The gum tree menace - time for action?

Gungahlin Al said :

Pawlonia: http://www.finegardening.com/plantguide/paulownia-tomentosa-empress-tree.aspx
Native of China. Leaves up to 600mm wide (yes that ain’t a typo!). Invasive, fast growing. A risky prospect in Queensland, less so here – like camphor laurel in a lot of ways I guess.
Key risk here I’d say would be blocking up your drains with the giant leaves, leading to localised flooding.

bugger. thought that they were a native. however, there is a bit more info re the trees at: http://www.paulowniatrees.com.au including – The leaves and flowers are rich in nitrogen and therefore serve as good fertiliser and fodder. The flowers are
colourful and beautiful in spring and the trees are green and shady in summer. Paulownia species are therefore very suitable for beautifying and enriching the environment. They are also equally suitable for landscaping of urban and industrial areas.

Paulownias can adapt to a wide range of temperatures. All species in Australia are known to withstand temperatures of -10o to +40o centigrade

Granny said :

I really don’t know what the answer to this one is.

Driving along a rural road in Victoria once, a huge branch only just missed the car in front of us. The shocked driver pulled over and some locals told him it happens quite frequently. As we continued driving, we noticed the number of fallen branches littering the road with a heightened awareness.

I just adore trees of all kinds and hate to see them removed, but a Canberra without gum trees is especially hard to imagine.

Then again, I am still traumatised by Judy’s tragic end in Seven Little Australians.

I hear you, Granny! I’ll never forget how upset I was by that when I saw it when I was about 12. Even more vivid than reading the original story.

All trees drop limbs, yes eucalypts have a tendency to do it with a higher frequency than many of other species, but I can think of a number of other trees that I would be more wary of. Ornamental pears, especially Pyrus calleryana have a tendency to snap with amazing regularity when they reach maturity, some maples and poplars to.
I have many photos of Mature north american oaks,that I have worked with that have dropped limbs, split etc… causing all sorts of damage. Many trees in Canberra’s urban forest have not yet reached the point where this becomes an issue.
I am not oppossed to removing trees for valid reasons but feel removing them because they are “widow makers” is not appropriate.
One might also ask if a school had such dangerous and evil trees why a parent would knowingly allow there child to be exposed to such a threat (perhaps such a parent might be liable too).

PinkysBrain said :

The big gum tree in our yard just dropped a large branch on the weekend. It landed next door, where my neighbours 2 and 4 year old play on their swing set. I estimate the branch missed it by 2m. The remainder of the tree will be gone by the end of the week. The government inspector who came to evaluate it didn’t even hesitate, he just said have it cut down as soon as possible.

Just a quick update: the tree has now been cut down. I asked for the remains to be left to use around the garden and so they left it. However, the majority of the wood was stolen from our yard by some random person with a trailor. My wife managed to get photos of them as they returned for their second load and they saw her and drove off. The photo of their license plates is too blurry to make out unfortunately but I do have a good shot of the driver. I can’t see the point in involving the police for a trailer load of wood that I would most likely have given away. At least they left us the mulch.

What kind of person would steal lumps of wood from a strangers yard anyway?

“If you had been poisoned by them you wouldn’t be so smart. …when did you leave school?”

Wookie’s don’t go to school. They smoke billys with gruff goats.

stonedwookie said :

Please think of the children!!!! LOL get a life you old whingers how about we get rid of all the roads because there’s cars on them that might hit your little kiddies next bread cause they might choke on it.
Im sure your kids will be whinging about YOU! when there’s no tree’s n oxygen cause you idiot bogans have cut them all down then hopefully they will die off and remove your poor genetics from the gene pool!

Don’t be a complete idiot, Stonedwookie.

The ACT Government did remove a few species of gums known to suddenly drop large limbs from their school grounds and had others inspected and pruned. They replaced trees with safe species.

In the same way they removed asbestos (ALL loose asbestos I had thought) and schools had to remove a range of toxic chemicals from the science technology and art departments.

