Women and their bodies

i said most women because it IS most women.. in our society getting married is what you do. yes more and more people are starting to move away from that, but MOST people will still (at some stage) get married.

the rest was clearly in my opinion.

Jesus Christ!!!! Which “most women”. I know many women in loving relationships (myself included) who do not want to get married. What most women? Maybe most of the women you know, but that doesn’t mean a generic sweep of the board “most women”. There are many many of us who enjoy making our own decisions in life.

And thanks to the majority of the male commenters for their intelligent (and humourous!)thoughts. Although, if I use bonfire’s approach, I can base my opinions on one experience and say “most men are tossers”. And would then look like a dick with all the sensible (and some very nice comments about their wives which make them seem even more lovely) comments that prove me wrong. Which Bonfire now looks like.

i don’t want to be married… but yes most women do. i think it may have something to do with their indecisiveness in careers and leisure activities… it’s easier to find a man and latch on to whatever it is that they like to do.

Of course this doesn’t apply to men – we let ourselves go long before one of the women chasing us finally runs us down…

im stating it as an observation. im not saying that its a peer reviewed, endorsed, rock solid finding.

but as an observation its a fairly accurate one.

a woman can do what she likes with her body, she can die her hair bright orange and wear a green miniskirt at the age of 90 if she wants to, but my statement that most women ‘let themselves go’ after marriage would still apply to most married women that i have met in my years on this planet.

if a man prefers marriage to a frumpy carping harpie, as opposed to a woman with pride in her appearance (whatever her body shape) and a realistic attitude to marital life (as opposed to whatever fantasy is concncted by watching hollywood films, reading womans magazines and gossiping with other ill informed fantasist female friends) good luck to him.

and lg, most women want to be married.

And bonnie? You are flattering yourself if you assume everything we do is to get a man. I have a man. It doesn’t mean I’m going to cut my hair (and who says having short hair is “letting yourself go, anyway???? Tell that to Keira Knightly) and stop shaving my legs. You’ll find most women are the same. Don’t assume we want to catch someone like you – most of us have vaccinations to stop us catching stuff like that.

Looks like blokes have the same tendency to turn into bunters after getting married as women. Possibly more, by the looks of those figures…

…I’d anecdotally suggest, anyway…

Journal: Obesity reviews: an official journal of the International Association for the Study of Obesity.

Article Title: Prevalence of obesity in Australia

Author: Thorburn AW

Ref: Obesity Reviews. 6(3):187-9, 2005 Aug.

Findings
Overweight or Obese Australian Males: 67%
Overweight or Obese Australian Females: 52%

Can’t find the original article I quoted but this study shows a similar result.

Ooh. Weddingcentral.com…

The Australian Medical Journal? The Lancet? Bah!

Pick a credible source if you want to give your arguement for “fact” credence, bonfire.

I don’t have a problem with your theory, so much as the way you have posited it as irrefutable.

as opposed to new womans authoritative status!

Given there are more overweight or obese males in Australia (estimate 64% male 47% female) why is it that you assume that females are more prone to this behaviour.

A link to a post and your observations at a mall only go to reinforce the anecdotal nature of your assertions.

i think men suffer that equally….

a 10 second googling throws this up

http://forum.weddingcentral.com.au/viewtopic.php?t=22469&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=8&sid=6ba0f1623d9e84e87a01668104957a47

Wander around any mall and you will see middle aged married women wearing tracksuits, shapeless formless windcheaters, short masculine haircuts. in fact any women who gets her hair done at ‘just cuts’ is a candidate.

it’s the whole ‘my task to snare a husband is now complete, why bother with my appearance any more?’ attitude.

Overweight is not immoral? Heh – depends who you ask…

I’d agree – there is no moral equivalence in getting a bit soft around the middle and beating your wife; but that’s not the point LG was making. She’s trying to point out bonfire’s point was anecdotal and a generalisation, not a “fact”.

Yeah, but accusing a woman of being fat and accusing a man of being a wife beater are two fairly different things. Being overweight is not illegal, nor, to mind, particularly immoral. Being a wife beater is both.

