except maybe build a fence on the border, which would probably hit his guttering] This stops your neighbor’s access to the inspection site.
2. The neighbor can’t get to the termite barrier without asking your permission or he’ll be trespassing. An inconvenience if you don’t get along with them. Else they’ll have to hang over the edge of the roof and inspect from above.
Ah, boundary disputes are so good when developers create them out of a simple need to reduce costs by using a garage wall as a fence instead of building one out of “treated” hardwood. This shouldn’t happen under any circumstance unless the houses are classified as duplex – considering they are sharing a wall on the boundary line.
I feel for you beejay76, but I fear there might be little you can do about it.
Interestingly, how do you access this part of the your yard without going onto your neighbor’s land?

screaming banshee said :

Move along, nothing to see here.

Except a deck with a view over nothing but a featureless brick wall, overlooked by the neighbours at the back, with not a tree in sight and no prospect of there ever being one. 🙁

Well if you need to walk around that side of your house, just walk over the deck, or get a reduction on your land rates.

Move along, nothing to see here.

I have read the last two pages of opinions and discussion about how this neighbor has built on ‘your’ land, and now that i can see clearly what your interpretation of ‘your land’ is and I am horrified!

All I can see from this picture that has been posted is a typical backyard similar to many i have seen before which in no way appears to encroaching on ‘your’ land.

All i can say is…. Thank goodness we do not have you as a neighbor, what an uncomfortable situation you seem to have made for yourself and your neighbor.

And as a side note, my goodness, ‘Termites eating through bricks, that is preposterous!

Good luck with this ridiculous fight!

beejay76 said :

the_dodgy_neighbor said :

I am disappointed that it has had to come to this. However, here is the deck in question.

Oh, god, so am I! So you can see in the pic that it comes a little way into our block. Now it’s out there, I can state the whole problem. It’s not with you using the land per se. We don’t mind you having general use of that little bit of land as part of your garden and so on. Obviously we can’t use it, so that’s not the problem. Our problem is with that large wooden seating structure well above our termite barrier that increases risk etc as we discussed previously. We would like it off our land, which would then give us a nice little buffer between the wood and our nice, chewable house frame. Given that it’s on our land, and you didn’t ask our permission or even consult, we don’t think that’s particularly unreasonable.

Are you serious BJ all week you have been telling us that this deck intrudes onto your land, for heaven sake go and either get a life or a lawyer, and stop telling porkies.

Storm in a tea cup

That looks like a deck sticking out from someone’s house, and butting right up against the wall of somebody elses house, across what looks like an unfenced property line.

Call me crazy, but if the owner of the second house wanted to walk down the side of his house he’d need to walk over the other persons deck.

Overall, I’d say this looks like a nice very deck in the wrong place. But I Am Not A Lawyer, thank Zeus.

the_dodgy_neighbor said :

I am disappointed that it has had to come to this. However, here is the deck in question.

Oh, god, so am I! So you can see in the pic that it comes a little way into our block. Now it’s out there, I can state the whole problem. It’s not with you using the land per se. We don’t mind you having general use of that little bit of land as part of your garden and so on. Obviously we can’t use it, so that’s not the problem. Our problem is with that large wooden seating structure well above our termite barrier that increases risk etc as we discussed previously. We would like it off our land, which would then give us a nice little buffer between the wood and our nice, chewable house frame. Given that it’s on our land, and you didn’t ask our permission or even consult, we don’t think that’s particularly unreasonable.

Hmm, Skid, very familiar with planning processes, aren’t we.

maybe just post a link to the image?

Here

http://i55.tinypic.com/2akbfxs.jpg

the_dodgy_neighbor said :

I am disappointed that it has had to come to this. However, here is the deck in question.

I’m not seein’ any deck here.

I am disappointed that it has had to come to this. However, here is the deck in question.

colourful sydney racing identity said :

In all seriousness, try and deal with the nieghbour directly, the last thing you want is to have a toxic relationship with the people you live next door to.

except that they are quite obviously idiots! Go the chainsaw!

The_Dudes said :

No photos hey…..if the deck is on your property, then how does that compromise your neighbours?? (that sounds dodgy). It looks like you made a mountain out of a mole hill!

Their block is seriously small. A photo would include their house. And, as I said before, there’s no line on the deck/ ground indicating where the boundary is, therefore what would you hope to see?

You seem determined to be critical, and you can if you like. All I was asking was if anyone had any knowledge about the laws surrounding this situation, as the territory does not intervene if someone builds on your land.

@Skid – I am waiting to hear from the Chief Counsel of ACTPLA (no less!) hopefully after the long weekend.

No photos hey…..if the deck is on your property, then how does that compromise your neighbours?? (that sounds dodgy). It looks like you made a mountain out of a mole hill!

