NSW introducing fines for drivers flashing lights to warn speeding motorists.

I get a warm feeling passing a speed camera and not flashing to oncoming speeding traffic

Putting aside all the rational arguments for not doing it, I get a warm feeling of mateship every time I get warned. Or when I warn someone and get a wave back. Sort of an ‘us against them’ feeling.

I had a guy flash me the other day…… Kinda wish he had of used headlights though … ;-p

Interestingly, I know a driver who got caught flashing his headlights to warn oncoming traffic of cops doing Laser. When asked why he did it by the cop, he completely denied flashing the headlights. The cop then said: “Oh, looks like you have a problem with your headlights then” and defected his car.

I love these little urban myths/lies/bullsh!t … if the head lights work as they’re supposed to then a defect notice couldn’t be issued. If the driver wants to dispute the cops alledged version of events it’s up to the cop to put up or shut up, end of story.

I always thought the the aim of speed cameras is to slow drivers down. If by someone flashing thier lights to the opposing traffic slows people down, then surely the aim has been achieved?
We need to make drivers slow down to the speed limit all the time, rather than just when a speed camera is nearby. Fines are better for a longer term result than a flash of the headlights (which results in a one off temporary reduction in speed).

A flash of the headlights means slow down, there’s something ahead. It might be cops, it might be some kind of contremps, a breakdown in a bad spot, stopped traffic on a high-speed section, or even an RBT. The oncoming cars don’t know what the problem up ahead is, all they know is there’s something to be careful about, and to proceed with caution.

Spitfire3 said :

And I’m sure we can agree that many of us stupid humans need blunt reminders in order to do what’s right.

What’s right is such an interesting concept.

Ozi said :

A fine and demerit points WILL, however, change behaviour, either through voluntary speed reduction by the driver over the long term following the fine, or through mandatory loss of licence following multiple fines and the associated demerit points.

Not necessarily.

Spitfire: that is a good point, and I know that avoiding a speed camera/cop due to head light flashing gives you a “oh phew, lucky escape!” feeling, but in reality does not overly change behaviour.

A fine and demerit points WILL, however, change behaviour, either through voluntary speed reduction by the driver over the long term following the fine, or through mandatory loss of licence following multiple fines and the associated demerit points.

And people who flash headlights for RBT’s deserve to be shot.

Interestingly, I know a driver who got caught flashing his headlights to warn oncoming traffic of cops doing Laser. When asked why he did it by the cop, he completely denied flashing the headlights. The cop then said: “Oh, looks like you have a problem with your headlights then” and defected his car.

Made me laugh…

~Ozi.

steveu said :

I always thought the the aim of speed cameras is to slow drivers down. If by someone flashing thier lights to the opposing traffic slows people down, then surely the aim has been achieved?

I think it could be argued that another aim of using speed cameras is to deter drivers from speeding for a much larger proportion of their time behind the wheel. A headlight flash warning isn’t as blunt a reminder as a hefty fine. And I’m sure we can agree that many of us stupid humans need blunt reminders in order to do what’s right.

I never flash for RBTs, but almost always flash for speed traps.

Sammy said :

I think the headline you’ve used is spurious. I thought the police officer on the news item was quite clear that they were really concerned about people flashing to warn of upcoming RBT stations, rather than speed cameras. He did mention that both were illegal, but the RBT issue was the one that they were really concerned about.

Thanks for your comment. I take your point. However, I hope that you saw I did explain the context in the original post about the RBT situation and specifically intended that my focus was on the speeding part of the equation.

As the police also intend to capture motorists where only a speed camera or radar is in use, I disagree with your assessment of the headline as spurious.

There are already coppers everywhere. Wish I had my camera on NYE

… well that’s odd. I spent a goodly portion of my NYE on the roads, we drove from Richardson to Pearce, Pearce to Kambah, then back to Richardson, then to Ainslie, and back to Richardson again (all this between 8pm and 1am) and didn’t see a single police car, RBT, or speed van.

steveu said :

I always thought the the aim of speed cameras is to slow drivers down. If by someone flashing thier lights to the opposing traffic slows people down, then surely the aim has been achieved?
RBT’s on the other hand, are a completely different matter I would suggest.

