30 October 2013

NBN terminated

| johnboy
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Kate Lundy is drawing attention to the Liberals yanking the rug out from under the feet of those already signed up for NBN connection:

The Abbott Government has terminated the National Broadband Network’s fibre rollout in multiple Canberra suburbs, leaving local residents and businesses having to rely on last century’s copper for their broadband.

The rollouts in Belconnen, Bruce, Cook, Macquarie, Aranda, Dickson, O’Connor, Turner, Braddon, Reid, Campbell, Acton and the City have all been terminated.

This means over 19,000 Canberra premises which were expecting to receive fibre in a matter of months will now be denied the service.

Residents and businesses in the affected areas will be left with one of two choices: battle on using outdated copper, or fork out up to $5,000 to have fibre connected to their home or business.

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steveu said :

Darkfalz said :

This nonsense about Murdoch wanting to stop the NBN to protect Foxtel is the biggest load of horseshit I’ve ever heard. Foxtel recently have introduced internet based Foxtel Play on PC, SmartTVs, XBox and so on – and they’d be able to provide a HD version if everyone had a 100mbit connection. I never wanted Foxtel mainly because I didn’t want to have to have the receiver unit, special cable and a subscription – but you can PAYG with an internet based Pay-TV. I’m looking forward to a VDSL2 connection and I suspect I’ll have it a lot sooner than I’d have had anything with Labor’s NBN.

No I disagree. IPTV is the biggest threat to foxtel.

Fox is run by murdoch, and it is a major american film and television producer/distributor. You do the math as to where the NBN fits in there.

https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/murdoch-block/moepiacmhnmbiilhpojodnaopndhddpg?hl=en

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/murdoch-block/#id=330064

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/MurdochAlert-details/?src=ss

Darkfalz said :

This nonsense about Murdoch wanting to stop the NBN to protect Foxtel is the biggest load of horseshit I’ve ever heard. Foxtel recently have introduced internet based Foxtel Play on PC, SmartTVs, XBox and so on – and they’d be able to provide a HD version if everyone had a 100mbit connection. I never wanted Foxtel mainly because I didn’t want to have to have the receiver unit, special cable and a subscription – but you can PAYG with an internet based Pay-TV. I’m looking forward to a VDSL2 connection and I suspect I’ll have it a lot sooner than I’d have had anything with Labor’s NBN.

No I disagree. IPTV is the biggest threat to foxtel. Fox is run by murdoch, and it is a major american film and television producer/distributor. You do the math as to where the NBN fits in there.

Robertson said :

In the UK when they reviewed disability benefits, 75% of people were removed entirely from benefits, and another 17% were found to be able to work in assisted employment, leaving just 7% of prior recipients found to be validly in receipt of benefits.

It is unlikely that a similar competently conducted review here in Australia would have any different result, thus saving us $30billion/year.

Once people have been on handouts long enough, they stop thinking rationally. They forget they’re meant to be receiving an allowance for something they apparently can’t do, or to help them find work, it simply becomes “my money” and they are violently protective of it.

This nonsense about Murdoch wanting to stop the NBN to protect Foxtel is the biggest load of horseshit I’ve ever heard. Foxtel recently have introduced internet based Foxtel Play on PC, SmartTVs, XBox and so on – and they’d be able to provide a HD version if everyone had a 100mbit connection. I never wanted Foxtel mainly because I didn’t want to have to have the receiver unit, special cable and a subscription – but you can PAYG with an internet based Pay-TV. I’m looking forward to a VDSL2 connection and I suspect I’ll have it a lot sooner than I’d have had anything with Labor’s NBN.

wildturkeycanoe said :

So who are we going to get to do these “case management” reviews, when the existing Centrelink staff are being cut in numbers and the wait time on the phone to talk to someone is anywhere from 1 to 2 hours??? Oh, let’s just employ more staff to do the job – at taxpayer expense!!
As for the volunteer work, fine idea, but who is going to pay for the related insurances to cover them in case of injury to themselves or to the public? There is a cost you hadn’t considered and quite a substantial one considering the price of public liability insurance. Would you make this a compulsory or voluntary exercise? I can’t see any cost benefit in having an over 65 go do volunteer work if they still get the same cheque at the end of the week, it just takes available work form someone younger that can do the job better and might gain valuable experience from it. I think there’s some fit, able bodied people over at the AMC who should be volunteering first, before we get hobbling home-bodies out onto the streets.
I find it curious that you mention assessing people every three months but shoot your own argument down in your last paragraph, unless of course you were considering home visits.
Now, back to the NBN…….Aaaaargh. I was merely months from cancelling my home phone line with rip off phone company, now I’m stuck having to pay $15/month for a service I don’t use but need, just to get broadband. I hate this government.

