Life experience vs youth

creative_canberran 28 March 2012 41

Earlier this month, the ACT Greens announced their 2012 election line up. Among the candidates, 20 year old University of Canberra student, real estate agent, drag queen and comic Johnathan Davis. By his own admission he’s scraping by, living at home, dividing his time between studies, part time work and his, various and colourful extra curricular activities. And there’s of course Wyatt Roy in the Federal Parliament.

Today Twitter brings word that NSW Labor loyalist and former ANU Union Chair Ben Dugan is to run for the Queanbeyan City Council. Readers of RiotACT have seen his name appear on here a few times, once because of his plan to rebrand ANU Bar (never happened) and his founding of an education foundation (not sure where that went).

I don’t want to focus on these individuals, but want to throw out there the issue of life experience vs youth. What do people think about running local and territory government while still studying, or with very little experience beyond study. Is there such a thing as too young, or is it desirable vs stale politicians jaded by the political machine?


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AsparagusSyndrome AsparagusSyndrome 12:22 am 04 Apr 12

Getting well along through middle-age now. As the old saying goes – The older I get, the better I was. I am more and more inclined to the conclusion that I and most others around me don’t have “the answers” and might just have to satisfy ourselves with giving out helpful suggestions and hope for the best.

So, give youth a go by all means. But not a free kick. Judge them by their performance and merit, just like the rest of us, and not by any misplaced ‘leadership’ aspirations they may exhibit. (Tt seems that every kid these days is given ‘leadership’ pep-talks at school each year from about the age of 8, so some of them might appear to us to graduate with a sense of ‘entitlement’ – this is just a passing phase. I’m not sure that too many of today’s youth got ‘follower’ pep-talks at school, but as that is most people’s destiny, it would seem more useful sometimes.).

Recognise that our youth have their own perspectives, just like we did, a less tarnished ‘idealism’ and perhaps less destructive cynicism than the rest of us. And yes, they often have less ‘real worldly experience’, but that all depends on your definition of ‘real world’ which generally appears to include “everything I’ve ever done and nothing else besides”.

If voted in, they won’t be working alone – they’ll be part of a team of varied talents and ages, whatever side of politics they enter (and sadly many will be absorbed into the party machines and compromise their individualism and ideals). Don’t be surprised if some of them switch sides. They won’t be the first. It’s not always down to naked opportunism – some of them are genuinely still finding their place in life (even if most of us would prefer they didn’t do that while in the priveleged role of public office).

Also bear in mind that genuine talent tends to show up early in those who possess it – its really up to us to identify it, recruit it when we find it, and cultivate it, not bury it. (The political workload will bury those of insufficient talent anyway). My $1.30 worth, allowing for inflation over all those decades.

c_c c_c 10:26 pm 03 Apr 12

Micky_P said :

…attempting to wound Ben Duggan’s council run is not a despicable attack?

Trying to wound someone’s name in public? You must have me confused with someone else:

http://twitter.com/#!/Ben_Duggan/status/184895964723679232

Ben_Dover Ben_Dover 5:14 pm 29 Mar 12

Jim Jones said :

Ben_Dover said :

You damn kids get off my lawn

Ah look! Mystic Jim makes up rubbish that no one has said, but is protected by the admins from any reply! Gosh, that’s novel.

astrojax astrojax 4:23 pm 29 Mar 12

poetix said :

(and all my comments are odd examples.)

🙂

ML-585 ML-585 3:26 pm 29 Mar 12

c_c said :

She was an immature, narrow minded person who didn’t listen and couldn’t look critically at something.

Sounds like your average university student to me.

I have nothing against “youth” (or even uni students for that matter), provided they don’t believe that they know everything (and by extension that everyone else knows nothing).

poetix poetix 2:09 pm 29 Mar 12

astrojax said :

poetix said :

astrojax said :

i rekkun there should be some youth voice in the political debate and don’t at all want to see obstacles in the way of any elegible folk standing to run; but any thought of mandating a youth quorum, some positive discrimination, would water down that input. so if this davis chap[?] is the right stuff, eloectors will elect. but i fancy most voters want something tangible for their vote and that would include some world and life experience.

that said, there also needs to be competition for the vote and a lack of this might see him get up! there is a dearth of talent in australian politics at the moment and perhaps a ‘youth team’ philosophy will give us some traction in coming terms…

Speaking of traction, why do you hate your caps key so much? Your sentences read like you were on one of those bikes where you can’t stop the pedals going round and you’re going downhill.

I would never vote for someone who wrote ‘rekkun’, for example. Or a real estate agent. But having some young people elected would be good. So long as they’re not Young Liberals, aka the Smarmy Army.

ode in reply

my caps key is broke. and i am the reincarnation
of e.e.cummings. and i have
a neurological disorder preventing me from using
big letters. and as a space
traveller, the caps key also impels me from my rampant thoughts

and there is an invisible man stalking
me warning me off the caps key. be afraid. and the weather
precludes my using

capitalisation: especially in the nation’s capital – we’re already
capital, so why double up? and this bike
is killing me…

and luckily for you, i’m not running. whaddya rekkun about that, eh? i wouldn’t vote for a real estate agent, either, btw… and not that i’ve ever got into the poetry of your own posts so much [an odd example here and there notwithstanding] 🙂

astrojax surprise
silvery starman floats out
rampant blatherings

🙂

(and all my comments are odd examples.)

