New Developments in Solar Technology

SEEChangeIncCanberra 2 April 2012 24

Arguments about the feasibility of renewable energy often concentrate around costings and capabilities that are out of date. But what exactly is happening in solar technology? Speculate no longer! Come along to the Bob Douglas Lecture Theatre, Eggleston Road, ANU Campus tomorrow night at 6 pm to find out for yourself what the latest from the solar industry can deliver.

Run as part of the ongoing SEE-Change Solar Seminar Series and the Canberra Environment and Sustainability Resource Centre’s SUSTAIN Ability Workshop Series 2012, Guest Speaker Steve Blume – President of the Australian Solar Energy Society (AuSES) and Vice President Public Affairs for the International Solar Energy Society (ISES) – will share his knowledge and insights in this short talk. Steve’s specialities include climate change and environment policy development & implementation, as well as solar and other renewable energy technologies.

Please register here through eventbrite if you wish to attend (but please note there is no need to print your ticket). For more information contact admin@see-change.org.au.


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HenryBG HenryBG 12:45 pm 05 Apr 12

chewy14 said :

HenryBG said :

Your response in a thread about developments in solar technology was:

But!…Coal!…

Hmm, for a guy who doesn’t like people misquoting him, you sure do a lot of it. Can you point out where I said “but…coal”?

FFS! I think my brain just exploded.

You added those quote marks in YOURSELF to make it appear as though I had written something I did not.

AGAIN.

Lunatic.

chewy14 chewy14 12:35 pm 05 Apr 12

HenryBG said :

Your response in a thread about developments in solar technology was:

But!…Coal!…

Hmm, for a guy who doesn’t like people misquoting him, you sure do a lot of it. Can you point out where I said “but…coal”?

Nah didn’t think so, you just like trying to hold people to higher standards than you hold yourself.

And what the Hell do Andrew Bolt and Tim Flannery have to do with anything discussed here?

Where’d the Logic master go?

I actually have no idea why you’ve posted such crap when I actually agree that we should be investing far more money in renewable energy.

You seem to have attributed a position to me that I never said or even intimated. Nice work cranky pants.

HenryBG HenryBG 9:38 am 05 Apr 12

chewy14 said :

You tried to suggest that the Chinese government is being “visionary”…

Oh yes, and use of the fake quote. Obviously, I wrote no such thing.
Well done.
Andrew Bolt would be proud.

Why don’t you give us some Tim Flannery “quotes”, while you are at it?

HenryBG HenryBG 9:35 am 05 Apr 12

chewy14 said :

HenryBG said :

It’s a stupid “point” when the topic at hand is “Developments in Solar Technology”.

As is the wont of the logically-deprived, you try to veer off on a completely “point”less tangent by talking about coal.
Or, if you actually do know what you’re doing in this discussion, you are deliberately trying to misdirect. But I doubt it. The quality of your argumentation suggests you’re not even being that dishonest.

Bahahahahaha. I didn’t veer off on anything.

Your response in a thread about developments in solar technology was:

But!…Coal!…

The usual meaningless gibberish from people who can’t grasp or accept change.

Your “energy mix” is just another layer of nonsense, probably gleaned from reading too many Andrew Bolt columns: There’s no rule or law of physics that says you have to have any particular “mix”. It’s all about economics and opportunity.

Iceland has its own peculiar “mix”, Tasmania has a particular mix including 15% coal, South Australia has 21% wind, in Spain wind occupies a 40% greater share of the “mix” than does coal.

Diggety Diggety 6:08 am 05 Apr 12

chewy14 said :

I’m actually a big supporter of increasing Australia’s use of renewable energy sources but they need to be taken in context of the overall energy mix.

+1

This is exaclty the attitude we need.

chewy14 chewy14 2:20 pm 04 Apr 12

HenryBG said :

It’s a stupid “point” when the topic at hand is “Developments in Solar Technology”.

As is the wont of the logically-deprived, you try to veer off on a completely “point”less tangent by talking about coal.
Or, if you actually do know what you’re doing in this discussion, you are deliberately trying to misdirect. But I doubt it. The quality of your argumentation suggests you’re not even being that dishonest.

Bahahahahaha. I didn’t veer off on anything.

You tried to suggest that the Chinese government is being “visionary” by installing large amounts of renewable energy and solar manufacturing capacity whilst convieniently ignoring the facts that they are also increasing their fossil fuel and nuclear capacity by massive amounts.

I’m actually a big supporter of increasing Australia’s use of renewable energy sources but they need to be taken in context of the overall energy mix. Talking about the massive growth in the use of renewables in China as some sort of putdown of Australia is deliberately misleading and nothing to do with developments in solar technology.