If you had been poisoned by them you wouldn’t be so smart. …when did you leave school?

Pawlonia: http://www.finegardening.com/plantguide/paulownia-tomentosa-empress-tree.aspx
Native of China. Leaves up to 600mm wide (yes that ain’t a typo!). Invasive, fast growing. A risky prospect in Queensland, less so here – like camphor laurel in a lot of ways I guess.
Key risk here I’d say would be blocking up your drains with the giant leaves, leading to localised flooding.

miz said :

I wasn’t aware they were frost resistant. I assume, too, that it’s evergreen.

There seem to be plenty of native trees other than eucs that grow in more temperate zones (eg moreton bay fig, flame tree, jacaranda – is that a native? not sure), but Canberra has a very European winter and a harsh summer.

Deciduous exotics are ideal as it’s useful if the tree sheds leaves to allow winter sun in.

I have a paulownia tree in my front yard. it is deciduous, and is a native. The canberra rex used to have a large one near the entrance, don’t know if it is still there. These trees are native to qld, and have really large leaves that provide heaps of shade. if the act govt planted a few more, I wouldn’t complain. they also flower in spring, and are also known as the princess tree….

Please think of the children!!!! LOL get a life you old whingers how about we get rid of all the roads because there’s cars on them that might hit your little kiddies next bread cause they might choke on it.
Im sure your kids will be whinging about YOU! when there’s no tree’s n oxygen cause you idiot bogans have cut them all down then hopefully they will die off and remove your poor genetics from the gene pool!

IMO one day we will be posting about those massive trees that have outstretched branches over Athlon drive crushing a car or causing a massive pile up
have you seen them?> driving from woden to tuggers just before the main traffic lights
or do i worry too much

remember living in wanniassa hearing a thud in the evening and near 800kg of wood later the neighbours front yard was cleared up

not good

I like big trees, ant.

I just think, either buy a home or block with a big tree on it because you like it or buy one without if you don’t.

Why buy something with a big tree you know you’re not allowed to remove and then complain because there’s a big tree in your yard that you can’t get rid of?

We bought our block because it was right next door to a magnificent big gum that had to stay per the plan, but we deliberately didn’t buy the block it was growing on.

Granny said :

It always amazes me that people buy homes with large trees then complain about them.

Well, Granny, many people have not yet made the connection between leafy suburbs and property values… I think there’s a lot of people in Gunghalin waiting for it to become the next manuka, having missed the fact that the big thing there is Big Trees. Lots of them.

A gum once stole my car and ate all the food in my fridge…

This is due to the poor parenting skills of the current generation of baby-bonus-fuelled gum-tree parents, I reckon.

The increased branch-dropping is due to the ongoing drought. We’ve been in drought, pretty-much, for many many years. The only really wet year I remember in recent times is 98. The trees have had to deal with longer and longer periods of extreme dry broken by shortish periods of storm rain. when did we last see floods (not roadway flash floods) in this region? They used to be regular.

I got back here last night, and after a month the damage being shown by my gums was a real worry. Whole bits of trees are just frazzling away. I’ve put a lot of effort into establishing many gums out here after the vandal farmers who had this area killed many massive gums, and this long dry is harming them. The deep soil never seems to build up moisture levels before the next dry stretch hits.

I had 10 gums on my block when I moved in. I was able to remove 9, leaving 1 on the nature strip. Cost me a fortune, but it was worth it.

I wouldn’t build under one. Which is why we changed our minds about a few otherwise very nice blocks of land. Bad enough the blocks with eucalypts on them but some had eucalypts just over the boundary on the neighbours block. What rights does one have to require a neighbour to get an arborist in regularly? Oh well, that’s one solar panelled grey watered house that wasn’t built.

I love gum trees. In all of the houses I have owned over the years – and there’s been lots – the best ones have had Aussie gums.

I-filed said :

when did an oak limb last fall anywhere in Canberra?

