6 February 2007

Hindmarsh Drive closed to Queanbeyan

| Sammy
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As of 3:45pm this afternoon Hindmarsh Drive is closed to Queanbeyan. Police are directing traffic to Queanbeyan via the Monaro Highway to Jerrabomberra.

Anyone know the reason for the road closure?

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Young people will drive like young people and occasionally they will suffer the consequences of their actions. No amount of training, education and penalties is going to convince all young people that driving is a privledge and not a right.

Only through experience and maturity do we realise that driving like Ayrton Senna results in being Ayrton Senna.

Growling Ferret9:39 am 09 Feb 07

Kids not being failed in Road Ready test is more the fault of porr examination questions, generous pass markers and their instructors rather than the fault of the kiddies…

GF, yes it is.

Kids see Road Ready as a joke – an obstacle they must sit through in order to get their L’s.

Some will barely pass (they should fail in my opinion) and then go on to get their L’s and P’s.

If they were failed in Road Ready they might actually learn a thing or two by repeating the course….

Hell, even my first car – an old 2L Sigma could push 140km/h. Only on private roads, of course.

More policing of dangerous driving (*not* just speeding) like failure to indicate, failure to give way, running stop signs (see other thread for where that can land you) _might_ help. Targetting inattentive drivers (autopilot syndrome) would probably help, too. Unfortunately there’s probably not enough cops around to actually DO it…

Any news on the kid driving yet?

Ah this Bogan will have a memorial erected for him for being a Bogan.

Something else to defile.

Growling Ferret6:35 pm 07 Feb 07

“It’s too easy to get your licence these days.”

FFS Nyssa – my old man got his motorbike licence (not P’s, full licence) doing a lap around the block. One lap, around the City Watchhouse block, Civic. No written exam, nothing like that. Now that was too easy.

What are the hoops kids have to jump through? Quoted directly From the ACT Road Ready Site

“To get a learner driver licence in the ACT you must:

* be at least 15 years and 9 months of age
* successfully complete a specially developed road safety course – Road Ready Program
* pass the computer based Road Rules Knowledge Test – you can use the practice test on this site to get ready.

Most ACT secondary schools offer the course as part of the year 10 program. For those who have already left school the course can be taken at a Road Ready Centre.

When you have completed the course and passed the Road Rules Knowledge Test you will be given a certificate that you take to a Canberra Connect Shopfront or the Road User Services office at Dickson, with proof of identity, to be issued with your learner driver licence.

Once you have your learner driver licence you can learn to drive with a driving instructor, parents, relations or friends provided that the licensed driver holds a full Australian driver licence. The full driver licence must be the type required for the vehicle the learner is driving.

A learner licence lasts for 2 years, but must be held for at least 6 months being able to obtain a provisional driver licence. You must display “L” plates at all times when driving.”

For P’s

“You must be at least 17 years of age and have held a learner licence for a minimum of 6 months before being able to obtain a provisional driver licence.

There are two methods you can use to get your provisional driver licence:
1. The Competency Based Training and Assessment Scheme (CBT&A), which uses a logbook system through an Accredited Driving Instructor.
2. Take a practical driving test with an ACT Government Licence Examiner.

You will be on a provisional driver licence for 3 years and must display a ‘P’ plate for this period – unless you take the optional Road Ready Plus (P..off) course after six months or more on a provisional driver licence.

During the 3 year provisional licence period your Blood Alcohol Content (BAC) limit when driving must be less than 0.02, which in practice means zero. So it’s best not to drink alcohol if you are intending to drive.”

Its definately harder than when I got my licence by 8am on my 17th birthday in 1992. It was a quick drive around Woden, a 3 point turn, a reverse park, merging into the traffic at the big roundabout and return to the Regtistry – 15 minutes tops.

If kids are unprepared and unable to face reality due to their own stupidity, a poor upbringing, a failure to understand consequences of their actions etc, there is little more society can do. See the dipshit 40 year old from Warialda (or wherever it was) who had a 14 year old driving the ute with 7 passengers in it. 17 year olds don’t have a mortgage on moronic actions…

The answer is blindingly obvious!