Perhaps you don’t realise that this case management already occurs, just in multiple government departments, not coordinating with each other. Centrelink hived off the job seeking aspect to private companies, like Kevin Rudd’s wife’s, with how much success?

Great idea to have convicted prisoners “volunteering” – you’d be happy to have them picking upo rubbish in your street? How many prison officers, and at what cost, would it take to watch them? There’s a reason why prisoners have walls or fences, it reduces the number of staff needed.

Organisations already have Public Liability Insurance, and it probably already covers volunteer activities.

I would prefer volunteering was voluntary, but I have heard stories of people unable to undertake volunteering or education (preferable; education and related volunteering even more preferred), because Centrelink considers them fit for work, and looks at changing them onto NewStart.

Straw man obstacles are easy to blow over… You seem to believe that Centrelink benefits should be “sit down money”. I thought that idea had been ditched decades ago.

As for my last paragraph – if a case manager doesn’t know that their client is immobile and can’t communicate, then they should go to the back of the dole queue themselves. And case management without occasional home visits is poor practice – you need to know the environment your client is living in.

IP

Robertson said :

AndrewW said :

Roundhead89 said :

Great to hear that Labor’s so-called “Nation Building” (costly nation-destroying) programs are being dismantled. This will be a small contribution to bringing down Labor’s humungous debt and budget deficit. While they are at it at it, the Libs should immediately abolish Gonski and the Disability Insurance Scheme. Every single thing Labor did should be abolished or reversed. They did no good, they did only harm and we will be paying for that terrible misadventure for many years to come.

Perhaps the next thing to be reviewed should be the disability pension. I can think of a few people rorting that particular scheme…

In the UK when they reviewed disability benefits, 75% of people were removed entirely from benefits, and another 17% were found to be able to work in assisted employment, leaving just 7% of prior recipients found to be validly in receipt of benefits.

It is unlikely that a similar competently conducted review here in Australia would have any different result, thus saving us $30billion/year.

get all the MEOC’s they seem to be good at pension fraud

JC said :

Mysteryman said :

1. The debt didn’t keep “Australia out of recession, kept people employed”. It assisted,

Oh so you agree it was money well spent then as it assisted in keeping the country out of recession?

Mysteryman said :

Our banks were also responsible for a large part of keeping us afloat as they hadn’t invested in bad debts like a lot of the ones in Europe and most of the ones in the US. The stimulus package helped, no doubt,

Crap Australian banks were exposed, ask the NAB about the UK banks and the money they lost in the US subprime market. Again you have agreed that stimulus money helped, so yet again how was it a waste?

Mysteryman said :

Unrelated and continued spending with no surpluses have made it larger.

Straight from the Liberal party play book this one. Yes the debit did get higher as there were no surpluses, though of course if Howard hadn’t wasted all his surpluses on buying votes there would have been money to ride the wave? You know save in good times, spend in bad.

Mysteryman said :

2. Hockey hasn’t doubled the debt, he has increased the maximum borrowing amount. Asking for a larger credit limit is not the same as doubling your debt.

True Hockey has just increased the limit not the debit. Though may I suggest if you were to go to a bank and ask for a loan they would want to know all you liabilities, and credit, even if unused is still a liability that they get very interested in. So for all purposes having the limit is as bad as having the debit. The cynic of course would say Hockey increased it to continue peddling the propoganda about how poorly Labor managed the budget. Never mind of course the rest of the world, and even the Libs when out of ear shot of the Australian public were quite happy to say how well things were going (with Labor in power).

So what’s this got to do with NBN again, I have forgotten?

Wow. You’re all over the shop, aren’t you?

Do you not understand what the word “assisting” means? In reality, the effect of the stimulus packages came a bit late to be of significant assistance in avoiding a recession. The biggest influence had already been felt from China. To answer your question, no, I don’t think all the stimulus money was well spent. I think some of it was – like the money spent on schools. I don’t personally believe the hand outs to individuals was a good idea and I don’t think it had the impact that the government claimed it did.

Actually, the “crap Australian banks” weren’t really exposed much at all. Losing some money on a venture, and leveraging everything against bad debt are not the same. I suggest you go and read about why the Australian banks fared so well through the GFC and look at the actual numbers. Even those that borrowed during the GFC borrowed amounts that are very small in comparison to their yearly profits at the time – certainly not the sign of a bank (or any business) on the brink of collapse. Strong federal government regulation helped prevent them from doing anything as stupid as the US banks.

“Straight from the Liberal party play book this one. Yes the debit did get higher as there were no surpluses, though of course if Howard hadn’t wasted all his surpluses on buying votes there would have been money to ride the wave? You know save in good times, spend in bad” – Go look at the budget papers from Howard’s last year – 07/08. A surplus of roughly $20 billion was what Rudd inherited from the Howard government. Hardly evidence that Howard “wasted all his surpluses”.

