Winter gas bill

Sorry to zombify, but I just paid the gas bill for the last three months, which was $968, making a total of whatever $881 and $968 is for the last six months. (I remembered this thread, where I mentioned my last bill, which is the only reason I can quote the amount. They’re too depressing to keep.) This strikes me as quite a lot for a two bedroom house with three people in it.

As I think I said before, in the 1950s, when the house was built, I think people had a different idea of what was acceptable. Certainly, insulation meant wearing a vest if our house is any indicator. They must have accepted cold as part of life, I think.

This is also for cooking and hot water though.

dpm said :

Coldandsad said :

We just got our $1800 bill for the last 105 days. Devastated. We only bought the house in May. We don’t have gas cooking or water, it is just the ducted gas heater. Have already had three people come and look at the heater (as it wasn’t working properly) and now I don’t know what to do, whether we should gt it looked at again or is that just throwing more good money after bad.

We don’t heat excessively. It’s a 4 bed, 2 living area house. We heat to 20 degrees between 7-8am and 5 – 9pm, 14 degrees overnight (as we have an 11 month old) and despite the people saying put a jumper on, the air is cold and breathing is the issue.

That seems way wrong to me.
Why don’t you post your MJ/day amount here and people with similar-sized houses could compare with theirs and see if the amount of gas being used is similar?
We haven’t got our winter bill yet (due soon) but this time last year our bill said 351MJ/day (and was 192 the year before!). That is for a smaller house (~17sq), but with the temp set at 20 *all* day (as people are home all day) and 14 overnight. We also have a gas-plumbed BBQ which we use ~fortnightly over winter for one dinner. If your MJ is over double that, then i’d say there are problems.

Also our house would be about 20 squares.

dpm said :

Coldandsad said :

We just got our $1800 bill for the last 105 days. Devastated. We only bought the house in May. We don’t have gas cooking or water, it is just the ducted gas heater. Have already had three people come and look at the heater (as it wasn’t working properly) and now I don’t know what to do, whether we should gt it looked at again or is that just throwing more good money after bad.

We don’t heat excessively. It’s a 4 bed, 2 living area house. We heat to 20 degrees between 7-8am and 5 – 9pm, 14 degrees overnight (as we have an 11 month old) and despite the people saying put a jumper on, the air is cold and breathing is the issue.

That seems way wrong to me.
Why don’t you post your MJ/day amount here and people with similar-sized houses could compare with theirs and see if the amount of gas being used is similar?
We haven’t got our winter bill yet (due soon) but this time last year our bill said 351MJ/day (and was 192 the year before!). That is for a smaller house (~17sq), but with the temp set at 20 *all* day (as people are home all day) and 14 overnight. We also have a gas-plumbed BBQ which we use ~fortnightly over winter for one dinner. If your MJ is over double that, then i’d say there are problems.

The bill says we’re using 664.64mj per day. I just don’t know why. The heater did blow the ducting off but we noticed and had it shut off till the next day and then got someone around to fix it the next day.

Coldandsad said :

We just got our $1800 bill for the last 105 days. Devastated. We only bought the house in May. We don’t have gas cooking or water, it is just the ducted gas heater. Have already had three people come and look at the heater (as it wasn’t working properly) and now I don’t know what to do, whether we should gt it looked at again or is that just throwing more good money after bad.

We don’t heat excessively. It’s a 4 bed, 2 living area house. We heat to 20 degrees between 7-8am and 5 – 9pm, 14 degrees overnight (as we have an 11 month old) and despite the people saying put a jumper on, the air is cold and breathing is the issue.

That seems way wrong to me.
Why don’t you post your MJ/day amount here and people with similar-sized houses could compare with theirs and see if the amount of gas being used is similar?
We haven’t got our winter bill yet (due soon) but this time last year our bill said 351MJ/day (and was 192 the year before!). That is for a smaller house (~17sq), but with the temp set at 20 *all* day (as people are home all day) and 14 overnight. We also have a gas-plumbed BBQ which we use ~fortnightly over winter for one dinner. If your MJ is over double that, then i’d say there are problems.

We just got our $1800 bill for the last 105 days. Devastated. We only bought the house in May. We don’t have gas cooking or water, it is just the ducted gas heater. Have already had three people come and look at the heater (as it wasn’t working properly) and now I don’t know what to do, whether we should gt it looked at again or is that just throwing more good money after bad.

We don’t heat excessively. It’s a 4 bed, 2 living area house. We heat to 20 degrees between 7-8am and 5 – 9pm, 14 degrees overnight (as we have an 11 month old) and despite the people saying put a jumper on, the air is cold and breathing is the issue.

Just got a $1600 bill for the last quarter. 4BR home that takes forever to heat up. R5.0 insulation in the ceiling which I had done a year ago, didn’t seem to make any difference.

20 degrees while we’re at home, 18 degrees overnight – only because the heater doesn’t keep up, and if we set it to 18, it might make it to 15 or 16 degrees by 6am the next morning.

Wife wants to sell the house now.

3BR home, not really sure on the insulation, only renting. We have recycled air con / heating but also run an oil fin heater in the main bedroom and a heat radiator in another room, and use blankets on the couch in the living room. We have solar hot water, winter bill was $600 for the quarter

snoopydoc said :

In winter: $130-150
Rest of the year: $50
4 bedroom house, 220 square metres, gas used for hot water, cooking and heating.

Your summer bill is less than the supply charge. Something’s not right there.

I’d be ringing ActewAGL. My mum got a bill for over $500 and she thought it was a bit high and made a call. A few days later she received a letter saying there was an error in the meter reading..

Wily_Bear said :

montana said :

kakosi said :

Gas is expensive and we were all duped into thinking it would be a cheaper “environmentally friendly” option. And it’s neither of those two things. So glad I went with reverse cycle electric air con as it’s much cheaper than your gas bills.

good luck using reverse cycle heater in the morning when its anything colder than 2 degrees outside, which in winter happens quite often.

I have reverse cycle on 24/7 in my four bedroom house for the entire winter, the naysayers all insisted it wouldn’t work below -5, it doesn’t struggle until around -8 degrees, and that has only happened once in my time here. I could not cope with the unique hell that is Canberra without the heater on all the time, and refuse to allow my kids to live like cave dwellers. That said, if I was paying some of the bills mentioned here, I might change my mind. My most recent bill was $570, bearing in mind that includes cooking, heating, drying and hot water. Why on earth would anyone choose gas?