Yeah, but accusing a woman of being fat and accusing a man of being a wife beater are two fairly different things. Being overweight is not illegal, nor, to my mind, particularly immoral. Being a wife beater is both.

Thanks Shab. My point was just that they are both generalisation and crap!

No bonfire. Yours in anecdotal (let’s see a journal article or two). LG’s is a demonstration of that.

lg the two are not remotely similar. one comment (mine) is factual, the other (yours) is feminist nonsense.

Bonfire –
I have sufered from ‘Post Marital Blimp’ I was married at about 24, and then I went from 74Kg to about 90 – 100kg. (It is a little variable) – That was 16 years ago.

It could also be that my male metabolism backed off and I could no longer have lunches of Potato Cakes – (Scallops are from the ocean).

But Megs and I both say it is ‘Post Marital blimp.”

PS – She hasn’t changed shape very much – Even with 2 kids.

Bonfire, that’s not true. That’s like saying “most men start hitting their women once they get married”.

My first girlfriend was tall with red hair… woohoo!

That’s rugby, though – blokes who play rugby are slightly more likely to actualy like a girl for her personality and brains.

Then again, who’s dating a league player for their personality either?

Matt Giteaus girlfriend is more on the large size.

except that most women let themselves go when they get married.

Battlekath is making good points. The media thing is pervasive, it is often in the subconcious. Women ARE judged on their appearance, more than men. What’s the first thing you say about Amanda Vanstone? That she’d a very successful performer in parliament? That she has a very quick wit? No. That she’s fat, and wears noisy shirts. What’s the first thing you say about Beazo? Not the same, is it?

This stuff worms its way into the way people think, en masse. When will you see a professional footballer with a size 14 or 16 girl on his arm? He’d be called a loser if he did that. Out with a Fat Chick.

I’m 20 and have come to realise that if you can’t change it, why complain ?

I’m 6’ft and am ‘officially’ underweight, even though my ribs don’t stick out, I have hips and red hair. I stand, without a doubt, a whole head above 90% of the girls in civic and I used to beat myself up over it. Then I started to understand that it was never going to change, so I stopped getting hung up over it and became confident. Apparently guys dig confidence (who would have thought).

TV has only a small percentage to do with things. Its a mental thing. Nicki Webster is only 18 remember… She hasnt started to really ‘fill out’ yet, and besides, anyone who is in the limelight has had to work extreemly hard for their bodies, its not like they were born that way.

You will find most of the girls will snap out of it when they get dumped for over critising themselves or singled out for being so damning when it comes to their own bodies.

Opps, I just re-read my post – BattleKath – I am mostly harmless…. Marriage does that to you!

Hmmm Hasn’t a lot transpired in my absence. You go to get the kids from school, and you are hitched – in a Civil Union. Well?

Just to set the slightly confused record straight.
(And because I really like numbering my paragraphs.)
1) VY – I am certainly not a girl – Every morning I look down and am reminded of this..
2) I am highly unlikely to require a Civil Union – I like girls.. They are soooo soft and squichy in all of the right places….Hmmm…
3) A wine with BattleKath (and VY) sounds like a fine thing.

I like this forum. There is a mystery about who is what, and while on the surface it looks like random people typing, it is actually a community behind the typing.

Have a great weekend.. See you on Monday.

battlekath is a hottie

… or should that be “civil union”?

“By the way…James-T-Kirk is hot!”

Does that mean you’re proposing marriage, VY?

Awwwe… now aren’t you nice! hehehehe.

i’m not perfect… but i’m glad that i’m me.

BattleKath – I don’t care what you look like, because you have already shown us that you’re funny, witty and can take our crap! You can come along to have red wine with myself JTK and LurkerGal.

JTK – absolutely, that’s all that any of us can do, simply work within our social circumstances… and that’s why everyone is different, we’re simply an effect of everything that has ever happened to us.

noice.

By the way…James-T-Kirk is hot!

I have been guilty of watching a season or two.. hated every minute of it.. but got addicted somehow, terrible stuff.