“So for all purposes having the limit is as bad as having the debit.” That’s a ridiculous statement. They are not even close to the same thing and it’s foolish to even suggest they are.

You don’t seem to know much about any of this.

Mysteryman said :

1. The debt didn’t keep “Australia out of recession, kept people employed”. It assisted,

Oh so you agree it was money well spent then as it assisted in keeping the country out of recession?

Mysteryman said :

Our banks were also responsible for a large part of keeping us afloat as they hadn’t invested in bad debts like a lot of the ones in Europe and most of the ones in the US. The stimulus package helped, no doubt,

Crap Australian banks were exposed, ask the NAB about the UK banks and the money they lost in the US subprime market. Again you have agreed that stimulus money helped, so yet again how was it a waste?

Mysteryman said :

Unrelated and continued spending with no surpluses have made it larger.

Mysteryman said :

Straight from the Liberal party play book this one. Yes the debit did get higher as there were no surpluses, though of course if Howard hadn’t wasted all his surpluses on buying votes there would have been money to ride the wave? You know save in good times, spend in bad.

Mysteryman said :

2. Hockey hasn’t doubled the debt, he has increased the maximum borrowing amount. Asking for a larger credit limit is not the same as doubling your debt.

True Hockey has just increased the limit not the debit. Though may I suggest if you were to go to a bank and ask for a loan they would want to know all you liabilities, and credit, even if unused is still a liability that they get very interested in. So for all purposes having the limit is as bad as having the debit. The cynic of course would say Hockey increased it to continue peddling the propoganda about how poorly Labor managed the budget. Never mind of course the rest of the world, and even the Libs when out of ear shot of the Australian public were quite happy to say how well things were going (with Labor in power).

So what’s this got to do with NBN again, I have forgotten?

JC said :

Roundhead89 said :

Great to hear that Labor’s so-called “Nation Building” (costly nation-destroying) programs are being dismantled. This will be a small contribution to bringing down Labor’s humungous debt and budget deficit. While they are at it at it, the Libs should immediately abolish Gonski and the Disability Insurance Scheme. Every single thing Labor did should be abolished or reversed. They did no good, they did only harm and we will be paying for that terrible misadventure for many years to come.

A humongous (your words not mine) debit that kept Australia out of recession, kept people employed, and a debit that Hockey has now more or less just doubled in one fell swoop, but will of course blame Labor for. As for harm and misadventure think the next 3 years (if Abbott lasts that long before the Libs knife him) will be interesting indeed for this very reason.

1. The debt didn’t keep “Australia out of recession, kept people employed”. It assisted, but the greater contribution to keeping things running in Australia came from China pumping up its stimulus program, which resulted in materials and minerals sectors in Australia going strong, as well as the follow on effects to other industries. China purchased record amounts of iron ore in early 2009 that gave a huge boost to our GDP. Our banks were also responsible for a large part of keeping us afloat as they hadn’t invested in bad debts like a lot of the ones in Europe and most of the ones in the US. The stimulus package helped, no doubt, but it wasn’t responsible for keeping us going. Also, the stimulus package isn’t the only reason we have the debt we have. Unrelated and continued spending with no surpluses have made it larger.

2. Hockey hasn’t doubled the debt, he has increased the maximum borrowing amount. Asking for a larger credit limit is not the same as doubling your debt.

Roundhead89 said :

AndrewW said :

Perhaps the next thing to be reviewed should be the disability pension. I can think of a few people rorting that particular scheme…

Oh Andy, you’re still obsessed with me. You should realise that stalkers are not regarded very highly amongst the RA community (and the public at large). I realise how frustrated you must be since I changed the security settings on my media ventures to lock you and your moronic nonsense out but displaying your deviancy on such a public forum as this is only making you look like a complete fool. By the way Andy I told mutual friends on Facebook about you and they have unfriended you and frozen you out as well.

Peculiar response! I don’t know who you think I am, but I can assure you that we don’t share mutual friends. Like many others on this site, I simply enjoy having a laugh at the nonsense you post under your many pseudonyms.

wildturkeycanoe7:03 am 01 Nov 13

IrishPete said :

Robertson said :

AndrewW said :

Roundhead89 said :

Great to hear that Labor’s so-called “Nation Building” (costly nation-destroying) programs are being dismantled. This will be a small contribution to bringing down Labor’s humungous debt and budget deficit. While they are at it at it, the Libs should immediately abolish Gonski and the Disability Insurance Scheme. Every single thing Labor did should be abolished or reversed. They did no good, they did only harm and we will be paying for that terrible misadventure for many years to come.

Perhaps the next thing to be reviewed should be the disability pension. I can think of a few people rorting that particular scheme…

In the UK when they reviewed disability benefits, 75% of people were removed entirely from benefits, and another 17% were found to be able to work in assisted employment, leaving just 7% of prior recipients found to be validly in receipt of benefits.