+1 , As I already mentioned, our reverse splits run 24/7 on cold days and we never have problems with sub zero temperatures. They have inbuilt de-frost so it might drop out for a while to melt the ice, but kicks straight back in after a few minutes. Technology is a wonderful thing.
They also have filters that take out pollen, dust etc. from the air and de-humidify so that the windows don’t get all black and moldy in winter. Just remember to clean the filters or they don’t work to full efficiency. [About every two to three weeks at our place because of the nasty dust-bunnies]

In winter: $130-150

Rest of the year: $50

4 bedroom house, 220 square metres, gas used for hot water, cooking and heating.

My daughter’s small family live in a newish, well insulated 4 bedroom house with ducted gas and gas stove. Solar HWS. She switches heat off at 8.30am, back on 5ish for 4 hours.
$717 for the last three months. OMG.
She has now set up a direct debit to AGL of $50 a fortnight which hopefully will build up before next winter.

fabforty said :

Craig1 said :

We just got our first gas bill in the mail today. Just under $1300 for less than 90 days. We have instant gas hot water, gas cooktop and floor ducted gas heating. We have been running the heating from about 5pm to 10pm at 17degrees, 10 degrees overnight (which means it never turns on) and 15 degrees until about 8 or 9 in the morning. A bit of a shock – didn’t think it would be that high.

Holy Hell Craig. Get someone in to check your system is working properly ASAP and/or make sure ACTEW has read your meter properly. That cannot be right.

You are not wrong. After a bit of investigating and some crawling around in the cavity under the house I may have found the reason (not that it will change the bill). When we first moved we had someone do some work under the house – looks like they have cut one of the pieces of hanging tape to run a pipe along the underside of the floor. Immediately under the new pipe (and where the hanging tape had been cut) the ducting had dropped and then split at a join allowing about a third of the volume of heated air to escape. Unfortunately this was all in the large diameter ducting not far from the heater unit. So we had a lovely heated cavity under the house.

montana said :

kakosi said :

Gas is expensive and we were all duped into thinking it would be a cheaper “environmentally friendly” option. And it’s neither of those two things. So glad I went with reverse cycle electric air con as it’s much cheaper than your gas bills.

good luck using reverse cycle heater in the morning when its anything colder than 2 degrees outside, which in winter happens quite often.

I have reverse cycle on 24/7 in my four bedroom house for the entire winter, the naysayers all insisted it wouldn’t work below -5, it doesn’t struggle until around -8 degrees, and that has only happened once in my time here. I could not cope with the unique hell that is Canberra without the heater on all the time, and refuse to allow my kids to live like cave dwellers. That said, if I was paying some of the bills mentioned here, I might change my mind. My most recent bill was $570, bearing in mind that includes cooking, heating, drying and hot water. Why on earth would anyone choose gas?

Craig1 said :

We just got our first gas bill in the mail today. Just under $1300 for less than 90 days. We have instant gas hot water, gas cooktop and floor ducted gas heating. We have been running the heating from about 5pm to 10pm at 17degrees, 10 degrees overnight (which means it never turns on) and 15 degrees until about 8 or 9 in the morning. A bit of a shock – didn’t think it would be that high.

Holy Hell Craig. Get someone in to check your system is working properly ASAP and/or make sure ACTEW has read your meter properly. That cannot be right.

Hooley Dooley, I shudder to think what mine will be. For the first time I’ve set mine at 17C all night, just to see what would happen to the bill. 21 from 7-9 and 5-10 could be huge.

Lucky that self employment means my gas is 30% tax payer funded

We just got our first gas bill in the mail today. Just under $1300 for less than 90 days. We have instant gas hot water, gas cooktop and floor ducted gas heating. We have been running the heating from about 5pm to 10pm at 17degrees, 10 degrees overnight (which means it never turns on) and 15 degrees until about 8 or 9 in the morning. A bit of a shock – didn’t think it would be that high.

KB1971 said :

Fair anough, thats your thing but I would be going & buying a better doona 🙂

Or a fatter husband. He’s too fit and slim.

poetix said :

KB1971 said :

poetix said :

Madam Cholet said :

I can’t believe how many people run their heating at night! Ever heard of more blankets? Our house has got as low as 9 degrees overnight which is still perfectly fine to get up and then put the heating on and shock horror, put a jumper and pair of socks on.

Never. We run the ducted heating all the time (a little lower at night). Hence our extraordinary bill.

Plus I use an electric blanket all night, and, only when strictly necessary, cuddling.

I am not prepared to be cold. You might as well live in a tent as get down to 9 degrees.

Forgive me Poetix but I cant help but see the irony here.

You are a vegitarian right? Presumably becuase you dont like what happens to animals? I respect that, no issue there but then you are happy to waste other parts of the earths resources because you are cold?

I know no one is perfect but I just fnd it funny how some people have high principles in one area completely miss another.

I was raised to turn all of this off when not using it, for the waste & the cost.

We’re all full of contradictions! I just have memories of a much too cold house while growing up. And being so cold as a student that I wore gloves while trying to study. I just don’t see this heating expenditure as waste. No doubt the cost will continue to climb, but this would be one of the last things I would choose to sacrifice. It’s a kind of therapy…

On the other hand, most of my day to day transport is a bike (except for one brief return car trip per day) so I probably use much less petrol than the average Canberran. I agree that my stance is at least arguably weird, but consistency is not one of my major aims in life.

Fair anough, thats your thing but I would be going & buying a better doona 🙂

KB1971 said :

poetix said :

Madam Cholet said :

I can’t believe how many people run their heating at night! Ever heard of more blankets? Our house has got as low as 9 degrees overnight which is still perfectly fine to get up and then put the heating on and shock horror, put a jumper and pair of socks on.

Never. We run the ducted heating all the time (a little lower at night). Hence our extraordinary bill.

Plus I use an electric blanket all night, and, only when strictly necessary, cuddling.

I am not prepared to be cold. You might as well live in a tent as get down to 9 degrees.

Forgive me Poetix but I cant help but see the irony here.

You are a vegitarian right? Presumably becuase you dont like what happens to animals? I respect that, no issue there but then you are happy to waste other parts of the earths resources because you are cold?

I know no one is perfect but I just fnd it funny how some people have high principles in one area completely miss another.

I was raised to turn all of this off when not using it, for the waste & the cost.