Anyway the kinds of people they get on this show is sickening… they are all the alpha male/female types with gorgeous bodies and hang me personalities. Its like masturbating with a cheese grater…

Yet they are passing it off as normal.

Watching Big Brother is like going to the zoo to see the ‘morons’ exhibit.

By the way, LurkerGal, James-T-Kirk is actually a woman, so let’s get it on!

And if I wasn’t looking to marry a bloke, I would too.

Incidentally, gay men don’t seem to generally have the same self-image problem. Of course, there are those who decide to make a fetish out of being tubby and hairy, but we just call them special people.

OMG – Bigbrother – Dont get me started — If I was to ever blow yp a TV station, it would be because of what the entire Bigbrother thing has caused society to do…

Live your own lives – Love your friends – Dont live life through the *&%(%$*& TV..

LurkerGal:

If I wasn’t already married – I would throw myself at your feet!!!

I agree with battle kath… the problem is bigger than just 1 person struggling with body image. there are people out there who don’t have the facilities mostly through ignorance to separate the media from reality. these are the people you need to educate. And generally these people are trapped in a cycle of consuming too much bullshit tv such as big brother to realise…

LurkerGal – I love your work!!!!! Wanna have a red wine?

BattleKath, Thanks for that. Yes, Media is not a personal issue, it is more of a social issue.

I have a close friend who is a farmer, and who has *no* exposure to the media. It is amazing how stress free his lifestyle is.

While I am not suggesting that everybody move out and ignore the rest of society, it does make me wonder.

The only thing I can do personally, is to empower my kids to believe that anything that the media tells them is biased towards whatever the media owners want to push.. And I personally controll it by ignoring the media thing.

It has taken effort, and I am happy with the result. BTW, I am a male who is 100+ kg, who could loose some body mass, but I actually dont care, as it helps me to ballast my 16 foot catamaran.

Have a great weekend.

Mmmmmm…yoghurt…I love yoghurt when you sprinkle chocolate on top, and cover it all with cream…

I like James T Kirk’s suggestion. I also appreciate VY’s comment. Now, according to him, if I can find another chick who has had a few red wines he will endorse our getting married!

Self awareness is the key. I have shed 17kg this year, and have (literally) had to walk my ass off. Is it worth it? Dunno, I’ll tell you in a few years when I see if I still get heart disease. It’s a health issue. Like I said, I used to have the body of a god – pity it was buddha.

VYBerlinaV8: I disagree – The media tells me I can eat anything I want as long as I join a Gym, and eat low fat yoghurt.

i agree that it takes work to fix a problem…and that it’s hard, no doubt.

but does the problem lie with how people perceive the media (or whatever else), or how the media perceives the people?

you’re missing my point… that this isn’t a personal issue, it’s bigger than one person being too lazy to fix their own problems.

Exactly – what affects your size is what you put in your mouth. You can enjoy what goes in your mouth, or you can enjoy your body shape. Choose.

Dam.. It’s been 3 minutes, and nobody replied…

But we live in the instant generation, where we can have anything – the media tells me so!!

BattleKath,

1) Everything can be fixed using some steps… It’s called making a plan.

If it makes you unhappy – (by affecting you) – avoid it. As my kids say – Your are the boss of yourself.

It’s never easy, but sometimes you have to do some work to get some reward.

saying to ignore the media, shopping centres etc. is bullshit.

i don’t have an answer, along with most people.
i’m simply stating that this happens, whether you like it or want it or ignore it…and that’s why there is so much focus on weight and body image, because obviously, even the few here that think this is a joke, are effected by it themselves or know someone who is.

If it was so easy to fix, that these (ridiculous)4 steps would solve it, don’t you think it would be fixed already. c’mon!

LG – you ARE hot after a few red wines!!

It’s been a bit lively here… Well done.
I totally agree with the media victim comments. It is pervasive within our society.

But, here’s a plan to solve the problem.

1) Stop watching telly. If you are addicted – try Foxtel or something similar. If required, resort to Aunty ABC. But stop the media entering your house.

2) Don’t read the paper, or any other magazine. If war is declaired, I’m sure somebody will let you know.

