Commuter or Day Tripper?

On the topic of lycra:

You might not see how it is necessary if you don’t ride, or if you only ride occasionally, but when you get a few kms up, you will discover that your body really can’t cope with normal clothing rubbing against it for that long. And then you will learn to love lycra, even if you still cover it up with ordinary shorts over the top.

Katie said :

… I ride down Limestone Av towards Anzac parade and I use the footpaths along this road every time. I have come to know where the tree roots, pot holes and other hazards (including overgrown hedges) are and can mostly avoid any mishaps.

However I continue to be amazed by the number of residents who reverse out of their driveways at a million miles an hour without looking and with too much speed to stop the car. Their hedges already take up the footpaths forcing me onto the nature strip and block the drivers view of oncoming footpath traffic. I have nearly been hit too many times to count…

Tru dat. Cars appearing from behind hedges are a real hazard. Yes, you can avoid them easily but to do so you have to ride really slow and that is not always practical. I feel that the danger posed by cars on the road is much less than that of cars reversing out of hedge-ridden driveways.

Plus, the hedges on Limestone are so old and gnarly that if you given them even the slightest of scrapes you will end up with some decent emo damage on your arms.

Loosen up New Yeah, you might enjoy it ;~)
Hehe, I am pretty loose – not wearing lycra does that for you!

I encourage all drivers to use the fastest and most direct route possible as long as they obey the road rules. As a cyclists, I will continue to do the same. Please keep in mind that our vehicles don’t follow exactly the same set of rules and you shouldn’t assume that I’m breaking the law just because I’m doing something that would be illegal in a car. Unfortunately there will be some cyclists who do break the law – try not to hold the rest of us accountable for their actions, they annoy us too. – North

If you go to the front page of news.com.au at the moment you’ll see a nice pick of one of canberra’s drivers enforcing their ‘right of way’.

tylersmayhem said :

On a final point about the whole “why do cyclists choose to ride on the road instead of using the bike path”: I think the closest comparison I can’t draw for motorists is, why do you choose to take the parkway, main road or arterial road? It gets you from A to B in the fastest and most direct way…and sharing the road SHOULDN’T be a problem!

Well actually the fastest and most direct way for a car driver would be to use the road and should you, say, get a red light, switch over to the footpath to cross a different road, then go on to use the slip lane if traffic is congested and then push your way infront of someone further up the queue of traffic – being sure to show your aggression to the person who is obviously not happy about being forced to let you in.

I was driving along the road, with right of way, and in excericsing my right of way that meant the cyclist had to wait to cross the road. He got a bit fired up at me for causing him such an inconvenience, haha.

Yeah, that’s not cool Holden! It’s those types that give us a bad name as cyclists.

so using the roads is just not an option. Why put yourself in possible conflict or worse, danger? Just leave 20mins earlier and enjoy the sunshine.

On a final point about the whole “why do cyclists choose to ride on the road instead of using the bike path”: I think the closest comparison I can’t draw for motorists is, why do you choose to take the parkway, main road or arterial road? It gets you from A to B in the fastest and most direct way…and sharing the road SHOULDN’T be a problem!

I ride to work a few times a week. I ride down Limestone Av towards Anzac parade and I use the footpaths along this road every time. I have come to know where the tree roots, pot holes and other hazards (including overgrown hedges) are and can mostly avoid any mishaps.

However I continue to be amazed by the number of residents who reverse out of their driveways at a million miles an hour without looking and with too much speed to stop the car. Their hedges already take up the footpaths forcing me onto the nature strip and block the drivers view of oncoming footpath traffic. I have nearly been hit too many times to count.
The stop signs on the roads that intersect with Limestone av (Quick st, Chisolm st, Cowper st etc) are also more often than not ignored by drivers which has lead to many a close call.

Cracking first post by Northbourne Ultimatum. Well done!

I used to be much more anti-cyclist than I am now. I figure I was spending more energy getting fed up at the relatively few times cyclists do something that bother me than I would be if just chilled out for the few seconds it takes to deal with most motorist-cyclist interactions.