Thumper Thumper 1:58 pm 29 Mar 12

Frankly I’d vote for Noddy over any of the current numpties on offer, and that includes all parties.

fragge fragge 1:15 pm 29 Mar 12

When I was younger, I clearly saw the benefits of having a young opinion contributing to political decision-making processes. As I have gotten older, my fickle brain thinks that its current system of logic is “better” and that individuals with life experience, contrasted against students, are clearly better decision makers over a broad spectrum. Young people tend to have focused goals and ambitions, and it is this ability to obsessively analyse situations for fault (where adults weight the protection of their status as guardian over the decision process more highly perhaps than the outcomes of all their decisions) – this fault-finding methodology can be utilized and used as a springboard for better, broader policy decisions with regard to future generations. The fact that we discount two entire generations of human beings from being able to make a real, immediate impact on the world that they live in is a very misguided state of affairs indeed.

astrojax astrojax 1:04 pm 29 Mar 12

poetix said :

astrojax said :

i rekkun there should be some youth voice in the political debate and don’t at all want to see obstacles in the way of any elegible folk standing to run; but any thought of mandating a youth quorum, some positive discrimination, would water down that input. so if this davis chap[?] is the right stuff, eloectors will elect. but i fancy most voters want something tangible for their vote and that would include some world and life experience.

that said, there also needs to be competition for the vote and a lack of this might see him get up! there is a dearth of talent in australian politics at the moment and perhaps a ‘youth team’ philosophy will give us some traction in coming terms…

Speaking of traction, why do you hate your caps key so much? Your sentences read like you were on one of those bikes where you can’t stop the pedals going round and you’re going downhill.

I would never vote for someone who wrote ‘rekkun’, for example. Or a real estate agent. But having some young people elected would be good. So long as they’re not Young Liberals, aka the Smarmy Army.

ode in reply

my caps key is broke. and i am the reincarnation
of e.e.cummings. and i have
a neurological disorder preventing me from using
big letters. and as a space
traveller, the caps key also impels me from my rampant thoughts

and there is an invisible man stalking
me warning me off the caps key. be afraid. and the weather
precludes my using

capitalisation: especially in the nation’s capital – we’re already
capital, so why double up? and this bike
is killing me…

and luckily for you, i’m not running. whaddya rekkun about that, eh? i wouldn’t vote for a real estate agent, either, btw… and not that i’ve ever got into the poetry of your own posts so much [an odd example here and there notwithstanding] 🙂

c_c c_c 12:40 pm 29 Mar 12

bd84 said :

There is merit in having both younger and older members of parliament.

This actually raises an interesting question that no one has touched on yet, how do we define young?

Wyatt Roy is 21-22. Johnathon Davis is 20. Ben Duggan is early 20s.

So we’re not talking teenagers.

But Natasha Stott Despoja was 26 when she entered parliament and her age was considered controversial for the time.

There’s obviously no magic cut off so long as they’re over 18, but is the idea of “young” politicians perhaps a generational thing. Will politicians generally get younger as people in society in general do stuff younger?

poetix poetix 12:39 pm 29 Mar 12

astrojax said :

i rekkun there should be some youth voice in the political debate and don’t at all want to see obstacles in the way of any elegible folk standing to run; but any thought of mandating a youth quorum, some positive discrimination, would water down that input. so if this davis chap[?] is the right stuff, eloectors will elect. but i fancy most voters want something tangible for their vote and that would include some world and life experience.

that said, there also needs to be competition for the vote and a lack of this might see him get up! there is a dearth of talent in australian politics at the moment and perhaps a ‘youth team’ philosophy will give us some traction in coming terms…

Speaking of traction, why do you hate your caps key so much? Your sentences read like you were on one of those bikes where you can’t stop the pedals going round and you’re going downhill.

I would never vote for someone who wrote ‘rekkun’, for example. Or a real estate agent. But having some young people elected would be good. So long as they’re not Young Liberals, aka the Smarmy Army.

Micky_P Micky_P 12:39 pm 29 Mar 12

c_c said :

Obvious question: does repeated posts about Zed Seselja and The ACT Greens equal an infatuation with Zed and the Green’s MLAs?

Of course not. What we have here is what Labor tried and failed to do in Queensland last week. Smear.
The Labor folk at ANU don’t like seeing their own criticised so hey go on the attack, just like Anna Bligh did against Newman before admitting she had no proof. It’s disgusting, and it adds nothing to the actually issues, which is the classic question of youth vs experience.