Skidbladnir said :

1- I am not a lawyer, and suggest you try and sort out neighbour issues amicably.
2- See 1.
3- Are you certain you’re aware of precisely where your land interest ends or common boundary exists? (Have you checked previous certified site surveys, and had everything re-surveyed by a registered surveyor to ascertain non-compliance or compliance? If not, proceed no further down the list, but click this link.)
4- See 1.
5- Was there a fence already, and has any ‘boundary repair’\’fence replacement’ been agreed to or reasonably considered by both parties with sufficient notice?
6- See 1.
7- Would you be willing to consider a private creation\transfer and grant of an easement as the servient party?
8- See 1.
9- Would you be willing to renounc your interest in the affected land in exchange for whatever recompense you require, in exchange for filing for a variation to the existing lease boundary with ACTPLA in your neighbour’s favour?
10- See 1.
11- The Take off and nuke the relationship from orbit response:
Would you be willing to consider civil action through ACAT if you were willing to accept a determination with total financial value less than $10k?
12- RE 11: See 1.

ACAT information available here, with application forms for various ACAT actions available here.

PS: This took about ten minutes of research and typing to achieve. Finding out your rights isn’t particularly hard, its mostly about working out which right to exercise

“WOW”… informative,constructive AND interesting, not to mention very helpfull

So what was the final result (or eventual advice from ACTPLA)?
I’m just curious if anything I said was actually of use.

zig said :

Photos or it didn’t happen.

Loads of people have asked for photos, but I haven’t posted any for two reasons.

Mainly, there’s no “your block ends here” mark on the ground, so it would be meaningless. Oh look. There’s a deck. Great.

Also, it would compromise the privacy of the dodgy neighbours, and I don’t think that’s really fair.

cranky said :

ACTPLA – The same pack of A#@*holes who caused me many tthousands of dollars and months of delay because a proposed renovation encroached 90cm onto their precious front boundary. A triangular shape (corner of a garage), so roughly 90 x 90 x 90 cm. We would have to move the building to comply, we were advised. No, no negotiation. This is a boundary already 6 metres from the curb.

This crowd of dogs#@ t seem to make decisions depending on which side of the bed they got out of, and whether they had achieved or not.

Sack the lot of them!

are you for real – you’re seriously criticising them for preventing you from building part of your private building on public land???

Photos or it didn’t happen.

ACTPLA – The same pack of A#@*holes who caused me many tthousands of dollars and months of delay because a proposed renovation encroached 90cm onto their precious front boundary. A triangular shape (corner of a garage), so roughly 90 x 90 x 90 cm. We would have to move the building to comply, we were advised. No, no negotiation. This is a boundary already 6 metres from the curb.

This crowd of dogs#@ t seem to make decisions depending on which side of the bed they got out of, and whether they had achieved or not.

Sack the lot of them!

I find it hard to believe that someone could have built a deck that extends onto your property and ACTPLA are not interested. In my experience the only way that this could have happened is if for some reason the boundaries are not clear such as you share the boundary with a tree or other immovable object, or you have a solid wall such as part of your house or garage which acts as your boundary. Do us all a favour and follow “Diggety’s” advice and post some photos online so that everyone can see what you are dealing with and provide you with some constructive advice.
This whole thing sounds a bit dodgy to me.

beejay76 said :

Well, hopefully it’s not just Skid yanking my chain. I’ve emailed that address as below…

Its no great secret, I’m a Federal employee in an area totally unrelated to land zoning and community planning, and not particularly hard to find.
Impersonating the media management area of ACTPLA and setting up an email on an ACT government domain just for talking about a property border dispute I have no interest in (beyond curiosity) could not possibly be a worthwhile use of my time

Well, hopefully it’s not just Skid yanking my chain. I’ve emailed that address as below…

My neighbours built a deck that extends onto our land. ACTPLA said to lodge a controlled activity form, which I duly did. They then informed us that it wasn’t a controlled activity and therefore outside your jurisdiction. Today, I have spoken to the chap who investigated, and apparently he didn’t actually look at the deck, which he has now agreed to do. However, I’m fairly certain that it won’t require a DA, and therefore his original assessment will be correct.

My problem is this: if there is no DA required for such a structure, there is no control over it. If ACTPLA also won’t bring people into line who build illegally then it means there is no other recourse than civil action. This means that there is effectively no government control whatsoever on structures exempt from DA. Does this mean I can walk across the road and build a pergola on my neighbour’s block? Apparently so, unless they take me to court to take it off. I think it is grossly unfair that because my neighbour decided “it shouldn’t be a problem” I have to cough up money to pay a lawyer.

It would be good to see a fix for this kind of thing by an extension of ACTPLA’s power to include the investigation of structures that are DA exempt. I intend to write words to that effect to every MLA, as well, but I’d be mighty grateful if you could pass it up the line.