I’ll hold my own if required (example to follow*), but I’m happy to live and let live. Life is too short as it is to worry about quasi-problems like this.

*I thought it was a bit cute the other day on my drive to work when a cyclist was on a bike path, approaching the kerb, and hoping to cross the road and continue on his merry way along the bike path. I was driving along the road, with right of way, and in excericsing my right of way that meant the cyclist had to wait to cross the road. He got a bit fired up at me for causing him such an inconvenience, haha. So I got a bit fired up in return an pointed out that there was no fornicating pedestrian crossing and that I was perfectly within my rights to continue my progress.

I’m not sure what planet he has been on, but I can’t think of too many situations where a car with a clear case of right of way is ever going to make way for a cyclist. There may be a few cases, but this was clearly not one of them!

I thought I’d never say it Jim – but well said mate, and in so many less words than anything I’d be able to come up with. Spot on!

Just leave 20mins earlier and enjoy the sunshine.

I think that’s a good attitude to have, I applaude you.

Or perhaps we could all just “share” the road together, and not get bent out of shape moaning about who gets what and when?! I imagine if as cyclists we paid to get registered and licensed, road only on the bike paths (if they were designed for commuting, not leisurely Sunday afternoon peddles), and didn’t wear lycra – the motorists who seem to hate cyclists would STILL find something to moan at cyclists about – “they don’t pay ENOUGH in rego and licensing”, “why are WE paying for bike lanes that THEY get to use, but WE never use” etc etc.

Perhaps it’s better to just leave it at what Jim and Northbourne posted 😛

I agree with Northbourne Ultimatum & tylersmayhem and have *very little* more to add.

I am a work commuter of the ‘cycle chic’ variety 😛 — I like wearing clothes that are as close to civvies as possible on bike journeys, ride at a fairly leisurely pace & my bike is ok but not fancy.

I’m not personally a fan of the lycra thing but 2 thumbs up to you kooky lycra-wearing-bike-aficionados. No really. Cycling is great – enjoyable to ride to and from work, far easier to ride a bike for your small shopping errands than drive, good for you health, environment, etc. What’s not to like? (Actually – I’ll tell you what’s not to like, angry car peeps zooming past you super close, just to make the point that you don’t deserve to be on the road)

I’m only sad that we don’t have an amazing bike culture like in Amsterdam, or more recently Paris with their Velib bike hire system.

In conclusion: Go Bikes!

“Registration for the purpose of law enforcement will achieve nothing.”

The whole bike registration thing is obviously a load of bollocks. The only people who propose it are always foaming at the mouth anti-cyclists pulling the same tired crap about “They’re getting something for nothing”, while ignoring the fact that bike riders are taxpayers anyway, and that bicycle use does no damage to the roads (unlike motor vehicles).

It’s not even really an argument, it’s more of a “I hate cyclists” signifier. They’re always the ones who believe that the car is the only legitimate form of transport … and they’re always angry angry angry drivers (that bloke who refuses to let you change lanes, even though there are only 3 people on a 10km stretch of road, for example). What is it that makes so many people turn into self-righteous raging d1ckheads whenever they step into a combustion driven rectangle of steel?

All of that said, the lycra thing still strikes me as an affectation.

Come on this is RiotACT, where it’s easier to complain than do something about the problem.

For the people with deep seated objections to all the cyclists out there, why are you no lobbying the government to instruct the police to divert their resources to stamping out bike rider traffic infringements? There are plenty of crimes being committed on a daily basis which the police could very easily enforce – redlights, stop signs, riding in pedestrian crossings, not wearing a helmet that meets the Aust standard. If the police issued a few thousand fines in the next week (including to your kids on their way to school) then that would stick it to those pesky cyclists.

Could it be that in the general scheme of things, no one really cares?

stray said :

i’ll stick to the pot holes, tree roots, smashed glass, mud and paths full of small kiddies..it takes me longer to get into the city, but i enjoy the fresh air for longer and my slow but assured safety. I’m a new cyclist and not a very competant one at that, with a rickety old bike that has has its own mind on when it changes gears, so using the roads is just not an option. Why put yourself in possible conflict or worse, danger? Just leave 20mins earlier and enjoy the sunshine.