Exactly!

If police are really out to reduce speeding (rather than just catch people), then I reckon they should accept “flashing”. The problem is cops using the RBT scenario (which I’d like to think doesn’t occur too often)as an excuse to target flashers, who cut down on their speeding fine revenue.

Given Spideydog’s quote above, it would seem that flashing to warn other drivers of a road hazard is quite kosher. I’ve seen it used for roos on the road, fatal prangs up ahead etc.
I still do it when I driving down the Kings Highway and there’s lots of traffic oncoming, if cops aren’t around.

I always thought the the aim of speed cameras is to slow drivers down. If by someone flashing thier lights to the opposing traffic slows people down, then surely the aim has been achieved?
RBT’s on the other hand, are a completely different matter I would suggest.
Cheers
Steve

I think you will find this is already covered in rule 218 & 219 of the Australian Road Rules:

218 Using headlights on high-beam
(1) The driver of a vehicle must not use the vehicle’s headlights on
high-beam, or allow the vehicle’s headlights to be used on
high-beam, if the driver is driving:
(a) less than 200 metres behind a vehicle travelling in the
same direction as the driver; or
(b) less than 200 metres from an oncoming vehicle.

219 Lights not to be used to dazzle other road users
A driver must not use, or allow to be used, any light fitted to or
in the driver’s vehicle to dazzle, or in a way that is likely to
dazzle, another road user.

Sammy said :

I think the headline you’ve used is spurious. I thought the police officer on the news item was quite clear that they were really concerned about people flashing to warn of upcoming RBT stations, rather than speed cameras. He did mention that both were illegal, but the RBT issue was the one that they were really concerned about.

Never in the Australian Road Rules have I seen any references to it being illegal to flash your lights to warn oncoming traffic of either RBT or Speed trap….

I would never do it for an RBT – they’re better off the road then driving. But sometimes your driving and you get distracted about the speed your doing so you could be doing 5-10 over, and a little warning to check your speedo is a very nice gesture to me.

Dear Woody Mann-Caruso

“Another numpty who thinks having expensive police officers driving around all day in expensive cars so they can engage in dangerous chases is a sound solution to speeding.”

Hmmm, I don’t think you’ll find that I suggested high speed chases as an answer…

“Do you really think if you were busted by a cop rather than a camera you’d be less of a whiner? I doubt it”

Hmmm, I don’t think you will find that I was complaining about the existence of either speed cameras mobile or fixed. Nor did I suggest that I was concerned about getting fined because I don’t speed. I’m not the issue here…

“Go away and get some stats to support your wild claims that “the revenue base has dropped” and that there has been a “marked reduction” in the number of police on the road”

I see you were only too happy to rely on your anecdotal experience to refute my claims and the absence of stats acted as no impediment. Why should you be so superior? I invited your views on this topic and I welcome them – however I do not agree with your method and hypocrisy only serves to undermine your argument.

As for my conspiracy theory – your words not mine – and arguing like an adult – my post doesn’t include the words numpty… whiner… and sissy and you ask me to be adult! If these words are the vocabulary of the educated adulthood to which you claim to belong I think I will stick to the education I have and continue to support my views based on logic not emotion. You would be well served to do the same.

I can assure you that I could have written more to explore and expound my views as to why this is problematic both from a legal and ethical sense. To have done so would have resulted in an essay or perhaps a thesis, but then this site would not be the forum. I chose this forum because I am interested in the diversity of views on the issue with one caveat – leave your belief in your own moral superiority at the doorstep and focus on this issue, for to do otherwise only serves you to make you look foolish.

Yes. Interesting dichotomy

I don’t think that word means what you think it means.