We’re all full of contradictions! I just have memories of a much too cold house while growing up. And being so cold as a student that I wore gloves while trying to study. I just don’t see this heating expenditure as waste. No doubt the cost will continue to climb, but this would be one of the last things I would choose to sacrifice. It’s a kind of therapy…

On the other hand, most of my day to day transport is a bike (except for one brief return car trip per day) so I probably use much less petrol than the average Canberran. I agree that my stance is at least arguably weird, but consistency is not one of my major aims in life.

16 or 17 is warm enough for me with a thermal top! 🙂 If it’s wear it or pay for it we take wear it. The heater is never on over night.

We must be scabby – err spartan too.

kakosi said :

Gas is expensive and we were all duped into thinking it would be a cheaper “environmentally friendly” option. And it’s neither of those two things. So glad I went with reverse cycle electric air con as it’s much cheaper than your gas bills.

good luck using reverse cycle heater in the morning when its anything colder than 2 degrees outside, which in winter happens quite often.

Call me a spartan. I only heat the kitchen/family room, set at 18C. My house has a fantastic solar aspect, with north facing glass along most of it, so the sun does the job during the day. I only turn the heating on when I arrive home about 6.30pm, and it turns off at 9.30pm with enough residual heat to see me through to bedtime. No heating in the morning, as I’m up and moving to get ready for work anyway, though if I’m feeling a bit sooky, I may heat the south facing bathroom with a column heater for half an hour.

I have electric radiant heating. It works really well, but costs a bomb to run, as I’m paying NSW prices. I’m expecting, even with my spartan habits, a bill of at least $700 for June-August months. The only gas I have is for hot water.

I’m with you, Madame Cholet. Heating a house overnight? Can’t see the point. I have a nice warm doona and sleep with the window open, as I like the fresh air.

I once lived in a rental in Kingston that was south facing, no insulation, tiny windows and no heating. I take the lesson in miserable cold from that when I buy my houses and will not consider one that doesn’t have a northerly aspect. It is madness to not build for the climate.

poetix said :

Madam Cholet said :

I can’t believe how many people run their heating at night! Ever heard of more blankets? Our house has got as low as 9 degrees overnight which is still perfectly fine to get up and then put the heating on and shock horror, put a jumper and pair of socks on.

Never. We run the ducted heating all the time (a little lower at night). Hence our extraordinary bill.

Plus I use an electric blanket all night, and, only when strictly necessary, cuddling.

I am not prepared to be cold. You might as well live in a tent as get down to 9 degrees.

Forgive me Poetix but I cant help but see the irony here.

You are a vegitarian right? Presumably becuase you dont like what happens to animals? I respect that, no issue there but then you are happy to waste other parts of the earths resources because you are cold?

I know no one is perfect but I just fnd it funny how some people have high principles in one area completely miss another.

I was raised to turn all of this off when not using it, for the waste & the cost.

Madam Cholet said :

I can’t believe how many people run their heating at night! Ever heard of more blankets? Our house has got as low as 9 degrees overnight which is still perfectly fine to get up and then put the heating on and shock horror, put a jumper and pair of socks on.

Never. We run the ducted heating all the time (a little lower at night). Hence our extraordinary bill.

Plus I use an electric blanket all night, and, only when strictly necessary, cuddling.

I am not prepared to be cold. You might as well live in a tent as get down to 9 degrees.

I can’t believe how many people run their heating at night! Ever heard of more blankets? Our house has got as low as 9 degrees overnight which is still perfectly fine to get up and then put the heating on and shock horror, put a jumper and pair of socks on.

Try engaging the H.E.A.T. team – costs $30 for an audit (alot better than the fed govt green loans audits). I found Kath Byrne very good – knew her stuff and came up with some great ideas. There are rebates of up to $500 (+30 back) if you implement some of the recommendation in the report they do. The real value is in how they explain whats going on, and their recommendations. Kath did a great job of this.

Our previous quarter was $225. This “winter” quarter it was $770.
We rent a newish house with partial insulation, though the sun only hits the bedrooms and not the main living areas. Although it’s new, it’s a cold house with all tiled floors…nothing to retain the heat.
We set the thermostat to a min of 16.5 and it’s never dropped below that except on really cold nights, and it goes to 20 between 6am-8am, then 6pm and 10pm.
We cook on gas.
We have one of these Rheem instant hot water heaters, about 1 year old…it’s absolute rubbish, but maybe it’s a cheap underpowered model, as you see in rentals. Takes 1 minute before you notice the water warming so the water and gas wastage is awful.
Next winter we’ll try electric convectors for the mornings and just heat the bathroom.

I submitted comment #3 to OP. Today I got our gas bill for the last 3 months. Am happy to advise it’s dropped down from $1100+GST last year to $476 (GST incl) this year.

Changes we’ve made this winter include:
– not using the heater of a morning or before 5pm
– using heater for max 2hrs a night
– reduced thermostat to 19 degs max
– closing doors to bathrooms & toilets
– ensuring blinds are closed when the heater is on
– reducing the length of showers

Because there’s ducted gas heating in this place, we can’t really restrict the heating to only the rooms we want. Even so, I’m pretty happy with the results of our “experiment” to see how we could reduce our bill. We now have a good baseline to budget for – from the extreme high of the first bill to the low of the second. I’ll admit we were cold sometimes, but it wasn’t as bad as it could have been. Feels good to keep $700 in our pocket, rather than give it to ACTEWAGL.

Have also made some changes with our electricity usage and that bill has decreased too – by about 30% from same time last year.

Power to the consumer!!!

Ours was $1150 for the last 3 months. Absolutely shocking. We’re in a rental with basically no insulation. With ducted gas heating, we keep it heated to 20 at night because otherwise it’s freezing. We have it set on a timer during the day so it goes down to 12 and then up to 18 when we get home, and then we turn it up to 22. But we spent 3 years in Auckland where we had to run electric heaters all the time and we were always freezing, and the electric bills were $500/month. We’re paying about the same here but at least we’re warm. We’ll buy our own place within a year or so, so at this point, we’re just chalking it up to the cost of renting.

$826 for March to June this year. Gas heating & Water. equiv of R6 insulation in roof. Use of blockout blinds on windows. 4 females in 25sq house, 2 males. Heating set on 16 at night as we have a 3 year old.

Avg usage for period last year was 496MJ where this year its 375MJ…which shows the difference in getting the insulation topped up I presume.

dtc said :

aidan said :

I’d be interested if anyone has replaced an old gas central heating unit with a more efficient new model and noticed significant decreases in their bill. Clearly new ducting would also have a big effect, but I’m wondering just how much. Our unit is getting close to the end of it’s useful life and I’m wondering what to replace it with..