I think that’s a good attitude to have, I applaude you.

i’ll stick to the pot holes, tree roots, smashed glass, mud and paths full of small kiddies..it takes me longer to get into the city, but i enjoy the fresh air for longer and my slow but assured safety. I’m a new cyclist and not a very competant one at that, with a rickety old bike that has has its own mind on when it changes gears, so using the roads is just not an option. Why put yourself in possible conflict or worse, danger? Just leave 20mins earlier and enjoy the sunshine.

Thank god for Northbourne Ultimatum – spot on post! You have summed up pretty much everything I was planning to rant about (not so eloquently) on this topic. I have been trying to understand the ongoing rivalry between cyclists and motorists (the majority of the time it’s the motorists). Recently I found out how my father-in-law and brother-in-law REALLY feel about cyclists. It started off with the “ridiculous crap they wear”, then the cursory “they should have to pay for rego, insurance etc”, then ending with the “it’s just they are so arrogant”. This was said in a conversation with them not exactly directing at me, but us all knowing that I am an on-again off-again cycle commuter.

I’ve only recently become a cycle commuter again, and before I started, I never had a problem with cyclists (other than those who decide they should use an entire road lane), but there seems to be quite a lot of people who just don’t like cyclists.

There are people I work with who ride, some of which have the full racing kit, or other like me who wear bike shorts (mainly to protect the grapes) with running shorts over the top, and a t-shirt. I’ve always been a little skeptical and self conscious about cycle outfits – but come next winter I’ll be getting some cycle gear. It’s like riding a motorcycle without leathers. It’s pretty important kit! Purely for comfort (chaffing and crotch) and safety (no gear to get caught in the moving parts). As for the comments made by my family members and plenty more out there on the full racing kit – there are some serous cyclists out there, and while wanting to be properly kitted out, they choose to wear the team colours of their fave team. I’ve never given my brother-in-law s**t for wearing his St. George jersey on the weekends, and when St. George are playing.

My favorite points brought up by Northbourne Ultimatum are around the topic of cyclists using the roads “for free”. If I chose not to have children and my tax money went towards playgrounds and public education I’d NEVER give parents a lecture about it, or want some kind of equalisation. The fact I’m out there getting fit (the primary reason for riding) instead of being a drain on the public health system is not something I want to get even with either. I own a car and pay rego and CTP and licensing, but when I ride, my car sits in the garage. We are so lucky here in Canberra to have such great facilities (yes, some which could do with some improving), but we should just enjoy that we have the options, and we all contribute.

As has been clearly pointed out here, cyclists will always lose in a fight with a car. All the more reason for the respect for cyclists to be reciprocal. If a cyclist ends up under a car, the argument is moot.

To the motorists – please keep an eye out for us on the road. Most of us try and do the right thing. Throwing cups of hot coffee at us and blowing your horn from 2 meters behind while doing 80km/hr shouting at us to “get on the bike path” is just plain ludicrous and dangerous. We don’t ask you to become a cyclist too, just for some mutual respect and safety. Most drivers seem to be able to manage sharing the road without feeling they are going to hit a cyclist on the side of the road. There are however a select group of motorists who clearly do. Perhaps learn a little about commuting by bike – even trying it one day and you’ll see first hand the safety challenges we face every day, and the reasons we don’t use the cycle paths. We have to use the “on-again…off-again” cycle lanes. Trust me, we’d be much happier if we didn’t have to share traffic lanes with cars, but the infrastructure doesn’t seem to be complete yet. When that day comes, then my mind might be closer to considering paying for licensing and rego for cycles.

In the meantime, ask yourself a question as a motorist…have you honestly never EVER broken the speed limit? Have you never EVER cut it close on a red light? Have you never EVER crossed the road on foot without waiting for the little green guy and beeping sound? These are not REAL reasons to dislike cyclists. Try and think deep down why you do, and throw a post on here, because I still can’t work it out for the life of me.