It is unlikely that a similar competently conducted review here in Australia would have any different result, thus saving us $30billion/year.

Even the Rabid Right Daily Mail http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2319355/Workshy-map-Britain-revealed-Thousands-incapacity-benefit-claimants-capable-working.html only claims 30%, so I am curious where you got your numbers from.

However, since work or study are generally quite therapeutic I think there would be value in Centrelink adopting a different approach. (Interestingly, I slightly mistyped Centrelink and the spellchecker only offered me Treblinka…). I think a “case management” approach to anyone on Centrelink benefits would be worthwhile – instead of just doling out money, maybe interview the person every so often (say every three months) to see what other assistance they might benefit from. For a marginal extra cost, there could be a massive cost saving. But it would need to be helpful not punitive. Even people on the Aged Pension might like to do some part-time or voluntary work.

Also a “whole of government” approach, so that Centrelink and the mental health, disability, housing and so on systems are all talking to each other.

There have been some awful stories from the UK, with people with profound disabilities having their benefits threatened because they have not attended re-assessment interviews. And by “profound” I mean people who are bedridden and unable to communicate.

IP

So who are we going to get to do these “case management” reviews, when the existing Centrelink staff are being cut in numbers and the wait time on the phone to talk to someone is anywhere from 1 to 2 hours??? Oh, let’s just employ more staff to do the job – at taxpayer expense!!
As for the volunteer work, fine idea, but who is going to pay for the related insurances to cover them in case of injury to themselves or to the public? There is a cost you hadn’t considered and quite a substantial one considering the price of public liability insurance. Would you make this a compulsory or voluntary exercise? I can’t see any cost benefit in having an over 65 go do volunteer work if they still get the same cheque at the end of the week, it just takes available work form someone younger that can do the job better and might gain valuable experience from it. I think there’s some fit, able bodied people over at the AMC who should be volunteering first, before we get hobbling home-bodies out onto the streets.
I find it curious that you mention assessing people every three months but shoot your own argument down in your last paragraph, unless of course you were considering home visits.
Now, back to the NBN…….Aaaaargh. I was merely months from cancelling my home phone line with rip off phone company, now I’m stuck having to pay $15/month for a service I don’t use but need, just to get broadband. I hate this government.

Roundhead89 said :

Great to hear that Labor’s so-called “Nation Building” (costly nation-destroying) programs are being dismantled. This will be a small contribution to bringing down Labor’s humungous debt and budget deficit. While they are at it at it, the Libs should immediately abolish Gonski and the Disability Insurance Scheme. Every single thing Labor did should be abolished or reversed. They did no good, they did only harm and we will be paying for that terrible misadventure for many years to come.

A humongous (your words not mine) debit that kept Australia out of recession, kept people employed, and a debit that Hockey has now more or less just doubled in one fell swoop, but will of course blame Labor for. As for harm and misadventure think the next 3 years (if Abbott lasts that long before the Libs knife him) will be interesting indeed for this very reason.

Robertson said :

AndrewW said :

Roundhead89 said :

Great to hear that Labor’s so-called “Nation Building” (costly nation-destroying) programs are being dismantled. This will be a small contribution to bringing down Labor’s humungous debt and budget deficit. While they are at it at it, the Libs should immediately abolish Gonski and the Disability Insurance Scheme. Every single thing Labor did should be abolished or reversed. They did no good, they did only harm and we will be paying for that terrible misadventure for many years to come.

Perhaps the next thing to be reviewed should be the disability pension. I can think of a few people rorting that particular scheme…

In the UK when they reviewed disability benefits, 75% of people were removed entirely from benefits, and another 17% were found to be able to work in assisted employment, leaving just 7% of prior recipients found to be validly in receipt of benefits.

It is unlikely that a similar competently conducted review here in Australia would have any different result, thus saving us $30billion/year.

Even the Rabid Right Daily Mail http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2319355/Workshy-map-Britain-revealed-Thousands-incapacity-benefit-claimants-capable-working.html only claims 30%, so I am curious where you got your numbers from.

However, since work or study are generally quite therapeutic I think there would be value in Centrelink adopting a different approach. (Interestingly, I slightly mistyped Centrelink and the spellchecker only offered me Treblinka…). I think a “case management” approach to anyone on Centrelink benefits would be worthwhile – instead of just doling out money, maybe interview the person every so often (say every three months) to see what other assistance they might benefit from. For a marginal extra cost, there could be a massive cost saving. But it would need to be helpful not punitive. Even people on the Aged Pension might like to do some part-time or voluntary work.

Also a “whole of government” approach, so that Centrelink and the mental health, disability, housing and so on systems are all talking to each other.

There have been some awful stories from the UK, with people with profound disabilities having their benefits threatened because they have not attended re-assessment interviews. And by “profound” I mean people who are bedridden and unable to communicate.