When I had my (oldish) central heater serviced, the service guy reckoned the new heaters are a bit more efficient but not hugely – not worthwhile if your existing heater was operational. However, if you are moving from a heater that doesnt allow zoning to one that has zoning, then it is a saving.

Not quite true. All systems have a minimum number of outlets. So unless you can zone into blocks that go that small you won’t benefit from zoning. For example my place has 7 outlets but the system has a minimum outlet requirement of 6.

Where zoning comes into play is if you have a house large enough to make it worthwhile. Say 10-12 outlets, where you could zone them down to zones of 7-8 (noting with zoning you usually have a common zone).

aidan said :

Thanks for that. The COP ranged from about 2.3 to 3.0 for typical Canberra morning temperatures. The heat pumps in that graph were air-to-water models designed for hydronic (radiator) heating applications. As an air-to-air heat pump is likely to operate at lower output temperatures the COP would probably be higher.

Here’s one for air-to-air, the only catch is that the outside temperature is the wet-bulb temperature, but given that the humidity tends to approach 100% at dawn it wouldn’t be too wrong to assume it’s the same as the dry-bulb.

dtc said :

aidan said :

I’d be interested if anyone has replaced an old gas central heating unit with a more efficient new model and noticed significant decreases in their bill. Clearly new ducting would also have a big effect, but I’m wondering just how much. Our unit is getting close to the end of it’s useful life and I’m wondering what to replace it with..

When I had my (oldish) central heater serviced, the service guy reckoned the new heaters are a bit more efficient but not hugely – not worthwhile if your existing heater was operational. However, if you are moving from a heater that doesnt allow zoning to one that has zoning, then it is a saving.

Thanks.

I’ve subsequently found this very comprehensive “Product Profile” of Gas Ducted Heating systems:

http://www.energyrating.gov.au/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/201102-gas-ducted-heaters.pdf

Table 9 gives some estimation of the benefits of a 4-star system over a 5-star system when a new heater is to be installed. It is a useful place to start when thinking about this stuff.

dtc said :

The easiest way to save heating costs is to only heat the area you are using and block off the rest of the house. For example, a heater (or wood stove) in the living room can mean you dont need to turn your heating on for the rest of the house until just before bedtime. However, it does mean that you cant wander around the rest of the house in comfort – toilet breaks can be a very quick dash!

We already zone our heating by partially, or fully, closing the “heating registers” (floor vents) in different parts of the house. However, we are a family of 5, with 3 children 10 and under. We just tend to use most of the house most of the time.

aidan said :

I’d be interested if anyone has replaced an old gas central heating unit with a more efficient new model and noticed significant decreases in their bill. Clearly new ducting would also have a big effect, but I’m wondering just how much. Our unit is getting close to the end of it’s useful life and I’m wondering what to replace it with..

When I had my (oldish) central heater serviced, the service guy reckoned the new heaters are a bit more efficient but not hugely – not worthwhile if your existing heater was operational. However, if you are moving from a heater that doesnt allow zoning to one that has zoning, then it is a saving.

The easiest way to save heating costs is to only heat the area you are using and block off the rest of the house. For example, a heater (or wood stove) in the living room can mean you dont need to turn your heating on for the rest of the house until just before bedtime. However, it does mean that you cant wander around the rest of the house in comfort – toilet breaks can be a very quick dash!

davo101 said :

aidan said :

Those who have heat pumps, are they effective on really cold mornings? As far as I can tell their efficiency plummets when the outside temperature is very low, and this is when we need the bulk of our heating.

See this curve. The other variable is how often the outside unit has to go through its defrost cycle. Apparently this is more of an issue when the outside temperature is in the 0-5 deg.C range.

Thanks for that. The COP ranged from about 2.3 to 3.0 for typical Canberra morning temperatures. The heat pumps in that graph were air-to-water models designed for hydronic (radiator) heating applications. As an air-to-air heat pump is likely to operate at lower output temperatures the COP would probably be higher.

What I really need for my place is more thermal mass. It is very pleasant during the day, but it cools down too quickly at night. Unlike the European systems, I don’t really want to heat my house to a constant temperature pretty much 24/7.

It would be great if phase change energy storage systems were mainstream, e.g.

http://solar-thermal.anu.edu.au/low-temperature/air-heaters/

We have heaps of solar gain during the day, just need to save it up for the mornings and evenings.

aidan said :

Those who have heat pumps, are they effective on really cold mornings? As far as I can tell their efficiency plummets when the outside temperature is very low, and this is when we need the bulk of our heating.

See this curve. The other variable is how often the outside unit has to go through its defrost cycle. Apparently this is more of an issue when the outside temperature is in the 0-5 deg.C range.

It’s important to remember also that the temperature you set the heating at makes an ENORMOUS difference to the amount of energy consumed. And as the differential between inside and outside temperature increases, so does the rate at which heat bleeds from inside.

Gas central heating, ducted through floor. Heater is an old (20+years) Brivis Buffalo, original ducting. 140m2 single level 4bdr 70s brick veneer (extended recently, ceiling and wall insulation, floor insulation in the new bits).

Thermostat set to 17 in the morning. Comes on at 7am and typically takes 45-50 mins to reach temperature (falls to 12 overnight, maybe colder on REALLY cold mornings).

North facing living areas mean the heater isn’t needed at all on sunny days.

The heater is set to come on in the evenings, again 17/18, but it cycles on and off fairly infrequently and is off overnight.

Mid Apr -> mid Jul $400. Usually the same for the next quarter.

I’d be interested if anyone has replaced an old gas central heating unit with a more efficient new model and noticed significant decreases in their bill. Clearly new ducting would also have a big effect, but I’m wondering just how much. Our unit is getting close to the end of it’s useful life and I’m wondering what to replace it with.

Those who have heat pumps, are they effective on really cold mornings? As far as I can tell their efficiency plummets when the outside temperature is very low, and this is when we need the bulk of our heating.

Sustainable House Day 9 September
http://www.sustainablehouseday.com/

JC said :

GardeningGirl said :

I agree, landlords should be required to provide a reasonable minimum appropriate to the climate without imposing on the tenants to fund what should have been provided in the first place. I’ve know of some landlords who paid part or all the water bill or paid for a gardener, in order to keep the exterior of their investment in good condition. Why can’t there be some system of penalties/incentives for them to put money into the inside of the house? Something such as make it compulsory for landlords of properties below a certain energy rating to either pay and keep paying half the electricity bills or pay once for the improvements that will bring the property up to that energy rating? Unfortunately I don’t think much of the energy rating system, but that’s a whole other discussion.