Sorry my post above is in responce to the following

Reply

Reply

Special G: Gotta agree with you – I recently started riding to work, thinking I’d stick to the bike paths wherever possible. Turns out you’re right – they’re absolute rubbish – try riding up the one on the western side of Owen Dixon Drive – broken glass literally every 10m or so. How long do you think a bike tyre is going to last on that? And as for the fully off-road ones, some are great like the one past the AIS along Ginninderra Drive, but some are absolutly awful – if roads were maintained to that standard there’d be an outcry and nobody would drive at all for fear of their car getting shaken to bits.

And for those bashing on about rego (even accepting the fallacy that “rego pays for roads”), I pay both motorbike and car rego – why should I not be allowed to make use of my double share of the road just because both those paid-up vehicles are in my garage? How many cyclists do you think really don’t own at least a car?

I always think it’s quite amusing the numer of people who jump up and down about the ‘perfectly good cycle lanes’ just next to the road. Here’s a couple of reasons why some people – especially racing bikes will avoid them:

1 – they are poorly maintained.
2 – quite often they are the old shoulder of the road and as such a poor surface – rough, potholes etc. A smooth surface makes the world of difference to a cyclist.
3 – cars kick heaps of crap onto the cycle lane – if you don’t believe this take a look after a road has been resurfaced. This also causes increase risk of punctures.
4 – cycle lanes meandering through the bushlands ofter have large bumps from tree roots in them. Not visable as you drive past in your car. These cause whole worlds of grief for the cyclists – especially at night.

Northbournes got it about right there. Think of cyclists not impacting as much on the health system as their contribution to the roads.

It’s probably bad form to disagree with johnboy in my first post, but I want to point out that bike registration in Japan has nothing to do with the harmony between bikes and cars on the roads there. Yes bikes are registered, but it’s a very small sticker and it’s only used to link the bike to the owner when the bike is impounded or found. It’s more like cat or dog registration.

Even if the police did stop you for doing something wrong, nothing would come of it. The police that you see on the streets rarely do anything and most people don’t obey them anyway. They sometimes tell people to stop doubling on a bike, but the second person will jump straight back on as soon as they’re around the corner.

Japan does have relatively low speed limits but it’s irrelevant because everyone speeds, everywhere, all of the time. The equipment they use to check speeds is arcane and can be seen from afar. Parking tickets though, they’re very high tech.

There are two reasons that riding on the road in Japan is safer and more pleasant than in Australia. If there is an accident between a bike and a car, the driver is assumed to be at fault unless they prove otherwise (I’m not suggesting this is a good idea). More importantly though, everyone in Japan is a cyclist first, then a car driver. They know what it is like to ride a bike so they respect cyclists and treat them the way they would like to be treated.

—

To the OP,

There’s nothing wrong with Lycra, wear it proudly.

Don’t ride too fast on footpaths, there are too many pedestrians and they are unpredictable (especially kids). Also, use a bell.

When you’re on the road obey all the road rules – ride like you drove in your driving test. Also ride like your invisible because most drivers won’t see you anyway. Always wave if someone does give way to you.

—

I can’t believe I’m getting involved in a cyclists-registration discussion.

Registration for the purpose of law enforcement will achieve nothing. If you think that registration will help catch those pesky cyclists who break the road rules, just try and use a cars rego to report it doing the same. Even if you have lots of witnesses, nothing will be done. Sure a couple of cyclists might get caught on camera running a red light or the number plate might be recorded by a police officer on foot but not nearly enough to justify the cost of the system. There is absolutely nothing stopping police catching more law breaking cyclists today, except that they have other priorities.

The standard of registration fees has already been defined by existing system, trucks pay more than cars, cars pay more than motorbikes, ‘green’ cars pay less than big cars. So the cost to register a bicycle must be very close to zero. Regardless of that, some say they need to be charged something for all that road used as bike lanes though. Some arbitrary figure will have to do, it would need to be enough to cover the administration and policing of registrations. Then it would have to only apply to those that really used the road, but what if they’re just crossing the road. Good luck with that.