IP

Robertson – where are you getting your figures on the UK’s review? last thing I read about it was:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/government-delays-disability-welfare-payment-changes-8905920.html
It is far from finished (as at Saturday) and has been severely delayed.

Roundhead89 said :

Great to hear that Labor’s so-called “Nation Building” (costly nation-destroying) programs are being dismantled. This will be a small contribution to bringing down Labor’s humungous debt and budget deficit. While they are at it at it, the Libs should immediately abolish Gonski and the Disability Insurance Scheme. Every single thing Labor did should be abolished or reversed. They did no good, they did only harm and we will be paying for that terrible misadventure for many years to come.

That is right as long as we waste money the way the coalition wants to waste money its all ok!! Meanwhile an infrastructure project that would have benefited the nation is called wasteful and all the voters who can’t use their brain to sort policy BS from reality, just rabbit the same political lines over and over again.

The NBN was the only really good idea that Labor had. Shame the coaltion decided it would attack everything, because I think this was one policy that should have had bi-partisan support, but it fit too nicely in the theme of wasteful spending, so now everything labor spent money on was wasteful.

Luckily Tony “the infrastructure prime minister” Abbott, will not wastefully spend money on infrastructure the whole country could have used and instead spend money wisely in electorates that need some extra cash and who seem unsure whether to vote for labor or liberal in 3 years time. That is definitely a sensible use of money if I was a coalition supporter.

AndrewW said :

Roundhead89 said :

Great to hear that Labor’s so-called “Nation Building” (costly nation-destroying) programs are being dismantled. This will be a small contribution to bringing down Labor’s humungous debt and budget deficit. While they are at it at it, the Libs should immediately abolish Gonski and the Disability Insurance Scheme. Every single thing Labor did should be abolished or reversed. They did no good, they did only harm and we will be paying for that terrible misadventure for many years to come.

Perhaps the next thing to be reviewed should be the disability pension. I can think of a few people rorting that particular scheme…

In the UK when they reviewed disability benefits, 75% of people were removed entirely from benefits, and another 17% were found to be able to work in assisted employment, leaving just 7% of prior recipients found to be validly in receipt of benefits.

It is unlikely that a similar competently conducted review here in Australia would have any different result, thus saving us $30billion/year.

AndrewW said :

Roundhead89 said :

Great to hear that Labor’s so-called “Nation Building” (costly nation-destroying) programs are being dismantled. This will be a small contribution to bringing down Labor’s humungous debt and budget deficit. While they are at it at it, the Libs should immediately abolish Gonski and the Disability Insurance Scheme. Every single thing Labor did should be abolished or reversed. They did no good, they did only harm and we will be paying for that terrible misadventure for many years to come.

Perhaps the next thing to be reviewed should be the disability pension. I can think of a few people rorting that particular scheme…

Oh Andy, you’re still obsessed with me. You should realise that stalkers are not regarded very highly amongst the RA community (and the public at large). I realise how frustrated you must be since I changed the security settings on my media ventures to lock you and your moronic nonsense out but displaying your deviancy on such a public forum as this is only making you look like a complete fool. By the way Andy I told mutual friends on Facebook about you and they have unfriended you and frozen you out as well.

Roundhead89 said :

Great to hear that Labor’s so-called “Nation Building” (costly nation-destroying) programs are being dismantled. This will be a small contribution to bringing down Labor’s humungous debt and budget deficit. While they are at it at it, the Libs should immediately abolish Gonski and the Disability Insurance Scheme. Every single thing Labor did should be abolished or reversed. They did no good, they did only harm and we will be paying for that terrible misadventure for many years to come.

Perhaps the next thing to be reviewed should be the disability pension. I can think of a few people rorting that particular scheme…

JC said :

puggy said :

Honest query, but can you link to info on Foxtel via ADSL?

Also, decent HD pay TV would take up much of that 25Mbps, not leaving much left over for anyone in the house just surfing the net, so yeah, 100Mbps is a threat.

Contrary to what people above are saying the existing ADSL network cannot stream Foxtel realtime and the nobbled fraudband would have difficulty too.

That said though what Foxtel offer over is on-demand movies and shows over ADSL. I have also noticed (but may have been there for a while), that you can now view the program guide for the previous 24 hours or so and select shows that have already been screened. Once selected and if available as not all programs can be done they will download to the Foxtel box for viewing later. So not realtime.

This isn’t correct. Foxtel have for some time offered Foxtel Play, which is a Foxtel service delivered via an Internet connection. No Foxtel box required. AFAIK, the only limitation is that it only streams SD content, there’s no HD yet.

I was interested in it briefly, until I realised it uses the same BS package system as the normal service, and isn’t really any cheaper.

goggles13 said :

as for VDSL, does anyone know if or when Transact will continue to rollout VDSL2?