Time to come into the real world I am afraid. For one if you force people to spend money then that money needs to be recouped through higher rental costs. Simple economics. Secondly a lot of rental properties are private residencies rented out whilst the owner is living elsewhere. So are you suggesting that someone looking to rent out for 1, 2, 3 years should be forced to upgrade just for the convenience of the tenant?

Personally the rental market is open to market force. Owners ask for the rent they think the property is worth and the tenant agrees by signing a lease. As a tenant if you are not happy with the property you inspect then you do have the choice to not rent and look elsewhere. Of course doing so may mean you pay more, but that is the market at play.

And before I get accused of being a greedy landlord, please don’t. I was a landlord for 3 years when I lived overseas and I looked after my tenants, even installing aircon. However you wouldn’t believe that the tenant in the house at the time then seriously asked me to pay for the water that the aircon used.

I know. It just doesn’t seem right.

On a personal level, it’s unfair that most tenants will not have the luxury of rejecting one property because there’s always a broadly comparable one but with better comfort and economy just around the corner, and if there ever was such an oversupply that tenants could easily pick and choose then it wouldn’t be a good situation for landlords. (I’ve been both.)

In the big picture, as long as there’s a proportion of housing that is inefficient and the owners have no incentive to change that, it makes the compulsory cfl’s and plastic bag bans and other token efforts at saving the planet an even bigger joke. I don’t know what the best answer is but letting those houses continue wasting energy because the tenants have no choice and the owners have no interest isn’t something that can continue to be ignored.

frankie said :

This is a very informative thread, thanks to everyone for adding their 2 cents!

I know the topic is regarding gas bills for heating, but I just wanted to ask if anyone has found definitively whether or not gas is better than electric for internal heating? My partner and I live in an old 4 bedroom EER 1.0 house with 2 other people, and last winter we had the electric internal heater turned on 24/7 for about 2 months, resulting in a quarterly electric bill of $951! We’re building our house at present and are putting in a gas heater… but talk of solar-powered electric heating on this thread seems as though it might be a better option cost-wise?

Thanks!

It isn’t only how the electricity is produced (solar) but how efficiently it is used that matters. I remember seeing comparison charts that showed reverse cycle was very good but that was many years ago so I don’t know how things have evolved since those measurements were done. We’ve been told to keep the heating on overnight otherwise the booster has to work harder to bring the temperature back up and it’s the booster that’s the most inefficient part. If you want to find out more you should go on the annual Sustainable House Tour, I think it’s this month?

Erg0 said :

Didn’t the Greens propose some sort of scheme along the lines of that being discussed above? No idea what came of it, a more motivated individual could probably find it with the search function.

They did, and it got thrown out (as it should).

MERC600 said :

Comic_and_Gamer_Nerd said :

Gas is the worst. Put a fire place in and for the cost of nothing more than some physical work we have zero bill. In fact, because of solar panels on the roof, our last electricity bill was 350 in credit.

Insulation, laminated glass in some windows, secondary glazing in others, our house is always toasty.

Secondary glazing is fine in Canberra, no need for double glazing unless you have the spare cash.

Am familar with double glazing, and its cost, but what please is ‘secondary glazing’. Thanks

Depending on your window frames, you can install a secondary piece of glass to the inside of the frame, not as effecient as double glazing but a lot cheaper and still makes a huge difference.
Or things like magnetite, although im not sure of their costing.
also glass fitted in a aluminiyum sliding system to be fitted onto existing reveals. There really are lots of cheap options.

milkman said :

Truthiness said :

I’ve lived in 20+ rentals in Canberra and not one of them had decent insulation, consequently the heating bills were always astronomical. land lords don’t care, they have zero motivation to spend money which will only save their tenants money.

oh how I wish the government would make insulation and double glazing mandatory, it would cut so many emissions and save so much money for the poor.

the current house didn’t even have curtains, just a single inefficient 4kw heater facing an open window in a room with no doors. we made our own curtains and bought an oil heater, but the next tenant will have to do the same thing. bloody greedy land lords.

it wouldn’t be so bad if it were possible for the poor to buy houses. the current massively over priced housing market means the only people who can afford houses are those who already have one, or are willing to spend 30 years in indentured servitude to a bankster.

After living on so many rentals I’d have thought you’d get better at choosing, or buy your own.

Harsh, but not unreasonable.

If you want your landlord to put additional heating/cooling/insulation in your rental home, talk to them about it, and work out how much extra rent you’d be willing to pay. I’d certainly entertain that kind of discussion with my tenants.

Didn’t the Greens propose some sort of scheme along the lines of that being discussed above? No idea what came of it, a more motivated individual could probably find it with the search function.

More than anything, I’m surprised at how much some people run their heating – ours is only on (at 21.5 degrees) for an hour in the morning and maybe an hour in the evening if it’s particularly chilly. With hot water, this gives us a bill of around $200 in winter and $70 for each of the other three quarters. Could be because our last place didn’t have central heating and, as one person said, we’re “used to being cold”.

Got a problem? Find someone to blame. Make them pay for whatever in your life doesn’t meet your expectations.

GardeningGirl said :

I agree, landlords should be required to provide a reasonable minimum appropriate to the climate without imposing on the tenants to fund what should have been provided in the first place. I’ve know of some landlords who paid part or all the water bill or paid for a gardener, in order to keep the exterior of their investment in good condition. Why can’t there be some system of penalties/incentives for them to put money into the inside of the house? Something such as make it compulsory for landlords of properties below a certain energy rating to either pay and keep paying half the electricity bills or pay once for the improvements that will bring the property up to that energy rating? Unfortunately I don’t think much of the energy rating system, but that’s a whole other discussion.

Time to come into the real world I am afraid. For one if you force people to spend money then that money needs to be recouped through higher rental costs. Simple economics. Secondly a lot of rental properties are private residencies rented out whilst the owner is living elsewhere. So are you suggesting that someone looking to rent out for 1, 2, 3 years should be forced to upgrade just for the convenience of the tenant?