And writing ANONYMOUS articles on RiotAct attempting to wound Ben Duggan’s council run is not a despicable attack? Mate, I’m using my real name.

I’m calling you out for the strange obsession you have with certain ANU students – which has been observed by most Rioters who have seen your threads.

c_c c_c 12:36 pm 29 Mar 12

Finally I want to make something very, very clear. My comments about Fleur Hawes on here came only after she began that remarkably stupid campaign against the ANU Library merger.

Initially, I tried to give her advice on how it should proceed. She wouldn’t listen. For her, it was all or nothing, she had no concept of negotiation with the Vice Chancellor or consultation with students. It was this way or no way. After repeated attempts behind closed doors, still my advice fell on deaf ears.

It was only after that that I chose to use a public forum to try and get the message through, that students needed to negotiate and make a more compelling case.

The Vice Chancellor even sent a letter out to the protestors saying the same things I was saying, that they needed to put a case to him and basically grow up.

Because she didn’t listen in person, and because she herself was fond of using the local media to get messages out, I decided to do the same. Initially about the library merger, and then other issues on campus such as the elections and housing.

There was never a personal interest, I want that very clear.
She was an immature, narrow minded person who didn’t listen and couldn’t look critically at something.
She’d ask for ideas but only accept those that fit her narrow vision. Surely her getting booted from the University after not listening to repeated academic warnings demonstrates that.
It’s harder to ignore comments on policy and electoral choices in a public arena, and that is my sole reason for commenting.

Now if you don’t mind, I want to get back to commenting on Zed Seslja latest crackpot announcement, before someone accuses me of having a thing for him. After all, a dozen or so comments, must mean something.

astrojax astrojax 12:21 pm 29 Mar 12

i rekkun there should be some youth voice in the political debate and don’t at all want to see obstacles in the way of any elegible folk standing to run; but any thought of mandating a youth quorum, some positive discrimination, would water down that input. so if this davis chap[?] is the right stuff, eloectors will elect. but i fancy most voters want something tangible for their vote and that would include some world and life experience.

that said, there also needs to be competition for the vote and a lack of this might see him get up! there is a dearth of talent in australian politics at the moment and perhaps a ‘youth team’ philosophy will give us some traction in coming terms…

c_c c_c 11:55 am 29 Mar 12

Obvious question: does repeated posts about Zed Seselja and The ACT Greens equal an infatuation with Zed and the Green’s MLAs?

Of course not. What we have here is what Labor tried and failed to do in Queensland last week. Smear.
The Labor folk at ANU don’t like seeing their own criticised so hey go on the attack, just like Anna Bligh did against Newman before admitting she had no proof. It’s disgusting, and it adds nothing to the actually issues, which is the classic question of youth vs experience.

devils_advocate devils_advocate 11:50 am 29 Mar 12

To come at this from a slightly different angle – is there any way this Davies character could possibly do a worse job that the current bunch – even if he tried?

I mean seriously, life experience, youth, qualifications, I think the first criteria should be a basic IQ test before we start worrying about aspirational qualities such as competence or experience or knowledge.

c_c c_c 11:46 am 29 Mar 12

Micky_P said :

The only reason the name Ben Duggan appears on this site is due to the OP C_C or otherwise known as Creative_Canberran

The only reason his name appears?

Check your facts: http://the-riotact.com/a-new-name-for-the-anu-bar/38887

Article written by Johnboy.

I have no interest in the individuals, only the issues and arguments they make.

p1 p1 11:02 am 29 Mar 12

c_c said :

Among the candidates, 20 year old University of Canberra student, real estate agent, drag queen and comic Johnathan Davis.

When I first read this, I thought it was listing *all* the Greens candidates, not the hobbies of one of them.

el said :

No, sorry – Due to my personal beliefs there’s no way I could possibly vote for a real estate agent. It’s just disgusting and immoral!

I feel the same way.

Jim Jones Jim Jones 10:56 am 29 Mar 12

Ben_Dover said :

You damn kids get off my lawn

Micky_P Micky_P 10:02 am 29 Mar 12

The only reason the name Ben Duggan appears on this site is due to the OP C_C or otherwise known as Creative_Canberran (and I do know his real name) has a fixation on him and his love interest Fleur Hawes (also of similar ANU political fame – but for other reasons)

It is public knowledge at ANU that the OP has updated websites like Uncyclopedia to reflect his ongoing infatuation with Ben Duggan, reflected in the Canberra article of the aforementioned website. The article formerly read ‘the Union Char slinkering away from Unilodge at 3am’ and after Ben’s resignation has been changed to political broker.
Some have formulated that this ongoing interest in Ben Duggan is due to jealousy of his love life and his success in student politics, C_C as most of you will know is a keen commenter on student politics (even bragging about articles on unknown websites) but has never actually run himself, denigrating the activity from his ivory tower. Whilst some view sniping from the unpopular edges as a commendable activity, others view it as a petty act and one that has garnered attention around ANU for the wrong reasons.

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