Investigating car break-ins

The doughnuts thing was a bit of a cheap shot. That kind of stereotype greatly reduces your argument.

There is an impression, though, that the Police are getting less appreciative of cases that aren’t already open-and-shut by the time they arrive on the scene.

Now, yes, it’s quite probable that a number of cases aren’t going to get convictions. But surely the Fear Factor of having the cops show up on your front door hasn’t disappeared so much that showing up is a useless activity?

Or are people really that laissez-faire about the cops these days?

they can also chat on their mobile and eat their donuts whie driving.

“An interesting thing happened on the way home yesterday.

I was following one a silver pursuit Police vehicle, and I couldn’t keep up with it legally on the Parkway..

But then I thought, hey maybe hi speedo is more accurate than mine and just kept the same speed as him.. “

Have a squizz at section 305 of the Australian Road Rules. The Police car is doing noting wrong. They are exempt

Nyssa

The cops apprhended your offenders. If they were juveniles then there are very strict criteria for keeping them in custody. In what you’ve said the offences wouldn’t justify that.

They went tou Court and got a wrist slap, how is that the Police’s fault? From what I gather they apprehended and prosecuted the offenders.

What you have explained doesnt justify in any way shape or form having a go at the Police. What sentence they did or didn’t get, as well as any possible compensation, is entirely the decision of the Courts

Next time I catch someone playing with my car with malicious intent – they will feel the wrath of all those who went before them – mark my words – i will be the one going to court – and I am sure that the police “Statistics” I have provided over the years will justify my means

If my kids ever did that I’d be the first to let the victims kick their arse.

When my car was broken into, hubby caught the kid. His friends then rammed our neighbours car into their garage.

Cops took the kids, then let them go and then had to “chase” them up again.

Went to court. Kids got a slap on the wrist. We were out of pocket some $400 – glass was smashed into our daughter’s capsule – and our neighbour had over $10,000 damage as the foundation had been damaged.

Kids were 17yo out drinking on a school night. Blood on the scene – kid tried to break our car’s lock with a pair of scissors, hubby ID’d him and NOTHING.

Gotta love the cops.

Anyone who gets caught speeding by those big ass ‘IM A SPEED CAMERA VAN’ are just morons. If you can’t see them a mile away, you probably shouldnt have your license to start with, hehe.

Chris S is spot-on. Drivers here are amazingly poor at piloting their cars, but they don’t realise how poor they are. And no one’s telling them. Provided they don’t get a speeding ticket, they are a good driver, it seems. Ha.

And don’t get me started on how you qualify for a licence. So you can do three sorts of reverse park, woo hoo. Can’t determine safe speed, can’t do anything when the car loses traction other than press the brakes harder, can’t read the traffic… it’s pathetic.

I’d love to see people driving like plonkers targetted by the police and vigourously prosecuted…but I’d also like to see speed vans given carte blanche to park on any road.

You’re right that a focus on speeding is not the only answer; but it’s still part of the answer. Whining that speed camera fines are “revenue raising” cuts no ice.

Chris S is right on the money here – focus on speeding gives the impression that having no idea (just slowly) is all ok. Every day I see people exhibiting the behaviours Chris S describes. But don’t worry, we’re all completely safe, after all “speeding is for wankers”. I look forward to the day when cops start handing out tickets that say ‘failure to use left lane’, ‘failure to indicate’, and ‘failure to adequately control vehicle’. The people will have to start using the brains instead of simply staring at the speedo…

An interesting thing happened on the way home yesterday.

I was following one a silver pursuit Police vehicle, and I couldn’t keep up with it legally on the Parkway..

But then I thought, hey maybe hi speedo is more accurate than mine and just kept the same speed as him..

One of the main problems is, as has been noted elsewhere, that enforcement action in the ACT (and many other jurisdictions) is focussed on just one thing, which is speeding.

When such a strategy occurs over a long time, it changes driver behaviour and attitudes. In the ACT, the very clear message, received loud and clear by many motorists, is that as long as you don’t speed, then your driving behaviour is acceptable.

