Snowtown to beat DFO by default?

Justin @42. Thanks for giving me a belly larf!

The Snowtown vault?

If we can’t have a fully blown IKEA then perhaps they can just give us the bookshelf department. Given high average incomes and the best educated population in the land you’d think there would be quite a market here for decent bookshelves (something between the crap at the low end with shelves that sag and the high cost bespoke units).

Eyeball In A Quart Jar Of Snot said :

Russ said :

With regard to Ikea, the rumour I’ve heard is that they require a catchment of 3 million people to establish a store.

We could be waiting a while…

I believe that the number is 2 million and applies to American cities.

I doubt Canberra will see an Ikea any time soon because of its small size and the Sydney store only 3 hours drive away.

Surely they should base such a decision on net disposable income? If that was the case, Canberra could probably sustain one.

Re Snowtown et al, DFO were way ahead of the brandypot, but Snowown Inc held them up with pointless legalese, which was overturned and DFO were allowed to proceed (albeit with many of the original retailers pulling out due to the delays). In the meantime, the brandypot opened and has malingered ever since. I believe that they had hoped that by holding up DFO, they would pick up the retailers that had put their hands up for the DFO.

There’s also sizable discomfort with Snowtown’s disrespect for the Pialligo precinct, what with building right up to the roadside so that it could only be Pialligo that lost out when any actual planning for expansion near the airport was undertaken.

So I guess lots of disquiet over many years at the inconvenience of everyone but Snowtown Inc.

Pandy said :

IKEA Adelaide: population 1.3million

And?

The numbers mentioned above do not apply to Australia but there is still a minimum population requirement needed for Ikea to set up shop.

Obviously this number differs between countries.

Canberra is too small, and too close to Sydney for those Swedes to start thinking about y’all.

deejay- the divided opinions regarding Mr Snow relate to the selling -off of public airport facilities by the Howard Government in the late 1990s. As Commonwealth land, these sites were not subject to state and council land planning laws, ie developers wanting to build on the airport site could pretty much avoid having to go through local and state approval processes. This made them very attractive development propositions, as well as handing over the opportunity for private exploitation of public monopolies- like airport parking and user fees for aircraft. This was ideologically driven by Liberal Ministers Peter Reith and John Fahey. Public monopolies may have issues from an economic efficiency viewpoint, but private monopolies are far worse- and that’s what the Howard Government gave us.

Normally (as I recall), a developer wanting to build office accommodation in the ACT would have had to go through ACT Government approvals, which would have required compliance with Territory Plans etc, meaning that the offices would have been built near town centres, ie, where the people, transport routes and other facilities are. Instead, we now have a sizable chunk of the ACT’s office accommodation that is very inefficiently located.

Numbers of ACT residents see this as a case of the public losing out badly on the disposal of a major public asset (not to mention being inflicted with an architectural blight on the landscape), and are unlikely to shed tears on Mr Snow’s behalf should he encounter financial difficulties.

Tooks said :

Pandy said :

IKEA Adelaide: population 1.3million

How do they fit so many in one store?

Flatpacks

Pandy said :

IKEA Adelaide: population 1.3million

How do they fit so many in one store?

Oh yes this is the guvmnt that says tough, we will build 10 story apartment blocks next door to you and call 500sq metre blocks of land large.

deejay said :

As someone who has only lived in Canberra and surrounds for three years, can someone please explain to me the Terry Snow hate? To me, he looks like someone who actually believes in Canberra and pumps a hell of a lot of his own money into building the region (although I’m not a fan of Brand Depot). Is it just tall poppy syndrome or is there a real reason for it?

There’s thems in Canberra that has to play by the local guvmnt and National Capital Authority rules, and then there’s Terry Snow. The blame should and does sit with the federal guvmnt halfwits who decided that planning inside airports is a solely federal guvmnt matter, however the Capital Airport Group hasn’t endeared themselves to the locals by utilising the freedoms to the maximum.

IKEA Adelaide: population 1.3million

Media reports say “Australian Competition and Consumer Commission (ACCC) chairman Graeme Samuel stands to lose more than $50 million if shopping centre owner Direct Factory Outlets (DFO) fails”

The cat did it said :

I should have added that the problem seems due to Austexx’s (parent of DFO) exposure to the disastrous $1 bn South Wharf project in Melbourne. DFO Canberra may well be trading comfortably. Could be an attractive target for Westfield, subject to any competition laws.

Of course Graeme Samuel is the man who administers the “competition laws” including selling off monopolies.

A few ad-hoc points.

Can’t say I’ve ever bought anything that I actually *needed* from DFO.

DFO needs a free kids playground, not Monkey Mania which is run by kids and costs an arm and a leg to enter.

Why are new shops popping up around the Dick Smith corridor? Why would you bother opening?

My daughter loves DFO. Great place to run around and get tired so mum can get an early night.