It is happening, and will happen. Otherwise they have to shut down their VDSL network. No spares available for their old VDSL (10 year old) equipment. It is my understanding that TransACT have clear plans to upgrade all VDSL1 to VDSL2 for this reason alone. Existing network has become un-maintainable.

I believe the maps that were up there were unrealistic and not reflective of what was happening, and I guess it could also be the libs planting their stamp on NBNCo to remind them that they are in charge.

It is reasonable to assume the people will get at least FTTN in Canberra.

There has not been an announcement that they have cancelled the NBN. I think the response from yesterday’s change on the website shows how important it is to people. Its really important I think. But not enough to keep the previous govt in obviously.

Telstra has started to sue the govt already btw.
http://www.afr.com/p/business/companies/telstra_takes_legal_action_against_dvd4Pj6SzE4ehXsDLEvOQP

Heard Kate Lundy on ABC this morning talking about this. The Libs all hid under their desks, refusing to be interviewed (ior perhaps they are all at a wedding in Broome or Bali).

There are two possibilities:

a) the Government is finally being honest about the rollout of the NBN, and has deleted from the maps all those places shown as “under construction” when they aren’t, they had just started poking around, measuing things and designing the installation; This was a standard Labot fib to make the naive believe that the rollout had gone further than it had.

b) the Government is using a) to conceal the fact that they are actually slowing or stopping, or re-prioritising the rollout, under the pretence of more transparency/honesty.

But if it’s really only a) I wonder why they’ve all gone to the same wedding instead of fronting the media?

IP

Growling Ferret12:29 pm 31 Oct 13

Just a quick install story from a very happy NBN customer.

Our street was cabled in April by a contractor who was looking forward to Easter so he could have a couple of days off after 28 days straight.

We were told we were live in August, so a call went though to the ISP ASAP. Installation was scheduled for about 8 weeks after the phone call due to high demand.

Around 2 weeks ago, external works were completed and the fibre terminated in a small external box.

Two local lads performed the install Tuesday. Took approx one hour, and was there 7th installation of the day. The ISP had everything connected by mid morning yesterday.

Previous speed on ADSL2 peaked at 6mbps download, and less than 1 up. NBN was 24.5 and 4.9 back up last night.

We were lucky as our street was on the Palmerston rollout.

NBN is the railways of the 21st century. The Liberals solution is half baked, and will end up costing us all 3 times as much when everyone realised its a far more expensive balls up than GDE Mk1, and the half assed solution is rectified once everyone realises it should have been done right first time.

cool story bro, how’s your new office on the hill or maybe within Dr No’s (Peta Credlins’ office?

Roundhead89 said :

Great to hear that Labor’s so-called “Nation Building” (costly nation-destroying) programs are being dismantled. This will be a small contribution to bringing down Labor’s humungous debt and budget deficit. While they are at it at it, the Libs should immediately abolish Gonski and the Disability Insurance Scheme. Every single thing Labor did should be abolished or reversed. They did no good, they did only harm and we will be paying for that terrible misadventure for many years to come.

steveu said :

If people are provided with a means of paying for their own FTTP at a price that is less than current rates (which I suspect is around $10K) then perhaps there is less of a conspiracy.

However if a decent retail option to provision FTTP is not provided to the public, then yep, for sure the murdoch and fairfax mob have won.

Regardless of the cost, putting FTTP within the reach of everyone had too many benefits to imagine in the long term.

I will tip my hat to Kate Lundy on this occasion – she did do good work lobbying against pair gain, and getting rid of RIM city up north.

cheap options for FTTP is a good idea, but at the moment, it looks like most suburbs won’t even get FTTN. so FTTP can’t happen.

as for VDSL, does anyone know if or when Transact will continue to rollout VDSL2?

Great to hear that Labor’s so-called “Nation Building” (costly nation-destroying) programs are being dismantled. This will be a small contribution to bringing down Labor’s humungous debt and budget deficit. While they are at it at it, the Libs should immediately abolish Gonski and the Disability Insurance Scheme. Every single thing Labor did should be abolished or reversed. They did no good, they did only harm and we will be paying for that terrible misadventure for many years to come.

If people are provided with a means of paying for their own FTTP at a price that is less than current rates (which I suspect is around $10K) then perhaps there is less of a conspiracy.

However if a decent retail option to provision FTTP is not provided to the public, then yep, for sure the murdoch and fairfax mob have won.

Regardless of the cost, putting FTTP within the reach of everyone had too many benefits to imagine in the long term.

I will tip my hat to Kate Lundy on this occasion – she did do good work lobbying against pair gain, and getting rid of RIM city up north.

c_c™ said :

nhand42 said :

Nobody’s getting 25 VDSL.

The average speed for VDSL2 in Canberra is 38.4 (Max 62) and 29.2 avg (Max 54) in Perth according to real world testing by TransACT. The same test found the fibre broadband in real world conditions was of course much faster for both average and maximum speed, the average being more than double.
.

