Should Police "Working on the roads" be different to "Roadworkers"??

Most of the time when Police stop a car they have a marked Police vehicle with big flashy lights blocking the road and making a safe zone for them. If they are hanging around on the road for an dextended time they wear high vis like any other person working on the roads.

They have guidelines governing when they should be wearing high vis. If you feel they have breached those guidelines then make a complaint.

Will a complaint or whinge get you off your ticket – no.

The workcover guy story – I call Bullsh*t. Urban legends/myths are a good story.

krats said :

On Your Planet You Certainly Have Grounds For Appeal…But Here On Earth You Do Not!

your correct, he would only have had grounds for appeal if he ran him down.

On Your Planet You Certainly Have Grounds For Appeal…But Here On Earth You Do Not!

You were speeding – you got fined – suck it up. End of that whinge.

As for Police and high-vis, in NSW they are required to wear high-vis when standing on/near a roadway as it is considered a hazardous worksite.

I do, however, wonder how our parking inspectors can wander about parking lots and roadsides without any visability – surely the Government must provide a ‘safe working environment’ for them? And as the hazard can’t be removed, PPE in the form of high-vis vests should be provided.

In both cases (police & parking inspectors) this should be rectified on 1 January when all states and territories align under new Work Health & Saftey codes – which would mandate such things and the Govt would be exposed to prosecution (by themselves) for not complying.

daddy said :

Better than that, I saw one made out of pink Playboy stickers – Hyundai Excel. Nuff said

Was the driver orange?

Bails said :

luther_bendross said :

To answer OP’s title question: yes. Roadworkers are people trying to improve the driving environment by bettering the infrastructure we use. Police are people trying to improve the driving environment by removing dickheads like you.

I love the heroes that frequent RiotACT. A brief perusal of this thread would suggest that no one in Canberra has ever received a fine for anything. Moreover, no one has EVER even once accidentally breached the speed limit on ANY of Canberra’s roads.

I wish you heroes who love the ‘admit you were wrong and shut the hell up’ attitude would mind your own business. OP has a legitimate point to do with OH/S for the Police, and fairness for the citizenry.

Yes, the OP has a very valid point regarding the visibility of traffic police. Hats off to him for addressing the issue.

But as I’ve said previously, attempting to segue from that point to “Therefore I should get off my speeding fine because the purpose of Hi-vis gear is not officer safety, but alerting speeding drivers and I wasn’t alerted” is bogus beyond description.

Really. If I could think of words to describe how bogus that is, I’d use them.

And FWIW, I’ve had three speeding fines in 32 years of driving. In one case I was young and stupid and plainly at fault. In the other two there were plenty of what I thought would be extenuating circumstances. However, in all three cases I was speeding, that was the truth of it and I copped it sweet.

Bussie said :

Golden-Alpine said :

Your last sentence is immature and down right disrespectful. These officers risk their lives every day they go out for you and your family. Suck it up and pay the fine and accept you were in the wrong.

What a ridiculous exaggeration. When was the last cop killed in Canberra while on duty? Pretty sure Winchester was the last cop murdered here, over 20 years ago, there might have been one or two killed in car crashes since IIRC.

Not a ridiculous exaggeration. Doesn’t matter if a police officer was killed yesterday or 20 years ago the fact still remains there is a real and present risk to these officers every day. I certainly appreciate what they do for me and my family.

I once got a speeding fine for speeding funnily enough. I was in the wrong, I was speeding. I paid the fine. So should the OP.

Jethro said :

Henry82 said :

Instead you’ve got canberra drivers, who drive frangipani excels through give way/stop signs without looking.

Saw a car the other day with a southern cross made out of frangipanis.

Pure awesome.

Better than that, I saw one made out of pink Playboy stickers – Hyundai Excel. Nuff said

Bails said :

luther_bendross said :

To answer OP’s title question: yes. Roadworkers are people trying to improve the driving environment by bettering the infrastructure we use. Police are people trying to improve the driving environment by removing dickheads like you.

I love the heroes that frequent RiotACT. A brief perusal of this thread would suggest that no one in Canberra has ever received a fine for anything. Moreover, no one has EVER even once accidentally breached the speed limit on ANY of Canberra’s roads.