😉

As someone who has only lived in Canberra and surrounds for three years, can someone please explain to me the Terry Snow hate? To me, he looks like someone who actually believes in Canberra and pumps a hell of a lot of his own money into building the region (although I’m not a fan of Brand Depot). Is it just tall poppy syndrome or is there a real reason for it?

as per russ’ comments, ikea requires a bigger population

Russ said :

With regard to Ikea, the rumour I’ve heard is that they require a catchment of 3 million people to establish a store.

We could be waiting a while…

I believe that the number is 2 million and applies to American cities.

I doubt Canberra will see an Ikea any time soon because of its small size and the Sydney store only 3 hours drive away.

Canberra isn’t large enough to host an IKEA, and assuming no change in corporate policy it won’t be for decades.

The new Belconnen development contains an Aldi, Target, specialty stores, a bus stop and more carparking.

John Moulis said :

…..PS – As far as IKEA is concerned, the hot rumour is that they’ll be opening in the new section of Westfield Belconnen. There is a large two storey area there and Westfield says that it will be occupied by “an exciting homeware chain new to the Canberra region”.

Russ’ (#30) comment about Ikea requiring a 3 million population catchment is probably right, given the location and number of their stores elsewhere in Australia. The Westfield Belconnen store is more likely to be one of the new Woolworths hardware chain.

With regard to Ikea, the rumour I’ve heard is that they require a catchment of 3 million people to establish a store.

We could be waiting a while…

I’d like to broaden the topic by saying that this trend of retail outlets closing down does not appear to be isolated to DFO or Brand Depot.

Working in Civic, I can’t but help see a lot of outlets closing in the City Walk area, and the “For Lease” sign displayed on the glass windows of those husks. It appears that the Canberra Centre is doing fine (no empty shops), but just outside there are quite a number of them.

Former DSE, and JB-HiFi in the Interchange, BOSE at the corner of Nthbourne Ave and Bunda St, Duty Free shop (now filled by CASA I think?), former MediBank Private on Akuna St and the camera shop (bottom of CCH building), former Barbars opposite to the casino and Tandy’s several doors down. Star Bucks near the merry-go-round, and the music shop next door. Godori, opposite to David Jones, is still empty.

I remember reading a local newspaper where shop owners voiced their concerns that Canberra, even in the CBD such as Civic, still appears not to have the critical mass to make doing business comfortable for retailers, and are waiting in anticipation for further high-density residential development to realise Burley Griffin’s original plan (which is to fill in the inside of London Cct with office/residential buildings).

One might say Canberra (at least on the north side) is still a country town with the locals expecting urban life-style.

toadstool said :

I noticed that a new Rivers is opening at that new centre across the road from the Good Guys carpark in Tuggeranong. Does anyone know if it’s an outlet store or retail concept store? What will happen to the one inside the Hyperdome?

The Rivers website has it down as a clearance superstore – no mention of the fate of the Hyperdome shop.

John Moulis said :

PS – As far as IKEA is concerned, the hot rumour is that they’ll be opening in the new section of Westfield Belconnen. There is a large two storey area there and Westfield says that it will be occupied by “an exciting homeware chain new to the Canberra region”.

Fingers crossed! I would sacrifice DFO for Ikea.

H1NG0 said :

Bronto said :

Surprise, surprise. If you ask me, both DFO and Brand Depot are rubbish. I have found much better clothes and bargains in europe and Asia.

It is comments like this that you have to wonder if Canberra deserves to have the selection of shopping centres it currently has.

Well it’s not my fault europe and asia have a better selection of clothes and better deals. It’s a fact and I’m sure season travellers will tend to agree with me. It’s about quality, not quantity and there are way too many cheap discount shops that go nowhere and are all the same clothing from one store to another – at least have a few shops that are unique and valuable for money.

Perhaps if you went overseas before commenting on my comment, you’d understand what I’m trying to say.

Gungahlin Al said :

The cat did it said :

Selling off natural monopolies like airports – another piece of short-term opportunism with costly long-term ramifications that we can thank John Howard for.

Dead right! For businesses around Canberra, and for town centres like Gungahlin, Woden Belco and Tuggers. Every non-airport related job in Snow Town is a job that should have been located in one of our satellite cities if not for the woeful contracts gifted to airport buyers by Howard’s mob (inc Tony Abbott).

The existence of offices and retail outlets at the airport really is quite tragic for the urban planning and sustainability of this city.

It will be a pity if DFO closes. I really like it – good quality goods at cheap prices. Also it supports community causes as evidenced by the firies selling calendars and the Vietnam Veterans MC being given space to conduct raffles. Brand Depot is OK if you’re after sporting goods and clothing – Paul’s Warehouse has four stores there. Nothing much else of interest though. Hopefully DFO will be snapped up by an astute buyer and we’ll continue to have access to this great facility.
PS – As far as IKEA is concerned, the hot rumour is that they’ll be opening in the new section of Westfield Belconnen. There is a large two storey area there and Westfield says that it will be occupied by “an exciting homeware chain new to the Canberra region”.

grunge_hippy said :

What I want to know is, where will the kiddies get their smiggle fix from if DFO shuts????!?!

Don’t they have a store in the Ainslie Ave section of the Canberra Centre?