Oh and if you want to talk about being logically deprived, i suggest you re-read your comments to me and then this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

HenryBG HenryBG 1:36 pm 04 Apr 12

chewy14 said :

My point is that whilst China is indeed increasing their renewable energy capacity (of which hydro is clearly the biggest atm), they are increasing their fossil fuel and nuclear capacity at massive rates also. You convieniently left that out because it doesn’t suit your argument.
.

It’s a stupid “point” when the topic at hand is “Developments in Solar Technology”.

As is the wont of the logically-deprived, you try to veer off on a completely “point”less tangent by talking about coal.
Or, if you actually do know what you’re doing in this discussion, you are deliberately trying to misdirect. But I doubt it. The quality of your argumentation suggests you’re not even being that dishonest.

chewy14 chewy14 1:27 pm 04 Apr 12

HenryBG said :

chewy14 said :

HenryBG said :

dungfungus said :

Isn’t 6.00pm a little late to be demonstating a solar energy concept?

You’re thinking Local again.

Here’s a clue: the sun shines 24 hours a day, without fail.

The Chinese government has announced plans to expand the installed capacity of solar capacity to 20 GW by 2020, and windpower capacity to 100GW by 2020.
(And considering they beat their target of 10GW windpower by 2010 by almost 300%, their targets are not just credible, but probably an understatement).

Here in the “clever country”? Ignorant pooh-poohers still clog up the debate with their nonsense, and we barely manage to produce 5% of our power consumption from renewable sources (and less than 2% of our production is from renewables). Some people need to wake up and realise the 1950s are over.
Like that Gina Reinhardt who I had the displeasure of watching on Australian Story again last night.

And their coal capacity is what 550-600GW? How much growth expected in this area?
And what’s their expected growth in Nuclear Power generation?

I think I’ve previously taken you to task on account of presenting logic-free argument in other threads.

Care to explain the logic present in your argument, if you have any/one.

I do wish those with no understanding of logical argumentation would stick to sharing their observations (something we are all qualified for) rather than participating in intellectual exercises for which they are not equipped.

And I’ve taken you to task previously on presenting facts without context. My comment was simply to ask you to present the full context behind your comments on China’s energy capacity. That you fail to comprehend simple questions that are asked is your failure not mine.

My point is that whilst China is indeed increasing their renewable energy capacity (of which hydro is clearly the biggest atm), they are increasing their fossil fuel and nuclear capacity at massive rates also. You convieniently left that out because it doesn’t suit your argument.

PS. going on about “intellectual excercises” just makes you look like a tool.

HenryBG HenryBG 12:26 pm 04 Apr 12

GardeningGirl said :

I’m sorry but solar energy turned into another industry to steer clear of, with government schemes and jumping on the bandwagon shoddy installers and cheap Chinese panels and major pollution problems in the vicinity of the factories. I’m not saying all factories or panels or installers are crap but we decided to wait until the industry becomes clearly more environmentally friendly and sustainable instead of flavour of the month trendy pale green before we look into it again. It’s a shame the government didn’t invest in growing local solar technology expertise instead of simply throwing money at any householder who wanted to cut their power bills. Perhaps it’s just a coincidence around here but the houses with the panels are NOT the ones with northern orientation and reduced lawns and water tanks and sensible cars and so on, in fact one of them was notorious for ignoring the water restrictions during the drought so when I saw the panels go on I just had to laugh at their sudden interest in being environmentally responsible. I hope things improve in the future, I believe in the ‘idea’ of solar energy.

Nice compendium of claptrap. Pity there are no facts discernable there in amongst the poorly-written gibberish.

The one that always gets me is the ignorance of people swallowing the Abbott opposition’s nonsense blaming the Federal Government for “dodgy installers” when building licences and so forth are managed by State Govenment.

The various solar schemes have *dramatically* (and in a very short time) increased the coverage of domestic solar in this country. And that was their intended purpose.
Now, what do you call a project/scheme which achieves its stated goals?
Yes! That’s correct! It is called a *successful* scheme/project.