Personally the rental market is open to market force. Owners ask for the rent they think the property is worth and the tenant agrees by signing a lease. As a tenant if you are not happy with the property you inspect then you do have the choice to not rent and look elsewhere. Of course doing so may mean you pay more, but that is the market at play.

And before I get accused of being a greedy landlord, please don’t. I was a landlord for 3 years when I lived overseas and I looked after my tenants, even installing aircon. However you wouldn’t believe that the tenant in the house at the time then seriously asked me to pay for the water that the aircon used.

Watson said :

Truthiness said :

I’ve lived in 20+ rentals in Canberra and not one of them had decent insulation, consequently the heating bills were always astronomical. land lords don’t care, they have zero motivation to spend money which will only save their tenants money.

oh how I wish the government would make insulation and double glazing mandatory, it would cut so many emissions and save so much money for the poor.

the current house didn’t even have curtains, just a single inefficient 4kw heater facing an open window in a room with no doors. we made our own curtains and bought an oil heater, but the next tenant will have to do the same thing. bloody greedy land lords.

it wouldn’t be so bad if it were possible for the poor to buy houses. the current massively over priced housing market means the only people who can afford houses are those who already have one, or are willing to spend 30 years in indentured servitude to a bankster.

It is a pet peeve of mine too. Add those astronomical heating (and old hot water systems are a major culprit too) bills to the already high rents and for lots of tenants that squashes any hope that they will ever be able to save up for a house deposit.

I agree, landlords should be required to provide a reasonable minimum appropriate to the climate without imposing on the tenants to fund what should have been provided in the first place. I’ve know of some landlords who paid part or all the water bill or paid for a gardener, in order to keep the exterior of their investment in good condition. Why can’t there be some system of penalties/incentives for them to put money into the inside of the house? Something such as make it compulsory for landlords of properties below a certain energy rating to either pay and keep paying half the electricity bills or pay once for the improvements that will bring the property up to that energy rating? Unfortunately I don’t think much of the energy rating system, but that’s a whole other discussion.

Truthiness said :

I’ve lived in 20+ rentals in Canberra and not one of them had decent insulation, consequently the heating bills were always astronomical. land lords don’t care, they have zero motivation to spend money which will only save their tenants money.

oh how I wish the government would make insulation and double glazing mandatory, it would cut so many emissions and save so much money for the poor.

the current house didn’t even have curtains, just a single inefficient 4kw heater facing an open window in a room with no doors. we made our own curtains and bought an oil heater, but the next tenant will have to do the same thing. bloody greedy land lords.

it wouldn’t be so bad if it were possible for the poor to buy houses. the current massively over priced housing market means the only people who can afford houses are those who already have one, or are willing to spend 30 years in indentured servitude to a bankster.

After living on so many rentals I’d have thought you’d get better at choosing, or buy your own.

Truthiness said :

I’ve lived in 20+ rentals in Canberra and not one of them had decent insulation, consequently the heating bills were always astronomical. land lords don’t care, they have zero motivation to spend money which will only save their tenants money.

oh how I wish the government would make insulation and double glazing mandatory, it would cut so many emissions and save so much money for the poor.

You do realise that even if the greedy landlord was forced to upgrade as you suggested that at the end of the day those costs would need to be passed onto the poor through higher rent?

smont said :

I’m quite blown away by some of the amounts being posted here. We have a typical 3br early-70s house with central gas heating (roof vents) that we set on 21 degrees morning and evening, gas instant hot water and gas cook tops; and our gas bill for quarter 13 Apr – 10 Jul (89 days) was $59. Just looking back through our last two years worth of bills online, it has never exceeded $60 for a quarter.

Our ceiling insulation is not particularly good; but our house is double brick, and we had double-glaze windows installed in lounge, bedrooms and kitchen 10 years ago. Had our central heating installed in 2005, five-star rated Braemar model (and no, I have no affiliation with Braemar!).

Hope ACTEW AGL aren’t reading this and can identify you, because you clearly have a faulty meter! I mean to say the service charge is around $50 a quarter, so cannot see how you could use just $10 worth of gas per quarter for heating, water and cooking. As mentioned my quarter bill for winter is $500 but summer around $150, or $100 in actual usage, for cooking and hot water alone. Now whilst your house may well be efficient from a heating perspective how can you use $10 on hot water and cooking?

Truthiness said :

I’ve lived in 20+ rentals in Canberra and not one of them had decent insulation, consequently the heating bills were always astronomical. land lords don’t care, they have zero motivation to spend money which will only save their tenants money.

oh how I wish the government would make insulation and double glazing mandatory, it would cut so many emissions and save so much money for the poor.

the current house didn’t even have curtains, just a single inefficient 4kw heater facing an open window in a room with no doors. we made our own curtains and bought an oil heater, but the next tenant will have to do the same thing. bloody greedy land lords.

it wouldn’t be so bad if it were possible for the poor to buy houses. the current massively over priced housing market means the only people who can afford houses are those who already have one, or are willing to spend 30 years in indentured servitude to a bankster.

It is a pet peeve of mine too. Add those astronomical heating (and old hot water systems are a major culprit too) bills to the already high rents and for lots of tenants that squashes any hope that they will ever be able to save up for a house deposit.

I’ve lived in 20+ rentals in Canberra and not one of them had decent insulation, consequently the heating bills were always astronomical. land lords don’t care, they have zero motivation to spend money which will only save their tenants money.

oh how I wish the government would make insulation and double glazing mandatory, it would cut so many emissions and save so much money for the poor.

the current house didn’t even have curtains, just a single inefficient 4kw heater facing an open window in a room with no doors. we made our own curtains and bought an oil heater, but the next tenant will have to do the same thing. bloody greedy land lords.

it wouldn’t be so bad if it were possible for the poor to buy houses. the current massively over priced housing market means the only people who can afford houses are those who already have one, or are willing to spend 30 years in indentured servitude to a bankster.

smont said :

I’m quite blown away by some of the amounts being posted here. We have a typical 3br early-70s house with central gas heating (roof vents) that we set on 21 degrees morning and evening, gas instant hot water and gas cook tops; and our gas bill for quarter 13 Apr – 10 Jul (89 days) was $59. Just looking back through our last two years worth of bills online, it has never exceeded $60 for a quarter.

Are you subtracting off the supply charge to get that figure? My quarterly gas bills in summer when I have zero usage are about $60.

smont said :

I’m quite blown away by some of the amounts being posted here. We have a typical 3br early-70s house with central gas heating (roof vents) that we set on 21 degrees morning and evening, gas instant hot water and gas cook tops; and our gas bill for quarter 13 Apr – 10 Jul (89 days) was $59. Just looking back through our last two years worth of bills online, it has never exceeded $60 for a quarter.