3) This is an important one – AVOID THE SHOPPING MALLS!!! – It has taken me 40 odd years to figure out that they exist to make us *want* to buy things, because we are too fat / too skiny / too whatever. We stopped going on a Friday night, and saved a bucket load.

4) Take up a sport that gets you outside with other people – AVOID THE GYM.. Go walking with friends.

Love the body God gave you, and don’t let others influence your life.

Man, I must be getting old…

I find only looking in the mirror after a few red wines helps. Good God I’m hot after a few red wines…………….

Disclaimer: LG does not encourage binge drinking, thinking you are hot, or looking in the mirror. Unless, of course, you are as hot as she is afte a bottle of cab sav.

but seriously most people are victims of media without knowing it. Everywhere you look there are images of perfect people (for me it happens mostly when I look in the mirror)… so much so that it affects the subconcious mind as well.

im stuffed too….

If you’ve reached the age of majority and are unable to see through media bullshit, then, unfortunately, you’re screwed. In more ways than one. Body image is probably the least of your worries then…

It’s your body, your mind and your time. If you choose to participate in activities that make you feel bad about yourself, knowing the outcome, then that makes you the idiot. Sorry to break the news.

yes, good solution. glad we had you here to fix everything!

idiot.

Then stop watching TV and reading magazines. The person in control here is you, not TV and magazines.

Hey, I always wanted a Ferrari cos I saw one on the telly – but guess what, it probably won’t happen.

…or that every magazine, tv show etc. is saying that what you can never be, is beautiful.

knowing that you can never be a certain size doesn’t change the fact that you want it.

haha…. for that reminds me of my favourite black books quote which was something along the lines of

“I once dated a girl with a nice arse… well it was enormous but there was always this tremendous sense of value”

i shoudl also add, that he couldnt tell her the reason they broke up cos he thought that woudl upset her, and cause her to focus even more on her arse size.

when she asked me i just said it was him, he was a bastard.

i have some mutual friends who were an item for some time. when they broke up he told me that she endlessly commented on her arse size, asking him if it was too big, until it drove him nuts.

in short, her obsession led to the relationship breaking down.

to be fair her arse is big, but not to the point that small children would point to it and laugh.

good on you LG.

I’m not a tiny little thing and I always hated my body. Now I have a man in my life who thinks I am perfect (and I have finally got over the psychological block of never being as beautiful as his previous size 8 girlfriends). I’m not overweight enough to be unhealthy, but I have a stomach, and I have hips, and ok, I admit it, I have a big ass.

But having someone who tells me every day how perfect my body is has made a massive difference. But my loathing of my body was something I had to get over before I could be happy.

I feel for all the women who aren’t there yet.

Body of a god…pity it’s buddha.

Seriously though, I think women are actually more to blame than men for body image problems. Most guys I know just don’t get that worried about how a woman looks. My wife occasionally whinges that she wants to be skinnier – I tell her not to lose weight, she looks great now (cos she does).

I think the most helpful comments have been about people simply being within the healthy weight and body fat ranges. At least, that’s what I’m aiming for.

Well, whatever. The thing is I don’t think you have to be the size someone has dictated is *right* to be beautiful or to be healthy.

Nah ant you have a bee in your bonnet for other reasons.

The comment was made that Jenny and Nikki are too skinny and have some eating disorder. I disagree. If you look at the girls under 25 these days, they are taller and skinnier than what I can remember from 25 years ago. All those hormones? To me Jenny and Nikki look like average girls of their age. I know personally what a woman with a eating disorder looks like.

I only have to look at the age group of women who go to the gym most under 25. Why I ask myself? To look good in the nite club?

It seems to me (and my g/f) that once women hit their mid-thirties and get married they just let go. And then they have a bloody hard time trying to get their teenage bodies back. They never will without hard effort. Thats why I said eat well and exercise. You got a problem with that evidently.

Of course there is a body image problem, why else are all those womens magazines sold. My g/f is smart but she spends $150 every 6 weeks on her hair, because she feels good about it. I think she is silly, but I have to evade the topic these days to avoid getting into the dog house. Are you going to judge her on that? If not why judge women trying to look more attractive?

