ACT Government now considers Light Rail a priority

At the very least he is now on record as stating that light rail would be a good thing for Canberra. – Jon Stanhope is also on the record saying ‘blame me for the 2003 fires’.

Point taken ?

It would be fair to say I’m already pro-lightrail, so thanks for the update.

BTW, has ‘bonfire’ ceased to exist ?

Mael, at lunch with Mr Stanhope on Tuesday when I raised it he was dead against it. At the time he was complaining about the potential cost to 4-lane the GDE. I pointed out that road construction is an insatiable beast, and that only a fully-fledged public transport system would ever reign it in, but it needed a visionary government.

I went on to explain the potential for vastly higher land sale revenue that would result from a guaranteed rail route but that wouldn’t result from buses (because they are guaranteed infrastructure as to bus routes that can be uprooted – and rooted – at will), higher rates, reduced road construction costs, reduced medical costs from prangs.

I pointed out the massive amount of land to be released along potential lines to Gungahlin and Molonglo, the land sale revenues from which could benefit from such a budget commitment, that a park’n’ride in EPIC could capture a lump of the NSW commuters before they rat-run through Hackett and Ainslie to Civic, etc etc as described on our website, and he did quiet down a bit in his objections. I pushed my usual argument that only a comprehensive cost-benefit analysis would reveal the full extent of these offsets to the costs.

But don’t get me wrong – I don’t claim responsibility for any turnaround. Other Community Council reps there supported the argument, and Joachim from North Canberra suggested the Infrastructure Fund as a funding avenue. And there has been strong recent lobbying from the Canberra Business Council, the Conservation Council, the Greens.

But of course the main credit goes to ACT Light Rail who actually kicked off this renewed push a year or so back.

However at this point the way the matter has been slapped on the agenda in an all-or-nothing way (as backed up by Stanhope’s comments to ABC Radio) inevitably lead one to wonder whether it is merely a ploy to make it go away? I’d like to think not, and that Mr Stanhope has got on board (‘scuse pun).

At the very least he is now on record as stating that light rail would be a good thing for Canberra.

We will be talking with federal reps and relevant ministers to ask them to instead consider the aforementioned cost-benefit analysis, with a view towards a few key initial routes – particularly where land sale revenues or vastly reduced road costs can go some way towards paying for it.

The obvious ones are Brindabella Park, Molonglo and Gungahlin town centre. On the back of today’s CT article about Tralee likely going ahead, I’d suggest that partial funding via a NSW Govt infrastructure levy on the Tralee developer would also see a Tralee/Jerra line on the priority list.

By breaking the proposal down into a staged approach, we may be able to avoid a baby-and-the-bathwater outcome that may or may not be the intent of Wednesday’s announcement.

I think it would be a great idea to work out how to plug it into either Belconnen interchange, or an alternative Belconnen site, and then build a site with a rail hub, bus hub, and a smegload of secure parking, first.

Either that or Woden, whichever is closer to civic really as the cost of track seems to be the most prohibitive factor in the equation.

In a major coup for Gungahlin, I can also see sense in using the VAST expanse of open land to work out some nuts and bolts before they consider more developed sites, at the same time, giving people an actual good reason to live in Gungahlin.

toot toot

big red;

1.)can you explain how the twu and cfmeu pull the strings of ACT labor? from where i’m sitting they have between them 2 tables at the alp state conference (or roughly 5% of the voting power, hardly a dominant force)
2.)Why would the twu be against light rail when it would have to be backed up by a bius system, meaning their members jobs would be unaffected?
3.) ACT Light rail has said numerous times that the twu are not against the idea, any comments?
4.) why would the cfmeu be against light rail? (more construction, good for members etc)
5.) What proof of this conspiracy do you have? (and dont just say your proof is the cfmeu and twu not publicly backing the proposal, thats meaningless, they havent publicly claimed not to be involved in the jfk assaination or faking the moon landings either)
6.)if your conspiracy was true why would stanhope put the idea back on the front page?
7.)If your conspiracy were true why would the twu and cfmeu allow stanhope to do this? surely they’d want the idea on the back burner.
8.) Are you the bloke who runs around garema place yelling about how the goverment stole your thoughts?

in short; light rail wont happen because it’s not its time yet; not cos of some nutbag conspiracy. Put your tin foil hat back on and watch some X files.

flying doormat said :

If the Government is having problems getting enough bus drivers to cover the new timetables how are they going to be able to get enough light rail drivers if it ever gets up and going!