The VDSL2 propaganda is technically incoherent – it is not achievable over the existing copper except for the tiny proportion of premises that are right up close to their exchange or in new developments on brand new infrastructure and still quite close to their exchange. Making general availability of VDSL2 will require the construction of a vast number of new exchanges and the laying out of vast amounts of new copper. It will cost more than the NBN, result in higher on-going costs of maintenance, and deliver a fraction of the performance and benefits.

The VDSL2 nonsense is a bit like somebody during the 1920s proposing a new breed of super-fast horse as a transport alternative to the combustion engine. Retarded.

I download movies on Foxtel regularly and using NBN but wireless it take probably about 10 seconds or so to get it playing. Haven’t run an ethernet cable to the box yet to see the time difference but I assume it would probably be 1/3 of that time.

Whether it is a conspiracy theory or not, it was competition to TV in general. The VDSL connection has prohibitive upload speeds and so little is known about many details that would enable broadcasting of TV. That said Youtube and other online video services are slowly having quality content on them. I watch a couple of series on youtube.

So whether Murdoch was behind the libs postion or not is irrelevant because FTTP was a threat to Murdoch and Foxtel. It was going to be very easy for anyone to broadcast anything if they wanted to on the FTTP NBN.

Just like the music companies whinging about copyright, so many companies in the world got used to their old world model which ripped off consumers and its easier to fight change than it is to adapt to a new model that provides less profits.

puggy said :

Honest query, but can you link to info on Foxtel via ADSL?

Also, decent HD pay TV would take up much of that 25Mbps, not leaving much left over for anyone in the house just surfing the net, so yeah, 100Mbps is a threat.

Contrary to what people above are saying the existing ADSL network cannot stream Foxtel realtime and the nobbled fraudband would have difficulty too.

That said though what Foxtel offer over is on-demand movies and shows over ADSL. I have also noticed (but may have been there for a while), that you can now view the program guide for the previous 24 hours or so and select shows that have already been screened. Once selected and if available as not all programs can be done they will download to the Foxtel box for viewing later. So not realtime.

As for this story, let me say there is no secret here that I am a Labor supporter and think the coalitions plan is bullshit, but I reckon the Labor party and the media are reading a bit much into the NBN’s change of map. From what I understand they have basically removed the forecast installs from the map to remove any ambuguity, but are still building what they have already issued contracts for which includes places like Belconnen and the City.

Indeed just yesterday I saw a truck in Dunlop installing conduit near Gininderra Drive that I suspect is for the back-haul fibre to the Scullin exchange. Though I do concede even with Fraudband back-haul is needed, so doesn’t mean FTTN, but nor does the fact the maps have been updated too considering the uncertainty.

nhand42 said :

Nobody’s getting 25 VDSL.

The average speed for VDSL2 in Canberra is 38.4 (Max 62) and 29.2 avg (Max 54) in Perth according to real world testing by TransACT. The same test found the fibre broadband in real world conditions was of course much faster for both average and maximum speed, the average being more than double.

Now I prefer the fibre NBN option, but I don’t think there’s any question for a majority of users they’ll be able to push it to 20 if they roll it out right. The question mark has always been Turnbull’s claims about updates to the VDSL standard that promise 50 and 100.

puggy said :

Also, decent HD pay TV would take up much of that 25Mbps, not leaving much left over for anyone in the house just surfing the net, so yeah, 100Mbps is a threat.

For a start it still doesn’t explain the threat. Telco part owns Foxtel, Foxtel and Telco both sell streaming and downloadable content. Both rely on expensive and ageing infrastructure. So it’s in their interest to have an NBN and the faster the better, particularly if someone else is paying.

As for ‘decent HDTV’, even the old fashioned MPEG2 based DTV HD channels max out at 15 for true HDTV, with another .5 for the AC3 stream, I’m looking at the stream info now for One-HD which is 1440×1080, VBR, it’s hovering around 9.5Mbps

H.264, the format used for Blu-Ray and most common for streaming online, requires less than half the bandwidth, and the next-gen format get’s it down even more.

puggy said :

Honest query, but can you link to info on Foxtel via ADSL?

You will need a Telstra T-Box or Xbox to get Foxtel over ADSL, it’s cheaper than OTA, but some shows will be blacked out as they do not have streaming rights. It’s cheaper than even the base package though to get an unblock-us account, as well as Hulu+ and Netflix subscriptions.

Deref said :

Robertson said :

Whining about cost benefit analyses is a complete waste of time.
The NBN was proving a great success.
Abbott is now repaying Murdoch by sabotaging this excellent project that was very efficiently delivering much-needed infrastructure.

+1

This is just Tony’s payback to Rupert Morloch for the election win.

It seems to me Rupert would make more money with NBN .