On-road bike facilities are just another thing that the democratically elected government has decided it is worth spending tax money on. Lots of people don’t use playgrounds, haven’t had to call the fire brigade, don’t go to hospital, don’t live in public housing, don’t use the schools and so on – they don’t claim they shouldn’t have to pay taxes to fund these things. It’s not like the car registrations and fuel excise even come close to covering the costs of the roads anyway. How many cyclists do you hear complaining about cars tearing up the roads that their tax money goes towards building.

Compulsory third party insurance for cyclists would be to cover injury or death caused by a cyclists. Cyclists rarely cause accidents and when they do the accidents usually don’t cause death or serious injury (to others). To highlight how rare it is, think about how much news time it gets when it does happen. Given the rarity of accidents and the cost when they do happen the per-person cost of insurance would be low. As with the registration, the cost of administering the system would be higher so it will continue to only be an optional thing that cyclists receive with club memberships.

Cyclists don’t pay registration and they never will. Waistlines, traffic congestion and petrol prices are increasing and the government is trying to encourage cycling not discourage it with registration fees.

Aeek said :

Cycle lanes are for cars, they move cyclists out of the lane, out of the way.

A fair rego cost for a bicycle, given the relative impact, would be less than the cost of administering it.

A consequence of my riding on the road is that when I drive, I see bikes, even motorcycles.

I have to pay registration for a car and a motorcycle, even though I can only use one at a time – so given that “relative impact” I shouldn’t have to pay registration for my motorcycle at all.

Basically I don’t give a toss if it’s a fair cost for a cyclist, you use a vehicle on the road, you should have to pay for registration and CTP Insurance, same as everyone else.

Cycle lanes are for motor bikes trying to turn left at the next intersection unless some twat cage occupant decides to stop their car in the lane.

Cycle lanes are for cars, they move cyclists out of the lane, out of the way.

A fair rego cost for a bicycle, given the relative impact, would be less than the cost of administering it.

A consequence of my riding on the road is that when I drive, I see bikes, even motorcycles.

kean van choc said :

If you want to go down this path of registration of bikes (and maybe you should sit back for a minute and actually think why cars are required to be registered in the first place) then those that pay rego and licence fees for cars and also cycle to work should receive a rebate due to the fact that they pay the same amount as other drivers but contribute far lees wear and tear to the roads than those that drive…

No worries, and while you are handing out fantasy rebates, please pass one my way and to the way of any other motorcyclist who pays license and registration fees for both a car and motorcycle.

I hardly think it is unreasonable for road using cyclists to pay registration fees, especially seeing as they are being catered for on our roads (by way of Cycle Lanes and Green Zones)

As has been mentioned in all the other posts, car rego doesn’t actually cover the cost of roads. The funding also comes from other taxes – including the gst you pay when you buy a new bike.

If you want to go down this path of registration of bikes (and maybe you should sit back for a minute and actually think why cars are required to be registered in the first place) then those that pay rego and licence fees for cars and also cycle to work should receive a rebate due to the fact that they pay the same amount as other drivers but contribute far lees wear and tear to the roads than those that drive…

Genie said :

I am frustrated when I have to slam my foot on the breaks to avoid hitting a cyclist on the STUPID green lanes. These are all located on slip lanes designed to NOT slow the traffic down when someone is exiting but I am seen too many near misses and find them dangerous !

Why don’t you just learn how to drive.

I love the green lanes, I position myself far right so its obvious early that I’m not turning left AND let cars exit on my left as soon as possible. Rarely had a problem.
Usually its a small car that can somehow not pass me whereas trucks have no problem.

I agree that all road users should pay their way, no subsidies whatsoever. Now let me think a moment… third party of a few thousand each year, full cost recovery for roads and associated public servants, a proper road rescue fee and full green house damage costs.

Bravo for those of you who wanna do the healthy cheaper option of riding a bike….

HOWEVER – I agree with harvyk !
It shits me that cyclists will regularly be riding on a road, when only a few metres away there is a perfectly good foot/bikepath.
I am frustrated when I have to slam my foot on the breaks to avoid hitting a cyclist on the STUPID green lanes. These are all located on slip lanes designed to NOT slow the traffic down when someone is exiting but I am seen too many near misses and find them dangerous !