All driver training should be conducted by the same teachers who instruct our police forces.

A two-three week course develops these ordinary mortals into superattentive, focused drivers, able to exceed the speed limit without their brains turning to mush, able to both drive and use mobile phones at the same time, able to perform U turns prohibited to normal mortals, and never have an accident.

If such training is available, why can it not filter down to the ordinary mug learner?

Once you get rid of the “driving is a privelege and not a right” mentality of most P-platers (talking to those doing Road Ready and also recently passed their P’s) we will all be fine.

My first car was a 78 Toyota. It got me around fine. I only bought my first new car 2 1/2 years ago and I was in my late 20’s.

I don’t believe the book thing has ever worked and they should take the test we all had to take – lose 6pts during your test and you don’t get your licence.

It’s too easy to get your licence these days.

Yeah, I’m not necessarily for the idea, but it’s been suggested before. I agree Ferret that P-platers do get a bad rap compared to other demographics, but I have to say that when I was 17 I knew more than a few dipshits whose driving would definately have benefitted from having a bit more experience and maturity under their belt.

NO to slower driving, and NO to more police patrols. They are sufficient the way they are.

Knee-jerk reactions is the LAST thing we need – and increasing the age limit will change the entire fabric of our society, fancy a pizza delivery boy having to wait until he was 20 – that’s nearly past the zits stage! (and they aren’t so gullible either – reducing the chance at a free pizza or extra change)

Life as we know it would spontaneously ‘upsize’. I wouldn’t want to be responsible for that…

Growling Ferret1:32 pm 07 Feb 07

“does anyone know if it actually makes much of a difference if you don’t let someone get on the roads until they’re say, 19 or 20”

Yeah, it means 17-20 year olf kids can’t get jobs that start or finish any later than the local bus timetable, or their kind parents will drive them to. Dumb idea.

Kids will always have accidents, but the overall accident rate is far lower now that it was 10 or 20 years ago – the whole P-Plater doom and gloom rubbish you hear is a media beatup by those too lazy to have a crack at the real issues – the lack of RBT’s, the lack of on road police presence, the failure of many oldies to be capable to still driving, but maintaining their licence as noone wants to disempower a large group of potential votes.

Yes, 1% of P Platers are dickheads who will crash – but there are many non P-Platers who are moving accident sites on every Canberra road.

I don’t think it would. You’d just have inexperienced 20 year olds driving around.

In the US they drive at younger ages (like 16). Some say it is better to learn younger, as you pick up the skills better.

I think everyone should drive a bit slower. And more police should patrol the roads.

What about raising the minimum age limits for P-platers? That’s occasionally kicked around as an alternative – does anyone know if it actually makes much of a difference if you don’t let someone get on the roads until they’re say, 19 or 20?

Its just a shame that idiotic driver (p-platers or not) have to learn from their mistakes by usually involving other innocent road users!

But I guess cars, cigarettes, sky-diving and guns have skewed it in the other direction for many years, so a correction is in order.

And as others here have pointed out in the past, it skews natural selection.

-But not so good for the undertaking profession.

I had a 1.3l suzuki swift with about 120hp
Dont sound like much but in a 700 something kilo car and the wrong hands could quite easily be fatal.

Its power to weight ratio not hp that kills – but in saying so – I could still die in any car that could go faster than 60kmh.

I believe limit power – and power to weight on P plate drivers – but it should be more about education rather than limitation.

To have any effect, you’d need to make the cars *really* slow. A bog-standard Hyundai Excel would probably be capable of reaching 140km/h+ along Canberra Avenue to Queanbeyan.

Perhaps a kilowatt and rev limit is the answer 🙂

Eighty kilowatts and half the rev range. It’d probably solve the oil crisis at the same time.

I meant, “small red car”. [ED. edited]

Take a look at the other thread, with the small red car on its roof.
-It’s all about engaging brain before gear.