I wish you heroes who love the ‘admit you were wrong and shut the hell up’ attitude would mind your own business. OP has a legitimate point to do with OH/S for the Police, and fairness for the citizenry.

Heaven forbid we actually have a sensible discussion…

Bails said :

I love the heroes that frequent RiotACT.

Yay! I’m a hero! I love you too man. And I guess I’m now justified to continue wearing my undies on the outside, although they’d better be hi-vis undies hey?

Many of us have seen police do some pretty silly and dangerous things around traffic. So it would have been a reasonable post, if:
* the OP hadn’t been looking for grounds for appeal against the fine,
* the OP hadn’t themselves been aware of the OHS reags (and presumably reasoning) behind hi-vis workwear in a worksite yet still chose to speed through one of said worksites.

luther_bendross said :

To answer OP’s title question: yes. Roadworkers are people trying to improve the driving environment by bettering the infrastructure we use. Police are people trying to improve the driving environment by removing dickheads like you.

I love the heroes that frequent RiotACT. A brief perusal of this thread would suggest that no one in Canberra has ever received a fine for anything. Moreover, no one has EVER even once accidentally breached the speed limit on ANY of Canberra’s roads.

I wish you heroes who love the ‘admit you were wrong and shut the hell up’ attitude would mind your own business. OP has a legitimate point to do with OH/S for the Police, and fairness for the citizenry.

devils_advocate said :

ex-vectis said :

I have to check cars behind me before I get on the brakes because my car brakes faster than average

Surely the cars behind can tell you are going to stop when the air break flips up on the Bugatti Veyron? I don’t understand can your car only break hard? FYI checking the available space behind your car when breaking is a normal driving technique and taught to students as a part of the learners program.

When a cop not wearing a high-vis vest gets clipped by a car, then the insurance companies will start making them wear them consistently. It is my opinion that workcover action and legislation is more about the insurance industry than it is about keeping people safe.

To answer OP’s title question: yes. Roadworkers are people trying to improve the driving environment by bettering the infrastructure we use. Police are people trying to improve the driving environment by removing dickheads like you.

ex-vectis said :

However, getting back to marksy’s very good point, the claim “I killed the policeman/woman because they blended in with the background while standing in the road and it was raining with traffic spray everywhere and yes I had slowed for the conditions” would probably stand up in court with a half-decent lawyer,

That’s kind of beside the point (for me); I would rather not run over anyone – police or civilian – and I have seen a few of them standing in the middle of the road as if they’re invincible or something. I have to check cars behind me before I get on the brakes because my car brakes faster than average. Also you don’t always get a good line of sight as to what’s ahead, especially if you have a lower vantage point, so seeing some dude standing in the middle of a lane you’ve just merged into isn’t optimal.

If they catch you for speeding, well, too bad.

I once almost ran a cop over when he walked out onto the road right as I was pulling out on a RBT stop a number of years ago. I was only doing perhaps 20km/h because I’d just pulled back out, but he walked out without looking and we both had a brown trouser moment. He wasn’t wearing high-vis. I stopped, he stepped back, and life went on.

LSWCHP said :

This attempt to claim “They weren’t wearing hi-vis gear, therefore I wasn’t alerted to their presence, therefore I shouldn’t be fined for speeding” is pitifully lame.

Lame is not even a word I’d use for it. Funny, in a sad way, though.

However, getting back to marksy’s very good point, the claim “I killed the policeman/woman because they blended in with the background while standing in the road and it was raining with traffic spray everywhere and yes I had slowed for the conditions” would probably stand up in court with a half-decent lawyer,

screaming banshee said :

Jethro said :

Saw a car the other day with a southern cross made out of frangipanis.

Pure awesome.

Photos or it didn’t happen.

Unfortunately I don’t always roam the streets of outer-Belconnen armed with a camera.

Although once I got a photo of a giant dog inside a caged ute.

I called him Norman.

Norman the giant f**k off dog.

Yeah, this starts off well and ends badly.