I also believe that regular cyclists should have to pay some sort of rego… A road user fee. We have to pay the Government money to use our car on their roads, to MAINTAIN and UPGRADE our roads, plus there is also the emergency service fee. Currently all the money we pay to UPGRADE the roads is in my opinion WASTED by putting useless bikelanes on the roads that only about 50% of cyclists actually use ! YES ALL OF US ARROGANT PEOPLE WHO YOU WHINGE ABOUT COZ WE DRIVE A CAR… WE HELPED PAY FOR SOMETHING WE DON’T USE – BUT YOU GET TO USE IT FOR FREE !

All forms of transport on our public roads should have to pay rego..

New Yeah said :

Please don’t wear lycra – wack behaviour by anyone unless you get paid to ride.

Not at all:

1. It doesn’t chafe,

2. It doesn’t catch on bits of the bike, particularly when mounting and dismounting,

3. The crotch doesn’t wear out (like cotton shorts or trousers when riding a bike in them regularly),

4. The tops of the thighs don’t rot from UV exposure (like cotton shorts or trousers when riding a bike in them regularly), and

5. It feels slinky 😀

Loosen up New Yeah, you might enjoy it ;~)

So let me get this straight, cyclists don’t like using the Bike Paths because it isn’t fast for them, so they use the road which usually means they end up slowing up cars. Sweet!

LlamaFrog said :

cyclists should only be on the road I was under the impression it was against the law to ride on the footpath?

err no. Keeping in mind bike paths are footpaths too, they’re only supposed to disembark in high pedestrian areas.. i.e. near shops, oh and crossing the road. Never applies to them anyway.

“In Canberra we have an excellent collection of cycle paths. Some of them take the scenic route which as a cyclist I can understand you not wanting to take, but when a cycle path is running parallel with the road why don’t you guys use it, it’s the reason it’s there, and it’s the sensible thing to do.”

It depends if you mean the paths that form part of the actual road and have their own little lane or if you are referring to footpath/cyclepaths a short distance from the road that do run parallel for brief periods.

If it’s the former then I don’t know of any cyclist that does not/would not use it but if it’s the latter then there are many good reasons why not. The main reason being its a lot slower as it’s often goes the scenic route. Not all mind you, the path around Lake Burley Griffin is brilliant. But it would be like asking car drivers to go to work via residential streets rather then main arterial roads. Most of the time it would be a lot slower and more annoying. The same applies to commuter cyclists, they just want to get to their destination as quickly as possible.

“Finally Bike vs Car, Car will win every time without fail.”

Exactly! Hence why cyclists must feel very passionately and practically why they think its worth the risk of using the road. Also why a bit more latitude and respect should be given to them as they are risking their lives against all the non-attentive drivers out there. The hatred aimed at them by the average car driver is quite mystifying.

As I’ve mentioned in the other weekly posts about cyclists on the road, a good cyclist travels along at about 30 to 40 km/h. On the way to work the bike path is full of kids riding to school.

Cyclist at 40km/h meets 5 year old kid on bike riding along in their own world = mess.

I think most very good cyclists would prefer to take the risk amongst the traffic rather than have to live with having wiped out a toddler on a bike path.

Also, for those bike paths next to the road, it takes a fair bit of momentum to get up to a good speed on a bike. Who want’s to stop their bike to climb over a gutter, then start. Bike paths also have plenty of twists and turns which isn’t good for keeping a constant speed – good fun for a mountain bike, but not a racing bike.

For those with the cable ties – I think the magpies have stopped swooping. It’s time to take them off!!

Sometimes, I ride on both – what happens then?

If you are sensible enough to use a vehicle that allows you to travel on footpaths, bike paths AND on the road then do what I do – enjoy the freedom and do your best not to agitate car drivers (don’t run red lights, give cars plenty of space, be ready to flash a smile etc).

Dopey car drivers are always going to chuck a wobbly about the versatility afforded to bike riders. But really, the all-round convenience of driving a car in Canberra renders their arguments null. In Canberra, the car remains king and car drivers ultimately get to most places faster than others will.