As an SES member I have been to more gums than Oaks, but its not unheard of.

bigfeet said :

Mono… thank you for your efforts in stimulating the economy.

You are either keeping lots of lawyers in business…or keeping the bubblewrap industry in business as you wrap your entire family in it.

Maybe. But so many cases where those who sued won need never have been defended. In the cases when it is a government department or big business they do these for bloody mindedness or as a deliberate policy to outspend the litigants. Spare a thought for the person injured through someone else’s carelessness or stupidity.

old canberran said :

Each of us has a responsibility to try and protect ourselves from injury. We can’t keep expecting others to do that for us.

Why shouldn’t we expect that appropriate care should be taken in cases where it is known that a danger exists. Are we supposed to case our children’s school playground and come down on the weekend with our chainsaw.

The big gum tree in our yard just dropped a large branch on the weekend. It landed next door, where my neighbours 2 and 4 year old play on their swing set. I estimate the branch missed it by 2m. The remainder of the tree will be gone by the end of the week. The government inspector who came to evaluate it didn’t even hesitate, he just said have it cut down as soon as possible.

Well, I have my chainsaw ready and I still need winter firewood. Where is this week of winter warming? I’ll clean it up tomorrow while you lot are still standing round talking.

I wasn’t aware they were frost resistant. I assume, too, that it’s evergreen.

There seem to be plenty of native trees other than eucs that grow in more temperate zones (eg moreton bay fig, flame tree, jacaranda – is that a native? not sure), but Canberra has a very European winter and a harsh summer. Deciduous exotics are ideal as it’s useful if the tree sheds leaves to allow winter sun in.

miz said :

Al, natives that grow here in Canb are fine, I quite like natives on the whole but unfortunately they are intrinsically un-shady. Parks and playgrounds need shade in summer, as does the westerly and northerly aspects of the home.

Try the kurrajong Miz – beautiful tree, if slow growing. There are plenty of good native shade trees – think outside the euc box.

Each of us has a responsibility to try and protect ourselves from injury. We can’t keep expecting others to do that for us. Gum trees can be dangerous in an urban environment, so is stepping in front of a bus but we don’t do the latter because we are programmed to wait until it has gone by. Unfortunately we tend not to do the same with gum trees and we mostly forget they are even there.
Limb dropping is not the only problem with them either. They tend to fall over after a lot of rain during high wind as they are very shallow rooting. Therefore, gums next to houses are an unnecessary risk. Getting rid of them is good advice.

You can partly blame Kerry Tucker and the old Greens’ approach to deciduous trees. An 80-year-old oak was felled in the inner north (home to lots of birds) and the Greens thought it was a great idea, as the tree wasn’t a gum… when did an oak limb last fall anywhere in Canberra?

Mono… thank you for your efforts in stimulating the economy.

You are either keeping lots of lawyers in business…or keeping the bubblewrap industry in business as you wrap your entire family in it.

Granny said :

Would you sue your aging grandmother if it happened in her yard?

If I knew my grandmother’s yard had a tree that was likely to drop branches or was infested with snakes I would do something about it.

People and institutions are found liable if it can be shown that they knew or should have known that they had exposed an injured person to a dangerous situation that could have been avoided.

It is one reason we have safer workplaces.

Gungahlin Al said :

The arborist was clearly reluctant to recommend removal given the tree is “ancient”, has multiple hollows being used by various parrot species, and would likely live for some decades.

I hope there is some plan to put up (and maintain) nesting boxes for the native birds. As eucalypts, both alive and dead, disappear there is a real shortage of nesting spaces for our natives, and with mynah birds driving them out, they will become rarer and rarer in our suburbs.

Native birds will happily nest in a man made box if they are provided.