I concur that wearing hi-vis clothing would be good for police safety. But the point of the hi-vis gear would not be to alert drivers to the presence of the cops so that they can temporarily slow to the speed limit and avoid a fine. The purpose of the gear would be to prevent drivers running over the cops as they perform their duties.

This attempt to claim “They weren’t wearing hi-vis gear, therefore I wasn’t alerted to their presence, therefore I shouldn’t be fined for speeding” is pitifully lame.

Jethro said :

Saw a car the other day with a southern cross made out of frangipanis.

Pure awesome.

Photos or it didn’t happen.

As for the OP, I may have even witnessed this in the rearview today. I did think it odd they he just strode into the middle two 80k lanes and pretty sure a car passed him in the left lane while he was out there before directing the offending driver to pull over. I too would have though hi-vis would be mandatory but more importantly PAY YOUR FINE AND STOP WHINGING DOUCHE.

buzz819 said :

Wow.. All I heard was.. Whinge whinge whinge… I got a ticket how do I get off?

Not what I heard…

I read a sensible post about a really relevant point .I too have seen (and funnily not seen for a while due to his black attire blending in with a tree shadow) Police road workers not wearing hi-visibility clothing. Hi-visibility clothing is worn by folk working on the roads for a reason. Not everyone has perfect eyesight and coupled with poor conditions bike gear could easily blend in with the background.

Well marksy, if someone in a position to make decisions makes the right one after reading your post then you could well have saved a life. Full marks. Shame it is just more hot air until a copper gets killed because thats the Polli’s we have….

And just to prove I’m not a speeding whinger – I dont speed. No, really. My wife says I’m a boring driver because I always keep to the limit and am looking forward to these ‘trip’ speed cameras. 🙂

p1 said :

Can I add my question about why cops on bikes don’t have to wear PPE to this rant?
.

They do. It’s called an AS/NZS1698 approved helmet. The law requires that every motorcyclist wears one – cops included.

Ozi said :

matt31221 said :

I love those MAD black german storm trooper style trench coats they wear in the rain, they look so friggin’ mean. Especially with the leather hats. I’d love to find out where they buy them and buy an unmarked one. The coppers have some great kit.

Ummm… not so much. They have bright flouro rain coats, but they just look like enormous numpties when they wear them. Don’t know which fervent day dream made you think cops have circa 1935 black trench coats!

I am sure of it – at one stage they had these black coats with either reflective “POLICE” or “AFP” on the back of the coat. Hmm, maybe it was the AFP not ACT Policing? It was a while ago I think.

Golden-Alpine said :

Your last sentence is immature and down right disrespectful. These officers risk their lives every day they go out for you and your family. Suck it up and pay the fine and accept you were in the wrong.

What a ridiculous exaggeration. When was the last cop killed in Canberra while on duty? Pretty sure Winchester was the last cop murdered here, over 20 years ago, there might have been one or two killed in car crashes since IIRC.

Can I add my question about why cops on bikes don’t have to wear PPE to this rant?

OT – Maybe the police should get those reflective stripes sown onto there pants like a lot of workers have now…

OMG! You have to be kidding right? You were speeding and you think you can get off because the police man wasn’t wearing high-vis? How do you justify this? You were speeding. Seems like you aren’t disputing that at all. Therefore you have no justification for appealing.

Your last sentence is immature and down right disrespectful. These officers risk their lives every day they go out for you and your family. Suck it up and pay the fine and accept you were in the wrong.

Grail said :

A police officer on the side of the road waving you down is not worried about machinery running them over, so there’s no desperate need for them to wear high-vis gear.

Well he bloody well ought to be! Especially if it was a night time RBT…

As Far As I Know “Road Workers” Don’t Have Gun’s.With The Exception Of Ivan

I’ve seen a Police Officer doing this on the last few hours of the GDE 60k speed limit. I drove up the GDE at 5am (ish) & all I saw was his red flashing stick sitting on his bike seat as I went past.

But while it would be nice for the Police to wear highvisclothing. But they are very well hidden in a high vis jacket when car headlights show him up before the Police radar picks up any car.