Bronto said :

Surprise, surprise. If you ask me, both DFO and Brand Depot are rubbish. I have found much better clothes and bargains in europe and Asia.

It is comments like this that you have to wonder if Canberra deserves to have the selection of shopping centres it currently has.

Evey major low to mid-range clothes retailer in the country should be concerned because Inditex is coming soon – owner of Zara, Massimo Dutti, Stradivarius, etc…

If you want discount clothes shopping do it overseas. Now if we could only get Uniqlo for T-shirts.

An article in today’s Australian (sorry no link)suggested that the troubles were associated with the poor performance of four DFO outlets – the Canberra one being amongst those and that the debt on these four stores was guaranteed against the highly lucrative other locations and that the gearing was so high the collapse of one would precipitate the fall of all of them.

I’m with Bronto on the point of there being far superior discount shopping abroad. Whenever travels take me to New York, I make the trip out to Woodbury Common – An afternoon spent there generally means I don’t have to set foot in a clothes or shoe shop for a couple of years.

Bronto said :

Surprise, surprise. If you ask me, both DFO and Brand Depot are rubbish. I have found much better clothes and bargains in europe and Asia. We must get the left over rubbish clothing in this country and it’s mainly for teenagers.

Replace it with a fantastic, quality store like Ikea that Canberran’s desperately want here instead of driving to Sydney.

Yea because people can just pop off to Europe for a saturday shopping trip 😐

+2 for IKEA.

I noticed that a new Rivers is opening at that new centre across the road from the Good Guys carpark in Tuggeranong. Does anyone know if it’s an outlet store or retail concept store? What will happen to the one inside the Hyperdome?

goose said :

I agree with Bronto. Bring IKEA to Canberra.

Until Ikea comes physically to Canberra, you might want to try this:

http://www.bringithome.com.au/site/aboutus.php

The cat did it said :

Selling off natural monopolies like airports – another piece of short-term opportunism with costly long-term ramifications that we can thank John Howard for.

Dead right! For businesses around Canberra, and for town centres like Gungahlin, Woden Belco and Tuggers. Every non-airport related job in Snow Town is a job that should have been located in one of our satellite cities if not for the woeful contracts gifted to airport buyers by Howard’s mob (inc Tony Abbott).

I agree with Bronto. Bring IKEA to Canberra.

Bronto said :

Surprise, surprise. If you ask me, both DFO and Brand Depot are rubbish. I have found much better clothes and bargains in europe and Asia…

I’m sure that’s a big help to the local community, haha.

I don’t mind DFO, it’s not perfect by any means, but I’ve managed to find some good stuff there at various times since it opened.

Surprise, surprise. If you ask me, both DFO and Brand Depot are rubbish. I have found much better clothes and bargains in europe and Asia. We must get the left over rubbish clothing in this country and it’s mainly for teenagers.

Replace it with a fantastic, quality store like Ikea that Canberran’s desperately want here instead of driving to Sydney.

I should have added that the problem seems due to Austexx’s (parent of DFO) exposure to the disastrous $1 bn South Wharf project in Melbourne. DFO Canberra may well be trading comfortably. Could be an attractive target for Westfield, subject to any competition laws.

As troll-sniffer says, it’s more likely that someone would purchase the assets for a more reasonable price. At least DFO has customers in it; must be a lonely job being a ‘sales consultant’ at Brand Depot.

The Brand Depot building is actually constructed as a an airfreight terminal. The miserable retail tenants are only there until Mr Snow finds an airfreight deal that pays better than they do (round-the-clock flights anyone?).

Selling off natural monopolies like airports- another piece of short-term opportunism with costly long-term ramifications that we can thank John Howard for.

Would take a LOT more that this to turn a corner for Bland Depot. Even Defence moving 1500 people into the empty buildings won’t really change things.

where will I get my Rivers specials?

“the two sweetest words in the english language: de-fault! de-fault! de-fault!”

Like most shopping centres, there’s a few shops that have what I want for not much $$, and a lot of places I just walk right past. Overall, it would be better if it had a free kids playground like Brand Depot.

brand depot is surely headed for the same fate? I used to go there twice a week for fitmums (the only business thriving there, along with lollipops after!) and it is like a ghost town. the foot court gets a few regulars from airport workers but thats about it.

What I want to know is, where will the kiddies get their smiggle fix from if DFO shuts????!?!

Does anyone remember the Brand Depot ads (brand deppo, Brand DeppOoOo) where they had people holding up their designer goods stating “I got this for $20, normally I’d pay $50,000” or something like that? I always had a chuckle because if you look in the background at the masses of other shoppers you might actually see two, maybe three people!!

The place is a tomb.

Or a win for the 15 year olds who are the only ones to shop in that place!!

A win for Brand Depot is a win for no one with any sense of fashion

Lets hope Troll-sniffer. Snowtown is woeful by comparison.

Possible that Terry would benefit but it’s more likely that someone else will step up to the plate and pick up the assets at a more sustainable price. I doubt there will be much disruption to the DFO trading environment that Joe Public will see.