Effectively, by sending this message, they have ended up with exactly the opposite effect of what was intended. Inattention, poor roadcraft, bad attitudes, inability to indicate, dangerous lane changing, inability to safely and properly get around roundabouts, etc are leading to the higher road toll. At the same time, people’s attention is distracted by constantly checking their speedo, always looking for the white vans, and ignoring all the other traffic rules with the exception of speeding.

It’s not as if the authorities are unaware of their stupidity – it’s been pointed out to them enough times. It’s just that sticking in a speed camera is so easy, and the rhetoric of road safety is again repeated, but of course the end result is more fatalities, and a permanent change for the worse in driver performance.

How stupid are our traffic enforcement authorities? So stupid that they are prepared to continue sacrificing good road safety and gain revenue instead!

Policing can be revenue neutral if we’re willing to have zero tolerance and the river of fines it produces.

But I’m not so sure we actually want that….

We’re getting the policing we’re prepared to pay for. Speed cameras are cheap, fairly unambiguous (no value judgements required for how fast someone was going), and make the government money.

Alternative systems judging whether people are driving appropriately to the conditions are ambiguous, expensive and cost the government money.

Take a wild guess why speed cameras are popular with governments.

Hey – you don’t need to convince me that motorbike riders are their own worst enemies. It’s not just because they’re soft, squishy and easily broken that motorbike riders have 30 times the fatality rate of car drivers.

On the remote roads of the NT, it’s probably not as big a risk to remove speed limits. It’s not like there’s much traffic. However, I think it’s fair to bear in mind that pretty much every crash out there is a fatal crash (and not just because of the remoteness)

Crap driving (tailgating, not indicating, talking on your mobile while driving etc) contributes to the road toll. I find it equally as enfuriating as speeding. No disagreement to the fact that it’s massively underpoliced. However, I find your willingness to chalk the road toll up to everything but speeding disturbing.

We need to create a culture of responsible driving – and I think speed cameras can be part of that. Yes, they are revenue raisers; but I’d say it’s a tax on stupidity.

I hear people say “Well, the speed limit’s 80, but they allow you 10%, and I was only doing 90. It’s just revenue raising”. Uh-huh. You were exceeding the speed limit, jackass. The limit is 80. Your top speed shouldn’t be 88. It should be fucking 80, and that 10% should allow for inaccuracies in your speedo, which is what it’s supposed to be for.

No, speed cameras are not the answer in and of themselves. Road safety is probably the best example I can think of of people in power always seeking a panacea, without taking a holistic approach to solving a problem.

All the people, all the time, need to know their limits and drive within them all the time before we start toying with the idea of doing away with speed limits. Until then, you’ll just have to stick to the speed limit like the rest of us slobs, bonfire.

I have a car that has tyres that are $350 a pop. I dont feel the need to speed and I’m damn sure the driving courses I’ve done are more advanced than anyone else’s here.

Speeding is for wankers, full stop

nt has a low road toll because it doesn’t have masses of population.. and everyone is too pissed to drive anyway…

oh btw mr shab, when driving to darwin from alice and back at speeds above 160, the ONLY vehicles that ever overtook me were motorbikes (and a porsche once).

i found that with no speed limit applicable, almost everyone apart from caravans sat around 140kmh.

nt has a very low road toll.

i personally think that the speed limit should be decreased and that all cars should have mandatory delimiting. That will decrease people dying. And will stop any possibility of police fining for the purpose of revenue. i also believe that it should be harder for people to get their licence and that there should be regular retesting. Especially once a person hits a certain age.

ad there was no speed limit when i was travelling at that speed.

if they had checked their mirrors they would not have pulled out. they didnt even indicate.

they were doing approx 140-150.

no one hit anything, brakes are there to be used.

i doubt theres any road in the act where you could do above 160 without encountering something else. maybe a european system with an unrestrcited speed third lane (where slow drivers are penalised py polizei).

re the post above i agree. crap driving perpetuates itself as its never picked up. no indoicating, tailgating, cutting in, lane changing every 3 seconds – bafflingly poor driving occurs every day and who gets pinged – speed camera victims.