What about us brain dead slobs?
You’ll be given cushy jobs
Where you sent here by the devil?
No good man I’m on the level

To all Sunshines, the Feds will not, repeat not, support a light rail spine for Canberra. That is why Stannhope is pushing for a light rail that links the airport to the House on the Hill as he knows there will be more support for it.

1 billion for an orphan light rail network? Sounds about right.

Oh ACT Light rRil was all for building the light rail system to Bungendore 1st.

Well Stanhope has neutralised light rail as an election issue completely. I wonder if the same stunt will work in the 2012 campaign? The reality is thta the CFMEU and TWU will not allow it and while they pull the puppet strings on ACT Labor you may as well forget about it. I just won’t happen.

If in doubt, check the TWU and CFMEU for their strong public statemeents of support. Guess what? You won”t find any. Toot toot.

Message to all potential Chief Ministers; If you build a Light Rail system, your name will be immortalised in the history of Canberra forever. There, that should do it!

I think the real celebration should be that public transport/rapid transit infrastucture has become a priority!!

Hooray

roland

ACT Light Rail said :

ACT Light Rail have always advocated for a single route to be constructed at first, as we recognise that it is an expensive public transport option. The network can always be expanded.

What route are you proposing as a first step?

I would think an intertown route (Belconnen to Civic) would be better than something like Civic to Parlimentary Triangle (or Airport) since workers in these areas would have to drive to the city anyway (and wouldn’t be able to park their cars). They’d just keep driving to work.

Whereas you should get a large number of Belconnen residents working in Civic to use the service.

Perhaps to answer Flying Doormat’s question – there will not necessarily be a requirement for a light rail driver. I have been to several European cities where the rail systems run to a schedule, and are operated automatically – sans driver! Every time I’ve used one of these systems it’s been awesome.

I know it’s not Europe here, but surely we can use this type of technology?!

Not sure how true it is, but a former employee of Action once said that the government has trouble keeping new bus drivers because of an arrangement whereby the more experienced drivers have first choice of shift. This means less experienced ones are working on weekends or late at night – not the best shifts if you have a family.

A light rail trip can carry more people than one bus (even the bendy ones), so in theory you’d need fewer drivers on the intertown routes, which could be diverted to bus services.

And I understand light rail is now something the ACT Business Council are supportive of.

If the Government is having problems getting enough bus drivers to cover the new timetables how are they going to be able to get enough light rail drivers if it ever gets up and going!

Im glad to see that people are arguing about where the light rail network should go!

ACT Light Rail have always advocated for a single route to be constructed at first, as we recognise that it is an expensive public transport option. The network can always be expanded. The Stanhope government have been quite bold in making a request for an entire network. In a sense, its a little too bold.

Some posters are correct in stating that no detail on funding has accompanied the request, ACT Light Rail continue to lobby for a feasibility study. This has to be conducted before any funding decision can be properly made.

Im also interested in the ‘flexible bus’ mantra. While overcrowded buses pass by people waiting for them, and services are cancelled because of a lack of drivers, i think we can accept that the best way for a public transport system to service our growing city is to have the backbone provided by light rail and to have that supported by buses. A fully integrated system.

I encourage people to attend the debate in September.

Havent they been suggesting this for the past fifteen (possibly longer) years? Seems like they are making out that this is a new thing.

I agree…just election talk. Nothing will ever come of it no matter who is elected.

Hargreaves recently completely dismissed any light-rail option

Tom-tom: Cheers for your post, and a lot to think about. I have been away from Canberra for around 5 years and am just back now. So the whole light rail proposal is new to me. You’ve helped me to get a bit of an overview. Nice one and thanks!

as i have said before, i have nothing against the idea of light rail, its just that when the govt. is faced with different ways in which to spend their limited funds; well light rail is just a lower priority than schools, hospitals and roads etc.

i dont see light rail in canberra working except as a link between major transport hubs, backing up a bus system, and to be honest the services provided by action in that capacity are probably the one thing that most people would agree action already do well.

Light rail will become more attractive as fuel prices rise, but to be frank i dont see many people changing their driving behaviour because of fuel prices. I’ll become more freindly to the idea when I see house prices in south tuggeranong and north belco/gunghalin crash, when i see jobs in the city and snowtown go unfilled for months, or at the very least when i see cars on the parkway with more than one person in them. (as an aside i’d say about 10% of people who get the 4c vouchers at woolies dont even bother taking them, hardly evidence of fuel prices being enough to change peoples behaviour yet.)

in short i think light rail is not a bad idea, its just not its time yet.