The possibility that a speed camera lies around the next corner or over the rise or behind that tree is a deterrent. If you’re too slow to catch on, or too much of a d.ckhead to care, then speed cameras are there to catch and punish you. It’s no different to having marked police cars driving around – except for the enormous cost. The revenue is a deterrent, punishment and icing on the cake for law-abiding citizens like me who reap the reward of better services.

(Thumper)”Or the number of people driving on unfamiliar roads is also much greater.”

Too right Thumper. Not only unfamiliar roads though, most of us aren’t used to spending the day behind the wheel. After 6-8 hours, even if you don’t feel tired, you reaction time HAS to be a lot slower.

.

A few years ago near Tamworth I rounded a bend at 140 to see a police car coming back the other way.

I thought “crap I’m screwed now” but he just flashed his lights at me.

I was thinking that was very decent of him and slowed down.

I realised just how decent he was being when I came around the next corner to see a speed camera.

Agree with most here. I flash regularly, but only for those nasty white vans which enjoy booking people in a 60 zones. I would never flash for a RBT.

I’m a bit selective. I warn other drivers of the ACT’s mobile fund raising vans, but I’m always happy to let the cops catch a few, especially those on RBT, who are simply doing their job -no doubt trying to prevent the carnage they often have to clean up as part of their job.

although I do note that the holiday period is the greatest danger period on our roads

Is it, or is it that it is the time of the year that the media takes note of the numbers.

I flash oncoming drivers all the time.
Except when there’s a cop hidden in their path.

I always thought that flashing your high beams to warn oncoming traffic about a speedtrap was already illegal, and covered by the more general fine for using high beams with on-coming traffic

I’d still do it regardless

Most times I flash my lights if there is a speed camera/radar ahead.

Isn’t the point of these devices to stop ppl speeding, not to catch them. At least thats what the government will tell you as they quickly pocket the millions of dollars worth of speed camera revenue.

I am glad for any woman to flash her high beams anytime.

I’ve seen just as much flashing around RBTs as speed traps. I always have a glance around for cops before doing my civic duty and warning the next lot of cars. I also use this to warn of a surprising road hazard ahead, like cars stopped for a crash, or a big dead roo still on the road or whatever, they’ll slow down and thus deal withi the hazard better.

Ha.
I some times flash my lights when i see sombody obviously speeding towards me, slows them down quick smart, But i wouldn’t do it if there actually was a speed camera or RBT.

If your driving like a dick head you deserve to be caught.

Another numpty who thinks having expensive police officers driving around all day in expensive cars so they can engage in dangerous chases is a sound solution to speeding.

There are already coppers everywhere. Wish I had my camera on NYE to take a pic of the double whammy outside Albert Hall – marked vehicle pulled over a motorcycle on one side of the road and an unmarked white 4WD pulled over some purple ricer monstrosity on the other. I see them pulling over somebody most days on my way to and from work. Sometimes they even nab people running the bus lane at the Yamba Dr roundabout.

Do you really think if you were busted by a cop rather than a camera you’d be less of a whiner? I doubt it. Go away and get some stats to support your wild claims that “the revenue base has dropped” and that there has been a “marked reduction” in the number of police on the road- then you can come back and argue like an adult and not some sissy conspiracy theorist.

I have always flashed to warn others of speed cameras, and have been appreciative of others doing it to me.

I’m no hoon, I drive sedately, but, like most drivers I believe, a little over the given limit. (I find Aus’s limits VERY slow.)

I would not condone flashing for RBT though, as I find drink driving evil.

I for one have no problem with the Police fining people for flashing their headlights as a warning to others. I don’t, and never will, do it. This practice only helps people that should be caught to avoid getting their just desserts.

I think the headline you’ve used is spurious. I thought the police officer on the news item was quite clear that they were really concerned about people flashing to warn of upcoming RBT stations, rather than speed cameras. He did mention that both were illegal, but the RBT issue was the one that they were really concerned about.