Also adding to the urban legend, I have been told it was a guy who was inspecting Woolworth’s Woden the next day & told them about his experience on Ginninderra Drive. It was at the bottom of the hill near Lyneham. The same OH&S Inspector also sat further down the road & called the Winchester Centre warning them about what happened. A few minutes later he saw the 2 Police Officers chuck their high vis vests on.

matt31221 said :

I love those MAD black german storm trooper style trench coats they wear in the rain, they look so friggin’ mean. Especially with the leather hats. I’d love to find out where they buy them and buy an unmarked one. The coppers have some great kit.

Ummm… not so much. They have bright flouro rain coats, but they just look like enormous numpties when they wear them. Don’t know which fervent day dream made you think cops have circa 1935 black trench coats!

Henry82 said :

Instead you’ve got canberra drivers, who drive frangipani excels through give way/stop signs without looking.

Saw a car the other day with a southern cross made out of frangipanis.

Pure awesome.

Most of the AFP ACT Policing DO wear High-Viz on the road I thought (most of the time anyways)? They certainly have High-Viz vests – they store it in a briefcase in their patrol car.

I love those MAD black german storm trooper style trench coats they wear in the rain, they look so friggin’ mean. Especially with the leather hats. I’d love to find out where they buy them and buy an unmarked one. The coppers have some great kit.

An urban legend that did the rounds.

Cop pings a motorist for speeding , pulls him over, and issues a ticket.

Motorist is a government OH&S inspector. Issues the cop with a ticket for not using high vis gear.

Ah, justice.

Grail said :

Hi-vis clothing on construction sites is necessary due to the confusing environments: piles of dirt, piles of construction materials, bare concrete, covered concrete, shiny metal, rusted metal

Instead you’ve got canberra drivers, who drive frangipani excels through give way/stop signs without looking. Eat, do make-up or text on the phone while driving. Vans stopping regularly along streets, cyclists cutting through traffic etc

A few years ago, I very nearly hit a police officer who ran out in front of me (I was doing the speed limit ~80km/h, I would have killed him).

Not only did I not see him until the last second, he actually didn’t see me. He must have been so eager to pull over the motorbike behind me that just failed to notice my car.

I too thought to myself he really should be dressed like a tennis ball, but were you just trying to get out of a fine you cheeky dog?

Hi-vis clothing on construction sites is necessary due to the confusing environments: piles of dirt, piles of construction materials, bare concrete, covered concrete, shiny metal, rusted metal — it’s a visually noisy environment and when you’re reversing a cement mixer into a work site on your fourth trip today it can get easy to not see people.

A police officer on the side of the road waving you down is not worried about machinery running them over, so there’s no desperate need for them to wear high-vis gear.

Of course, you could go find the advert for that ambulance-chasing lawyer on the RiotACT, he seems to specialise in getting people off on technicalities.

The first part of your argument was valid, however the last paragraph was blah blah about avoiding for tickets. Stop for police when you see them, whether or not they’re wearing high vis.

If you think just turning your head slightly like nothing has happened and drive past, it’s not going to work. Firstly, they can see your plates, secondly they usually have a high powered police car to chase you down, and finally – you’ll get a fist full of tickets for failing to stop. They’re not stupid, they can tell. Just like i can tell when i cross at a pedestrian crossing and people don’t want to stop.

Next time you get pulled over (assuming its regular occurrence), say something like “it was difficult seeing you there officer, perhaps you should wear high vis for your own safety”. Otherwise i’d suggest writing your argument to a local member? legislative assembly? someone who can actually change the law. When you do write the letter though, exclude the last paragraph.

Reminds me of the old story that police can’t issue tickets if they’re not wearing a hat.

You should be paying enough attention to the road and the environment around you that you don’t hit a cop, a workman, a student, a mother, a business-person, a child, or ANY other pedestrian, regardless of what they are wearing.

Wake up to yourself.

Absolutely. And I think you will have similar grounds for appeal should police (hopefully) decide to shoot you without using ear protection.

Shouldn’t you be doing the speed limit anyway, regardless if there’s a police officer checking speed? No wonder construction takes ages in Canberra, nothing but whingers.

At least you’ll have an excuse when you knock one over.

Wow.. All I heard was.. Whinge whinge whinge… I got a ticket how do I get off?