And, in other news,
[Turnbull:] “”the Americans are in a period of dysfunctionality on this … the Chinese are very alert to it and are introducing an emissions trading scheme. It’s a trial and it’s got a very small price, but the Chinese do take it seriously.
”I think we are more likely to see leadership out of China than America.” China is trialling an emissions trading scheme in seven provinces, but was widely condemned for cruelling any chances of an international climate change deal at the 2009 United Nations meeting in Copenhagen.
Mr Turnbull said he found it astonishing that climate change denialism was now a pre-requisite for Republican presidential candidates in the US, where a ”war against science” had been successfully waged by vested interests.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/us-behind-china-on-carbon–turnbull-20120403-1wast.html#ixzz1r2A9A3uu

GardeningGirl GardeningGirl 12:09 pm 04 Apr 12

I’m sorry but solar energy turned into another industry to steer clear of, with government schemes and jumping on the bandwagon shoddy installers and cheap Chinese panels and major pollution problems in the vicinity of the factories. I’m not saying all factories or panels or installers are crap but we decided to wait until the industry becomes clearly more environmentally friendly and sustainable instead of flavour of the month trendy pale green before we look into it again. It’s a shame the government didn’t invest in growing local solar technology expertise instead of simply throwing money at any householder who wanted to cut their power bills. Perhaps it’s just a coincidence around here but the houses with the panels are NOT the ones with northern orientation and reduced lawns and water tanks and sensible cars and so on, in fact one of them was notorious for ignoring the water restrictions during the drought so when I saw the panels go on I just had to laugh at their sudden interest in being environmentally responsible. I hope things improve in the future, I believe in the ‘idea’ of solar energy.

HenryBG HenryBG 11:00 am 04 Apr 12

welkin31 said :

Of course – I should have thought of that.
Solar bankruptcies mark industry coming of age
http://www.climatespectator.com.au/news/solar-bankruptcies-mark-industry-coming-age
Oh – thats good then – it’s all normal.

It means that, unlike the Nuclear industry, solar power companies are operating in the free market.
And as solar power is now cost-equivalent to burning coal (already way cheaper than burning gas), there is no reason to oppose it.

Wind power, of course, is already way cheaper than burning coal. It just doesn’t have the history of subsidies that coal power does, so it’s ramping up much more slowly here than in China where they are happy to pounce on a bargain without being retarded by anti-renewable cranks like we are here.

welkin31 welkin31 10:31 am 04 Apr 12

In addition to Solar Trust of America and German solar firm Q-Cells mentioned comment #10 – some more examples – of solar bankruptcies – Solyndra – Solar Millennium – Stirling Energy Systems – SpectraWatt – Evergreen. Keeps the lawyers in new Mercs I suppose – but producing usable electricity at home power points – not so easy is it.

Solar panel scammers set up new company, Premium Solar Systems
http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/solar-panel-scammers-set-up-new-company-premium-solar-systems/story-e6freoof-1226070491741

Solar Millennium Files For Bankruptcy As Solar Shakeout Continues
http://www.forbes.com/sites/toddwoody/2011/12/21/solar-millennium-files-for-bankruptcy-as-solar-shakeout-continues/
The above article has links to – Stirling Energy Systems went belly up in September along with SpectraWatt and Evergreen. This week, BP pulled the plug on its four-decade-old solar division.

Solyndra, solar company that Obama visited, to shut down
http://www.climatespectator.com.au/news/solyndra-solar-company-obama-visited-shut-down
Phew – the list goes on.

Of course – I should have thought of that.
Solar bankruptcies mark industry coming of age
http://www.climatespectator.com.au/news/solar-bankruptcies-mark-industry-coming-age
Oh – thats good then – it’s all normal.

HenryBG HenryBG 10:03 am 04 Apr 12

chewy14 said :

HenryBG said :

dungfungus said :

Isn’t 6.00pm a little late to be demonstating a solar energy concept?

You’re thinking Local again.

Here’s a clue: the sun shines 24 hours a day, without fail.

The Chinese government has announced plans to expand the installed capacity of solar capacity to 20 GW by 2020, and windpower capacity to 100GW by 2020.
(And considering they beat their target of 10GW windpower by 2010 by almost 300%, their targets are not just credible, but probably an understatement).

Here in the “clever country”? Ignorant pooh-poohers still clog up the debate with their nonsense, and we barely manage to produce 5% of our power consumption from renewable sources (and less than 2% of our production is from renewables). Some people need to wake up and realise the 1950s are over.
Like that Gina Reinhardt who I had the displeasure of watching on Australian Story again last night.

And their coal capacity is what 550-600GW? How much growth expected in this area?
And what’s their expected growth in Nuclear Power generation?

I think I’ve previously taken you to task on account of presenting logic-free argument in other threads.

Care to explain the logic present in your argument, if you have any/one.

I do wish those with no understanding of logical argumentation would stick to sharing their observations (something we are all qualified for) rather than participating in intellectual exercises for which they are not equipped.

HenryBG HenryBG 10:01 am 04 Apr 12

welkin31 said :

Solar bankruptcies in recent news.