Al, natives that grow here in Canb are fine, I quite like natives on the whole but unfortunately they are intrinsically un-shady. Parks and playgrounds need shade in summer, as does the westerly and northerly aspects of the home.

bigfeet said :

When I lived in Cairns there were signs up all along the Esplanade about the dangers of falling coconuts. You would see three or four newspaper articles every year about someone being hospitalised from a coconut strike. Never heard of anyone being killed though.

there are actually professional tree climbers in cairns that specialise in removing coconuts from palm trees in heavily used areas….make quite a good deal of money too

When I lived in Cairns there were signs up all along the Esplanade about the dangers of falling coconuts. You would see three or four newspaper articles every year about someone being hospitalised from a coconut strike. Never heard of anyone being killed though.

It’s obvious that Drop Bears have been at work again.

Would you sue your aging grandmother if it happened in her yard?

Granny said :

And would you sue yourself if it happened on a family bushwalk?

willo said :

and how about if you or someone in your group was bitten by a snake on a bushwalk?…gonna sue then too?

Call me stupid but other than the falling branch I can’t see the similarity to the bush and a school playground. And if the playground was known to be infested by snakes and nothing was done and my child got bitten, too right I would.

and how about if you or someone in your group was bitten by a snake on a bushwalk?…gonna sue then too?

And would you sue yourself if it happened on a family bushwalk?

RachelPower said :

unfortunately we live in a society where common sense is over-ruled by the opportunity for a quick buck by suing someone/anyone.

It is a shame but the governement has to put signs up everywhere but I think it is a serious threat and common sense is not what it used to be.

Well if my child had been injured or killed in the school playground by a branch falling from a species of tree known to suddenly drop branches I would not hesitate to sue. How else can you get any action from people who value money more than the health of the children in their care.

I’ll agree with anyone who says ‘menace schmenace’.

Menace schmenace.

Gum trees

a Need to be limited and monitored
b Should be encouraged everywhere
–> c Its complicated

Gobbo said :

I would have voted for “encouraged and monitored”. But there is no option for me.

+1

Please! No more warning signs! Maybe an education campaign every now and then.

And in answer to those whose ask whose fault will it be if a tree falls: no-ones. Its a tree. Just because we can reduce a risk from miniscule to non-existent, does not mean we should. Eg we could reduce road fatalities dramatically by limiting all cars to 20kmh, and eliminate them by banning driving. But we don’t.

Life has risks. The risk of a healthy gum tree killing or injuring someone, other than in a storm or firestorm, is an acceptable risk, I reckon.

unfortunately we live in a society where common sense is over-ruled by the opportunity for a quick buck by suing someone/anyone.

Travelling around the country last year in a camper trailer I saw many signs warning of the trouble of falling limbs and not to camp under the gums – only problem was the you had to camp in designated areas and all of them were under gums! We saw what was a relatively small limb fall near our camp and it sliced through the coppers log barrier like it was butter.

It is a shame but the governement has to put signs up everywhere but I think it is a serious threat and common sense is not what it used to be.

dexi said :

English settlers called the gums Widowmakers. They learnt not to camp under them.

Just like I don’t park under the one on my nature strip.
It’s “common” sense.
Aside from having to whip out the chainsaw once every now and again it’s never caused me any harm.

Sure, if you’ve got a 50 footer 2 metres from your bedroom window, that’s a different story. But quite simply it would be impossible to maintain every tree in the ACT in a “safe” condition, so why would anyone risk accepting the liability of attempting to do so?

It always amazes me that people buy homes with large trees then complain about them.

English settlers called the gums Widowmakers. They learnt not to camp under them.

Welcome to Australia. There are eucalyptus trees here.

That being said, removing some branches is not that bad an idea.

anyone can have the 2 out the front of my house. Free to good home

I’d like to see the statistics of people killed by falling gum limbs in Canberra, or Australia, for that matter. I’d suggest the risk of it happening is miniscule, (even if Peter Carey did you use one to kill off poor old Harry Lovejoy). I’m not for a nanny state.

I imagine different species of Eucalyptus have a range of characteristics. I know that a number of years ago a student was badly injured by a falling gum limb and they looked at removing this species from schools. Brittle gum I think it was called.

I didn’t vote because the choices are too limited.