(by the way bigred; can you explain how this latest development fits into your consipracy theory about the twu and cfmeu owning act labor and blocking light rail even though it would be in their interest for the scheme to go ahead? might be time for you to dig out the tin foil helmet)

Its been raised and then crossed off the list so many times… Price of petrol/gas is going up and probably forcing their hand and making more economically viable then before

Problem is that they need to ensure it extends the full length of canberra and thats going to be a pain in the ass so they will probably end up only doing Tuggeranong>Woden>City>Airport>Belco (major centres) as proposed

suburbs surrounding and north of Gungahlin will miss out
Suburbs from Calwell and south of there will miss out
Suburbs at the east and west extremities of the ACT will also miss out

But

if they integrate the bus system to get people too and from those suburbs into these light rail centres/stations they could be onto a winner..

finding $1bn dollars will be a bit of an ask!!

By the time it gets approved(if at all) it will probably cost em 1.5bn

1. The Stanhope govt is on the record as saying light rail isn’t for Canberra.
2. The submission to the Rudd govt won’t include proper costing.
3. If they were serious, they’d consider the future possibility of light rail in all their current planning proposals for the Belco town centre.
4. It’s an election year.

Do the math.

If it does link the major urban centres with civic and the airport, is linked to park and ride, SAFE bicycle parking or the ability to easily carry bicycles on it, then I would use it a lot.

But what I’m seeing is not just doubt that it will happen, but comments suggesting that it’s a waste of money, electric cars would be better etc. I can understand people being sceptical about it ever actually eventuating – I am. But I don’t understand the bagging of the idea?!

It’s not even a promise, it’s a “we’ve asked Santa for this”. But kiddies who live in safe electorates only get coal, no matter who’s in power.

I like it Thumper

its called an election year promise, believe it when you see it and not before

Can someone enlighten me…I really don’t see why everyone is so opposed to a light rail system. I think it’s a brilliant idea!

Oh ye of little faith Pandy.

If they are sensible about the proposal, link the major suburban centres Belco, Gunners, Tuggers, Woden) to Civic and the airport; support it with a Park & Ride series of FREE carparks and set the fares at a reasonable price people will use it.

If you build it, they will come…

Mind you, I’m never one to accuse the Stanhope Government with making commonsense decisions that will benefit the general populace.

I’m quite cynical, it being an election year and all, that this is just a headline grab since if it fails to progress it will be because of the Commonwealth Gov.

But either way, I’d love to see a proper feasibility study done. I for one would definitely use light rail to get from Belconnen to Civic for work (either park & ride at Belconnen or use a fast feeder bus service), since if I don’t get to Civic before 8am I have park on the opposite side of town to where I work because there is such a shortage of carparks…. my monthly pre-paid government parking ticket is quickly becoming useless…. since I often have to pay for parking in a non-government carpark.

I would rather see more money spent on buses – as Aurelius mentioned buses are a lot more flexible than the proposed light rail system would ever be. Total waste of money

If the government here can’t run a bus system (which is much more flexible than a rail system) what makes anyone think this will work any better?

Light rail? Too late! Let us have a system of public electric cars. You register on the Internet and for a fee use the internet to find the nearest parked vacant car which you take to the drop off point nearest to where you are going, this could be outside your house or outside your office. Admittedly such a system works better in a crowded CBD, but heck, isn’t that where we are trying to reduce pollution? And eventually the outer suburb livers will buy their own and recharge at the parking points. With a little ingenuity electric cars will also be able to take us to the coast, Sydney etc. (and why not Kakadu?)in comfort and reasonable speeds.

Insurance, liability etc. are not insurmountable. We do this already with hire car companies,

At last the ACT Government is asking someone else to pay for light rail ($1 billion) rather than ACT taxpayers. If the ACT payed for it the majority of residents will see absolutely no benefit from this proposal but will be paying through via increased taxes.

The best thing about the proposal will be that after having spent $1 billion of Federal money, the system will be seen as a disaster as poor patronage from the pollies and workers in Snowtown shun the system because:
it does not go where they want to go
system is too infrequent
they have to interchange in Civic
the pollies have to share the tram with the lower classes

Now for the route: A triangle between Civic, Parliament House, National Gallery, Kingston, Fyshwick, Snowtown, Russell, back to Civic.