I’d rather than the police policed things like crimes against property, and bad or dangerous driving. These arbitrary speed limits don’t achieve anything to my mind. A good driver will choose an appropriate speed, and it might be quite fast. A bad driver can be doing the limit, and be bloody dangerous due to their stupidity and lack of skill. I’d prefer to see the cops grabbing people who tailgate, drive too fast for the place they’re in or the conditions, are putting others at risk by their driving behaviour, and things like that.

I really deplore the trend to not investigating thefts. I guess it’s so hard for them to get a conviction… everything is “circumstantial” evidence unless people SAW them nicking the stuff, it seems (or can prove they were there by blood etc). It’s no wonder thefts are increasing: it’s a sure winner for the scum who do it.

Hmm…a “minor incident” involving you doing 190. I’m not the least bit suprised the person who pulled out on you didn’t see you.

You call it a “minor incident”, I call it “reckless indifference to the life and property of others”.

I don’t care how good a driver you think you are, how well maintained your car is or any other “mitigating factors” you care to raise. No-one up to and including Peter Brock should be driving at 190 outside of a race track.

Morons like you are the reason I’ve sold my motorbike and have bought a pushie and am discovering the pluses of buses.

you might be a good driver… and I know plenty of them… but how do you account for those that aren’t. Your speeding could turn someone else’s minor stupidity into slaughter… and who will they blame the car that blindly changed lanes or the car was doubling the speed limit?

143kmh in a 60 zone – loss of licence 6 mths, occurred nearly 20 years ago. never been pulled over since (well sort of, have been pulled over but talked my way out of a few).

Several 10-15kmh above limit tax revenue tickets from cameras.

There are ways to receive prior warning of these though, which i dont really want to discuss too openly.

Lived in NT for several years, regularly did 180 plus on my way to work. Always snuck around town though.

There was a minor incident when i approached some cars at 190ish and one pulled out to overtake AS i was overtaking them.

So, yes i do in fact live in accordance with my beliefs and will cop the consequences. I wont live in fear of my oppressors though.

Ive also done a couple of advanced driving courses, competed in motorsports (briefly – too expensive if you want to win) and have a very well maintained and modified car. tyres alone are several hundreds a corner.

and btw i dont suffer from road rage and havent used my horn for years.

LOL

Irongeek – Oh great cop dater, please! share with us some of your other great wisdoms!!

hehehe, that’s the funniest thing i’ve heard all day!

I also note that the folk who want swift and brutal punishment for breaking the law get awful uppity when they are swiftly and brutally punished for breaking the law…

People who speed are blatant idiots. If you enjoy going fast and testing the limits take flying lessons or move out to SA/NT where they have roads with no speed limits. The issue is that you are driving in populated areas…. now sure it may come down to weather, condition of car, driving ability but speed ENHANCES these problems… yes thats right children it makes them worse. Very basic physics…

Anyway if you are really gung ho about testing limits why don’t go stand out in the middle of busy traffic and see how many speeding cars will miss you.

I’m interested to know, Bonfire – have you ever recieved any speeding fines? Made the kind of arguments you’re making now?

And how did you go with them?

Or is this merely an “in theory, I hate speeding fines – in actuality, I don’t speed or I pay the fines.”

Chris S – your comments are grossly ill-considered. All law is aimed at the lowest common denominator; and it has to be. Especially when you’re considering laws that have to apply to millions of people in possession of a potentially lethal machine.

You may well be able to drive safely at high speed. Many people can’t. Shall we allow the poor drivers to drive (dangerously) at higher speeds for the benefit of those who drive well at high speed?

Or shall we have a multi-tiered licence system. You can ignore speed limits if you have a special “good driver” licence? If so, how will it be enforced?

Speed limits aren’t a perfect solution, but they are the best solution we’ve got to an intractable problem. I’d rather see them lowered, but that’s me then…

Why are you in such a rush, anyway? We live in Canberra, for chrissakes! Nowhere is that far from anywhere else.

yes its much easier to fine a motorist than track down repeat offenders breaking into cars.

the speed limit on the parkway is 100km. it’s the LIMIT which the last time i checked was the greatest possible degree of something. that has been classified as a safe speed… not whatever YOU think is a safe speed.
Comment by BattleKath — June 21, 2006 @ 1:36 pm

Spot the cop.. They all sound the same.