Cheers,

BJ

ACTPLAComms said :

Beejay76, we’re sorry to hear you received an unsatisfactory response to your query. If you could email ACTPLA_Communications@act.gov.au and provide us with your contact details, we’d like to be able to come back to you with a suggested course of action.

While you’re at it, can you please get Jon Stanhope to put some staff on 132281, so people relying on mobile phones don’t endure a high cost as well as inconvenience during the 10 minute wait – thanks to public art taking precedence over local government services? Thanks ACTPLA.

Beejay76, try us! Email us at ACTPLA_Communications.act.gov.au so we can help.

Beejy76: Thats your opportunity to ruffle feathers knocking..

That is the email they use for RSVP and invites to industry events and developer information sessions, its primarily their Public Relations management email.
The phone numbers that associate though, goes to Client Services Communications and Government Services Section, who are amongst other things community management, media strategy and engagement, responsible for maintaining their web presence, and advice to the ACTPLA executive.

beejay76 said :

ACTPLAComms said :

Beejay76, we’re sorry to hear you received an unsatisfactory response to your query. If you could email ACTPLA_Communications@act.gov.au and provide us with your contact details, we’d like to be able to come back to you with a suggested course of action.

You what? Methinks someone is taking the piss.

I reckon it’s legit – quick way to find out is to email them and ask.

ACTPLAComms said :

Beejay76, we’re sorry to hear you received an unsatisfactory response to your query. If you could email ACTPLA_Communications@act.gov.au and provide us with your contact details, we’d like to be able to come back to you with a suggested course of action.

You what? Methinks someone is taking the piss.

EvanJames said :

Keijidosha said :

I suggest you simply claim the section of deck on your property and use it for your own purposes. Perhaps a quiet place to defecate every morning before breakfast?

I like this one the best.

We really need a picture of the problem, I think.

+1.
Photo please!
I’m interested, did they need to jump the fence to build the deck?

ACTPLAComms said :

Beejay76, we’re sorry to hear you received an unsatisfactory response to your query. If you could email ACTPLA_Communications@act.gov.au and provide us with your contact details, we’d like to be able to come back to you with a suggested course of action.

I hope ACTPLAComms isn’t a confused apparatchik of the Communications arm of the ACT branch of the Peoples Liberation Army.

On the other hand, if this is fair dinkum then good on you, ACTPLAComms. In my experience it’s rare to see a government agency respond so positively to a problem. More power to you.

Beejay76, we’re sorry to hear you received an unsatisfactory response to your query. If you could email ACTPLA_Communications@act.gov.au and provide us with your contact details, we’d like to be able to come back to you with a suggested course of action.

Pandy said :

14: Take off and nuke from orbit and aim at Skidblanir. The tin foil hat wont mask the GPS transmitter implanted into his head.
It’s the only way to be sure.
2 birds, one nuke.

Um. It looked like good advice to me. You’re not the offending neighbour are you Pandy?

Pandy said :

14: Take off and nuke from orbit and aim at Skidblanir. The tin foil hat wont mask the GPS transmitter implanted into his head.

It’s the only way to be sure.

2 birds, one nuke.

what are you on about????

gazket said :

I just looked at the ACTPLA web site and its a useful as tits on a bull. most pathetic web site ever, links they give come up with a msg cannot be found.

100% agree. I tried to get them to elaborate on some of their rules about class 10A structures and DAs, they couldn’t/wouldn’t answer a question about their own web page and referred me to a building surveyor. He ended up telling me over the phone quite simply everything was fine [no DA required], with a “here we go again with ACTPLA” kind of tone. If ACTPLA can’t act or even make determinations using their own rules, what use are they except for raking in cash at everyone’s expense?
As for the deck dilemma, I say walk past it, hit your head “accidentally” on it and sue the pants of ’em.

Pandy said :

14: Take off and nuke from orbit and aim at Skidblanir. The tin foil hat wont mask the GPS transmitter implanted into his head.

It’s the only way to be sure.

2 birds, one nuke.

Huh? Seriously. What’s that about? What’d Skid write that caused that?

14: Take off and nuke from orbit and aim at Skidblanir. The tin foil hat wont mask the GPS transmitter implanted into his head.

It’s the only way to be sure.

2 birds, one nuke.

I just looked at the ACTPLA web site and its a useful as tits on a bull. most pathetic web site ever, links they give come up with a msg cannot be found.