German solar firm in trouble
Solar panel maker Q-Cells to file for bankruptcy
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-17587830

Developer of California desert solar plant files for bankruptcy
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-solar-bankruptcy-20120403,0,7195246.story

If you want a list of all the bankruptcies in Europe and the USA over the last 5 years, you just might find there is nothing unusual in seeing these manufacturers included. Hint: there’s this GFC thing been going on, don’t know if you’ve heard.

Meanwhile (from Wikipedia):
“China produces 30% of the worlds solar photovoltaics (PV).[19] It has emerged as the world’s largest manufacturer of solar panels in the last two years.[20] Major Chinese solar PV modules manufacturers include: Suntech Power Holdings, Trina Solar, Yingli Solar, Canadian Solar, Solarfun, Upsolar. Thin-film PV producers include ENN Solar and Astronergy Solar. While poly-silicon and wafers producers are LDK and ReneSola.
China has become a world leader in the manufacture of solar photovoltaic technology, with its six biggest solar companies having a combined value of over $15 billion. Around 820 MW of solar PV were produced in China in 2007, second only to Japan.”

So, while China leads the world in manufacturing and installing renewable technologies, the cranky pensioner nay-sayers in Australia continue to retard us in this area.

Why anybody even listens to these ignorant anti-renewable cranks is a complete mystery.

welkin31 welkin31 8:54 am 04 Apr 12

Solar bankruptcies in recent news.

German solar firm in trouble
Solar panel maker Q-Cells to file for bankruptcy
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-17587830

Developer of California desert solar plant files for bankruptcy
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-solar-bankruptcy-20120403,0,7195246.story

chewy14 chewy14 10:51 am 03 Apr 12

HenryBG said :

dungfungus said :

Isn’t 6.00pm a little late to be demonstating a solar energy concept?

You’re thinking Local again.

Here’s a clue: the sun shines 24 hours a day, without fail.

The Chinese government has announced plans to expand the installed capacity of solar capacity to 20 GW by 2020, and windpower capacity to 100GW by 2020.
(And considering they beat their target of 10GW windpower by 2010 by almost 300%, their targets are not just credible, but probably an understatement).

Here in the “clever country”? Ignorant pooh-poohers still clog up the debate with their nonsense, and we barely manage to produce 5% of our power consumption from renewable sources (and less than 2% of our production is from renewables). Some people need to wake up and realise the 1950s are over.
Like that Gina Reinhardt who I had the displeasure of watching on Australian Story again last night.

And their coal capacity is what 550-600GW? How much growth expected in this area?
And what’s their expected growth in Nuclear Power generation?

HenryBG HenryBG 10:34 am 03 Apr 12

dungfungus said :

HenryBG said :

dungfungus said :

Isn’t 6.00pm a little late to be demonstating a solar energy concept?

“Some people need to wake up and realise the 1950s are over.
Like that Gina Reinhardt who I had the displeasure of watching on Australian Story again last night”

Since the 1950s, TVs have a “change channel/on/off switch” fitted. Why I am not surprised you haven’t found that out yet?

What? Take your eye off the enemy?

I don’t think so.

dungfungus dungfungus 9:48 am 03 Apr 12

HenryBG said :

dungfungus said :

Isn’t 6.00pm a little late to be demonstating a solar energy concept?

“Some people need to wake up and realise the 1950s are over.
Like that Gina Reinhardt who I had the displeasure of watching on Australian Story again last night”

Since the 1950s, TVs have a “change channel/on/off switch” fitted. Why I am not surprised you haven’t found that out yet?

HenryBG HenryBG 9:29 am 03 Apr 12

dungfungus said :

Isn’t 6.00pm a little late to be demonstating a solar energy concept?

You’re thinking Local again.

Here’s a clue: the sun shines 24 hours a day, without fail.

The Chinese government has announced plans to expand the installed capacity of solar capacity to 20 GW by 2020, and windpower capacity to 100GW by 2020.
(And considering they beat their target of 10GW windpower by 2010 by almost 300%, their targets are not just credible, but probably an understatement).

Here in the “clever country”? Ignorant pooh-poohers still clog up the debate with their nonsense, and we barely manage to produce 5% of our power consumption from renewable sources (and less than 2% of our production is from renewables). Some people need to wake up and realise the 1950s are over.
Like that Gina Reinhardt who I had the displeasure of watching on Australian Story again last night.

dungfungus dungfungus 7:25 am 03 Apr 12

SEEChangeIncCanberra said :

Oops I just remembered where I am. Rioters? The bicycle-powered heat lamps comment was a joke; just though I should make this clear in case I inadvertently started a ‘how rude are canberra Cyclists thread’.

Yes, don’t upset the Petal Power People. Actually, if they were at your nightime forum there would be lots of potential sunshine eminating from the collective fundamental orifices on the bicycle seats.

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