Please don’t wear lycra – wack behaviour by anyone unless you get paid to ride. And cable ties should only be used for dodgy household repairs.

Pontius Pilate said :

This is an issue that will never be settled on this or any other forum.

I think Shinyflu summed it beautifully, just deal with it people. If Harvyk1 is infuriated caused he gets delayed by 5 seconds on his way to work occasionally, he really needs to gain some true perspective in life.

As for the original posting, ride where you feel comfortable and wear what you like to wear. Just don’t go for the silly spikes out of the bike helmet cause they are plain embarrassing and unnecessary IMO.

I don’t get infuriated because of the lost 5 seconds (I couldn’t care less about that). I get infuriated at cyclists whom take pride in getting in the way of cars. Now natural selection says that these guys won’t survive for long, however in an accident it will be considered my fault as a car driver (no matter what the circumstance), and if I am lucky to manage to get the blame put onto the cyclist, well not a lot of good that will do me, as they are uninsured.

In Canberra we have an excellent collection of cycle paths. Some of them take the scenic route which as a cyclist I can understand you not wanting to take, but when a cycle path is running parallel with the road why don’t you guys use it, it’s the reason it’s there, and it’s the sensible thing to do. Some basic facts for you – Car = over a tonne of metal surrounding the driver. Bike = a light weight metal frame that will do nothing to protect you in a crash, Car = drives really fast, a bike rider going flat out can just about do speeds which are considered slow in a car. Bike = really slow, thus are an obstacle on anything but the slowest of traffic jams. Finally Bike vs Car, Car will win every time without fail.

taco said :

Holden Caulfield said :

When stopped a set of lights, have you never seen a cyclist come up the inside lane and through a red light. If a motorist has had the gall to park too close to the kerb, thereby blocking Lance Armstrong’s pathway, I’ve seen a cyclist or two deliver a few choice words.

A cyclist overtaking a stationary car at traffic lights on the left is legal the last time I read the section of the road rule handbook that deals with cyclists.
I also think it’s much better to get to the front when you can be seen much easier…

a) I didn’t say it was illegal, just as it is legal for motorcyclists to lane split so long as the traffic is stationary (IIRC).
b) I agree with you.
c) You missed my point.

Holden Caulfield said :

When stopped a set of lights, have you never seen a cyclist come up the inside lane and through a red light. If a motorist has had the gall to park too close to the kerb, thereby blocking Lance Armstrong’s pathway, I’ve seen a cyclist or two deliver a few choice words.

A cyclist overtaking a stationary car at traffic lights on the left is legal the last time I read the section of the road rule handbook that deals with cyclists.
I also think it’s much better to get to the front when you can be seen much easier.

Like the OP I also switch between on-road commuter and footpath pram dodger – my morning commute from Belconnen town center to Civic goes on-road (no cycle lane) for ~1km, on-road cycle lane for ~2.5km, off-road cycle path for ~500m, back onto the on-road cycle lane for ~3km, onto side streets without cycle lanes for ~1km and then footpath for the last ~1km

I’ve picked what I feel is the best balance of safety vs. speed for me – I can do virtually the whole trip on an off-road cycle path, but it’s much slower, longer & hillier (I’ll do it during the warmer months on the way home when I don’t mind the extra time)

Pontius Pilate said :

Just don’t go for the silly spikes out of the bike helmet cause they are plain embarrassing and unnecessary IMO.

I can understand the utility of the silly cable-tie spikes of the helmet during the magpie swooping season (though I’ve never been bothered to do it myself), but I don’t understand why people leave them on all year round

Pandy – I was going upload an image of Sarah Palin – the ultimate MILF for the neo-con age, but couldn’t bring myself to do it. And I can’t think of a Canberran or Australian equivalent. Probably someone in the Greens.

Those posting about demerit points above might be interested to know that traffic offences committed on a bike (or horse, or just walking) will all earn you demerits on your driving license.

LlamaFrog said :

cyclists should only be on the road I was under the impression it was against the law to ride on the footpath?

It’s legal in the ACT.