Our ceiling insulation is not particularly good; but our house is double brick, and we had double-glaze windows installed in lounge, bedrooms and kitchen 10 years ago. Had our central heating installed in 2005, five-star rated Braemar model (and no, I have no affiliation with Braemar!).

Sounds like your double brick (pretty sure mine is single) and double glazing are saving you heaps of money then. I dream of double glazing. Everyone put it in their houses in Western Europe in the 70s. And proper shutters. Hard to find a house without those 2 things there, though admittedly the long term rental properties are pretty crappy and cold there too.

This is a very informative thread, thanks to everyone for adding their 2 cents!

I know the topic is regarding gas bills for heating, but I just wanted to ask if anyone has found definitively whether or not gas is better than electric for internal heating? My partner and I live in an old 4 bedroom EER 1.0 house with 2 other people, and last winter we had the electric internal heater turned on 24/7 for about 2 months, resulting in a quarterly electric bill of $951! We’re building our house at present and are putting in a gas heater… but talk of solar-powered electric heating on this thread seems as though it might be a better option cost-wise?

Thanks!

I’m quite blown away by some of the amounts being posted here. We have a typical 3br early-70s house with central gas heating (roof vents) that we set on 21 degrees morning and evening, gas instant hot water and gas cook tops; and our gas bill for quarter 13 Apr – 10 Jul (89 days) was $59. Just looking back through our last two years worth of bills online, it has never exceeded $60 for a quarter.

Our ceiling insulation is not particularly good; but our house is double brick, and we had double-glaze windows installed in lounge, bedrooms and kitchen 10 years ago. Had our central heating installed in 2005, five-star rated Braemar model (and no, I have no affiliation with Braemar!).

Chip said :

No normal house would be so well sealed that lack of fresh air would be a problem …

Unless your house is free of plastics, estapol, synthetic surfaces, laminates, chipboard, and synthetic furniture sponge/rubber, you will find there’s quite a toxic buildup of fumes if you seal it up … you’ll find that the sorts of air-sealed eco-houses featured, say, on “Grand Designs”, have all-wood furniture, organic, natural, oiled, plastic-free surfaces and NO risk of toxic fumes within. Plus sophisticated air-replenishment technology …

I agree with dugite – air leakage is a big culprit. No normal house would be so well sealed that lack of fresh air would be a problem so close everything up, install draught seals, slowly pass a wet hand or smoking incense stick around skirting, doors, windows, exhaust fans, wall vents and architraves to locate leaks and seal them up. With ducting, make sure that mice and general wear and tear haven’t created holes in it causing warm air to be lost under floor or in ceiling space. Try and use heating systems and furniture placement that minimise air movement, especially where people sit – chill factor compensation is costly and moving air loses heat to walls, windows and ceilings more quickly.

Comic_and_Gamer_Nerd said :

Gas is the worst. Put a fire place in and for the cost of nothing more than some physical work we have zero bill. In fact, because of solar panels on the roof, our last electricity bill was 350 in credit.

Insulation, laminated glass in some windows, secondary glazing in others, our house is always toasty.

Secondary glazing is fine in Canberra, no need for double glazing unless you have the spare cash.

Am familar with double glazing, and its cost, but what please is ‘secondary glazing’. Thanks

Wow, some big differences here.

I have the thermostat set to 20 from 6am to 8.30am and then again from 3 or 4pm to 8.30pm. I used to just put it on 5 degrees overnight, but with it taking so long to warm up in the mornings, I now set it to 14 degrees. And still it was only 17 degrees when we left for school/work the other morning! And it feels much colder than that. It seems to only raise the temp about 2 degrees in an hour. Which seems extremely wasteful. I will mention it to the landlords.

My house faces West. With only a couple of small windows on the East and North.

I have been meaning to draft proof it and hang proper window coverings. But it is hard to get motivated if it’s a rental. Still, if I would’ve done it when I moved in 5 years ago, I probably would’ve saved myself the money it would have cost me to buy decent curtains, etc.

I am moving to our new house with EER 6 end of this year and I will be very interested to see my heating bills there.

Our 4 BR home winter (july – sep) gas bill is heading towards $850 based on today’s meter reading. Gas is on timer : 2 hrs morning 16 deg; 5hrs evening 18-20 deg. Individual rooms use electric oil column heaters, eg study, as required.

I’ll share some life lessons:

When buying a home ask to see the previous year (or two) of energy bills: can save you heaps and can make a purchase decision easier.

In a two storey home, if possible, isolate each floor by installing doors at the bottom of the stairs. We did this in a 22 sq townhouse and it cut the following year’s energy bill by one third (yes, a third!). WE were fruitlessly pumping energy into the lounge but it just made upstairs warmer. After the doors went on the lounge stayed warm and we lost very little heat up the stairs.

Encourage your kids to leave home. Yes, when my daughter left for uni our yearly energy bill decreased by $500. What price love?

When renovating, insulate any wall, floor or ceiling cavity that you can gain access to. It also helps with sound attenuation. Insulation is relatively cheap so don’t skimp on it.

Gas is the worst. Put a fire place in and for the cost of nothing more than some physical work we have zero bill. In fact, because of solar panels on the roof, our last electricity bill was 350 in credit.

Insulation, laminated glass in some windows, secondary glazing in others, our house is always toasty.

Secondary glazing is fine in Canberra, no need for double glazing unless you have the spare cash.

Around $285 here, in a 17 year old theoretically EER4 3-bedroom place with gas heating, hot water and cooktop. We only heat the house during the day when we’re home, and turn it off overnight. I’ve added extra insulation to the ceiling in the last year or so, and am currently battling with the drafts around the crappy aluminium sliding window frames and around doors. I may have to replace the ceiling fans with ones that aren’t just holes into the ceiling space.

Every winter seems a little bit colder than the one before.

$500 for the first quarter, which is ducted gas, instant hot water and gas cooking in a 3 bed built in 2000.

We have the temperature set to 23 on the heater (though at lounge height it is closer to 20-21) and have two people using the shower. For this bill my wife was home a lot more than usual so the heater would have been used quite a bit.

So overall not too bad considering.

My brother just got a $1300 gas bill, he is having his Gas heating looked at this week. I would be a little annoyed finding a bill that size in the letterbox.