All the NBN bosses resigned a few weeks ago there’s no one there to run it, so that would be why things have stopped.

The NBN will have to restructure so all dates will probably change .

Inner North Canberra reduced from full rollout map of “under construction” to three blocks in Braddon around the Telstra exchange.

Perhaps it’s just bad luck…or maybe even 50 years later…”Australia is a lucky country, run by second-rate people who share its luck.”

Rawhide Kid Part3 said :

Its going cost them a real bundle to get out of all those signed up contracts with the contractors.

As long as they can screw over some Labor-voting electorates, I guess they’ll consider it money well spent.

c_c™ said :

The supposed dent made to Foxtel’s business will exist whether you get a 25 VDSL connection of a 100 Fibre connection. The fact that Foxtel is rolling out services on ADSL already suggests not only are they not threatened by fixed internet, but they embracing it…

Honest query, but can you link to info on Foxtel via ADSL?

Also, decent HD pay TV would take up much of that 25Mbps, not leaving much left over for anyone in the house just surfing the net, so yeah, 100Mbps is a threat.

c_c™ said :

The supposed dent made to Foxtel’s business will exist whether you get a 25 VDSL connection of a 100 Fibre connection.

Nobody’s getting 25 VDSL.

justin heywood7:01 pm 30 Oct 13

c_c™ said :

The Murdoch argument makes no sense and people should give it a rest.
The supposed dent made to Foxtel’s business will exist whether you get a 25 VDSL connection of a 100 Fibre connection. The fact that Foxtel is rolling out services on ADSL already suggests not only are they not threatened by fixed internet, but they embracing it, and would likely love it if the government foot the bill for massive distribution infrastructure, letting them ditch the satellite infrastructure and compete with the tide of on-demand services that will supplant broadcast businesses.

All true, but simple minds see conspiracy everywhere. Their enemies are superr-evil and super-smart.

Robertson said :

Whining about cost benefit analyses is a complete waste of time.
The NBN was proving a great success.
Abbott is now repaying Murdoch by sabotaging this excellent project that was very efficiently delivering much-needed infrastructure.

This is a real shame. One of the largest opportunities for social and economic benefit, gone. Cheers..

Rawhide Kid Part36:37 pm 30 Oct 13

Its going cost them a real bundle to get out of all those signed up contracts with the contractors.

Robertson said :

Whining about cost benefit analyses is a complete waste of time.
The NBN was proving a great success.
Abbott is now repaying Murdoch by sabotaging this excellent project that was very efficiently delivering much-needed infrastructure.

The Murdoch argument makes no sense and people should give it a rest.
The supposed dent made to Foxtel’s business will exist whether you get a 25 VDSL connection of a 100 Fibre connection. The fact that Foxtel is rolling out services on ADSL already suggests not only are they not threatened by fixed internet, but they embracing it, and would likely love it if the government foot the bill for massive distribution infrastructure, letting them ditch the satellite infrastructure and compete with the tide of on-demand services that will supplant broadcast businesses.

Robertson said :

Whining about cost benefit analyses is a complete waste of time.
The NBN was proving a great success.
Abbott is now repaying Murdoch by sabotaging this excellent project that was very efficiently delivering much-needed infrastructure.

+1

This is just Tony’s payback to Rupert Morloch for the election win.

mossrocket said :

I guess Kate has lots of time on her hands now…

Shame she didn’t use her position as techno chick MP and press for a proper cost benefit analysis after Conroy brain-farted his way through drawing the NBN on some napkins in the Rudd Force One 747…

If Labor had done that – instead of promising the world and delivering SFA (cue Gungahlin Al) we might not be in this position…

but I guess it’s easier to say the plug is being pulled – even though the cord didn’t exist..

Well this has to have been the cleverest post I’ve ever seen. Somehow the liberals cancelling a project which was the brainchild of Labor is Labors fault…

Could you please explain exactly how your logic came to this conclusion?

In my mind, the fact that the libs basically went to an election with the plan to gut the NBN is the reason why they are now gutting the NBN, despite the fact it is super short sighted.

The only reason why they are not shutting the NBN down altogether is that shutting down the NBN would be a politically bad move. Nothing preventing them from killing it off slowly by making the project fail however…

Whining about cost benefit analyses is a complete waste of time.
The NBN was proving a great success.
Abbott is now repaying Murdoch by sabotaging this excellent project that was very efficiently delivering much-needed infrastructure.

I guess Kate has lots of time on her hands now…

Shame she didn’t use her position as techno chick MP and press for a proper cost benefit analysis after Conroy brain-farted his way through drawing the NBN on some napkins in the Rudd Force One 747…

If Labor had done that – instead of promising the world and delivering SFA (cue Gungahlin Al) we might not be in this position…

but I guess it’s easier to say the plug is being pulled – even though the cord didn’t exist..

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