Pontius Pilate said :

Just don’t go for the silly spikes out of the bike helmet cause they are plain embarrassing and unnecessary IMO.

More embarrassing than lycra pants?

This is an issue that will never be settled on this or any other forum.

I think Shinyflu summed it beautifully, just deal with it people. If Harvyk1 is infuriated caused he gets delayed by 5 seconds on his way to work occasionally, he really needs to gain some true perspective in life.

As for the original posting, ride where you feel comfortable and wear what you like to wear. Just don’t go for the silly spikes out of the bike helmet cause they are plain embarrassing and unnecessary IMO.

Lenient said :

Also bikes would be able to overtake cars and swear at the drivers about obstructing traffic.

They do that already!

When stopped a set of lights, have you never seen a cyclist come up the inside lane and through a red light. If a motorist has had the gall to park too close to the kerb, thereby blocking Lance Armstrong’s pathway, I’ve seen a cyclist or two deliver a few choice words.

That said, I’m happy to deal with it as per shiny flu’s advice. Really.

If a pro-cyclist wants to tell us all how many crap drivers there are out there–and I don’t dispute that for a second–and then still choose to share the road, with all the laws of physics against them, well, who am I to argue. Good luck to them.

I’ll keep out of your way, if you keep out of mine.

most (if not all) suburban speed limits could go down to 40km/h add that would add only seconds to travel time, providing the current 60km/h suburban streets were retained. After all once off a 60km/h street you are only a couple of hundred metres away from you destination.

Also bikes would be able to overtake cars and swear at the drivers about obstructing traffic.

In Japan bikes are registered, system works pretty well there.

Then again in urban areas the speed limits are rarely above 40kmph, who wants a slice of that?

All my fanatasies: shattered, sigh

Not really, I just like the acronym!

Rosebud is a MILF? Which is your picture?

cyclists should only be on the road I was under the impression it was against the law to ride on the footpath?

Does wearing loud lycra pants and riding on the road make you a commuter and therefore under the rules of the road? Does pretending to be a MILF (and who can tell under helmet and large dark glasses) and setting a cracking pace of slow on the footpath, absolve you?

It might you honked on Commonwealth Bridge… 🙂

I think cyclists should be able to use the road, as long as they are registered and licensed to do so, are subject to the same demerit system as drivers / motorcyclists, and have compulsory 3rd party insurance for their “vehicle”.

Soley directed at harvyk1.

People in cars, people in trucks, people in busses, people in stupid half-car-half-4WD’s, people on motorbikes, people on bicycles, people walking… do you know what it is… it’s a god damn mode of transport. Each has its own pro’s and con’s, each with its own problems and idiots in each group.

Bicycle commuters come in all shapes, sizes, colours and levels of intelligence. Car drivers get a license as easy as well, bluffing your way through one driving test and thereafter have the ability to kill anyone with a tonne of oil and metal (some like to mix that with alcohol), but also have the ability to be courteous and drive responsibly. It’s not like the NRMA or ‘Canberra Motorist Party’ actually represent every single motorist in the same way Pedal Power don’t represent every commuter and the same way that the Pro-Pedestrian group can’t account for public servants jay-walking in Civic every Friday lunchtime.

Here’s an idea- Deal with it.

Here we go again!!

That is an angle I had never thought of! Thanks!

Don’t get me started on “commuter” cyclists who decide that riding on the road is a perfectly good thing to do. I’ve lost count of the number of times I’ve had to slow down to 20km/h so I didn’t knock one of these guys off their bikes, what’s even more annoying is when there is a perfectly good cycle path not less than 2 meters over running along side the road.

Also I know of a few times that “commuter” cyclists have taken pride in breaking laws (such as speeding in a school zone) to the point that they have framed their fines. Also forget about red lights.

I’d like to see a commuter cyclist license, so that like every other road user, if you wish to use the road, you need a license, and compulsorily insurance. Break the law and you earn demerit points. Gain to many points and you loss your rights to ride on the road.

But it would never happen, there are too many cyclist groups that would do anything to stop such a thing happening, even if it would save their members lives.