Thanks for posting, Watson. This has been an interesting comparison.

We have a five bedroom single level brick veneer house with reasonable insulation, converted to a dual occupancy but still with a single heating system. We run a central gas heating system at 20 degrees in the mornings (from 5:30am until 8am) and 21 in the evenings (3pm to 11pm). We have gas hot water on demand and electric cooking. The heating system has been run for the last four winters with no maintenance at all. We had the ducting cleaned in June this year.

Our August quarter for the last four years has been $717, $750, $855 and $1038. This last one was August 2011, and was a big jump because we had a member of the house suffering from pneumonia and kept the heating on overnight and through the day for six weeks of the August quarter.

Oddly, this last summer being so cold we didn’t turn the heating off at all, and the February quarter was $50 cheaper than the previous year ($150) when the heating was off and we only used the gas for water.

beejay76 said :

Around $350 here. We have a small 3 bedder, heating off at night and most of the day, and set to 19 for mornings and evenings.

Sounds about right. I do not like my winter gas bill… I think I’d have a heart attack if it got anywhere near some of the other numbers in this thread!

Around $350 here. We have a small 3 bedder, heating off at night and most of the day, and set to 19 for mornings and evenings. Our house is well insulated, but friends of mine who also have well insulated houses often have bills of at leat double ours. This is largely because they run the heating all night, and/ or they set the temp well over 20. Perhaps if you have the temp high you could try setting it lower. Otherwise, check for gas leaks 😉

I have ducted gas heating (electricity for everything else), and my gas bill was $280 for the last quarter. Three bedroom 1970s brick house with ceiling insulation; can’t remember the EER but it wouldn’t be over 2. Heating vents are in the floor.

During the week I use the heating for 5-6 hours in the evening, and heat to 18-19 degrees. I have ducts throughout the house but close off the bathroom, toilet and laundry (to judge by the resulting temperature in the bathroom, those doors insulate very well!) I don’t heat in the morning. On weekends I heat for a couple of hours in the morning if I get up early, but the living area and bedrooms are north-facing with large windows so the sun is more than enough for most of the day.

poetix said :

I think I win. Or lose. $881 for a quarter for a two bedroom house. That was a lovely surprise. I think it was built when people expected to be cold.

And there’s still a crack in the window because I’m afraid of the potential asbestos, and haven’t prised any out to have a test etc etc.

Being a wimp costs a lot.

I think I win. Or lose. $881 for a quarter for a two bedroom house. That was a lovely surprise. I think it was built when people expected to be cold.

Just got a bill for $840 for my fairly poorly insulated 4 bedroom house. This is a little more than last year but I think it has been colder this winter. We have ducted gas heating. I love being comfortable at home so I am willing to pay it. But am also planning to invest in better insulation.
I think if your house is taking a long time to heat up, there’s a chance that some of the ducting may have holes or gaps – the heater could be pumping lots of its hot air into the celing. Ours warms the house quickly – about 10 minutes and you start feeling better.

$740 is about three tons of wood. That should last you over winter.

The best thing about wood heating is that you are using sustainable renewable fuel.

$595. We are in a 3 bedroom one bathroom home. The house orientation is north-south, with only the bedrooms getting sun throughout the day. There is no wall insulation.
My wife has been on maternity leave since November 2011 and she heats the house during the day if it drops below 17 degrees. We heat throughout the whole night because of our baby.

Our house leaked like a sieve until we installed underfloor insulation and magnetite secondary glazing over the windows. We do have ceiling insulation.

In older homes, heat loss through windows can be between 20 and 40%. We used to feel a breeze coming through our windows…when they were closed. We could also feel cold air coming through our floor boards.

Houses in Canberra (even modern ones) should be used as a case study of how not to build houses in a climate similar to ours. We place the thermal mass of the house on the outside (brick), where it super heats in summer (thus requiring air-conditioning) and provides no benefit in the winter.
Even the standard for double glazing here is pi$$ poor.

Our gas bill was $504 & that was expensive for us. We only heat what we need to when we need to & turn it off at night.

We have a single story 4 bedroom house, 180m2, with wall furnaces.

Our last house was 1/2 the size with central heating & cost $100 a 1/4 more.

I dont think central heating is that efficient, especially if it is coming from the roof as the heat travels through the piping outside the insulated bit of your house.

Crikey! By way of comparison our July electric bill was $450. I expect our next one to be smaller. North facing small 3 bedroom. We are out mostly during the week although one day a week at home. We only really heat the living area. We also have a system in the roof space that pushes warm air into the house in winter and does the opposite in summer.

The size of you gas bill will vary according to many things, but one of the main problems in Canberra houses is air leakage — especially in old and modified rental properties. Air leaking around downlights, windows and ducts is often much more important (and easier to fix) than insulation problems.

It might help if you tell us what temperature you’re heating to. There’s a big difference between heating your house to 20 degrees, and 24 degrees. If it’s taking that long to heat a 2 bedroom place, it indicates to me that the heating unit mustn’t be all that efficient either. If it’s old, it may be using a lot more gas than a newer unit would.

We’ve had $1,000+ gas bills over winter, and I’d expect another soon. 4 bedroom house with fairly dodgy ceiling insulation, and no wall insulation, heated to 20 in the morning and evening, and it comes on if the house drops below 14 at night – mainly because we have two young children. The bill will blow out because my wife’s still on maternity leave, so the heating’s been used a lot more during the day than normal.

Last year our winter gas bill was $1100 + GST. We rent a 4br 2 storey house (est. 2006) with ducted gas heating, gas hot water and hotplates. The house has no ceiling insulation. Was our first winter in Canberra so wasn’t sure what to expect with the bill and got quite a shock when it arrived. Have severely changed habits this winter & no longer use the heating of a morning and now use it for a max. 2 hours at night. Offered owner $$$ to assist with install of ceiling insulation back in April. Still waiting for an answer despite repeated approaches to real estate agent.

Sounds about right. I only use gas for instant hot water and that adds up to about $150 – and that’s for less than one hour a day.

Gas is expensive and we were all duped into thinking it would be a cheaper “environmentally friendly” option. And it’s neither of those two things. So glad I went with reverse cycle electric air con as it’s much cheaper than your gas bills.

If we mis-use the gas ducted heating here, we can get $900 bills – old big house, lots of bed rooms (ceiling insulation, ducts in all rooms). Doesn’t take very long to warm up the house in the morning. We turn it off at night and during the weekdays.