Having dated one.

I would support zealous policing of speed limits if it actually contributed to road safety. Unfortunately there is no real correlation. I note with interest that better driver training, safer cars, higher quality tyres, better roads (to name but a few) are all (in mine and some others opinions) more conducive to road safety than speed cameras. However, speed cameras are easy to install and gather revenue with, and unfortunately can be justified to those who don’t choose to look deeper.

Here endeth the inflammatory remarks.

Argue your nonsensical point with the police the next time you get pulled over… i’m done.

speeding is more of a breach of an onerous ill advised regulation. set by small minded types to gouge more tax out of your pocket.

given the amount of speeding above the moronically low limits that already goes on, if speeding really did kill, there would be millions of dead each year.

What is it now ? hundreds ? a thousand ? less people than die of eating too many burgers in any case.

Considering the amount of cars x kms travelled x idiots on road, i think we have a pretty low and realistic road fatality figure.

kiddyfiddling is an indictable offence, as well as being distasteful.

thievery is an indictable offence as well as being vulgar.

im all for stocks and public humiliation in garema place. perhaps a minister caught drink driving might not think it was such a good idea.

in your opinion, clearly.

BK, the law is an ass.

To continue the age of consent eg, many 15yo are as physically intellectually and emotionally mature as 18yo and vice versa. The legislature has drawn a line at 16yo. Got a problem with where the line is drawn lobby for change, but screwing emotionally intellectually and physically mature 15yo’s is not civil disobedience it is a crime, as is speeding.
If you want any credence to your civil disobedience excuse, invite the police to watch every time you speed and get arrested as is usual in civil disobedience protests.

You’re breaking the law.

Battlekath, speed limits are set for the lowest common denominator – car, driver, conditions.

When we have fundamentalists pushing the speed camera approach, there is no allowance for skill, quality of car (inherent safety, good tyres, well-maintained etc) and good conditions, then we have what is effectively in Canberra, civil disobedience.

A good example is Hindmarsh Drive – 6 lanes (3 each way), divided each direction, yet pig ignorant speed cameras operators make a great living.

It stinks.

I’m with Danman – there’s no point even calling the cops if someone is messing with your car. You’re better off just injuring them so at least they will think twice next time.

I know the policing is about priorities, but frankly I don’t care. If someone is going to physically intrude into my belongings I will simply resolve the issue with them (of course, if the police would actually turn up, I mightn’t have too). And before I get the angry retort of don’t blame the police, let me just say that I don’t, this is simply my reaction to this part of the world as I find it.

That sentence doesn’t even make sense. Can I argue about that?

hehehehe

Hehehe, done.

thankyou mr shab for neatly summarising my argument.

obviously battlekath is a softhead since breaking into cars is a victimless crime and me going about town in a safe and careful manner is a crime.

BK – don’t bother arguing the merits of speed limits with bonfire. He thinks they’re a facist construct of the nanny state, and is unlikely to be swayed. Take my advice and save yourself from RSI.

Besides, it always ends with you being called a softhead and him being called a retarded ape…

I like to test the limits by sleeping with bonfires kids, they’re only 10% under the age of consent so that’s cool isn’t it.

it’s always people who don’t abide by the rules who then complain when they get caught.

Also, the chance of you having an accident greatly increases if you are going over the speed limit.

it’s not each to their own, you’re breaking the law…and i hope that due to your speeding, nobody is killed.

maybe some of us like to test limits. others are content to button their cardigan and receive nice pats on the head.

each to their own.

the speed limit on the parkway is 100km. it’s the LIMIT which the last time i checked was the greatest possible degree of something. that has been classified as a safe speed… not whatever YOU think is a safe speed.

Rant Warning.