Many women try and look feminine and they know being overweight (and these days grossly overweight) makes them invisible to men.

Good looks are a fact of life with the opposite sex. Somehow, I believe that women delude themselves in believing whatever they do, lose weight, do their hair, they will ever look like Jenny, because as joeyjo says their basic body shape will never allow it. They must know it.

BTW: Elle Macpherson (The BODY) was never attractive to me, but how many women tried to emulate her? Shudder. But then I find some women attractive that my mates would say they are not.

Pandy is evidently trolling, by exaggerating the sort of attitude that perpetuates the problem under discussion.

Jenny is too skinny? Give me a break!

Anyway you can be skinny as you like but if you have an ugly face you will be transperant.

Eat well, exercise, get that puppy fat off your body and she’ll be right.

And Nikki is not skinny. Looks like may 18yo chicky babes at the local gym.

The other thing that bothers me is that everyone is trying to conform to the same body shape, even though we are all completely different and will never look the same. I eat whatever I want but I’ll always be a bony skeleton, while I have friends who eat amazingly healthily but will never ever be the size of Jennifer Hawkins because that’s not their body type. Their frame doesn’t support it, their metabolism won’t allow it and it’s just not their natural body shape.

Here’s a good eg, linked from ABC Shallow End, of photshopping, and Nikki is barely 18 and already too skinny and probably eating disordered

http://www.sandstorming.com/images/nikibandafter.jpg

Geez you blokes that think Jen Hawkins is too skinny must be the Hefners of Canberra

Of course women are worried about their appearance. Look at the media, constantly focussing how they look. Look at how any prominent woman is commented-upon: on her appearance.

See many ugly old women on TV? No? See any ugly old men on TV?! Hell yeah. No one even thinks to comment on their appearance. For women, it’s invariably the first thing.
Example: the two morning TV show hosts. One is called “skeletor”, the other is criticised for being fat (and oddly, both are former Canberra newsreaders!). What criticisms are levelled at the males they present their shows with? Nothing to do with their appearance.

Body shape wrong, body size might have been slightly better but still subject to similar criticism. May be the mass media should only portray models who have a % body fat that is in the healthy range for sex and age.

I don’t believe it should present shape… because even if everyone was healthy there would still be somethings which not everyone can naturally achieve. However they should promote healthy living.. maintaining balance…

It’s an interesting problem given that it is estimated that in Aust 47% of women and 63% of men are overweight or obese and are thus exposing themselves to increased risks of heart disease, stroke, etc. Unfortunately those who are affected by their body image to the extent that it impairs their sex life are probably not the overweight but the underweight people who have an (under) eating disorder or body dysmorphic disorder. How should the mass media present body shape in a way that encourages the underweight to eat more while simultaneously encouraging the overweight to eat less? Both extremes have similar morbidity problems.

Kerces,
Cheers for that. your writing is coming along in leaps and bounds by the way. top stuff1

Yeah, that Hawkins chick looks fantastic; but only if you’re into the praying mantis look!

Have men been blamed for women’s low self esteem issues again, or have New Women finally realised that they might be part of the problem?

Capt Benno, to read more of my thoughts on this subject, have a look at thie Concat article.

I am an avid reader of glossies but also highly disagree with the contradicting and hypocritical “size” philospohies they peddle.

Capt Benno I agree…. its kind of like saying ‘we have identified that you have low self esteem in regards to your body shape – so have a picture of what you should look like’…

New Woman magazine ?

Lancet it aint.

please insert the word ‘add’ at your leisure folks in my last Dantesque rant.

Jennifer Hawkins is too Skinny. Give me a woman with Curves anyday.

Woman need to chill out.

Well done. No offence intended, but as a bloke who had a partner who did suffer with eating disorders, I strongly believe that peddling information such as this will only to the problems that many wonderful, graceful women wrongly perceive that they have.

If I had my way, this wouldn’t have made it through moderation.

Sorry kerces, but having a spray on a to;pic that really pisses me off.