Canberra wouldn’t be Canberra without its profusion of gums.

dexi said :

“If said branch lands on a car or someone walking a dog who is to blame ?”

God.

ahhh so in reality i get sued for it ?

“If said branch lands on a car or someone walking a dog who is to blame ?”

God.

i have 2 huge ones on the nature strip of my house, they are always dropping large branches. I rang some DUS department and they came and pruned them (smashed my letter box at the same time). Still they drop the occasional large branch. If said branch lands on a car or someone walking a dog who is to blame ? and if they fall over and wipe my house out what then. Ive asked for them to be removed but basically get the not a chance reply even though they are taking the same ones down in the kids park one house away from me. Keep them locked up in a forest somewhere i say !

It is unfortunately the case that built up areas and big old eucs just don’t mix.

GCC (following up on concerns from some residents) this week received via the LDA an arborist report on the whopping great yellow box beside Flemington Road just north of Well Station drive (east side). The arborist was clearly reluctant to recommend removal given the tree is “ancient”, has multiple hollows being used by various parrot species, and would likely live for some decades. But he conceded that in what is going to be a highly built up area, the tree could not be rendered even close to safe without losing everything that made it valuable.

But Miz that doesn’t mean the answer is always some exotic deciduous either. There are plenty of appropriate native species and evergreens are quite OK in most situations.

Maybe not limited – but certainly monitored – warning signs erected a’la Sydney Bot Gardens Moreton Bay Figs.

I could imagine it could be a logistical nightmare for areas such as Mt Majura, Mt Ainslie, so maybe standard disclaimers on entry to these areas? – I dunno.

I say let them be (for the most part) and teach people what to expect from the environment in which they live. Wrapping everything up in bubble wrap and pretending that life isn’t dangerous is just asking for trouble.

Overwatering young eucalypts makes fast growing branches that the tree can’t support when it is larger, which are more susceptible to falling.

I remember reading this but can’t find the exact study.

You should consider yourselves blessed with these trees, they are very beautiful.

I think it also gets to a point where there’s an element of risk in life, even just getting in your car to drive down to the local shops.

“As Canberra gets older and the eucalypts get bigger is this something we need to get serious about?”

No. You just need to look after them. This would be true for all large trees in public places. They fall down if allowed to rot or if Mother Nature gives them a helping hand.

Plus, because there is an obesity epidemic, the drop bears are fatter then normal, thus overloading the trees.

I would have voted for “encouraged and monitored”. But there is no option for me.

Does extreme and prolonged heat, as recently experienced in town, make gums more fragile?

Yes. When they get stressed they do tend to drop off branches.

Australia. Home to most of the world’s most deadly snakes, spiders, and sharks (who have been putting on a good show of late). Eucalyptus trees Vs snakes Vs spiders Vs sharks – I’ll take the trees any day.

I live in a 50 year old suburb that has many large apple box gumtrees and it is amazing how often large limbs fall down.

As long as people are sensible and don’t have branches too close to their homes and pay attention to branches that they are sitting under if having a picnic, then I see no problem.

Does extreme and prolonged heat, as recently experienced in town, make gums more fragile?

I really don’t know what the answer to this one is.

Driving along a rural road in Victoria once, a huge branch only just missed the car in front of us. The shocked driver pulled over and some locals told him it happens quite frequently. As we continued driving, we noticed the number of fallen branches littering the road with a heightened awareness.

I just adore trees of all kinds and hate to see them removed, but a Canberra without gum trees is especially hard to imagine.

Then again, I am still traumatised by Judy’s tragic end in Seven Little Australians.

When I say ‘newer’ I mean, as opposed to inner north and inner south which have a lot of deciduous.

Gums are useless shade trees. Gums in parks need to be replaced with decent deciduous shade trees (particularly in the newer suburbs where gums were planted prolifically). It will make a big difference to park usage – a number of smaller suburban parks near me (tuggeranong) are so hot and weed infested you rarely see anyone there.