Over the years and through the course of every car I have owned i have had them broken into.
The worst was when I was skating at belconnen after work ( as an apperntice chef ) – some derros brok einto my car and stole all my cheftools and some DIRTY chef jackets ( I don tknow why they stole these )
All up it was about a week or more worth of apprentice wages stolen and when i reported it to police in the flesh they had the audacity to laugh when my description of contents stolen included a boner. How professional. The latest incident occured on saturday night in Ngunnawal. My car was attempted to be broken into, nothing stolen, however the door handle and lock assembly ( one piece ) was ripped from the door and left hanging by internal levers etc. I discovered this on sunday orning when i was heading off to my mated for a day in the brindies. I thought fuck the fuckers and went out anyway ( clambering in and out of my car over the passenger seat. I rang the cops that night ( no rush as they just need my report for statistical data, not actually crime fighting ). The reporting officer was very friendly and she noted that there was a lot of minor criminal damage that night ( pretty much said it was drunk kids smashing pots – letterboxes – random vandalism ) but admitted that nothing would probably be done. In another incident I was walking ( on yowani – having parked on Barton Hwy ) with my significant other at the time at about midnight during the week after work. We heard a smash ran to the car to see 2 teen thugs standing outside of it.
I ( we ) ran and caught them, restrained them until the police attended and they got bailed up and went to the station.
I rang the police the next day – they let them go because we didnt see them break the window – and I was left with a 120 dollar bill.

It was then that I decided that if i catch anyone doing this to my car – so help me god they will pay

Sounds good to me Bonfire – can we put drug dealers pushing “Harry Potter” tabs to schoolkids up there as well??

if i was driving at 110kmh and everyone else was doing 15kmh then perhaps i might run into someone and a death may result.

doing 110kmh on the parkway is keeping up with traffic, and is therefore a safe speed to travel at.

breaking into a car to steal to support a drug habit is causing harm. to me, by permanently depriving me of goods and posessions i own.

i suppose stringing car thieves up on light poles with a sign around their neck saying ‘car thief’, and leaving the body to rot is a bit too harsh isnt it.

you don’t get booked for driving 10K over the limit in canberra. its a natural state of affairs to drive that fast.

Break and enter = burglary. Cannot commit a burglary on a car, only a building. Police attend all burglaries.

I didnt say they weren’t investigated, just that they are recorded via other means. If 20 cars are broken into in the one location well thats a different scenario.

Unfortunately, in this day and age, its about priorities. I don’t know many coppers that would book you for 10km/h over the limit on the parkway. Speed cameras aren;t run buy the Police

You can get DNA from many things however, blood is easy to see and hence doesn’t require hours of looking (cf hair, skin flakes etc), it also indicates that the donor of the blood was at the crime scene at the time of the crime or after the crime (providing the blood of course is due to broken glass and the glass was broken to provide entry). Thus the person at AFP Coms can ask the victim whether there is any blood and send out a car or forensics accordingly. Very unlikely the blood would be a result of violence unless maybe the thieves had a dispute about dividing the spoils

your driving at 110km on the parkway could kill someone… a break-in to your car isn’t likely to physically hurt anyone but the thief.

so a real crime like theft and break and enter, which occurs commonly is not investigated, and no punishment occurs when offenders are (n)ever caught, yet i driving my stanley steamer down the parkway at 110kmh will incur a fine.

oh yeah, i see how im a much greater danger to the community.

i was going to say that surely you can obtain DNA from a whole range of other things…

but it just occured to me that blood may inidcate some kind of violent crime… in which case it makes sense…

“volume crime”… I think that’s what my neighbour commits with his reggae music every Saturday morning.

Quite generally when certain types of volume crime occur where there is no likelihood of the offender being identified through coppers turning up (i.e no evidence to gain) the crime will be recorded when the victim contacts Police but there won’t be attendance. Each situation is different but, generally speaking, for a one off car break Police won’t turn up in accordance with the priority system

DNA collection

why blood… in case the poor dears cut themselves whilst attempting a break and may need medical assistance.

Makes sense. Many years ago, I used to park at the Rex hotel, with many other Civic workers. Every car was broken into and parking change stolen (or so it seemed) over the years. The car park was littered with broken glass from the cars whose windows had been smashed to gain entry (my car’s $1200 soft-top was slashed for the same reason).
One day I went to get my car at midday, and noticed two druggy-looking guys, one apparently was lookout, the other was looking into each car in turn.
So I phoned the cops…. they must have had umpteen reports of broken-into cars over the years: here was their chance to catch the buggers. I sat there for half an hour, watching these two check out all the cars, waiting for me to leave. The cops never came.