Thats true, but wouldn’t there be more chance if those rollerblades went really fast?

Engine size has got sod all to do with it. You can kill yourself on a pair of roller blades if you wanted to (or even if you didn’t want to).

Restricting drivers to low-power cars won’t really help much.

I disagree. If you take away P-Platers power to drive at high speeds, it lessens the chance that they’ll wrap themselves around a tree.

Yeah, you’re right fnaah. Strange I forgot about this, as I contemplated getting a Kawasaki Vulcan 800 when I got my ‘L’s, but went for a ZZR-250 instead.

How ridiculous I looked on that tiny little sport bike.

Actually Sammy, you’re not restricted to 250cc at all, you are restricted to a certain power/weight ratio. 1100cc cruisers are generally “learner legal” due to their massive weight, and I can tell you that they will propel you down the road faster than just about any car.

I learned to drive in a ’68 Fairmont XT with a 302 Windsor V8, and have an exemplary driving record. A friend of mine learned to drive in one of those 3-cylinder Suzuki jobbies, and he totaled two cars before he turned twenty.

Restricting drivers to low-power cars won’t really help much. I know they do it for motorcycles (I let my L’s expire a year ago, but I’ve still got my 250cc yamaharley), but what of the Sydney P-plate biker who was caught doing 190km/h on his brand new R1 (which he wasn’t legally allowed to ride)?

Doesn’t Victoria have power restrictions on L and P plate drivers? Does anyone have any numbers that show the restrictions have any effect (one way or the other)?

Sammy, that actually makes sense.

When you first get your motorcycle license you are restricted to 250cc. Should be the same for car drivers. Restrict them to 100 kw.

I hear you Maelinar – my first car was 998cc, and the speedo didn’t even go to 140kmh. If I wanted to show off to my mates I had to bang on about my power to weight ratio, rather than impress them with speed. Looking back, I’m glad I had the car I did too.

Just plain stupidity!
Getting home yesterday afternoon was a nightmare!

Oh well.

I blame the parents. When I was the equivalent of a P Plater, the maximum top speed on a downhill run with the wind behind me was 120, in a gutless 1.3l Nissan Sunny.

Retrospectively, it saved my life by being such a go-cart, I was not able to put myself into the serious risk category between in this example a regulated traffic light stretch of road.

My guess is one of those hotted up holdens that go for around $30k, and a harsh welcome to the world of enduring debt.

As in “U F***ing Onanist”. (The driver, not you West_K).

West_Kambah_4eva8:28 am 07 Feb 07

The car crash is a cover story, it was actually a UFO crash.

If you need two hands to pick your nose, Hasdrubahl, you probably need medical attention…

Looking at the footage on the ABC News, it looked like he crossed the median strip, across 3 lanes of traffic going the other way, up an embankment and into a tree.

There were thick skid marks the whole way, so he must have been travelling at a *very* quick pace.

Only if you take your hands off the wheel to light a cigarette/text your mate/pick your nose.

Sorry, when you’re driving at 140+ it ain’t an accident, its an inevitability

Any news on whether the kid’s gonna be OK?

Welcome back SGS

Yeah, sorry, Canberra Avenue is the road that was closed, at it’s intersection with Hindmarsh Drive.

Actually no it doesn’t, my mistake

Samuel Gordon-Stewart5:27 pm 06 Feb 07

It’s Canberra Avenue that was closed, just after the Hindmarsh intersection. Apparently it is open again now, but there are still longer than usual delays in and around the area.

It does if you live in Jerra

Hindmarsh Drive doesn’t go to Queanbeyan?

Yay. Monaro Highway will be (extra) chaos.

Samuel Gordon-Stewart5:04 pm 06 Feb 07

Late teen P Plater hit a tree and was taken to hospital in a critical condition. Police estimate he was travelling in excess of 140km/h. Accident happened just after 2pm, the road will probably be closed right through peak hour.

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