1- I am not a lawyer, and suggest you try and sort out neighbour issues amicably.
2- See 1.
3- Are you certain you’re aware of precisely where your land interest ends or common boundary exists? (Have you checked previous certified site surveys, and had everything re-surveyed by a registered surveyor to ascertain non-compliance or compliance? If not, proceed no further down the list, but click this link.)
4- See 1.
5- Was there a fence already, and has any ‘boundary repair’\’fence replacement’ been agreed to or reasonably considered by both parties with sufficient notice?
6- See 1.
7- Would you be willing to consider a private creation\transfer and grant of an easement as the servient party?
8- See 1.
9- Would you be willing to renounc your interest in the affected land in exchange for whatever recompense you require, in exchange for filing for a variation to the existing lease boundary with ACTPLA in your neighbour’s favour?
10- See 1.
11- The Take off and nuke the relationship from orbit response:
Would you be willing to consider civil action through ACAT if you were willing to accept a determination with total financial value less than $10k?
12- RE 11: See 1.

ACAT information available here, with application forms for various ACAT actions available here.

PS: This took about ten minutes of research and typing to achieve. Finding out your rights isn’t particularly hard, its mostly about working out which right to exercise

Why don’t you send them a nice thank you note for the deck and invite them to a bbq on it?

Keijidosha said :

I suggest you simply claim the section of deck on your property and use it for your own purposes. Perhaps a quiet place to defecate every morning before breakfast?

I like this one the best.

We really need a picture of the problem, I think.

It’s pretty amazing that you need a DA and a yellow notice on a stick to erect a birdbath, but can build a dirty great structure over the boundary.

Why is there not a fence protecting the extension of the deck onto your boundary? Was it build prior to the fence being errected?

beejay76 said :

Thanks Skidbladnir. I was clearly looking in the wrong place and didn’t know what to call it. So it would seem that you *are* allowed to build wherever the hell you like and then the owner of the property has to sort it out….

Interesting. I wonder, had the offending structure been one which required a DA, would ACTPLA have fined you, because it is on your land…?

seems strange that you need approval to have a water tank within 1.5m of the boundary yet you can build a deck on someone elses land

Thanks Skidbladnir. I was clearly looking in the wrong place and didn’t know what to call it. So it would seem that you *are* allowed to build wherever the hell you like and then the owner of the property has to sort it out. How crap is that? Better hope no-one whacks something up every time you go on holidays, what?

While I don’t have access to a chainsaw, there is a power saw looking for a bit of action. Perhaps I should just ask Captn RAAF around.

the chainsaw option is going to do wonders for your relationship with your neighbour/s…

I can’t believe ACTPLA reckon this is out of their authority; whose do you need, the police? I’d be calling ACTPLA to ask for advice on what to do now… not a handful of ACT residents who jump straight to the chainsaw option – as amusing as that does sound 😉

Of course, the Lt. Ripley method has it’s own attractions, too…

I would be very wary about starting the chainsaw unless you were “surveyor sure” where your boundary was.

In all seriousness, try and deal with the nieghbour directly, the last thing you want is to have a toxic relationship with the people you live next door to.

BlackIce said :

Well, if there’s a structure on your land, you can always use a chainsaw to remove it…

Is it a nice deck? You could always put a BBQ and some chairs on the bit on your side of the line, invite some friends over and have a party?

Encroachments between lesees of two seperate titles are a private matter, not ACTPLA.
http://www.actpla.act.gov.au/topics/design_build/manage_construction/encroachments

Occupiers are responsible for care, or at least reasonably minimise the risk of injury, of anybody entering that land.
(IE: You can’t line your border with pitfalls, nor cover your section of the constructed deck with panji traps)

I don’t disagree with the consensus that chainsaw revenge is the ticket, but if you don’t have access to a saw, then I suggest you simply claim the section of deck on your property and use it for your own purposes. Perhaps a quiet place to defecate every morning before breakfast?

Might be a case to make some of your rates money back. Assess the total percentage of your block that has been rendered unusable for your own purposes (all aesthetic and privacy concerns included) and offer to lease the affected area for a goodly percentage of your annual rates bill.

Oh and while we’re there, how about a photo of the transgression?

I suggest you take off and nuke the site from orbit, it’s the only way to be sure.

How far past? Get a proper survey done and make allowance for error, i.e. be conservative. Be assertive, but don’t just go ahead and cut. In a matter-of-fact manner, with evidence in hand, advise neighbour. This is a technical issue that can be fixed by doing remedial work that can leave the neighbour with a decent deck and you with your land. Clearly the neighbour needs to pay for the work, but if they don’t wat to then they need to understand that the alternative is a fe minutes of chainsaw.

Then get rid of it.

Treat it like an overhanging branch and cut it down.

If it is on your property then you are free to do what you like to maintain the longterm, aesthetic nature of your property. If the ACTPLA say that it is not their issue then you go to town son.

Well, if there’s a structure on your land, you can always use a chainsaw to remove it…

Trim the deck like an over hanging branch. Use a chainsaw.

They built on your land, hence you can remove it from your land, right?

trespass